💣┇weapons-gadgets

[olive herald]

nama tama shooter for the cl 40

[feral pawn]

No, and if this was to be implemented, the time to recharge should be way higher than 10... I mean going from 8 to 10 seconds but getting a whole extra grappling hook charge will just be broken. Already now grappling hooks gain you more distance than 3 dashes do from spawn point. Besides, the grappling hook is already pretty OP as is, when it's used lights just dip completely and there's not much to do

[bleak copper]

immagine how cool it would be if they added an ICE grenade. It would be for medium, costing 600 coins (or whatever the currency is called), and slowing the enemy for 1.5s (effect would be cleared if any caught fire). In-game name could be 'Glacial Grenade' after all they already have pyro grenade so its only fair to add this.

[feral pawn]

not for medium, no, please no 💀

[bleak copper]

nah cuz all the other gadget r pretty shitty (other than like prox sensor but it got nerfed)

[feral pawn]

lol, what?

So we're just gonna ignore jumppad and zipline, which, if u dont have on several maps, ur literally just doomed. We're also not gonna mention defibs cause it's not like those are perma meta to have on every single team in the game. Or dematerializer with 3 stacks that almost every medium in the game above gold runs?

Medium has the best gadgets in the game, no joke, that's why you see a majority of all teams in this game run medium and often 2x medium or even 3x medium with 3x defibs. Sure, heavy and little have gadgets too, but I'd say mediums gadgets are way more impactful. So no, please don't give medium more stuff (that is OP) unless some of these things are nerfed more notably.

[rich flame]

3x mediums is the sweatiest comp you will ever see

lights get kills but mediums win games

but the ICE concept did get me thinking, ICE is also a pretty common cyberpunk concept, standing for "Intrusion Countermeasures Electronics", perhaps it could be a stasis effect that freezes things in time and prevents them from being interacted with

like you throw the ICE at a wall and it prevents it from getting destroyed or dematted

throw it at a door and now it cant be opened

or maybe even you can throw it at something like your own heavies dome shield to extend its duration and make it invincible for a short duration

[shadow onyx]

And you one hand it like you are from o block

[lusty raven]

this sounds super cool tbf

[oblique crypt]

Making walls/objects invincible or immovable is an interesting idea

Would counter a bunch of heavies arsenal though

[lusty raven]

yes... but if Heavy gets it, i think it would be fine

[oblique crypt]

True

[lusty raven]

bcs heavy is breacher and bunker builder

[oblique crypt]

Oooooo it would probably make goo invincible too

[lusty raven]

ye... i love the shuting doors trick imho

[shell sonnet]

i dont like the idea of limiting one of the games main mechanics

[lusty raven]

i do... if it would be easily recognizable and time limited

[rich flame]

yeah like make the ICE'ed stuff actually look like its frozen

[lusty raven]

especially if you had it in a form of grenade or a launcher, which would be able to block one direction at a time

[shell sonnet]

could also potentially cause problems

winch a cashout into a corner, goo, freeze, free steal

[rich flame]

it could be on a really long cooldown

[lusty raven]

or maybe... and this is just a modification....

maybe instead of making what it hits indestructible... it could instead force the original map layout for some time

so it would remove what isnt supposed to be on a map and force what is supposed to be there at the match start

[shell sonnet]

i prefer the idea of making frozen walls briddle and be able to be destroyed by normal gunfire
playing into the finals gimik rather than hindering it

engagement is better than stalling imo

at least for fun value

[rich flame]

personally i quite like the bunker playstyle, "fun value" is subjective

maybe glitch effects counter the ICE

[lusty raven]

true actually

glitch is kinda the "fuck up with whatever players may throw" kinda gadget and should counter the ICE as well

[shell sonnet]

it is, but you also need to keep everyone in mind that needs to face it
and being met by an invincible wall in the game specifically about destruction seems kind of backwards

[rich flame]

you could say the same thing about having a dome shield in a game about shooting people

[shell sonnet]

and whats the balance supposed to be anyways?

either the area is really small and you just step 2 meters to the side and it didnt do anything
or it straigh up covers an entire wall, which then causes problems for everyone that hates turtles

[rich flame]

well you would ICE anything important, like the area below and under the cashout

[shell sonnet]

and that is somewhat of a problem, no wonder its been nothing but nerfed, still remains questionable in certain aspects atm

[deep kite]

best weapon for light?

[placid slate]

m11 or xp best generalists

[deep kite]

how is the m26 or the arn??

[placid slate]

m26 cant say much about, dont see it often and i havent used it enough to give a proper opinion. ARN is basically if the range on the xp isnt cutting it for you

[tidal moat]

i just learn the genuine joys of turning off melee aim assist for dagger its sooo much better

[weak kernel]

the APS used to more or less serve this function outside of the hammer (which also helped to make the hammer more appealing) but yeah the demat has really had a messy effect on the gadget balance of the rest of the game. it just makes it too easy for a team to mindlessly breach or make/utilize angles with very little downside

[junior plaza]

Don’t know if this is a hot take or not but I think the motion sensor is better than the sonar grenade

[slender bear]

It depends a lot on whether you prefer bypassing line of sight or having infinite duration. For general purposes though, I would still say that proximity sensor is better.

[shut bane]

Sonar grenade is a bit more practical in quick engagements than motion sensor imo

[junior plaza]

I bounce around light and medium a lot but whenever I play medium the sensors feel like a must have

[tranquil rose]

Sonar are def better, it's capacable of detecting in different floor levels

motion sensor can't detect anything that is below or above the floor

Which let's be real, is REALLY important to know

[rough marsh]

I think we need more offensive gadgets, all gadgets are mostly classified as utility or defence

[errant jungle]

Advice for world tour loadouts for medium and heavy?

[errant jungle]

Give the guardian turret legs

[errant jungle]

https://tenor.com/view/walking-gun-gun-guns-gif-16748937

Borderlands running gun gif

[pastel narwhal]

thats diabolical

[errant jungle]

The gun says "here come dat boi" when it activates

[pastel narwhal]

just some analog horror type crap

[slender bear]

Any interesting melee weapon ideas for light? I've thought of a mace, a whip, a stun baton, and a flail, but I'm struggling to think of many others.

[errant jungle]

Nunchucks
Tomahawks
Brass knuckles (could be for heavy instead)

[slender bear]

I don't know how I didn't think of nunchucks
:( that's brilliant

I think a tomahawk would probably end up on medium, but I love the idea of brass knuckles on heavy. They could get a boxing glove skin, or ORF! Themed cat paws.

[wide onyx]

Just buff sword. Only melee light needs

[errant jungle]

Give em a charged uppercut on right click that throws people up

[slender bear]

Sword buff yes, but some variety is always nice.

[slender bear]

It could have a special animation/effect if you knock an opponent out!

[errant jungle]

If you kill them yes
Maybe crowd cheering would be enough tho

[errant jungle]

I find the idea of this progression funny
Machine gun>shotgun>assault rifle>pistols>minigun>PUNCH

[slender bear]

What about a ringing sound like in a boxing match?

[errant jungle]

https://tenor.com/view/tf2-team-fortress2-team-fortress-soldier-heavy-gif-24947379

[slender bear]

Imagine if they actually gave heavy a double/clone like in pootis engage. That could be so funny

[errant jungle]

We can just dress the same
One with sunglasses and gun
Other without glasses and with a hammer

[slender bear]

Two heavies raid a building being occupied by another heavy who happens to be an rpg main

[wheat jetty]

Is their anny gun they havent nerfed the heck outa ...i hate running into suprises ..gun worked good before now its junk ...might as well have a new gun like water pistol ...adlad or rock trowing

[hushed moat]

Any guns light has

[wheat jetty]

K

[swift agate]

Tomahawk could be a cool thrown weapon for medium or heavy.

[tame heart]

Favorite loadouts for ranked?

[meager snow]

probably medium would be better

[swift agate]

Heavy should get a javelin

[slender bear]

Spear alt rework?

[spare sail]

WHAT HAPPENED TO STUN GUN😭😭

[swift agate]

It's good now

[spare sail]

I WISH THAT THERE WERE 2 MODES THE STUN THE U CAN SWITCH TO THE OTHER 1 WITHOUT DIEING LIKE HOW U SWITCH TO SEMI OUTO FROM FULL AUTO I WISH H COULD CHANGE THE MODE I LOVED. THE. STUN GUN

[swift agate]

Sucks to suck ig. Sorry you can't get free kills anymore

Looks like you might actually need to think about the way you play and improve at the game

[spare sail]

I use it to run not get kills

[swift agate]

Then where's the problem? New one is even better at escaping than the old one, because you can't be shot in the back. They can try to follow you, but you're faster, can use movement util, and can take ziplines when they cannot

[spare sail]

No I just like the old 1 more it was more op and they can still move with the new 1

[swift agate]

Ah, that's very straight foreward. Skill issue, git gud n00b

[spare sail]

The 1v1 me

[swift agate]

Nah

Just get better

[high timber]

I know who you are. -_-

[swift agate]

Oof

Caught in uh... 360p I think

[spare sail]

Wdum

[high timber]

the light player I LOATHE 😡

[spare sail]

What loathe mean

[swift agate]

Yeah that's about the intelligence I expect

[high timber]

hate but with a cushion

[spare sail]

Y u don't even know. My username

[swift agate]

-dont nerf xp
-give back old stun gun

All we need to know abt you

[spare sail]

Sniper better tbh but XP I still like for fun

[spare sail]

If u hate me now u. Should see me with sniper lol

[jolly bison]

Why is the FOV on the Holographic scope on the AK/FKAR is 78 but when using this scope on the XP54 the FOV is 68?

It's just weird and doesn't make sense. Is it a bug that everyone is just ignoring? It's really inconvenient...

[spare sail]

It's the new update deal with it

[jolly bison]

Did this really appear with the update? And if so, is it normal or did they just screw up?

[spare sail]

Yes

[jolly bison]

is this planned?

[spare sail]

Idk

[jolly bison]

If they didn't write about it, then it's just another pile of shit in own pants.

[proud kite]

Hey guys just wondering is there a quick emote button on console?

Like how on pc you can just press one button and it automatically plays your main emote

Is there a bind I can do for console or does it not exist

[glad valley]

Just quick tap the emote wheel button

It doesn’t always work though

[queen pagoda]

After nerfing the dagger they come up with this animation nonsense. What a joke
Nobody played with this weapon before, imagine now...
It would be interesting to have a concrete list of the most played weapons to the least played, in my experience on the South America server, worse than the dagger is only the Riot Shield

[gaunt lion]

shild...

[gaunt lion]

shild is literaly the best

[gaunt lion]

pair motion with demat and its baisicly the same

[neon slate]

What sights would you prefer for each weapon?

[gaunt lion]

i just use the looking glass for everything, exsept the repeter, i use the red dot on that one

[wide onyx]

Melee was too punishing for lights apparently....... So it had to be nerfed.

[neon slate]

What's the red dot one?

[slow linden]

Wild but it's a free country,being wrong is free too ig

[slow linden]

You cooked,curious what do you use on light?

[gaunt lion]

the little one

[hybrid dagger]

Please bring back the Stun gun

[sly lodge]

Can we get a option to change sights on weapons mid game

[sacred scroll]

Isnt it already back?

[sweet grotto]

Nerf the CB's fire rate.
Nerf Cerberus damage.
Nerf CL back to where it was.
Nerf defib:

• Either limit it's pick rate per team to prevent 3x Medium defibs or lower the defib health regain for Medium as a deterent.
  Buff Riot Shield or change it's mechanics.
  Buff dual blades, or change their mechanics.
  Bring back KS and other animation cancels for specializations.
  Add a grenade indicator.
  Put glitch mines on Light or Heavy and nerf them. Maybe have their do a burst of glitch, not a consistent one.

Overall, I believe this game is suffering from Medium's current style. It is designed to be able to do basically everything combat-wise, which is ridiculous. You want to snipe? Medium can do it. You want to melee? Medium can do it. You want to use a shotgun at close quarters? Medium can do it.
I understand that Medium is meant to be a Jack of all trades kind of deal, but it should be capable at most, but a master at nothing in specific. Instead, it's a must-have for sweats who want to optimize everything, and they get the best of both worlds because of how Medium currently it.

Medium can perform support duties:

• Healing
• Defib
• Mines
• Turrets

Medium can perform movement duties:

• Zipline
• Jump Pad
• Demat

Medium can perform combat effectively and indepedently with it's variety of weapons.

• You can have 1 person for long range.
• 1 for close.
• 1 for mid.

Medium is the problem in this game because it has essentially nill drawbacks, BESIDES area destruction... which can now just be substituted with expo canisters and grenades. Change how Medium works, stop freaking out about Light and Heavy being too strong, they both have very noticable weaknesses, while Medium really doesn't (other than destruction). It's infuriating seeing the 3x Medium meta, and it's even more unfun to play against. You made 3 classes for a reason, make them all a viable choice, preferably being LMH instead of a 3x of ANY CLASS.

Also, criticism is welcome.

[polar edge]

• cerberus dmg already reduced with getting 1 pellet removed
• CB Fire rate is fine since it already punishes you very badly when missing
• CL is a noob tube and luck weapon, you will have a scenario of either putting the enemy down in 2 shots or putting 5 shots and they will kill you with their 1 HP left
• Defib definitely needs adjustments, but what you're saying is "might as well remove defib from the game"
• Riot shield is in a decent spot, you can still counter it with melee or Flamethrower
• DB defnitely needs a rework
• KS needs that animation cancel other than other shotty
• i thought we had Grenade indicator
• i think Glitch mines having a health of how many seconds of it glitching people (lets say 5s) is decent rework
• medium is literally Jack of all trades, i don't think it masters in melee though, but long range can be an annoyance that i agree. and medium quite literally the support type character despite having some BS weapon, so i think they can't exactly nerf their utilities. Light is glass cannon, Heavy is defensive and destruction, Medium provides support. the roles have been decided. you could argue that basically make Medium weapon useless but make their utilities better instead

[obsidian nexus]

XP54 is ridiculous

[radiant vapor]

pls add some animations for sledgehammer

[lusty raven]

dont bother... the "criticism welcome" is there for the lolz... he copypastes the same thing over and over

just like the dude with the PLR skin...

cerberus rn feels sad... the effective range is like 5m max. After that its hard to kill even light on 3 shots, but people will still pummel it down until there are only ARs left on medium yet again 😦

[gaunt lion]

What is bro on about

[slow linden]

Complete and utter madness

[jolly bison]

How can you make Cerberus not a victory button? Even after the nerf, the range at which he can bite your face off is just awful.

What's more frustrating is that you're really trying to out-play him at fair ranges, but the dude just spit on you without even trying.

[slow linden]

It really only affects lights,people with perfect aim can shred a heavy but if the heavy is prepared and has good positioning you're honestly cooked as a cerb player,also light has their own free win button it's called the xp54,shit can melt heavy in 1.5 seconds to the body with enough ammo to spare you can probably kill a light to the body or melt a medium to the head if you so choose,I honestly think not running the xp54 right now on light is just throwing,while with the cerb it's not good in all situations,I'll admit it can be busted I'm powershift though but I only play powershift when I need to I think it's a bad gamemode

[jolly bison]

Dude, the difference is that when you kill with a tracking weapon - you try. And when you use Cerberus, It's like coming to a playground with a mortar and crushing the remains of children into the asphalt. XP54 is too strong, no doubt. But it requires skill.

This is more of a problem for mid-rank players. Because at normal rank, people have no problem melting someone's head.

[wide onyx]

What class do you mainly play

[plush harbor]

Cerb shouldn’t be as good as it is at frontlining

It needs to be tuned to work well defensively and not offensively
If you want an offensive shotgun model should be the one to fill that role

[jolly bison]

I play mid and light equally.

[plush harbor]

As for xp54, I personally think light having more options on a similar level would be better than nerfing it, but if you were to nerf xp I’d go for -2 mag & increased recoil OR -4 mag

and then alongside that, fix arn recoil and reload and quicken the quick reload

Then buff m11

Or rework light specs

[jolly bison]

We need to make cerb a close>mid range poke weapon.

Less instant damage - more burning.

More spread, but also more pallets.

the problem is that mid doesn't have the same mobility as Light with dashes in a shotgun setup.

In general, the Cerberus would be a more adequate weapon if it were a double-barreled rifle. In my opinion.

[plush harbor]

I’m fine with it being a poke weapon as long as it doesn’t absolutely dominate cqc like it has for the past season

nerf fire rate nerf pellet damage add back that one pellet increase burn increase spread

Now instead of being fast fire rate decent accuracy damage dealer it focuses on fire proc and chip dmg

Now medium has an option for accurate precise damage cqc or fire proc and support cqc

then rebuff util nerf pike and ar ranges

[sand monolith]

She gets it 🐐

[plush harbor]

hope ts game gets better next season so I grind for Ruby again

[sand monolith]

Maybe by season 20

[plush harbor]

Even though I won’t use the Ruby gun for heavy lol

[novel coyote]

back at it again: magic wand skin for the data reshaper… make it happen 😤

[polar edge]

at this point they need to put more TF2 like weapons/spec into the game

disguise kit for lights would make some funny shit

[civic forum]

Please add a cool animation for inspecting the throwing knives im begging you :>

[tranquil rose]

I can't tell exactly what would be the best way to nerf, since I still think -4 bullets might not solve the actual problem of the weapon: Easy to use with too much return.

Now increasing recoil might be a good first step, since it becomes a bit more difficult to use.

I do agree some weapons does deserve so more love, but it's important to nerf the xp so those weapons may actually appear (ARN is almost there).

[south plinth]

imo XP-54 should be the middle ground between M11 and ARN

A recoil increase + more damage falloff would keep it towards close-mid range where It should be I think

[tranquil rose]

It would be much easier if haven't put ARN in the game, but oh well

[tranquil rose]

Originally XP was suppose to be the great pick for medium range, nice sustained damage but with less burst to compensate the fact you're picking a safe option, while m11 was to be very high dps at close range. Now ARN appears to be this choice, making Xp in a very akward position of where to put it.

[high timber]

I suggest mag size decrease and more damage fall off

only problem with adding recoil is just that people just get good enough to control the recoil and you're back to square one

[tranquil rose]

Yep

[tranquil rose]

It's kinda hard to know what stat to tweak with it cuz you can't make it a worse ARN but at the same time it can't be too easy

[high timber]

I mean the weapon just needs a weakness

its archetype should just be a jack of all trades and a master of none. A general all rounder
The AKM of light, essentially

[tranquil rose]

Not necessarily, it can be good all around with no weakness but no strengths as well

[high timber]

yes

[tranquil rose]

To honest reducing damage wouldn't sound bad either, if took away 1 damage you're still dealing a full 544 damage in body shots.

[high timber]

Also imma be the first to say it, but adding more weapons to the game is gonna hurt balance in the long run. I think going forward we just need to make other options more viable, which does the same effect of introducing variety without cluttering the weapon roster

[tranquil rose]

Even if you miss half the mag you're still doing 272, enough to kill a medium

I gonna be honest that if they touch the xp I think it's completely fair to touch the mediums ARs as well

[radiant vapor]

dagger gents another animation while sledgehammer has only the default animation. :(

pls some Sledgehammer animations

[high timber]

I'm fine with the damage, because I feel like it should still be strong. It just can't level with shooting people at AR range.

• Decrease ROF by 5-10%
• Increase damage drop off at 20-40m
• Decrease mag size by 3-5 bullets.

[tranquil rose]

I don't think they should mess with ROF

I guess just tweaking a bit the range and the mag size is enough

[high timber]

fair enough

[plush harbor]

Don’t nerf xp into the ground again

S3-5 xp was just painfully mediocre

[high timber]

i dont think anyone wants that

[plush harbor]

Finally light has a good weapon that isn’t absolutely stupid as shit (lh1)

[tranquil rose]

93R?

[high timber]

I mean XP is creeping

[plush harbor]

you clearly haven’t read the Reddit or feedback channels

[high timber]

well, in this chat currently

[plush harbor]

It’s never been meta

[tranquil rose]

I guess why

[high timber]

I know how games end up when everything is nerfed into the ground (R6S)

[plush harbor]

It’s an alright gun but it lacks in ammo and sustain

[tranquil rose]

But like I said, medium ARs should also change with the philosophy of medium range

Atm AKM is sitting at 30m and FCAR/FAMAS at 35m, it's a lot

[plush harbor]

Akm needs its 4 ammo back

[tranquil rose]

I would reduce the FCAR and FAMAS range to 30m, give akm back it's 4 more bullets and stay at 25ms range.

So no more beaming from across the map.

[high timber]

93R is underrated af

[tranquil rose]

It's range is insane

[high timber]

its a silent meta weapon atm

[tranquil rose]

So XP still be competing against other ARs

[high timber]

also yeah AKM is like, slightly undertuned

make that shit have 37 bullets, fuck it

[tranquil rose]

If they reduce the range to 25m, yeah fuck it and give it 37

[high timber]

it does like no damage, might as well make it a spammy weapon

[tranquil rose]

It does like 20 of damage per bullet, though it has the highest fire rate of the ARs

The TTK is awfully the same beetween them as well

[high timber]

I mean its strength is that your damage potential relies on consistent shot hitting

[tranquil rose]

At 25m with 37 bullets, yeah it would be a very good weapon to have at mid fights

[high timber]

rather than being able to hit like 3 bursts with a famas or half a mag with scar

[tranquil rose]

Yep and those guns have very manageable recoil as well

[high timber]

honestly the ARs are in good spot tho

[tranquil rose]

Between them? Yes. Against other guns? Nah, they really need to be less tuned

[high timber]

give revolver fan the hammer
and then watch it become meta

[tranquil rose]

There's the skin though

[round mason]

[high timber]

IDGAF

[wicked anchor]

Honestly, it would be dope if they made it have an increased rate of fire when hipfired

[high timber]

increased rof, hipfire only and 50% accuracy debuff

[wicked anchor]

It already has an accuracy debuff when hipfired I think it would be fine as is accuracy wise

[vague verge]

as much as I love the m60, the buff made it so versatile that it feels like a waste to use other guns

[hardy dust]

Ehh

Its the most versatile sure, but gets outpreformed in a lot of different scenarios

[vague verge]

m60 doesnt get gimped as much at range like the shak, AND has more mag size
lewis gun.
deagles are great but there effective combat range occurs less often than the m60's
the SA just doesn't feel good to use anymore

[hardy dust]

Shak and sa do better up close, deagles and lewis at range, minigun in a good stack does really well, m60 is just consistently decent

[vague verge]

it's most effective combat range also happens to be the range that most battles occur

[hardy dust]

And it doesn't have that great of a burst

[vague verge]

honestly it seems that originally the lewis was is supposed to be heavy's FCAR so I don't see why they don't increase recoil as well as its damage

[hardy dust]

Its good but nowhere near overtuned

[vague verge]

I never called it overtuned

[hardy dust]

Fair

Im just saying its in a good spot right now

[hardy dust]

Well tbf fcar has basically no recoil rn

And recoil increases are never fun

[vague verge]

and i'm saying that it's the most consistent weapon in a class where consistency is iffy. what reason would I have to use anything else?

[hardy dust]

Because other weapons do better in the scenarios they are better in and by a significant margin

[vague verge]

at a minimum, rework the buff. at a max, buff the other options

[hardy dust]

Personally I think lewis should get a small buff/rework to be slightly better up close/midrange and slightly worse at range

[vague verge]

except the m60 is still usable in those scenarios unlike the deags, shak, or SA

maybe not so much the deags, but still

[slender bear]

My new favorite light combo is db with nullifier. You can grapple to close distance, and take two shots, then nullify them so they have to wait for you to reload. If you're confident hat you'll hit your shots, you can nullify someone who knows you're there, then grapple while they can't shoot or use movement.

[vague verge]

wow I hate you

[hardy dust]

Yeah, but that's the advantage of m60.
Jack of all master of none

[slender bear]

I despise db, but at this point I'm just going to abuse it as much as everyone else does.

[vague verge]

maybe a recoil nerf with buffed mag size, while lewis gets a recoil buff would make them actually viable sidegrades

[vague verge]

watch appoh brigade against that next

honestly tho they should nerf db dmg but heavily buff its reload

[hardy dust]

I think m60 shouldn't be changed. It's a good balanced weapon and great for new players to start with.

[hardy dust]

Db is fine honestly. It's not that hard to counter or anything

[vague verge]

the design philosophy of "less ammo = more dmg" doesnt work and that's seen in the old CL40 and cerb

[hardy dust]

Annoying when they sneak up on you sure, but that's just when you're not paying attention

[slender bear]

"Everybody go on game-feedback and ask for light to get deleted. Let's get this broken class out of the meta. Shit's the epitome of anti-fun."

[vague verge]

I used to like him too

but nah he decided to be the worst kind of person when it comes to these games

[slender bear]

How do you counter getting killed instantly?

[vague verge]

same way you counter sledge

look around you

[hardy dust]

You can counter them closing the gap on you

[vague verge]

unlike sledge you're more or less safe with your back to a wall

[slender bear]

All I'm saying is that if sword needed a 25% damage nerf, db needs the same at the very least. It has at least some ranged capabilities, and it one shots light players from further away than a sword can even swing.

Not that I think sword actually needed the nerf it got.

[vague verge]

sword felt unresposive and unfun to play against, the db feels the same but at the end of the day its range gimps it

[hardy dust]

Sword absolutely did not deserve any nerfs

[vague verge]

just make it like cloak/vanish bomb where one reduces the cooldown of the other when used

better yet put a cool down on sword dash after regular dash is used

[gaunt lion]

I think the sniper would be more balanced if it was projectile based instead of ray based

[slender bear]

It is projectile based after 50 m

[gaunt lion]

Who is using it after 50 meters tho

It's completely unnoticeable

[slender bear]

It's a sniper. 50m is pretty far, but you're probably still sniping.

Also, that's just a nerf. You're really trying to "balance" one of the worst performing weapons in the entire game by nerfing it. I personally think they should balance the XP by buffing it's fire rate to match m11s, then give it LH1 damage and the sniper's falloff range.

[gaunt lion]

[slender bear]

Exactly.

[vague verge]

THEY SWAPPED THE SPIN CYCLE TAC RELOAD AND ITS INSPECT

[swift agate]

"#1 Kyoto fan" pretty much explains the thought process behind wanting to nerf the SR. Of course a sniper rifle will perform somewhat well in Gigantic Open Space Simulator 2025

[wet night]

how are you suppose to use cloak

[swift agate]

With q

[vague verge]

repositioning

[woeful jackal]

What guns should I use on heavy nothing is seeming to work for me?

[boreal laurel]

The best gun for heavy right now is the M60. Deagles are technically better DPS-wise but harder to use. Flamethrower is great for pub-stomping, and SHaK is good if you’re good with medium ARs. And if you like bullying people with melee, there’s always sledge. I like KS-23 and minigun myself, but they’re both hard to do right. If you’re new to the game I would say stick with the M60 at first, then work on unlocking SHaK next and then probably Deagles

[graceful grail]

Use spear, trust me

[vague verge]

sledgehammer

or just don't play heavy

[woeful jackal]

I need to get my wins on heavy and I don’t like heavy but I feel with the melee I can’t get close enough before I’m dead and the heavy guns have to much recoil for me

[high timber]

I'm convinced some of y'all shamelessly want broken weapons

[boreal laurel]

Honestly I would say take sledge or flamer into the new event mode—there’s a lot of close-quarters fights to be had in that map, so melee weapons are easier to use. I feel your pain though, heavy guns do kick hard.

[icy sparrow]

@still magnet this is what good dagger animation look like https://youtube.com/shorts/ic0MONjH1Ws?si=Hesd7arTUQOE4gbJ
@spice oxide

[high timber]

Genuinely miss when lmgs were optimal options for heavy

[vague verge]

they still are?

[high timber]

I mean when paired up against sledge or mini

It's kinda like,why not just pick those

[boreal laurel]

Both the LMGs are way more viable than minigun. Not to say minigun can’t be good, it’s just not as good as M60/Lewis.

[high timber]

Are we talking about cash out modes?

[boreal laurel]

I am at least

[high timber]

Okay

[hardy dust]

I find minigun has more potential

[high timber]

I just find that when paired with a team and you're playing a closely knit support role

Mini gun provides really good utility

That it becomes almost a must pick if you're not using sledge (at least in ranked)

[woeful jackal]

Is mesh shield not as good as yonk claw?

[hardy dust]

Both are really good

Depends on your weapon and teammates

[woeful jackal]

Also sarge they should revert sword nerf of buff it in a way it does not feel usable at the moment

[copper hazel]

false btw

or the projectile has to be so fast so it wont even matter that it's a projectile

cuz like what's even the point of full projectile sniper that can only oneshot 1 class Only if land a crit

[gaunt lion]

How?

[hardy dust]

Just revert it

[copper hazel]

because as i said - or projectile has to be so fast so it'll be barely noticable or the gun will be completely useless on 40-50m range even

[gaunt lion]

Nvm I don't care

[hardy dust]

It wasn't a balance issue, just bad players complaining because they cant aim / high ranked players not wanting to play against a different playstyle/not a gun

So just skill issues really

[gaunt lion]

That's also not an explanation

[copper hazel]

it is an explanation. making sniper a basically worse bow is surely a bad idea

[woeful jackal]

Oh I don’t played ranked

[copper hazel]

but yeah ofc the guy who never played with sniper will be always right

[high timber]

Give sniper charge mechanic 😎

[copper hazel]

i mean it'll actually be a camper dream even in cqc

cuz if charge will deal 125+ damage in the body it'll be funny as fuck

[high timber]

Exactly

[copper hazel]

but it won't ever happen because of the balance issues

[high timber]

Balance around humor

[gaunt lion]

Go back to tf2

[high timber]

Gladly lol

[gaunt lion]

Il join

[high timber]

5k hours, another 1k won't hurt

[gaunt lion]

[copper hazel]

tf2 but another 1k hours hurts you

[high timber]

impossible

Sniper is in a weird spot ngl

It's kind of a weapon that just exists and it can only be that

[copper hazel]

you mean in the finals?

[high timber]

Yes

[copper hazel]

tbh i honestly think it's good in terms of damage, rpm and etc etc rn

[high timber]

If you pick sniper in wt or ranked on my team, I'm sending you to the shadow realm

[copper hazel]

but i don't like the fact that easier to use weapons aka repeater and pike can easily outplay sniper on sniper range with 3 bodyshots

[high timber]

Honestly, something like the kraber wouldve been cooler

[copper hazel]

but not me tho i'm sooo cool

[high timber]

1shot per mag, really steep bullet drop and travel time but insane damage

[copper hazel]

here come's the balance issues like shotgun aping with it and camping

no one would like this

[high timber]

Make it do more damage with range

[copper hazel]

so what's the point to use it even if you'll land one shot per game on 60m range at best

[high timber]

JK a weapon like would never work but it would have aura

[copper hazel]

yeah ikr

[high timber]

And we should balance around aura obviously

[copper hazel]

in this case sr-84 would be hard meta on lights already

[high timber]

It would be funny just seeing lights one shot each other all game

[copper hazel]

i mean yeah it's funny

[high timber]

Bro loading videos on discord mobile is so ass

Imma just assume you got shat on in this clip /j

[fresh pine]

just a lite with a sniper in power shift

[wet night]

I am either bad or there is just to much counter play to trying to be sneaky with the dagger

[wide onyx]

The dagger is not an optimal weapon. The skill floor is much higher compared to lights other weapons.

[vague verge]

30MM MAADI GRIFFIN FOR HEAVY

PLEASE

[wet night]

it feels like the general concept of be sneaky and get back stabs has to many counters so you take dash and try to get cheeky backstabs... kinda lame

[vague verge]

THE ROUNDS ARE THE SIZE OF A REDBULL CAN

[earnest bane]

Nerf xp54 revert damage buff

[hoary coral]

We need a clone ability in the game asap

[oblique crypt]

But it's super fun

[wet night]

It is. I have been enjoying it with the current event game mode

[candid bone]

tf2?

[shrewd scarab]

I'd love a new medium revolver
or pistol in general

[opal kettle]

Glock 18, Glock 18, Glock 18, Glock 18

[high timber]

I honestly think this game doesn't need new weapons for a while

Like what could they possibly add that wouldnt fit a niche or archetype of an already existing weapon?

You might as well just try to make other options viable

[obsidian nexus]

XP54 IS BROKEN

A LITTERAL BABY COULD USE IT

[slender bear]

We normally don't get three weapons in one season, so hopefully next season they bring more specs. They affect playstyle more than weapons anyways, and light hasn't gotten a new one since launch.

If they gave both medium and light new specs, all three classes would have the same amount.

[obsidian nexus]

with every +1 light in every match, the match gets 2x worse.

[shadow onyx]

fr. Scope for revolver like GIGN and some pistol as well

[shrewd scarab]

I feel like we should get an event that just
"Every class, every weapon/gadget. Lets see what happens"
I honestly think a testing ground like that could lead to weapons being potentially retooled & moved to classes that can use them better

or at least, have the event for the fun of seeing a light with a sledgehammer

[slender bear]

I've been saying that rpg is an inherently unfair gadget for a while. I feel like seeing it on light might be what helps people connect the dots on why.

[shrewd scarab]

lowkey I feel ya
but I also have a pretty solid idea on a sidegrade instead

hear me out:
"Stinger Charge"
Its a scrappy, modified Thermite gadget for Heavy and Medium. It deals very little damage to structures, and requires a good bit of aim, but when used right can absolutely change the game for melee focused builds
on Medium, it would help give support mediums running melee, and since it would be best to come with an RPG nerf it would also help weed out people using the RPG's damage as a crutch

[slender bear]

I love it! I just realized though that rpg already has a ton of skins and has been there from the start, so it would at least need to have the same firing mechanism.

[shrewd scarab]

I'd imagine a revamped RPG would focus more on the structure damage than player damage (probably smth like the CL40 nerf with reduced AOE damage)
meanwhile the stinger charge would take that lost damage and thin it into a wide, inaccurate but worthy cone of "I gotta get at least a quick melee's worth of damage in"

[polar edge]

put a charge indicator for weapons like sword or Backstab to know that it is charged

[shrewd scarab]

& let heavies keep their sledges charged!
they're the only one with a heavy/alternate charge that cant be held!

[polar edge]

bro making heavy the elden ring boss to lights

[slender bear]

After they patched out the bug that gave medium a makeshift grappling hook, we found another one that takes you to sky box in around 5 seconds! It's probably time for me to switch off of light. I was joking about medium being better than light at movement, but at this point, medium can have as many as 3 movement tools on hand at a time, and these bugs let them move faster than light does with setup. They can't keep getting away with this! D:<

[lavish nimbus]

Heidi’s

Sushi

Jsjsjje

HsjajjSj

[neon slate]

What sight is good for the AKM?

[tranquil rose]

Any of your choice. I suggest you checking youtube to see which one you liked the most.

[plain jay]

I'd say the red dot or the looking-glass but like paulolb said it's more of your choice/preference

[eager wasp]

whatever works for you is the best

[ornate scaffold]

AKM: Adder Reflex
FCAR: Red dot
Famas: Red dot

[plucky spade]

i can't believe people are askking about best sights

[tranquil rose]

Hey, isn't that a familiar face lol

[rough marsh]

I think they should add syringe gadget to medium, like, it will increase your or teammates health by 50 points for a small period of time, what do yall think about that?

[nimble lion]

Maybe for the light class?

[rough marsh]

Maybe, but I think it will fit medium better because one of mediums play-style is medic, and syringe increasing someone’s health sounds like medic thing

And facing 200 health light would be something between total abomination and total devastation

[nimble lion]

Yea but If it forces a light main to replace one of their lethal gadgets than it could work, because I see a lot of light mains use the vanish, gas, and pyro combo,

Idk, I feel like I'm not making much sense. I feel like i had point that I lost as I started typing 😭

[slow linden]

I feel like it would negate the necessary punishment of direct fights with light,someone can just use syringe and the overtuned xp54 and atomize everyone

[rough marsh]

Bad combo, gas and pyro nade are easily the worst grenades in the game, high elo ranks would just dump thermal vision or glitch nade and equip syringe

[slow linden]

Do not slander my beautiful Pyro grenade,gas is ass I entirely agree with that

[nimble lion]

I've successfully used both gas and pyro together. And had very successful games with them. I think both have their place.

[rough marsh]

Sorry, but there are just better options

[slow linden]

Pyro and goo are a godlike combo

[nimble lion]

I think its really about how you use them

[rough marsh]

1. Build a wall for a defence
2. Destroy your defence

[nimble lion]

Yes pyro and goo is goated.

[slow linden]

No,trap people in burning coffins

I do it all the time

[nimble lion]

When you put it like that it sucks. I like to have gas and pyro cause I can use gas to push people away from objectives and I can use pyro to burn gas if I need to take an objected blocked by gas.

Also If tossed correctly gas and pyro can create a explosion capable of blowing a cash out off a platform or other high ground.

[slow linden]

Step 1 fill room or hallway with goo in the middle of a fight,step 2 make sure escape routes are blocked,add pyro mines for seasoning(optional),step 3 immolate all who have trespassed upon your domain

[nimble lion]

Idk how to put a like on your message cause I don't use discord mobile that often but here (❤️)

Pyro mines are a dear friend to my heavy build :))))

[slow linden]

Or just block behind them and throw a Pyro grenade at their head and mag dump them

[nimble lion]

nothing better than winch clawing someone into my pyro mines )

[slow linden]

Run goo gun,flamethrower,Pyro grenades and Pyro mines,it is a very versatile loadout,it's only limited in the breaching department but if you wish to breach run c4 or rpg instead of Pyro grenades

This is my favorite heavy loadout

[nimble lion]

Ima try it tomorrow )) Ty. I currently run Winch claw, sledge, rpg, pyromine/lockbolt, and dome shield. I rotate pyro mine and lock bolt depending on the people I'm against.

[slow linden]

Try to goo gun people before you flamethrower them,should prioritize gooing the upper body but encase them if you can

[umbral meteor]

does anyone else get it where the gun wont shoot

[slow linden]

Is your gun also missing pieces of it's model?

[umbral meteor]

not that ive seen but sometimes when i switch back to the gun i cant shoot

[slow linden]

There was a bug that happened to me a couple of times particularly with the flamethrower a couple seasons ago where the front of the gun was nonexistent and couldn't fire,also when I switched weapons it would be welded to my hand and make weird abominations,my rpg and goo gun loaded flamethrower canisters instead of rockets and goo canisters

[plucky spade]

yeah

I'll be here as long as people have ideas like @nimble lion

[obsidian nexus]

nerf xp54

[icy sparrow]

@dapper marten ?

[candid bone]

NO

[obsidian nexus]

its broken asf, theres no reason to play any other weapon right now. + its the easiest weapon to use.

[candid bone]

its really not broken

[boreal laurel]

I main a variation of this: flamer, goo gun, pyro mines, RPG, and motion sensor. I find detection ability to be indispensable

[wide onyx]

Proxmidity sensor

[royal pier]

Recoil so low that the "challenge" is to not overcorrect and pull too much.

[royal pier]

Pretty sure you can override the higher burn tics of the Flamethrower with the other sources of burn.

I prefer Lockbolt - RPG (save for picking off runners) - and either Dome or Barricade (which you can burn through if they're close to it).

Spec can be anything. Winch is kinda eh just because it doesn't subsidize your DPS like Charge, or allow you to block damage while still burning like Goo/Mesh.

Really funny if you manage to Lockbolt right behind a team approaching you. Burn them, block in some way, laugh maniacally, cry when the burn randomly wears off too early.

[slender bear]

What's up with dagger's backstab? It doesn't function, and often gives no extra damage even when you hit somebody square in the back while they attempt to steal. I don't want to spend a whole second charging for buggy hitboxes and 15 extra damage. It has an absurd charge time and you are slowed down for all of it, and the end lag after you stab slows down ttk.

[smoky jackal]

no sword buffs is making this game a cod clone

[keen turtle]

I was under the impression that different sources of burn damage ticked individually rather than overriding

[royal pier]

I love melee, but Sword was the least fun to face.

[royal pier]

Oh hey we played together last night.

[royal pier]

It's hard to test if they stack. At one point I thought they did, but now I'm more on the side that they end up overriding them.

The problem with testing is that using a Pyro Mine/nade near a dummy is that they do regular damage in addition to burn. So obviously they'll die faster, but due to the regular damage.

[crystal seal]

hi

[keen turtle]

It was a pleasure.

I'm thinking that getting hit by a flame thrower + environmental burn, will stack. It's hard to find info on it.

[royal pier]

Yeah that is one is possibly easier to test. Put a goo nade right next to the dummy and try to apply both burns at the same time, then compare to just flamethrower alone.

[grim pasture]

how do i level up the rocket launcher faster? some games i get 1k experience, last game i got 300. but i used the rocket launcher more often. i have no trouble leveling the grav cube or the guns. just seem clueless on the rocket launcher and winch claw

[slow linden]

I feel that it does stack,but if not it's fun from a psychological standpoint I think it scares the shit out of people that a heavy is lighting himself on fire and detonating mines in his own face to kill them

[smoky jackal]

not as unfun as the constant xp metas

[slender bear]

Since people want a sniper on heavy, I have an idea. In order to feel like a heavy weapon, it would have to have some crazy damage (more than the SR-84), so it would probably 1 tap lights with body shot. This would be pretty absurd for a weapon, so they should give it a twist: make it a gadget. It would be a mounted sniper rifle you can place down, with low-ish sensitivity because it can one tap lights so easily. It could get 3 ammo per deployment, allowing for three shots before it dissappears. It could have infinite duration while deployed and it could have health equivalent to the mesh shield (or maybe dome). It would be really interesting because teammates could use it too, allowing for more team based play.

Also, can you demat enemy deployables (turrets, zipline, jump pad, and the like)? I know you can demat yours, but I'm not sure about enemy stuff.

[arctic zodiac]

Same people that need a crutch to perform 😄

[slow linden]

I'd have to say spear takes that spot the only problem is it's a rare pick,but it counters every other melee except for Sledge

[smoky jackal]

xp is peak crutch lmao

[arctic zodiac]

Thats what im saying lol

[smoky jackal]

ik im agreeing

[slow linden]

Truly,fuck xp54 users I fucking hate meta slaves,I hate people who are so greedy that they NEED to win every match,and if you beat them its like you slaughtered a treasured relative of theirs(they probably don't care about their family imo)

[slow linden]

Either a giant harpoon gun or an anti tank rifle I won't take anything else

[smoky jackal]

truly takes no skill to use and is just there to make cod brained kids happy

[slow linden]

Time will rob them

[smoky jackal]

i just wish embark didnt keep rewarding them

[slow linden]

Embark will learn eventually, I mean there is such thing as a high dps long range automatic done right,the fcar is pretty fair

It's got insane recoil and the recoil is omni directional

[smoky jackal]

the devs have had so many seasons but keep buffing if after nerfs. they cant bare to see the xp not be good for half a season

[slow linden]

Third time's a charm

[smoky jackal]

its obvious the devs have their favs, its just bias at this point

[slender bear]

They need to bring xp down to pre buff arn damage and make something other than a gun viable.

[slow linden]

Be funny if an unpaid intern nerfed the xp54 into the ground but it wouldn't do anything long term

[smoky jackal]

its funny they always buff the xp again after talking to top players about suggestions

[slow linden]

It really is throwing to not use the xp54

[wide onyx]

That's a bit of a stretch

[slow linden]

FUCK the top players,only a quarter of ruby has actually earned their throne,the rest are boosted players and a few cheaters

[slow linden]

Nah every other weapon light has is losing the close to mid range 1v1

It needs a major nerf the people who use it deserve only misery

[slender bear]

Why is thermal bore better for breaching, and why are breach charges better for destruction than thermal bore?. They are pretty evenly matched in just about all ways, but it feels like it should be the other way around.

[smoky jackal]

"im unique" plays only xp, invis

[placid slate]

It's funny how appoh be running that exact loadout while crying for sword nerfs

[slow linden]

I do play only invis,but I mainly use matter or dagger

[smoky jackal]

cod brain truly is a disease

[slow linden]

They're dogshit that's why they only use the most unbalanced thing and whatever can counter that thing they want it nerfed or removed

[royal pier]

I meant in general, but yeah the Spear is generally the best melee v melee weapon.

You actually can beat Sledgehammer, but you can't make a single mistake. The easiest method is using winch to interrupt one of their swings.

The most reliable combo is two stabs, followed by the spin hitting twice.

[royal pier]

Both suck.

[royal pier]

You can win without winch, but you have to hit with the first stab before the sledge gets in range.

[spare sail]

Yo hi

[slow linden]

That really only reinforces my point it's pretty broken for melee on melee,maybe even against some shotguns but I won't get into that before I do more testing

[smoky jackal]

sword actually took skill, the xp is just invis, play at range, and have some what good tracking

[slow linden]

I could tolerate and reliably counter sword at its peak,I cannot do the same when it comes to the xp54

[wide onyx]

Spear is not generally the best melee v melee weapon lol. Your argument of interrupting a sledge with winch applies to spear the same way. Except sledge kill combo on a heavy is faster than spears.

[royal pier]

Cerb beats basically everything at close range still.

I don't think the Spear being strong at other melee match-ups being that big of an issue considering how much it can struggle against Dash Lights and Demat due to the lack of destruction and burst damage.

[slow linden]

Filthy fucking roof campers

[slow linden]

Just run winch or goo gun to force panic and waste dashes,and I said SOME shotguns,the cerberus is not SOME shotgun it's THE shotgun

[royal pier]

The spin can't be blocked by Riot Shield, and I think Dual Blades deflect either does nothing or reduces it by an insignificant amount. Sword has to be perfect to time the lunge amd not get hit, which I have seen done, but only a couple of times.

Note that I said winch helps, but you can still win without it.

[royal pier]

Winch with spear vs dash Light still requires two hits to kill. Meanwhile Sledgehammer has the swing + Quick Melee combo. Although now you gotta be close to the max winch range for the stun to last long enough.

Sure, Goo Gun can force them to use dashes, but they get further after each one, meaning a single missed goo means they're getting away.

[slow linden]

Just sit in spin against light melee and you will win 90% of the time,the only time you need to play kind of smart is against medium melee and then against Sledge you need to put in major effort

[royal pier]

I'm approaching tier 8 with spear. It's not that easy. They can mash dash and escape the second spin.

Don't forget they removed the spin slide.

[slow linden]

Well yeah they can escape,but cmon. They're lights. They want that kill

[royal pier]

Because yes, before you could winch and slide spin towards them, but no more.

[slow linden]

They never run for long

[royal pier]

If they're the XP-54, or really any ranged weapon, they can just dash back while spraying.

I've had dome and goo nades, still not enough if they aren't total trash.

[slow linden]

I'm speaking purely about melee on melee

[royal pier]

Oh and backstabbing a spinning spear can be tricky since I can just do 180-degree turns and still hit.

[royal pier]

Doesn't really happen that often because we're in the pew pew meta.

[slow linden]

And the xp54 can do that to basically everything except for minigun if the minigun guy is really good

[royal pier]

Also, Light can always bail, regen, and be back before the Heavy even starts to regen.

[slow linden]

True heavys regen time needs adjustment

Shit takes years

[royal pier]

Typically I have Lockbolt to help with that, but it's a finicky gadget at times. One Dash also out-ranges it.

[royal pier]

It's like 19 seconds to be full when low.

[slow linden]

It feels like 30

I think regen time among classes should be universal

[royal pier]

Like fine, have it take 10 seconds to start, but then make the health come back faster.

Maybe don't let a single tic of damage below 20 interrupt the timer.

[slow linden]

Either all are long or none are long

[royal pier]

It feels like the Heavy regen was picked assuming they would always have a Heal Beam, but life isn't like that.

[placid slate]

See, I would consider goo gun, if goo didn't prevent the spin from working

[slow linden]

The mediums I get are usually brainless akm turret mediums

[slender bear]

Now that we have healing canisters in the game, any thoughts on making med gun spray healing mist so it's not just a mercy ripoff?

[slow linden]

True but it's better than nothing

[royal pier]

Whenever I foolishly decide to solo queue, there's like a 60-70% chance I either get LLH, or MMH with both Mediums being Demat.

[royal pier]

That actually should be fixed now.

[slow linden]

I think it would need a heal rate buff but yeah increase risk vs reward

[slow linden]

It wasn't I tested it with sea urchin the day they said they fixed it

[placid slate]

It's not, they fixed the wrong one again

[royal pier]

My friend who likes to heal now uses both together. That's probably why they nerfed the charges on Data Reshaper. They now pretty much always enter combat with a Heal orb to use on allies.

I know I can do the regular stab through goo. But I haven't messed with spin as much out of habit.

[placid slate]

Spin just doesn't work if there are a couple of damagable objects nearby, and kyoto walls for some reason

[slow linden]

I like mediums who actually play support instead of defibbing me into gunfire while running turret and running away,getting me farmed to save their own kd or just being dicks

[royal pier]

Their name is HealingBeamFTW lol. So you can guess their priorities.

[slow linden]

I run demat or turret most of the time but I only run turret with melee and I use demat to drop gas and glitch mines into fights

[placid slate]

Mfs who called themselves support mains are kinda goofy ngl, like what makes you different from a medium with a heal beam? Do they just picket the entire time?

[slow linden]

I don't like people who call themselves support mains and yet the only support they provide is the occasional defib(they either cannot or don't heal you anyway

[royal pier]

I liked running around with turret on a throwable.

Really annoying that they broke them again. If the objective they're on breaks, it goes to the center of the earth.

[slow linden]

Did they remove that?

I remember doing it with a fire barrel recently

[royal pier]

No it just pisses me off that putting it down requires you to be hyper careful to not break the object.

[slow linden]

True

[royal pier]

Cause otherwise it just falls through the world.

[slow linden]

I think area carryables should be unbreakable unless shot or meleed except for barrels

[royal pier]

Also you can end up accidentally exploiting.

[slow linden]

I want to kill a whole light stack with nothing but a chair

[slow linden]

Lmao

[royal pier]

Seems pretty abusable. I just want the turret to not phase through like it used to. Putting it on top of a goo can and throwing it used to pop it on top of said goo and it was pretty cool and helped close the distance as Riot.

I would also like a turret rework in the vein of TF2/OW where I have to actively maintain it.

[slow linden]

I think it'd be fair but yeah nothing should be falling through the map

[smoky jackal]

if we are gonna nerf the sword, we need to nerf the light db. 156 dmg in 1 shot is insane

[slow linden]

Real (don't nerf db it's balanced but hey why not be consistent)

[slender bear]

db does 156 damage in one shot from further away than sword can deal 60.

[royal pier]

I think the majority would be fine with that.

I would give the DB a duck bill choke that makes the spread a wide horizontal pattern. This would mean less single target damage, but more "AoE" damage.

[slow linden]

I think that'd be fair honestly

[royal pier]

I also just like the idea of it. I prefer interesting gimmicks.

[slow linden]

Would keep the cloak db barrel stuffing crowd happy while making the weapon more unique

[royal pier]

Might have to make the reload faster and adjust the damage down. It has to complete with the M26.

[slow linden]

Same,it's why I hate most ARs and SMGs it's harder to give them interesting gimmicks especially more modern ones

[royal pier]

But yeah if the M26 is the single target shotgun, the DB could be the team damage one.

[royal pier]

Careful, if Vicc sees this they'll start claiming you want to make those weapons worthless.

Wanting the generic hitscans to have gimmicks/more challenge = making them bad. According to them, at least.

[slow linden]

I sincerely hope xp54 is eternally banished to being worthless

[slender bear]

I think they should give Recurve bow they ability to curve arrows while ads. I don't think Recurve bows irl are actually made to "curve" their shots, but it's literally in the name.

[weak kernel]

finals playerbase not beating the "i just want light to be a nuisance gimmick class without saying that" allegations

[slow linden]

That's about it though

[royal pier]

How dare players who checked out this game due to all the gimmick weapons in the marketing want that to be the norm and not have the meta be guns with less challenge than CoD guns.

[slow linden]

That's what light should be yeah,poke,run,ambush,light should NEVER be able to win in a head to head direct damage trade

[weak kernel]

then stop all the finangling and careful wording and say "i don't want light to be a flanker, i want light to be useless"

because light is already that against a decent player :^)

[royal pier]

I want the M11 to be hipfire only with a "focus" aim like the minigun/KS-23/Deagles. It would make it unique compared to the other options.

As for gimmicks to give the XP, yeah that's tricky. It's the most bland weapon in basically every game it's in, while also often being meta lol.

Like the MP5 is basically the default "SMG" in most games with guns.

[slow linden]

You're biased because you main light,I'm not talking about flanking I'm talking about brainless idiots who just run at you while shooting and win because they're using the xp54,the m11 is still perfectly viable for flanking (if only it wasn't dwarfed tenfold by the xp54)

[weak kernel]

if they ran at you shooting and won you either got zoned out or you lost the gunfight lmao

[royal pier]

They could lower the base damage and up the headshot multiplier so that you at least have to hit headshots to be effective. At least that's something.

[slow linden]

I fuck with this

[stark dirge]

what did you guys do to the ak, it feels different

[weak kernel]

making the DB a team damage weapon doesn't even make sense, if it's not doing decent enough damage to two tap a player up close- how is it doing good enough damage across that wide pellet spread to justify taking that over just taking a single target weapon and killing people? Even the CL-40, as much as people complain about it, has literally always been a gimmick weapon against decent players, even when it was "overpowered"

[royal pier]

They "smoothed" all the ARs recoil, which has made them even easier to use than before.

[weak kernel]

the reason ape lights are obnoxious is that you know, subconsciously, that they're stupid for doing that and that you should've won the fight. I've been in that position. that doesn't mean lights should be punished for doing that it just means we're occupying a low skill bracket together

[royal pier]

Make the reload faster. Hell, make the player fire both barrels at once so it can keep up the pressure consistently.

[slow linden]

I was using the fcar and hitting only headshots the xp just has that high of a dps where the health deficit between classes doesn't matter,it can kill a heavy to the body in 1.5 seconds and it only affects the other classes worse from there

[slow linden]

Both barrels firing would be cool

[stark dirge]

easyer???! 2 weeks ago, i was playing awesome games with the AK, now i have a very, VERY hard time to have fun with the AK, it feels differnet, like shots dont hit

[royal pier]

Doom super shotgun feels.

[royal pier]

You might be pulling down too much to compensate.

[slender bear]

I wouldn't say light should never win in a direct DAMAGE trade, because at that point light becomes just the objectively worst class in the game. Ttk should always be lower for a medium fighting light though. It doesn't matter if light has higher dps as long as it's ttk is always the lowest. Wanting light to have the lowest dps and the lowest health at the same time doesn't hold up at higher level play because people's aim counters good movement. Light only has mildly better movement than medium (when measuring purely by how far you can go and how fast you get there), so lowering damage to be the weakest in the game will only work if we buff lights movement to be the objective best in the game.

[slow linden]

The only exception should be shotguns and melee

[stark dirge]

the AK was great where it was... so dumb that changed it... AGAIN!

[weak kernel]

i'm Consulting Ze Chart and if you're "hitting all headshots" with the FCAR then the TTK against light is half of a light not doing the same

[royal pier]

I mean I think you're touching on the core problem, that Light doesn't really fit in the main 3 person squad modes.

It feels like a 5v5 or 6v6 class. I wouldn't be shocked if the game started as that initially.

[slender bear]

Yeah, at least those have actual limitations.

[weak kernel]

a light hitting all headshots with the XP is actually barely faster than the FCAR landing bodyshots

[royal pier]

The only reason Light is seeing relevance in ranked and WT now is because the XP-54 is so nuts atm. If/when they nerf it, probably back to MMH meta.

[high timber]

The problem with XP is not just flat damage, it's sustainable and consistent damage with incredible range for an SMG

[slow linden]

On top of the xp54 having overtuned damage it has basically no recoil,I played only 3 games with It and averaged 20 ish kills

[royal pier]

And they gave it extra bullets for no reason.

[high timber]

Id just nerf mag size and damage drop off at 20+ meters

[slow linden]

Agreed it has way too little falloff and way too many bullets

[high timber]

Like you can just straight up beam heavies at AR range and destroy them

[royal pier]

Yeah at a minimum.

I'd still like them to reduce base damage and up the multiplier so that the damage can roughly stay, but you have to use that nonexistent recoil to hit headshots then.

[slow linden]

Just go play cod man you don't belong here

[weak kernel]

I have a feeling I'm more of a cod hater than you are, you're just spitting bullshit so i'm calling it out

[slender bear]

It was already good, I have no idea why they buffed it at the start of the season. I'm all for having light be workable in higher level again, but I don't know why they make the other weapons viable before buffing things that were already strong.

[royal pier]

Even more insane that they buffed it at the same time they add the ARN, the gun intended to be a mid range powerhouse.

[slow linden]

Nah you love cod,you love giving Activision and sledgehammer your money

[weak kernel]

literally haven't bought a cod game beyond 2010

gimmick weapons are cool, turning good weapons into gimmick weapons on a class that has a deficit of truly good weapons is stupid as hell

[slow linden]

Liar liar plants for hire

[opal kettle]

I hope that they make the ARN shine more next season

[slender bear]

He is actually right about that though. Xp is broken, but that doesn't mean it's impossible for it to lose out to something else.

[high timber]

You guys don't want an ARN meta lmao

[weak kernel]

ARN meta would be genuinely miserable

[royal pier]

I saw someone play Blops 6. Their guns (on controller) had more recoil than this game.

Idgaf if they're different types of PvP games, you don't want the above paragraph to be said about your game.

[high timber]

I'm telling you right now, ARN being meta would be LH1 part 2

[slow linden]

Things can be gimmicky and have a skill curve and still be really good,take the sledgehammer or the minigun for instance

[weak kernel]

sledge is essentially a fun gimmick, if you said they should turn the lewis gun into a weapon similar to the sledge heavy players would rightfully say shut up

[royal pier]

The controller recoil looked higher than everything but the LMGs in this game on MnK. This was the opening mission btw.

[placid slate]

Also the sword (former) and dagger (when it actually works)

[royal pier]

Another weapon that should probably have low body shot damage, but a higher headshot multiplier.

[weak kernel]

XP has some falloff and should probably have a little more. Light should be able to zone out people to an extent, as far as like, shotguns and melee. they shouldn't have effectively medium rifle range with light's DPS. I think Embark is aware of that which is why the ARN started so pitiful.

[placid slate]

Played a bit of bo6 when that came out, didn't feel the recoil at all when I wasn't playing snipers

[high timber]

Calling me a meta slave when I'm using the revolver before it blows up

[slow linden]

The Lewis gun should honestly see a nerf and a buff,I think it would be really funny if when you reload it you throw the dinner plate like a Frisbee and if you hit someone with it it does 40 damage but the weapon remains otherwise unchanged

[keen turtle]

was responding to a comment about throwing if not using the XP. Sorry

[royal pier]

Or have that for the ARN, then make the MP5 have an almost nonexistent headshot multiplier.

Idc how they do it. Just make it have something unique to it.

[high timber]

I take no offense, it was funny

[royal pier]

Oh man speaking of which, I've been pretty consistently beating meta crutch teams with the MGL32 and Spear recently. I would say it felt great, but only in a "glad we beat those boring fucks" way. It wasn't fun in the traditional sense.

[slender bear]

I honestly would have been fine with ARN's initial damage if it had less recoil and more ammo per mag. Idk why they tried to emphasize its mag when it can even be fired all at once, and even if it could it would only have <1/3 of minigun's mag.

[royal pier]

Kinda a shakey comparison since the Minigun tickles after like 12m.

[keen turtle]

whats the MGL build? I started the season with the goal to main it but fell off. I ran Goo Gun/MGL/RPG/Lock Bolt/Barricade

[placid slate]

Use charge n Slam, patches up close range weaknesses

[rough drift]

What’s the new meta

[keen turtle]

goo gun covers all weaknesses

[rough drift]

I haven’t played since last season

[slow linden]

I agree,they're fun to beat but hell to fight,me and my bros like doing dumb shit like running triple minigun and triple flamethrower with goo gun and Pyro mines and basically lighting the whole map on fire

Love seeing lights panic when the whole room is on fire and a heavy who is also on fire is rapidly approaching them with goo gun in hand

[slow linden]

Agreed goo gun highest skill ceiling and best spec in the game

[royal pier]

It's pretty flexible. Pretty much always Charge as the Spec, though. You can try goo gun, but it's really unreliable. You can goo the top of their body, hit them with the MGL32 in the legs, and you have no guarantee it'll actually do damage.

My most common loadout is Pyro Mine, RPG/C4, and barricade. You can also toss in Lockbolt instead of the Mines, but the mines are so good for defense.

If you time canceling Charge just right, you can for whatever reason send them flying forward right into ideal MGL32 range.

I always forget to clip those moments.

[slow linden]

You kinda need charge and slam for mgl to work right,you need as many disabling and direct damage sources as possible

Flashes,RPG, lockbolt

At the very least it's the easiest way for ME personally to use it

[keen turtle]

C4/Pyro Mine and goo gun for big stall potential. Its a great combo w/ goo gun

[slow linden]

I've done it it's pretty great

Has only failed me once

[royal pier]

Here's more random MGL32 clips.

[keen turtle]

Theres a content creator, I think Ekazo or something, runs it at a high rank. Great content. He runs deags no less

[placid slate]

Got a teamwipe with it while my entire team was dead and won the match because of it

[plush harbor]

Tickles 💀

[slow linden]

It doe NOT tickle and that's coming from a heavy main,I think the spread buff made it pretty consistent up until about 20 meters

[royal pier]

I can beat a minigun at 20m with the SHAK-50 and M60.

[slow linden]

Yea I nuked a light with gas mines once,they should really give heavy gas mines

[plush harbor]

This doesn’t tell us anything

[slow linden]

I don't know about the shak but definitely the m60 it's just an all around more reliable and better weapon

[royal pier]

That you shouldn't be losing a head-to-head fight against it assuming you're both full. Obviously if they have Dome down, don't take that fight. That applies to every ranged Heavy option though.

[slow linden]

Nah I can pretty consistently beam light from 20 meters unless they're using throwing knives,bow,sniper or xp54 I don't even try to fight those weapons at range I WILL run

[royal pier]

The hype around Minigun seems ridiculous when any weapons with good headshot damage just shit on it. I've spammed crouch and still gotten deleted by Revolver, Pike, Repeater, Deagles, Sniper, and LH1.

[slow linden]

Deagles definitely melt it that's true

[royal pier]

Especially if they have any form of cover to jiggle peek off of.

If they nerf the mobility of minigun, it's dead.

It's effective when heavily supported, and that doesn't describe the situation for most players outside of high ranks/wanna-be "pros."

I can see them making you unable to slide while spooling.

[slow linden]

I think it could use a crit buff tbh but the minigun is great it just relies heavily on your team and positioning (I'm about to show you two team wipes,one of which I had dogshit positioning idk how I got it they were really ass)

[royal pier]

I mean that second clip was them hardly shooting at you lol.

[slow linden]

Yeah I said they were really ass

[royal pier]

The initial death in the first clip was due to the Mesh cover. Then they overextended.

[royal pier]

Which is actually a good example of the way support enables it.

[plush harbor]

Minigun didn’t need the buff

[slow linden]

Yeah they really overextended

[royal pier]

Although you could just run the M60/ShAK-50 and have no downsides outside of them being moderately harder to use than the ARs/SMGs.

And I was kinda hyped for a possible HHM team comp, but one Glitch Nade or well placed Glitch Trap just destroys it.

[slow linden]

Nah it needed it but it's kinda obsurdly strong in a three stack(three of almost any weapon is obsurdly strong tho)

[plush harbor]

I disagree tbh

[stray night]

buff the LH1 firerate to like Open beta but only on irons

[slow linden]

You are entitled to your opinion,I respectfully disagree

[plush harbor]

The point of the mg was to have good positioning that benefitted you. If you didn’t have that positioning you shouldn’t have won. The range buff makes it just more oppressive for no reason

[royal pier]

I'd rather minigun not be a spray cannon and instead have slow moving but accurate projectiles with a bit more force at mid range.

[slow linden]

Give it perfect accuracy but make it slow projectiles with bullet drop 😈

[royal pier]

You know how in irl footage of the minigun from a distance you can see the tracers? Think that but at all ranges.

[slow linden]

Yea

[royal pier]

Way more interesting and unique.

They could even take away headshots if they're worried about mid range being too good when players master leading their shots.

[slow linden]

I agree entirely but it's got enough of a gimmick and skill curve to be fun,it's just the things that counter it REALLY counter it

[royal pier]

And I wouldn't mind said counters if they weren't easily slotted in secondary gadgets.

[slow linden]

You mean frag and Pyro grenades and Rpg?

[royal pier]

I mean Glitch making you have to commit to keep firing due to no access to
Dome/Mesh/anything defensive.

[slow linden]

And lockbolt I guess,funny enough minigun relies HEAVILY on being able to move

[royal pier]

But yeah there's tons of options.

[slow linden]

I am one of the few heavy players who actually like glitch mine,I'm pretty jealous of medium tbh

Grenade tho? Yea I agree

Just give it slow projectiles,perfect accuracy and bullet drop and it'd be able to contend with its counters

[royal pier]

Ty discord app for not sending my post.

[slow linden]

Minigun should harshly punish both enemy and self for not correctly utilizing cover and angles,it's big,it's slow it's bulky,it's an easy target and it needs the reliability to offset that

But honestly I'm happy with it's current state,lights and disgusting comp players would only complain and it'll be nerfed into the ground if they buff it at all

[royal pier]

Minigun actually gets super inaccurate if you force them to flick to you. I have a video, but Discord is being stupid.

[slow linden]

Another fun weapon to be eventually gutted at the cries of insufferable lights,even their own fun weapons aren't safe because they eat their own

[slow linden]

Oof

[royal pier]

Gonna restart my phone cause it just refuses to upload.

[slow linden]

K good luck

[royal pier]

Eyyyyy it worked.

Terrible mid-air accuracy as well.

[slow linden]

It should be more oppressive,it's slow and bulky it should harshly punish bad positioning for both enemy and self

[slow linden]

It does have terrible mid air accuracy they really don't want you A10ing people

[royal pier]

Obviously, the more practical option is Anti-grav Cube.

[plush harbor]

Good. Harshly punish bad positioning by not allowing it to have range

[slow linden]

I didn't think gravity cube applied an in air accuracy debuff

[royal pier]

So once they potentially remove the ability to slide and jump while spooling, you can counter it by simply just walking away.

So another basically unused Heavy weapon.

[slow linden]

Just like the ks23 that thing desperately needs no spread and crits,could use a destruction buff too tho

The ks23 is my favorite shotgun of all time,and I was excited when in this game they gave it slugs but it just sucks

[royal pier]

I still feel like ya'll are overhyping the effect of the accuracy buff. It still loses to most weapons in a head on fight outside if that 10-15m range. What happens is that people hear it and the sound of getting hit is so violent that they panic.

[slow linden]

I think the accuracy buff made it USABLE it's still a very flawed weapon,few of heavys weapons aren't

[royal pier]

I don't think it needs crit, but 105 damage and them smoothing out the janky animation cancel change with Winch would go a long way alongside 100% aiming accuracy.

[slow linden]

I still want MGL to have sticky grenades as an alt fire

[royal pier]

Even with the return of the shot + winch + QM combo from when it released, it would still have a lower average ttk than many other options.

[royal pier]

I'd rather that just be a new Light weapon.

[slow linden]

I think anything that shoots less than 3 projectiles per firing should have crits

[slow linden]

Would be cool but I like the softball from titanfall let me have this,it'd also make the mgl a lot more versatile

[royal pier]

Finding the right value for criticals on the KS-23 would be a nightmare. I tried a while ago, and it was always either insignificant, or OP.

[slow linden]

140 crit keep body damage the same

[royal pier]

I want "aiming" on the MGL32 to show the initial flight path.

[slow linden]

I think this would be neat but I also want it to show potential bounce trajectory

[royal pier]

You think people are going to accept it doing old RPG damage on a headshot?

[royal pier]

I don't trust them to pull of the bounce trajectory.

[slow linden]

I thought old rpg did like 160 on direct impact

[royal pier]

But also 140 means either having to hit two headshots on Medium, or three shots like it already takes.

[slow linden]

I want headshots with weapons that are precise to be rewarding

[royal pier]

Nah was 150 at launch, down to 140 mid S1.

[slow linden]

No one complains about bow,throwing knives or sniper but if they suddenly gave medium or heavy the bow everyone would cry

[royal pier]

Tbf, the KS-23 also has destruction.

[slow linden]

Not enough destruction

I think it should be able to pierce walls and also two shot them

[royal pier]

I think instead of it destroying in 2, give it a faster reload at 3/6 like the 1887.

Cause 3 breaks per tube if it got aimed 100% accuracy is a bit much.

[slow linden]

But when it pierces a wall it doesn't damage it flashes the room

[royal pier]

Doubly so with a HS multiplier.

[royal pier]

Now you've just made a new weapon lol.

[slow linden]

I what if headshots would flash instead of crit

[slow linden]

Would be fun,maybe the ks23 us so poorly made it needs a full rework who knows

[royal pier]

I'd just take 105 damage. Adds quick melee finishes back.

Would make it possible to shoot - winch - QM Light.

You can do that now, but you have to land Lockbolt, then winch.

[slow linden]

The ks23 in real life does have the option of flashbang slugs

[royal pier]

But a stable 105 makes every build one less shot with a QM.

[slow linden]

The lights wouldn't like this

[royal pier]

In the time it takes to do it, a ShAK-50 can just kill them in 5 shots.

[slow linden]

They complain nonstop about qm finishes

[royal pier]

Whenever Light players complain about combos, I remind them that I could just shoot them.

[slow linden]

I agree I'm not siding with them I'm just stating a fact

[royal pier]

And the KS-23 is a slowish slug.

[royal pier]

Yeah I'm just giving you a easy retort when they do complain.

Though I did get not liking one 1887 blast with QM.

[slow linden]

People on Xbox servers message me all the time when I goo them,Pyro mine and them shoot it with a flamethrower they're always messaging me and they're usually lights

Few of them called me slurs

[royal pier]

The shock when the glass cannon assassin is made out of glass and fails to assassinate.

[slow linden]

I really think the average light is just a really dirty angry,toxic person that doesn't actually doesn't want the game to be balanced

[royal pier]

Wraith

[slow linden]

I'm stealing this

[slow linden]

From apex?

[royal pier]

Weirdly enough, never had an issue with Tracer in OW.

[high timber]

Because tracer takes 100x more skill than the meta light load out rn

[royal pier]

Yeah, same kinda player. The assassin archetype tends to attract agro people.

[slow linden]

I shit on her but I main junk rat so I can't really claim to be a good opponent or a particularly fun one to fight

At least that's what others say

[royal pier]

Some psych student should do a study on the links between certain personalities and preferences in builds/classes.

[slow linden]

Junk rat is not well liked

[high timber]

You really have to have insane game awareness as tracer

Also her pistols are very reliant on above average tracking

[slow linden]

You do, a junk rat could by flying in behind you 🌚

[royal pier]

Tracer also only hits hard close up. Meanwhile Light has weapons for all ranges.

[slow linden]

This is true

[high timber]

In retrospect, I think it was awful to not be more strict on light's range potential

[slow linden]

Dash xp54 is just tracer but infinitely better damage with less survivability

[royal pier]

They squished Tracer, Pathfinder, and TF2 Spy into one build, but without the limited loadout options of two of those things.

[high timber]

Bow and sniper in an ideal world should be on medium

[slow linden]

I 100% agree with this actually

Also why the hell can't I use irons on sniper,scopes are for the weak

[high timber]

I say ideal,because making this change now would have major gameplay implications

[royal pier]

They've been so meticulous with making sure Heavy is mostly close range damage with specs and gadgets to compliment that.

Meanwhile, Medium and Light.

[high timber]

Medium should be medium range and long

[slow linden]

Lights would cry and leave

[royal pier]

I've been saying they should try a new mode where each Specialization is its own class, then limit their loadout options based on that.

[high timber]

The cerb on medium doesn't even make sense either.

The model works so much better as a shotgun because it has decent short to medium range

[royal pier]

Like how they do in Limited time modes.

Only less silly when it comes to options.

[high timber]

Would be an interesting change

[royal pier]

Also, a way to help with weapon balancing would be to rework everything so that it deals slightly different damage to each build.

That would stop situations like how the SA1216 now needs 5 shots to kill another Heavy. My suggestion would have it take 3 on Light and 4 on Medium and Heavy.

[high timber]

Only problem is a lot of people would complain about lack of freedom

[slow linden]

I think it should have way more spread,way more pellets,way less damage per pellet and a stacking and scaling burn effect

[high timber]

And my lunch break is over

[slow linden]

I think fire SHOULD scale and stack multipmicatively based on seconds of exposure to fire surfaces and amounts of hits from a fire weapon

[slow linden]

Good luck

[royal pier]

cough Vicc cough

See the reality is that more options is often actually less choice. When you have access to everything, you tend to only take the best things. This means gadgets that are good, but not amazing, go unused by most people.

Would old 140 damage RPG be a problem if it was on the Charge class that only has access to the MGL32, Spear, Sledgehammer, and Flamethrower? It would certainly not be a huge issue.

[slow linden]

Only the truly free actually choose,a slave just obeys the meta

[slow linden]

I think flamethrower would be better paired with goo gun

[royal pier]

There can be cross-over

[slow linden]

Actually best paired with goo gun they compliment each other very well

[royal pier]

They could even take weapons from other builds if they wouldn't be OP on a certain spec.

[slow linden]

Like a point buy system like old cods??

[royal pier]

Eh, not really. I'd just limit the choices completely.

[slow linden]

Can't use a certain setup unless it adds up to a specific amount?

[royal pier]

Cause a point system here would just introduce a new problem of what value to assign.

[slow linden]

Fair that's easier to do and I don't trust embark to give everything the right values

[royal pier]

Whereas my suggestion just doesn't let you combine anything that would be oppressive together.

[slow linden]

Like turret motion sensor,glitch mine and aps?

[royal pier]

Like, SA1216 could also be on the Charge build, and buffed up some since Winch is no longer a factor.

[slow linden]

Cause I use those together and people hate me for it

[royal pier]

Yeah, the relatively weaker Turret gets access to the Glitch Trap that feels like bullshit when used on Demat/Heal.

I mean at least that has an "Engineer" theme.

[slow linden]

I use those,run dual blades,camp nearby,and when they get pinged I charge in if they shoot the turret I kill them,if they shoot me I deflect their bullets and the turret kills them

[royal pier]

Don't let any spec but Heal
Beam have Defib.

[slow linden]

I agree entirely I hate being revived into gunfire and being farmed

[royal pier]

I mean, I'll gladly face that over Cerb/FCAR+Demat+Defib.

[slender bear]

I think it would be cool if you were able to float up and down while looking in that direction in gravity vortex. That would give light a very niche but helpful movement option.

[oblique crypt]

As a melee user I second this

[royal pier]

Demat is bullshit, but if their options were limited to melee and DMRs, it'd be less BS.

[slow linden]

I mean yeah it's a unique goofy build,turret with melee is fun,it's like a security guard class or something

[royal pier]

While keeping the Specs tied to their current body types would be best at the start, down the line they could go wild.

[slow linden]

It pisses off smg lights though

[royal pier]

Like Medium body with Winch, but they only have melee weapons or something.

[copper hazel]

because balancing issues

[slow linden]

Medium with cerb but they only can use goo gun and goo grenades and fire gadgets

[copper hazel]

as well because of this - gun will be hard nerfed and no one would be pleased with this change after all

[slow linden]

Fair enough

[royal pier]

Yeah, shit like that. Hyper specific, but overall you end up with more variety.

[slow linden]

Scopes are a lot easier to use than irons tho

[copper hazel]

because of the factor like health
in this case any named weapons would be 1.5-2x times weaker than on light

[copper hazel]

false tbh
as well not for the sniper or any non-auto weapon

[slow linden]

I just kinda mindlessly spam bow and throwing knives and win trades with mediums,not heavies though and I guess that's fair

[royal pier]

This system would also let them put something like, say, Dagger on a class with the Heavy build, but have it function differently. For example, no backstab, but hitting the head does bonus damage (just not the super high backstab damage).

Lets players use already existing skins and animations, with a new experience.

[copper hazel]

i can understand if you can do this with knifes (to mindlessly throw them and win) but if you can do this with bow it's just skill issue from enemies and not a strong side of the weapon itself

[slow linden]

At that rate just give heavy a CO2 knife

[slow linden]

It is harder to do with bow but it's still possible

[royal pier]

I just like the idea of big dude going nuts with a small knife. Obviously they'll have to scale them up some, but I don't see that being a huge undertaking.

[copper hazel]

but not mindlessly
you actually have to aim preferably to the head to outplay medium with bow

[slow linden]

True but you don't with heavy,he's really slow and easy to hit,basically a free kill if he's not running deagles or m60

[copper hazel]

i mean ttk on heavy with 3 bodies takes over 2 seconds
as well bow's draw speed is slower than dodge so you don't have this much room for movement

[slow linden]

Heavy with a bow but instead of a spec you just get a sledgehammer

[slow linden]

Always aim for heads,body shots are usually wasted shots

[copper hazel]

bow has too many downsides to be useful and it pisses me off

[royal pier]

Eh, that might be too complicated. Ig they could have recharging uses of sledge overheads as a spec.

[copper hazel]

yeah but let's be real you will never land all the time two perfect headshots in a row

[slow linden]

Yea

[slow linden]

You'd only need to hit one then body shot

[copper hazel]

only meds
not heavies, it's not like with sr-84

[slow linden]

One headshot on a heavy is east enough

[slow linden]

I thought it was stronger how odd

[copper hazel]

186+124=310
not enough

that's why this weapon is barely used because it requires so much effort for not this much of a reward

[slow linden]

Well reliably headshotting heavy is easy enough

[copper hazel]

^

as well bow has this weird no-reg issue like sr-84 which feels awful

[slow linden]

You definitely can,heavy is too slow to miss

[royal pier]

QM finishes.

[slow linden]

This too

[copper hazel]

with the fact that many heavies are still running charge n' slam it's just too risky

[slow linden]

Especially from medium to close range

[royal pier]

It takes 3 hits from Charge to kill now.

[copper hazel]

depends which heavy cuz heavies with shotty/sledge are pain in the ass to fight against with bow/sr-84
as well human factor exist you can't be 100% precise no matter what

[slow linden]

Take risks,risk vs reward is the whole point of the game

[copper hazel]

heavy can land 2-3 shots on you with lmg and then just charge when you go up close and you're dead
as well rpg exists

[royal pier]

Shout out to one of the worst changes they ever made back in S3. Still haunts us to this day.

[slow linden]

Yeah fuck this change entirely

[royal pier]

Well, you are the assassin build. The Heavy shouldn't be shooting at you until you have a major advantage.

[copper hazel]

and that's my whole point - this weapon require too much skill and risk with not worth of it reward
it's a weird hybrid of sniper and TKs which doesn't know what it should be

[copper hazel]

if you're running bow you're not an assassin lmao

[slow linden]

Cl40 is an inconsistent piece of shit and all of the explosive weapons can direct impact for like 12 damage because of dogshit embark spaghetti code

[copper hazel]

people call everything a spaghetti code now?

[oblique crypt]

Hmmm, a specialization that simply gives you another primary weapon slot could be interesting.

[royal pier]

The linear explosion system absolutely qualifies.

[slow linden]

I mean what else would you make responsible for improper hitreg

[copper hazel]

bad servers that causes so many issues?

[royal pier]

Also, shout out to them barely increasing the MGL32's range in the same patch.

[slow linden]

If the servers are so awful why implement a feature that makes them feel worse

[copper hazel]

idk i'm not an embark employee lmao

[small mist]

Mean while i have someone shoot it in my zip code and i instantly die(light player) think your just bad dude XD

[copper hazel]

as well for some unknown fucking reasons it takes 5 fucking full charged bow shots to destroy zipline IT'S SO FUCKING ANNOYING

[royal pier]

This game also has a weird double server system. One for players, the other for the environment and the like. This is why desync is so high. The servers have to work together, which takes more time.

[slow linden]

Picture below represents you and anything you type

[small mist]

Prob cause bow has a low environmental damage

[copper hazel]

damn really?

[small mist]

Wow someones salty i made a joke cope more kid

[royal pier]

Tbf, it is a bow.

[slow linden]

I mean the flamethrower takes like 4 tanks to break a zipline

[royal pier]

Give Heavy bow, but they get heavy drop explosive arrows.

[copper hazel]

i mean in this case it'd be easier to do this with qms cuz like it's a 4m range weapon anyway
but bow isn't

[slow linden]

I countered with another joke,average light mains so toxic

[copper hazel]

that will deal 50 damage at full charge 🔥

[small mist]

https://tenor.com/view/yoskulls-fud-clown-gif-26802991

[slow linden]

I agree but some bullet weapons take obsurd amounts to break ziplines

[royal pier]

Have a brief delay before they explode for traps and for moments where players that get hit stumble back to their team, only to hit all of them.

[slow linden]

Lmao imbed failure

Get outta here dude

[small mist]

Meh it happens if you can read youd get what it says

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/knuckles-glasses-i-can't-read-sonic-boom-gif-16639389307809755599

[copper hazel]

imo non-auto weapons shouldn't be like that cuz holy fuck it's faster to kill 2 fucking heavies than to destroy one zip with bow/sniper

[small mist]

Ayy yo you to welcome to the illiterate club bro

[slow linden]

Reading is for weak people,strength is the only way

[royal pier]

Just punch it? Or take Thermal Bore since that can give you lines of sight.

[copper hazel]

some zips are out of reach (as an example the church on bernal) and i have no way to punch them
why the fuck i should waste like 5 seconds to destroy this shit

[royal pier]

Bore them. Kaboom.

[slow linden]

I agree,I think the cl40 takes like 4 shots to break a zipline? I needa do more testing but it's around there and it feels weird

[royal pier]

MGL32 takes one frag 😎

[copper hazel]

i mean this weapon shoots at least way faster than bow/sniper so it sounds not as bad

[slow linden]

Roof campers when I blow up the fucking church

[royal pier]

Yet eight to break a wall/floor.

Idk why the MGL32 can't break shit in 6 booms.

Though ig there might be times where I'd rather it didn't.

[copper hazel]

embark moment

[slow linden]

You break the zip line then have basically no ammo to defend yourself,yea it's not as bad but it's pretty bad

[fathom cove]

is the v9s declared a handgun stupid question

[copper hazel]

fair enough but at the same time if you have time to destroy zip you probably have time to reload as well cuz you're pretty aware of surrounding

[slow linden]

I'm pretty sure

[royal pier]

Lower the radius of the MGL32 a bit, up the destruction, give it just two damage "shelves" as they called it. One that's 84 damage, then another that's 50.

[slow linden]

All I'm saying is some automatics can destroy a zip line with plenty of ammo to spare,why not the slower chunk damage weapons

[royal pier]

Atm the MGL32 does 83 damage, meaning 3 nades does 249 damage. Idk why Medium requiring 3 max damage nades is so terrifying to Embark.

[slow linden]

Mediums embarks favorite class,they want it to be the best

[fathom cove]

NO ITS HARD ENOUGH TO KILL

[shell sonnet]

especially since you need to hit every single one of them almost directly

[fathom cove]

nvr mind mb i read it wrong

[shell sonnet]

i had maybe 1 situation in recent memory where that would have even come into play, and that was against a medium on kyoto that refused to get off the balcony and i was allowed to sink all 3 nades right into the railing

[royal pier]

But also they like to baby Light, until they randomly decide to make Cerberus one shot it (until recently).

Also let's be real, the nerf barely matters. Oh no two shots on a gun with fairly fast RoF.

[shell sonnet]

i love that 5v5 qc is finally getting a little bit more traction, hope something will come out of that

[royal pier]

I'd even take 6v6.

[shell sonnet]

more chaos, fine by me, just not 3rd parties

[royal pier]

I'd take them killing the 3v3v3v3 format entirely if it means fewer instances of the team that got wiped first coming back for a easy clean up.

[shell sonnet]

i am a bit worried about constant objective jumping tho, cant ever cap if 6 people keep jumping on it over and over 1 at a time

[slow linden]

They do,the average light player is smooth brained rodent that can barely play lights strengths even when they're using lights overtuned weapon of the season

[copper hazel]

to be fair before cerberus was model

didn't oneshot but had 20m range of two-shot

[royal pier]

Yeah. Really they like to baby Light specifically when Heavy is involved.

[copper hazel]

this game will never be balanced unfortunately
i just want a reason for one light to be in team over any other class

[shell sonnet]

i think thats part of the "intended" balance in QC tho
winner of the first fight dies to the 3rd party
1st looser respawns and weakens 3rd party
original winners respawn and clean up, taking what should have been theirs to begin with

but its just so roundabout and confusing, which also makes it feel like it took way more effort for getting the same reward which just makes it unsatisfying

[royal pier]

Calling it now, they nerf sledgehammer regular swing so that you can't use a QM after to kill a Light. Then they maybe even make the overhead swing do like 145 damage and have a delay before you can QM.

[slow linden]

Yeah it's really gross they're trying to make light insta melt heavy and then are surprised when the other classes get hit even harder

[copper hazel]

i bet they wouldn't but might make goo from goo gun to disappear faster

[slender bear]

I found a use for gravity vortex! I don't know why they gave SR-84 spread while in the air, but bow still has perfect acuracy so you can make shots consistantly!

[royal pier]

In my experience, it'll often be my team quickly wiping one team, then right as we're going to wipe the other team, here comes the team that got wiped to clean up.

[shell sonnet]

that also happens a lot, i dont like any of it

[copper hazel]

"wow i'm a free kill just kill me!" type shit tbh

[slow linden]

Xp54 might as well be oneshotting lights with how quickly it kills,lights without one barely stand a chance

[royal pier]

Wouldn't change the already unreliable winch + swing + QM combo.

If you winch too close, they can easily escape the QM. But they won't acknowledge that.

[shell sonnet]

even worse, since you actually beat the uphill battle of 3v6, just to get fucked anyways

[slender bear]

I'm grasping at straws for uses tbh. I need to find a way to use it effectively

[copper hazel]

you can't
bow isn't made for the plays like that. it needs movement to be at least some sort of viable

[copper hazel]

as well there's like couple spots on certain maps that can allow this so i'm not even sure you'll ever use this

[royal pier]

Many Light players that are bad also love to pretend that Winch is super easy to land.

They will never acknowledge it being a projectile that will often not go where you're aiming if you flick and use it.

And if you get goo locked and die as a Light, especially Dash, lol.

I'll give Cloak a pass.

[slow linden]

Buff cloak it's poo

[royal pier]

You can absolutely dash from Winch on reaction.

[slow linden]

Specifically rework it's nerfs or just give us tf2 spy cloak

[slender bear]

I don't think that works. Average reaction time is usually around .3 seconds, which is longer than winch's activation. If you're really good it might be possible, but you'd still have to know it was about to be used.

[slow linden]

Could also make cloak not go down at all if you're not moving

[copper hazel]

it was like that on s5 start (you could've stand still in invis for almost 2 minutes)
it was an awful change

[royal pier]

If we're talking the 10-12m range (where the stun actually lasts long enough to combo), then I strongly disagree.

But also, once you know a Heavy has winch, be prepared for it.

[slow linden]

How do you not see them? I see them perfectly

Invis doesn't work on me

[copper hazel]

because on the start of s5 you was fully invisible while standing still
and on top of this - you could've been invis for this long

[slow linden]

It's also loud as fuck toss a gas grenade or something

[copper hazel]

only if you're like in 3-4m range of the guy who's invis
if someone's camping on roof you had no way to know this at all

[royal pier]

Cloak and invis in general should be completely invisible at range (outside of scope glint), then get gradually more visible tye closer they get. That would take graphics settings almost entirely out of the equation.

[slow linden]

I agree

If I'm within like 6 meters of cloak they should look like a watery blob

[copper hazel]

nah don't make an invis even worse somehow

aren't you the one who asked to buff it like 5 minutes ago

[royal pier]

They also need to make smoke and gas spheres like Valorant so that they're consistent for all players.

[slow linden]

No sound cue,silent footsteps,complete invisibility at range

[royal pier]

It's a buff at range. Atm I can see them with my settings from like 30m away.

[slow linden]

Cloak needs these dagger nerf also needs to be reversed

[copper hazel]

i mean who is using invis on range in current state
like yeah it's cool but 90% of it is needed in cqc

[slow linden]

Getting shot out of cloak should put it on cool down

[royal pier]

If they wanted to give Light more team utility, they could also make Invis Cloak an AoE that also works on allies.

Make Vanish Bomb personal invisibility only. Crush it in your hands or something.

[slow linden]

No you don't get to run away,you were seen,stay awhile

[slow linden]

Invisible heavies are terrifying