🪅-progaming

[spark tiger]

NO

im NOT using voice messages

[jade stone]

i get the same result with !=

[ornate quiver]

well whats Transferable
it seems like it's a container of some sort
probably over ffi or whatever

you should compare the underlying content

[spark tiger]

[valid jetty]

i havent

i know it exists but i havent played it

[placid cape]

too silent

[hoary sluice]

turn up your sound

dalboebsin ba?

[jade stone]

comparing undlerlying content doesn't seem to work

i think i will just make some native code for what i need

[winged mantle]

😭 ??

[crude star]

it says you posted it

[winged mantle]

stack exchange reminding me of old stuff

this is the best thing i have ever posted

[valid jetty]

reminds me of when i searched up what an auto var is in C and got this post

https://stackoverflow.com/a/2192761

[winged mantle]

B is a funny language

[crude star]

does register exist in c++

[shrewd canopy]

./run ```cpp
int main() {
register int a = 42;
return a;
}

[rugged berry]

@shrewd canopy I received cpp(10.2.0) compile errors

file0.code.cpp: In function 'int main()':
file0.code.cpp:2:16: warning: ISO C++17 does not allow 'register' storage class specifier [-Wregister]
    2 |   register int a = 42;
      |                ^

[shrewd canopy]

sad

[fervent torrent]

🥀

i have to work on this too

[shrewd canopy]

the only keyword from C that doesn't exist in C++ is restrict iirc

[crude star]

C++, the C superset that isn't

[winged mantle]

when i think of things c has but c++ doesn't i think of well defined union type punning and the ability to use & with an rvalue

[crude star]

C has alloca

peak

[winged mantle]

i imagine the latter is limited but i remember being able to do &(SDL_RECT) {0, 0, 10, 10}

maybe it's a weird compiler extension idk

[valid jetty]

you’re still restricted in C

you can’t do &1 to automatically put a 1 on the stack somewhere and give you a pointer to it

[winged mantle]

thats not really useful anyway

[crude star]

dynamic stack allocation

[valid jetty]

it’s been pretty useful in elle code

[winged mantle]

when would you use an int pointer other than output param

[crude star]

it is actually

[crude star]

an input output param that you don't actually want to read

[valid jetty]

use std/prelude;

fn direction(i32 *other) -> bool {
    return !other ? direction(&0) : &0 > other;
}

fn main() {
    io::printf(
        "The stack is growing {}wards for your architecture.",
        direction(nil) ? "up" : "down"
    );
}

[valid jetty]

well no, you can swap the int for anything

[winged mantle]

you can do it with a struct though

unless it's a weird compiler specific thing

[crude star]

struct intt { int value; }

[valid jetty]

https://github.com/acquitelol/elle/blob/rewrite/examples/graphics/uv_mango.le#L44-L49

[pearl stag]

uv_mango.le: Lines 44-49

rl::set_shader_value(
    shader,
    rl::get_shader_location(shader, "time"),
    &#cast(f32, rl::get_time()),
    ShaderUniformDataType::SHADER_UNIFORM_FLOAT
);

[valid jetty]

but the ergonomics of being able to take the address of any rval

is nice

https://github.com/acquitelol/elle/blob/rewrite/std/runtime/allocators/gc.le#L101

[winged mantle]

oh and of course c has vlas

[valid jetty]

ugh

https://github.com/acquitelol/elle/blob/rewrite/std/runtime/allocators/gc.le#L101

[pearl stag]

gc.le: Line 101

self.__internal_mark_region(#cast(void **, &0), #env.stack_top);

[winged mantle]

in c++ you need to use alloca

[fervent torrent]

vro.

[valid jetty]

vlas in what sense

being able to do int foo[bar] with an arbitrary rval in bar?

[winged mantle]

with arbritary expression

[crude star]

I don't think alloca is allowed in C++

[valid jetty]

well yeah an rvalue would be an expr

[winged mantle]

wdym it's a non standard thing anything doesn't this depend on implementation

[valid jetty]

does c++ not let you do this???

[crude star]

alloca would mess up destructors

[winged mantle]

nope

[valid jetty]

wow

[winged mantle]

gotta do std::vector

or whatever

[valid jetty]

std::span

[winged mantle]

whats a span

[valid jetty]

https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/container/span.html

[winged mantle]

that doesn't explain much

its a slice?

[valid jetty]

a slice

yea

[crude star]

^

[winged mantle]

what would it do

[valid jetty]

static arrays can’t exactly grow in size so a slice/span works well

[winged mantle]

that sounds fun

[crude star]

can't unwind stack if you don't know the stack size

[valid jetty]

i know the stack size

[winged mantle]

seems to "work" with ints

[crude star]

huh

[winged mantle]

(not really)

idk if this happens in c too

but surely alloca would increase sp so how would it cause weirdness

won't i be a register anyway

maybe i should just add register

@signal oak create doom in c++ templates

[native spruce]

bwah

[shrewd canopy]

Does int* foo = new int[bar]; not work for that

[valid jetty]

isn’t that boxed/heap alloced tho

afaik new is for heap allocations

[winged mantle]

rust brainrot

[valid jetty]

boxing is not a rust term

c# and haskell use the same terminology

[winged mantle]

irrelevent languages

[winged mantle]

yes

[crude star]

only rust uses it in the language itself

[fervent torrent]

god damn i'm a genius...

[crude star]

allocating on stack is dumb anyway

both the stack and the heap are in RAM

[winged mantle]

ram is your bedroom floor heap is the random clothes scattered around stack is the stacked books

[jade stone]

@winged mantle will clean up their room

[winged mantle]

this is not a self-referential your

[jade stone]

i swear is there no good clipboard library for linux

how tf do i get notified without making like 10 specific implementions for each DE

[winged mantle]

notified about?

clipboard stalking?

[jade stone]

when the clipboard changes

i am making a clipboard app

[winged mantle]

does wayland make it hardfer

[crude star]

execvp("wl-copy", "--watch")

[lavish frigate]

Don’t care about stack or heap or whatever im shitting in your ram and causing a pc crash

[jade stone]

yes and no

if wayland wasn't a thing, i would just use c/c++ for this

[jade stone]

there is an XDG Desktop portal for this

but kde doesnt support it

it has it's own dbus interface thing for it

[shrewd canopy]

Wish APIs were actually unified per platform

[lavish cloud]

Wayland is supposed to do that

Unfortunately they forgot to ask both users and developers for feedback

[fervent torrent]

how can i edit this tooltip?

[spark tiger]

real https://vxtwitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/1940747452103139450

SwiftOnSecurity (@SwiftOnSecurity)

I frankly do not understand how online video games coded in C++ are ever safe to run at all.

QRT: vxunderground
Gamers are going ballistic

Call of Duty WWII, available on Xbox PC Game Pass, contains an unpatched RCE exploit

Someone is trolling gamers with Notepad pop ups, PC shutdowns, and gay pornography https://t.co/FLNzRbLt1s

vxTwitter / fixvx · Jul 3, 2025, 12:20 PM

[shrewd canopy]

this is massive skill issue

rust solves only memory safety issues, not security issues

[native spruce]

well it depends

“security issues” could happen due to a wide range of bugs

it just happens that rust can deal with most if not all of the memory related problems that could lead to any potential security issues

while it does not stop security issues as a whole, I.E. logic bugs can still occur. It does solve the most common ones

[frosty skiff]

a majority of security related issues are usually memory related whether it's uaf, double free, stack smashing or a buffer overflow

heartbleed is a good example, and iirc the 2019 chrome zeroday was related to heap corruption that allowed for ace

[crude star]

swiftonsecurity 😭🙏

[spark tiger]

tssss

[wild coral]

which one would you use
pycord
or discord.py

im using discord.py rn but i was just curious

[crude star]

no reason to use pycord anymore

d.py is maintained again

[wild coral]

figured

i like d.py

discord bots r cool :3

[wheat kernel]

pycord is ass

[austere idol]

log4j

[fleet cedar]

No swearing in this christian minecraft server

[nimble quail]

nothing too crazy just yet

[hoary sluice]

@valid jetty me when i dont want to make a parser

[valid jetty]

well how do you think the elle lsp works silly

trolley~1

parser? for what

[ivory heath]

I don’t like the fact that here and golang this isn’t a explicit type

[ivory heath]

70% if you believe some companies.

Some of the biggest attacks in history have nothing to do with that tho. Just incorrect permissions or logic exploits.

[fleet cedar]

Or social engineering

[ivory heath]

Yop

Does not matter how many array slices you bounds check if I can get a intern to plug in this one simple usb stick

[mild yoke]

L rust

[valid jetty]

you can exlicitly type it if you want

i32 x = 42;

[ivory heath]

You can in go as well. I don’t like the implicit :=

How do you handle variable shadowing?

[valid jetty]

exactly as you’d expect

[ivory heath]

if I for example have

Var someString string 
if someString, err := someFunc(); err != nil {
    return err
}
fmt.PrintLn(someString)

In go someString is never written to and it pisses me off

[valid jetty]

in elle that doesn’t happen

if you use := in a tuple destructure it’ll shadow the previous variables

[ivory heath]

Oh you can redefine the type of the var itself within the same scope? Thats… that would be a headache to actually use

[valid jetty]

well, yes because as far as the compiler is concerned the previous variable no longer exists

it just resolves to the last defined x

[valid jetty]

i’ve found a single good use for it

[ivory heath]

What use?

[valid jetty]

fn main() {
    server := TcpServer::bind(port := 8080);

    while server.is_err_and(fn(err) err == Errno::EADDRINUSE) {
        server = TcpServer::bind(port += 1);
    }

    server := server.unwrap();
    defer server.close().unwrap();
    $printf("Server is listening on port {}", port);

    connection := server.accept().unwrap();
    defer connection.close().unwrap();
    buf := Array::bytes(BUF_SIZE);

    while (_, received := connection.read(buf)) && received != 0 {
        $printf("Received {} bytes: {}", received, buf.join("").replace("\n", ""));
        connection.write(buf).expect("Failed to send response");
    }
}

the server := server.unwrap();

[ivory heath]

Oh yeah I guess it could be useful for that instead of polluting the name space

[valid jetty]

yeah

[ivory heath]

You have to be aware of what the type is updated to tho

[valid jetty]

it’s fine because there’s an lsp

you get hover diagnostics

(and it’s strongly statically typed)

[ivory heath]

I think code should be readable without a LSP

[valid jetty]

if you try to use the .close method and it hasn’t been unwrapped you’ll get an error at compile time

[valid jetty]

i mean imo it’s still readable

[ivory heath]

I mean you can infer what it does

I just like verbose personally

[valid jetty]

i mean nothing is stopping you from giving the unwrapped or wrapped version different names

you could have maybeServer -> server or server -> serverUnwrapped

but generally you’re allowed to shadow like this because why not

you’re never gonna use the result ever again, so why not overwrite it (as far as the compiler is concerned)

[valid jetty]

also, you can only redefine the var’s type if you’re shadowing the previous one

you can’t do

x := 1;
x = “hi”;

[ivory heath]

Yeah that makes perfect sense

[valid jetty]

maybe i can make a pedantic compilation flag which disallows shadowing? but i’ve seen very very rare cases where it actually screws you up

[ivory heath]

A warning, but not an error?

Pedantic to mean just means all warnings becomes errors

[valid jetty]

oh true i could just make it a warning

i need to stop thinking like andrew kelly it’s not good for me

one big differentiator is that i fucking hate immutability

it just becomes annoying at a point

i have like 100 pub keywords in some of my rust files because i have to make every single field public (which is a different problem)

but yeah, variables are mutable, all pointers are mutable

and i will die on that hill

[ivory heath]

You miss out on compiler optimizations and safe assertions

[valid jetty]

i mean i guess that’s true

but until i switch to a non-qbe backend the optimizations i can do are already very limited

[spark tiger]

can do that in rust as well afaik

[valid jetty]

you can yea

[ivory heath]

Ex, if I multiply by a global constant that isn’t Inlineable and mutable then the cpu has to deference it first.

Which actually can SOMETIMES be faster in specific scenarios or ISA

[ivory heath]

I don’t like it in it either

[valid jetty]

in rust mutable constants are unsafe lol

because thread safety

[spark tiger]

i guess rust compiler is smart enough to fail on some unpredictable ones iunno

[valid jetty]

and anyway “mutable constant” is a contradiction

i think you mean mutable global static

[ivory heath]

I meant to use constant in quotes not literally

[valid jetty]

oh

[ivory heath]

Static means something else depending on the context

[valid jetty]

well yeah but in a global context it means the value is constexpr and, if mutable, is put into the uninitialized data section .bss

that’s what you mean 99% of the time when you say static variable

[ivory heath]

That makes me think of something I’m working on….

I have mutable globals but I hate it

[valid jetty]

i have tried to make global mutable variables usable but it’s hard

global!(POINTER_ID: &str = "__ptr__", get_POINTER_ID);

#[macro_export]
macro_rules! global {
    ($name:ident : $type:ty = $value:expr, $getter:ident) => {
        pub static mut $name: Option<$type> = Some($value);

        macro_rules! $getter {
            () => {
                unsafe { $name.unwrap() }
            };
        }

        #[allow(unused)]
        pub(crate) use $getter;
    };
}
``` because rust

[ivory heath]

Yeah that sucks.

[valid jetty]

i don’t even need this bearocracy because the compiler is single threaded

[ivory heath]

I assume rust is smart enough to see that there is an unsafe reference to a global constant to then not inline said constant?

Else you get undefined behavior

Oh wait, it’s defined as mutable

So ofc it wouldn’t inline

It’s not a constant cast to mutable

Why would it even be unsafe tho as long as it’s wrapped within a mutex….. something something pointers

[valid jetty]

@hoary sluice is there a way to write this more elegantly with less allocations

fn Array::merge_sort<T>(T[] self) {
    if self.len() < 2 { return self; }
    return self.iter().map(fn(x) [x]).collect().merge()[0];
}

fn Array::merge<T>(T[][] self) -> T[][] {
    if self.len() < 2 {
        return self;
    } else if self.len() == 2 {
        res := [T;];
        xs, ys := self;
        i := j := 0;

        while i < xs.len() && j < ys.len() {
            if xs[i] < ys[j] {
                res.push(xs[i]);
                i += 1;
            } else {
                res.push(ys[j]);
                j += 1;
            }
        }

        // one of these will be empty :)
        res.extend(xs.slice(i, -1));
        res.extend(ys.slice(j, -1));
        return [res];
    } else {
        res := self;

        while res.len() > 1 {
            // you cant escape this while-loop with fold :(
            res = res.chunks(2).map(fn(x) x.merge()[0]).collect();
        }

        return res;
    }
}

i can do a swap buffer but then that no longer has the super elegant res.chunks(2).map(fn(x) x.merge()[0])

and the actual merging logic for when the len is 2 is kinda mehhh for readability

i had a version before which was more elegant but it was O(n^2logn) because it popped from the lists from the front which shifted everything back down

i guess the most elegant way to write the merging logic would be to use a deque but i dont have that in elle

i might just write one specifically for this

ive wanted one for a while but if i write it i need to do it right

[median root]

yo do packages like pynput and pyatuogui support flatpak apps?

[hoary sluice]

@fleet cedar is a lot smarter than me

[shrewd canopy]

of course

[median root]

great that means i have a bigger issue i needa fix

[mild yoke]

real

[shrewd canopy]

i have 2.37.0.windows.1 so

[winged mantle]

no updates to git with dnf update --refresh

[nimble bone]

is it over now?

[jade stone]

okay

[viscid grove]

wdym over

[nimble bone]

Apple ships git 2.39 😭

[lavish frigate]

it shall stay this way

~>git -v
git version 2.39.1.windows.1

[nimble bone]

That's better.

[jade stone]

is this git for windows only

nix only has git 2.49

@pseudo sierra fix

[viscid grove]

it has a command for apple

[nimble bone]

https://mac.com

https://archlinux.org

[jade stone]

it says all versions <= 2.50.0 are vulnerable

[viscid grove]

yeah

[nimble bone]

https://getfedora.org https://get.opensuse.org/tumbleweed https://ubuntu.com https://debian.org

[jade stone]

but the CVE says otherwise

[viscid grove]

wow

paper spreading misinformation

[jade stone]

yop

[pseudo sierra]

it's in 25.05 staging and been in master for a day

[jade stone]

still hasn't hit unstable

😔

[pseudo sierra]

shrimply use master

also I'm pretty sure it's in unstable small

[jade stone]

https://github.com/NixOS/nixpkgs/blob/nixos-unstable/pkgs/applications/version-management/git/default.nix#L63

[pearl stag]

default.nix: Line 63

version = "2.49.0";

[valid jetty]

@royal nymph https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npUDDjQ9J_w

this is kind of awesome

[crude star]

this sucks who taught the aibros yield

[valid jetty]

no keep watching

watch the whole thing

it gets better and better

[jade stone]

Husk

[valid jetty]

pls watch the full video this is actually pretty cool

[crude star]

you can replace await with yield but it creates the same problem as async 😭

[jade stone]

You posted effect here before and I didn’t like it then

[valid jetty]

thats not the problem it solves

using yield, you can bubble up tagged errors

which you cant do with await

but there is more interesting stuff

[crude star]

@grok summarise this video

[supple whale]

this is awful, this is just old nodejs style callbacks, but wrapping promises

[valid jetty]

just watch it 😭

omg watch the video

[supple whale]

and old node users know how insane of a pain that is

[shrewd canopy]

fun fact, python is used to have coroutines implemented with yield and yield from

[valid jetty]

it is not like old nodejs callbacks

[supple whale]

it is just re-wrapping them

[crude star]

its half an hour long no one is watching

[supple whale]

which is awful

[valid jetty]

it is not doing that 😭

[nimble bone]

lc.gpt tldr

[visual shell]

> This video introduces "Effect" as a powerful al…

The video introduces "Effect" as an alternative to async/await in TypeScript, addressing issues of unpredictability and error handling. Key points include:

• Issues with async/await: It's unpredictable, especially with success and error channels, and often requires try/catch blocks for unknown error types.
• "Effect" Features:
  • Explicit Error Modeling: Allows tagging different error types with full type safety.
  • Defined Channels: Clearly defines success, error channels, and dependencies.
  • Structured Error Handling: Uses utilities like catchTags for specific error types.
  • Data Parsing: Includes @effect/schema for runtime validation and parsing.
  • Enforcing Return Types: Uses makeEffect to type success channels, preventing type mismatches.
  • Rich Utilities: Offers retries, filtering, and an HTTP client for error-managed, schema-based requests.

The speaker recommends "Effect" for more predictable, type-safe asynchronous code management.

OpenAI • Response may be factually wrong or completely made up.

[supple whale]

sir, it legit is, you have await wrapped into a generator callback on each step

this is just nodejs callbacks, just more complex

[jade stone]

what even is the point of this

[valid jetty]

the difference is that if something can fail in a yield, the error is propagated to the generator's type signature so you can catch it later

[jade stone]

this is worse than async/await

[supple whale]

so you get x10 the boilerplate, x0.1 the readability and pure pain

[supple whale]

type safety

TLDR typescript doesnt implement @throws

and with this you can have type safe errors

[jade stone]

eh

not worth it

[supple whale]

yeah

[crude star]

errors are a skill issue

[jade stone]

just use a discriminated union if errors matter that much

[supple whale]

i 100% agree that lack of error support is a BIG problem in TS

[valid jetty]

it has much more than just type safe errors however

[jade stone]

can't really be solved tho

[supple whale]

it can

JSDoc solved it decades ago

simply no1 implemented the spec

[valid jetty]

it has requirements for dependency injection, a ton of utility functions, etc..

[crude star]

if my code throws an error its a user problem

[jade stone]

i should really look into DI sometime

[frosty skiff]

true

[jade stone]

never really gave it much thought

[frosty skiff]

just tell the user not to make mistakes

😁

[supple whale]

DI?

[jade stone]

dependency injection

[supple whale]

i arrived at a simple solution for errors in TS tho, if its a promise, then it throws an error, always.

[frosty skiff]

I love DI

[supple whale]

sir... thats step 1 of programming doe

i cant imagine anything without DI

[jade stone]

guh

what even is it

i've heard of it before, but never used it

[crude star]

it's a nonsense term tbh

[supple whale]

yeah

so TLDR

[frosty skiff]

basically, instead of a class creating it's own dependencies (such as the objects it needs to work) such are provided from the outside (a different class)

[jade stone]

wouldn't that just mean passing a bunch of poilerplate parameters around

[frosty skiff]

basically

constructor hell

❤️

[jade stone]

horror

[frosty skiff]

it's why people use

stuff like koin

[frosty skiff]

for di

[jade stone]

@signal oak what is koin

[supple whale]

class MySomeThing {
  constuctor (myfilestrture: Directory) { 
    this.myfiles = new myfiles('/base/')
  }
  something () {
    return this.myfiles.entries()
  }
}

[frosty skiff]

di framework

https://insert-koin.io/

[jade stone]

love the domain

[frosty skiff]

it gets even better they're sponsored by a fuckton of csgo gambling sites

[jade stone]

WHY ARE THEY ALL MADE USING KOTLIN

INSANE

[supple whale]

you have some abstract structure, and something that consumes said structure, then anything that implements said structure can be used, and the consuming class doesnt really care how it implements it, all it cares is that it implements it

[frosty skiff]

because kotlin is superior

I'm writing my compiler for x86 -> jvm in kotlin

[jade stone]

writing cursed java rn

public class ClipboardWatcher implements AutoCloseable {

    @SuppressWarnings("unused")
    private final ClipboardChangedEvent onChangeCallback;

    public ClipboardWatcher(ClipboardChangedEvent onChange) {
        this.onChangeCallback = onChange;
        this.setupListener();
        Thread t = new Thread(() -> {

        });
        t.setDaemon(true);
        t.start();
    }

    public native void setupListener();

    public native void cleanupListener();

    @Override
    public void close() {
        try {
            this.cleanupListener();
        } catch (Throwable e) {
            e.printStackTrace();
        }
    }

    /**
     * some data for native, probably a pointer.
     * <p>
     * if you change this, you probably will segfault
     */
    @SuppressWarnings("unused")
    private long nativeData = 0;
}

[supple whale]

so pretty much any W3C defined spec, that is then implemented anywhere, you don't care HOW File works in JS, all you care about is it works

[frosty skiff]

what are u working on even

[jade stone]

need to be notified when clipboard changes

[frosty skiff]

for mobile?

im guessing because

[jade stone]

no

[frosty skiff]

oh

[jade stone]

this is desktop jvm

[frosty skiff]

why is it in java then

[jade stone]

eaiser to work with JNI imo

(cba to learn jni for kotlin)

[fleet cedar]

It's not like jni is any different in kotlin

Still the same jvm

[frosty skiff]

I love jni i create 1000 dummy dll's for my drm

[supple whale]

damn, discord already sold my data, that was fucking QUICK

[frosty skiff]

my bad

[jade stone]

is that the same guy that made the last video

[supple whale]

maybe

idk

[jade stone]

yeah

it is

[supple whale]

jesus

[frosty skiff]

JNI in kotlin isn't really any different to how you'd use JNI from java

its just external func nativeshit(): string rather then public native string nativeshit();

unless that isn't what u mean

[jade stone]

guh

i probably could do it in kotlin

but meh

[frosty skiff]

why don't u just write it to work outside the jvm 😭

[jade stone]

wdym

[frosty skiff]

like

[jade stone]

my app is in kotlin

[frosty skiff]

oh

[jade stone]

i need c/c++ code to get when the clipboard changes

you can't do it in java, even with polling (in any sane manner)

[frosty skiff]

what is kotlin used for then? the gui etc

[jade stone]

yeah

[frosty skiff]

I see

[jade stone]

the ui is compose destkop

(wanted to learn something new)

[frosty skiff]

I've been using skia a lot recently for rendering stuff myself

and it's been awesome

[jade stone]

neat

[frosty skiff]

mostly via tiny-skia in rust

idk i love jni

ive done so much with jni

i could probablyh talk about jni all day

[jade stone]

i need to render arbitrary html for this project tho

so that will be fun

[frosty skiff]

oh interesting

[jade stone]

(no js tho)

[frosty skiff]

yeah

[jade stone]

@signal oak how does java handle kotlin typealiases

guhh mugman left

[frosty skiff]

iirc aren't typealiases a compile time thing?

[jade stone]

oh

you cant

just use the underlying type

[supple whale]

right, dont do shit while updating drivers

[frosty skiff]

when i update my drivers i actually start probing the cpu mid update ❤️

fixes all my issues ever

[gaunt whale]

What does probing mean

[austere idol]

running some random benchmarks (and viruses)

[lucid trail]

i got a new keyboard!

[ionic lake]

congrats!

[dense sand]

vscode release notes be like:

• ai
• ai
• more ai

[tired vigil]

Tf is MCP anyway

Also aren't half of vscode updates just them adding special integrations for copilot chat?
I hate this sm

[dense sand]

in my old days, mcp was minecraft mod coder pack

😭

[tired vigil]

That would be a much better feature tbh

[jade stone]

Minecraft patcher?

[fervent torrent]

does anyone know how i can edit this tooltip?

[ornate quiver]

YOP

I love jni

[valid jetty]

wow this is so much slower than quicksort lol

[ornate quiver]

jni is fun

[valid jetty]

goes to show that time complexity is not necessarily linked to speed i guess

merge sort on a 10k array with random numbers from 0-10k takes 4m 23s, quick sort takes 29s on the same array

and there are both O(nlogn) :3

wow actually

the quick sort is almost instant 😭

the actual formatting of the array into a string takes 30s

yeah wtf

why is the quick sort so much faster than merge sort even though they have the same time complexity

fn Array::sort<T>(T[] self) {
    if self.is_empty() || self.len() <= 1 {
        return self;
    }

    __internal_qsort(self.elements, 0, self.len() - 1);
    return self;
}

!pub fn __internal_qsort<T>(T *array, i64 low, i64 high) {
    if low >= high {
        return;
    }

    T pivot = array[high];
    i64 i = low;

    for i64 j = low; j < high; j += 1 {
        if array[j] < pivot {
            T temp = array[i];
            array[i] = array[j];
            array[j] = temp;
            i += 1;
        }
    }

    T temp = array[i];
    array[i] = array[high];
    array[high] = temp;

    __internal_qsort(array, low, i - 1);
    __internal_qsort(array, i + 1, high);
}

😭

[jade stone]

JNI seems relatively simple yet i feel like i will go insane with it

[ornate quiver]

there's quite a bit of footguns that you have to avoid

[jade stone]

i'm already using c++

[dense sand]

why are you using jni

[jade stone]

i need to be notified when the system clipboard changes

[dense sand]

from java?

why dont you use jna or ffi 😭

[jade stone]

wdym by ffi

what ffi does java have

[dense sand]

something like this

https://dev.java/learn/ffm/

but only if you use new java version

[jade stone]

i'd rather use jni

cba to bother with JNA

and im limited to java 21

[valid jetty]

what the hell is this https://dev.java/learn/ffm/native/

why so much bloat to call a C function

[jade stone]

yeah

[dense sand]

i mean, tbf im more comfortable with using jni-like syntax too

[ornate quiver]

to make it "safer' or something

[jade stone]

it seems a lot more complicated then it needs to be

[dense sand]

its just that jni will soon become deprecatzed feature in new versions of java

[jade stone]

also what's dev.java

who owns that

[ornate quiver]

jni is so much more simple

[ornate quiver]

I don't remember it being deprecated

[dense sand]

will soon

[ornate quiver]

it's just turned off by default for security

[jade stone]

i doubt that

[ornate quiver]

deprioritized maybe sure

jni can't ever go away

[jade stone]

i feel like there's already decades of JNI code out there

you cant just break that

[dense sand]

i feel like the native keyword got so much potential, when i wrote my own jvm, i added this annotation which allowed to invoke the method as-is without having to do package shit, that was pretty cool

(yes its gpt generated lmao)

[jade stone]

i remember reading this

didn't look too deep into it tho

https://developer.android.com/training/articles/perf-jni#faster-native-calls-with-fastnative-and-criticalnative

Since Android 12, a call to a @CriticalNative native method from a compiled managed method is almost as cheap as a non-inline call in C/C++ as long as all arguments fit into registers

neat

i wonder how much heavy lifting almost is doing there

[valid jetty]

omg @hoary sluice i can make namespaces like zig

look at this 😭

use std/prelude;

struct Std @nofmt {
    @unused io *io,
    @unused libc *libc
}

struct Prelude @nofmt {
    @unused Std std
}

const prelude = Prelude{};
const std = prelude.std;

fn main() {
    prelude.std.io.println("hello, world!");
    std.io.printf("wtf {}", 39);
}

this just keeps getting worse and worse

[hoary sluice]

elle more like js

[spice token]

So do yall play games here

It says pro gaming

[timber root]

yes

[lavish frigate]

no

[ionic lake]

I play games, what games you like?

[spice token]

breaking bad tycoon

https://tenor.com/view/walt-walnterwite-walter-stare-staring-breaking-bad-gif-8185929955267525825

[ionic lake]

got me

[gaunt whale]

real

[lavish frigate]

https://vxtwitter.com/ptr_to_joel/status/1943257351055671410

Joel 🇦🇺 (@ptr_to_joel)

someone in r/java has created one of the programming languages of all time

vxTwitter / fixvx · Jul 10, 2025, 10:33 AM

[timber root]

is it becuase of miku update

[lavish frigate]

Get this Roblox garbage out of my precious programming channel!!!!!!!!!

‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️

[spice token]

yesh

[spice token]

shush

[lavish frigate]

Get this Roblox garbage out of my precious programming channel!!!!!!!!! Get this Roblox garbage out of my precious programming channel!!!!!!!!! Get this Roblox garbage out of my precious programming channel!!!!!!!!! Get this Roblox garbage out of my precious programming channel!!!!!!!!! Get this Roblox garbage out of my precious programming channel!!!!!!!!! Get this Roblox garbage out of my precious programming channel!!!!!!!!!

[spice token]

wow spammer

ban

[timber root]

new pasta just dropped

[austere idol]

ufffff

[lavish frigate]

think its really funny how every modern language now uses "let" for variable declaration

[austere idol]

except for zig

zig uses const and var

[lavish frigate]

thats why nobody uses zig

[austere idol]

you are of the same opinion on lua in general too?

[lavish frigate]

no

i just dont want to open this channel and see "tycoon" i want to open this channel and see programming nerds

[austere idol]

oh yes, r*blox uses its own strong typed fork of lua

[timber root]

what if we rename this channel to progaying next june

[lavish frigate]

in my goal of not having any deps i have now dug into win32 api and c interop and made my own tracing macros

we stay winning tho!!!

[frosty skiff]

I've done so much with JNI

I've been writing something to help with reverse engineering stuff related to JNI recently in Rust

Mostly to fuck with https://jnic.dev

[frosty skiff]

(I also made my own thing similar to this that used JNI in Rust, basically JVM -> Rust transpiler for mostly making stuff harder to analyse)

[shrewd canopy]

Obfuscation

[austere idol]

obf*sc*t*on

[frosty skiff]

I LOVE OBFUSCATION

WHAT THE FUCK IS A STABLE CFG

WHY IS THERE 5000 BRANCHES

WHAT IS GOING ON ‼️

[austere idol]

what the fuck is this

the sin against everthing human

[frosty skiff]

It's great

Idk I like obfuscation not writing it but I like dealing with it

It's fun to mess around with

since it's usually all done via dynamic analysis if it's x86 noting it's a lot harder to-do it via symbex/similar noting cryptography is used in a majority of string obfuscation & similar

[shrewd canopy]

glad the library i am reverse engineering aint obfuscated at all

[frosty skiff]

I LOVE REVERSE ENGINEERING RANDOM OBFUSCATED MC CHEATS

what is even going on ‼️

[austere idol]

OwOwOw
meowemow meow
imhackerlolquestionmark

[frosty skiff]

owowowo.py is so good

oh yeah

a lot of people seem to not know about function hooking because a majority of the time their shitty antidebug is usually touchable via just hooking ntqsi lol

[hoary sluice]

@valid jetty @placid cape advantage 360 next??

[crimson sparrow]

Have you seen movfuscator? https://github.com/xoreaxeaxeax/movfuscator

[frosty skiff]

like years ago yea lol

[supple whale]

and what phone do you have? yes.

[ornate quiver]

this isn't the most interesting this person has done
he figured out a Ring -2 privilege escalation exploit

[hoary sluice]

yes thats the whole point

[crude star]

ummm technically he just used someone else's paper

[spark tiger]

[ornate quiver]

wait what

[crude star]

bottom of readme

[native spruce]

https://x.com/samhenrigold/status/1773118887791313114?s=46 @woven mesa

sam henri gold (@samhenrigold)

@ChristianSelig @pwign shhh nobody has to know
Image(_internalSystemName: "recap")
Image(_internalSystemName: "hand.side.pinch")

X · Mar 27, 2024, 10:44 PM

[jade stone]

there's also a video about it on youtube

[crimson sparrow]

Yeah, I assume that’s where most people have heard of it from https://youtu.be/HlUe0TUHOIc

Realizing it was 9 years ago 😭

[jade stone]

i've seen that one before, but it's not the one i'm thinking of

[woven mesa]

omg

[lavish frigate]

Crazy

https://x.com/forloopcodes/status/1943591524203200661?s=46&t=4l2ZQDMG6L-NMRnMGjD6LA

forloop (@forloopcodes)

my university is teaching prompt engineering instead of cuda or assembly

is this a sign to drop out?

X · Jul 11, 2025, 8:41 AM

[spark tiger]

clean ur url

[lavish frigate]

nop

[spark tiger]

https://tenor.com/view/soccer-rabbids-kicking-gif-4288155671504938034

[tired vigil]

Eww

[austere idol]

unreadable

[lavish frigate]

does converting math expressions into postfix make sense in a language? i found it easier than making an ast

[fleet cedar]

Sure, a lot of bytecodes do that

[lavish frigate]

cool, tbh i already implemented it before asking myself that question

[spark tiger]

who that

[lavish frigate]

wtf is bro doing

[frosty skiff]

I'm writing an obfuscator for nix

[shrewd canopy]

Why does n*x needs an obfuscator

[frosty skiff]

It doesn't

It really doesn't

[crude star]

its already obfuscated

[frosty skiff]

it's already terrible why not make it worse

❤️

[crude star]

yanderedev's successor

[placid cape]

lmao

[frosty skiff]

origianl

[ornate quiver]

this is like as bad as yanderesim

what is bro doing

[native spruce]

them showing off private apis is crazy

[frosty obsidian]

makes pretty good videos trying out different programming/game dev concepts

https://youtu.be/yyJ-hdISgnw

[ornate quiver]

we need this but built in to compose

its 2025 and theres still no conclusive way to figure out recompositions

[jade stone]

just send me the nix and have me us it in my dotfiles

same thing

[frosty skiff]

im making this worse btw

I want to find a way to get around nix repl and I have a few ideas

although they're all complex

[jade stone]

impossible

[lavish cloud]

the worst possible way to do i18n on switch for sure

[lavish frigate]

youtube has been pushing WAYYY too much logical redstone so i tried my hands at it.... 8 bit binary addition without any help... took me a couple hours 😭 (only looked up the real life circuit for a full binary adder)

[ivory heath]

Bro just learned game maker give him some time

HAI MAC OS

[lavish frigate]

😭

[woven mesa]

this is literally what made me write one

[lavish frigate]

he constantly goes around saying he has 20 years of experience at blizzard and amazon games and also said he hacked into nuclear power plants for the government

its crazy

[lavish frigate]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jGrBXrftDg

the glorious giant ass commit with the "add a ton of new stuff" title

[sly violet]

who is @vale geode

[paper scroll]

💀

i fear i do that

sometimes i commit but not push when i add something but i usually forget to

[lavish frigate]

yea thats what happened here 😭

[hollow locust]

is there a known alternative to old TextElement? the one that aside from being a component also had Sizes and Colors nested objects

[lavish frigate]

using the win32 api always makes me want to explode

[frosty skiff]

I am implementing IR for Nix

[lavish frigate]

java dev was here...
https://vxtwitter.com/yutongwu111140/status/1943615182061642058

Keruis (@yutongwu111140)

clean and readablecode

vxTwitter / fixvx · Jul 11, 2025, 10:15 AM

[shrewd canopy]

At least its not javascript tho

[crude star]

all of this is valid javascript

[lavish frigate]

i think its c++ because the tweet author primarily does c++

[winged mantle]

not possible

new creates pointer which uses ->

[ivory heath]

you owe me. i got muted for that

[winged mantle]

guh wait you're obviously kidding

it would obviously use :: too

[spark tiger]

i just got u in my tl

[frosty skiff]

yep follow me

[spark tiger]

ok bet

[lavish cloud]

have you considered just using renderdoc

[runic sundial]

shit don't work in a compatibility context

[lavish cloud]

how so

[runic sundial]

it ONLY works in a MODERN CORE CONTEXT

neconectar

and if i were in a modern context

i would be using bindless textures

BUT GUESS WHAT !!

IT CRASHES WHEN YOU DO THAT TOO

[lavish cloud]

rip

[runic sundial]

necowaaa

Shit fucking sucks

Only works if you follow their special rules

apitrace is goated thoe

[lavish cloud]

meanwhile I gotta learn aarch64 binary because keystone is gpl

[runic sundial]

works with everything

Been working on my own shaders mod on 1.7.10

[lavish cloud]

bro why are you even on 1.7.10 smh nobody plays that shit anymore

[runic sundial]

MFPV

[lavish cloud]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1288552058214944982/1356328189374365946/brandbird.gif

[lavish frigate]

1.7.10 is peak

i will not take this hate

[runic sundial]

minefire

[lavish frigate]

1.7.10 is the version i have the most hours on i think

maybe a close second behind 1.8

[runic sundial]

Been working on a modpack for 1.7.10 for years now

[lavish frigate]

thats the version i grew up on that has all the mods

[runic sundial]

No point moving tbh

[crude star]

ok but in the big 25

[lavish frigate]

you still have big modpacks that are on 1.7.10

if you search for recommended modpacks rn people will recommend you modpacks on 1.7.10

[runic sundial]

NecoArc

[lavish frigate]

just this week i was recommended ftb infinity evolved which is in fact on 1.7.10

[crude star]

im gonna use log4shell on you

[runic sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/goofy-cat-gif-27287649

[crude star]

who is that

[lavish frigate]

u cant i exclusively play on minecraft bedrock now

[runic sundial]

What if we deleted your downloads folder?

what then

NecoarcGangdam

[crude star]

there's nothing important in my downloads folder

[runic sundial]

ok

then delete it

for me

[crude star]

i do that often

[runic sundial]

next delete app data

[crude star]

nop

[runic sundial]

now we know what you fear

[frosty skiff]

jdwp is so dumb

I remember a minecraft cheat using it

to make it seem like you didn't have to download the client lol

[runic sundial]

????

[frosty skiff]

idk it's implementation isn't amazing and if I'm being honest I've only seen it be used maliciously or in other dumb ways

[runic sundial]

https://docs.oracle.com/javase/8/docs/technotes/guides/jpda/jdwp-spec.html

vro

it's literally like

the thing that Java debuggers use

[frosty skiff]

I know

[runic sundial]

what's wrong with the implementation then?

neconectar

99% of the time this is just used for generic java debugging, then the 0.nothing% for cheat clients and the like

[frosty skiff]

I mean, I mostly just dislike how it's extremely coupled to hotspot because it means it's implementation is weirder on other VMs (I've personally had issues with such), same with the fact that by default it's security model sucks

Also, iirc JDWP still has synchronization issues too

[runic sundial]

I only test against Temurin

[frosty skiff]

Same with the protocol being ass

[runic sundial]

protocol works in the background, i only do the check to see if the intellij debugger is connected

NecoArc

[frosty skiff]

it's been a while so I'm hoping they're fixed but I had issues with GraalVM/OpenJ9

[runic sundial]

so like

what

[frosty skiff]

I mean, for most people what I said wouldn't matter anyways since they're just debugging like the MC client or smth else locally lol, but idk I just think for how long it's existed it could've definitely been improved

[runic sundial]

i don't care about GraalVM/OpenJ9

No point in them. At all.

[frosty skiff]

idk graalvm is pretty cool and provides a lot of stuff most other VMs don't

[runic sundial]

Cool in concept, but in practice it's compat hell

And up until pretty recently, you needed the enterprise version to get any perf gains

Last I measured it, didn't provide tangible gains for me

At this point if I need more performance I can just write Zig and load the native, be that via JNI or Panama

[frosty skiff]

I mean, the Graal compiler is still in CE, same with IGV which is pretty nice, and in terms of diagnostic data & similar Graal does give the most I've seen with any VM, I think the issue with Graal is that a lot people exaggerate it's performance impact when it really isn't that big

[runic sundial]

What diagnostic data in particular?

[frosty skiff]

Mostly related to the Graal compiler

I know they give a lot of information related to its IR

[runic sundial]

fair enough

[frosty skiff]

I do a lot of stuff regarding optimisation and having more data is always nicer, a lot of different VMs don't provide such so Graal doing so is great

[runic sundial]

I have my JProfiler licence and that gets me plenty far

[frosty skiff]

I just write whatever I need using jvmti 99% of the time nowadays

I don't rlly use jprofiler as much as I used to but I still think it's nice to have

[runic sundial]

At the end of the day most of my code ends up being GPU limited anyway

[frosty skiff]

rendering stuff?

[runic sundial]

Yop

[frosty skiff]

dip

rip*

[runic sundial]

Few months back wrote a mod to add Tracy support with GPU profiling for 1.7.10

[frosty skiff]

I do a lot related to transpilation/re with the JVM rlly

I've been getting into rendering stuff a bit

not in the JVM though I've been working on my own compositor for Wayland

[runic sundial]

unpossible

[frosty skiff]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/635625889249624095/1351179206280609913/5OvD05T.gif

[runic sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/developer-we-have-a-bug-gif-9159002844106963379

[frosty skiff]

https://tenor.com/view/minecraft-minecraft-minecart-explosion-funny-random-gif-27309450

[torn thunder]

self-destruction mechanism

[jade stone]

@nimble bone

[frosty skiff]

I am working on a transpiler for Nix

[pseudo sierra]

I kinda wanna dm them like yo I'll have a look and make it work for 5k

[lusty wagon]

The fuck you mean 50 to 60 thousand lines

[lavish frigate]

its ai so 59k lines of comments

[lusty wagon]

Oh right

[valid jetty]

i think elle can have japanese fields in structs 😭😭

i haven’t tested it but the idea just popped up in my head and i think it’ll work

[frosty skiff]

60k lines of slop

[valid jetty]

LMAOOOOO

THAT IS COMPLETELY UNINTENTIONAL

[tired vigil]

does it also support unicode escape sequences like js does?

[lavish frigate]

Horrible

[shrewd canopy]

TIL javascript supports this

[valid jetty]

WHY

[valid jetty]

rust documentation is so deep..

[valid jetty]

ill just die on that hill

(not only japanese)

@hoary sluice you can write elle in russian

how do you feel about that

fn is_cute(VencordMember hiii) {
    match hiii {
        VencordMember::PaiPaiPaiPaiPai
         | VencordMember::Llsc12
         | VencordMember::Vendicated => true
        VencordMember::Bendicated => false
    }
}

this is an exhaustive match, there are only 4 vencord members overall

you, llsc, vee, and evil vee

[crude star]

how do you "accidentally" add unicode support

[spark tiger]

who is evil vee

[valid jetty]

well, it turns out rust's char::is_alphabetic includes unicode alphabets

and then i just have to properly encode the symbols in the qbe file where necessary and it just works

lol

[winged mantle]

ok i've been programming for nearly 10 years

i just discovered how casting integers to a smaller type works...

i don't think i've ever done it in a case where it changes the value

[valid jetty]

as in, bit masking?

if you cast a u64 to a u32 you get the lower 32 bits (or x & 1 << 32)

[jade stone]

I scored 10/28 on https://jsdate.wtf and all I got was this lousy text to share on social media.

[winged mantle]

i always assumed high level languages would be more intuitive and doing e.g. (uint8) 256 would yield 255 😭 idk why

that would have to compicate the machine code for all casts to smaller types

[valid jetty]

[winged mantle]

i was planning to implement a programming lang for fun

and if i didn't realise this i would make it work like that

[valid jetty]

well

you wouldnt because the intermediate representation would do it for you

but yes

[winged mantle]

wdym

i wouldn't use il

i'd just make an interpreter

without jit

oh wait

ig i could also use language's cast

uint8_t cast_uint16_to_uint8(uint16_t value) {
    if (value > 255)
        return 255;
    
    return (uint8_t) value;
}

so good

[valid jetty]

I scored 19/28 on https://jsdate.wtf and all I got was this lousy text to share on social media.

im laughing so hard

[supple whale]

we scored 15 with 3 of us doing itXD

alcohol was involved in decision-making

[fleet cedar]

I got 10/28

[valid jetty]

i think i got lucky

[lavish frigate]

I scored 5/28 on https://jsdate.wtf and all I got was this lousy text to share on social media.

I guess I have too much common sense

[tired vigil]

I scored 16/28 on https://jsdate.wtf and all I got was this lousy text to share on social media.

I guessed most of the questions 😭

[magic shale]

I scored 11/28 on https://jsdate.wtf and all I got was this lousy text to share on social media.

i hated dates before and now i hate them more

i have to know what the new Date() implementation looks like

[shrewd canopy]

datetime.datetime my beloved

[hoary sluice]

its wrong

u need to append "at" to [-2] of the print function name

[valid jetty]

that sentence makes 0 sense

[hoary sluice]

its pechatat'

not pechat'

[valid jetty]

idk russian i used google translate

:3

[ruby wave]

Hello, do you know where I can find Vencord configs?

[shrewd canopy]

Good that i can speak russian natively

[valid jetty]

language no.3

i did german too

@royal nymph love?

god german is so long 😪

[crimson sparrow]

I scored 13/28 on https://jsdate.wtf and all I got was this lousy text to share on social media.

[valid jetty]

and lastly, australian

[crimson sparrow]

How does this work?

[valid jetty]

the upside down alphabet is still a unicode alphabet

just like cyrillic or japanese

[fleet cedar]

No it's just scattered symbols from all over the table

[valid jetty]

i guess i got lucky that all of them are considered "alphabetic" by the unicode standard

then

omg do i allow emojis

nvm theres no simple way

[crude star]

type before field 💔

[glacial mirage]

do you say "this is my dog max" or "this is max (he's a dog)"

[crude star]

max is a dog

worst argument I've ever seen

[glacial mirage]

thank u

[valid jetty]

my terminal is a bit broken but it works

[fleet cedar]

I say "this is Max", that he's a dog can be inferred from the fact that he's a dog

[valid jetty]

"Max is in a state of existence" sounds funny

[fleet cedar]

Aren't we all

[crude star]

im not

[winged mantle]

me neither

[native spruce]

maybe make an extension

[crude star]

@young flicker is not decodable

[woven mesa]

do u want some help

i can help

[valid jetty]

idk who would ever want and/or need this but its here i guess

[woven mesa]

why the fuck would i make an app with flutter

that shit is horror

elle!

[frosty obsidian]

it is actually decent for cross platform

[woven mesa]

i think i would rather not

[frosty obsidian]

you just have to learn dart

[woven mesa]

i have dealt with flutter before and i do not like it

i have written dart

[frosty obsidian]

i can also tell when an app is flutter just by using it

[woven mesa]

wait im in the nerd channel

how did i end up here

i might be going insane

[frosty obsidian]

someone pinged you

[woven mesa]

oh

no one pinged me here i think

i was pinged in regulars

im going insane

[frosty obsidian]

@woven mesa

[woven mesa]

that was 2 hours ago

[frosty obsidian]

the channels are also next to eachother

[woven mesa]

my chcannel list keeps them apart

guess im insane

[frosty obsidian]

idk then

[woven mesa]

yea

sidelo

i need an ipod ipa

[frosty obsidian]

subconsciously started talking about a programming thing in a programming channel

[woven mesa]

whats my youtube byundle id

com.llsc12.youtube

@frosty obsidian do u love my software rasteriser

[frosty obsidian]

where is 4k hdr raytracing

[woven mesa]

idk man its a single cpu core

[valid jetty]

i wrote a spinning cube this is basically the same thing right

[woven mesa]

omg

twinning

[valid jetty]

:3

how much code is yours

the cube is only this

use std/prelude;
use std/raylib;

enum Screen {
    WIDTH = 800,
    HEIGHT = 600
}

fn main() {
    rl::init_window(Screen::WIDTH, Screen::HEIGHT, "Spinning Cube");
    defer rl::close_window();

    camera := Camera3D {
        position = Vector3::from(4.0),
        target = Vector3::zero(),
        up = Vector3::xyz(0, 1, 0),
        fovy = 45,
        projection = CameraProjection::CAMERA_PERSPECTIVE,
    };

    rl::set_target_fps(60);

    while !rl::window_should_close() {
        rl::update_camera(#cast(Camera *, &camera), CameraMode::CAMERA_ORBITAL);

        rl::begin_drawing();
            rl::clear_background(#cast(Color, &0xFF181818));

            rl::begin_mode_3d(camera);
                rl::draw_cube_v(Vector3::zero(), Vector3::from(2.0), #cast(Color, &0xFFC98FFC));
                rl::draw_cube_wires_v(Vector3::zero(), Vector3::from(2.0), #cast(Color, &0xFF1A1A1A));
            rl::end_mode_3d();
        rl::end_drawing();
    }
}

the

the raylib,,

[woven mesa]

i didnt use raylib for the rendering

[valid jetty]

wait whatttt

[woven mesa]

i allocated a block of memory to write my pixel data to

[valid jetty]

wait is the fps counter from sdl then

or what

[woven mesa]

i literally like

[valid jetty]

oh i see

[woven mesa]

wrote a 3d renderer

[valid jetty]

[woven mesa]

i use raylib for windowing and drawing my framebuffer to a Texture2D to show on screen

and also mouse capture and other inputs

@valid jetty

rate 🥺

[valid jetty]

looks so good

what is it written in

C++?

[woven mesa]

swift,,

can also build to linux

but i set up this proj with xcodeproj instead of standard swift package bc i wanted to have the ability to build into an app bundle

[valid jetty]

swift doesnt sound like it should be fast but its arc lmao

[woven mesa]

swift is fast

it runs on iphone sep

also write a kernel or firmware with embedded swift

idk how to use the new swift memory stuff thats for avoiding the unsafe pointer stuff

so i still use unsafe raw mutable pointers

[winged mantle]

I remember ignoring warning that I was modifying const pointer in c

c const pointers are based because they're not actually const

[woven mesa]

swift encourages you to avoid using pointers outside a special closure they give you so they can ensure you dont use after free

and also guarantee the lifetime too ofc

[valid jetty]

i hate languages that treat you like a baby

[woven mesa]

swift isnt treating you like a baby

bc thats just one of the methods for accessing raw memory

you can also just get the pointer iirc

theres no baby treatment in swift when you’re doing c interop for example

[valid jetty]

ok fair but thats because a lot of swift depends on objc which depends on C

[woven mesa]

no i mean like passing pointers and receiving data from c interfaces means you manage memory lifetime manually

objc interop in swift is incredibly decent

c interop is very unshielded

calling c from a binary at runtime is scary

[brisk bane]

Ayame Stats

Bot Started

<t:1749550809:R>

CPU Usage

1.5%

Memory Usage

1.4 MB

Swift Version

Swift 5.10

Jul 12, 2025, 10:27 PM

[woven mesa]

[brisk bane]

gbp to usd

$1.32

Took 0.089

[woven mesa]

true

[spark tiger]

this guy is so annoying https://x.com/kai_fall/status/1943674349099078110

Kai Fall (@kai_fall)

which one is more ergonomic?

X · Jul 11, 2025, 2:10 PM

[jade stone]

i dont know rust, but this looks like a bad to do it in rust

[spark tiger]

they just intentionally make rust look worse than what it actually is

[jade stone]

yeah

thats what i thought

i dont like rust that much

but i dont like go either

[spark tiger]

one time they benchmarked the same program in go and rust in… debug configuration

[jade stone]

also i could be wrong here, but dont you not need clone because an i32 is trivialy copyable

[spark tiger]

and when was pointed out, was just “well i just used whatever the default build option is”

[spark tiger]

yeah

[lucid trail]

like none of these type annotations are necessary

[spark tiger]

yeah

[austere idol]

so, show the right way of doing that

thats how it looks like in c

[valid jetty]

(1..5).map(|x| x * x).sum()

thank you and out

or if you dont wanna cheat like i did

let vec = vec![1, 2, 3, 4, 5];
let mut sum = 0;
for x in vec {
    sum += x * x;
}
println!("sum = {sum}");

either way its not as bad as that person is making it out to be

(for the record these examples above are RUST not elle :'))

[ionic lake]

elle code

[winged mantle]

lol

??

[winged mantle]

even i worked this out

rust basics

😭

ok in fairness wat

it's in a vector so it must have a type

why do i need to cast it to the same type it already is

but they didn't use pow in go so its unfair lol

???

somebody explain

[valid jetty]

no

in rust if you don’t specify a type rust makes it an unrepresentable internal type called {integer} which automatically converts to whichever integer you need

so you’re not casting it to the same type, you’re specifying that the generic {integer} is specifically i32

if you hover over a vec without a type specified you can see it says Vec<{integer}>

rust can multiply together 2 {integer}s because it constant folds them anyway

i’m pretty sure that internal type is specifically for constexpr integer literals

it just so happens that when you wanna print the {integer} it defaults to i32 but that’s not its type

the added benefit of doing it like this is that if you do x * 2, the 2’s {integer} type absorbs to whatever type x is

[fleet cedar]

If the {integer} is un-inferred it defaults to i32, but calling a method on it is an error

Probably mostly because you might be looking for a trait function and that could be dangerous if it guesses wrong

[valid jetty]

i’m assuming that’s a semantic backwards compatibility with C

a plain integer literal in C is an int, so you would assume equivalent behavior coming to rust

though rust doesn’t have 39L or 420ULL lmao

[fleet cedar]

No, but rust has 98u64

[valid jetty]

yeah true

[winged mantle]

no it doesn't

it says Vec<i32>

and it says item is i32

i don't understand... lsp says it's Vec<i32> but the error doesn't go away unless you explicitly type it

let vec: Vec<i32> fixes it

so does having any of the variables inside it explicitly an i32 (somehow the rest implicitly become i32)

[valid jetty]

integer literals in rust are not i32, they can take the shape/absorb the type around them

[valid jetty]

^^^

[valid jetty]

if your vec has an explicit i32 then the other integer literals absorb the i32 and also become i32

[winged mantle]

the lsp is wrong...

[valid jetty]

that’s just your lsp being bad then

[fleet cedar]

RA isn't always accurate with the fine details

[valid jetty]

you could write vec[1i32, 2, 3, 4, 5] and the error would go away

[winged mantle]

i can't tell if this is genius or stupid

[valid jetty]

if you wrote 1u64 the vec would be Vec<u64> because the other int literals also absorb into u64

[winged mantle]

but it's certainly something that i haven't seen in other languages

[valid jetty]

it is genius, elle has the same thing albeit it doesn’t have an unrepresentable internal type

just if you write an integer literal it infers from context what type it is

think about it, if int literals were always i32 then if you wanted to write a u32 or anything bigger you would get undefined behavior or an error

being able to infer what type it is is a benefit not a downside

[winged mantle]

but... how does it work