Please, bring back WGC on Win10 🆘

[rigid glade]

It works perfectly fine on Win10 22h2.

I'm using WGC really-really often, to be able to play many games with LSFG (through streaming on my VR headset) and also for capturing games with LSFG.

But, starting with LS v3.1 I can't anymore use WGC.

Thus no more playing with LSFG with my VR headset, and no more video capture.
It is really sad.

[dusty patrol]

While I’m also sad to see this go, at least you can still downgrade to a previous version using steam. Just set your beta participating setting to legacy 2.13 or whichever version works for you

[rigid glade]

Thank you, I already have an old version, but unfortunately, it is not very convenient to use two versions when it might be just one.

Problem is that all the versions use the same configuration file, so when you are use an old version, all new settings are reset when you launch a new version.

Also, there is no reason to force disabling features without allowing them to be enabled (no technical limitation), and forcing users to use two (or more in the future?) instances of LS, when there could be just one.

[dusty patrol]

Afaik you can't run multiple instances of LS without doing some sandboxing. I completely agree with ya

[twin brook]

can you give some example use cases where VR has problem with DXGI? I don't really use lossless scaling for VR or videos so I'm not familiar with it, and it makes the request better

It's kind of a similar situation for visual novel readers, as DXGI capture does not work for visual novels (it doesn't update on still frame). So depending on the age and engine of the VN either WGC or GDI is needed to capture the game properly, and that means that the latest update disabled all visual novel upscaling functionality for everyone except people who have the latest and greatest OS, W11, and very modern hardware so that it is willing to accept and lets you install. Traditionally people have been reading VNs on positively ancient computers and OSes because they're fun with little to no hardware performance requirements, so this eliminates that crowd and kind of moves the philosophy of lossless scaling to being software for new fancy computers only.

In February 2025 58,7% of Windows users were still on Windows 10, so while people who read are a minority in general, W10 users are not exactly a minority of Windows VN readers.

[rigid glade]

I'm using Virtual Desktop to stream my PC desktop and games on the giant virtual display of my VR headset.

Only WGC can be captured by any other software (including Virtual Desktop).
DXGI can't be captured at all.

So, when I need to play games or watch something with LSFG, I choose the WGC capture method, and it works like a charm on a VR HMD.

[twin brook]

ahh I see, yea that makes sense

[rigid glade]

Please, bring back WGC on Win10 🆘

@static gyro Hey, sorry for tagging you. Could you share your thoughts on this?

[static gyro]

Can you name games that dxgi can’t capture for testing?

[static gyro]

WGC was disabled on windows 10 as it can’t track the game framerate which is crucial for fg to work. Most uses don’t read tooltips about framerate locking requirement to multiple of refresh rate leading to misusing the software, poor experience and bad reviews

[rigid glade]

But WGC actually works in windows 10 😰

Moreover WGC is the only working solution for streaming games with LSFG on wireless VR headsets like Meta Quest 3.

I used LSFG to play PS3, PS4 games with 30->120fps on giant virtual screen.
Also this way I can play emulators the same way.

But now, on the new v3.1 version it's no longer possible.
Without any technical limitation, nothing has changed in hardware but "clicks" and it no longer available 😟

Please consider to re-enable WGC on windows 10, give us an option to enable it

p.s.
There is also other people who also asking for bring back WCG.
https://discord.com/channels/1042475930217631784/1346635569899372544

[static gyro]

The only case when it works is when game framerate is a multiple of refresh rate. Your case is rather unique, most of other users just misused it

[rigid glade]

The only case when it works is when game framerate is a multiple of refresh rate.
Yes, it just requires knowledge of how to use it, but it works!
And very useful. In fact the only solution for streaming LSFG

You could just add a note that "you need to know how to use this option, otherwise use DXGI" instead of just turning off WGC completely... 😟 😭

[static gyro]

There is also other solution. Upgrade to Windows 11.

Windows 10 is almost 10 years old

[rigid glade]

Many users still using Win10, in fact half of all

https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/Steam-Hardware-Software-Survey-Welcome-to-Steam
https://gs.statcounter.com/os-version-market-share/windows/desktop/worldwide

Also, for these users there may be reasons why they do not want to upgrade to Win11 yet.

And also, in a more general sense, it is much easier to "check the box" and return the ability to use actually fine working WGC on Win10, than to update the entire system and reinstall all the software, look for alternatives to those programs and convenient features that may no longer be available on Win11.

[static gyro]

I mean LS works on Windows 10 with dxgi just fine, but when there is some specific case like VR and streaming upgrade can be justified

[rigid glade]

Can you please at least give an option to enable it, at least through the .ini config file, something like "Allow_WGC_on_Win10=1" ?

Also, it is not only a streaming to VR headsets, but also any form of capturing/recording games with Lossless Scaling (LS1 included) on Win10

[twin brook]

Hi, for example this one: coµ (or comyu). In this VN the main menu has animated background so it's ok and you can move mouse around while being captured by DXGI.

1. hit start and you'll come to this scene in the screenshot. Here the fps will be synchronized with that icon in the bottom right and LS will display 7/7 as fps when captured by DXGI, even if you're moving the mouse
2. you can right click to hide the UI and it shows how the mouse just freezes because there's no frames, even if you're swinging it around
3. in this VN the config menu in bottom right (when opened from ingame so this scene, not main menu) doesn't have animation, so you can experience what kind of issue DXGI capture can have with navigating VN menu

I think DXGI might be pretty good for VN too if this issue with mouse movement not causing frame update can be solved, in my experience it tends to give at least some display when you try capturing with it. Sometimes WGC completely fails like for example with this coµ VN right here and GDI works for this one, with a bit of mouse offset strangeness. Still more usable than trying to navigate with frozen mouse.

One good example of difficulty with menu navigation is the visual novel I named that profile after: Butterfly seeker. Just start the main menu and upscale it with DXGI capture, and try to hit the buttons.

[static gyro]

So you exploited the WGC not being able to capture at game framerate. If you upgrade Windows to 24H2 you won't be able to use WGC as well, as it works the same as DXGI in this version. So, bringing back WGC is just a temporal solution in your case and won't solve the problem you describe for everybody

[twin brook]

hm yea VN basically needs more fps than the screen is changing at since the medium is essentially stills

with some animations sometimes

how about GDI, would it achieve this on newer windows too

if wgc has changed

[static gyro]

I'm thinking about some mode that can capture at refresh rate for scaling, fg won't work in this case obviously

[twin brook]

yea I've been using this LS for VN scaling for smth like 4 years now, no one's gonna need frame gen for VN

I remember helping you test the anime4k models

[static gyro]

Mouse cursor is the only issue?

I think it makes no sense to waste GPU for scaling 144/165 etc frame per second when there are only 7 new frames, just the cursor rendering must be decoupled

[twin brook]

and the pale line that appears up top I guess, but that's very minor issue and appears in WGC too. for DXGI capture mouse cursor is the real issue, and as far as I've used it for VN (not too much since I've been running WGC and GDI) it's updating properly whenever it does get a change in image

so it should be alright if the cursor is showed separately

[static gyro]

I will think if I can implement something like that

[leaden haven]

+++

[twin brook]

actually now that I think about it, in VN wouldn't just running VRS on it solve this potential performance issue completely even if you do it as a refresh rate capture?

[static gyro]

But VRS is Anime4k only feature

[twin brook]

ahhh right I see

[covert otter]

Found this after asking about screenshots in #💬│lossless-scaling

Is there any way to take screenshots on Windows 10 systems at this time?

[dusty patrol]

Printscreen key then Ctrl+V into any photo editor like paint