Fallout 4

[heavy pine]

Uhhhh

I dont mind homestuck

[brittle oar]

off topic but what would u say is a good hub to get LUTs?

[brittle oar]

U think the fandom isn’t that bad?

[modern hedge]

🤷‍♂️
I would just make them yourself honestly

[heavy pine]

Im js braindead to their Fandom is all

[shadow prawn]

how does rtx remix work on dx11

[lucid mesa]

A wrapper that takes everything needed from the game and sends it to RTX Remix via an API (I think)

[modern hedge]

basically yeah

[modern hedge]

#1489456366765473892 message

[shadow prawn]

does it run like shit

cause we already have rt and pt in skyrim

[modern hedge]

think she said it was running at like 20 fps rn

but a lot of that has to do with stuff not being culled I think

she's only been working on it for like 2 days lol

[shadow prawn]

fo4 culls aggressively

[modern hedge]

I think she might've stripped it out for rn

because you can't patch trace against stuff that's actively culled

[shadow prawn]

if this was some free and open thing I'd help but i can see they are already charging money for it

where do i try this

nonsense. you aren't in a single Skyrim modding server as far as i can see

[modern hedge]

https://github.com/Kim2091/Remix-Wrappers/releases

[raven flame]

Cool! I am glad to meet someone who is present in every Skyrim modding server on the planet and is able to judge based on aggregated views of every single community

[shadow prawn]

oh you were quoting

other guy is in places

[raven flame]

👍

[iron drum]

that's not the same thing

[iron drum]

it's just temporary until it's complete. afterward it will be made free & open source as previously stated. i appreciate the offer though

[iron drum]

the culling doesn't take effect because of the way this works

it's actually not culling anything

all cells are loaded

that's the biggest perf hit right there

[modern hedge]

did you publish the one that's ported over to xoxor's template?
assumed you hadn't 😅 lol

[iron drum]

you're thinking of FNV i think 🤔

that's the only one of my mods i ported to the new setup

the FO4 mod doesn't use it at all

[modern hedge]

doodlum replied to a message related to fnv

[iron drum]

oh oops

i didn't even notice

no i didn't release that one yet because it's a lot less stable

sorry 😅

[modern hedge]

it's okay lol

[iron drum]

anyway, i have the doc about FO4's skinning ready. i've been reviewing it and have some ideas on how to approach the implementation

it is easily the most complex system i've seen for a game so far for Remix compat. given that getting FNV's working properly was a challenge, i'm a bit scared lol

it's also a bit harder doing this through the API

i may have to modify the dxvk-remix side of things again to make this a bit easier

[iron drum]

so you're saying it'd be a waste of time to port Remix to Skyrim SE?

that was going to be my next project. porting this mod to it

[shadow prawn]

if you are trying to use our work that's under GPL you'll get DMCAd

[iron drum]

? i wasn't going to

i don't know what your problem is

and i'm only charging for the FO4 mod temporarily to help cover time and cost of developing this

i always pay attention to licenses and stuff with my work too

if i ported this it'd be completely independent from your work

[modern hedge]

-# gplv3 doesn't stop you from paywalling stuff either

[lucid mesa]

https://tenor.com/view/lion-sigma-alpha-how-bro-felt-after-saying-that-sigma-lion-gif-13957304746104521882

[modern hedge]

https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#DoesTheGPLAllowMoney

[iron drum]

either way, i don't see any reason i'd have to touch that source code

[iron drum]

there was some stuff revealed by it that i hadn't even considered

it applies a color overlay for characters to provide the skin colors without additional textures

i'm so used to working with older games and their pipelines. using vertex colors for things like this instead of dedicated passes in shaders

[heavy pine]

is this a good or bad thing

[iron drum]

it's another thing i have to manually parse and make work with Remix

so bad 😔

windows keeps breaking which is NOT helping

[heavy pine]

danm

bleh

[acoustic grotto]

Ugh. DA:O's character creation was a doozy to figure out as well for the same reason.

[iron drum]

aw 🙁

i may have to look into modding the base game at this point to make it more compatible, instead of trying to parse everything as is

[final siren]

Hadn't somebody done that before, or am i mistakened?

[iron drum]

Nukem was messing around with it, using a similar method to what i am

but it wasn't complete and faced a lot of issues

the idea is that because Fallout 4 and Skyrim SE aren't that different, i'd have an easier time porting the mod than someone else starting from scratch on it

ofc, the FO4 mod would also be open source by that point. so someone else could port it too if they wanted

[iron drum]

first image shows just how much the game loads into Remix currently

this is using remix's freecam, not tcl in game

there is 0 culling happening outside of distant cells being unloaded in favor of LOD versions (which currently do not render)

(technically isn't culling anyway)

[modern hedge]

and that's with precombined disabled correct?

[iron drum]

it is

it's a lot easier to parse things with that disabled

it's gonna be a pain in the ass to do it with it on 😭

[modern hedge]

good lol :p

the performance is so garbage with precombined disabled in vanilla lol

hopefully means that there might be more performance on the table if you can get working 🙏

[heavy pine]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1311163958157381744/1419764341347192953/ShiggyWiggyFastTransparent.gif

[iron drum]

that's cute

[fossil comet]

@iron drumit's probably because that dood is part of the community shaders project. you are direct competition and you will be even more so if you actually go through making that Skyrim se mod, that's the only thing that makes sense to me

also a quick disclaimer I am not attacking anyone or disrespecting anyone

[modern hedge]

why does it have to be a competition? that's my thing lol

[fossil comet]

I don't know but that's the only thing that makes sense to me

[modern hedge]

yeah

[iron drum]

i'd like my work to happily co-exist with everyone else's lol. i don't want to compete with anyone. but yes i think that makes the most sense given what happened

people can choose w/e they want. more options = better

like there's no need for threats 😭

[heavy pine]

I threatene you

Have a good time or else

Or else uhm uhn

Banned of of all social media

[iron drum]

silly

[fossil comet]

anyway in a more positive note the interior shots of the Vault and the furnace looks really great already

[modern hedge]

the hable was the right choice I think

vanilla looks a little washed out at times

[iron drum]

yeah i agree

AGX is too saturated compared to Hable in this instance too

though, i do need something between the Alyx and Uncharted 2 presets included for Hable

rn i'm just using the Alyx one

[iron drum]

which of these settings should i be adjusting to achieve ^

[modern hedge]

I would start with

0.15    Shoulder Strength
0.50   Linear Strength
0.10    Linear Angle
0.20   Toe Strength
0.02   Toe Numerator
0.30    Toe Denominator

and I think there might be a "direct" mode or something along those lines under tonemapping mode

[iron drum]

lmao

as soon as i clicked Direct it crashed

[iron drum]

these look pretty nice. a bit bright but i think i just need to adjust eye adaptation

[modern hedge]

I pulled the numbers from fallout 4 renodx

https://github.com/clshortfuse/renodx/blob/4eb0016de859d6065db4c28461add4b6203cc0f1/src/games/fallout4/15_tonemap_a_0x8024E8B5.ps_5_0.hlsl#L54

assume they are the numbers the game actually uses

[iron drum]

okay yeah Direct is broken

i might have broken it when i ported it

[modern hedge]

ahh lol

[iron drum]

definitely looks better than before

ty

[modern hedge]

np

[iron drum]

🤔 now how do i go about getting the game's colors in real-time

[modern hedge]

like the luts?

[iron drum]

yeah

w/e it uses for the color tinting

and how would i want to apply it in remix?

[modern hedge]

holy shit lol

[iron drum]

1000x better lol

[modern hedge]

It looks like the game uses a 16 x 16 x 16 texture for the luts

this block is how the luts get applied I think
https://github.com/clshortfuse/renodx/blob/4eb0016de859d6065db4c28461add4b6203cc0f1/src/games/fallout4/15_tonemap_a_0x8024E8B5.ps_5_0.hlsl#L87

[iron drum]

😠 if only those specular maps were working right for interiors

[iron drum]

would i want to somehow integrate this directly into the tonemapper? or would it be like a separate post processing effect

(i know very little about tonemapping lol)

[modern hedge]

looks like they are linear luts that get appied right after the tonemapping

[iron drum]

🙏 thank you renodx gods

vanilla game

(slightly different time of day. hard to replicate)

[modern hedge]

might be worth looking at the game's brdf shader to see if there are any changes you can make to the pbr approximation stuff

[iron drum]

in this case, it seems like these simply aren't being assigned roughness maps. they may be stored in a different way for these textures. i'll have to dump them manually and take a look

[modern hedge]

ahhh

[iron drum]

✨

the effects this is gonna have on the settlement system's lighting

i'm so excited lol

the vanilla game's lighting falls really really short there

[modern hedge]

that's siick

[iron drum]

part of the workshop UI works!

[modern hedge]

fyi if you want the tonemapping to be even more accurate to vanilla you can try to pass this cbuffer instead of hardcoding it to 0.02
https://github.com/clshortfuse/renodx/blob/4eb0016de859d6065db4c28461add4b6203cc0f1/src/games/fallout4/15_tonemap_a_0x8024E8B5.ps_5_0.hlsl#L61

[modern hedge]

I was wrong

the luts are gamma 2.2

not linear

[iron drum]

soooo how would i want to apply it then

[old fog]

it looks rlly good. golly

[iron drum]

#1489456366765473892 message

make sure you look at this one 😆

[old fog]

v excited to see more

maybe someday they'll make transformer work with ray reconstruction (i know that there's a lot there)

[iron drum]

that's already a thing 🙂

DLSS 4's RR is a transformer

it's what i'm using there

[heavy pine]

So is the pbr transfer from game to remix "easy" is it like a topbr or moreso a direct connection

[iron drum]

when Remix is running, it's pulling the texture information from the game's memory in real time (not from the files). it finds the albedo and assigns it to the parent mesh, then finds the normal map and converts it to octahedral format for Remix. then finally it finds the specular map, extracts one of the channels (iirc the G/green channel), inverts it, and assigns it as roughness

some of the meshes don't appear to have a specular map assigned though, which leads to them being ultra shiny

[heavy pine]

Aaah

[modern hedge]

after the tonemapping you'd want to encode to 2.2 gamma then apply the luts

[iron drum]

i'd like to know: what state would you guys want the mod to be in before you sub for it?

if it's kinda "never" then i should prob give up on the subscription idea

[heavy pine]

When the mod is in a state where its easy to plug and play, if not a little glitch

But

Im subbed regardless so idk if I count

[iron drum]

you do

you're subbed because you want to support us in general, not for the mod specifically 😆

[heavy pine]

Right

[iron drum]

right now it is a simple drag and drop install, and you can run around in it and do a bunch of stuff. but you can't really play it yet

next release will be playable. skinned meshes, pip boy, single window instead of the dual window thing

[heavy pine]

Id say playable in the sense of being able to walk around rather than like

Playable playable

[iron drum]

oh

well it's already like that

[heavy pine]

Testing for Unity rtx started eith little no geometry yet I had a blast testing that through stuff

So I think currently if I agai wasnt already, would subscribe to gain access for the sake of screwing around

[iron drum]

it is fun to mess around with right now

seeing areas in new lighting and all that

[heavy pine]

Thats kina the goal for any game I try to do

Like if I can at least move around and see say

Abt 50 ish percent of things

You bet im gonna play through the entire game js to see wtv

[iron drum]

my credits renew in ~40 mins. excited to work on the skinning implementation with all the new info we have

[iron drum]

oh. well um. 98% of things are visible and work okay

[heavy pine]

[iron drum]

only two things missing are glass/transparent objects and skinned meshes

[heavy pine]

Woaw

[iron drum]

some meshes are misplaced. they're animated and that isn't working right yet. but that's it really

😔 maybe i misunderstood what people will consider playable. i just didn't want anyone buying it thinking it's like 100% playable and functional

[heavy pine]

Will this be the base structure for other dx11 games? (Sorry if I keep being pestery abt other games n such

[iron drum]

dw. yes it will be. once i finish this mod i'm going to be stripping out all of the game specific stuff to make a template

anyone will be able to build on top of it

[heavy pine]

Nice

[hidden pond]

I'd be subbed now but cash is tight right now. soon...

[iron drum]

god

the skinning implementation is a nightmare

did live analysis to verify some findings, some were wrong and had to be fixed. then multiple review agents to make sure that they were written correctly. addresses were wrong, so they had to be fixed. then a whole lot more

~3 hours of verifying later, i'm finally implementing

[rustic compass]

We are making progress

[iron drum]

some

he turns upside down if i face him the other way

i don't know why

it's driving me nuts

[rustic compass]

[lucid mesa]

Have you tried doing a RTX Remix capture and pointing the AI at it? That alongside a rough description about what was wrong helped in Dark Souls.

Make sure it actually looks at the bone data in the capture

[iron drum]

hm. good idea

lol it just crashes when i try

[lucid mesa]

Hmm, maybe do it in a smaller area?

[iron drum]

no it's def the skinned meshes causing the crash

[iron drum]

@wary marlin you got any idea what could be causing this behavior?

when the character is facing in the direction it loads in, they're positioned normally (albeit horribly distorted). turning around causes the limbs to become inverted. legs are on top, arms are below. even the face and torso rotate

i think i'm gonna have to stop working on skinning for now because it's wasting a lot of time and credits, i can't get any further than this. will 100% need help with it

[wary marlin]

If thee mesh is ‘held together’ the matrices (bone and model to world) are properly referenced. It may be that they are not transposed at the right place, or the weights and indexes are not decoded properly, or the shader does extra shenanigans on verts.
Let me see if I can inspect the game myself.

[wary marlin]

float4 BoneOffsetCurrent; // cb12[35] - Current frame translation offset (x, z, y mapping)

Take a 3x4 matrix, transpose and add to the last row -BoneOffsetCurrent (float4 constant register 12)

Last row is a translation vector, so it makes sense that it adds an offset

(talk later, going out)

[wary marlin]

So it doesn't seem to do much with the bones, except that offset, and the fact that indexes are float value. The weird rotation could be because the bone matrix is not transposed ? (the 3x3 part of the matrix is rotation scaling). I can take a look at the code if you want, maybe I notice something.

[iron drum]

❤️ thank you

yes it's likely that it's not being transposed properly

[iron drum]

new plan to prevent certain people from using my work against me:

• get Skyrim SE working in an alpha state alongside FO4, open source both at the same time

(doodlum muted me for 24 hours in his server for talking about this project, despite others and himself talking about it just fine)

[modern hedge]

keep in mind they use reinhard tonemapping for skyrim

[lucid mesa]

What a baby

[iron drum]

anyone here mod Skyrim?

should i do AE or SE?

doing AE because that's what i own

[raven flame]

Holy meme

That's geniunely sad

[iron drum]

i broke his rule about not talking about paywalled mods

i missed it

but i didn't even know it'd be an issue because he started the discussion of it there

😔

[raven flame]

Oh

Hm

Then it is technically fair ig

Sad nonethless

[raven flame]

Did he outright muted you or at least gave a warning?

[iron drum]

the way he went about it def wasn't fair. he conveniently left out that it'll be open source soon, and ofc i was muted so i couldn't defend myself

[iron drum]

mute + warning

[iron drum]

thankfully someone nice there forwarded info from me about it being open source soon and w/e

[raven flame]

So at least you were vindicated in third person?

[iron drum]

people were asking me questions about the FO4 mod btw. that's the only reason i was talking about it there

[iron drum]

somewhat, yeah

[raven flame]

Wait, so someone asked you about it, you replied, and he muted you?

[iron drum]

yes

3 people were talking with me about it

[raven flame]

Okay, yeah, that's geniunely pathetic

[iron drum]

convo started by talking about texture work and how Remix functions. then someone asked about Fallout

[raven flame]

Well, obviously you were trying to promote your commertical project in greediest way possible

[iron drum]

😔

[raven flame]

Like no questions there, your honor!

I bet guy is just butthurt due to spotlight steal from his glory

So if you open source them indeed and will continue gathering convos - will be pretty fun

[final siren]

People were kinda like that when GTA 4 remix got tons of attention.
Xor had monitized his mod iirc and people got made about it.

[lucid mesa]

Shouts out to the community members discussing it normally

[iron drum]

ya for sure. they were all really nice

i'd love to talk with them more tbh

kinda hard to now though

[raven flame]

I bet for most players and many modders it's just new and improved stuff they can play with

[tame kestrel]

Yeah, this was an unexpectedly warm welcome

[raven flame]

But indeed some mod creators get overprotective about, I dunno, vibe of their own little corner?..

[tame kestrel]

Remix has mostly been alienated by original games' communities

[raven flame]

Well, I can quite well feel frustration from mods being paywalled

Considering how much that goes against long-standing spirit of modding

But one thing is paywalled mod

And other is patreoned ultra early access which is openly stated to going free when it's near being ready

[iron drum]

like 😭

i have put so much work into making this happen, and i'm the only person working on it

i need financial support to make it happen

wtf is wrong with that

i want to make it open source when it's ready/usable

[raven flame]

Honestly - I see it less about financial support

[tame kestrel]

And even so my personal opinion is that people are entitled to do whatever they want as long as they're in line with the law

[raven flame]

And more about not showing clearly unready thing to the wide world

[raven flame]

Entitled - sure

[tame kestrel]

I think Luke Ross was being shitted upon because of paywalling unfairly. The actual issue is thay his mods are shit lol

[raven flame]

But it doesn't authomatically make it good or even neutral

[iron drum]

no i def need financial support to make it ready to show to the world

[tame kestrel]

You saying that paywalling is inherently bad?

[raven flame]

Bad is probably excessive

But paywalling generally ready and comitted mod is questionable IMO

Having free mod + patreon is much more suitable, but can imagine this bringing MUCH less

And in-dev examples are obviously different beast

[iron drum]

imo it's kinda messy. this is someone's work. if they want to charge for it to support developing more mods, i don't see anything wrong with that. it does take a lot of time to develop things like this, and not everyone is in a stable enough situation to dedicate time to it without additional support

the SEUS PTGI dude did this, then when he stopped developing mods he made them all free

[tame kestrel]

I have nothing against paywalling again if it doesn't violate the rights of others

If the product is good then great

If it's not then oh well

[raven flame]

That's probably what I am having problem is

Equalising mods to product

[iron drum]

well, it's a lot of work put into it. so w/e

personally i wouldn't charge for a mod that's complete/not being developed anymore

but i can see why people do if it brings them steady income

[raven flame]

It's just that mods are so inherently unique phenomenon for gaming, and they have such a long and rich history

And just equalising them to product diminishes that

[tame kestrel]

I don’t think it's really fair to decide what a mod should be on modders' behalf

[raven flame]

Sure

And as I have said - I don't see it as inherently bad

Just... A bit sad?

[iron drum]

can't say i agree with this. the way i think about it is: would these mods even exist if they weren't able to be funded in this way? imo it's better to have it in one form than not at all

[raven flame]

That's a fair argument too, yeah

[final siren]

On a semi-irrelevent note, Sonic Ether somehow still has 918 paid members on patreon.

[raven flame]

And it goes hand in hand with having free mod + patreon or paid EA

[iron drum]

like, as someone who does NOT have steady income and has struggled with being poor their whole lives... the concept of making money doing something i love is really enticing and i'd love to have that kind of position

[raven flame]

But dam, just imagine if They Hunger was paid back in the day!

Prepostreous!

[raven flame]

Oh absolutely

Situations where money influx is literally make it or break it for mod are quite different IMO

[iron drum]

that is indeed my situation

if i hadn't received donations for my software dev work, it wouldn't exist either

if i had charged for it, i'd have prob 5x the amount lol

[raven flame]

And as I said - at least for me paid EA is quite different from paid mod period

In any case, that's just a humble opinion of some rando)

[iron drum]

i wish i wasn't already being harassed over it 😭

[raven flame]

Let's be honest - you aren't harassed over it

[iron drum]

🤔

[tame kestrel]

[raven flame]

It's just a justification

Just too shiny work in wrong corner of the net

[iron drum]

i don't understand

[tame kestrel]

A person can deside for themselves whether they are being harassed or not

What kind of gaslight is this

[raven flame]

I mean that the real reason for harassment is hardly paid status IMO

Like, it doesn't look that way for me

Just someone was glad they fould a public reason for that

[acoustic grotto]

Ah, you mean they are just using that as an excuse to treat Kim the way they are.

[iron drum]

ah

maybe yeah

doodlum's behavior definitely feels like harassment to me atp

and some others have gotten on me about it too

[modern hedge]

oh no you're trying to get paid for your work...
the horror

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/doug-maclean-mac-maclean-doug-sportsnet-gif-12484306793259547039

[tame kestrel]

One of the reasons why I think it is important to hold a strong personal stance regarding such things

People are sheep sadly

Common sense must be valued

[modern hedge]

You've put a non insignificant amount of time and money into this already so putting behind a payway for early testing isn't unreasonable and if anything is smart because the people willing to pay for beta software are probably going to be more helpful in testing than the average user

[raven flame]

Not just that - putting out early work for public view can be quite detrimental

People on average just DON'T understand what "work in progress" means

So it's either paywalled EA or just literally waiting for it to be ready before announcing

[tame kestrel]

Honestly yeah, we've had an absolute disaster of a review on Painkiller RTX ModDB 😄

[raven flame]

Second one is definitely much sadder

[modern hedge]

exactlyol

[raven flame]

Motivation alone would be in shambles most of the time

[iron drum]

The Fallout 4 mod is now free in my server: https://discord.gg/nwtGYKrV

[karmic river]

niceee

but why tho?

thought you wanted to make it fully compatible before making it free?

[iron drum]

no one was subbing, so i was essentially gatekeeping the mod for absolutely no benefit

[karmic river]

i hope someone will help with it now

[iron drum]

it's closed source still. won't be too long before it's open source though

if anyone plays it and tests, please give feedback and report bugs

[shell cedar]

okey

[iron drum]

i'd prefer it if that was done in my server in the proper channels though 🙏

[shell cedar]

roger

https://tenor.com/view/rogerroger-star-wars-gif-24538011

[thin swallow]

I agree completely. I remember him being an arrogant prick to a couple people in the original Skyrim LE post when everyone else just wanted to help. I would just block him and move on, that's what I did. No need to take shit from that guy.

[dire canyon]

some of these people get super offended just for asking questions. i say its their fault for revolving their lives around video games, and a single old one at that

[thin swallow]

Totally agree!

[iron drum]

currently backporting the improvements from skyrim to fo4

[iron drum]

ehe

first render with the new pipeline

see that? 60 FPS. and it's rendering FAR more than it did before while having more than double the FPS

we have moved mostly away from F4SE now

it just doesn't provide most of the info we need

this... unfortunately also means that this mod will be locked to one version of the game unless i do RE again on a new update. so lets 🙏 that they never update the game again 😭

[shell cedar]

that ram usage tho

[river shadow]

prob has a shit ton of stuff running

other than the game

[hidden pond]

idk I'm pretty sure the Skyrim compatibly mod pulls about those same numbers with just it running...

[cosmic urchin]

oh no

they update shit so randomly

hope they don't do it again

[hidden pond]

||there's def gonna be a update this year||

[cosmic urchin]

probably 🙃🫩

[iron drum]

yeah the game is only using ~10 GB

[iron drum]

textures are fixed

[heavy pine]

yay

[iron drum]

fully GPU bound too ✨

✨ optimization

[heavy pine]

woaw

✨

[acoustic grotto]

That is actually really good. No CPU bottleneck, almost a full 60 FPS at full resolution... you love to see it.

[iron drum]

ohh right

the best part about this rendering method is that i can turn the combined meshes back on

[iron drum]

woww. even less cpu bound now and more LODs render

i never thought i'd see FO4 Remix at 60 FPS like this with all of it rendered...

[acoustic grotto]

Let this be a lesson to you the next time you doubt yourself!

Truly magnificent. The boundaries continue to be pushed back

[modern hedge]

damn fallout 4 remix probably running better than halo now lol

[iron drum]

😅

trees are sad but... look! LODs

[silk anvil]

Honestly this may make me re look at my modlist that i put on pause for a few months! If I can finnaly throw away enb that'll be lovely

[oak quest]

can you share your workflow (new pipline) how to tell the ai agent what do to? how to explain to him exactly that i want to make my game patch traced etc? its so hard to explain it to him with each game 😭

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/vibe-coding-kai-lentit-gif-8970542015069914600

gif tutorial of my workflow.

[iron drum]

so

✨

got LODs fixed some

[gaunt stratus]

where did the black levels go

[iron drum]

it's the volumetrics causing issues rn

doors and the guns work now

[heavy pine]

oooooh

[iron drum]

ehehe

✨

i'm so happy! it's coming along SO well now

and it's running so much better than it used to

now that we have alphas working for foliage, perf is a bit lower unfortunately. but they can be replaced later with real meshes

so much is being rendered

just to give you guys an idea: right now culling is completely disabled. it's rendering basically the ENTIRE map and it's still sitting around 20 FPS here. with culling it'll be a lot more performant

[oak quest]

@iron drum

[iron drum]

i'm sorry, i'm so tired/fatigued right now that i can barely even work on this, let alone write up info for that kind of thing

if you can tell us what game it is, i'll try tomorrow or later tonight

[oak quest]

🫂 ok totally understandable thank you goat 🫂

the game is Witcher 2

[iron drum]

✨

water

it only took 10 hours 😭

[oak quest]

its so crazy how far we come i remember in 2023 everybody still tried to make half life 2 rtx remix stable 🥹

[iron drum]

😅 yeah

and the spreadsheet we had back then

[oak quest]

🥹 good times

[rustic compass]

Need to update a lot more games now because there's like a few dozen of incompatible games working

[iron drum]

i did have it looking prettier than this, animated + reflections + transparency. but it had a lot of very strange issues with reflections, so i decided that i'm just gonna replace it in the toolkit instead

[shell cedar]

That looks like the water normal texture

[iron drum]

no this is what i did intentionally

[iron drum]

m

time of day is hooked up

weather isn't gonna be fun. i pretty much can't do it right now unless i manually expand CR's sky implementation

i guess i should focus on implementing culling now

[iron drum]

there are some issues right now with object positioning

most are fine, but more minor objects (those you can normally place in the settlement builder) lose their transforms and positioning

[heavy pine]

ooh

is it because they are custom

?

[iron drum]

it seems like they use a different method for storing their positioning vs the normal world objects 🙁

[heavy pine]

oof

[iron drum]

😭

[shell cedar]

Can objects be repositioned in toolkit?

I imagine it's because fallout using the havok system

For nifs

Like this

Havok is messy

[iron drum]

okay

i think i'm going to clean up the repository for FO4 and Skyrim and make them public soon

i'm gonna need help finishing it up

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/many-hands-make-light-work-gif-24070543

[iron drum]

✨ repo is cleaned up

[shell cedar]

i wait

was nv fixed?

[iron drum]

turning off precombines fixes it almost entirely

unfortunately it looks like we're going to have to go back to that

[iron drum]

NV is already fully playable except for some issues with fake shadows

i'm sure you guys are tired of seeing the same areas over and over

it's a good test though

this is with the completely reworked plugin. almost all of the code was rewritten or modified to be more efficient

also this game is a rare case where RR is actually worse in most ways

[raven flame]

Interesting, how so?

Smoothes over things too much?

[iron drum]

lots of flickering mainly. the textures in fo4 have enough detail that it confuses RR a lot it seems

also all of the alpha cutouts for trees, RR erases most of the branches on them

[astral sapphire]

so interesting to see fallout 4 working with remix i havent used remix in along time ngl last games i tryed were like JC2 and like command and conquer renengade lol and i dont even know how to install remix into anything nowadays i was using some method of dragging files into a game and doing it that way.

[iron drum]

😊 lod trees are fixed now

working on these decals next

[gaunt stratus]

how does the main boston area run

[hidden pond]

holy loaded assets batman

[gaunt stratus]

vanilla game would crawl there

[iron drum]

with precombines on, around 50-60 FPS believe it or not. this is with them off though because it's causing some weird issues with object placement

this was closer to 30 FPS

[hidden pond]

placement ?hmm. I wonder if that's just a vanilla issue or something. I assume you are running the game as close to vanilla as possible right? anyways This is from the PRP repair pack FAQ.

" What is PRP?
The Previsibines Repair Pack is a full rebuild of the game's precombine meshes and occlusion information to lower draw calls, cull duplicate references, and** fix placement errors** that the unofficial team cannot fix without disabling them."

https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/46403

might be worth a shot installing to try to see if that fixes the issue...

[iron drum]

yeah

i was just about to try that actually

alsooo

the REALLY neat part about using the remix api is that just about every mod you can imagine for fo4 will be directly compatible, with the exception of graphics mods

even UI mods should work

[hidden pond]

yeah i noticed that with Skyrim. super sick

[iron drum]

i have a new build for you guys to play with

will share it in ~30 mins

well

i'm really angry

i forgot this new version of FO4 was a thing. maybe that's the issue u were having @hidden pond

this mod was made for the "next gen update" but not the ridiculously priced new version

if you have the new one then it wouldn't work

god...

i guess maybe i should update it

since like 90% of the mods require it now

#1490217004408246313 message

invite for anyone who hasn't joined: https://discord.gg/FA6U2wCHxy

v0.0.2 is released

[hidden pond]

uh... wait I don't think I tried fallout 4 and your mod yet. Skyrim I tried but havent tried f4 yet. was waiting for the back port of the recent stuff you did.

I still have the old version of fo4 installed before the AE update atm. when it dropped I heard it broke a shit ton of mods so I was waitng for mod update before even hitting update on steam. good to know 90% the mods have updated though. I'll prob move to AE in that case.

[iron drum]

🤔 hm

guess i'm just confused

not unusual

[hidden pond]

Yeah that's cool . just for a refresh: Skyrim started refusing to run the last version of the mod I tried but yeah.

[hidden pond]

The more I see Your work though makes Me feel that it might be worthwhile to go the API route for most games that are supported by huge modding communities due to how compatible going that route seems to be compatible with mods.

[iron drum]

meehhhh

there are so many drawbacks to using this method

if there was a different one available, i'd absolutely be using it instead

the FFP conversion mods are hard enough. this is like 10x harder 😭

i suppose it could be worth it in very specific circumstances

it's just so difficult

[hidden pond]

We're gonna need a bigger AI!

[iron drum]

they are already nerfing 4.7 a bit. not much but it's noticeable

i wanted to try gpt 5.5 but i don't have access to it

[iron drum]

Bethesda left "function=Always" in NiAlphaProperty for half of FO4's alpha-cutout assets, vanilla DX11 hides it with a hardcoded discard, Remix's path tracer doesn't, and the surfaces render solid. ONE LINE of override, fixes the whole class.

fuck you bethesda

this took 2 days to fix

[iron drum]

.

that's fixed now

next: attempt once again to fix object positioning

[shell cedar]

no space left or i would test the new build @iron drum

[fossil comet]

@iron drumI don't know if they're willing to work with you but I suggest you might want to reach out to Asciimov they seem to know a lot about the creation engine and have released a lot of Mods that modify and fix some core issues with both Skyrim and Fallout 4

[iron drum]

that's a good idea

i just am hesitant to bring anyone else on the project when my health is so poor. i don't want to cause them issues by not being available to discuss things

[iron drum]

thanks to @hidden pond

[hidden pond]

That reminds Me: You should be able to gain full control over the "fake" light that Beth uses for the night GI. In Morrowind it is called Light 6. This is the light you should see at night that is the shadow caster/light source that is detected by remix at night and is prob not currently synced to that moon I'd assume right? You can then attach that light to your procedural moon/make it follow it's orbit. You can also Make Your moon follow the original light source as well but if it's again like any of beths other games, it's gonna make for some interesting orbit path for your moon ,So you are better off doing this if all of the above is true: Gain full control over the light and attach it to your moon. Find the games billboards for the moon and make your moon sync to that. Attach the vanilla "GI" light to your moon and now you have everything synced.

[gaunt stratus]

atmos night sky?

[hidden pond]

You can see how I did all that in the repo I think, most of that is wrapper side I think so the other repo but I do have a better detailed doc on what I did for Morrowind I can dm you though if you want it that might have the full details.

[iron drum]

yes ✨

i reworked the moon system and some of the variables to make it more tweakable per game. but otherwise it's all @hidden pond's work

[gaunt stratus]

will it be available in the remix plus repo?

[hidden pond]

Mostly Claude's work and it's all heavily based on the frostbite paper from Your original PBR sky implementation and a few other resources/papers. I can just prompt pretty good I guess and have a basic grasp of how stuff works instead of asking for " gta 6 please"

Protip: always asume your AI is gaslighting YOu btw.

[iron drum]

that's where it's implemented rn, it's not pushed yet though

[hidden pond]

I'm just glad it seems it wasn't very hard for You to separate it from the Morrowind stuff I did. It's def not a super refined system yet and there's def room for improvement but as as base I'm really surprised it all turned out as good as it did. 🙂

[iron drum]

i'm getting the moon and stars connected up as a proof of concept for fo4

making sure the API connections all work properly in plus

[iron drum]

you did a good job with it, dw! most of it was easy to separate

[iron drum]

@hidden pond 😭 they kept the TES moon names for FO4

[modern hedge]

lmfao

[hidden pond]

I love this studio lol

they must say to their devs "if it isn't broke don't touch it, like at all. Not even renames." absolute jenga tower of a engine prob would collapse if they changed the moon name really.

You should come work on MW after so you learn the DNA of this shit lol. prob take everything you could learn forward through the iterations of the engine for remix usage.

[iron drum]

✨

[heavy pine]

Wrong reaction

Gosh we hate double tap

[modern hedge]

forgot how bright fallout 4's nights are

[hidden pond]

yeah they are basically as bright as day in vanilla. Always played with the Darker Nights mod on the darkest preset.

[atomic mantle]

On moonlit nights, the nights should be brighter. Are you working on rendering stars and clouds?

[hidden pond]

Stars are in. I just did a cloud System though that can be used.

[iron drum]

finishing up the star/night sky implementation

[iron drum]

okay

night sky is pushed. working on the clouds now @hidden pond

there is a minor issue rn with the night sky stuff. the stars and milky way simulation need more things to tweak

[iron drum]

@hidden pond amazing work

i'm gonna rework it to have more depth and more options, but as is it's pretty versatile

[final siren]

clouds in regular dxvk remix when

[iron drum]

well, this fork (remix plus) is meant to be easy to maintain. so it doesn't need to be in normal remix. plus with how pwerformance intensive a lot of the sky stuff is, i don't think they'd want it?

[hidden pond]

Yeah I think I from now on what I'll do is spec into a design philosophy that keeps that in mind when adding features from now on that might end up ported.

anything specific You want or need with it currently?

[brittle oar]

fallout 4 clouds?

[iron drum]

i'm enhancing it currently. making the clouds volumetric, adjustable samples per ray, etc.

the baseline cloud implementation is already in my fork btw

[iron drum]

thanks to goku yus

[hidden pond]

yeah it's pretty impressive for a near one shot. I haven't had much time to add anything to it though. just committed it barebones just to get that far into it at least.

[iron drum]

if you add anything else, could you base it on my latest commits please? it'll be a lot easier to add in

[brittle oar]

ah nice they were able to translate fallout 4 clouds into remix?

[hidden pond]

sure can! and is what i'd perfer. teamwork makes the dream work

[rustic compass]

these clouds look so natural

is this all procedurally generated?

[hidden pond]

better then that. I added procedurally generated clouds

[raw flame]

How much performance do they consume?

[hidden pond]

none I don;t think. very cheap.

[iron drum]

in my sample i went from 15 FPS to 13 FPS by turning it on

[brittle oar]

what method did u use?

[rustic compass]

volumetric or, how is that being rendered?

pretty nice results btw

[hidden pond]

One minute. I'll get the details.

[iron drum]

these are not volumetric. they're almost like 2d planes

[rustic compass]

still looks good

[raw flame]

How do they look at sunsets? In Fallout 4 they turn orange and it looks really beautiful.

[iron drum]

it does

but at longer distances it does kinda fall apart imo

[hidden pond]

I'll be adding a thing for sunsets and sunrise soon...

as well.

[rustic compass]

i think they might react to light, like how clouds look around edges

[hidden pond]

but yeah looks decent as is

[iron drum]

hang on, don't do anything until i finish the volumetric version because it'll do this automatically

it'll directly react to the sun and sky color

[hidden pond]

yeah I mean later. like 12 hours or longer for sure. got a wicked headache

[iron drum]

hope u feel better

and thank you for doing this

[iron drum]

doesn't do that yet

[hidden pond]

No worries. That's what community is for!

[iron drum]

my goal is to get a basic volumetric version in that doesn't cost too much more than the existing system. if that's not possible then i'll include an option to use the current version

[brittle oar]

like the method u used?

i wonder how many cloud techniques there are out there for vulkan

[rustic compass]

i hope volumetrics work, so we could see those beautiful god rays

[raw flame]

Not much, but something that could help to partially cover it would be large clouds.

[brittle oar]

found a paper that said it would do volumetric clouds fast but turns out its just volumetric clouds rendered in datafarms then streamed to ur game

💔

terrible

[final siren]

you guys should add a weather system with procedually generated tornados and stuff

[iron drum]

😭 r u tryin to kill us

[brittle oar]

found this ig https://cescg.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/Sakmary-Real-time-Rendering-of-Atmosphere-and-Clouds-in-Vulkan.pdf

how pretty

[hidden pond]

Maybe...

[iron drum]

biggest problem is efficiency of volumetrics in path tracing vs a normal renderer

also the way the sky works is very separate from the normal game world afaik

it would be incredibly difficult to connect it naturally for things like tornados

same problem for godrays 🙁

[brittle oar]

why not have it done thru raster? i dont see why we couldn't combine PT and raster effects, even if its not technically accurate to IRL

[iron drum]

that's a lot easier said than done

[rustic compass]

compositing results would work, but they would mess with upscaler or some other thing

[iron drum]

goku has been doing great work with the sky stuff. he'd probably manage to pull this stuff off 😅

i just can't

[hidden pond]

Current cloud features

• FBM-based procedural clouds at a configurable altitude (default 3 km)
• Weather-driven coverage, smoothly interpolated during weather transitions
• Wind-driven UV scrolling with configurable speed and direction
• Sun lighting: Lambertian diffuse core plus Henyey-Greenstein silver lining
• Cloud self-shadowing via 4-tap Beer-Lambert along the sun direction
• Cloud ground shadow: overcast weather dims both NEE sun sampling and the
  atmospheric color through getTransmittanceToSun
• Night mode: clouds lit dimly by Secunda (weighted by phase) plus a faint
  airglow floor so overcast nights aren't pitch black
• Horizon fade to hide the sphere tangent line
• Atmospheric extinction: sun reaching the cloud top is attenuated by the
  same getTransmittanceToSun path used everywhere else, so golden-hour
  clouds automatically pick up the warm tint
• Full UI: every parameter exposed as a live slider under Sky Tuning
• Works in all three evalSkyRadiance call sites (primary, direct-NEE,
  indirect-bounce) without per-pipeline tweaks

The cloud layer is rendered procedurally
from hash-based FBM noise that was already in atmosphere_common.slangh for
the moon surfaces and galactic band. No new textures, no new bindings, no
compute pass. Works in every evalSkyRadiance call site
(geometry_resolver.slangh, integrator_direct.slangh,
integrator_indirect.slangh) automatically.

[brittle oar]

💔

just hope adding in raster techniques isn't out of the question if its easier/performs better

[brittle oar]

and hopefully this is all solved preferably by march 2027

[rustic compass]

DAYYUM

[hidden pond]

should be possible

[rustic compass]

it already does a lot of things

that i wanted to see

[hidden pond]

IKR

one shot the thing too

[iron drum]

i did notice some issues with the ground shadows. they don't work for me, but that could be a problem with my port

[brittle oar]

i hope with the ability of 2d clouds being generated, it means there's a way to add in your own cloud textures

[iron drum]

but it's pretty amazing already

[rustic compass]

IES next

[brittle oar]

also everyone should look at decima's clouds https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B-D275g6LH7LOE1RcVFERGpkS28/view?resourcekey=0-P04mYcVQ1lDPdn7FDunEIw

like oh my god im gonna cry

[rustic compass]

does the current cloud implementation follow naturally occurring cloud shapes or types?

[brittle oar]

we'd have IES by now if remix had a plugin system ong

one day we'll have a system for devs to easily implement new features/techniques like unreal or blender

[rustic compass]

we will have Remix AI do all the remixing for us

[brittle oar]

they will never do clouds this pretty

https://advances.realtimerendering.com/s2023/Nubis Cubed (Advances 2023).pdf

ngl decima should just give me their volumetric cloud code

[rustic compass]

is gta 6 even going to compete with this

those clouds look majestic

[brittle oar]

again decima should just give me their cloud code

https://github.com/YueZhang1027/CIS5650-Final-Project-Frostnova

someone implemented it in vulkan

[final siren]

there's no way this isn't rendered

[brittle oar]

nah i dont think, geometry looks video gamey with the lighting

[iron drum]

doesn't have a license, otherwise i'd take a crack at it

@hidden pond did you cite the papers you used as sources in the code? that's important to do

[brittle oar]

what about this https://gitee.com/jett-rot/Project-VolumetricCloudRendering

[hidden pond]

Meh wait a year and AI will be able to one shot full volumetric clouds like from the frostbite paper or w/e the heck else we want.

[hidden pond]

uh. 50/50 chance on that. Where should I add that to anyways? never did this sstuff before really to this depth.

[iron drum]

should be in the comments at the top of the code

it's important because when implementing code based on papers, licensing is iffy/messy

[brittle oar]

its a shame i see stuff like this cause it looks so cool but they never credit what papers/code they were using https://www.patreon.com/posts/139879553

same with MC shaders

like dont be gatekeepin u can tell us

[iron drum]

🥺

lets see how it looks

[hidden pond]

on it.

[iron drum]

what do you guys think

[hidden pond]

these are the two papers I supplied the AI with at the start of the project. The frostbite one most people that followed CR's work on the Atmos sky probably already seen that one seen before.

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/funny-gif-797109095501667511

[iron drum]

also 👀

it's the same perf hit as the old system

[final siren]

needs a little more detail, a little too "blurry" looking

[iron drum]

i'll add it in

[iron drum]

better?

[final siren]

maybe a little more depth also

[iron drum]

can't do that without it requiring more samples, which does harm perf

[brittle oar]

now thats gmod volumetric clouds if i've even seen it

[heavy pine]

Cant wait to add this into fire watch
-# once everything renders right

[rustic compass]

Now these sorta looks like volumetric to me

[raw flame]

I think they look a little squashed, I think that makes it look weird in the background

[hidden pond]

I got it all added to the code now and ready to push to My repo with the proper credits citations, You want me to still wait?

[raw flame]

How do they look with fog?

[iron drum]

they are actually volumetric, just with some limitations imposed intentionally to keep performance sane

[iron drum]

again not something that can really be fixed without making this run at like 5 FPS

[iron drum]

you can go ahead and i'll cherrypick it

ty

[rustic compass]

ayeo, volumetric clouds in remix

Looks better, and they even react to lighting

[iron drum]

because they change color from the sun more now, they also change the color of the landscape more too

everything has an orange-y color to it now

[brittle oar]

is it planned to have the clouds in the distance slightly curve/lower in height?

[hidden pond]

prob be able to fix that somehow

[brittle oar]

cause curvature of the earth

[iron drum]

no that's a good thing

[hidden pond]

ah lol

[iron drum]

can try it

no clouds in the same scene

it looks so much more natural with them omg

[iron drum]

@gaunt stratus look what we did! goku implemented the base system and i gave it a bit more depth

i'm gonna work on optimizing it now and getting it to look a bit more natural

[raw flame]

But how does it look with fog? To see if that helps the background.

[brittle oar]

what paper did u use for the clouds?

[iron drum]

fog isn't working properly in FO4 rn

[iron drum]

it's custom code based on the code goku implemented. no paper used for this step

[rustic compass]

Is this banding pattern supposed to be here? Or an older version of fBM clouds

[iron drum]

that's probably just from it sitting on the same exact frame for like 5 mins

dlss gets artifacty when that happens

[brittle oar]

ah ok

[gaunt stratus]

nice, though they look very squished? almost the same issue as my implementation. I think they're not interacting with the remix camera correctly

[iron drum]

😔

it's only squished because having them deeper harms performance more (it requires more samples to look okay)

[gaunt stratus]

are we sure? even flat 2d clouds shouldn't look compressed like that

[brittle oar]

maybe its could be the 2d clouds being given depth?

[brittle oar]

this is how it looks without the added depth

[iron drum]

@gaunt stratus this was the pure 2d implementation

yes

[iron drum]

and yes i'm sure

i tested it

[gaunt stratus]

perhaps they need to curved around the atmosphere because it literally looks like a completely flat 2d plane

its very off-putting

[iron drum]

😔 u should read the chat

[gaunt stratus]

yes i know they're 2d

that's not my issue

[iron drum]

curvature is already planned, these are not 2d, they're voluemetric and ray marched

[gaunt stratus]

guh now im confused, so y'all are doing two different implementations?

ah nvm i think i get it

[iron drum]

the biggest problem rn with higher depth amounts is that the cloud shape up higher does not change

[iron drum]

no, i built on top of the 2d implementation

[hidden pond]

the 2d implementation I'd intended to be a steeping stone to something bigger and better eventually anyways really. just a stop gap for now.

[gaunt stratus]

2d one looks great

[raw flame]

Yeah, I also think that 2D would allow for the easy creation of other types of clouds.

[brittle oar]

or we could ask decima nicely for their clouds

[iron drum]

the voluemtric system already allows for this, it's fully configurable. it builds on what goku did for the 2d system (which allowed for different types too)

i'm trying to refine it

ig cuz you guys prefer 2d rn i'll add it back in as an option (if i can find a way to without harming perf at least)

[hidden pond]

more options the better for sure.

[brittle oar]

hope you're able to take concepts from other more refined papers/implementations of 3d volumetric clouds if u want this to be the base choice of volumetric clouds in remix

[hidden pond]

technically we can feed it any paper/concept really

[iron drum]

you guys are being kinda harsh for something that's an initial implementation

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/truing-true-true-that-true-dat-dats-true-gif-5975729414943393288

[raven flame]

Don't take it as people being harsh. I can bet that everyone here greatly appreciate your work. Take it more as people being honest

Volunetric clouds are based and volumetric clouds in Remix are triple based!

But there is some banding present. Dunno if clouds themselves or actual accumulation error

[hidden pond]

Nothings final though really. Nothing wrong with criticism. Nothing worse then a yes-man.

[hidden pond]

might be discord or just the screen shot. If HDR was on it will do that banding when going to png.

[iron drum]

no i appreciate criticism, now i'm implementing fixes based on it. like curvature, depth, etc.. i do want it to be better

but like 4 people piling on and not even reading the chat before pointing out the same flaw over and over was pretty frustrating

it'll be ready in an hour or so

[hidden pond]

there's no banding on my screen when I'm playing anyway. but most videos and screens of the render and it usually has banding from what I noticed. discord compression makes it even worse I think

[iron drum]

current additions:

• curvature
• change in cloud shape for depth
• better blurring between layers so higher sample count isn't as necessary
• improving performance

[iron drum]

the banding was def just from it sitting for 5 mins on the same frame

your implementation is pretty much perfect as is

[raw flame]

I mean, I know there are limitations, but I don't know exactly where they begin.

[hidden pond]

i've documented the current limitations somewhere...

think its in clouds.md on the test branch on my repo. should have that listed I think

[brittle oar]

only CR mentioned the lack of curvature and dan was only asking questions, none of us want to pile on you dw we all understand ur doing this in your free time and we appreciate it and that this is only early beginning work

you and goku are appreciated for the work thats being done

🔥

[gaunt stratus]

yes, i apologize if i sounded harsh

[hidden pond]

all I got say is I'm thankful to CR for the sky in the first place. With out that work I would not have been able to produce anything of value. CR is the real hero here In My eyes.

[final siren]

owner role for CR

[iron drum]

what do you guys think about this

still need the curvature added

[raw flame]

Yeah, that makes it much prettier.

[gaunt stratus]

much better

how does lighting work for these? raymarching?

[iron drum]

yeah

[gaunt stratus]

what currently influences it? just the sun? they look uniformly grey-ish

[iron drum]

sun + skybox color

working on the gray appearance, it's not intentional

[gaunt stratus]

gotcha

[iron drum]

i think it's from the shadow related stuff

(cloud shadows affect the game world)

it seems to be tinting the clouds a bit too heavily

hehe

new rendering solution. no more layers. only 3 samples here (as opposed to 12 samples in the image from ~10 mins ago). looks just as good i think

well, a bit noisy. but 5 samples would fix that

[hidden pond]

the clouds.md file should have some stuff about the shadow and transmittance implementation in a bit of small detail.

[brittle oar]

i want you to make the volumetric clouds simulate IRL by tomorrow ❤️

[gaunt stratus]

no, next 3 hours 🕜

[hidden pond]

No now

[iron drum]

so obviously vanilla clouds are prettier. they have the advantage of well... being made by someone who knows this stuff a lot better (and it is just images anyway)

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/ahoklollmao-sigma-oh-yeah-i-agree-american-psycho-gif-2344314189969571426

[raw flame]

Could you blur it a little to mask the noise?

[iron drum]

just increased the samples to 5. perf is basically the same, and noise is gone now

[raw flame]

They look pretty good in the base game, but I don't know what happened to them in Far Harbor.

[hidden pond]

far harbour has it's own weather I think. Should be able to be handled though. prob has something special they need to be flagged or something.

Might just need to hook it up to sync to the games weather data. I assume it's just on a single "preset" currently for the implementation or is it already hooked? should be the same process aswhat I did for morrowind really if you want to pull the data

[iron drum]

i already got the hooks for all of the weather states. just need to make custom configurations for each

and uh

it'll be ~30 weather types iirc 😭

[hidden pond]

lol. oh dear.

yeah I'd say once you hook the weather it'll fix it self.

[iron drum]

this is vanilla btw. they were just saying vanilla far harbor clouds looked bad

[hidden pond]

lol omg holy shit I though it was the sky stuff just bugging out. .. wtf lol. Yeah I use weather mods anyways so My experience with what the vanilla fh weather looks like has faded apparently

[iron drum]

i'm collapsing a lot of the shaders that were added for this, they kinda murdered performance. should help quite a bit

then i'm gonna try to fix the cloud colors

@hidden pond are you able to test the build for this by chance? i wanna see if the perf is good for you

[hidden pond]

I'm away from My Rig for a bit but I can when I get back. Might be a few hours though Idk.

[iron drum]

🫂 no worries

[heavy pine]

Wawa

[iron drum]

[iron drum]

ah right i forgot to update

i'm testing it in other games to make sure it works properly

[heavy pine]

https://tenor.com/view/caseoh-caseoh-twitch-take-a-picture-picture-moment-in-history-gif-18128752694931999774

Looks so good

[iron drum]

🥺

trying to find the right parameters for fnv specifically

[raw flame]

Can you make them absorb more light? So they have more contrast.

for reference

[iron drum]

it's just not as realistic

[iron drum]

i thiiink it's in a good enough state to publish now?

@hidden pond ur opinion? since u made the original ❤️

[raw flame]

All that's missing is the fog. it doesn't work in the current runtime version, or does it just need to be connected to the game?

[iron drum]

I'm sorry about earlier. a lot of shit has been happening and I'm really struggling to do anything right now

[iron drum]

it's not a runtime issue, it's just an issue with FO4

fog works in fnv. fog is more of a per game tweak and I didn't feel like messing with it tbh. maybe tomorrow

[iron drum]

ohh right

perf cost seems to be about 3-6%

[rustic compass]

The original fallout 4 clouds have clouds at different altitudes, so there's like a composition layer that's making it feel more natural

[iron drum]

I need to change out the noise type to allow for bigger variation in cloud size and density

and allow height variation ya

[hidden pond]

Yeah it looks great to Me! Could always return to it later as well to fine tune it as well if You aren't fully happy with it. It is not exactly a boring system to work on after all imo.

[iron drum]

❤️

i'm working on expanding it right now. adding height variation, a different noise implementation to break it up a bit more... and kinda maybe directly referencing the Nubis paper and copying a lot of stuff

[hidden pond]

I kinda pushed this out the door yesterday. I wanted to just get the base into Sparkles hands. We could do a multi layer cloud system. I have a whole doc of ideas ready to go to try to put in action.

to list a few:

A. Multi-Layer Cloud System (Dynamic + Static)

• Static cloud heightmap (procedural or from .cld if available) for large-scale form.
• Dynamic turbulence (3D noise + time) for movement, driven by a simple wind vector (configurable speed/direction).
• Layering: at least 2 layers with different altitude, opacity, and scatter contribution.
• Tunable via UI: coverage, drift speed, turb strength, layer offset.
• Generic value: works for open-world or 3D environment hosts.

B. More Celestial/Celestial Events

C. Time-Of-Day Color Gradient & Ground Albedo Influence

D. Atmospheric Pre-Integration with Remix Light System

E. Star/Galaxy Parallax & Field Depth (Optional, Low Cost)

G. Day/Night Transition Blending (Dusk/Sunrise)

H. Exposure / Tonemapping Integration

[hidden pond]

Nice! lol You love this thing don't ya ?

[iron drum]

😆

a lot of my projects require this to be complete, so that's part of it. but the other part is that it's just nice to work on something new. i've been focusing on FO4 and Skyrim for over a month now and i'm tired

[hidden pond]

yeah makes perfect sense.

[iron drum]

the current volumetric system costs about the same as your 2d system did, after a bunch of optimization

it has a lot of options too

like a toonnn

there's more than this now actually

[hidden pond]

hell yeah. nice work. I'm just getting on the move today right now but I'll be def talking a good look shortly

As it stands though I think You have it in a good spot. The sky needed this. Perfection can be achieved later.

[iron drum]

this version is on github already (not built, just the code). i'm working on the nubis version rn locally

will post pics of that soon

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/machineeverything-machine-machineman-machinemanmenace-trinidad-gif-14525023

[iron drum]

btw, having more stuff for the night sky would be amazing. i expanded the options and moon system already, but i dont' seem to be particularly good at working on that part of it 😆

i like ur ideas for it here. one of the main things i wanted to add was star clusters, differences in star size, and more things like that. also the current stars don't like to render with RR, only normal DLSS

[hidden pond]

Star clusters have been on My mind since the first build.

I think what I'm gonna do is integrate/backport what you have into what I'm doing while keeping the morroind specific stuff I am doing so we can keep parity kind of.

I see You hit the m_staged bone thing . Rare club of remixers that have hit that.

I went full nuclear on that one. 2048*2048...

[iron drum]

🤭

[brittle oar]

very ambitious, hope there's information out there to make working on this easier

so u dont just have to solve everything on ur own

[hidden pond]

It's all proven techniques I think. I'm not inventing nothing new... I don;t think anyway.

There's a reason all this worked the first shot I fired after all. all based on real proven tech.

[brittle oar]

ya ya ik i just mean i hope u use as much useful info out there as possible

[hidden pond]

Yeah for sure. My current workflow is that do a reserch dive on my own , I'll study the stuff Myself first before I even ask the AI anything. Then I'll do a grill session with it so we are both on the same page of what I understand ,what I want, how I want vs what is actaully deliverable realistically given the scope. The AI is relentless in this loop and will quickly temper any unrealistic expectations I had at this point on what is possible vs impossible.

[iron drum]

thoughts?

denser example

[final siren]

do the clouds cast shadows?

[iron drum]

yes

[modern hedge]

muuuch better

[rustic compass]

Looks too dense and unrealistic. Kinda like that smoke box demo

[rustic compass]

Talking about this

[rustic compass]

This looks very natural

[iron drum]

more coverage, less density?

[raven flame]

I always wondered which exact properties of real-life clouds give them that streaky distribution, with occasional harder lines ect

Density variations?

Never seen it simulated in volumetric clouds, only painted on 2D ones, so must be very untrivial stuff to implement

[rustic compass]

Might need to take a page out of Nubis, they seem to have naturally occuring cloud formations figured out

[iron drum]

this is based on nubis

it uses the same noise form to try to replicate it

[raven flame]

Also those bloody birds...

How much ammo I've spent in younger years trying to take them down!

[rustic compass]

Yeah, this feels much nicer to look at. Previous screenshot had more heavier formation. Is it possible to have darker colour variations added in later?

[raven flame]

For some reason always believed that I was just too inaccurate to get them

[final siren]

just aimbot

birds stand no chance

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/vats-fallout-target-vault-108-gif-12021170

[raven flame]

IIRC that doesn't work even against ground crows

[hidden pond]

prb not no

[raven flame]

Those can be shot tho, and give juicy 1xp each

And sometimes do a funny fountain of blood out of thin air

[modern hedge]

I just wished the color of the sunlight impacted the color of the clouds more

[iron drum]

here's a bit of it

[hidden pond]

should be possible

[iron drum]

now that i have all these new settings, i need to optimize again

[iron drum]

which one

[modern hedge]

the left one

[hidden pond]

1st

[iron drum]

and what about this one

[modern hedge]

best mix of both?

[iron drum]

it's literally the middle setting between them so yeah

[hidden pond]

that's illegal!

jk

[iron drum]

this is extremely customizable

you can even change the cloud colors lol

[modern hedge]

probably unrealistic for realtime but I really like how these clouds look.

[iron drum]

yeah there's no way we're getting that with this unless we want like 3 FPS 😭

[hidden pond]

live leak of Sparkles prompts

"claude, simulate the universe as a feature for Remix plus"

[iron drum]

🥺

[rustic compass]

RemixHumans™

[hidden pond]

I'm praising Your work if that's not apparent by the way. ❤️

[iron drum]

i appreciate it lol. i was really depressed yesterday, i'm sorry about that. and i appreciate the support a lot 🫂

wanna see somethin trippy

i forgot to make the moon interact with the clouds. so it's acting as if the sun were still there even at night

[modern hedge]

classic new vegas smh

[hidden pond]

lol ah yeah I think i did something simular. was like a nuke went off.

[rustic compass]

Accidental but very stylized look to it

Kind of like old music videos

[hidden pond]

could be used intentionally though for an area like the Glowing sea.

[final siren]

uncolored aurora borealis

[rustic compass]

Adding that to the list of features

[hidden pond]

customizabile aurora borealis is on my list of todo's

[iron drum]

fixing some bugs. namely shadow casting from clouds is broken rn, and some sliders don't work. after that's done i'll work on optimization again

this new simulation increased the perf hit by another 6%

[hidden pond]

Working on gaining parity with the current state of the system in Remix Plus now.

[final siren]

remix premium when

[iron drum]

https://github.com/NVIDIAGameWorks/dxvk-remix/commit/f900f2c1bfec94ac82c540795023e2de4aa445e8

after the cloud system is finished, i'm going to rebase remix plus to get these perf improvements

but it's gonna hurt

[hidden pond]

yeah i did some cherry picking from there the other day as well.

[final siren]

what happened to dxvk updates in the github updates channel?

[hidden pond]

bot died

[iron drum]

bot died, nightraven runs it and he hasn't been around for a while

[hidden pond]

legit saw him typing in this very channel here today..

like within since I logged in for sure

[iron drum]

🤔

i guess he just missed the ping then

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/i-don't-know-idk-idk-about-that-gif-7336250873949261946

[iron drum]

😔

[rustic compass]

Remix pass

[final siren]

imagine having to buy it in v bucks

[hidden pond]

I'm really surprised Nvidia has not done anything with the M_staged bones yet. Pretty sure CR did a bug report a year ago on it, Mark def has been brought to attention on it and E-man.

[modern hedge]

M_staged bones?

[hidden pond]

Yeah by default remix has space for 256 objects skinned with 256 bones each. this tends to be much to low for some games. I encountered it in Morrowind as npc;s have about 15-20 bones EACH. you can see how this would be a issue once you go to a large populated area. It's looking like most beth games will trigger this at some point. It's value was only chosen by Nvidia I think because it's the DXVK default.

[modern hedge]

oh lol

what happens if a game exceeds that limit?

[iron drum]

it just crashes lol

[hidden pond]

the bridge crashes to desktop

on the vanilla state of the games you'll rarely hit it though I think maybe the largest of population centers . But once you start adding mods it's over.

[iron drum]

in fnv it's exceeded without mods...

[hidden pond]

yeah that tracks

[modern hedge]

lovely lol

[iron drum]

it's patched in remix plus at least

will be in the new build

[hidden pond]

yeah I've been doing it for about a year

[iron drum]

wondering if i should offer remix plus as an option in the downloader when it gets stable enough

[hidden pond]

doesn;t mess anything up

[iron drum]

🤔 that was interesting to read

[hidden pond]

yeah

2048*2048 is waht I have mine set at. that is the max though I think.

IIRC it just crashes if you go beyond that. havent had any issues at the max though.

[modern hedge]

wished I could drop my remix fork and just use remix plus lol

[hidden pond]

some crazy mods out there with a shit ton of bones on skinned objects...

[hidden pond]

it's prob possible really to merge what you need. It's not like you are trying to switch to a completely diff platform. Remix is Remix at the end of the day.

[hidden pond]

why wouldn't you?

https://tenor.com/view/bullish-bullish-af-buy-buy-moar-crypto-gif-4023638677059070706

[final siren]

remix plus needs caustics before that happens

[hidden pond]

god damn it are you reading My todo list!

[iron drum]

hemry was working on restir pg iirc

[hidden pond]

tone is a bit off there... that's a joke that you hacked my pc

[iron drum]

if he publishes that i'll cherrypick it

it has caustics iirc?

[final siren]

how do you know?

[iron drum]

oh it was PT

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/power-rangers-action-mighty-morphin-huh-no-idea-gif-3433588

[final siren]

It did, but it was very laggy and not fully implemented.

[iron drum]

hmmm

well

with all of these additions we're looking at significant performance hits unfortunately. idk if it's worth adding all of these things if it won't even be playable

[final siren]

Making certain things toggable should help, if possible.

[hidden pond]

prob more optimzation that can be had too. this was rapid development.

Well cherry picked Your new stuff and My build works fine seems to run about the same as what I thought the other build was doing. Oh My God the amount of settings lol. You've outdone yourself sparkles. awesome job.

[brittle oar]

PEAK

PEAK

PEAK

#github-updates broke ig

[brittle oar]

and for clouds do you plan on using irl image references?

[hidden pond]

IDK man at this point I think sparkles is cooking so well I won't even need to. I might move on to caustics lol

[iron drum]

night time is almost entirely fixed with the cloud system

[iron drum]

@hidden pond

(i'll respond to ur dms in a little bit, i saw them!)

[final siren]

really needs them crepuscular rays

[hidden pond]

https://tenor.com/view/awesome-job-mate-gif-11607609880448062786

[hidden pond]

it's on the list.

[final siren]

There's also weird blocky artifacts around 0:30 which i don't know if from compression or not.