🪅-progaming

[shrewd canopy]

I think i wouldnt help a selfbotter on vencord server

[upper oak]

i don't use sb

[spark tiger]

u don’t need to get ur token to fetch channel

what’s ur end goal

[upper oak]

get my tk easily on any of my alt or main

to connect easily

[spark tiger]

connect to what bruh

[winged mantle]

https://github.com/tc39/proposal-pipeline-operator

[tired vigil]

It's still stage 2 after 10 years

Gta 6 will be released before js pipeline operator

[lavish frigate]

we need LINQ queries in js

make it as bloated as c# please

🙏

[valid jetty]

you quite literally have this

or well

at least linq lazy iterator adaptor stuff

like .Select .Filter .Aggregate have their js .map .filter .reduce equivalents

[lavish frigate]

i specifically said LINQ queries cuz i want the language to have more useless keywords

with select and where and everything

[tired vigil]

I think they were trying to make c# more approachable to non developers by copying sql syntax

[supple whale]

proper in place threading ❌
more useless syntax sugar ✅

[winged mantle]

i don't really like it lol it belongs in functional languages

[supple whale]

well js is kinda functional

at least in the way u can write it

[tired vigil]

^^

[supple whale]

rather than the way it structured

becauuse "um akshtually" everything in JS is an object without exception, but u can work it with it as a strictly functional lang

still, i fucking despise this sugar shit

the ?. operator was peak, evverything else is useless tbfd

maybe a := operator from GO would be good

[tired vigil]

What does it do

[supple whale]

BUT I JUST WANT THREADING REEEEE

[supple whale]

const error, res := await fetch(url)
if (error != null) return 'nope'

[tired vigil]

Ohh there's literally another proposal for that

for js

[supple whale]

yep

THREADING PLEASE

I WANT

SO BADLY

INLINE THREADING

FOR DECADES

[tired vigil]

Well at least you can do Promise.try() now so u never have to use try/catch blocks again

At the cost of worse performance and everything being async

[crude star]

i dont think js will ever be threaded

[supple whale]

at that point i can just write my own ulitity function for it

[lavish frigate]

bringing back my rust result/option port to ts

[crude star]

workers exist anyway

[supple whale]

it is threaded

and its easy to introduce ur own threading impls

but its about inline threading

like what kotlin has

[crude star]

write for(;;); in discords console

and watch everything freeze

[supple whale]

because as of now threading is piss, but you NEED a 2nd file to run the threaded code on, which sux

[supple whale]

yes, and so will every other language, when u write a sync loop in the main thread

[crude star]

go wouldn't freeze

workers aren't quite threads

[supple whale]

they are

because the BARE MINIMUM for js threading as of now is:

import { expose } from 'abslink'

export default expose({
  add: (a: number, b: number) => a + b
})

and

import { wrap } from 'comlink'
import worker from './exposed.ts?worker'

const threaded = wrap(worker)

const res = await threaded.add(1, 3) // 4

thats currently the bare minimum boilerplate

but its stilll... a loooot

and requires 2 files

my dream is inlining this

i rly just want

const threaded = thread({
  add: (a: number, b: number) => a + b
})

const res = await Promise.all([threaded.add(1, 3), threaded.add(1, 3)])

[supple whale]

yeah, but go is black magic

and is pretty much alone in that category

well it really just does inline threading, like what i described

but it splits the code into threaded chunks automagically

[crude star]

javascript workers have entirely different contexts

it's a whole separate process

can't share objects

only specific array buffers

if you want to be pedantic though there's no real distinction between threads and processes besides namespacing at the kernel level

to create either you just fork vfork clone clone3

[supple whale]

they can

objects are serializable

[crude star]

atp the threads could be in completely different computers 😭

[supple whale]

yes!

well currently they are the same process

different contexts

[supple whale]

i actually support this

abslink lets you simply create async messages over abstract message channels

so you can exchange messages via http or ws

and implement IPC that way

its why i built that lib unironically!

[crude star]

thatd be cool

erlangcoded

but guess what erlang calls their threads

[supple whale]

its just flat out doable

liek the lib is alr there

xD

you just need SSE and fetch minimum

or preferably WS if u want less boilerplate

[lavish frigate]

i know we have vercel nerds here so can one of you idiots explain to me what fluid compute is and what all these buzzwords in here are that are complained about https://vxtwitter.com/dioxuslabs/status/1937214107385757737

Dioxus 🧬 (@dioxuslabs)

vercel's Fluid Compute makes me irrationally upset

push javascript to the backend, make it single threaded, and then make it single-process(!)
it’s serverless! no std::fs , no std::socket, no AOT compiled code
the ecosystem needs to add “serverless runtime support” 🥴
oh no, pages load slow, let’s stream snippets of

vxTwitter / fixvx · Jun 23, 2025, 6:20 PM

ugh

full tweet

[tired vigil]

How does that work
Idk anything about this but like how does it map object prototypes to the correct classes? How does it serialize internal properties?

[crude star]

functions can't be serialized by structuredClone so the answer is just no

unless you do your own thing

[supple whale]

yes functions cant be

object cvan

[tired vigil]

interesting

[supple whale]

objects sir

Object

not class

[crude star]

errmmm classes are objects? 🤓

[supple whale]

yes

but they arent Objects

[crude star]

ok true

[ivory heath]

JS is a single threaded language. It is only concurrent for stuff the runtime handles in the background generally IO related. Similar to python with the GIL

[ivory heath]

This will never happen because JS isnt a multi threaded language and never will be multi.

[ivory heath]

the only black magic that GO! does is green threads not hardware threads which languages like java and C# use.

GO! uses goroutines to its advantage for garbage collection but thats an entirely different matter

[ivory heath]

Its more than that as i said. It uses green threads instead of hardware threads.
languages like c++ and rust let you do the same thing as you describe and even have their own async packages

[shrewd canopy]

Python can be multithreaded and will be, there is accepted PEP to optionally kill gil

[shrewd canopy]

"GO!"

[lavish frigate]

i personally think we should push for multi-threaded js so i can run my vencord crypto miner more efficiently

[ivory heath]

Its beta and unstable as of rn. All of the packages are designed around the idea of python being single threadded and the runtime itself isnt thread safe because of it

[shrewd canopy]

Of course

Thats why i am saying optionally kill gil

[ivory heath]

youre trying to be right by a technicality

[shrewd canopy]

Yeah and

[ivory heath]

I personally think the average JS developers head would explode at the idea of a mutex

[lavish frigate]

we will teach them

!!

"just wrap stuff in a mutex and then that mutex in an arc and your problems with go away !!!"

[ivory heath]

.....

i wonder if c++ has equivalents like that never really checked

i mean the fucking atomic pointers

[lavish frigate]

hm

[ivory heath]

arc is just a std::shared_ptr in c++

[lavish frigate]

apparently it has something similar

with std::atomic

[lavish frigate]

ya std::atomicstd::shared_ptr>

[ivory heath]

no Mutex<T> tho

[lavish frigate]

no way https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/thread/mutex.html

[ivory heath]

you have to just

std::lock_guard<std::mutex> lock(mtx);

at the begining of your function call or lock it manually

which all that does is abuse local lifetimes to call a deconstructor to automatically free the lock once the scope is left

[lavish frigate]

😭

[viral prairie]

wouldnt it be cool to add the "hint links" thing from qutebrowser to the electron discord app jst saying btw-

[ornate quiver]

be the change you want to see

[woven mesa]

i should learn how to use swift distributed actors

[supple whale]

oh boi is that wrong, yeah it's single threaded but I/o stuff isn't multi threaded like you think, it's just bindings to native code which is multi threaded, because js has no threaded language functions

[supple whale]

yeah not like go, but it could let users create in place threading like c++ or kotlin

[ivory heath]

I know.

[supple whale]

yes, but as a developer you could really give less of a fuck tho, I just want multi core processing and it does that

so it really doesn't matter for the end developer

[ivory heath]

wtf do you mean. There is a massive difference

[supple whale]

to a system dev, or a c dev maybe

not to a js dev

end goal: more cpu power

how they do it, doesnt matter

it gets done

[ivory heath]

Ex,
Green threads cannot have thread affinity. They can however have significantly lower ram usage

Green threads are limited by the runtimes context switching and in the case of golang is whenever the fuck it feels like. Hardware threads are treated fairly and evenly by the scheduler.

Maybe as a JS developer it does not matter because in the end JS is shit and you’re not gonna get good performance

[supple whale]

that just means you cant write good js, cope

[ivory heath]

lol

[shrewd canopy]

Nah

I also agree that js/ts is bad language

I wish apps were actually native

Like were made w c++/rust/<insert any compiled language>

[ivory heath]

I dislike them incredibly. I think majority of websites could just be mark down + css

[shrewd canopy]

Same

[ivory heath]

The only time JS can compete with any compiled language, even GO! Is in massive for loops. Other than that the over head of JS itself massively slows own execution and garbage collection is a pain

In multiple larger “energy efficiency” or runtime oriented benchmarks JS is consistently using 4-16 times a native c/c++ or “muh rust”

• shitty JS devs that are ever plenty

[winged mantle]

average c++ code

std::monotype<std::monovalue<std::chrono::clock<std::infinity>>>

[lavish frigate]

It’s not a bad language if you use it what it was meant to do

Especially now with how many features it does actually have, very viable to just use vanilla js for simple websites

But then framework devs come crashing through the wall with 900 deps for their blog

(Framework still good for complicated sites, like SPA, etc.)

[supple whale]

oh yeah no, i agree, most websites dont need to be webapps, but they still do it, which is why i always make the clear distiction between websites and webapps, and the same applies to browsers, firefox is great for websites! aka what you call markdown + css, but the moment u try running webapps on it, its useless, chrome is the other way around

[supple whale]

cool, thats an opinion for sure

[ivory heath]

What?

[winged mantle]

i love ts/js

[ivory heath]

Why are you acting like spider monkey is horrible?

[supple whale]

actually, from experience, for loops is where native MASSIVELY outperforms js, almost always, and the most significant uplifts i always saw in JS, was from moving loops to native

[supple whale]

its not

its utter fucking awful dogshit

[ivory heath]

mf Used compiler opts thank the lord

[supple whale]

sm is so bad when it comes to any form of gc or large memory operations its fucking unfunny

sm's gc will freeze the main thread for multiple seconds at a time

its insanely bad

[supple whale]

but yeah, this is by far the biggest problem in JS

the devs are fucking incompetent and cant write good code

i wrote MANY js based libs which easily outperformed native equivalents, because of how incompetent many devs are

[winged mantle]

honestly i don't think writing good code is possible in any language

[supple whale]

and you can gain SO MUCH performance in JS by just swapping some libraries at compile time, to your own custom ones which dont do stupid shit

[winged mantle]

the best representation of what a program should do is english
vibe coding is the way forward

[supple whale]

i think the best example of this very thing is the process polyfill for web, which uses a SINGLE set timeout, because the author wants backwards compatibility back to edge 1, and some weird smart TVs which can only have 1 set timeout active at once????

legit just replacing that with queueMicrotask reduces the code for that module from 400LOC to 1LOC and increases perf x10000

AND PEOPLE USE THAT LIB EVERY DAY

its unfunny how utterly incompetent many JS devs are

[supple whale]

waIt no i think it was x40000?

because IIRC set timeout minimum time is 4ms, and queuemicrotask can be as little as 1μs

[winged mantle]

1usd

[ivory heath]

Trueeeeeee

Be right back gonna write JS SIMD

[supple whale]

there

[supple whale]

dont say SIMD around me i get PTSD because of WASM

SIMD in wasm is so painful

i mean SIMD overall is painful

[crude star]

skill issue

[supple whale]

well yeah, thats syntethic benchmarks, which rarely represent real-world applications tho, in JS 90% of the heavy lifting is done by native api's anyways, so many of those benchmarks just opt to re-write those APIs in JS, poorly at that, instead of using what the env provides, because they know the perf will be identical, because then the only thing else to benchmark is just sugar that developers write around said api's to pass the objects around to libraries etc, which has close to 0 difference, thats why JS is so good, because you still get native perf thanks to the standardised APIs written in native code, that you'll never need to give a single fuck about, they just work, while working with the flexibility of a GC'ed language

platform agnostic code is simply so much easier to work with

[supple whale]

you're not wrong!

having to compile native code to wasm, for different types of SIMD, because different CPUs support different intstruction sets twists my insides so much

then before u can even init ur library u need to check what SIMD set the given cpu supports before u can load ur lbirary

.

why dont native devs that make these libraries just handle these cases for us

instead we need to build this shit 4 times

[ivory heath]

What? WASM offers a native “vectorized execution” API

[crude star]

SSE3 has existed for 20 years you can stop checking

[supple whale]

haha... you'd be surprised what kind of hardware users run....

[crude star]

llvm and gcc both output sse3 to do floating point 😭

[supple whale]

yes, and if your CPU doesnt support SIMD, the WASM instantiate will fail

[crude star]

you literally can stop checking

[supple whale]

and i'm telling you, i have statistics for uses which cant run SIMD, and need to fall back to non-SIMD versions of my WASM builds

because people are running laptops and chromebooks with CPUs so old they dont have SIMD

[ivory heath]

They all do that’s a lie.

It’s just is it arm or x86

[supple whale]

yes a 15 year old ARM Intel cpu

👍

[ivory heath]

MF got users on pentium with MMX

[supple whale]

yes, thats what happens when you ship products people actually use

you get a big userbase which you need to support!

i know, this might be shocking to you

oh also IIRC smart tv's running androidTV often fail the SIMD eval too

but that shit is just e-waste so makes sense

[crude star]

horror

[supple whale]

oh it gets so much worse

did you know that 99% of all androidTVs run in 32 bit?

yes they have 64 bit cpus, but they run in 32 bit!

[ivory heath]

Sorry the stuff I work on requires RX 6000 / cuda 11 compliant gpus :3

[crude star]

half of windows is still 32bit

[supple whale]

did you know that some of the latest androidTV updates started deprecating 32 bit support, which 99% of all android tv's still use!

[supple whale]

which means you can simply crash all active webview by just running

const subarray = new Uint8ClampedArray([255, 0, 255, 0, 255]).subarray(1, 5)
await createImageBitmap(new ImageData(subarray, 1))

often rebooting the TV if the OS UI uses webviews?

this hasnt been fixed for 2 years now!

[supple whale]

nice, that'd cover about 20% of my userbase!

which is why i stick to JS

i write one codebase

and it works on every GPU, CPU, arch, device

[ivory heath]

> JS
> gpu
OKAY BUDDY

[supple whale]

my single codebase runs on phones, tv, pcs, macs, linux, steamdecks, vr headsets, cars

[supple whale]

yes sir, JS's canvases are GPU accelerated

[ivory heath]

Canvases LMAO

[lavish frigate]

😭

insane people only in this channel

[ivory heath]

I thought you meant something real like compute

[supple whale]

3d rendering is real compute sir

[ivory heath]

Indeed

[supple whale]

and this "js based non real comptue" as you'd call it, easly outperforms other half-competent developers like VLC

:^)

[ivory heath]

VLC kinda ass ngl

[supple whale]

yep, its also the most used video player in the world thats not windows media player, since that one comes built into the os

[ivory heath]

Only cause it’s older than mpv

And video land made it

[supple whale]

nope, only because it has a proper UI which just works, and is idiot friendly unlike mpv

#1 reason for people not using mpv is because they dont know how to install ui for it, and they dont know how to configure it

because real users are average 9-5 workers, which dont know how a computor works

[ivory heath]

MPV has a ui? Wdym

[supple whale]

they install an app and they want it to work

[supple whale]

by default it doesnt, thats exactly my point

mpv isnt targetted at normies, so normies aka most of the world, will never use it

[supple whale]

becase.

they dont want to spend an additional 3 days fixing it to get it to work with their HDR display

[ivory heath]

It has one

[supple whale]

no, thats an OSD which has 0 functionality compared to what VLC offers

which also barely works and flashes like fuck on an HDR display, since its just subtitles rendered on video without HDR metadata

which again, you need another config setting to fix, which isnt on by default for some god forsaken reason

which is why VLC is the biggest in the world, because as we both said, its codebase is dogshit, but its appealing to normies, which just want something thats user friendly

[ivory heath]

That’s a you problem unfortunately

Most people will never use a thrift besides the OSD

not like VLC has actual options either

[supple whale]

and thats why its REALLY not difficult to outperform native with JS, because just as JS devs are incompetent, so are MANY native devs

[ivory heath]

What are you gonna do? Use a Deband filter from the 90s?

[supple whale]

me and the 60 people who commented on the issue on github

👍

[ivory heath]

Hm, what about VLC having borderline unusable performance due to running out of date as shit library’s

[supple whale]

brotha what the fuck are u saying

i'm not arguing VLC is good, we both said its dogshit

but its user friendly

my exact argument is that VLCs perf is dogshit

and my "non real 3d rendering" with js, can easily outperform it

ur just arguing for the sake of arguing

not because u have an opinion to voice lmao

[ivory heath]

Oh, try and make a JS video decoder :3

[supple whale]

i did

two

[ivory heath]

SURE YOU DID BUD

How’s decoding h.264 in JS?

[supple whale]

you dont need to

you just give the h264 frame to the browser and it decodes it for you

because as i said, the beauty of the JS is the wrappers for the native apis that are standardised

which people like you ignore for the sake of "huuur duuuur i write dogshit code just to proove js is worse, rather than creating the optimal solution"

[supple whale]

and you likely mean rendering

anyways i wrote a pure js async iterator based decoder and encoder for mkv, which can easily handle speeds higher than my storage, so i guess it caps out at 8GB/s for me for data truput

and for the 2nd one, we compiled libav to WASM, and we transmux mkv into mp4 real-time to add mkv support to browsers like firefox and safari which dont support the format

[ivory heath]

The joke is I work on the stuff you’re importing from the runtime for your JS :3

[supple whale]

good for you!

that doesnt invalidate how good js is

for all i care you could work on an ass scratcher, js is still good

[ivory heath]

It’s not

WASM is better than JS

[supple whale]

LMAO

[supple whale]

i love people that proove their experience and competence in a SINGLE sentence

imma frame this, at the end of this conversation, just to proove you dont have actual real-world experience

[ivory heath]

You’re just fun to piss off

[supple whale]

because if you actually ever used WASM you'd realise its main purpose is not performance, which it cant offer at all anyways

[ivory heath]

WASM can and is fast

It’s not as fast as if the browser did have a native lib for it, but it is fast

[supple whale]

again, isolated benchmarks, and not real-world use cases

[ivory heath]

In real world use cases

I’m not talking make believe. Actual project that use it

[supple whale]

hate to break it to you, WASM still runs wrapped in JS, and to access that data, you still need JS, so you'll never be much faster anyways

and the latency and sizes are simply not worth the 0.1% perf you'll save in actual use cases

WASM is only good for porting massive libraries you dont have the time to write correctly in JS

oh whats this? wasm still uses JS memorry? to read external data you still need to serialzie and deserialzie js objects?

"wasm is faster, we ran a 1M iteration for loop inside wasm which never exited it, its an order of magnitude faster than js!" sure buddy, now read that data back to js, and you're an order of magnitude slower than js because WASM doesnt support proper serialization

anyways, go back to ur gpu land, because you've never worked with competent web apps and you're just talking out of ur ass

framing this just for the sake of it

[ivory heath]

Cool

[fleet cedar]

Wasm is faster at bulk computation, which is not a common need in websites

[ivory heath]

Yeah the problem is we can’t just make the entire website WASM

The WASM to JS overhead can make it slower but WASM is usually between 1.5 -10x faster

To say it isn’t faster is insane tho

[supple whale]

yes, in real world use cases its not faster

because as you said, real world needs to read the data from WASM

which is where WASM fails

thats also COMPLETLY ignoring how long it takes to download the wasm and compile it

and the complexity it introduces at build time

[fleet cedar]

Buses are faster than walking. Going to the bus stop, waiting for the bus, and then going from the bus stop is sometimes not faster than just walking a few hundred meters

[supple whale]

^

[ivory heath]

There are plenty of websites that are significantly faster

Due to WASM

[supple whale]

because they either write dogshit JS code, or dont use web apis for it

[ivory heath]

I hate your blanket coverage of shit instead of actually explaining

[shrewd canopy]

Figma :)

[nimble bone]

erm what the figma

[supple whale]

wasnt that a security thing more than performance thing?

[fleet cedar]

Nobody's saying js or wasm is objectively better for everything

Both have their strengths, and for most websites, js suits them better

[supple whale]

WASM is decent if you're running it on edge or a server

with shit like WASMer

but not in web

the only valid use cases for wasm on web i found so far is porting massive C/C++ libs to web in a single day instead of taking a month to re-write them, and some multi-threaded decompression algos which web doesnt support

that didnt do that well on js, because they used SIMD

[winged mantle]

what is this code style

[supple whale]

dont remember what that was, it was some giga niche file compression shit

[winged mantle]

putting semicolon on the next line

[fleet cedar]

Probably "if line starts with ( put a semi"

I've seen similar rules in lua

[supple whale]

yeah, for IIFE, if you write a no semi style js, you need a ; at the start of the IIFE

but

that shit is questionable indeed

[winged mantle]

just don't write no semi style js it's confusing doing this

[supple whale]

dont write IIFE's simply

xD

[winged mantle]

this isn't an iife though

[supple whale]

it is, but isnt?

im giga fucking confused tbf

cuz its async wrapped iife

but then the semi for the iife is on the next line???

god that is fucking unreadable

nuke it pls

[winged mantle]

I find my own code the most readable

I must be the greatest programmer

[supple whale]

facs.

[winged mantle]

[ivory heath]

The unknown is making it sound like WASM is never faster when it is. “Never in real world use” when entire web GUIs instead of native apps, emulator, web based WASM + WEBGPU projects all rely on it for acceptable performance

[supple whale]

yeah see, this is backwards thinking

just use the DOM

you have a gpu accelerated rendering pipeline right there

and u fucking use wasm

WHY

[supple whale]

aka .

[ivory heath]

Because the DOM can’t do everything?

[supple whale]

yes it can

defo more than a canvas outputted WASM bitmap

[fleet cedar]

Implementing all the rendering and interaction from scratch will be hell for accessibility

[supple whale]

that just means u cant do it

[supple whale]

and the canvas wont even have it in the first place

thats the point

so what he's using WASM for isnt perf, but saving time by not having to implement the UI himself

and instead instantly porting some existign codebase for it

[ivory heath]

There are complex shader pipeline simply impossible for the DOM that still makes sense as a web app.

Especially with the advent of chrome books and browser only devices

[supple whale]

i'm yet to find a single shader which cant run on web

especially if you use tools for porting shaders to opengl

and use webgl2 which can just flat out run any opengl shader out there

I know, because i ported ALL the mpv shaders to web this way

just to proove a point to a guy, who made a similar argument like you

xD

then i made a lib for it! https://github.com/ThaUnknown/video-deband/blob/main/src/shaders.js

this is just 1:1 the mpv deband shader ^^

[winged mantle]

i saw a ui app that was using wasm and a canvas and it was very laggy in chrome but fine in firefox

[supple whale]

and running shaders on GPU will always be faster than a single threaded WASM CPU thread which is shared with the current JS instance, so idk waht you're tryign to say here

[supple whale]

how much do you want to bet that the app had to fall back to some webgl implementation, which simply ran better because the webgpu version for chrome was just written like shit xD

[shrewd canopy]

I dont when I write too verbose documentation

[supple whale]

im actually curious, link me

[winged mantle]

https://rttv.ca/main mine craft

[ivory heath]

rust

That explains everything

[supple whale]

wasm bindgen

okay

so pretty normal so far

[shrewd canopy]

panicked at C:\Users\RTTV\.rustup\toolchains\nightly-x86_64-pc-windows-msvc\lib/rustlib/src/rust\library/core/src/num/f32.rs:1402:9: min > max, or either was NaN. min = 1.0, max = 0.0 dang

I cant even run it on mobile

[supple whale]

probs SIMD tbf

no cap

wasm is hell to work with in browser, because you need 3 build outputs

WASM2JS if WASM itself fails [GIGA SLOW], WASM, and SIMD wasm

[shrewd canopy]

Seems i can if i enable desktop mode

Ah it seems to rely on screen size lol

[ivory heath]

I’d kill myself

Idk if rust would make windows better or worse

[winged mantle]

doesn't windows already use rust

[supple whale]

they.... use webgl2 which they control inside the rust codebase

[winged mantle]

ok. whatever that means

[supple whale]

they make wasm bindings for all the web api's of webgl2, and call them inside their rust library as if rust had it

[winged mantle]

i haven;'t done much webgl and i think since i tried it there's a new thing

[supple whale]

which means each call to any of the webgl shit is calling between wasm and js

aka big boi overhead

[winged mantle]

ah chrome only thing

[supple whale]

but idk why i'd be slow in chrome

[royal nymph]

fix

[winged mantle]

ah yea webgpu

[supple whale]

i dont see any webgpu calls

[shrewd canopy]

Rotate screen and itll work

[supple whale]

only webgl2 calls

that the problem

[winged mantle]

nop i was just looking up webgpu

[supple whale]

i lied!

[lavish frigate]

😭

[supple whale]

there are webgpu calls

[royal nymph]

WHY'S THAT A THING 😭😭😭😭

[supple whale]

webgpu shit!

[winged mantle]

i was googling what webgpu is and it seems to be webgl but google chrome only

[royal nymph]

panicked at C:\Users\RTTV\.rustup\toolchains\nightly-x86_64-pc-windows-msvc\lib/rustlib/src/rust\library/core/src/num/f32.rs:1402:9:
min > max, or either was NaN. min = 1.0, max = 0.0

Stack:

Error
    at onPanic (https://rttv.ca/snippets/nbtworkbench-26507aaadea5d6ad/web/script.js:23:17)
    at imports.wbg.__wbg_onPanic_a3859b9cd1fad37e (https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench.js?version=2:1343:13)
    at https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench_bg.wasm:wasm-function[2200]:0x2a07e7
    at https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench_bg.wasm:wasm-function[2249]:0x2a5ddd
    at https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench_bg.wasm:wasm-function[3924]:0x30c0a2
    at https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench_bg.wasm:wasm-function[2843]:0x2d8e7b
    at https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench_bg.wasm:wasm-function[541]:0xcdbf9
    at https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench_bg.wasm:wasm-function[476]:0x4f76b
    at https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench_bg.wasm:wasm-function[1523]:0x25f645
    at https://rttv.ca/nbtworkbench_bg.wasm:wasm-function[4217]:0x311983

[supple whale]

its a normalized vulkan api

and its not chrome only

[lavish frigate]

why is there like no info on this thing i cant find even just like an about me to link back to the creators

[supple whale]

deno implements it too

actually firefox and safari have it too

peak!

[winged mantle]

in practice

[supple whale]

just not fully, only mostly

[winged mantle]

nightly only it seems

[supple whale]

i mean yeah, you'd never run a web app on anything else than chrome

[supple whale]

yeah

deno webgpu support is insane too, because u can write native apps or server apps which have normalized GPU access

its massive, and people sleep on it

[winged mantle]

discord feels laggier in chrome than firefox for me

[tired vigil]

incredible

panicked at C:\Users\RTTV\.cargo\registry\src\index.crates.io-1949cf8c6b5b557f\wgpu-23.0.1\src\backend\wgpu_core.rs:1790:18:
wgpu error: Validation Error

Caused by:
  In a CommandEncoder
    Command encoder is locked by a previously created render/compute pass. Before recording any new commands, the pass must be ended.

[winged mantle]

there's noticable lag spikes

and i have hardware rendering on pretty sure

[supple whale]

i'm ~40% sure its either scrolling

or animated images

* {
  will-change: scroll-position;
}

.members_c8ffbb, /* members list */
.guilds_c48ade, /* server list */
.chatContent_f75fb0, /* main chat messages container */
/* .sidebarList_c48ade, channels sidebar with animated banner */
.layerContainer_da8173, /* app sibling container for overlay elements */
.app__160d8 { /* app container */
  contain: strict !important;
}

.typingDots_b88801, .vc-typing-indicator-dots {
  contain: paint !important;
}

.avatarDecoration_c19a55, .avatarDecoration__44b0c {
  display: none !important;
}

[winged mantle]

i've never had any perf problems on discord in firefox which is pretty hefty, moreso on github 😭

[supple whale]

try this css

and tell me

[lavish frigate]

wondering how this even happened like how do you mess up calling CLAMP

[supple whale]

i wrote that after spending like 3h looking at discord's draw calls

to make sure it doesnt lag to shit XD

[winged mantle]

i think github is the only site i've had serious problems on on firefox

[ivory heath]

They don’t care, the point is be written in memory safe+++++ rust

[supple whale]

https://thaunknown.github.io/jassub/jassub/stress/index.html

this should crash ur firefox browser

xD

[supple whale]

IKRRRR

as i said 90% of use cases for WASM are wrong

[supple whale]

what you're doing is sane, because you're saving MONTHS of work not having to implement that shit yourself

but its by far not a fast solution

[winged mantle]

i think they were doing a reverse electron

[supple whale]

LMAO does ff no longer support that video format?

its legit just:\

[winged mantle]

instead of putting a website into a desktop app using a webview, they put a desktop app into a webpage using wasm

[supple whale]

wasm rust bindgen is unironically insanely good

esp when compared to the attorcities emscripten commits against humanity

but what they did is NOT a good use of it XD

[winged mantle]

it's not doing anything in chromium either

[supple whale]

hooow

[winged mantle]

do i need to use full chrome

instead of diet chrome

[ivory heath]

FF supports that fine. Dunno why it’s a issue

[supple whale]

wtf did ffmpeg change?

i muxxed this video

did some "light clipping"

so the metadata is a bit.. fucked

it worked a few years back, doesnt anymore

funny!!!!

[ivory heath]

Wdym light clipping

[supple whale]

how do i say it

ebml is made to recover from data structure.... inaccuracies

same as html u can have fucked tags

and the browser will fix it for the most part

ebml is kinda the same

and uuuh yeah i did some fucky when i converted an mkv clip to mp4 and the data is SLIGHTLY malformed

https://thaunknown.github.io/jassub/jassub/burn-in/index.html this one will work, but its nowhere as heavy

ALSO ITS LOUD WATCH OUT

[ivory heath]

Ffmpeg can do that just fine. No meta data fuckery

What did you do?

[supple whale]

clipped the video without any metadata

there's just "suddently" a video clip which skips a few minutes of contents thats nowhere to be found

the seekhead is non-existing for that clip XD

[ivory heath]

Why

It’s so easy to do right

[supple whale]

this one only peaks at like 500 bitmaps per frame, which is only like 1-2GB of data per second

the other one did 20

but it dead

[supple whale]

what can i say, im a lazy mf

and just used minimal tools for it

i didnt want to re-encode it

so i just clipped the video segment and extracted it

XDDDD

[ivory heath]

I didn’t know the ffmpeg CLI isn’t a minimal tool

[supple whale]

nah too much typing

im a lazy mf

[ivory heath]

Fair

[supple whale]

LMAO

doesnt like memory poking

who would have thought

[spark tiger]

"choosen" 💔

[supple whale]

sir i write code not text

xD

docs are my bane

[crude star]

its webvulkan

[winged mantle]

why does vulkan seem to be the future

isn't ease of use more important than perf in many cases

isn't opengl good for that

[crude star]

vulkan is horror

[lavish frigate]

because like 2 people on the entire planet interact with vulkan directly its almost always completely abstracted and most developers dont have to deal with it directly

[winged mantle]

2 people on the entire planet actually need that much perf

[lavish frigate]

like in a game engine if you see a checkbox that says "use vulkan" and clicking it instantly doubles your performance while you have to do no shit except have the poor engine developers deal with vulkan more of course you will press it

[crude star]

i get worse performance using vulkan so it must suck

[lavish frigate]

upgrade yo damn gpu its already crying

[crude star]

definitely unrelated to the fact my gpu is 12 years old

[lavish frigate]

called it

[lavish frigate]

yea and those 2 actually work with vulkan while everyone else uses the tools those 2 provide and build their shit on it

so it all works out in the end

[supple whale]

extensible, fast, free

its HELL to work with, because vulkan DOES NOT hold your hand

its the "raw dogging assembly" of gpu rendering

but its really good

when done right

[winged mantle]

i meant more in the sense it seems like it's replacing opengl which seems sad

[supple whale]

opengl is old

and it didnt hold up well

[crude star]

there are opengl -> vulkan translation layers

[supple whale]

and dx is decent, but ABSOLUTELY PROPRIETARY

[supple whale]

yeah but thats only for compatibility

not performance and features

[lavish frigate]

i think its funny that proton translates dx to vulkan and makes some games get a performance boost i think that should tell u enough how performant vulkan actually is

[supple whale]

this guy dumbed down opengl vs vulkan quite well: https://youtu.be/7cta91Y53gs?t=151

[crude star]

half of my proton games i gotta PROTON_USE_WINED3D=1 %command%

i love old gpu

[supple whale]

dude unironically

i'm so hyped for linux

its looking so and so much better thanks to proton

[shrewd canopy]

I would be never hyped for linux again since i broke my Fedora VM and no way to debug it or anything

[supple whale]

XD

skill issue

[crude star]

i can help you break your windows system instead

[supple whale]

oh im the master of that too

shit i nuked my ubuntu install so many times that i've got re-installing ubuntu down to a t

same for my windows install

man the amt of times i re-installed win7 and vista as a kid because i deleted or fucked with smth i shouldnt have

sheeesh

[runic sundial]

Im sorryh but I will have to kill you now.

Dry Cat

goodbye

[ivory heath]

It does actually usually run better.

[supple whale]

from what i've seen its hit/miss

sometimes it does, soemtimes it doesnt

also very gpu dependent

i saw intels arc gpus fucking love that shit

[ivory heath]

Because they don’t have OpenGL drivers

They run under a shitty translation layer. ZINC is better at it

[supple whale]

they do

they dont have old dx drivers

just a shitty translation layer

[ivory heath]

MESA wants to remove open gl drivers and only use translation layrws

[supple whale]

i'm all for it tbf

opengl is fucking hell and lag on anything arm based

[ivory heath]

I didn’t know DX11 was old

[supple whale]

ehhh

kinda

i mean i agree with u

lack of dx11 support is questionable

but then again, the perf it gives them by not having to support it is great

many games that have these dx11 issues u can just run in vulkan or use dxvk

and you'll regain that lost perf

like almost all unity games can just be launched with game.exe --vulkan

and x10 perf, 0 bugs XD

[ivory heath]

They don’t

They use a DX11 layer in widows ans ZINK on Linux

[ivory heath]

Idk why it didn’t reply to this

It was funny when Intel said fuck it and used DXVK

[ivory heath]

It depends on the game

But yeah

Arc itself is mid

It was over hyped as shit by LTT for having a hardware av1 encoder

LE AV1 STREAMING NOW

[supple whale]

so from owning 2 pcs, one running a b580 and one running a 2060

arc is fucking insane

[ivory heath]

It has fine price to performance

I got my 6950xt for stupidly cheap

[supple whale]

fine is a hardcore undersell, especialy outside of the americas

[ivory heath]

Oh outside the US sure

[supple whale]

ex: eastern europe, brazil

i think the only issue i had with arc....

was mihoyo games, that i need to launch via vulkan

and thats it... there's nothing else

like all games just ran no questions about it

no fuckery, no configs

and it runs damn fucking well

its nuts

[ivory heath]

It wasn’t always like that.

Launch was horrible

[supple whale]

those chromium artifacts were kidna annoying for the first half year, but nvidia suffered the same thing, so i think it was a chromium thing

[supple whale]

idk about the a series, i got the b series on launch day

and it was fucking nuts

and boi have i tried to get this card to... not work

but it just fucking works

[ivory heath]

Battle mage is it own thing

I meant a series

[supple whale]

yeah a series was dog, but that's behind us now

oh i know

one thing i miss

Nvidium mod for minecraft, cant run that...

go figure right!?

thats the only thing i REALLY miss on my arc workstation

that shit was great, 500 chunk render distance, 100fps

[ivory heath]

Too bad Intel compute is… where AMD was a decade ago

I take that back they have good ai accelerator support

But anything for generic compute

Like amd HIP is meant to be nearly 1:1 with CUDA in some aspects so it’s easy to change the target with just some define statements if you’re lucky

Intel has no such thing afaik

https://github.com/CHIP-SPV/chipStar

[supple whale]

yeah see, thats why its a consumer gaming card

not a workstation computing card

[ivory heath]

Any card is a compute card

[supple whale]

macos notarization taking hours

fuck apple!

[spark tiger]

why is it called poop https://github.com/andrewrk/poop

[solemn ravine]

Acronym for "Performance Optimizer Observation Platform"

[spark tiger]

could have swapped the words

[lavish frigate]

no fun allowed

[spark tiger]

this is a serious language

[supple whale]

mmmmm, appl,e

[ornate quiver]

btw anyone with a jellyfin setup which gpu do you use to accelerate transcoding

i hear the docs recommend Intel Arc but idk

suppose that's because of good av1 support?

[jade stone]

NVIDIA 1650

[ornate quiver]

what workloads does it handle well

[jade stone]

Idk, never had issues

There’s always a bit of latency jumping around, but that is more likely hard drive rather than transcoding

[ornate quiver]

o

[cinder egret]

integrated or something like a 1650 like sadan said

there is a 1% chance you’ll ever need anything better than integrated gpu unless you’re planning on giving 20 people access to the server….

and they will all be somehow using it at the same time

[ornate quiver]

oh okay

[cinder egret]

intel is great for transcoding because if quicksync meanwhile amd is very lackluster for the most part but if you’re going amd i still don’t think you’d need dedicated gpu

[ornate quiver]

yeah I doubt more than two people will ever use it at once

[cinder egret]

ideally you don’t want to transcode anyway but ykyk sometimes it needs to happen

[ornate quiver]

it would probably be smarter to buy a cache nvme to accelerate the nas instead

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1243981505470926869.gif?quality=lossless&name=plink&size=64

[cinder egret]

but as long as you have an igpu you should be pretty well off

also i wouldn’t recommend a cache nvme either but if you wanna buy it then it won’t really cause any harm.funds might be better spent upgrading something though

[ornate quiver]

hm alright

[cinder egret]

i don’t have personal experience with it but from all of my research, apparently it was one of those things that was a definite “yes it’s needed” to now being “no it’s useless” but i don’t have the specifics or anything on that

if you could instead spend that extra money on a better cpu you’d likely have a better time with that instead though

[ornate quiver]

oh really why is that

[cinder egret]

it's just one of those things that is nice to have but not necessary. if you will be video editing from your nas or something then you should absolutely get it, but otherwise you won't necessarily need it and money would be much better spent elsewhere. but of course you may wanna do your own research and stuff to determine if you think you would need it or not

it wouldn't really help much with basic file serving or something like plex/jellyfin but would greatly help if you intended to do intensive work through your nas for whatever reason... if you could, you should most definitely get an ssd if you haven't already, for boot drive and for all apps/docker containers. another way you would see improvement is if you do not have much storage, which if you plan to have a lot then it would be even more useless

i am not an expert though i am speaking purely from what i found from my research into building a NAS when i wanted to sooo

[cinder egret]

@ornate quiver help me

[ornate quiver]

oh okay thanks

makes sense

[cinder egret]

what i just said to you could be completely wrong in every single way possible actually @ornate quiver

[ornate quiver]

yeah you love spreading misinformation

[cinder egret]

you might have a specific use case where it is neat to have but it is far from something you would have to have so you should just do a little research and determine if it's worth but i would say put money into cpu upgrade instead and make sure that you have an SSD for boot drive + apps/containers

[ornate quiver]

5s of research says that people recommend more ram over dedicated cache drives

so i guess yeah

[ornate quiver]

yeahj im probably gonna go nvme for boot and containers

[cinder egret]

so blobcatcozy @ornate quiver

[spark tiger]

is zls (zig lsp) lowk useless or am i just used to how good rust-analyzer is

it can't even tell me i used wrong amount of arguments in a function call before i build it ffs

[ionic lake]

rust-analyzer does workspace diagnostics on startup, zls prob doesnt

[lavish frigate]

zls doesnt build all your deps every 5 seconds

:^)

[winged mantle]

copilot review useless there's no way my code is this good

at least it did spot one obvious mistake

[spark tiger]

yeah but like what does zls even do

like the only errors it showed were when i forgot to put a bracket or a semi-colon

[valid jetty]

you configured it wrong then

the syntax checker and (everything else) checkers are typically different parts of the same lsp

for example, in rust syntax errors happen as soon as you edit the text, but stuff like mismatched arity only appear when you save the file

[spark tiger]

on apparently you can make it have build-on-save errors

[native spruce]

@woven mesa they want too much from me

[lavish frigate]

what does the app look like rn

[woven mesa]

WHAT

thats fucked up

[nimble bone]

Apple so insane

antrag is cute

however right-swiping an app crashes

[solemn ravine]

skill issue

works on all my devices

[spark tiger]

wat even is this app

[woven mesa]

antrag isnt urls guh

[nimble bone]

howwww

[woven mesa]

use after free

!!!!!

[solemn ravine]

dis the app

[woven mesa]

@solemn ravine @nimble bone @spark tiger

[spark tiger]

i thought apps can't know what you got installed or what

[woven mesa]

sammie is very smar

so she did it anyways

[spark tiger]

well i mean i heard that banking apps bypass it somehow with like private api or something

[nimble bone]

needs pariting file + local VPN

[spark tiger]

oh

[solemn ravine]

The app acts like a desktop computer

[woven mesa]

pariting file

[solemn ravine]

so it can do desktop stuff like list applications via a tcp request

no banking app can use this

[spark tiger]

oh that's very interesting

[solemn ravine]

Because they would need to ask the user to pair to a computer

which is… why would they do that

[spark tiger]

sorry i meant that how banking apps can detect whether your phone is jailbroken or not. i think they do it by detecting something in apps or whatever

i mean obviously they use another method

that doesn't require any user interaction

[solemn ravine]

There’s many ways to do it, ts is just another thing (but yes this app can detect ts) but regardless this requires full blown knowledge that you’re doing this sort of operation, it doesn’t hide it

A similar app does the same thing as antrag but don’t list more information

[spark tiger]

i see thank u

[solemn ravine]

but review seems to be asking too much from me

[woven mesa]

star trek so good

[solemn ravine]

since one of my other apps do link to the same resources as this one

[woven mesa]

liquid glass,,

i drank it

[solemn ravine]

They can’t accept that

[woven mesa]

you cant upload apps with beta sdks

[solemn ravine]

imagine me trying to upload the vencord extension and it ends up me chatting with the reviewers for a few days straight

oh my gosh this was the image they gave me 😭

god forbid I link to the project repo and give links to guides

[ivory heath]

Im not sure if this is smart the the dumbest shit ive ever made

[ivory heath]

i always try to make readable code when i write anything

I also have a sane .clang_format

[spark tiger]

UseTab: Never 🙏

[solemn ravine]

I programmed

[woven mesa]

scary

[solemn ravine]

@woven mesa idk if our approach for monitoring the clipboard is still good

need to reboot my mac so I turn off launchpad

[woven mesa]

i think its better for backwards compat

[solemn ravine]

tbh I’m not sure if there’s another way either

[woven mesa]

bro who made so much decoding logic

so unreadable

[solemn ravine]

TO WHAT

[woven mesa]

#warning("implement screenshots decoding")

[solemn ravine]

if ur talking about feather then most likely I was the one who touched it lol

[woven mesa]

nop i think it was me

guhh i dotn remmber ant of this

[solemn ravine]

u made it very large

but I did add some stuff

[woven mesa]

yeah you made a buncha properties optional

fair ig

[solemn ravine]

altstore repos suck yk

I think all of them are optional

so it just accepts anything given to it

[woven mesa]

scary

[solemn ravine]

maybe the apps array should be required at least

[woven mesa]

?

[woven mesa]

the unit tests are broken

[solemn ravine]

oops

what I do

[woven mesa]

nothing its just bc the uhh

models were moved out of feder

[solemn ravine]

oh righ

[woven mesa]

to altsourcekit

[solemn ravine]

aaah

[woven mesa]

i accidentally installed feder on my sisters phone

again

[spark tiger]

accidentally

[woven mesa]

xcode keeps defaulting to her phone before mine

[spark tiger]

oh i read it as fedora for some reason so i was like how tf do u accidentally install an os 😭

i gotta eep fr

[solemn ravine]

screenshots seem like hell..

imagine having 2 formats

[woven mesa]

Plugin “LicensePlistBuildTool” from package “LicensePlist” must be enabled before it can be used.
Enable it now?
Build plug-ins with malicious code can harm your Mac or compromise your privacy. Be sure you trust the source of build plug-ins before you enable them.

idk what that is

[solemn ravine]

enable it

[woven mesa]

what it do

[solemn ravine]

its for licenses

grabs all licenses from the project and bundles them

[woven mesa]

ooohh

[solemn ravine]

automatically

[woven mesa]

so true

[solemn ravine]

super useful

[pearl stag]

license_plist.yml: Lines 1-32

options:
  licenseFileNames:
    - LICENSE
  packagePaths:
    - Package.swift
  prefix: thewonderofyou.Feather
  xcworkspacePath: "*.xcworkspace"
  addVersionNumbers: false
  singlePage: false
  sandboxMode: true
  force: true

manual:
  - source: https://github.com/jkcoxson/idevice
    name: idevice
    body: |-
      MIT
  - name: "Zsign"
    file: "Zsign/LICENSE"
    
  - name: "ElleKit"
    file: "LICENSE_EllEKIT"

  - name: "LiveContainer"
    file: "Zsign/LICENSE_LC"

exclude:
  - swift-html-entities
  - LicensePlist
  - XcodeEdit
  - Yams
  - /.*-kit/

[solemn ravine]

tbh I didnt like yml at first

but when I was setting this up I got more fond of it

[worldly sigil]

its honestly fine when its kept super simple, personally

[spark tiger]

yaml is so cool but messing up indents is awful

[woven mesa]

the new xcode is nice

[worldly sigil]

but the moment you deal with anything that makes you add like 6 levels of indents is...

[woven mesa]

but still slow

i cant even type

[spark tiger]

lmao

i saw it

[worldly sigil]

my typing is off today

even on monkeytype

[woven mesa]

its still going

[spark tiger]

samsung galaxy whar

[worldly sigil]

ah yes, xcode and smasnug

[woven mesa]

yea

[solemn ravine]

this app is a monster

[woven mesa]

meret is actually worse

yk its bad if it takes apple long to build too

[solemn ravine]

if u got vscode with the extension it’s pretty hard to mess up

but if you’re editing with like nano then good luck

I had trauma with python when trying to edit it with cli

[woven mesa]

fr

[royal nymph]

not every day they have to build a Turkish supermarket app

[woven mesa]

explod

[solemn ravine]

idgi

@woven mesa do not look at the warnings

[woven mesa]

@solemn ravine my eepiness has gotten to me also unit tests are broken and i need more time to fix

can i look at it in morning pls

🥺

[solemn ravine]

thats up to u

[woven mesa]

gn oomfies

bye everyone else

[royal nymph]

that's okay ❤️

[lament bay]

gg

[native spruce]

@woven mesa LOL the apple clipboardviewer is source available

https://developer.apple.com/library/archive/samplecode/ClipboardViewer/Introduction/Intro.html#//apple_ref/doc/uid/DTS40008825-Intro-DontLinkElementID_2

oh hell yeah

god damnit their code so bad

[woven mesa]

true

[winged mantle]

when i saw switch statement i assumed it was js

[dense sand]

That's the boldest assumption ive ever seen 😭

[ivory heath]

How did you think C++ was JS

[winged mantle]

wdym c++ is very similar to js they both have classes

and they both have switch statements

[lavish frigate]

and they both have insane ugly ways of declaring private methods and properties

[runic island]

would there be any way for me to add this box with options to ephemeral messages somehow ?

https://i.imgur.com/1iymNNN.png

when hovering over ephemeral messages ?

not that exactly but a button that would interact with the ephemeral messages contents, like a copy content button for example

or integrate the translate button for normal messages into ephemeral ones

[winged mantle]

friends

🧑‍🤝‍🧑

[lavish frigate]

🤝

there is no real amazing way for that and that kinda sucks

[dense sand]

just because you type 5 less letters?

[lavish frigate]

but i still think
private function something() {}
is better than both
#something()
or

private:
  T something() {}

[winged mantle]

programming in so many languages is screwing with my brain

[lavish frigate]

read my follow up message, i think they kinda are all pretty inelegant but i cant deny that they work

[winged mantle]

c++ private: is fine but c++ friends feel like bloat

[lavish frigate]

yep 😭 fucking put function something() for c++

[winged mantle]

just add a comment saying // don't use unless you know me

[lavish frigate]

i dont think so its kinda very ugly, just doesnt really fit in with the other syntax..

😬

[winged mantle]

I mean you usually group together private stuff

it means less repetition

[lavish frigate]

thats true but i think id have prefered a block instead of randomly switching over to python mode

[winged mantle]

you can always do public: int pubFunc() if it's a one off

[fleet cedar]

Which is nasty

[lavish frigate]

dont husk me you know what i mean 😭

[winged mantle]

why so

[fleet cedar]

You should group by semantics, not arbitrary language limitations

[winged mantle]

good practice to group together internals

put public stuff at the top so library consumer knows what to use

[fleet cedar]

Good practice to put privates near where they're used

[winged mantle]

i mean in c++ you define headesr and source files separately

[fleet cedar]

It's so dumb that you have to define private stuff in header in the first place

[winged mantle]

you don't always

[lavish frigate]

Glad I still kept myself safe from the mess that is headers

[winged mantle]

programming languages not having headers confuses me

i sometimes feel like i need to edit header after editing something in source file

I haven't even done much c/++ lately

c++ developers anonymous

[fleet cedar]

It's just that headers aren't necessary, technology has evolved since the 70s

[winged mantle]

c++ modules exist now

🔥

[fleet cedar]

And how many compilers support them?

[winged mantle]

idk

i do like how header files are like documentation

[lavish frigate]

This broke me the first time I asked this question

I was like „c++ finally has print!!… oh“

[winged mantle]

how many of you rust devs actually have a job

[lavish frigate]

Idk but when I search for zig Jobs I get 100% less results than when I search for rust jobs

[winged mantle]

instead of using REAL languages which get you a job you use languages which pamper you with pleasant print functions

for your TOY projects

the one person i talked to who had a programming job mentioned using assembly

[lavish frigate]

I had a web dev job for 3 years and now I’m searching for another one so yeah

[winged mantle]

actually yeah the truth is all you need is javascript

[lavish frigate]

No I need js to get money so I can fund projects in languages I actually like

[winged mantle]

what if you made a rust like language that compiled into js

[lavish frigate]

What if you cargo build —target=wasm32-unknown-unknown

[winged mantle]

fn main(window: dom::Window) {
    let Some(cool_elem) = window.document.get_element_by_id("coolElem") else {
        panic!("cannot find #coolElem");
        return;
    };

    cool_elem.add_event_listener("click", |e| e.prevent_default());
}

[lavish frigate]

do i have news for you...

[winged mantle]

wait is this even syntactically valid

[tired vigil]

u don't need to return after panic

[winged mantle]

fixed

oh

i assumed that was wrong

i had just panic before idk i'm a bad rust dev

[fleet cedar]

That's spelled .expect("cannot find #coolElem")

[winged mantle]

i just wanted to have some pattern matching

totally didn't forget

[lavish frigate]

use web_sys::wasm_bindgen::prelude::*;
use web_sys::{HtmlButtonElement, window};

#[wasm_bindgen]
fn main() {
  let document = window().unwrap().document().unwrap();
  let element = document.get_element_by_id("coolElem").expect("Could not find element");
  if let Some(button) = element.dyn_into::<HtmlButtonElement>() {
    let on_click = Closure::wrap(Box::new(move |event: Event| {
      event.prevent_default();
    }));

    button.set_onclick = on_click.as_ref().unchecked_ref();
  }
}

welcome to rust, this is possible

actually you might not even need the wasm_bindgen

whoops

[winged mantle]

but naturally it has a lot of unwrapping and boxing and moving

what if you had a language with music as a first-class feature

you could just write c# to play the note c#

maybe a good name would be C#

[lavish frigate]

😭

[fleet cedar]

Lilypond

[winged mantle]

special kinds of loops for different scales would go hard

[supple whale]

i think theres some library for that

that compiles to wasm

and its dogshit

[winged mantle]

i mean more of a typescript like thing

probably not viable

[tired vigil]

actually this is just alternative syntax that can also be played as music
iirc there are a few languages specifically for writing music algorithms with loops and instruments and stuff like that

It's really cool when someone writes live code in it, the music changes in real time

hell yeah https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1m0aX9Lpts

[winged mantle]

c++ is scary https://madebyevan.com/obscure-cpp-features/

i did know the first 6

c++ feels weird to me

in normal use i feel like it's fine apart from template errors

but learning c++ is like learning a non programming language

it's constantly evolving with new words like rizz

it has many obscure words like gongoozler

i guess words like gongoozler and ken are like compiler specific extensions

(in case you were wondering gongoozler is "a person who enjoys watching activity on the canals of the United Kingdom" and ken I have heard people from scotland say to mean "know" and they are both regional)

ok better example is antidisestablishmentarianism

i find it funny that people seemed to become aware of this word from that steam bug because i knew it for years

honestly error handling is the best thing about go because it showed that the developers felt schadenfreude

yes

[gilded surge]

it is indeed possible

[winged mantle]

why are you asking this in the programing channel

[tulip sage]

oh shit

mb

[jade stone]

Didn't know these

[winged mantle]

really

howw

noob

i knew all but third there

the second is one of the first six but i did know it

[jade stone]

I have written one C++ project ever

I need to do another one soon

@winged mantle do I do ui with gtkmm or QT

[winged mantle]

qt

qt is easy

[ivory heath]

How so?

[lavish frigate]

I dislike both # and private: with how they look

They don’t fit

[fleet cedar]

The 4[ptr] one isn't in c++, that's c

[winged mantle]

if go has byte why doesn't it have word, dword and qword

ah it's architecture specific ig

except windows of course thought it was smart to use those terms in the registry

[shrewd canopy]

it does have all of these

uint16, uint32, uint64

[winged mantle]

byte is an alias for uint8

no aliases for the others