#Remove critical success from struggle skill check

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

sweet hatch
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A bunny is rewarded for hitting good skillchecks, how is that a problem?

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You can also just throw him, if you think its a good player. Dont take the risk of having him shake free

coarse olive
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So you want to encourage macro usage and circumvent gameplay mechanics? Horrible take.

sweet hatch
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I want to reward players for playing well, yes

coarse olive
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A bunny shouldn't be "rewarded" for being caught

sweet hatch
coarse olive
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Yes I imagine that is confusing for you

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You aren't required to comment on my feedback

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Go support your bad takes elsewhere

lime shale
# sweet hatch You can also just throw him, if you think its a good player. Dont take the risk ...

^
Also the macro usage thing is absolutely absurd, yeah sure, the ability to hit better skill checks is going to cause a massive increase in people using macros to escape faster, totally, definitely what’s going to happen.

The survivor needs to be able to have a chance to recover from a mistake, since they can be killed, the juggernaut cannot. If they’re able to hit those hard skill checks, they are rewarded with escape.
(Also, even if this so called “macro uprising occurs”, you can still just toss the rabbit instantly or take the key then toss.

Is the idea of people using macros bad? Obviously.

Is there any foolproof system that can lack any possibly exploitable system? I don’t believe there is.

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Also, you can’t just say
“So you are encouraging macros?!”
In response to someone just saying “skill checks are a valid system for being able to escape the killer”

coarse olive
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It was a response to rewarding hitting good skill checks. The problem is when players do it at 100% success rate.

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Bunny's recover from a mistake by having their team bail them out. Not being able to 1 vs 1 in a 4 vs 1

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They have enough get out of jail free cards and anti tunnel mechanics. They don't need immunity from ever having a card placed in them or put in a cage

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Can you imagine if in dbd picking up a survivor and carrying them for more than 5 seconds they break free? Almost like that would promote unhealthy gameplay like slugging.

lime shale
# coarse olive Bunny's recover from a mistake by having their team bail them out. Not being ab...

And if the rabbits aren’t grouped up 24/7, to split up and divide the work of objectives? Does that just mean that the survivor doesn’t deserve to have a chance to get out?
Also, where are the macros you’re referring to? Skillchecks are tough, yes, but it’s not impossible to just get good at the game and gain the ability to hit Perfect skill checks consistently.

coarse olive
lost niche
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Difference being that in DBD the killer has to take the survivor to a particular location.
Here the hunter can make a bunny almost instantly lose a health state as soon as they're grabbed.

lime shale
coarse olive
lost niche
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I think that critical successes might be a bit too much at the moment, but I don't think they're unfair as a concept.

lime shale
sweet hatch
lost niche
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I'm here to not play DBD :P

coarse olive
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And if people bothered to read what I wrote I'm talking about a minimum time of action

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Which for some reason is an offensive concept

sweet hatch
lime shale
sweet hatch
coarse olive
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It is a problem.

coarse olive
lime shale
coarse olive
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Then you lack the ability to identify proper gameplay balance. Got it

lost niche
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Might as well not have a struggle to escape at all at that point if you're able to do everything at minimum

coarse olive
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No because that can be abused

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And hold people hostage

sweet hatch
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Calling other members stupid wont fix your issue

coarse olive
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That same logic why have cages if I can't use them

lime shale
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Also, please provide any evidence as to these macros that are being used.

coarse olive
lime shale
# coarse olive You seem the type to use them, so no. Learn AHK.

Refusing to provide any actual evidence is more of a problem. Thought you wanted to make this game better.
The evidence that you “have” is apparently enough for me to make a macro, or know what to do with this evidence to be able to make one, and you’re holding that hostage from the game developers? “Go support your bad takes elsewhere.”

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Additionally, hot take, hear me out. This “evidence”, is all in your head that players are using macros, you’re just going against actually skilled players.

coarse olive
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Thank you for your comment. It was very intelligent and not at all uninformed

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You arent anyone worth sending this information to so no, I will not help you cheat.

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Nor will i share hints publicly how to do so

orchid wadi
coarse olive
orchid wadi
dim flower
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So I agree, I do think bunnies can pop out of a grab too quickly and avoid being punished or getting grabbed. This is something I and several others have brought up on every alpha phase. this really makes the cages almost completely worthless. As a result I see very few magicians even try to use the cages. It also makes the cage traps pointless to even have in the game.

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All that said, there are no bad takes. you agree with someones take or you disagree with it. no more no less. We need the open dialogue so the devs have as many different opions and ideas as possible. Then they can make the best decisions for the gameplay over all.

timber vessel
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There needs to be a trade off, cages are useless because you can't get to them, but you also shouldn't be able to get a key and place a card and throw/cage them.

Maybe slow down the wiggle progress while walking but take a chunk of progress every time a magician takes an action.

dim flower
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The trade off IMO is the traps bunnies have for cages. Giving magicians more towards using the cages, and bunnies using those traps means bunnies may avoid taking damage all together and waste some of the monsters time in the process. Cards are great, but they can be largely ignored since a good chunk of them only work if you tunnel. The rest vary from mild annoyance to a slightly more worrisome annoyance. Taking a key, I personally feel should be automatic if the key is in the bunnies back. This would help keep things balance for those of us that like to carry a key in our back to preserve energy, and a back up key in our inventory.

lost niche
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The cards also take up inventory space, so you need to loot the bunny twice if they have a key in their back along with stuff in their inventory in order to place one. This takes a significant amount of time.
The cages just aren't worth using unless you're directly next to one. Better to chuck the bunny down the stairs.

dim flower
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Currently, the main way the devs have been balancing bunnies and magician is with the items found on the map. Its why the RNG of the game can be so incredibly brutal at times. Fireworks counter Imposters, Smoke counters ticket masters, cage traps counter the cages, and Cuddlebuns counter madness. adjusting drop rates on these items per floor makes a HUGE differance to game balance.

lost niche
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It's always a tightrope act when balancing an asymm game. Since it's 4 v 1 any small change to bunnies is equivalent to a more massive change for the hunter.

dim flower
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Agreed. plus, balance needs to be focused on a team of 4, and not just 4 individuals. Which means solo players have a rough time, but balance overall is good.\

frozen verge
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so just to add a bit of reasoning to this arguement. you post states you want to REMOVE critical success from struggles. now that said. theres one huge glaring issues your not seeing with that ask that makes it entirely unreasonable, if you hit all normal skill checks, the magician can pull your key, shake you down for your second key in inven, card you and then still throw you all before you even get 3/4 of the way out of struggle phase. what your asking for is entirely unreasonable, unfair, and RUINS the balance of the game for bunny and pretty much confirms magician would always be able to perform all possible actions. the game is hard enough as bunny against a proper magician, your asking for them to make it then impossible.

frozen verge
copper apex
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I think all the mechanics should be considered when talking about that, because that is not the only way bunnies can avoid damage.

That is a hot topic because it pops up every now and then.
Bunnies have marbles, rocket, now the cage trap and oils so they can avoid getting caught or at least take some time from magician. We cant compare much of gameplay now because people are learning, but im sure that when bunnies start working together, saving each other and doing everything at once people will probably complain a lot about missing a oportunity of getting one life gear out.

And yes, the game is hard for both sides, but it takes different strategies, knowledge and abilities to learn and do good in a match.

What i can see is that the skill check doesnt make any difference at all for new players because they dont manage to hit them, but for advanced players it makes a huge difference.

Maybe it could be a gear for magician? The gear could affect not only the skill check itself but other aspects too

lost niche
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Could steal some ideas from DBD like the Iron Grasp perk, or a variant of Agitation that speeds up the Magician's actions done with a live bunny in hand.

lime shale
# lost niche Could steal some ideas from DBD like the Iron Grasp perk, or a variant of Agitat...

This would be exponentially better than just erasing the Great Skill Checks entirely. Thanks for suggesting a possible alternative!
Increased Grip Gear(slightly longer time for rabbits to get out of your hand) sounds like a good idea for how to increase what the killer can do against a good survivor, while not making it entirely unfair for the survivor.
Maybe make a seperate thread just for this idea, so that it’s not just jumbled up in this 50 message long thread.