Proof Of God

[acoustic cove]

Not to divine

[inner shale]

And that mineralization replaces organic material with surrounding minerals.

[acoustic cove]

I mean anything inside the fossil is still a fossil since it is part of it

[rustic pine]

well we weren't talking about the same thing, its a technicality, cause fossil could be anything at all that is preserved, a mummy is a fossil

[inner shale]

A mummy is not a fossil what lmaooo

[acoustic cove]

Wait

Wait no mummies are not fossils

[acoustic cove]

Unless that mummy got fossilized in stone somehow

[inner shale]

A fossil is animal remains preserved by natural processes

[inner shale]

Lol yea

[acoustic cove]

It’s also what I call old annoying people

[inner shale]

Lolll

Except old people are alive due to humans lol

Cuz our technology

[acoustic cove]

Only natural?

[inner shale]

And healthy lifestyles

Yea

[acoustic cove]

I’m not too big on geology

[inner shale]

I am big on everything science

[rustic pine]

im talking about Desiccation

[acoustic cove]

But we can make fossils through pressure no?

[rustic pine]

https://ucmp.berkeley.edu/paleo/fossils/drydes.html

[inner shale]

Yea but it would take 10,000 years

[acoustic cove]

We can’t blow them up and make lab grown fossils?

[inner shale]

You don’t know what u are talking about 80% of the time

[inner shale]

I suppose so

I wouldn’t really know

[acoustic cove]

Oh yeah we can and it looks super cool

[inner shale]

Interesting

[rustic pine]

sure you can think that if it makes you feel better

[inner shale]

We aren’t discussing synthetic fossils tho

[inner shale]

I can scroll up and give you 15 messages that aren’t true

[rustic pine]

What is desiccation?
Desiccation, also known as mummification, is a very unique and rare form of fossilization. Desiccated/mummified fossils are next in quality to frozen fossils. Bones and tissues of desiccated organisms of the desert are well preserved, although they often fall apart at the slightest touch. With desiccated fossils, even the skin and hair retain their original color. For example, a fossil mummy of Anatosaurus was air-dried before natural burial. When fossilized, there were impressions of the skin in the hardened burial matrix leaving a detailed surface pattern. These extremely fragile fossils are so rare that a collector who finds one is likely to turn it over to a museum. Such fossils are the only accurate evidence available to the scientist trying to restore a bag of bones and give it the proper clothing.

[rustic pine]

nope

you just didnt understand what i was saying

[inner shale]

I suppose you could argue that a mummy is a fossil

We are talking about natural fossils tho

[rustic pine]

that does happen naturally

[inner shale]

.

[acoustic cove]

A MUMMY NATURALLY?

[inner shale]

.

[acoustic cove]

How?

We make mummies

[rustic pine]

you just told me a mummy isnt a fossil

[inner shale]

A mummy is made by humans

I we are talking about natural fossils

A mummy is not a natural fossil

It is preserved by humans

If u are gonna argue semantics then just leave

[rustic pine]

when i was saying you cant date fossils with carbon dating, was because i wasnt including these technicalities

and you got me on a technicality and insalting my intelligence because of it

even tho the whole time from the start i was telling you what i was actually referring to

[rustic pine]

mummification is also a natural process

its basically just removing all the water so it can no longer decay

[inner shale]

No it isn’t

It is done by humans

Making it not natural

[inner shale]

“You can’t date fossils with c14”
Isn’t true and there is no technicality

[rustic pine]

most mummies are natural, problem is when you hear mummy you are only thinking about man made mummies

[inner shale]

There is no such thing a a mummy not made by humans

It is strictly a human preservation technique from ancient Egypt

[rustic pine]

Desiccation takes place when organic material is found in conditions void of moisture. This results in dehydration and the material can then be preserved for thousands of years. Arid regions are favorable environments for desiccation. Dry caves also prove excellent conditions. About the time that the mammoths were freezing in the northlands, other vertebrates crawled into caves in the southern desert region and died. In this aseptic environment, dead organic material becomes mummified. Not surprisingly, a few of the Ice-Age animals did just that. Extinct ground sloths have been found lying on or near the surface. The cave-dwelling sloth was also represented by their dried dung.

[inner shale]

That is not mummification

[rustic pine]

Natural mummification is defined as the process by which the skin and organs of a deceased person or animal are preserved, without the introduction of chemicals by humans.

i think its better if we just dont debate on anything

[inner shale]

No it is not

[rustic pine]

no hard feelings, i dont think you are dumb but apparently you think i am and dont listed so thats that

[inner shale]

Lol please show me one natural mummy then I’ll shut up 😂

[rustic pine]

A mummy is a dead human or an animal whose soft tissues and organs have been preserved by either intentional or accidental exposure to chemicals, extreme cold, very low humidity, or lack of air, so that the recovered body does not decay further if kept in cool and dry conditions.

I mean your just arguing with wikipedia at this point

[inner shale]

Mega sigh

[rustic pine]

have you never heard that there is more then one spicific meaning to terms?

[inner shale]

Two Oxford dictionary definitions

One is that

The other is “someone’s mother”

This is a dumb argument

[rustic pine]

https://www.livescience.com/mummification.html#:~:text=Mummies are also created by,factor that mitigates against decay.

just read, i have showed you so many things already and you just dont get it

[inner shale]

Ok fair enough

Not the traditional definition but you some consider it as something different

I’ll give it to you 👍

[acoustic cove]

Yeah my mummy thought me that… but that doesn’t make her a mummy, just my mom

[inner shale]

Lol

[acoustic cove]

Neo things can have other meanings yes. But when we talk about a certain kind of mummy, fossil etc you can’t use arguments that refer to a different type to support a point. This is a fallacy

[rustic pine]

im not, i was talking about that the whole time, but also even man made mummies use the term fossil

[acoustic cove]

And you use them interchangeably in everyday life?

Cause in debates people should be very clear with words

We talk about fossils and you said also mummies are fossils. If mommies are the same as fossils why even bring it up as an example of other things being fossils. It’s confusing

[rustic pine]

you dont know the context of why i'm talking about this, im saying because when i said you cant date fossils with carbon dating i was talking about completely mineralized fossils, and not technicalities

and then i said if you want to go that dirrectiong then even a mummy is a fossil

which it technically is

and yes you can carbon date thme

[inner shale]

Mineralized fossils are dated so this is wrong

[acoustic cove]

But if the word mommy is a synonym to fossils how can you say even a mummy is a fossil… the statement itself differentiates them. That’s why I’m saying it’s confusing

[rustic pine]

its not a synomym

well maybe it is idk but that is not something i was saying

[acoustic cove]

Why does it matter though? Since like the other guy said yesterday our 6billion years with our understanding is how long the 6000 years in the Bible were referring 😂

I’m all for the debates but saying the Bible is always right literal never contradictory and never figurative kills me

[inner shale]

He isn’t saying all definitions are the same

[rustic pine]

Im not someone who says or thinks that

[acoustic cove]

Yeah I said the other guy last night

[inner shale]

He is saying there is an alternate definition which there isn’t in the Oxford dictionary

[acoustic cove]

I don’t put words in people’s mouths 🙂

If the definition is not in the Bible I don’t trust it

[inner shale]

Oh

Lol what

Ohh

That’s what he said lol

[acoustic cove]

The answer is 100% no don’t ask it

[inner shale]

Aka 99.9999% of words

@rustic pine the problem is you think mineralized fossil have no carbon

[acoustic cove]

Almost everything has carbon or a derivative

Period

[inner shale]

Yep

[acoustic cove]

Might be a minuscule quantity but is there

[inner shale]

Yea

[inner shale]

On earth that is

[acoustic cove]

Let me rephrase that

Yeah on earth

Elsewhere it could be silica

[rustic pine]

no

of course they have carbon

[inner shale]

.

[inner shale]

I already said I’ll give it to u although it isn’t the traditional definition

[rustic pine]

not carbon you can use to test

[inner shale]

We observe enough carbon to test man

[inner shale]

U made this up in your head no where did you read it

[rustic pine]

unless there is what i would refer to as unfosslized organic matter inside, but apparently that is also considered "the fossil"

[inner shale]

Mineralized fossils have enough carbon to test period.

[craggy maple]

Nothing was created, aside from everything at some point

silly boi, regardless of what your view is

[inner shale]

Prove it

[craggy maple]

Don't y'all believe in the big bang theory or smth

[inner shale]

Creation assumes a creator

[craggy maple]

Ya

It's a question no one can answer in either regard

[inner shale]

Something can exist without a creator

[rustic pine]

you need piece of the actual carbon based organic material, you are takeing a sample size that counts the amount of carbon 14 within that known volume, you cant just have contaminants in it that could distort the volume c14 ratio

[craggy maple]

It's a argument with no end and no win on either side

Nothing can't become everything, so you either have faith in one theory or another

Both make sense in certain ways

[inner shale]

No one said nothing became everything

[craggy maple]

It can't have always been

[inner shale]

I wouldn’t know

[craggy maple]

Ya

[inner shale]

So there is no proof of a creator

[craggy maple]

Weather you choose to believe or not, religion is by far a force of net good in the world. You can't prove something of that nature

Doesn't seem to me like the discussion makes a whole lot of sense yanno lol

None of us will know for sure till we're dead lol, we'll find out if there's nothing or something, and be like "huh, cool"

[inner shale]

Ever heard of 9-11

[craggy maple]

Was born on it

[inner shale]

Damn

[craggy maple]

Ya

[inner shale]

You know what caused it?

Religion

[craggy maple]

Seems an awful lot like corrupt govt officials honestly lol

But saying it was jihadists is comforting

[inner shale]

Ever heard of the crusades

[craggy maple]

Yes, Muslims were conquering land, and it was essentially a counter assault

Which wasn't all that successful afaik, not super knowledgeable on that history

[inner shale]

People died in the name of a non existent being

Most wars were started for religious reasons

Why live in delusion

[craggy maple]

Most wars are started over resources not religion but in ancient times perhaps more often

Your theory seems equally delusional

[inner shale]

Ever been to the Middle East?

Women can’t learn to read or drive in several regions

They are treated as property

[craggy maple]

It's very hard to defend all religions ya

Islam was a religion the prophet mohammed created after talking to someone in the church/synagog forget which. It teaches valuable things, and has a much more serious tone, but it is pretty problematic by todays standards

From their view, which has some merit, not much point in a religion if you change with the world

They view being beholden to their rules as something that will reward them in the afterlife, so they follow it. Yes it's unfortunate that the women have far, far less freedom, but generally they're moderately happy, have less to worry about, and live in a far more communal society

Benefits and drawbacks. The people who are the most radical, Afghanistan etc, are a bit off the path, so it's pretty harsh to judge a religion based on those standards

I dunno yanno

[inner shale]

.

So now you see why this is a valid discussion?

[craggy maple]

For what reason, because you think it causes all wars?

Or because societies are different?

[inner shale]

No because religion is delusion and as a society we should not teach falsehoods and live in the truth

Religion causes many to skip the step of using logic to back up claims and that is not how a society advances

Teaching dogma is harmful

[craggy maple]

They're stories that have survived for thousands of years, teach valuable and powerful moral and life lessons, shaped society into what it is today, and will be around long after you're gone. It's foolish to believe that you're smarter than religion, and are the arbiter of what is or isn't true

[inner shale]

Keep the stories

Keep the lessons

Leave out the threats of eternal punishment

[craggy maple]

Do you think a godless society would be better?

[inner shale]

In many ways yea

[craggy maple]

What do you care if you don't believe?

If you get annoyed by individuals who preech to in their view "save" people, have a good laugh about it or something lol

[inner shale]

It causes our society harm

Im not annoyed

Just concerned

[craggy maple]

Electricity causes us harm, your point? Lol

[acoustic cove]

Kid, before you answer know what you are talking about. The Big Bang was a collision. Therefore something existed before

[craggy maple]

It's a net good, net goods are... Good?

[craggy maple]

And where did that come from? That's my point about the argument being irrational from both sides

And now, we've moved on to is religion good for the world

[inner shale]

.

[inner shale]

.

[inner shale]

.

[craggy maple]

Abolish the electrical grid, based

1800s living yeehaw

[inner shale]

That would harm people

Abolishing religion wouldn’t

Overall

I’m saying leave out the harmful parts

Not the whole thing

Ready?

[craggy maple]

People seem to do bad things with or without religion. I'd wager less with

I'd rather have a putin that converted to Catholicism than a putin that was atheist

[inner shale]

Once again there are good things about religion

Convert Putin to believe in that stuff

Not the eternal punishment belief of a non existent being and dislike of gay people

[craggy maple]

The hatred pointed at gay people is a misinterpretation of religion

[inner shale]

Ok and

You are getting off track of what I’m saying

[craggy maple]

Eeucate them further

[inner shale]

There are negative aspects of religion

I don’t like those

The rest is fine

[craggy maple]

It would then cease to be a religion

[inner shale]

Read the Bible from a metaphorical point of view

Yep

[craggy maple]

cool

[inner shale]

Do you believe in god?

[craggy maple]

Monotheistic ya

Latin mass appeals to me the most of the several forms of service and whatnot

But again, can't prove anything from a logical point of view, so it's interesting/difficult making a choice

[inner shale]

Why do you believe in him then

[craggy maple]

Makes sense to me

[inner shale]

What about it makes sense?

[craggy maple]

That something created something which created more things

[fierce cargo]

Hello @inner shale, apologies for the delayed response. I’ve been quite busy lately, and I wanted to give you a detailed response.

[inner shale]

No worries

[fierce cargo]

Apologies for the poor handwriting. Writing is not my strong suit. And I really didn’t want to type out 5 pages of text onto this discord 😂

[inner shale]

Just read the first two sentences and I have a feeling how where u are going to go

I’ll answer this misconception first before continuing so I don’t forget

Animals survive based on fitness

Survival of the fittest doesn’t mean on the fitness species of all survives

It means that the creatures that survive pass on their genes

So naturally niches form

Animals that hide

Animals that hunt

Animals that fly

Animals that walk

Birds that eat nuts

Birds that eat mice

Fish that eat plankton fish that eat other fish

These are all niches

These animals have specific traits that keep them alive

And even if a specific animal is more fit in that specific niche it doesn’t mean all other species die

It means they will take up more of the population as they take more resources

Does that make sense @fierce cargo

You brought up Stephan hawking

Evolution is a process of survival by natural selection

It has nothing to do with an individual person that has survived for a certain amount of time

And if it wasn’t for our technology he would have died way before

This a large misrepresentation of evolution

The reason these animals are alive is because are are fit to do so

None are “weaker”

@fierce cargo

I will wait until you respond to move on

[fierce cargo]

Ok. Makes sense. Continue 🙂

[inner shale]

so we can agree that the first page is irrelevant to evolution?

second page doesn't address evidence for gods existence

the fact that humans haven't died off doesn't justify gods existence

can we agree on that before i move on to page 3?
@fierce cargo

[acoustic cove]

@fierce cargo the problem is that if there is a God he can’t even protect us if he wanted. We have reached a level at which we can wipe out humanity and wouldn’t even be that hard. If god is such a powerful being for creating us, why don’t you consider genetic biologists gods. They can form a life however they see fit. It’s possible to control a person’s genetic code, what eyes they’ll have, hair etc… if we can as humans replicate super complex organisms why aren’t we gods?

[fierce cargo]

They cannot do it perfectly though. And even if someone were to press the nuclear launch codes right now, God could easily stop them from launching. If there is no God, we all would have destroyed each other long ago.

[acoustic cove]

It’s funny that you think that as I think most of the troubles in our world are due to “God”

Most of the friction around the planet throughout history in the past 2000 years has some connection to God

@inner shale what’s your opinion on this matter?

And @rustic pine

[inner shale]

one sec im talking with @fierce cargo

[inner shale]

can u agree xc dude?

@fierce cargo?

[timid ore]

How can someone honestly believe this and say it’s science. I’m not being harsh I honestly would like to hear

[inner shale]

I never said it’s science

[timid ore]

But you said you believe in science

[inner shale]

Just because I believe in science doesn’t make everything I say scientific

and because we have never seen energy/matter created so there is no reason to believe it is

[timid ore]

So has something always existed

And than those gases formed into the world we know

[timid ore]

What do you consider religion to be. My definition would be a lot different

[inner shale]

I don’t know

[inner shale]

I’ll take the Oxford definition

These are good

[timid ore]

My definition is. Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world

So I guess it’s a matter of opnion because corrupted religion causes wars because of a desire of power. True religion is caring for those in need

[inner shale]

I don’t understand how that is a definition

When you use the word you are defining in your definition

[timid ore]

I think it’s a little closed minded to hold so strongly to something that you can’t prove scientifically, it takes some sort of faith to believe it happened because no one knows how guises gases got there. Or the previous gases etc

[inner shale]

What gasses

How is it close minded to say I don’t know

I’m not taking a stance

I just don’t know

[timid ore]

That is what the Bible calls religion, and I’m assuming that is what you think most people who believe in religion support

[inner shale]

You can’t define a word with the word you are defining that is circular reasoning

[timid ore]

How did the Big Bang start?

[inner shale]

What am I holding strong to that I can’t prove?

[inner shale]

I don’t know

[dense flicker]

time started at that point -- meaning something must have caused it

[inner shale]

Sure

Idk what that would be

[dense flicker]

Well they'd have to be a creator

[inner shale]

That is a leap of logic

[dense flicker]

Since they could create something out of nothing

[timid ore]

How is it circular reasoning when you group people into religion that believe what the religion says and than some people believe that murder is religion I think it’s a bit hasty to say that Christian’s Muslims and Catholics are all the same

[inner shale]

Should me something that was created that wasn’t there

[timid ore]

Creation is done.

[inner shale]

You have your definition of religion and I’m saying I use the consensus definition for the word

[inner shale]

Prove it

[dense flicker]

You can change things into other things but you can't create matter or energy

[inner shale]

Yep

[dense flicker]

Or time or space

[inner shale]

So why do you assume it had to be created

[dense flicker]

But something must have caused that

[inner shale]

Yep

[timid ore]

But someone had to define that someone that had a bias approach so why wouldn’t you use the very means of religion to define itself?

[dense flicker]

Because otherwise there would be no world

Reality would be a meaningless void

[inner shale]

Man i don’t really care what you definition is we are talking about god

[inner shale]

But we are here so there is an explanation I just don’t know what it is

[timid ore]

Well what you think about God is the important part because a lot of people believe many different things

[inner shale]

3v1 time 😆

[fierce cargo]

How can problems be God’s fault when He doesn’t exist?

[dense flicker]

xd

[inner shale]

I believe god as in a creator of the universe is not real

[dense flicker]

there has to be SOME fundamental thing/being that exists eternally

Because otherwise they'd have to have been created

[fierce cargo]

Nothing justifies God’s existence except God Himself

[inner shale]

Why there is not reason to believe that

[fierce cargo]

Only God can convince one of His existence

[inner shale]

Lol then tell god to convince me lmao

[dense flicker]

If there wasn't, there would be no existence

[timid ore]

Yes

[inner shale]

Why not?

[fierce cargo]

He chooses some to reveal the light to, and others to keep blind

[inner shale]

Ok well ur god is very rude

[timid ore]

The Bible is the way to get that revealed

[dense flicker]

Because it has to be created

[inner shale]

Lol

[fierce cargo]

I cannot tell God anything. I can only ask Him.

[inner shale]

I’ve read it

[timid ore]

What did you think

[inner shale]

I’ve “asked him” before

[timid ore]

That’s not the truth

[inner shale]

I used to believe it

[timid ore]

What changed?

[inner shale]

My brain developed

And I used logic to make oppinions

[fierce cargo]

@timid ore Jesus literally said so.

[timid ore]

Where?

[inner shale]

😂

[inner shale]

Again u are assuming this

[timid ore]

Why does he command believers to go everywhere if he is only choosing some to show the light

[inner shale]

Lol

[fierce cargo]

Matthew 15:13-14

[dense flicker]

right

If it's not created

And it's outside of time

It would have to exist fundamentally

--eg God

[inner shale]

We exist
Nothing about that assumes a creator

[dense flicker]

Right but we were created

[fierce cargo]

Not everyone is a believer. Not everyone will receive second life. Not everyone will have their eyes opened. There will be the blind that lead the blind into a ditch.

[timid ore]

Interesting that doesn’t talk about God electing anyone

[dense flicker]

By our parents at the least forget about a soul or not for now

And our parents were created

Or changed from other matter, whatever

[fierce cargo]

@timid ore Oh the Bible talks about election a LOT

[timid ore]

Matthew 15:13-14 KJV
[13] But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up. [14] Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

It does

[dense flicker]

...all the way back to the big bang

[timid ore]

It talks about it in the sense that everyone receives him as there savior is elected

[dense flicker]

At which point our universe and time both started

[fierce cargo]

Roman’s 11:5-7

[timid ore]

You do know it was talking about how God preserved his people and is doing the same now

[inner shale]

Lol

[timid ore]

Not saying that some are allowed to see and others aren’t you have to keep the Bible in context. Read the previous verses and later verses

[inner shale]

This is funny

Who is gonna give me proof of god?

[fierce cargo]

Isaiah 54

[inner shale]

Instead of arguing about Christian beliefs lol

[timid ore]

You have to believe in God by faith

The heavens declare the glory of God but it’s up to you to believe

[inner shale]

Why

[timid ore]

He says you have to

[timid ore]

Where does it talk about in 55

54

[fierce cargo]

We cannot convince of God’s existence or prove to you that He exists. You are blinded right now. Even if I did prove God exists and showed God to you, you still wouldn’t believe

[acoustic cove]

That why the quotation marks. That word also relates to Allah. Are you Islamist?

[timid ore]

He sounds like a Calvinist or someone that loves devils advocate lol

[fierce cargo]

@timid ore the entire chapter discusses how Jesus is our inheritance. The inheritance of the Gentiles. The reason the Gentiles (non Jews) have access ti salvation

[acoustic cove]

So there is nothing objective that could justify believing in Him, thanks!

[inner shale]

I should believe something exists because you told me that thing says it exists

Not a good reason

[timid ore]

Right so Gods desire that all come to him Jews and gentiles how does that show that he limits to only a few

[inner shale]

A giant spaghetti monster told me it exists guys
So you have to believe it

[acoustic cove]

I do devils advocate but in this instance I’m just answering him stupid comment like he caught me in a trap 😂

[timid ore]

You should read the Bible and if you do it with an open heart and not trying to prove something it will speak to you

[timid ore]

It’s one of my favorite things to do

[inner shale]

I read it and believed it for 13 years… please

[acoustic cove]

Mine too until people think I’m a creationist or a flat earther where I start regretting it 😂

[inner shale]

I stopped believing when I chose to believe in things that have evidence

[fierce cargo]

2nd Peter 3:9-13

[acoustic cove]

I red it and believed in it until I was 15 and actually learned about other religions

[timid ore]

I feel to many people don’t want to be accountable to an all knowing God and that is what turns them away from faith

[inner shale]

I did til 13

My entire family is Christian

[acoustic cove]

No joep people simply are not as gaulible

[fierce cargo]

So @acoustic cove what do you believe in?

[acoustic cove]

It’s called evolution when people understand that a falling start from millions of years ago is not a flying leprechaun

[timid ore]

He says he is not willing that any perish, spiritual separation,

[acoustic cove]

Star*

[timid ore]

It teaches a to all people gospel not to just a few

[inner shale]

Is anyone here going to give evidence for god?

[timid ore]

Well the Bible does say flesh and blood can’t convince you it has to be the Holy Spirit conviction through hearing the Bible

Like I said our very existence and universe is evidence of God but it has to be received by faith

[acoustic cove]

Personally? I believe in freedom. Freedom for anyone to believe whatever they want. Faith is an amazing thing for a person to have. But it’s PERSONAL. Once you bring science to wrongly try and prove something that’s where you lose me. When your faith takes over your common sense that’s where you lose me. When you try and attack my beliefs that’s where you lose me. If you really want to know 🙂

[timid ore]

Just like believing in evolution no one was there to witness it’s a faith base theory

[acoustic cove]

Is anyone here going to give objective evidence we live in the matrix? Cause that would be easier and more sensical

Part of believing in God is that you cannot have evidence

So it’s an oxymoron to try and providing evidence of his existence

[timid ore]

I believe the same thing. No one should be forced to believe Christianity or Islam or evolution. We should have individual soul liberty, free will,

[acoustic cove]

Once you bring in evidence of Gods existence, faith is gone

[inner shale]

I’ve heard the Bible

[timid ore]

The Bible proves his existence, but it is a faith based book

[inner shale]

But there is no evidence of god

[acoustic cove]

You are wrong here. You included evolution with belief and faith based systems

It’s like saying I don’t need to believe I am human

[timid ore]

How do we know that the Bible is false?

[acoustic cove]

If it’s true it contradicts itself therefore cannot be true in a literal sense

[timid ore]

No man observed creation just like no man observed millions of years of evolving and a Big Bang

[acoustic cove]

If it’s figurative then sure it has some great messages and teachings in it

[acoustic cove]

We observe it currently 😂

[timid ore]

I won’t be able to convince you other wise last night proved that lol😂 that was fun though

[acoustic cove]

On the other hand no one ever observed creation

[timid ore]

We observe current life but how do we know something was millions of years ago if no one was there to account for it

[acoustic cove]

Did you observe god tell king James what to pick and choose?

[fierce cargo]

@acoustic cove When did I attack your beliefs?

[acoustic cove]

You didn’t

I was stating what I believe in

[inner shale]

Lol

[acoustic cove]

Like that whole thing

[timid ore]

There is a line of men that have documented there beliefs from king James all the way to present day American in crimson red is the title

It shows all the way from ad 0 to present day

[acoustic cove]

Same thing with the Quran. With much more reliable observations

[timid ore]

And God didn’t tell king James 😂 but would be cool if he did lol

[acoustic cove]

Why don’t you believe in the Quran?

[fierce cargo]

In which ways does it contradict itself? If you interpret it the wrong way, it appears to contradict itself 🤷🏻‍♂️

[acoustic cove]

If we say that okay sure this is how we go about it

Why not all religious texts?

They were written the same way as the Bible

[inner shale]

Someone please answer the question of the thread

[acoustic cove]

Buddy he was saying yesterday that the Bible should be taken literally and is never wrong. Therefore there is NO interpretation at hand. IT IS LITERAL according to him

[fierce cargo]

I have, and you said no. So I won’t bother any further. Fair enough?

[timid ore]

It’s a faith based thing the Quran claims to be Gods word Allah but also it claims to have Christian principles coming from Abraham and so forth. So it crosses two different lines

[fierce cargo]

Him??? Are you talking about me or someone else?

[acoustic cove]

Joep

[fierce cargo]

Ok

[timid ore]

I told you yesterday there is only one interpretation why would you say I didn’t?

[acoustic cove]

I haven’t talked to you to know your belief system I’m not going to pressure to know it

Or out words in your mouth before talking with you

Presume*

[fierce cargo]

There are numerous interpretations of the Bible. One is the way it is intended and literally no one alive fully understands the Bible completely, outside of Jesus Christ

[acoustic cove]

If there is only one it is not an interpretation. It is the text itself

[inner shale]

Someone please answer the question of the thread
😂

[fierce cargo]

And He gives us the Holy Spirit to help us understand it.

[acoustic cove]

Interpreting means NOT LITERAL

Can we at least all agree that there is no proof of god

[inner shale]

Not necessarily

[acoustic cove]

If there was proof there was no faith

[fierce cargo]

Can we also agree that there’s no proof in the big band either?

[timid ore]

I honestly believe our very existence proves that there is a God.

[acoustic cove]

“the action of explaining the meaning of something.”

[fierce cargo]

*bang

[acoustic cove]

If it is literal there is no meaning. It’s what it says

[timid ore]

You can go anywhere in the world and every culture is trying to serve some form of a God

[acoustic cove]

Then you are not a believer

You don’t have faith

[fierce cargo]

Neither side can produce foolproof evidence of either.

[acoustic cove]

You just know he exists

[timid ore]

It takes faith to believe that Jesus Christ is God

[acoustic cove]

There is no ounce of faith in you if you KNOW he exists

[timid ore]

Yes

[acoustic cove]

Even from a Christian side people say of course there is no proof, that’s why we have faith

[timid ore]

It’s not knowing that is wrong, but putting your faith in which”god” is the faith

[acoustic cove]

You can’t say there is definite proof and still think you are faithful

[inner shale]

Faith is not a source of truth

[fierce cargo]

This whole thread is pointless tbh. It was designed for argument 😅

[acoustic cove]

And that’s why I believe faith can be great for those who have it. Cause they don’t need proof for it

[fierce cargo]

Truth Powers is not looking for proof

[acoustic cove]

But saying that faith is the proof you are either joking me or something is seriously wrong

[fierce cargo]

He just wants to attempt to humiliate those that respond

[timid ore]

Is there a definite proof that Jesus Christ is God. No, that’s where faith comes in, but God has built all of us with an instinct that there is a God. Hence why some of y’all said you did believe

[fierce cargo]

Stop feeding him. Ok? Good night

[acoustic cove]

Joep if you were born in Iraq would you still believe in Jesus?

[timid ore]

Faith is proof to me but you can’t prove it in a debate it’s personal, the Bible says this will sound like foolishness to those that don’t believe 😀and from your responses I think y’all would agree with the Bible

[acoustic cove]

What do you think objectively

[acoustic cove]

Me?????

[timid ore]

Honestly probably not unless someone came and told me and I was able to see from the scriptures the truth but if I was never given that opportunity than absolutely not

[inner shale]

Little bit of both

[fierce cargo]

Many born in Iraq do believe in Jesus. And they are persecuted for their belief. As Jesus said they would be, 2,000 years earlier.

[inner shale]

I want to hear some proof but no one has given any

[acoustic cove]

@timid ore with our conversation do you think I ask questions to catch you in something to humiliate you? Honestly..

[inner shale]

Just an old book that is true because it says so

[fierce cargo]

No. You don’t want to hear proof. You just want to argue 😂

[timid ore]

I feel like you ask questions not for learning but for debate sake.

[inner shale]

I want to argue against non truths

[fierce cargo]

Ba dum tsss

Nice one

[timid ore]

And I enjoy debating but it won’t profit you anything in the long run because it is a faith base and the more you fight and argue the harder it will be for you accept it as truth

[fierce cargo]

I ask questions to challenge the unbeliever.

[timid ore]

But I also want you to see how serious and real it is to me and hope that one day. You will believe not because of me but because of what Gods word says

[inner shale]

If I don’t want to hear proof what proof have you given?

[fierce cargo]

And it’s called apologetics.

[acoustic cove]

But why do you want to accept it as the absolute truth? Are you not content with belief and bettering yourself according to that?

[fierce cargo]

See my original post.

[inner shale]

I have but u haven’t responded to my counter

So I haven’t moved on yet

[acoustic cove]

I would also love some of those please

[inner shale]

I countered page 2

Waiting for response to move to page 3

[fierce cargo]

I did. All of my pages lol

[timid ore]

Sorry I must of deleted my old message lol

[inner shale]

No I responded to page 2

I’m waiting for u to tell me if what I’m saying is accurate

[inner shale]

.

[acoustic cove]

I can tell you for a fact that when these debates happen no creationist will change their mind and no evolutionist will change theirs

[inner shale]

Click to view

[acoustic cove]

There is an inherent difference between knowledge and belief

[fierce cargo]

I already responded to that. It just got lost in this mess 😂😂😂

[inner shale]

Lol please link it

[timid ore]

Yes I agree that’s why it is unprofitable

That’s why you just give the truth if the Bible and let the Holy Spirit convict you

[acoustic cove]

No it isn’t

[fierce cargo]

I don’t know if I can find it anymore lmao

[acoustic cove]

Cause someone in the middle might read it and get both perspectives

And decide for themselves

[inner shale]

Just say it again

[timid ore]

Yea I’m saying unprofitable for the two or however many that is debating

[acoustic cove]

I don’t know

I’ve read more Bible verses in the last 24 hours than I did in the last 10 years

[inner shale]

Lol

[timid ore]

😀

[acoustic cove]

And you also learned what evolution actually teaches instead of some random high school “teacher”

[inner shale]

I’ve read practically the whole Bible minus psalms cuz it was too boring for me

[timid ore]

True

[acoustic cove]

Okay psalms? 😂

Too much

[timid ore]

Psalms actually has some excitement in it believe or not lol

[fierce cargo]

Nothing justifies God’s existence except God Himself

Was my response

I think…

[acoustic cove]

Yeah but instead of justifies you used proves

[inner shale]

Ok so then we can agree that page two in no way proves god?

[timid ore]

There is people running from kings and bounty hunters and stuff like that

[fierce cargo]

None of my pages prove God. Nothing I say will prove God to you. They are counters to your post 😅

[acoustic cove]

For me the biggest proof against the existence of God is actually the existence of the Bible :/

[timid ore]

How do?

So?

[fierce cargo]

I will say, though, that leptogenesis indicates God’s existence if you think about it.

[inner shale]

.

[timid ore]

That’s interesting honestly never heard that before

[inner shale]

.

Then give me proof @fierce cargo

[acoustic cove]

Because god is belief in the unknown. The Bible makes it known and is written by people like you and me. And many more but it’s mere existence does not make sense within the belief system

And when god got in earth with all his infinite power what he decided to do was turn water into wine?

[minor aurora]

Hey y'all, I'm just gonna put in my two cents. First, the title of the thread is proofs of God, so good arguments or bad, those are what we should be seeing. Second, a lack of a proof does not constitute disproof, because that transfers a burden of proof, so we shouldn't see any people riduculed for lack of a formal proof.
Finally, can we point to the definitions we're using for what a "God" is? Because if there isn't a solid agreement on what constitutes God, then it is vacuously true and untrue at the same time.

[timid ore]

I could see that, but if you are going to believ that God created the entire earth and everything in our solar system why wouldn’t you believe that God spoke his word to a prophet of God or apostle. And if he is powerful enough to create the world why can’t he persevere his Bible

[acoustic cove]

Everyone here points to Jesus and the Christian God

[fierce cargo]

I agree fully with @minor aurora

[timid ore]

That was the first of many

[fierce cargo]

Thank you for that!

[acoustic cove]

I guess you guys just raid the ridicule part and not the rest of his comment

Read*

[inner shale]

First No one has said no proof equals disproof
Second when someone doesn’t have proof but believes in something it should be questioned

[acoustic cove]

Autocorrect is killing me today

Perhaps god is trying to confuse my messages

@inner shale maybe he exists and you were to quick to jump the gun

[inner shale]

?

[timid ore]

😂 I hate auto correct

[inner shale]

But please listen to @minor aurora everything here should be proof of god

[fierce cargo]

@inner shale clearly sarcasm

[inner shale]

?

[acoustic cove]

You want an empty forum?

[timid ore]

🙄😀

[inner shale]

Lol I want a forum that is crowded with ppl arguing over Christian perspectives

[acoustic cove]

That’s why I created the other one

[inner shale]

Yea

[minor aurora]

Great, so the Christian Bible says God is Love. And Love exists, so by that definition God exists.

[acoustic cove]

Show me proof of love 😂

[fierce cargo]

If you want to argue Christian perspectives, then you should respect the beliefs of others as well. Fair enough?

[minor aurora]

(unless we want a proof that that love exists?)

[inner shale]

The issue with this line of reasoning is you are assuming what the Bible says is true

[acoustic cove]

It’s a human construct

And a quite recent at that

[minor aurora]

no, I'm utilizing the definition you gave me to use.

[timid ore]

Do you have morals?

[inner shale]

What?

[acoustic cove]

My wife says no but I think I do 😆

[inner shale]

What definition…

I’m so confused 😆

[timid ore]

So your married so you wouldn’t just go and sleep with a whole bunch of woman right

[minor aurora]

my bad, not the definition you agreed to

[acoustic cove]

Correct

[minor aurora]

but here was what I thought we were using

[inner shale]

Do you see the issue with this line of reasoning?

[acoustic cove]

I’ll sleep with the same woman many times 😂

Why get others when I have the perfect one?

[minor aurora]

The only issue is that you haven't even declared what a god is and what it means for it to exist

[inner shale]

You are the one that is supposed to define god you are claiming him

[minor aurora]

Once again, we can't have any sort of dialog without any definitions

[timid ore]

Why not if there isn’t a God why shouldn’t we break the concept of marriage or why would is wrong to murder or steal. If there isn’t a governing morality that existence in the person of God

[inner shale]

Then define what you are claiming

[acoustic cove]

@minor aurora before you continue could you please tell me if you believe in creation and in the Bible in a literal sense word for word?

[inner shale]

I’m not claiming anything u have to define

[minor aurora]

Okay. I define god then.
God is love.
love exists.
Therefore God exists.

[acoustic cove]

Why was that not allowed before the Bible?

[inner shale]

Oh ok that makes sense

[acoustic cove]

Why were thieves punished before those teachings?

[fierce cargo]

So, answer me this, why do you refuse to say the Bible can be true? Why should we be forced to believe it is false? Because you say so?

[inner shale]

God =love

Sure if that is all it is then I’ll agree with you

[timid ore]

Because we are born with a conscious that tells what is right and wrong

[minor aurora]

Perhaps that begs the question of what love is, but then we'd be in a different forum.

[fierce cargo]

God is not love. God is righteous, and merciful, and just.

[inner shale]

an intense feeling of deep affection.

[timid ore]

Anywhere in the world thag you go even to the deepest parts of the Amazon they still have government if it’s tribal or whatever they still hold marriages sometimes it’s perverted like polygamy, and they even hold to murder being wrong in some aspects like they won’t kill each other

[fierce cargo]

Combine those together to get a form of love

[timid ore]

You seriously don’t know anything about God 😂

[fierce cargo]

There are 4 types of love @inner shale. You of all people should know that

[fierce cargo]

Apparently not 🤷🏻‍♂️

[timid ore]

What’s the first fruit of the Holy Spirit

[acoustic cove]

Anything can be true. Of course the Bible can have truths in it. But it’s impossible to be true throughout with no mistakes

[fierce cargo]

The fruit of the Spirit is a result of having God within us, and there are many of them, not just love.

[minor aurora]

Also idk which holy texts you subscribe to, but if it's New Testament Christian Bible, then perhaps you'll accept 1 John 4:8

[timid ore]

Yes but you said God isn’t love

[inner shale]

😂 what

[timid ore]

And the spirit he gives us tells us he is love and that’s how we are able to love others

[fierce cargo]

Perhaps I should have clarified. God is not just love.

[timid ore]

Ok yes definitely

[acoustic cove]

I mean let me ask you guys something. Do you believe the Bible is more true than science books?

[minor aurora]

There's much more to Love than just deep affection.

[timid ore]

If it contradicts the Bible yes but there are plenty of science books that agree

[minor aurora]

XC is referring to the greek words for love, there are four of them with four very diverse meanings

[acoustic cove]

When you are sick or in trouble does the Bible tell you to go to pray?

[inner shale]

Funny thing is when people want to ask me for definitions I just copy and paste the true definition and they always come up with some random definition out of their butt

[inner shale]

Ik but he says I should know them

[minor aurora]

Lol "true definition" according to what? 21st century dictionary authors?

[inner shale]

Yes

[acoustic cove]

And please cite me one I’d love to see a science book referring to the Bible 😆

[fierce cargo]

The four types of love are Agape, Eros (the affectionate love), and two others I don’t remember off the top of my head

[timid ore]

In trouble it says to obey the government and to get what ever problem you have resolved with a brother. Sick the Bible says to take medicine and also to pray but it doesn’t say to act foolishly and abstain from doctors it says to use wisdom

[inner shale]

Ok so I think of love as one thing so idk what u are talking about

[acoustic cove]

Agape and Eros are synonyms

[timid ore]

Phileto or brotherly love like Philadelphia

[inner shale]

I only know one type of love

[minor aurora]

No, true definitions of words encompass much more than what the people who wrote dictionay pages have to say. And being in the dictionary doesn't make it more true.

[acoustic cove]

@fierce cargo here is about to teach me Greek guys 😂

[inner shale]

Ok well I agree with the traditional definition 🤷‍♂️

Making gods definition abstract doesn’t prove he exists

[inner shale]

When u teach a Greek guy about Greek guys lmao

[acoustic cove]

So I’m guess I you did all your vaccines and the Covid vaccine. You did 6 ft apart, not go to church or gatherings… you always wore a mask… right? Since the Bible told you to obey the government

[inner shale]

Lol

[acoustic cove]

You think that is a science book??? 😂

Cause it had the word science in the title… and general science at that! Come on man

[timid ore]

The Bible says to obey the government as long as it doesn’t contradict the Bible. Bible says to forsake not the assembly of believers so no you go to church

[acoustic cove]

It’s a kids’ book 😂

[timid ore]

Vaccine was never mandated where I was so no

[timid ore]

Poor judgement sorry😂

[minor aurora]

Communication relies upon commonly accepted meanings, as well as the speaker's intended contextual and specific meaning, and the potential ways for the audiences to interpret those meanings.
Speakers telling you a definition that they made up on the spot isn't something to mock. It's a genuine attempt to communicate the idea.

[inner shale]

Oh yea

[timid ore]

There is thousands of creations science books just like evolutionist have plenty

[acoustic cove]

Add peer reviewed on your search next time 😉

[inner shale]

I can disprove modern science with a 5 dollar picture book lol

[timid ore]

I wore a mask wherever it was required

[acoustic cove]

Show me one scientific book about creation

Not thousands… one

[inner shale]

That use logical fallacy to back up claims

[inner shale]

He just did bro the $5 picture book

😆

[acoustic cove]

No honest mistake come on

And joe anything below 50$ Is probably not a scientific book

[inner shale]

You can buy it off thrift books .com bro

[timid ore]

So would you consider a text book and science book to be the same

[inner shale]

A scientific creationist book exists out there somewhere but that doesn’t mean what it says is accurate

[timid ore]

There is a creation scientist named ken ham that does creation books

[minor aurora]

As for love, imo it would be detrimental to neglect the relationship/companionship aspect of it and the selflessness that comes with it as well as the enfatuation and obsessive aspects of it

[inner shale]

DONT EVEN GET ME STARTED ON KEN HAM LOL

[timid ore]

Go for it brother😂

[inner shale]

Lol have u seen his debate with bill nye?

https://youtu.be/z6kgvhG3AkI

[timid ore]

How was it?

[acoustic cove]

Not science book. Scientific book.

[inner shale]

Bros whole argument is “we weren’t in the past so we can’t predict it”

[acoustic cove]

Scientific has to be peer reviewed

[inner shale]

There are peer reviewed creationists books

Doesn’t make them true

[acoustic cove]

Scientist? Hold up let me check his qualifications

[inner shale]

He got a degree in theology 💀

[acoustic cove]

He studied to be a teacher 😂

[timid ore]

What constitutes a scientist?

[acoustic cove]

Connects perfectly to our comments about teachers yesterday

[timid ore]

I wouldn’t group all teachers together that’s a bit off

[acoustic cove]

Expert knowledge in natural and/or physical sciences

[inner shale]

He has a bachelors degree in applied science

[acoustic cove]

Wtf is that?

[timid ore]

And biology

[inner shale]

Not quite sure

[acoustic cove]

General studies for science?

[inner shale]

No

[acoustic cove]

He does not have a biology degree 😂

[timid ore]

Yes he does it was announced in his debate that you posted

[acoustic cove]

Ham earned a bachelor's degree in applied science (with an emphasis on environmental biology)

THIS IS NOT A BIOLOGY DEGREE 😂

[inner shale]

Yep

[timid ore]

Ooos my bad 😂 two mistakes in five minutes

[inner shale]

But doesn’t matter degrees don’t make what you have to say valid

[acoustic cove]

You are disgracing my life by suggesting that it a biology degree

[inner shale]

Lol

[timid ore]

😂

[acoustic cove]

Depends on what you are saying

[minor aurora]

good. biology majors can suck it

[acoustic cove]

If our other friend is telling me I don’t understand how carbon dating works no my degree makes me more valid no offense

[acoustic cove]

Honestly I agree

[inner shale]

This statement is inherently generalized meaning one situation in which it happens make the statement true

[acoustic cove]

I did it cause I had too many bio credits from chemistry 😂

[inner shale]

Who wants to give proof that god exists

[timid ore]

I think I’m going to bed this was fun except for the 10 time truth kept asking about proof that god exist 😂😂

[acoustic cove]

I guess another uneducated person who hasn’t read the Bible… shame

If you read it you’d get all the proof in the world apparently 😝

[timid ore]

No if you believe it 😂 but close

[acoustic cove]

Just observe the mummies man

[inner shale]

The only reason you should be in this thread is if you are answering my question loll

[acoustic cove]

@inner shale observe the mummies man! Chill 😆

Just don’t take their toilet paper off they might have mineralized and hunt you

[inner shale]

Well it looks like all the creationists have left now but any evidence of gods existence can go below 👇

[minor aurora]

God is that by which all other things came into being.
We exist (citation needed).
Therefore, the God exists.

[acoustic cove]

And for our friends who love Wikipedia (AND I HATE QUOTING WIKIPEDIA)
“The existence of God is a subject of debate in theology, philosophy of religion and popular culture.”
Don’t see science there 😉

[acoustic cove]

This is a fallacy and purely counter scientific. You get your argument and try to draw evidence to it. Find evidence that alone lead you to God without using God in the method

[minor aurora]

science means to test the observable processes of the world, and a god purports to be outside of the bounds of the world, there's no way that science could factor into it

[acoustic cove]

Oh thank you

Okay you are different

[minor aurora]

That was my definition of what a God is, not a method for deriving him.

[acoustic cove]

No no it’s fine I assumed you were going to scientifically prove to us god exist like they apparently did

Now could you give an example of proof that would lead us to the existence of God as the explanation. Objective and repeatable examples please?

Cause if you define God different than the consensus yeah God is faith

God is love

God is Jesus or Allah

God is a higher power

[minor aurora]

What do you mean by God? Extemedi...

[acoustic cove]

Sure

What everyone was referring to

The Christian God from KJV

[minor aurora]

everyone else is contradicting themselves

[acoustic cove]

No allegories thé being God and Jesus

[acoustic cove]

THANK YOU

Finally

I’m not alone

[minor aurora]

(Which is fine, so long as we don't presuppose consistency)

[acoustic cove]

With what you are saying though about love the problem is is that proof of god?

Cause that could mean people felt love therefore created the idea of god to explain love

[minor aurora]

you're assigning cause and effect to this, and you shouldn't be

[acoustic cove]

Chicken or the egg issue

Well it’s fundamental that there is cause and effect

With cause there can be no effect

Without*

And there can’t be an effect without cause

[minor aurora]

Oh, well yeah, the human description of a phenomenon come after the phenomenon

But i think it's inaccurate to say "created the idea of" for that

[acoustic cove]

But why?

We know it was created

It’s not even a very old idea

[minor aurora]

because creation implies something out of nothing, inspiration would be a better term for that

[acoustic cove]

A very long time before that love was another god

Aphrodite

Inspiration leads to creation of ideas it’s the same thing

[inner shale]

You are claiming something by assuming the answer here…

Leprechauns are green
Green exists
Leprechauns exist

[acoustic cove]

You just move a step back sure

[minor aurora]

the difference here would be "all things that are green are leprechauns"

[inner shale]

No you start with god exist
And end with god exists…

You are assuming the conclusion

A logical fallacy

[minor aurora]

...

[acoustic cove]

Already had this talk

He is saying we can’t prove it scientifically he is not like the others

[inner shale]

He is using a line of reasoning

How that works is you say a bunch of true statements that end in a conclusion

The issue is you can’t start the line of statements with the conclusion

[minor aurora]

It's a definition, not a conclusion.

[acoustic cove]

Well duh

[acoustic cove]

God exists is a definition?

I’m confused?

[inner shale]

“God exists” is a definition?

[minor aurora]

God is Love was my working definition there actually.

Hence my leading off with it

[inner shale]

.

[acoustic cove]

Besides the fact that love is not an existing thing but an idea

[inner shale]

Your conclusion was that god exists now u are saying that is a definition

[acoustic cove]

How do you conclude god exists

[minor aurora]

Yeah, that's a different argument, with potentially different definitions

[acoustic cove]

God is love
Love is an idea and construct of humans to explain a feeling
Therefore god a human ideological construct

By your line of thought

[inner shale]

That is the argument I have been discussing 🤦‍♂️

[minor aurora]

But I think my favorite definition of God actually is this one exactly.
Define God as the prime reality (first thing to exist) and it follows directly that God exists.

[acoustic cove]

@minor aurora this is exactly your train of though. So you got enough proof that god is an ideological construct of humans and not something that actually exists?

[inner shale]

God exists is a statement not a definition as you aren’t defining anything…

[minor aurora]

Like I said, we aren't going to get any scientific results out of this, but there we go.

[acoustic cove]

Not scientific

I followed exactly what you said

But you assumed love existed

Which it doesn’t

[inner shale]

Wait what

Entremedi you are attacking the wrong part of the argument

[minor aurora]

interesting claim, I think most of the world disagrees with you, but now the burden of proof lies on you

[acoustic cove]

Love is not something that exists. It is an idea we have constructed to explain certain chemical reactions

[acoustic cove]

No I’m simply using his train of thought to prove to him that based on his claims god does not exist

[inner shale]

Love exists @acoustic cove idk what are are talking about

[acoustic cove]

Most of the world disagrees with what? That love is a human ideological construct we made up to explain what the feeling of chemical reactions in the brain create?

This is a fact

[minor aurora]

That it doesn't exist.

[inner shale]

The issue with the argument lies in the fact that he says

God is love

Sure someone can think that and there is nothing wrong with it but he doesn’t believe in a inanimate god

[minor aurora]

the world disagrees woth that.

[acoustic cove]

Love does not exist. Chemical interactions exist. We just made up the word love to explain it cause we had no clue what it was

[inner shale]

Yes and the chemical interaction are what we call love

[minor aurora]

words exist...

[inner shale]

Chemical reactions exist
We call the this phenomenon love
Therefore love exists

[minor aurora]

inanimate?

[inner shale]

Love is inanimate

[minor aurora]

😆

[acoustic cove]

Intangible

[minor aurora]

tell that to your mom

[acoustic cove]

Ideological

[inner shale]

You are saying love is alive?

[acoustic cove]

Hey legendary bring me glass of love please 😂

[inner shale]

Inanimate = not alive

[acoustic cove]

Of course it is inanimate and intangible

[minor aurora]

i can't keep it in a glass, and I'm no-where near you, but I'll do the best I've got ❤️

[acoustic cove]

You thing it is tangible?

Are you trolling me know @inner shale

[inner shale]

I take it back I was thinking of something else

[minor aurora]

Course it's alive. My love for you grows stronger as as this conversation progresses 😆

[acoustic cove]

It means corporeal, grabable

[inner shale]

Love is alive…

U think love is alive

Wow

[acoustic cove]

Say hi for me

[minor aurora]

You betcha it is

[inner shale]

Lol wtf

[acoustic cove]

Alive literally or in a figurative ideological way?

[inner shale]

How can a feeling be alive 💀

[minor aurora]

figurative ideological.
Wdym by alive literally?

[acoustic cove]

Cause if you mean figuratively yeah that’s what makes it inanimate

[minor aurora]

Mayhaps what I mean by love is more than just a feeling.

[inner shale]

Mayhaps 💀

Im dead

Im so fckn dead rn

Omlllll

[minor aurora]

😝 good

[acoustic cove]

Love is the feeling we get when certain chemical interactions occur in the brain… nothing more

[inner shale]

Mayhaps

U kill me 💀

[minor aurora]

Does that feel good?

[inner shale]

Bro just got finished watching game of thrones

[minor aurora]

Nah, Love is more than that

[inner shale]

Bro just time travels from the midevil Europe

Mayhaps

[acoustic cove]

No more

[inner shale]

Fuckn dead

[acoustic cove]

He is asking for PROOF of god

[inner shale]

😂

Nah we ain’t skipping over the fact this man just said Mayhaps

[acoustic cove]

Not ideological indications of something bigger than us

[inner shale]

Dude said mayhaps

💀

[acoustic cove]

Proof has a much higher burden

[minor aurora]

ngl I'm surprised my jokes hit truthpowers so hard

[acoustic cove]

Proof. Like I saw fox create it and I have pictures, evidence etc

[inner shale]

Mayhaps 💀

[minor aurora]

you trust pictures?

[acoustic cove]

God* why did it autocorrect to fox 😂

[acoustic cove]

Hey if you want to go into that go to my flat earth forum 🙂

[minor aurora]

I don't think I'd trust pictures nowadays

[acoustic cove]

Cause no NASA fakes all the pictures

The earth is flat wake up people

[inner shale]

@minor aurora proof of god here 👇

[acoustic cove]

I can prove the earth is flat. If I put a post it on the ground it’s staying flat!

[minor aurora]

God:=Prime Reality
QED

[inner shale]

What

[minor aurora]

That's my proof

[inner shale]

😆 what

That is two words

[acoustic cove]

God is discord! There proof he exists

Come on man

[minor aurora]

come on what?

[inner shale]

If god is discord and only discord then god does exist yes

[acoustic cove]

Legendary is probably an atheist trolling

[inner shale]

Probably

[minor aurora]

Like you two?

[inner shale]

Prime reality wtf does that mean

[acoustic cove]

I’m not an atheist

[minor aurora]

First thing to exist

🙂

[inner shale]

For all literal purposes we are atheists

[inner shale]

Why

[acoustic cove]

I AM NOT AN ATHEIST

[minor aurora]

for discussion purposes it doesn't matter

[inner shale]

Lol ok ok shut it

😂

[minor aurora]

labels usually don't make much difference anyways.

[inner shale]

I hate hearing agnostic cuz ppl misrepresent it

[acoustic cove]

fuck no one is asking what I believe in to say “your mom”? 😦

[minor aurora]

and certainly shouldn't here.

[inner shale]

Lol then leave

If what your saying doesn’t matter then leave

[minor aurora]

?? Bro i don't think you're tracking

[acoustic cove]

God is science

Then sure I believe

[inner shale]

Yes me too

[acoustic cove]

Just make the Bible into confetti

[inner shale]

Whooooo yeaaaa

[minor aurora]

It doesn't matter whether we say we're atheists, or agnostics or christians, or martians, etc. We aren't discussing ourselves or our beliefs

[inner shale]

Yea but u are saying god = first thing to exist

Prove it

[minor aurora]

prove what exactly?

[inner shale]

.

😆

[acoustic cove]

Well he defines god AS the first thing to exist lol

Therefore it MUST be true

As it’s the definition 😂

[minor aurora]

Precisely

[inner shale]

Ohhh dang u right

[acoustic cove]

Proof he is trolling

[inner shale]

So god is the universe?

0:

[minor aurora]

call me a circle one more time

[inner shale]

Wut

[minor aurora]

how's that?

[acoustic cove]

Where in the curve are we

Aise i feel like I’m in the valley of despair with some stuff I’ve seen here 😂

It was a hard fall after Mt stupid

[minor aurora]

Clearly the argument is circular as all getout, (the use of what you call "fallacy" doesn't doesn't actually mean it's false, it simply means that it doesn't actually say anything, which is totally fine as it's still true by definition despite being a definition rather than a proof derived from definitions)

[acoustic cove]

Thé why say it as proof? You said this forum is only for proofs earlier

[minor aurora]

and seeing as you've been talking about circular arguments before, i thought it was an opportune time to post that age old meme of the triangle mocking the circle

[inner shale]

@acoustic cove u can deal with him Lmao

[minor aurora]

and i happen to love the threatening connotations of the meme as well

[acoustic cove]

I’m watching a movie

[minor aurora]

does that answer your "wut" satisfactorily?

[acoustic cove]

I’m not saying anything about you

Talking about the debate itself in general

[minor aurora]

sorry, was ignoring you and responding to truthpowers. Now onto what you were saying

[acoustic cove]

Oh oh ok

Nothing doesn’t matter it was a joke I thought you were referring to that meme

[minor aurora]

Firstly, Proof by definition is so trivial that some might not consider it a proof, because it doesn't say anything of substance. This doesn't make it not a proof though, it's just a reminder of the framework (read axioms) that we are proving the statement within.

[inner shale]

Hey guys

[minor aurora]

Ye?

[inner shale]

Off topic

Based on our discussion everyone guess eachothers ages

@acoustic cove

Is 35

@minor aurora is 16

[minor aurora]

I'd peg truthpowers at 17 and extremedi at 28

[inner shale]

Ok @acoustic cove ur turn

[acoustic cove]

Truth 17-19

Legendary 22-24

Legendary might have gotten us spot on

35? 😂

[minor aurora]

35 is pretty high...

[acoustic cove]

35 wouldn’t do a mom joke

[minor aurora]

bet

[acoustic cove]

Okay yeah I know 50year old who do

[inner shale]

Ok how old is everyone

[acoustic cove]

He got me

[minor aurora]

I'm 19

truthpowers?

[inner shale]

Dang almost said that haha

16

[minor aurora]

lol

that's funny

[inner shale]

@acoustic cove ?

[acoustic cove]

28

[minor aurora]

I was going to say 16 for you, but when you called me 16 I was like "nah, he thinks I'm younger than him"

[inner shale]

Wow nice guess legendary

Lol

[minor aurora]

so I figured you had to be at least a year older

[acoustic cove]

I was thinking 19 for legendary actually

The guesses messed me up

[inner shale]

U sound like a lot of my peers 🤷‍♂️

[minor aurora]

the guesses put me up to 22? lol

[acoustic cove]

Yeah