#politically aware thread

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

zenith lodge
#

NO ONE CARES

#

you are the only one talking

dense heart
#

is everyone in this server a femboy?

limber kettle
zenith lodge
dense heart
#

I'll take that as a yes

limber kettle
stable bane
#

i mean i can also get uniform of some group with chevrons and all and go do whatever, idk man, i obv dont support that portion of azov that used to be, but they are mostly dead by now anyway. no real need for hurdurr thread ig, im also kinda sick of conversing about inherentry controversial thing

limber kettle
#

I mean i dont hate the citizens

#

I feel bad US and russia pulled yall into a war

#

But Id rather see US lose the proxy war

#

Since if they win

#

Theyll burn moscow

stable bane
#

i cant hate the army that much either, even the nazi portion of it

limber kettle
#

And annex it

stable bane
#

russia winning wont mean ukraine annexing, it will mean burnt ground

limber kettle
#

It will be worse for russia

stable bane
#

they hate us as much as we hate them if not more

limber kettle
#

Than ukraine

#

As russia has more people

#

And more land and resources

#

US would turn russia into a different country

limber kettle
stable bane
#

i doubt it will get to the point of counteroffencive going into russian land (at least that far as kremlin), likely change of power in russia is going to happen earlier

limber kettle
#

ukraine

#

russia

#

woah

#

Russia bad
Ukraine Worse

#

Russia just wants your government to let donbass(mostly russian population) go as well as no joining nato

stable bane
#

most of russian land is unusable either way

limber kettle
#

They dont care for the majority ukranians

stable bane
#

yea sure, they want "mostly russian population" bs

limber kettle
#

Not at all

#

Donbass is mostly russian

#

And has been

#

If US didnt pressure azov

#

This wouldnt have happened

stable bane
#

i live in the fucking region getting shelled every fucking day and night, my region is >90% russian speaking and more than half of that number cant speak ukrainian for shit

#

what happened in eastern regions is literally a russian proxy war giving weapons to essentially somali pirates but of ukraine

#

if it went way it went in crimea they wouldnt have lasted a week

#

like what happened here when they tried to overturn government in my region

#

it all ended in couple days with no resistance to our SWAT

limber kettle
#

Lol you dont have to stay in ukraine

#

Europe is welcoming

stable bane
#

i do have to stay in ukraine as a ukrainian citizen that doesnt break laws without much need plus not having funds to do it either way

limber kettle
stable bane
#

also if anything i think ukraine gotten better since 2014

limber kettle
#

Are you calling the old communist parties of Donestk and Luhestek the same as somalia pirates?

#

What the fuck?

#

I know right

#

Donbass communist who make the people live well

stable bane
#

im calling current people "in charge" essentially pirates

limber kettle
#

Somalian pirates are a condition of French and British ships stealing fish from the country and fishermen

limber kettle
#

They literally had collective farms

#

Planned economy

#

Whole being bombed by Ukraine for 8 years!

stable bane
#

(and lined their pockets)

limber kettle
#

And you say they are pirates?

stable bane
#

yea right

limber kettle
#

You have no clue what youre talking about

#

Even if you do live there

#

That makes it all the more pathetic

#

They live in ukraine so they magically get everything

#

Solid video on it

stable bane
#

too much water and no markers to watch it whole reasonably skipping useless shit

#

mm yes doubling sound on ukrainian speech too so speaker cant hear it either and has to find the source of clip

#

CCs are a thing for a reason

limber kettle
#

Criticizing the format of video instead of video points instead

stable bane
#

anyway, by the looks of it that video doesnt really end with the "how to avoid" statement, and i cba to watch it all with all the water, maybe sometime later

#

again how can i find his points in midst of 80% useless shit if he doesnt even tag the parts

#

war was unavoidable, there is no way around it

#

our old government was heaps times worse than our current one

limber kettle
limber kettle
stable bane
#

yes, the bunch that was "legitemate" before 2014

limber kettle
#

Before 1991 it was a good place

stable bane
#

aka the pro-russian bunch for years on years who had done nothing but rob us

limber kettle
#

That were elected in?

#

Lmao

#

I'm sorry you have to think like that...

#

Over the pro ukraine ones that were dogshit

#

The 2 sides were both garbage

#

Russias side was slightly less garbage

stable bane
#

nah, same shit

limber kettle
#

Under communism ukraine was better

stable bane
#

but at least without pro-russian puppets we wont have to deal with russians after this for a long time

#

communism was never better

limber kettle
#

Lol it was

#

Inb4 the "holodomar" line

stable bane
#

yea sure, thats why my ancestors name is on a Minnesmärke

#

thats how good it was

limber kettle
#

Let's see if they repeat all the fasisct hits

stable bane
#

not even Holodomor

#

the stalinist purges

limber kettle
#

Free education,healthcare, transport, pretty streets and monuments, gays where treated better

limber kettle
#

Oh right your arguing against all of communism with 1 train of thought.

#

The so called purges were against people who were clearly up to no good

#

Its gone over in grover furr

stable bane
#

oh so my fathers side ancestors just one day disappeared for the whole purpose of NOT speaking russian neither ukrainian

limber kettle
#

Bs

#

Russia had ethical laws on speach

stable bane
#

yea right, the poles, germans and swedes that lived (and their heirs still do) live in eastern parts of ukraine are sure up to no good

limber kettle
#

They werent allowed to remove people for not speaking russian

#

Part of the keep the culture act

#

Under lenin

stable bane
#

by the time of purges lenin was nothing but a figure

limber kettle
#

But they also genocided

#

A lot of people

#

Poles got treated well

stable bane
#

and my family isnt german yet also got mistreated same as their brothers

limber kettle
#

Dont know about swedes

#

Poles got treated great

#

They got fucking trains first

#

Got healthcare like day 1

#

Food was given out more greatfully

#

Not sure what you mean

#

By pols

stable bane
#

there is a Minnesmärke in Gammölsvänskbi to 16 people killed (of ~200 at the time) in stalinist purges, my distant relative name is on that stone too

limber kettle
#

Their us entire books on how pols got treated best

#

Under soviets

stable bane
#

swedes got treated like shit

limber kettle
stable bane
#

especially considering none wanted to abolish their religion because that was the only thing that helped them

limber kettle
stable bane
#

sweden was never ally, but was more or less neutral true, but otherwise it would mean walk in the park destruction

#

of ~200 TOTAL citizens of the village

#

not the amount killed

limber kettle
#

Ill research sweden

#

Lol only 200 died of that 200 probably 90% were kulaks

#

And hoarded grain

#

Deserved

stable bane
#

you still dont read but whatever

limber kettle
#

Kulaks were common all over eastern block before they were delt with

stable bane
#

we have vastly different views on whats happening and you get to write from warm home while i sit here at +8 C

limber kettle
#

Ukraine poland estonia

#

Its actually cold

#

Heaters busted

#

Capitalism am i right

stable bane
#

yea well my electricity was out for 27 hours yesterday

limber kettle
#

Well you chose to stay in ukraine

stable bane
#

so home is basically almost as cold as outside

limber kettle
#

Why not go to nederlands?

#

Youd be safier

stable bane
#

again, i dont have a choice without breaking the law

limber kettle
#

Laws are meant to be broken

stable bane
#

why not? maybe because i have no savings since russia invaded?

#

all money i have rounds up to about 1600$

limber kettle
#

Hnm

#

True

#

Could get a job

#

In poland

stable bane
#

yea no, i choose to stay here not just because of laws, i have some commitment to both my family and work considering how much my boss helped me over the years to stay afloat

limber kettle
#

Ah

stable bane
#

plus leaving border by breaking law rn comes up to about 4 grand usd

limber kettle
#

Oof

stable bane
#

(and isnt a 100% thing either)

limber kettle
#

They fine you for wanting to not die?

#

Bad government

stable bane
#

lol fine

#

yea no, literally bribes

#

and noone says they will work

#

also i do want to at least be able to visit my homeland some time later

#

which i wont be able to if i leave the border rn

#

i can wait it out slowly rebuilding my savings while trying to help my Mariupol family settle here as well

#

gives me time to improve my system engineering and swedish skills too so i can move to sweden once borders are open

#

i love my job and dont want to loose the field i work in

limber kettle
#

Ah I see

#

You have a lot of self interest in the war aganist Ukraine and in the quasi fasisct government

#

Makes sense

cerulean crater
stable bane
#

Something that basically no longer exist

#

Due to rapid unbuilding over the span of weeks

sacred parcel
#

Scheduled rapid demolition

limber kettle
stable bane
#

can believe the "people supporting russian orgs/russians" part though, is something russia would do and did in the past

dense heart
limber kettle
#

@limber kettle like by material conditions, I meant to say that due to the increasing changes in society, it was a reaction of the ruling class.

limber kettle
#

By the ruling or once ruling class

#

Reactionarys are almost always on the side of capitalism

#

Why revolutionaries are on the side of socialism(modern change)

#

I see, it makes sense.

#

So even like the american revolution which was capitalist, it was against fuedalism

#

Which at that time

#

Capitalism was more socialist

#

Then fuedalism was

#

Europe was in a state of late stage fuedalism

limber kettle
#

Now europe is in a state of stagnation

#

US has it really bad

#

People want change

#

Its just

#

Hardwr

#

The matieral conditions

#

We live in

#

Are very different

#

Than the 1920s

#

And 1930s

#

Yeah

#

Keep in mind from the start of 1900 to 1970 saw more revolutions than most time periods

#

Specifically the 1910s and 1920s saw so many governments collapse

limber kettle
#

Turkey became a republic, ireland got free from britian, soviet union started, mongolia freed itself,you saw china reform into a 2 country system(later in 49 a second revolution kicking out kmt).

#

Like

#

It was so much good

limber kettle
#

Everyone says only russians succeded but thats wrong

#

Success was just different

#

The types of revolutions were different

#

Country to country

#

Of course they are

#

Turkey went from a theocracy to a republic

#

Thats massive

#

Ireland went from a colony to a country

#

Mongolia went from fuedalism to communism

#

You saw like a lot happen one after another

limber kettle
#

Yeah

#

Till 1992

#

They were communist

#

Now their a socialist state

#

Which is like

#

Not as good

#

But still good

#

Just sucks

#

Mongolia was badass

#

They went communist and kept the king alive basically to live in his little house and watch the world change outside.

#

Almost mockingly

#

Also after he died no more kings existed there

#

Nice

#

Yeah the west would like you to believe only russia succeded

#

Its way more complicated

#

The success of other countries were just as big

#

Even if not communist

#

Fuedalism is so bad

#

Theocracies are not great

#

I definitely need to inform myself more! Thanks.

#

What countries today would you consider to be socialist

#

Also mexico

#

1917

limber kettle
#

Complicated

#

What kind of socialism?

#

Like Socialism without pure capital?

#

In that case, North korea,mongolia, wa state

limber kettle
#

Socialism with pure capital? Norway,netherlands,slovania

limber kettle
limber kettle
#

So like Soc dems

#

Basically

#

Yeah

#

Socialism thats good is rare.

#

Like north korea cool

#

Mongolia cool

#

So China is pretty much a hybrid right?

#

Wa state cool

limber kettle
#

China is fighting deng era free market socialism

#

China is more planned economy

limber kettle
#

Which under socialism would be called communism with chinese characteristics

#

Vietnam is communist too

#

Laos is communist but is also fighting deng era shit of their own

#

Cuba is communist

#

Venzuala is socialist

#

Brazil rn is soc dem

#

I see

#

Yeah, China is still doing reforms to get rid of Deng era policies

#

I think Deng era policies were necessary at the time for economic growth and industrialization, but they aren't needed anymore.

#

I dont

#

Deng was a capitalist free loader

#

Like mao and stalin both said

#

Hmm, I see

#

Finland went from capitalism with monarchy to just capitalism 1917

#

Which was a big deal

#

Socdems lead it

limber kettle
#

Malta 1919
Iraq 1920

#

Just to name some others

#

Greece won then lost

#

So i dont count greece

#

They had like 5 yrs of freedom

#

So little time :(

limber kettle
#

Greece is complicated

#

They never get to be free

#

Always war

#

Always poverty

#

Endless wars

#

Feel bad for them

#

Yeah, but thankfully the Greek communist party is growing strong recently!

#

Greece communist think gays and trans are liberal capitalist

#

Still glad for the growth

limber kettle
#

Communist are so complicated

#

It certainly is

#

Has many different variants and interpretations

#

Any good literature you'd suggest?

#

Well many communist follow stalin religiously

#

But mao was pretty great

#

I think lenin sets the solid groundwork for all modern takes

#

Marx(and engels) ofc is the creator

limber kettle
limber kettle
#

And that's mostly the reason why the 1848 revolutions failed, bad organization.

#

However they caused big changes at the same time.

#

The saddest thing is engels met lenin

#

But died before lenins revolution ever happened