Unstable Transit

[wild timber]

the fear of no extra ships continues

maybe it should get renamed lol

no extra ships -> skirmish/little war

[dire bison]

Their loss - The fewer that play it, the easier it is to rank

[fleet steppe]

tried committing to heavy split beam this run

looks like a complete loss on stage 14

my ships just cannot keep up with the incoming skirmishers, 6 fire rate upgrades on cruiser, 1 on corvette

ok well I actually can survive with only ~140 damage taken

maybe Cruiser should have more than 2 targets with its 3 turrets

stopped at Stage 17

could be Balance making it harder but extra mods with duo should balance that out a bit

[tired blaze]

Beam splitter's full potential is only really unlocked when you have barrier fighters (that survive) which can give you the time they need to ramp up.

[wild timber]

heavy split in non-sim feels like old charge, absolute garbage at clearing enemy packs

[dawn gate]

first time I ever got past round 19 today, got to 22 but that seemed like a hard wall of fail. Hardly got touched in the rest and base never hit even once, then couldn't even take out 2/3 the enemies cause some big ships one shot anything that didn't have a barrier

[light verge]

https://tenor.com/view/macross-missiles-itano-circus-missile-barrage-mecha-gif-24987157

[storm bay]

https://tenor.com/view/kill-it-with-fire-missiles-more-missiles-all-the-missiles-megas-xlr-gif-25111969

[mortal mason]

22 and then got rekt by those missiles
should ve checked next enemies probably

not bad i guess for almost randomly taking upgrades and not swapping a layout since i had 5+ ships

[fervent turret]

well that's my game over, did not count missile chuckers 🤦

[obsidian glade]

Those missiles seem to wreck a bunch of people lol

[fervent turret]

we've been calling it out for weeks now I feel like lol

[obsidian glade]

It still looks silly when the missiles at the other end of the battle field send a volley my way and it just snipes me from halfway across the galaxy

[mortal mason]

3 column with missiles = annihilation

[light verge]

just 2 missile users in 17 will ruin your day

any more than that in 18+ will just outright kill you

especially since there's no priority sorting for missile boats

[shell jasper]

I dunno what woudl improve it at all

lowering damage helps but only a few levels worth of help prolly at most

less targets I guess?

[light verge]

i dont think you need to bother at present

there are like a few run enders depending on configuration

if you have less than 2 capitals at 16 or so a bulwark is a potential run ender

a bulwark in a sea of capitals is a huge run ender

two of them will just kill you

[mortal mason]

Would be nice

I dunno if it's ok but rn it feels like the best way to get to highest stage is to to choose whatever layout has the least amount of missiles (and sometimes snipers)

Also would be great not to have them at column C where our ships just can't reach before dying

[dire bison]

A trait of missiles that make them work so well is that as soon as ANY ship is within range, they fire the full payload, which hit targets no matter how far away they are. But that helps us at least as much as the enemy - it helps lessen the range and speed handicaps that we might have. Hopefully this doesn't change.

Maybe a cap or weighting system on how many of each type can spawn in a wave would help, or limits / weighting on which rank they can spawn at. That'd likely be best as a per-ship-type setting (imo). Maybe adjusting the stats (esp range) of our missiles and their missiles so they are more alike. Maybe clicking a target to set it at priority. Point defense systems of some sort (like hull bomb) that could intercept some of the missiles. I dunno, I'm just spitballing ideas here 🙂

But the last couple of screenshots amount to the Kobayashi Maru for any fleet we send out to meet them.

[mortal mason]

It doesn't matter how many if they one shot everything you have
Having a max rank where they can spawn would help but this would be a bad design

[shell jasper]

I mean if missiles dont exist at all how many more rounds do yoiu make it?

[light verge]

depends on the build

one could easily make it to 30-40 with the right rerolls with a full charge duo more choices no extra ships

it's also why no extra ships is op

less ships to reroll on the opposition

you can control your enemies and outpace their damage by a bit

glass cannon usage is only a problem until round 8

[shell jasper]

vs dieing to 2-3 missiles on what round?

[light verge]

if there's enough missile boats, like 2 slots worth, probably between 17-23

[shell jasper]

so there multi target just kicks you that hard I guess hrm

[light verge]

missiles only start ramping up on damage imo at around 15

[light verge]

there's also the seeming behavior that missiles also target your units far beyond their range due to retarget behavior

[shell jasper]

ya thats just same as your missiles

[light verge]

funnilly enough that also includes hitting the base with a SINGLE stray missile

and them getting nuked

[shell jasper]

they also have a huge range though anyway

oh lol base catching a stray is funny

[light verge]

it saved at least one run and got me further by 4 levels

[cloud hatch]

halving the range and targets will make missiles more manageable...they'll still hurt, but they won't destroy your entire fleet from way out of range instantly

[shell jasper]

reducing range much just makes them a shitty gatling

[cloud hatch]

ok maybe not half, but they outrange several charge laser ships of ours

so like, 750/800 maybe?

[storm bay]

the other thing that feels bad is the targeting

[nova light]

that benefits us as much as them so it can stay

[storm bay]

we have to kill everything before we can touch the missiles while they rain on us

nah it doesn't

[cloud hatch]

yeah that's a lot harder to change though, reducing the range would help them move a bit closer so maybe our cruisers hit them once before getting in range of the bigger ships

[storm bay]

you can give us sniper missiles

[cloud hatch]

cl snipe gets a buff "fires at 3 additional targets", no damage changes

sounds crazy broken, but honestly ML enemies would still be better

[storm bay]

it'd just be increased range on missiles

[shell jasper]

buffing your missiles doesnt really change the aspect of enemy missiles being the stopper tho

[storm bay]

well missiles aren't the only run ender

swarmers and bulwarks are ruinous as well

[shell jasper]

right thats like my original line of questioning reason lol. something ends your run

[cloud hatch]

something ends it, ML end it about 10+ levels earlier than everything else

[shell jasper]

so does changin missiles really do much

well, tamp down target count and range a bit nd thattle close the gap

[cloud hatch]

and you can play around with positioning a bit more with swarmers/bulwarks, ML just hit you from so far away it doesn't matter where you're positioned

[storm bay]

bulwarks just have so much hp that they screen your mediums for the whole fight while they get shredded by swarmers and missiles

[dire bison]

They should still be threatening, so hopefully don't nerf them into irrelevance. They just shouldn't mean auto-wipe

[storm bay]

which positioning doesn't really help either

[shell jasper]

targets 12->8
range 1000->800
damage 2.5->2
shoudl still be a threat

just little less

[dire bison]

They had 12 targets? Wow, no wonder lol

[light verge]

swarmers are only game enders for certain builds

bulwarks end games if two of them exist past 20

missiles end games

[dire bison]

love getting bulwarks vs fighters with base shield powerup

don't love them in a lot of other fleet setups heh

[light verge]

if only the shield powerup appeared so often...

also 12 targets lmfao

no wonder

https://tenor.com/view/macross-missiles-itano-circus-missile-barrage-anime-gif-24987159

[dire bison]

Round 10 get a choice of base powerups

like weapons every 3rd

[light verge]

🤔

that sounds delicious

[dire bison]

equalizing

[light verge]

maybe guaranteed soft pity base powerup if you didn't get any before round 10

(and if you did get pity beforehand, you get a choice of ship powerup instead)

[dire bison]

Or choice of base at 10, choice of upgraded base at 25, no chance any other time. Level 10, pick shield -> level 25, pick faster reapplying shields or stacking shields

[wild timber]

current missiles already have 8 targets

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

2nd run of today crams a lot of mods in lol

[shell jasper]

oh looked at wrong one, 6 then

[storm bay]

that's per ship right? so the unit goes from hitting 16 to 12?

[shell jasper]

yup

[storm bay]

I guess that means it can only nuke one fighter squad

[tired blaze]

Any missles nerf is welcome. I think the range one alone will do a lot.

[woeful zephyr]

rank 1 stuck

[ashen nebula]

Maybe scales entirely differently more akin to what players could have, so they are still reasonable health check but never outright show stopper.

[light verge]

yeah the scaling goes nuts as we go

well, i think it's less that and more there's no real opportunity to bulk up HP on our side because a hull upgrade (but not hull amp) is generally a lost opportunity

that 2 dmg rocket becomes a 20 and then suddenly all your 15hp fighters are instakilled... for obvious reasons

and your cruisers are melted

it almost feels like hull upgrades should add damage negation as well

but i'm just shitting ideas out of my head

[shell jasper]

no the scaling goes nuts

every 10 stages the rate of scaling doubles

you are left behind no matter what

but thats the point. if the scaling didnt go crazy thered be no challenge past a point nd youd keep going prolly for decades

[finite wave]

First (till I ain't)

[digital bobcat]

What Run Modifiers make you go, "I gotta do UT now"?
Is "more mods" on its own good enough?
(I usually go for Duo)

[dire bison]

More than 15 banked, I'll run 2+ positives. Anything that is 1+ positive when I am between 10-15 banked. Less than 10 banked, I take whatever happens to be up at the time.

[light verge]

anything duo works for me

unless it also has hard

because duo will have balance in it and will likely have fewer mods

duo, balance, fewer choices, hard is a death knell for me so i skip that

[cloud hatch]

today's was pretty good

[river flax]

Is there never any Duo without Balance?

[dire bison]

Like right now?

Feels like the duo mod balances pretty well regardless of having the Balance modifier, though.

[undone kiln]

no hull no problem

sniper long range rapid fire is good

[fleet steppe]

Bulwarks get so fat

really got to lean into corvettes this run

[mortal mason]

nice run

[cloud hatch]

yeah today was good too

[dire bison]

twins

[cloud hatch]

aha i'm 5th now

[dire bison]

Poor selection for my wave 31, too many hexes

[drifting hinge]

i just got #2 sorry

[dire bison]

Did you favor one ship, or run balanced? I kept mine pretty balanced

[cloud hatch]

everything into corvettes, hc's got missiles (and barrier)

i lucked into base barrier

[dire bison]

double snipe, both had barriers (not until WELL into the 20s), exploit. Single grid 2x damage bonus, only 1 burst - think on HC.

Really fun run, though

[woeful zephyr]

RIP

attempting to stack the HCs does about equally

I say attempting to, cause the rng in this run REALLY wants you to stack the corvettes

maybe additional ships shouldn't be called "rewards". that way people realize that no extra ships is good

rng STILL wants corvettes to be stacked roflmao

[woeful zephyr]

duo + more choices for the daily run? it's been forever since that happened! 😆

should have saved my fuel

[river flax]

Oh a very rare, nice

Lotta damage amps

[dire bison]

Had to pick barrier / ship improvement on my HC. Got lucky - picked Ship Improvement, first roll next wave gave me barrier 🙂

much tougher than yesterday

[woeful zephyr]

what 2 ship types?

[dire bison]

HC and Frigate. Didn't get a base ability or any spawn boosts. Both had barrier and SI, and frigate had its special ability... barrage I think it's called.

[light verge]

more choices duo today is cursed

hc/frig

[lusty umbra]

You Do UT every day?

[woeful zephyr]

almost

[light verge]

i do UT when the winds are favorable

[undone kiln]

is a raid boss bulwark this one

[woeful zephyr]

i do it when I'm awake

if I wake up in the middle of the night I might spend banked if there's a useful UT upgrade waiting to be claimed

[wicked zealot]

Whats like the current „meta build“ for UT? What stuff do I aim for? What is considered the strongest?

[autumn fossil]

basically just synth. it scales the best, aside from AF, but AF is completable

the amount of AF, base, od, fighter, and efficiency UTs you need to get to a point where there is such diminishing gains that further progress is useless, is relatively low

i stopped all those at 1e6 and even that's probably too much

cap stats is always nice to get, but you don't need high UT to reach 143

mastery and spec are nice to have, but don't scale as well as synth

lol. wrong channel. i thought this was eoc.

[autumn fossil]

barrage missiles and snipe charge laser are considered best iirc. but not together. damage is king, which includes fire rate. i would avoid glass cannon on anything aside from fighters. at least until your frigates and cruisers are dying in one shot anyway

[fervent turret]

almost baited me, game...

pog

[drifting hinge]

mostly straight into the corvettes, double snipe charge, almost exclusively went damage instead of any attack speed

[rain kindle]

what was the bait?

[autumn fossil]

prob damage amp with 4x missiles and 3x snipers

[rain kindle]

interesting.... maybe i have been playing it wrong. lol. i would have absolutely picked that one. or re-rolled. but mostly picked that one.

i think i have looked at the enemy ship list only when two of the combos are same, and those are the power-ups i want.

in other words, they come second in terms of criteria to power-up

then again, i am never in top 10. so what do i know.

i am just...

https://tenor.com/hq2ZrMLNgZf.gif

[tired blaze]

enemy loadout matters a lot for stages past 20

[light verge]

Starting 18 arguably

Regardless

If using cap ships, avoid swarmers

They're a death sentence especially when your capships can no longer oneshot them

Avoid bulwarks. Depending on what's inside the enemy configuration, you're likely to be screwed ESPECIALLY when there are two of them

Capital ships you have are worth two mediums, and so you might be screwed if you have too much of them, depending on build

There are other tips as well but those are like very important

Oh and yes, Missile enemies prioritize small ships and in higher difficulties will most likely kill them leaving your cap ships naked

[woeful zephyr]

16 stages cleared gets 2nd place? damn..

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

[tired blaze]

I have returneth to give you competition once again.

[bitter umbra]

well lets see if i stay

[bitter umbra]

that'd be a no lol

:D

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

let's see if that stays

#1 with 14 stages cleared roflmao

hard seems to be coming up a lot lately lol

[tired blaze]

One of the best runs I've done recently. Ain't no way it's getting beaten.

Got tons of barriers and fleet barrage.

[woeful zephyr]

duo which is sadly out of reach 🙁

[bitter umbra]

death sentence at stage 20

happy with that run

[river flax]

Grats

[fervent turret]

regrets

managed to get positioned to beat it on last retry 😰

this without the frig barrier

I'm dumb, I want to go back

my run is just over

[mortal mason]

Mine ended at 16 😄
Are 4 charge lasers good?

[tired blaze]

It's what I usually go for. But I also like missles for cruisers. Great for swarmers, if they live lol

[mortal mason]

Had missiles on cruisers today
Didn't help much against 5 missile enemies 😄
Otherwise was very good

[obsidian glade]

I usually only put missiles on tele fighters

[tired blaze]

I like them on cruisers cuz they have higher damage than normal ships, and 3 launchers. So a single salvo can take out a lot of ships at once.

[light verge]

I am not a fan of pure more choices or none

My runs almost always end up being scuffed

[woeful zephyr]

more choices huh?

[river flax]

First time ever getting missiles with burst fire

[dire bison]

It's glorious

[dire bison]

Heavy split beam laser on stage 6. Top ships are hitting two targets, bottom ships are hitting one target (twice?).

[ashen nebula]

🎉

[lusty umbra]

this is bonkers

[woeful zephyr]

Enemies get slot bonuses now?

[lusty umbra]

new simulation only option to give a slot randoma bonus every level

dies at level 51

[ashen nebula]

looks like a stalemate

Oh after a while my base get annoyed and just shoot it anyways :p

[wild timber]

are you sure it's sim only?

[shell jasper]

its not it can be on live one at uh, some % chance

[wild timber]

gaming

[ashen nebula]

The forbidden rare

[wild timber]

i htink that stat should be changed from burst fire to max targets

[ashen nebula]

The new simulations is fun

[bitter umbra]

??

why did these missiles stop firing

they shoot one volley then they just stop lol

these missiles just dont shoot

Ooh i see whats happening

their range isnt inside friendly ships so they dont shoot, but they stop to quickly to actually counter

[shell jasper]

that should have been fixed on 0.2

[bitter umbra]

ah gotcha

wasnt a update notification in game

[shell jasper]

I never got aorund to putting update notice on server but did a few mins ago now haha

[woeful zephyr]

today's daily run is nuts

[bitter umbra]

probably because everyones testing it

also so much modifiers

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

[light verge]

holy shit grid mod is hilarious

i fucking love it

oh god i'm getting teleport assasinated

teleport jump actually useful?

in live Unstable?

shocking truth!

[dire bison]

Wow I love that grid buff mod

[storm bay]

pft

and that's just cuz i picked a fight with 2 MLs by accident

mono sniper CL fighters with rare mod on

[dire bison]

hot damn, nice

[empty cargo]

wait what

[light verge]

this truly is peak...

[fleet steppe]

beams taking L to enemy barriers is expected but still sad

[storm bay]

damn

[fleet steppe]

grid buffed peak gameplay though

[storm bay]

not getting lucky on x2 damage + fire rate in column C

[autumn fossil]

barrage missile fighters as usual

[fleet steppe]

💯 ❌💯

looks like the end for this run

[empty cargo]

nice

[fleet steppe]

this is the end of the road

[bitter umbra]

Holy hell

73

[fleet steppe]

I farmed for damage amps periodically with my rerolls

Super powerful

[bitter umbra]

only difficulty 3527714.357

[autumn fossil]

exponentials go brrr

[woeful zephyr]

stage 60 cleared 💀

[woeful zephyr]

damn what modifiers did you pick?

[autumn fossil]

glass cannon is capped at 4 now?

[fleet steppe]

I prioritized fire rate over glass cannon

[woeful zephyr]

it stops giving you them at higher stages for some reason

[autumn fossil]

i'm just noticing that glass cannon is not showing up anymore

[fleet steppe]

did I really pick 23 hull amp? that doesn't seem right

but the hull numbers are there

you could probably get another handful of rounds in there

but you're definitely going to have to find the damage amps for it

Corvettes get the fire rate rare mod which is a decent multiplier to damage that fighters don't get, and also respect range of charge lasers a lot more, so I opted for them

[obsidian glade]

Holy shit what a run lol

[woeful zephyr]

let me guess, the lab rats discovered that you can progress forever if glass cannon isn't capped

[woeful zephyr]

died at 74, but almost made it..

what's the highest stage cleared so far?

hmm, eternal vigilante avoided hull 🤔

but was 1 stage lower

just 1

[light verge]

the grid experience

oh, its just one grid, eh.

Wait, two grids?

Oh no....

Oh yes...

Oh yesno

10 stages in: TEAM ALPHASTRIKE

[cloud hatch]

yeah it was quite a fun conversation thinking about the crazy ideas

[woeful zephyr]

the best part of the grid is it removes slot upgrades which increases the chance you'll get damage amplifier. the grid itself sorta sucks, especially with no extra ships since without it you can get 4 specifically chosen slot upgrades which are better than the random ones you get through grid.

[ashen nebula]

The grid thing feels minor advantage with some risk, usually we can assign our fleet to take more advantage from the grid, until we rolled some nasty combos.

[river flax]

There's very rare tile mods?

Death

[woeful zephyr]

I died here for the second run of the day

this event is great for getting record stages cleared

[tired blaze]

Barriers stop working at very high stages. Their damage scales so high that even with the 99% damage reduction or whatever it is, they still oneshot. Pls fix 🙁

[obsidian glade]

It's actually 99.9%

[woeful zephyr]

Is that due to the barriers not working or due to players avoiding all hull upgrades?

Get a bit of hull amplifier. It's good for you. 😄

[nova light]

also don't take too many glass cannon

[proud vector]

got to 54 with dispersion pulse and so much armor as fk weapon no need 😆

P.S. Build with teleport also funny. Like barbarian jump 🪓🎅

[dire bison]

Glass Cannons appear to be limited to 4 per run now, so that's not an issue

[nova light]

holy that is a lot of hp

[ashen nebula]

Do single Cruiser supposed to make split beam become single target?

This run my HC took split beam then single cruiser, it stop doing two beams

Oh wait, it still do two beams against med size enemies, but not smalls

[hearty osprey]

Them stats

[proud vector]

This can exterminate entire planet Star Destroyers

(regular Cruisers, hull bomb, mode with ships and bonus fields) -- finished on 69 stage

https://tenor.com/view/sith-star-destroyer-gif-19515108

https://tenor.com/view/this-will-probably-kill-two-birds-gif-21452558

[fervent turret]

rare mods is interesting; it's fun but it seems to balance itself by effectively reducing how often you see plain damage buffs

hull/mono cruiser continues to be just not worthwhile outside of funny solo bomb shenanigans

[nova light]

that's about as good as it can ever be

also stage 60 is way past anything anyone was ever meant to come close to

[echo spear]

If you can tell it but Rarer Mods can go way further because of amps

becomes much more common

[fervent turret]

yeah but it competes against all the other rare mods early on

[dire bison]

The one that needs to stop competing is Burst Fire once a ship gets to 3. Getting the downgrade option 4th rank almost every level

[nova light]

2 copies of burst fire

[nova light]

-# hey there has to be a few duds

[dire bison]

True, but I thought that was what hull was for hehe

Mediums are death sentence here 😲

[shell jasper]

full grids seem so absurd lol

stage 73 sheesh

do we have a record stage?

[fleet steppe]

73 cleared by Luna here, I got 72 a little higher up

There's a pretty high amount of luck fishing for damage amps

[tired blaze]

61 damage amps is silly

[dire bison]

Absurdly fun* lol

Stacking every positive modifier gets us some crazy scores, though 🙂

[fleet steppe]

I think you effectively need Grid Boosted mod to filter out the grid bonuses for your reward options and increase odds of finding damage amp

[dire bison]

Agreed, but I have had a LOT of runs where grid bonuses rarely came up at all, so I'm not sure the actual impact once "Rarer Mods" is no longer there.

[cloud hatch]

are the rare/grid buffs going to stick around in simulation after spacemas?

[obsidian glade]

I'd assume so

[cloud hatch]

i hope so

[shell jasper]

they will, just not rare every time

[woeful zephyr]

There should be a "well done" modifier that gives you no rares 😂

[shell jasper]

I thought a "slog it out" mode with no damage upgrades might be silly but maaaaaaaaaaaaaaan I feel like those fights would be slow and sucky. or itd be undoable in general

[river flax]

Oh nice

[empty cargo]

beam does show particles

[rain kindle]

wohoo.. my first on the podium.
yay. i am first of the losers. 🙂

[echo spear]

How does it works with fighters?

with 9 fighters per fleet means 9 hits without barrier and they die in a single hit anyway

unless their health is too low

[river flax]

Can enemy barrier fighters tank Disruption Bomb or whatever once?

[tired blaze]

Today's records are gonna be wild

[woeful zephyr]

someone is going to clear 40

sadly it's not me

[tired blaze]

I'm surprised I only made it to 35, felt like I had a solid setup. Maybe too many missles, who can say.

[woeful zephyr]

did anyone clear 40? lol

[digital bobcat]

Is teleport on fighters good now?

[woeful zephyr]

apparently 3 people made it to 40, don't know if any cleared it

[digital bobcat]

Best weapon is still charge lasers, maybe quick on fighters and sniper on Corvette?

[tired blaze]

I think I coulda made it further with beam lasers, but I weren't brave enough.

[woeful zephyr]

really? I went double snipe CLs as usual lol

[tired blaze]

same

didn't expect duo to be so strong

[woeful zephyr]

well mono gets into the 70s lol

[tired blaze]

yeah well my brain didn't connect the dots lol

[digital bobcat]

Woo hoo. Just got to 40, glad I had the fuel saved up

[woeful zephyr]

what weapons?

[shell jasper]

42 cleared highe st so far

[woeful zephyr]

ever, or for today's daily run?

or both?

[shell jasper]

I just meant todays, might be ever too not sure

[woeful zephyr]

is that hard to look up?

[shell jasper]

no just had to go back and look. Its highest outside of one thats almost certainly cheated/bugged from 12/1

[obsidian glade]

Wait didn't someone reach the 60s not too long ago?

Or 70s even

[cloud hatch]

that was in simulation with mono

[obsidian glade]

Oh

That makes more sense

[woeful zephyr]

I made it to 74 using mono simulated lol #1335902304959987733 message

afaik no one has claimed a higher stage yet

[dire bison]

Fighters are good, but their special ability (teleport) doesn't help as much as vette and frigate abilities. But Frigate only has 2 ships, so they die off faster. Vette seems to be the best combination of ships/specials, it's certainly the highest I can push with.

[echo spear]

So what's the new meta now?

For very very deep late game of ut

[dire bison]

CL snipe or ML Barrage. Stack damage abilities, hit range upgrades for breakpoints. Hull amp is marginally useful, but reg hull upgrade is not. Glass cannon now limited to 4, get all 4. Burst is still unlimited, so ignore it after your second upgrade. It'll keep spawning forever, though, don't take the bait.

[echo spear]

I'm going for snipers

and also Corvettes replaces the fighter?

[dire bison]

For me, in mono sims, I can push higher levels than fighter. Others may have better luck. They are both good, though.

[echo spear]

but do I need those upgrades?

The glass Cannon and the amps of dmg and hp

And burst

[dire bison]

yes, yes, maybe, and yes (2 only)

[echo spear]

Or a 4 burst shot when frigate

Like idk if I can do a 4 burst with frigates

if the dmg decrease happened with the 4th burst shot with an ability

[dire bison]

1 (base) -> 2 -> 3 -> stop. The fourth one is a DPS loss.

The frigate spacial doesn't lower damage per shot, I believe. So get that one if avail

[echo spear]

That would expect that a 4 burst shot is a DPS increase as long it's a frigate

[dire bison]

This is getting annoying lol

[nova light]

hull, you say

[dire bison]

🙁 Ran out of rerolls, had to pick between two nonupgrades, both with a tough enemy fleet. Maybe I should have chosen the other one - those skirmishers made excellent shields against my weapons

[cloud hatch]

great day

[dire bison]

nice!

[cloud hatch]

and then duo/rarer mods for the next run is also nice

[woeful zephyr]

did you do it yet?

[cloud hatch]

nah, gotta wait a bit for fuel, but i'll have enough for it today

not expecting a run that deep, but it's probably an easy 20+

hoping it's not cruiser/hc though, aha

those are a bit annoying the first few levels

[river flax]

I expected some hardcoded "super mega easy" one on Christmas

RIP me

40 WOW

Wtf lol

[digital bobcat]

I did quick charge on fighter, sniper on Corvette

[woeful zephyr]

quick CL? interesting..

that makes sense with fighter since they can't keep their distance lol

[digital bobcat]

That's why I did it lol, I get annoyed by the fighter running in with snipers. And if I'm unlucky and get lots of swarmers, they seem to overwhelm my snipers

[vital oar]

Charge.Laser.Snipe.

s29 cleared for me, but my fav weapon

[cerulean compass]

This was hella fun! Shame I took the missiles thinking it was bulwarks :S

first time all field slots are full on this difficulty 🙂

(I'm not very good at this)

[echo spear]

Thought was Extreme

With insane scaling

[cerulean compass]

aye, t'was!

[cerulean compass]

not even rank 1 😭
people really cooked today!

[dawn gate]

oof. Had a setup that was flawless when looking casually, no base damage and hardly ever lost a ship...till I hit round 32 then I got whacked so hard it was a total fail

barriers on top of barriers, almost every node had a buff, if I made one mistake it was possibly taking a teleport all fighters to far side of the field

think those sniper ships might've had their own missles cause my fighters get wiped out 2 seconds

[woeful zephyr]

would you like double tap or fleet double tap? 😆

[woeful zephyr]

3 duos in a row, and not enough fuel to do them all 🙁

[azure fulcrum]

Love to clear 35, and still only be rank 76, really says a lot about how strong a day it was :V

[waxen portal]

Today had to be rigged.

[river flax]

Ultimate noob trap

[cerulean compass]

100%!

it's good for maybe a position node for 1 ship to do, but all your fighters 😬

[river flax]

I thought it was the entire fleet

LOL

[woeful zephyr]

it is your entire fleet

very effective trap, people don't even know what it does 😆

[river flax]

Yeah that's what it is

The position node is "fine" ish

The fighter node is generally bad

Fleet teleport is omega cringe

[obsidian glade]

Teleporting fighters are the most fun thing UT can give you imo

But yeah teleporting fleet is just bad

[nova light]

if only sylv added my 'sawblade' weapon idea

then it'd be fun

[woeful zephyr]

what?

is synth being used as a weapon now?

not that anyone would be surprised if it was XD

[obsidian glade]

https://tenor.com/view/noita-hello-chat-funny-memes-sawblade-gif-24869895

No idea why that text is there but that's how I imagine it

[hollow badger]

Having tried it once, I realised that the amplifier is the most powerful.

[light verge]

only if you have barrier and your entire squad teleports with you

[woeful zephyr]

the what?

damage amplifier?

[dire bison]

We need range amp. Fire rate amp would be funny but I bet MLB would crash it.

[woeful zephyr]

https://tenor.com/view/oof-baseball-blooper-popup-gif-6160974

[hollow badger]

Yes, it's a damage amplifier.

[fervent turret]

meaning the base buff I expect

[woeful zephyr]

this is another noob trap

[empty cargo]

good with beam

[woeful zephyr]

it is?

[light verge]

does fire rate affect tick rate if done as a tile mod?

[autumn fossil]

it can be depending on the enemy makeup. beams are immediate so while they may take longer to ramp or whatever, this is immediately dealing more damage and burning off small enemies

and the range is a nice bonus

it's a massive trap with cl since they already have more than enough range and decent damage but are already suffering for fire rate

[fervent turret]

the problem is the fire rate also affects target swap speed

[dire bison]

I've found that to be in the 'never get this' category.

[shell jasper]

maybe 0.5x fire rate?

[cloud hatch]

maybe if made that ship target the furthest enemy instead of the closest

[dire bison]

^ Yes, that would make this attractive. Way too often, the target dies before the shot arrives, so any ship we have with this upgrade does not contribute to the battle. With beams, there is no travel time, but the delay to begin shooting still makes it less effective than not having it. But with targeting the rear-most enemies instead of the closest, it is no longer competing for targets and losing. Not sure if it would need the fire rate changed to 0.5x at that point or not, would need to test.

[shell jasper]

eh no targetting stuff, I could increase projectile speed?

[cloud hatch]

wouldn't really help, since most of the time half your fleet (or more) is targeting the same thing the buffed ship is targeting, and since it's firing slower, it'll never even going to get to shoot

about the only time i've ever seen that buff work is when you stick a crusier/hc in it, and the rest of your fleet is small...the cruiser will target a big ship while the rest of your fleet deals with the smaller stuff (or as mentioned above, beams will at least connect)

changing it somehow to "as soon as target is acquired, shoot, then start 10 second cooldown to select next target" would be good though

keeps the spirit of "big shot, but not very often" and makes it actually contribute

[ashen nebula]

I think attack speed buff would help, without changing the code I guess at least reduced its drawbacks.

Or maybe make it mult-target/extra target.

[nova light]

nope

[light verge]

Ok that's big

[tired blaze]

yeah 0.25 fire rate makes it very restrictive. But I like the design.

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

how many people actually did this run? lol

[obsidian glade]

At least 2

[empty cargo]

ount

[woeful zephyr]

is anyone doing the 4th run of the day? 😆

[tired blaze]

I'm curious if this will stick. Clearing stage 25 was really cutting it close. Was only doable with this exact layout I'm sure.

[woeful zephyr]

Ah it's the attack of the dildo ships

[astral jay]

This.... is just simulation mode but still.

Finally done at stage 50

Though, not sure what the game considers 'hardest mods' for the Unstable Transit combo

NM

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

ok, how many people did this run?

[empty cargo]

2

[bitter umbra]

lmao

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

never seen that before

[cloud hatch]

ok the next run was duo/rarer mods with cruiser/vette, and the one after that was duo/rarer mods with cruiser/fighter

[dire bison]

which of the three were you able to push furthest?

I only got to 31 on the first run, didn't try the next

[cloud hatch]

the first one, cleared 34, the second one cleared 33, the third one i cleared 32

[dire bison]

At face value, I would have bet on the cruiser/vette, followed by cruiser fighter

[cloud hatch]

yeah i would have thought so too, but the fighter one had very few damage amps

plus the fighter ability is terrible

on the first one i got fleet double tap, but didn't the fleet one with the vettes

[dire bison]

yeah. I got fleet barrage or whatever its called on the frigs

[woeful zephyr]

rank 2 stuck

and i don't have enough fuel for the duo 🙁

[uncut gate]

Wow I just unlocked UT, I am stoked to have a rogue-like mode where we get to have a big scary base haha, and it will be a great trainer for learning positioning

[uncut gate]

I feel like I'd want the Synth one for Alien parts and such, the Mastery one is neat but I have M7 crew and 2492 sleeves with it taking about 600 for a mastery so it seems it'd save me like a day of crew leveling but also then I have to wait a day for another UT haha, unless Mastery still matters after page 3 of crew mastery

[dire bison]

Get a few points into each one, they are all useful. They all have MASSIVE artificial diminishing returns, so early points matter more than later points. Always spend your fuel on Galaxies if you have an active galaxy you can attack, once the galaxies are clear you can use fuel to get more UT battles.

Synth, Capital, and Mastery are likely the most important up through EOC. Research has the least bad diminishing returns, so points there stretch value further, but eventually you run out of research (only affects AF, not specimen research).

You can stockpile 4 days worth of attempts, so if the mods are "Hard, Balance, Fewer Mods" just wait a day and see if you get a better selection. And use the simulation a lot, so you get a good feel for each ship, weapon, and combination of the two.

Ran into this bugger in a mono fighter sim. My dudes were wearing him down extremely slowly while he was picking them off one by one. Wasn't sure if I would win, and my base got bored --- randomly shot him out of the sky lol

Proposing this be a base mod in-game. Long range, slow firing artillery that can Death Star a random enemy during normal play. It could replace the base retaliation strike if that sounds too powerful, but if it's slow enough (perhaps 2x the other buff timers?) it would probably be balanced and cool 😎

Also - holy hell, enemy barriers are paper to my rock when playing rapid beams

(this is a good thing)

[uncut gate]

Thank you for the information, I'm gonna go for Mastery then since it's helpful right now and was just worried it'd be not so helpful once I get that 3rd page of mastery upgrade haha

Oh my, I assume the level only got this high due to Xmas with the higher rare mod chances haha, guess I ought to keep some restraint

How many extra waves is worth doing? So far I'm on stage 19

I took half my base's damage on wave 20 haha so I guess the answer has been found

Wave 21 and I esploded haha. I reckon buying UT's with fleet time is just for when galaxies are maxed? Cuz it's a pretty poor deal at like 2.5x real time

[obsidian glade]

Yeah it's not worth doing when you still have galaxies to do

[tired blaze]

Happy New Year 🎉

[uncut gate]

Sheeesh, mine is just Rarer Mods haha

Though that's z95 haha

[pastel hedge]

teleport drive is such a funny modification

i have it on fighters and so all they ever do is sit in the corner, immediately all pile jump the snipers/anything in the back, obliterate them with their collective firepower and confuse the enemies

having a barrier, base barrier and charge lasers with burst is not helping the enemy fleet

[woeful zephyr]

Teleport fighters:

https://tenor.com/view/go-away-tossing-kicked-out-gif-20991890

[pastel hedge]

forbidden technique: bum rush

what is anything going to do against this

what could go wrong

[pastel hedge]

enemy scaling gets ridiculous is what could go wrong 💀

what 50 fighters stacked on the same ship does to a guy

[uncut gate]

I heard of the cringe of the teleport module but used it anyway and it's pretty great in sniper maps but at the very least it makes the enemies turn a bit in a match which buys time, I went 21 sectors my first go thanks to it haha

[bitter umbra]

Yeah, the main thing with it is, you not being able to disable it lol

[uncut gate]

Yeah haha

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

I was expecting someone to get to stage 40 today lol

[simple lagoon]

Hello all.
I got this upgrade showing up but i have it already on my corvette, does it stacks?

its also a grants whole fleet on my corvette, so wondering if my heavy cruiser gonna get double buff or if i should go for one of the two other upgrade i have available. ?

[empty cargo]

what

they just have the same icon

[tired blaze]

Barrier projection is the best upgrade, so there's no reason to replace it, ever.

[woeful zephyr]

what?

why?

not 1.25x fire rate with snipe CL?

[cloud hatch]

it's not just one barrier, it keeps putting it back, i found i go further with the barrier base upgrade

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

[cloud hatch]

also i kinda feel like the exploitation field one works better than the fire rate one

[woeful zephyr]

really?

I guess near the end of the run damage matters

earlier on fire rate matters more

[cloud hatch]

yeah, the different phases are fun

"gotta shoot now", "don't care lol", "omg need damage"

[tired blaze]

I'm also kinda convinced the barrier stacks, seen some weird stuff.

But don't take my word on that

[cloud hatch]

i know it stacks with the normal barrier, and it gets re-applied

bit harder to tell if it stacks with itself

[woeful zephyr]

It's a good thing the enemies don't have a regenerating barrier or else it might be possible for a battle to last forever

The enemies do have regenerating shields though 🤔

[autumn fossil]

nice, my first time getting rank 1

[simple lagoon]

I had a run with 5 heavy cruiser on fast firing charge laser, so kinda wanted the firing rate overall. But yeah near the end i got like at minimum 4 fighter squad in front per fight, got overun my missile launcher couldn't handle them enough :/

[cloud hatch]

sorry

[autumn fossil]

lol, i'm still rank 1. we're tied

[cloud hatch]

oh nice

[dire bison]

https://tenor.com/view/danny-de-vito-arnold-schwarzenegger-twins-gif-14878045628732340267

[dire bison]

I think it stacks, but I'm not positive. Overall, I prefer exploitation once my attack speed is high enough. I'm torn between barrier and exploitation overall, since enemy numbers / attack speeds change how powerful barrier is. LOVE it against bulwarks, barely notice it against missiles/skrimishers.

[simple lagoon]

someone told me it stacks and tested, it does 👀

but yeah it was'nt very effective further in the runs.

[fleet steppe]

[woeful zephyr]

pick it and record the battle XD

[fleet steppe]

too late (I lost that round anyway)

(heavy) cruiser as a duo ship does terrible things for the enemy fleet configurations

[cloud hatch]

it CAN be a good though though

since your fleet is dumb and targets a single ship with everything

when you have a split between vette/frig/fighter, and a cruiser/hc then at least half of your fleet is targeting something different

[fleet steppe]

at stage 33 each bulwark is so fat any mediums will shred

[wild timber]

how are enemy missiles now anyway

[cloud hatch]

well, kinda hard to say with the rare mods always on, runs are a bit stronger in general

but they don't feel as oppressive as before

[dawn gate]

I tell ya, what really kills a run seemingly no matter how good, is if you arren't carefully looking and avoiding picking any choice that gives enemies the missle weapons

few days ago had a run that was so great but I failed at like round 24 I think despite flawless up till then, kept getting great bonuses for entire fleet + enemy debuffs ..then all lost at an impossible battle even with 4 rerolls

enemy had 2 of them giant ships with massive missle spam that asploded my fleet right thru double hp, maybe like triple net damage, and all with multiple stacked barriers

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

[bitter umbra]

the funny is here

[pastel hedge]

hehe

[uncut gate]

Oh wild, for me that was a rare mod

Oooh I see, the 2x damage haha

I assume that the "No Extra Ships" modifier basically means no UT today?

[autumn fossil]

the rare version is fighter-specific

the very rare version applies to the entire fleet

[uncut gate]

Oh, I see how memful that would be haha, especially since it scrambles your fleet position haha

[autumn fossil]

no extra ships is actually a good modifier. the enemy fleet's size is based on your fleet's size

[uncut gate]

Ooooooh, I didn't know that, so it would be "fair" especially as you get more starting ships, I assumed fleet size was entirely scaling of waves haha. I have 1x of Fighter, Corvette, and Frigate which means no medium ships for me but hopefully also not needing it since I'll have super boosted "heroes" haha

[cloud hatch]

the first few rounds can get a little rough with no extra ships, just don't pick the 4x swarmer enemy option or something

[uncut gate]

Fair, missile Frigate would be the answer but also would make the other enemies tougher, so best avoided haha

[bitter umbra]

Sad

no mono

[river flax]

There's never Mono in normal play

If anything, I would have expected it hardcoded on Christmas

[fleet steppe]

No Extra Ships definitely among the best mods to get

[dawn gate]

is nice our missles finally got boosted, but when the enemy comes with the near indestructible ships especially if they get missles, that just ruins the fun by basically being a surprise middle finger game over run if you didn't check before you start

[river flax]

So check?

The game is intended to kill you no matter what eventually

[dawn gate]

yep. I always forgetting to do it 😛

[cloud hatch]

got a bit spoiled having rarer mods for a few weeks, aha

[empty cargo]

lol

[woeful zephyr]

rng is trolling us now..

[empty cargo]

literally

[bitter umbra]

lmao

[shell jasper]

awe not first run of day tho

[dawn gate]

in todays edition of lol hard run enders at round 15 no matter how many times I try, even with 2 runs

[rain kindle]

YAYYAY.... finally... i am now going to ignore how much i drop in the next few hours! 🙂

[stone spear]

I'm satisfied where I am, lol.

[pastel hedge]

obliteration by firing squad

im just amping fire rate and seeing how far this can go

im seeing sizable volleys of lasers just fuck off to the spirit realm because their target died to volleys that got there earlier, lmao

[woeful zephyr]

rest of the recent history is pretty good too

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

[rain kindle]

out of curiosity... are you playing it daily just for the bragging rights?

[autumn fossil]

tbh i should be playing it daily. fleet kills achievement isn't gonna happen by itself

[pastel hedge]

just hop into a random galaxy, autobattle all the nodes, undo, end the run, go in again, repeat and undo and repeat and undo etc

[wild timber]

that costs fuel

which costs progress

[river flax]

UT also costs Fuel 😝

[uncut gate]

With UT, is it better to get specimen gain or AF gain? Both are 0

[autumn fossil]

both. technically AF has the best scaling, but that's something that matters only when you're 1e6+ on everything

[dire bison]

And obviously, concentrate on the system you are currently, or about to be, working on.

[woeful zephyr]

nope, mainly to save the banked runs for when I can't do a run due to irl stuff

🤔

why is there a huge empty space on the right side of the box?

you could fit a 6th day there lol XD

[cloud hatch]

not there for me?

[old marsh]

current record is stage 50 cleared

[empty cargo]

very standard

[old marsh]

damn really?

i though that was impressive

lmao

[empty cargo]

no i mean you chose very standard modifiers

[old marsh]

i know i was joking

[empty cargo]

can get around stage 70 with more choices + mono + no extra ships + more mods + rarer mods

[old marsh]

no extra ships?

that seems like a nerf

[empty cargo]

no extra ships is actually good

[old marsh]

really?

[empty cargo]

UT enemy "mass" is the same as players

[old marsh]

i did it with more choices more mods rarer mods mono grid buff

[old marsh]

ohh i see

[empty cargo]

whenever you get a ship the enemy also get a ship

(1 medium = 2 light)

[old marsh]

is grid buffed good too?

[empty cargo]

idk about grid buff

[old marsh]

you get an extra random grid buff every stage

[empty cargo]

that affects enemy too iirc

[old marsh]

it doess yeah

do you know which weapon type is best or does it not matter?

[empty cargo]

people here really seem to like missile

[old marsh]

i like it too

[dire bison]

grid buff is a lot of fun, but don't use beam lasers. It won't clear enemy barriers, so you have a very real chance every level of dying. I've lost on stage 9

[autumn fossil]

you can usually take better advantage of the grid buff than the enemy random placement does

but you need to have no extra ships

one thing it does that is very nice is that it prevents you from getting grid buff upgrade rewards. which means you have more useful rewards on average

[dire bison]

It does make me laugh if I'm playing a full 15 squads of teleporting fighters, and get 7 grid teleports 😂

[bitter umbra]

dear god, their learning

[cloud hatch]

not a bad run

[nova light]

I'm not sure if the sniper grid buff is better or worse on enemy missiles
but oof, double swarmer barriers

[wild timber]

it's definitely better if they have sufficient screening

but probably not as scary as a regular x2 fire rate

[dire bison]

Could very well be a buff for the player, depending on what level it's on. If the missile will 1 shot you anyways, that massive decrease in attack speed might be enough to take it out.

That grid buff is on my "Never get this" list.

[river flax]

https://tenor.com/view/bosnov-67-bosnov-67-67-meme-gif-16727368109953357722

[empty cargo]

@woeful zephyr

[bitter umbra]

banning you

[river flax]

Don't worry, the tester chat is worse

[bitter umbra]

cries

[woeful zephyr]

They don't do AB testing, they do 67 testing.

[river flax]

YES

Testing Sylv's patience

Not tester chat but DMs

[obsidian glade]

et tu, brute?

Nobody is safe from the brainrot

[woeful zephyr]

Embrace the 🇴 🇺 🇳 🇹

[obsidian glade]

🇴 🇺🇳 🇹

[river flax]

I do feel sorta likea hypocrite, in my server this stupid continuous brainrot would not fly at all, I would have nipped it in the bud on like, day 2

[woeful zephyr]

[obsidian glade]

ount no more

[finite wave]

Suffer not the alien to live

[cloud hatch]

uhhh

why are you doing z69 instead of z52?

[finite wave]

... I forgot to switch galaxies

Fuck I've wasted so much fuel

[cloud hatch]

good thing you posted at least

[finite wave]

Thanks for pointing it out, I've no clue how long I was just grinding on z69 😩

[woeful zephyr]

3rd run of the day has some really nice modifiers

[woeful zephyr]

died on stage 37 for the 3rd run of the day.. picking orange mediums was a bad idea oof

I think that may be the highest stage posted here for a non-simulated run without the spacemas modifiers (grid buffed, rarer mods)

and now I have 1e7 artifacts in cap battle lol

[uncut gate]

Is the Armor for Cruisers good? I have 2 units of them but I'm not sure if the upgrade is worth it since it cuts them in half in exchange for just 6 damage of removal when this units do like 70 per shot, I'm on wave 19 so that might be why it doesn't seem so obvious

[nova light]

possibly, with right synergy

generally not though

[uncut gate]

Okay yeah I reckon

Thankfully I did take it, but was slaughtered in the next round so the poor decision didn't mean much haha

[dire bison]

My reasoning behind the recommendation to not take it is overkill. At a certain level, an enemy shot will hit for 100% of your HP. But it doesn't stop there, the next level it might hit for 120%. Then 167%. Then 285%. The numbers are made up but the concept is true. All that extra % of damage is wasted potential on the enemy's part. He has to fire a second time to kill the second Cruiser/HC.

But if you went with the single cruiser upgrade choice, that extra damage is no longer wasted and will quickly reach 1shot kill anyways. This is true even with damage block stat, which scales very slowly and has an effective ceiling. If you stack hull upgrades, you aren't taking offensive bonuses, so you will get whittled down faster than you can kill, and not reach as high of a stage. The missing damage upgrades are worth far more than the dps buff that a single ship receives. Single ship option is absolutely on my "Never take this" list.

[river flax]

Enemies have shot scaling in UT?

Oh the damage scaling

[bitter umbra]

honestly now thinking about it a shot scaling mod would be interesting

could be like very rare

[dawn gate]

when your base takes daamge from the FIRST ROUND. Ouch...good thing re-dos refresh every round

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

[merry hare]

How do you play this? Do you just do 1 run per day to avoid it from over-filling? See how it goes, or save-scum the hell out of it?

[woeful zephyr]

you can do more than 1 run per day but only the first one is ranked

(it's the same daily list of runs for everyone hence the runs can be compared)

save scumming will cause the game to not rank your run afaik

(I think)

since that would give an unfair advantage

[grim veldt]

is there a UT setup guide

[bitter umbra]

with UT, you dont need to save scum at all tbh

cause after 10 Rounds you get the max bonus of Artifacts

but i wouldnt put your fuel into UT until eoc

[grim veldt]

is there any reason to run ut more than stage 10

im on the first run and its still going...

[bitter umbra]

Yeah

so you can auto complete UT without penalty

while 10 is max, go as high as you can so you have banked artifact max

[river flax]

After G8

Not "EoC"

[river flax]

Also, eventually it's about 1.5 runs per day

[bitter umbra]

End of content for Galaxies :p

[river flax]

https://tenor.com/view/disable-the-ping-replies-ping-replies-dont-ping-me-warn-gif-20411479

[woeful zephyr]

there's a setting to turn off ping notifications on your end.. smh

[bitter umbra]

lol

[river flax]

There's also block

SMH

[bitter umbra]

thats right

it goes into the square hole

[woeful zephyr]

when all you have is a hammer..

[river flax]

It's easier for me to block people that don't comply with a request to not ping than it is to change how I want Discord to operate

I WANT to get pings for important shit

Like announcements, updates, etc.

So DND and muting server pings doesn't work for me

The only option left is blocking

I've had this discussion so many god damn times, it's unreal, either stop pinging or get blocked and then it doesn't matter anymore

Obviously I'm not directing frustration at Sounding, they're fine (as it's only this once, so far), but a useless ping is a useless ping and if it continues I'm just going to block

Pings are distracting, stop it

[bitter umbra]

yeah i get it

[dawn gate]

was glad went someone pointed it out to me for the first time, I never even noticed it always defaults to on

[woeful zephyr]

rank 1 stuck

that green guy must be green cause he's green with envy 😛

[obsidian glade]

I don't, tbh lol

I still try to respect it tho

i wonder if there's a plugin that lets you set ping defaults per user

[river flax]

That violates ToS

Which I'm unwilling to do, but IDC if you do as long as it's not in my server, if it allows you to improve my Discord experience by not pinging, that's all good 👍

[river flax]

I gave the only reasoning necessary, you're welcome to disagree but if you actively fail to respect it, I will block

I am curious what your misunderstanding is from

[obsidian glade]

Oh yeah don't worry I definitely try to respect it even if I don't really understand it

I get your reasoning, it makes logical sense, I just personally don't care at all about getting pinged by people. In fact I prefer it, as it means I don't miss the conversation. And pings show up in the server sidebar anyway, so if there's important announcements I'll see them soon enough anyway

So I just can't really put myself in your shoes there, but that's alright, I don't have to understand to follow your preference

[woeful zephyr]

double rank 1 stuck, not bad

[woeful zephyr]

not bad

[river flax]

Since Damage/Hull Amps are 1.2x, don't they allow you to go infinite?

Doing a Fighter Mono run RN with 18 damage amps, they have about 500 DPS

Make that 900

You get the idea

[autumn fossil]

eventually the scaling outgrows what you can combat with damage amps

[uncut gate]

I Balance a bad or good modifier?

Oh dang, maybe I'm really bad at this UT thing haha, my record for z52 is wave 13 haha

[nova light]

manageable in duo, utterly trash otherwise

[uncut gate]

Ah okay noted, I shall abstain this day then haha, it's just Balanced for me

[uncut gate]

Is no Modifier also bad?

[dire bison]

Neutral. It won't hinder you getting max points, but it won't help either. I generally skip it, others play regardless of the mod.

[bitter umbra]

pretty much in any rouglelike you want to stack stats onto one thing which is why balance is bad for late game runs

[shell jasper]

some mechanic that encourages spreading instead of stacking might be interesting. or like a cap on upgrades per ship based on how deep you are? That feels "arbitrary" and dumb tho so more natural be betrter but

[cloud hatch]

well, we all hate balance...so it'd be interesting to have a mechanic where spreading is a benefit

"every different buff across your entire fleet gives x damage/shields to your entire fleet"

[woeful zephyr]

damage spread

like force the damage you take to be spread out among all your ships

actually that could be very bad

ok, that still doesn't encourage spreading buffs..

[shell jasper]

ya it almost just has to be a forced thing with either presenting less options for ships with more upgrades, or capping them

[woeful zephyr]

really? should be easily beatable.. but the rank 1 from Jan 18 stuck so there's that

[shell jasper]

need that sol post to see how many playin

[woeful zephyr]

just implement it into the actual game 😆

[shell jasper]

hrm, maybe

[nova light]

it's really just the nature of the roguelike

you haven't got anything else in particular to help scale stats enough to compete

maybe something like scales with mods on other ships, but it becomes weird

[slim scroll]

do i keep the buffs i earn forever?

with UT

[woeful zephyr]

hell no lol

that would break things

[slim scroll]

ok so they rotate when i do the next run

[woeful zephyr]

yeah

and you always start the run with no bonuses and accumulate them over the course of the run

[slim scroll]

i mean the buffs you select at the start

so these ones get replaced by my next run

[woeful zephyr]

oh those stay

[slim scroll]

nice

[woeful zephyr]

I thought you meant the buffs within the fleet run itself

[slim scroll]

so a small gain every day then

[woeful zephyr]

yeah

[dawn gate]

possible idea for a new UT buff: damage spread by linking all your ships together? Fighters would still go poof first probably and it might be a mess if ya got any barriers

or maybe like shield/armor repair/remote repair?

[bitter umbra]

Strength in numbers would be a interesting modifier where each ship thats still alive gives a bonus based on the amount currently alive. Would work both ways

[digital bobcat]

Buffed grid was a bigger bonus than I guessed it would be, hit 39

(fewer choices, duo, rarer mods)

[cloud hatch]

39? wow i did bad, lost on 32

[vital oar]

31 is my limit\

i love charge laser snipe

using them always hope they wont get nerfed

[digital bobcat]

I think it was a bit of luck

CL Snipe and I always filled the X2 health, barrier, and X2 DMG/rate. Only used teleport when I had to.

Got barrier and *3 burst on both ships and fleet bonus to fire rate

[magic lake]

One of my best runs yet and the first time I've hit rank 1 even it it might not last 😄

[cloud hatch]

you said you got rank 39, are you on z52 galaxy?

[digital bobcat]

Yea

The last one

[cloud hatch]

aha, I don't think you got 39 then, maybe a typo

[digital bobcat]

Ohhh yea, sorry

I was looking at my best clear 🤣

I cleared 32

D'oh

[cloud hatch]

ok I feel less bad now

someone earlier did get a good rank and he was on the prior galaxy, hence my question

[woeful zephyr]

wow 34 is good

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

no way that's going to stick

[cloud hatch]

i dunno, just straight up balance is a pretty big "nope" from most people

esp since yesterday's was good enough to bank several days worth

[woeful zephyr]

true

I wonder how many people played today's run..

Sylv should add that to the rank history page 😄

[shell jasper]

tis on the list!

eventually!

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

[dire bison]

🤔

[autumn fossil]

sylv really like balance

i really should have done a run with more choices, but i was busy that day

[woeful zephyr]

hurry up.. 😐

[obsidian glade]

the game should add a self-destruct button

[tired blaze]

Rank 1 on my birthday. Balanced as all things should be.🎉

[potent cloak]

So do people who max g8 just use fuel to refill UTs?

[tired blaze]

yes. UT bonuses are important.

you get 10x amount of artifacts each galaxy cleared post 5

[potent cloak]

I have all cleared, get ~1.75e5 max artifacts for UTs

[fallow isle]

Does the deployment grid matter much for UT? Is there a preferred arrangement for each stage?

[dire bison]

Happy Birthday Skolander

[dire bison]

There's a bonus missing somewhere, then, should be getting 2.08e5

[potent cloak]

Ah, I don't have the crew upgrade yet

[autumn fossil]

each run, each stage is different

there's no specific setups that you can predict

[shut otter]

There any kind of generic UT guide? Don’t see anything in pins and literally nothing in the wiki

[cloud hatch]

#1335902304959987733 message

everything there is correct, but i'd say charge laser snipe is prob the best weapon, being able to hit enemies before they can hit you is really the only way you can survive in later stages

[vital oar]

UT banked stages changed to be banked runs that can stack

pls explain

something good?

[cloud hatch]

yeah it's good

instead of just one run contributing to your banked clears, every run that gets higher than 10 keeps adding to it

[vital oar]

u mean DOUBLE the amount like it should be???

[cloud hatch]

say you have 2 banked stages right now, and you do a run that gets to stage 17, you'll gain 3 banked stages bringing your total to 5, then the next run you get to stage 15, you'll get 2 more banked stages for a total of 7

[shut otter]

thanks, bookmarked those tips. though i'm still a bit unclear what I should do at all for my first UT run lol. all i've done is click around in the simulator but that didnt really clear anything up

[shut otter]

welp rank 69 tells me idkwtfid. got to stage 17 anyway by "always choosing damage, stack as many on one ship as possible"

[cloud hatch]

yeah that's pretty much what you wanna do, focus on getting charge laser snipe (ideally on corvettes if you have them)

[shut otter]

so of the 6 ut upgrades (are there only six), it looks like you cycle through them at random but your artifacts applied to them, and thus their boost, grow?

[cloud hatch]

currently there's 9

and yes, the artifacts you put on them don't go away

[shut otter]

when do you want to do "spend instability for X artifacts"?

[cloud hatch]

the banked runs are when you don't wanna do the UT run, it just gives you the reward as if you finished stage 10 (the reward cap)

[shut otter]

and does it cost you 1 or more "banked stages" or something?

[cloud hatch]

yeah, 1 banked stage every time you do it

[shut otter]

there any general plan to picking which of the 3 upgrades to target each run? due to the fractional exponent do you get the most gain by spreading the artifact gain around?

[cloud hatch]

they have different scaling

so keeping them all even isn't the best idea

A/F and synth scale the best

cap battle is always gonna be helpful

[shut otter]

ah yeah they've got a ⁨⁨^0.5⁩⁩ while fighter dmg has ⁨⁨^0.2⁩⁩

[cloud hatch]

progressing to more galaxies will also dramatically increase the number of UT artifacts you get as well

so it might be a good idea to hold on to instability if you're close to finishing another galaxy

[shut otter]

does it matter at all how many ships you lose, to make it worth retrying? or basically if you win with 0 base damage that's the best worth achieving

[cloud hatch]

base damage is all that matters, even if you have 0 ships left it's still fine

no benefit to trying to save ships

simulation is free though, so practicing there is a decent idea

[woeful zephyr]

me wondering for a second why my banked stage is 8: 😱

[fervent turret]

what does stacked UT mean?

[woeful zephyr]

banked runs just keep accumulating now, right?

like you can have an unlimited number now, right?

I wonder if the number of people doing UT each day will drop a lot cause of this..

[cloud hatch]

it might go up, since just a middling mid teens run will still get you a few banked stages

[fleet steppe]

Fewer Choices really does a number on Rarer Mods

it feels like it's not even there

[river flax]

Banked runs?

[woeful zephyr]

Yeah but when you first glance at it it looks like you lost a bunch of banked stages

[woeful zephyr]

🤔

[shut otter]

Oof, feel like every time I choose teleporting fighters my run ends on the next round. The fighters jump and get nearly immediately annihilated, then the rest of my fleet has no meat shield

but I’ve just been selecting every Rare mod I’m ever presented. Maybe I shouldn’t.

[deep coral]

same, the teleporting has a big enough charge up time that by the time they do it they're mostly dead or they get somewhere and insta-die, i'll never take that one again

[shut otter]

The first time I thought “oh I must be doing it wrong” the second time I thought “fuuuuck teleport” lol

[dire bison]

for rares generally get 2 bursts, ship imp, 4 glass cannon, frigate/corvette special ability (especially fleet version), fire rate/damage/damage+fire rate/damage+hull grid bonuses, and every damage amp that comes up. Some of these are not marked rare on the card. Hull Bomb and the other one are nice at early levels to help clear skirmishers, so is hull amp, barrier grid bonus, and HP grid bonus. But if you can make it to mid-late game, you'll be happy you took a damage increase instead. Teleport isn't very good. Fleet teleport can be better. But both put your ships into immediate fire range of the enemy - having enemies gradually come into fire range is usually better. Avoid the teleport grid bonus also, since it's a suicide card for that 1 ship. The .25x attack speed grid bonus is a downgrade (imo) - the benefits of that card don't come close to the penalties. But some people like it with beam weapons so YMMV. I think that's all the rare/rare-ish cards avail, and this is only my assessment - others may disagree.

[shut otter]

You mention a ton of rares I haven’t seen yet so maybe they come later? The main rares I’ve gotten: teleport, burst fire, barrier, and not rare but I take every charge snipe I can get

But yes your comment about teleport and firing range is exactly the problem, my fighters drop into the middle of swarms which haven’t been thinned yet and RIP

[shell jasper]

maybe teleport needs a barrier but man that seems like itd just be way too good then

[empty cargo]

:/

[fleet steppe]

chain teleport if it kills the enemy that it shoots at 🗿

[shell jasper]

though it is rare so maybe

[empty cargo]

🤔

[fleet steppe]

or maybe immediate refire if the enemy it targets dies, to really lean into the ambush type feel? rip fleetwide solo missile fighter framerate though

the teleport bunches them all up and I think it's likely they'll all be targetting the same enemy so the offense is probably wasted a bit

[shell jasper]

maybe teeleport one after another actually?

[fleet steppe]

cooking??

[shell jasper]

negates the eney volley a bit, and prevents the giga clumped shooting from your guys

even like 0.05 between would help

[shell jasper]

seems better

[fleet steppe]

curious how this change would affect multiple teleporting units that choose the same spot to teleport to

[shell jasper]

it shouldnt effect anything aside from the slight delay causing an enemy death and thus different jump location

[dire bison]

Teleport feels like it should be a powerful ability. The stagger is a step in the right direction. I think testing it with players would be a good idea, would allow some fine tuning on the amount of staggering to give them. I don't think it's enough to make me desire teleport any more than I currently do ... since they die within 1 salvo anyways. I like your barrier idea, perhaps have it be invuln instead of a barrier that can be overpowered, but only lasting as long as the small damage boost teleport gives. Maybe replace the damage boost. I think defensive buffs are what's needed, so it doesn't feel like a suicide mission that doesn't last long enough to affect the battle.

(My thoughts are based around mid-late game dynamics)

[cloud hatch]

another day, another balance...

wonder if the weights changed or something

[autumn fossil]

sylv giveth and sylv taketh away

we can now accumulate free runs instead of just taking the max every time, but now we have to spend them more because it's all balance

[shut otter]

What multiplies your max artifacts gained besides completing more galaxies? I notice each UT run I earn veeery slightly more artifacts

[shell jasper]

I dunno even this 0.05 second stagger seems to have vastly improved the results. the fighters dont all target one ship and it takes several volleys to bring them down

[cloud hatch]

targeting is kind of the weak point in UT, so yeah it makes sense that forcing a re-target makes things better

and staggering them also causes the fire times to desync from the individual ships in the group, so that also keeps the benefit

if you had an entire fleet's worth of cl snipe ships and they all could acquire targets on spawn, adding a stagger delay to their first shot would be a pretty large damage increase cause they wouldn't all fire at the same thing

that might actually be an interesting thought, fleet wide (you and enemy) the first shot a ship does is staggered within it's group...doesn't require changing the targeting code, it'll just naturally happen due to the the firing times being different

[shell jasper]

oh balance 5 days in a row wow

30% chance per day so uh... less then 1% chance for that

[cloud hatch]

yeah and then there's this too #1335902304959987733 message

it really does seem like balance is showing up too frequently

[cloud hatch]

and another balance shows up, aha

[woeful zephyr]

Exactly 1 balance per day, a perfectly balanced rate

Balance balance

[shell jasper]

6 in a row? sheesh

[cloud hatch]

on the plus side, the new banked runs system is real nice

[delicate marten]

is there a cheat sheet on what mods to lean towards if you don't know what you're doing

[autumn fossil]

damage and fire rate, whichever leads to more dps
(snipe) charge laser xor (barrage) missile launcher. don't mix anti-shield weapons with anti-armor

glass cannon is decent lategame on fighters because they die in one hit anyway

[light verge]

on that note

don't take glass cannon early if at all possible, especially if the map has a lot of counters to your current build

[woeful zephyr]

taking glass cannon early is fine

[light verge]

you are courting death in that case

(unless you know what you're doing)

[woeful zephyr]

just don't get hard enemy layouts early on lol

and it's fine

[digital bobcat]

Sooooo much balance 😂

I guess I bank another day. When does it flip over? In a few hours?

[cloud hatch]

midnight gmt

[deep coral]

ok, so teleport on barrier fighters, think it’s worth?

worried I’ll lose their blocker effectiveness, think i’ll pass

[delicate marten]

is there any reason to continue fighting stages once your artifacts says MAX