💣┇weapons-gadgets

[eternal lodge]

I suppose dev don't care to sell there skins

[coral sequoia]

CL40 is balanced haha

Wait until you see a good player with the model

[eternal lodge]

model same shit different taste

[uncut apex]

with model you atleast have to have good aim

[coral sequoia]

yeah

[eternal lodge]

yep but still wide spread and easy to hit

[uncut apex]

its has a super narrow spread, lmao

[coral sequoia]

You’ve not used the gun much have you?

[eternal lodge]

yeah but still a shotgun

[uncut apex]

you clearly dont know what you are talking about if u think its got a wide spread

[eternal lodge]

still wider than AK

so make it like a real shotgun not a mid range shotgun

[coral sequoia]

Real shotguns have an effective range of about 35 meters, that’s a shit ton more than the model

I like that it rewards precision in contrast to shotguns in other modern games.

[eternal lodge]

yeah I ok no problem with that, then what to do ? look like a waste my time here by the way ... I was hopping the best for season 4 now I not interested in this game anymore .... too many balance issue. lot of hopes fall in the bin

[uncut apex]

sure alot of balance issues, but model isnt even close to being a priority on the list

[eternal lodge]

not the most OP

[coral sequoia]

Who knows, maybe they’ll introduce the changes you want next patch!

I recommend taking a break from the game, there’s no point in playing stuff you don’t enjoy 🙂

[eternal lodge]

yep exactly I will ! cause right now it's not really fun

[uncut apex]

yeah just like alot of people arent playing until cl40 is nerfed 🙂

[sick dirge]

What’s the biggest balance issue, in your opinion

[pine grail]

I agree but the pike is aids

[eternal lodge]

• light is weak and don't have any really good weapons
• Medium is OP with all the gadget (Turret, APS, defib, CL40, Pike, Model etc ...)
• Heavy is still OP with so many health, charge, and flamethrower. you can do many thing whithout any penalty cause you have so many HP.

Every games with 3 body type like that fail cause there is always a body type OP when you try to balance. So I guess this is no different. they try but still not working Imo ! the simple example is when you play ranked there is only Med and heavy. the meta is still 2 mediums and a heavy. So I think there is a problem.

Not fun to play lead to super low player retention.
and the game die. end of story.

It's now 4 seaons they try to balance and everytime there is drama cause the balance sucks ... and look like dev didn't care ...
So I suppose let this game die

[distant flare]

I defo agree with you on this one, as far as video games go this one actually has surprisingly good balancing. Obviously some weapons are better than others but very few items in the game are unviable. There are also some very strong weapons in the game but they aren't so broken to the point where everything else is non-viable by comparison

There's def some buffs and nerfs that need to be made but all in all the devs did a good job on the balancing

[eternal lodge]

mouhahahaha OK ... if you want
game is good balance sucks

have fun on this broken game 😉 I will wait until maybe season 75 I will try again. if not dead by the way

[distant flare]

Lmfao if you think this game's balancing is bad you have obv never played call of duty in your life

[eternal lodge]

no I don't like this game at all so I don't care.
but I play many games that are balanced.

[distant flare]

Yk there is a very big difference between balancing problems and just being ass at the game 💀 Sure the pike and the med grenade launcher are strong but I can still handle them, clearly you cant say the same 😭

[eternal lodge]

mouahahahaha ! Sure have fun !

[distant flare]

😭 😭 😭

[eternal lodge]

when I see COD "Jesus" I don't have anything to do with you 😉 I don't like COD at all and I don't even talk about Jesus !

[distant flare]

You have to be like 12 years old 💀 Theres just no way

[eternal lodge]

yep sure 😉 have fun

[pine grail]

Real

[pine grail]

You need to find him maybe he’ll help your delusions

[dense oasis]

https://www.imfdb.org/images/2/26/Protecta.jpg

Protecta as MTX for SA1216 when?

[wooden maple]

Hey, anyone know what the explosive arrows are that I see people use?

People (I think lights?) fire these bolts that have a delayed detonation. Like an arrow that is thermite with delayed explosion. Seen in multiple games. Google has been useless. Anyone know what it is?

[dense oasis]

The Thermal Bore?

[wooden maple]

maybe? is it a gadget or weapon?

[dense oasis]

Gadget

[wooden maple]

Thanks! Light?

[dense oasis]

It's like a grenade launcher with a scope. And yes it's Light exclusive

[wooden maple]

ah cool thanks

[dense oasis]

Don't try to use it on players lol it goes through them without damaging them

[wooden maple]

oof

[dense oasis]

You can kill with it, I've done it. Usually against anyone taking cover behind the Heavy Barricades, and indirectly on anyone foolish, FOOLISH I SAY, enough to be on a crane, 'cause that thing breaks cranes easy

[mild crest]

type shi

[valid goblet]

pike is broken

the devs barely play their own game they play for one twitch stream and thats it they don’t play it when a patch comes out they don’t test things before pushing out of patch so they don’t have a realistic justification of how the weapons play every weapon and gadget should have use the original mentality with this game was to have fun, now its a game of meta abuse over and over again its a cycle that will never stop because they clearly can’t see what the player base sees

I been playing sword from the beta most off meta u can be and I just see a cycle of meta abuse each patch or new season if they truly want a player base that will enjoy the game , they need to actually do some testing with weapons and gadgets , please fix the bugs also I enjoy this game but it starts to feel stale when u just see the same cycle of what got nerfed this patch an what got buffed to high hell

[royal pier]

I think I finally understand why the KS-23 irks me. I keep wanting to have to lead way more than what's necessary. It feels more natural to lead for the CL-40/Knives/Bow/etc. because the amount you gotta lead is actually semi-significant. Meanwhile, the KS-23 require you leading by a very, very slim distance.

[royal pier]

I also think the dispersion circle/cross is incorrect when firing and jumping. It suggests it's way more accurate than it is, at least when used at close range.

[slim path]

Why dont they make a class that has the equipment and abilities of a light and the hitpoints of a heavy? Very Fatphobic to me tbh

[dawn granite]

Can we have a flash bang or concussion mine? Alternately, we could have a tar mine that slows and can make fire more intense

[nocturne bridge]

Best gadget is the one thats the best

[proven lance]

this is so cap lol

Negative nancy over here

[loud merlin]

🤯

[viscid ibex]

embark devs wtf are u doing with this game like when u gon nerf the model im tired of it taking half my health from 50m and it being so op bro and like u actually need to balance shi and not js sit there and do nth bec u think ur game is so balanced and good so please just listen to feedback and not just randomly change the balances

[distant flare]

Icl that shit is busted 😭 That thing has way too much range for a shotgun

[fleet brook]

I sometimes convince myself that this isn't just a place for spam of

Thing op bro thing op

With no nuance on how to fix it or make it better

I used to call it the light support group but now it's more of a I just lost to something in a match support group

Tbf I've had nuanced discussions but I feel like 87% of this page is just

"EMBARK x is broken fix it my life is in shambles because of it"

[distant flare]

Lmfao ur lowkey right 😂 But thats just how comp gamers are, we do wayyyy more complaining than anything else

I'll give the devs props this game has far better balancing than a lot of other competitive games

[shut bane]

hey embark wtf are you doing with "MY" game that "I" play, its not like you guys made it. tch

[fleet brook]

Tbf I play dbd siege and comp genre is the place for people with something they need to boast about at least on the level of willing to go to a discord

Overwatch

Jesus overwatch fandom is bad about demanding nerfs for things they don't like even if the thing isn't good

And smite it's the constant It's not that I hate feedback it's spam brain rotten "X is broken fix X" shows a lack of understanding about the game the weapon or people who just want to make something terrible because it's op rn

Or the "My fun" is more important than everyone else's fun types

[distant flare]

Nah the dbd hate is actually warranted tho 😭 As someone whose had it for a long time I can objectively say that the balancing on that game is horrible

I regularly get chewed out by my teammates because my build isnt meta

[fleet brook]

Oh it's abhoored but that's because the devs built a game that was meant to be horror but gave survivors op looping tools and as the saying goes

Gamers will optimize the fun out of games

So horror game devs now suddenly are balancing a comp asym

Tbf I'm a twins main they sold me the idea of a "rework" for 3 years then reverted half of it so it just ended up being a large bug fix

[distant flare]

Yo Ive actually never thought about it like that 🤯 Thats so facts, the devs never meant to make a comp game but they were forced into balancing one because of the audience the game built

[distant flare]

YO this is the quote of the fucking century right here 😭🙏 That shit needs to be on a wall plaque in every single dev studio

"Gamers will always optimize the fun out of games."
-Natastrophic, 10/2024

True-er words have never been spoken

[fleet brook]

Tbf that's the position most non comp devs are pushed into

Hence TCM older smash bros were supposed to party games that were made into comp games

[distant flare]

Also facts, Melee for example is one of the biggest comp games of all time but the balancing is atrocious because it was never supposed to be comp in the first place

The revolver is objectively worse than the pike because it does similar damage while only having 6 shots but that doesn't make it non-viable

Very few things in this game are non-viable, you can even pop off with the war machine if u know what ur doing

The heavy grenade launcher

[fleet brook]

Revolver has a less constricting sight but less range

[ornate tiger]

the thing that frustrates me about the discussion about weapons in this game is that people don't seem to realize how good a weapon is varies so much based on team comp, positioning, and how well your team is playing to support you

like the light sniper rifle or the heavy grenade launcher are basically support weapons but people think they're bad just because they're not good in close range 1v1s, the point is that this is supposed to be a team game and ideally you're not fighting those close range 1v1s

[shut bane]

Is anyone at the last stage of the battlepass yet, im wondering if the vfx on the sledgehammer are purple

[acoustic patrol]

Idea: Gadget: Wrecking Ball Flare.

Throw it down, unchained wrecking ball comes flying in from a random direction. Absolutely decimates the building.

[reef vector]

or normal flare, retro alien invasion happens where you are

[gaunt terrace]

Or like a giant tunneling laser maybe that drills and sets things on fire 🤔

[reef vector]

but flares arnt great so not really

thermal bore

[gaunt terrace]

I’m picturing a horizontal orbital strike. Or whatever direction you’re looking maybe when you activate it

[reef vector]

maybe

also y isnt anyone picking engimo its the best sponsor

[gaunt terrace]

Can I post links here btw? Want to link a Reddit post with an idea I had

[shrewd axle]

you can but no embed I think

[fickle radish]

did time to steal got increased in the last few months?

[sand monolith]

This guy played black ops 3

[hot kraken]

Will the heavy get a sniper too? What would you wanna see as a heavy sniper? Personally think they could pull off a high risk high reward weapon. Low rate of fire, high damage

[acoustic patrol]

I like heavy risk weapon, but I wanna see arena damage.

[hot kraken]

They have the shotgun that does that. But honestly if a sniper gets that ability it would have to be buffed

[acoustic patrol]

Railgun.....

[hot kraken]

My initial thought was musket

They have canons already. But this would have a sight

[acoustic patrol]

Too old. Game is set in the future where the weapons they are using are considered relics, railgun too new.

[hot kraken]

Or maybe a Winchester?

[acoustic patrol]

Specifically?

[hot kraken]

They have the old shotty for medium and a Lewis gun for the heavy

[idle reef]

counterpoint, sword and bow

[hot kraken]

Right

Literally ancient weapons. Spears too

[acoustic patrol]

Fair enough

But musket just doesn't fit.

[idle reef]

lowkey embarrassed I forgot spear I ran spear only for like 3 weeks

[hot kraken]

Another good candidate would be the auto sniper from CSGO

Low ammo capacity, high dam

[idle reef]

one could argue a throwable cube that reverses gravity doesn't fit, but here we are. It's a VR game show, anything is possible... in The Finals

[spiral pilot]

Nerf cl40, Nerf pike, Nerf charge damage and maybe add more slam damage. buff xp54 magazine or range

[hot kraken]

Would you use a musket? I'd like if the main draw of the weapon is that it peirces enemies

[idle reef]

I use every gun when it's added, plus I main revolver so I'd probably enjoy a musket for a solid few weeks or so

[hot kraken]

I think xp54 just needs like 3 more bullets if that at all

[acoustic patrol]

It seems unlikely.

[hot kraken]

Same. It would have to be pretty clutch tho for having one shot

Instantly have to reload. If they had gun game it would be a fun weapon

[idle reef]

150 damage with 2x head multiplier 🔥

[hot kraken]

💀

[idle reef]

gotta make that one bullet count

[acoustic patrol]

Yes because making a gun that one hit kills a light at decent range is not asking for reveiw bombing.

[hot kraken]

That would be pretty cracked. It would have to be up to a certain range like other weapons

[acoustic patrol]

145 damage.

[idle reef]

One bullet and realistically would have a several second reload time, lights can do plenty tbh

plus you ignored the fact that mediums would be 1 shot head which is even funnier

[acoustic patrol]

That would make the weapon a meme because if you have to piss off to reload or seheild. It would make the weapon useless in combat.

[hot kraken]

Ikr. I don't think that's a smart idea to make it one shot. but it sounds fun as a power weapon or maybe if they had a different throw away mode. I've thought for a while they could release abilities just for events

[hardy dust]

Holdfast musket...

[hot kraken]

Yuh

[acoustic patrol]

Hm, 3.5 second reload?

[hot kraken]

I can pretend to be a pirate ☠️

[hardy dust]

1 shot kill to the body, bad range and accuracy, 12s reload. 💀

[idle reef]

A musket in general is kinda a meme weapon in an fps game, be honest

[burnt canyon]

Cl40 needs more self recoil considering rpg showed how toxic the playstyle is of just shooting ur own feet

[hardy dust]

M2 is a bayonet jab..

[acoustic patrol]

Congratulations, if the dome shield wasn't nerfed, it would be viable 🤣🤣 12 second reload lol.

[hot kraken]

Bro add that tiny pistol from BF1

[burnt canyon]

You mean light shouldn't have a blunderbuss that causes the character to fly backwards when shooting?!

[acoustic patrol]

🤣

[idle reef]

nooo, light should be a machine gun that sends it flying

[hot kraken]

This sounds fire. I didn't understand that meant mouse two. Been on ps5 since my PC broke

[hardy dust]

Ngl a range melee hybrid would be pretty fun.

[acoustic patrol]

Ballistic knife.

[burnt canyon]

Ballistic knife from cod

[idle reef]

yalls braincells linked

[hot kraken]

Hell yea

[spice vigil]

paintball guns in new events that do like 5 damage

[burnt canyon]

Just let spear have a rework that lets you throw it

[acoustic patrol]

Long Barrel Double barrel for heavy, perfect match made in hell?

[hot kraken]

Ever see pepperballs? It's like paintball but spicy

[idle reef]

a paintball LTM would actually be fire

[acoustic patrol]

Y E S

[acoustic patrol]

Light work, no reaction.

[burnt canyon]

Explain to me why rpg was nerfed from 1 use 140 to 1 use 100 but cl40 has 4 rounds that hit about as hard with barely self damage?

[icy forge]

Lore accurate DOOM guy

[hot kraken]

Bro. Would you FW Ice Canisters as a grenade type? Sticky bomb (potentially) that makes sliding faster, on affected surfaces and another thing that puts out fire. Frozen doors must be destroyed until they unthaw

[acoustic patrol]

ROFL

[icy forge]

I don't understand

[burnt canyon]

The only thing they fear is you needs to play if you wipe a squad within 6 seconds

[acoustic patrol]

What don't you understand.

[hot kraken]

One is a weapon. The RPG needs to be weaker but stronger in others

[icy forge]

The 4 letters, I don't understand what you tried to tell me

[idle reef]

I so desperately want to argue with this about how throwing spears and close combat spears are different, but at the same time like... they gave it a javelin skin so I don't know what to think anymore. (Plus the fact spears are designed to be used with throwing machinery to actually really hurt)

[burnt canyon]

But it effectively has just been replaced with a spammer version

[idle reef]

ROFL = Rolling on (the) floor laughing

[acoustic patrol]

Rolling in floor laughing. Tip for the future, just google it.

[burnt canyon]

Our digital architects can technically fabricate anything in the arena afterall

[idle reef]

yes but consistencies aren't consistencying😔

[hot kraken]

Nah. The grenade launcher is countered by the shit nobody rocks. That's why it's hard to counter. But an RPG does immediate destruction to surfaces

[burnt canyon]

From my understanding you can destroy terrain with cl40 now

Well without having to require the area to be decimated already

[icy forge]

Lol, I didn't knew what it meant

[fickle radish]

you always could destroy stuff, but you need like 8 shots

last time i tried i think i used like 6 shots to destroy that blue metal roofs on vegas

[burnt canyon]

Seems reduced or at least on fortune stadium

Whereas the ksg seems to take 4 shots to open up a wall

[odd verge]

defibs need to be a specialisation

please I beg you

[random fractal]

If im in the wrong channel tell me, but i have an idea for the future

Suppressors for some guns, just like with the new red dots sights we could aplay them to some weapons and take the suppressor off from the v9s (or v95 im not sure) and the M11

And for guns i would love to see two of the, for the light class would be the Kriss vector and for the medium class the M416

For the heavy class i guess the chainsaw? But not the one to cut wood, the Lmg

[fickle radish]

ksg was always 4 shots except on relase

[burnt canyon]

That's funny cuz last season I grinded up to emerald 1 using 3 shots to open up walls consistently

[fickle radish]

so it was 4 first and then changed to 3

[icy forge]

Adding supressors as well would make the game look to much like cod, we would have to many options and it would be overwhelming for new players

[tender oriole]

New melee for light: Claws (like wolverine- can be a skin) m1's individual slash - m2's dual slash with a slight dash like while dual slash it goes forward

[fickle radish]

its already annoying being killed by an invisible light coming out of nowere with a shotgun

imagine the fun of being killed by guy hidden in a corner using a silenced akm

[eager wasp]

silenced sword

[burnt canyon]

Suppressed dagger

[noble ibex]

If only certain weapons could give hidden perks, like the sword can get a lunge(I know it already has a lunge with it's charge stance), dagger with silent steps instead of using the cloaking device. Medium's shield could offer a small shield bonus to nearby allies, dual swords offer an increase movement buff after deflecting. Heavy's sledge offers a small damage buff to devices (turret, mines, etc), the spear could offer movement speed or maybe a small weapon speed buff

[icy forge]

Agreed

[burnt canyon]

I'm NGL hot take but I don't really think this game needed attachments to feel good but adding extra perks to specific load outs just leads to this whole "catch up" system of whatever weapons get perks or bonuses might just lead to other weapons then needing perks to become relevant until it's a whole buff nerf perk system cycle

[coral sequoia]

Silenced sword

https://i5.walmartimages.com/asr/114fb63a-ffc5-4e1f-90eb-70f8aac2d2b7_1.43fa9e9d84a0bfbad4009b4ca31e610f.jpeg

[noble ibex]

Hmm fair enough

[halcyon brook]

Funky

[distant flare]

I feel like that's exactly the reason why people think they are bad, they are too situational. You have to specifically build up your team around those weapons and most teammates aren't willing to do that, as someone who mains the war machine I'm speaking from experience on that one

Still a blast to use nonetheless but finding teammates who are willing to learn a weapon they won't even end up using + adjust their build/playstyle to suit it is pretty unlikely

[vale obsidian]

^^^

weapon that rely on teammate is not fun for everyone anyways

[shell sonnet]

@vale obsidian
Someone else already suggested something like that
If we did that, it would compete (and loose to) model

Less damage, being a projectile making it harder to hit, less ammo

Utility from clearing mines and destruction isnt impactful enough

And (imo) it would kind of ruin its identity
There must be a way to get it balanced without changing that

Personally id be interested to see how rate of fire would affect it, because in theory it should allow us to tailor ttk to exactly what we want

[vale obsidian]

half damage is plenty enough to clear utill
and half being bonus on hit make the direct more satisfying

[shell sonnet]

Id rather have a strong but slow grenade launcher than leaving enemies at 5 hp constantly

[vale obsidian]

thats just how the game like to balance itself (light sniper)

[shell sonnet]

I know, but it doesnt make up for what it looses compared to model

Splash will be basically nothing (unless you want to clear util)
And if you wanna go for directs just use model

Not a good state

[vale obsidian]

i see cl40 as model that trade damage for utility anyways

model will be better yes but if cl40 can hold his own then thats balance imo

[shell sonnet]

But it wouldnt

With direct hits, cl-40 takes 3 shots, while model does 2
(While also being harder to hit)

And splash would need probably like 6 shots, by then youre dead

Is there anything wrong with trying to lower its rate of fire as balance attempt?

[vale obsidian]

model also have the same quo&quo "splash" problem as cl40 with paschal shot
so idk i feel like its around the same, beside cl40 only need to hit 1 more splash the size of a observable universe to kill the 5hp meds

and reason why i didn't want to tiger with fire rate is cus i feel like i have to play test it first to say anymore
(very bad)

[shell sonnet]

You didnt want to suggest a rate of fire nerf because you cant play test it...

But suggesting to half its damage on the only thing that makes it stand out is fine?

[vale obsidian]

the half damage change i think is best for what we have now cus i can test the base gun
but i can't play test the half damage change so i don't want to add more

[near scroll]

I always thought a handgun + melee combo would work very well on light, get up close to get initial hipfire shots then dash/grapple in for the melee finisher. not sure what weapons exactly, though we still don't have fist type melee weapons, so perhaps a handgun + brass knuckles?

in the same train of thought, I also really like the idea of giving heavy sort of an overwatch doomfist type weapon, where they shoot using hand gauntlet gun thingies (would fit a sci-fi season best) and also have melee attacks just punching people

speaking of a sci-fi season, I feel like a season with 3 laser guns would go hard, one of the guns could be a hitscan continuous beam, one could be a repeating blaster, firing projectiles and the last a chargeable gun, either projectile or hitscan idk

[icy forge]

I I always thought about a Doomfist like weapon but that punches with left click and does an explosion with the alt fire with like a 5sec cd

[near scroll]

like it shoots a projectile that explodes or just does an explosion near the user? also I'd like it to be roughly 50/50 in terms of melee/ranged usage so I wouldn't do your idea but it does sound cool, reminds me of the explosive hammer in killing floor 2

[brittle mortar]

https://youtu.be/j90nZ1-K-zQ?si=TuGSvfSRQNlM03th Guys, what do you think about this being a "sniper" for the heavy ?

[near scroll]

lmao hyper strikes again

rpg skin otherwise?

[brittle mortar]

Would be an option

[unique swallow]

Man I love cashout against 3 chinese CL user

[ashen hawk]

Introduction of Limit on no of classes in a team?
I mean, could reduce the triple med defibs, med cl40s, med pikes, light cloaks, heavy sledge, or almost any other triple that u coudl find in the game, so that things dont get so annoying (but triples like famas, m11, or lewis and stuff like those dont really matter tho)

[icy forge]

Would do an explosion in front of you

[near scroll]

give it any form of explosive jumping and i'm all in haha

[void edge]

Best weapon to pair with heal beam?

[near scroll]

the best all rounder pick is AK : lots of bullets with high damage, so lotta dmg/mag, and reload isnt so bad, so you can switch back and forth between beaming and beaming quite easily

then depending on your playstyle and your team's loadouts pike for long range poke, model for close range or cl40 for explosive spam are all good options, though those weapons will need more attention when it comes to ammo management

[timber sparrow]

Just learn the pike best ttk on medium at every range

If you aren’t comfortable with it just use akm

[stiff vine]

cl-40 can kill a heavy faster than any of heavy's weapons can kill a medium

[timber sparrow]

the sa12, m60, lewis, and 50 akimbo in question:

[covert parcel]

no dupelicates could be a temp gamemode to see if its good (or only implement ranked only etc etc)

Yes multiple classes (Yes triple M)
No same spec, weapon, gear (No x2/3 defib, no x2/3 CL40, no x2/3 HealBeam)

[stiff vine]

You need perfect aim to contend using those guns and I'm pretty sure cl still kills faster

[restive plover]

Neither of these things are true.

[timber sparrow]

It doesnt and that excludes headshots,

Only body shots compared to only directs on the cl40 they kill faster than the cl40

[inner comet]

Is this a good idea? Obviously just a rough collection of ideas, but I think it has potential. I wouldn't make it season 5/6 tho because it would be to soon after the s3 Japan

[restive plover]

Cl40 and model are pretty inefficient with heal beam due to excessive down time.

[timber sparrow]

Model and healbeam pair exceptionally well

cl40 well its really not that good. More or less takes no skill to use so anyone can be good with it

My dog dropped a 20 bomb with it

[hazy spoke]

taking away matchup possibilities is the worst you can do. its about versatility and games that are unique everytime.
we know that it isnt that versatile right now because of bad balancing. but forcing comps would take the posibillity of high versatility every game.
the best solution to equalize pick rates would be to buff specs and add specs to the classes that bring a VERY HIGH value to the fight (even if its something like raw damage (charge and slam) every spec needs such a different playstile to counter it) which is making specs the perfect medium to adjust class value and therefore pick rates. (light will still be most played bc of fun factor, but maybe you could run him at high elo someday)

[stiff vine]

i want to see you try and fight against a cl-40 dude jumping and sliding around while you have to be hunkered in 1 place having to aim and make sure every shot hits

[covert parcel]

as a temporary gamemode

if its competitavely viable implement it into rank but not casual
if its not viable in anything dont implement it

just as an extra gamemode see how it goes, never as a "this is permanant"

[stiff vine]

3 direct hits from cl-40 kill a heavy and 3 near hits leave the heavy at little to no hp where he can easily be cleaned by a teammate or any sort of damage

exactly

[fleet brook]

Lights weapons out dps mediums

[stiff vine]

lights have no hp tho

[fleet brook]

I don't think cl is even the highest DPS for mediums

It's annoying like all grenade launcher

[stiff vine]

sure the aimbotters that hit 100% of their headshots have faster ttks

you can miss wiuth cl40 and still 2 shot lights

[timber sparrow]

Its easy if im playing heavy

[fleet brook]

And grenade spam is annoying

I play junkrat in ow and played a decent amount of pre buff CL

Grenade spam is the issue

[hazy spoke]

i dont think anyone would like to be forced to play a certain class. imagine the insta locks would go crazzzzzy😂

[timber sparrow]

m60 has no recoil

[fleet brook]

And the fact this game rewards spam

[covert parcel]

i said dupelicate classes, no dupelicate gear

[fleet brook]

This is only really a nerf to medium

Heavy had spec variety (before sheild got old yellered)

[covert parcel]

temp gamemode just spitballing

[smoky jackal]

lights with stun/ invis nade get nerfed

[covert parcel]

also just do 2 M 1 heal 1 demat/turret

[fleet brook]

Good meds run heal beam

[icy forge]

I disagree

[fleet brook]

Turrets only work if at least 2 people have them

Demat is a kinda selfish utility

[covert parcel]

im not argueing that what

am i not writing correctly or are people illiterate

[fleet brook]

Heal beam is always useful and makes meds quick revive not useless on lights

[stiff vine]

dont mind them they are saying bs only to annoy. they said m60 has no recoil in defence of the cl40

[fleet brook]

Nah I'm just saying meds if you aren't stacked or if you want to ruin people's fun (which let's be real anytime there's a new game mode people try to make a meta for it for some reason) the only really viable spec is heal beam

[timber sparrow]

Bro flat out lied and said cl40 killed faster than all heavy weapons but alr

[fleet brook]

CL 40 should just have a lower ammo count

[covert parcel]

theres no role lock you can have 3 meds

yes duplicate classes
no duplicate gun / spec / util

[stiff vine]

how can you even defend the cl40 right now? its basically a better sledge hammer with a faster fire rate and range

[covert parcel]

funny

[timber sparrow]

Im not gonna defend the cl40 it requires no skill, but im not gonna lie that its overpowered

[hazy spoke]

ok this would be actually fun and would push versatility in the first place. limiting it in the last, but still interesting

[fleet brook]

Because pre buff it was one of meds worse guns

I'm not defending it I think it should have a LOWER AMMONIA COUNT to reduce spam

[icy forge]

Honestly, played the cl40 in s1 and they are not wrong, I read everything and honestly, you are just over reacting to it, try to find a counter instead of crying about it

[covert parcel]

ca thunk funny +1 ammo to CL40 and give it faster reload

[fleet brook]

But pre buff it was competing with meds better weapons which kinda got gutted

[stiff vine]

i cant believe they nerfed the rpg to deal 100 damage and made the cl40 do more damage than it in the same update

[fleet brook]

What you don't like your 100 damage on a 45 second CD that's supposed to be a "destruction tool" on a FORTY FIVE SECOND CD

[stiff vine]

pre buff cl-40 was mostly used in power shift to protect the platform

[fleet brook]

Jesus that quote aggravated me because I play destruction heavy destruction heavies don't want RPG because it takes years to come back

[timber sparrow]

Cl40 is really not that good

[stiff vine]

i read that and started biting my table because it angered me so much

[fleet brook]

Is it meds best weapon No

Is it the easiest weapon to extract value from at medium range Yes

[timber sparrow]

exactly

[icy forge]

I feel like for 3 seasons, the rpg was mandatory, as a heavy main, I hope that embark will had another utility gadget because now that they nerfed, I only use it in powershift

[fleet brook]

Is it a very spammy weapon ye but alot of weapons in this game reward spamming

[stiff vine]

its not the best in damage terms but it's the easiest to use and it confuses the enemies because of the particals

[fleet brook]

Or just make it a destructive tool by lowering the CD

[timber sparrow]

Its more of a crutch than anything. Once you start playing with players that have mastered the weapons they play, it’s practically unviable

No skill floor, low skill ceiling

[stiff vine]

imagine the rocket deals 90 damage but has bigger explosion radius and 20 second cd

[fleet brook]

It's a good entry level weapon kinda the point that the aks served until they were made just kinda bad

[fleet brook]

Arena damage but I get what you're going for

[icy forge]

For real, I don't use it much now that you can't one shot light and I think that's a good thing

[fleet brook]

Also I think it's unreal that light has better long range breaching and destruction then heavy

[timber sparrow]

i like rpg as a long range breach especially with suspended structures

[stiff vine]

what do you mean? heavies have sledge hammer... sledge hammer... CNS... sledge hammer...

[icy forge]

Yes, like 3 breach charges maybe a bit to much

[fleet brook]

I like it as well until I get slapped and rkoed by a 45 second CD then it's never up when I want it again

[stiff vine]

did i miss anything?

[fleet brook]

You got the KS which I guess.... exist

It can kinda destroy stuff not well but can

[timber sparrow]

Honestly gonna start playing heavy in ranked, love light but hard to have the same impact even when playing well

[icy forge]

It's still good but more situational now

[stiff vine]

dont you need half a magazine to break a small part of a wall?

with the ks

[supple oracle]

Sometimes more than half

[icy forge]

Yes

[stiff vine]

and why did they even nerf heavy's c4 to only have 1 charge and let lights have 3 charges?

[fleet brook]

Yup

[timber sparrow]

Also been loving the m60, actual laser

[fleet brook]

I prefer burst over sustained damage because cover in this game is everywhere

[stiff vine]

use sledge hammer... you can hit a burst of damage, then die because 3 teams are lazering you at the same time

[timber sparrow]

The c4 does significantly more damage than the breach that’s why

[stiff vine]

your opinion has been invalidated as soon as you were preaching for the cl40

[timber sparrow]

Cope harder, dont lie about the cl40 then

[fleet brook]

I just think it needs an ammo nerf

[stiff vine]

whatever light main. bet you still cant win a fight without your stun gun

[timber sparrow]

I dont like it as much as the next guy but i wont flat out lie to make it look worse

Havent used stun since season 2 throw pick gadget

Guys the cl40 kills faster than every heavy weapon (i love spreading misinformation)

[fleet brook]

Hmmm tribalism what society is built off of

[river tinsel]

When are we getting an auto 9 (robocop) skin for the 93R?

[timber sparrow]

That would be sick

[fleet brook]

Why do you think 93r needs a red dot

[river tinsel]

Because its irons are terrible tbh.

[timber sparrow]

Because the iron sights suck and having something over them would be nice

[fleet brook]

Just curious because it's been one of my Faves

[fleet brook]

I've honestly just gotten used to it for like 2 seasons

[timber sparrow]

Im fairly comfortable with its irons but id still like a rds

[fleet brook]

Plus with 93R it has good hip fire so I spend a decent amount of time un ads

[river tinsel]

If it didn't have as much jitter with each burst it wouldn't be so bad but tracking with it is terrible which is why they seem to buff its hip fire constantly

[timber sparrow]

i mainly hipfire but sometimes ads can Guarantee those hs

[fleet brook]

Also at the risk of sounding rude

Whenever we're talking balance you gotta remember most of the community is casuals and most people aren't even out of gold like 60% of the player base is gold

Or below

[river tinsel]

Embark have the chance to do the funniest thing ever and make a nerf toy skin for the CL-40 for everyone saying to nerf it

[timber sparrow]

Im almost at plat, would of had it but i literally got 2 unranks One of which never played the game right before rank up. Wish matchmaking is solo queue was more reasonable

Ranked as easy and the guy was level 2 with 3 wins 😔

[fleet brook]

Embark also has a rocky history with nerfs

Half the time it's just butchering something

[river tinsel]

But thats not what I'm saying.

[fleet brook]

Seige requires you to be at least level 50 before rank games are available

[fleet brook]

Oh I know I just don't trust embark with nerfing things or adjusting them over time

[river tinsel]

I think the issue is they look at the data spreadsheet of how often everything is used and just go "oh this isn't used much, buff it" or "oh this is used a lot, nerf it"

Its the same issue arrowhead had with balance in helldivers to a certain degree

[fleet brook]

Spreadsheet balancing will always lack context

[river tinsel]

Sometimes its just as simple as people like this weapon. Or people are too afraid to experiment with the "weird" weapons.

[timber sparrow]

Or sometimes the weapon flat out sucks like the dual blades

[river tinsel]

Tbh I don't know why they even added thoes.

[timber sparrow]

They were cool on paper, terrible TERRIBLE execution

[river tinsel]

I'd rather they let some weapons be usable cross classes and just let medium use the sword or something

But also make it so it breaks walls some how

[stiff vine]

cns light deals 5 damage per hit

[river tinsel]

Would the pike be nessary if they just let medium use the LH1?

[stiff vine]

and it does a squishy plush sound

[river tinsel]

I don't see why meds shouldn't also be able to use dual degals

Or the heavy be able to use the . 357

[timber sparrow]

The pike is just a better lh1 ngl

[river tinsel]

Embark have a lot of ex battlefield devs and like even BF3/4 had cross class weapons

But like I don't think every weapon should be cross class, just a handfull

[river tinsel]

Yeah so like why bother adding another gun that just does the same role?

And its not like it can't be done because I've literally had a bug where I was playing light with an ak

[timber sparrow]

So mediums can deal with lights long range

[supple oracle]

Except the revolver should have been that option

[timber sparrow]

It was in season 1 then they randomly nerfed it despite not being meta at all

Been mid ever since

[mellow gazelle]

Sounds like the cl40 in season 3 nerfed when it was never meta. Now that’s it’s slightly overturned I hope it’s not over nerfed

[timber sparrow]

More or less got a rework that just didnt work

[fair jetty]

did they change something with the ak in new season apart from the clip size? Idk but it just feels really different now

[leaden iris]

What's better ks-23 or SA1216?

[timber sparrow]

Sa1216

[leaden iris]

Thanks

[shut bane]

Ks-23 imo, range is just a lot better than the sa1216’s but you gotta be pretty accurate with the crosshair and ammo management

[vale obsidian]

just watch

@raven jungle how?

[bleak cedar]

Hey guys, how are you?, ive been thinking of a really interesting weapon concept that is not normal for games to have but are also really cool, the weapon concept i created is a bracelet that would be on your right arm, that would shoot small coins that deal some time of bleeding like damage(not sure how to balance that), it would have inf ammo but it would kinda of overheat. The overheat would be severe, but would be managable.
After that im not sure what to put as an extra to the weapon nor how damage numbers work, so i would like some help with it. What about this?

I would probably give it to medium or light

[icy forge]

Just like Scotty said ! Do not trust CNS ! Damn S¥S Horizon is glitched

[stiff vine]

the glitch box glitched your world

[vale obsidian]

it would just be a bandage fix like rpg :P

as a weapon?

[grizzled plover]

so goo gun but with aoe?

[vale obsidian]

why would you want that

[vale obsidian]

slow gun?

[grizzled plover]

as an april fools event thing maybe

[vale obsidian]

oh ok, people actually susgressed something like that and being serious about it before

i forgot what they susgessed

[grizzled plover]

throwing axes for heavy

[vale obsidian]

thats not a bad idea actaully

[bleak cedar]

What you guys think about this?

I really need opinions

[hallow leaf]

Imagine they being back nukes for April fools

[grizzled plover]

just make the rpg the nuke as an april fools patch but make it look "real"

and watch the chaos that unfolds in the discord

[hallow leaf]

or buff cl-40

oh wait they already did that

[grizzled plover]

lets be honest they did that to sell skins

[hallow leaf]

100% and if i didnt already hate the balance team this would have made me hate them now i just hate them more

this game would be soooo much better if they just got rid of the current balace team

[crimson wedge]

fire fighter outfit and fire axe skin for sledge when? The irony of being torched by a guy dressed as a firefighter with a flamethrower is to good not to happen

[shut bane]

Get a load of feedback chat lmao

[hallow leaf]

the one about the game being dead?

the only thing dead is the balance teams brains

[crimson wedge]

I prolly should have lead with this but a funny pyromaxing heavy loadout is the whinchclaw, flamer, baricade or dome, pyro mines, proxy sensor or explosive mines. I want to dress up as a firefighter as I fight with fire to really pull the gimik together

[dapper tendon]

What do you guys think the meta is? For each class

[lofty sky]

Yo why does the sniper get projectile but not the pike?

The same with the lh1 tbh

[hardy dust]

Light : Lh1,cloak,glitch,stun,gateway.
Medium :
Pike,heal,defib,jump,zip. (You can swap some stuff since stacking mediums is very strong and you won't need all the movement)
Heavy :
M60/lewis,c&s,rpg,c4,dome.

[dapper tendon]

What is c&s
And cloak over dash?
And heal over demat?

[hardy dust]

Charge and slam.
Dash is pretty useless against people who can aim well.
Heal is the strongest medium spec, but since running multiple mediums is very strong you can usually run both anyways.

[crimson wedge]

Iron sights or at least non-scope sights for the tracking dart and thermal bore when?

[hallow current]

Legendary Weapon Skin Idea for Dual Blades: ✨Nun-Chucks✨

Spinning Nun-Chuck animation for deflecting bullets 😃

[crimson wedge]

I wish there was a button to quickly disequip or equip scopes from the before match loadout prep phase, or at least see if a scope is on a gun to begin with. its a little thing but it still would be a nice QoL addition.

[lilac sphinx]

I Agree On This, its quite annoying to find out that you meant to remove the scope but you didnt. my thoughts tho

[shut bane]

Dual blades should have some increased movement speed and or a charged attack when attacking while blocking just to start off an attack more consistently if you can get close enough

[crimson wedge]

I'd honestly have them have slower move speed but better deflection and uniqe melee parry damage

[hallow leaf]

All dual blades really need are double damage on last attack on combo and better deflecting and parrying

[brisk lake]

they should rlly buff mediums shotgun to 1 shot heavies from 50 meters

good idea holy s***

[calm turtle]

Make it do irl damage

[bitter surge]

F-car has the hardest recoil pattern in the game.

[cedar coyote]

agreed

[valid goblet]

Sword is the best light weapon if you know how to use it , its meta

[spiral pilot]

nerf pike its way way way to overpowered in hands of decent players. and nerf cl40 ofc

[exotic skiff]

That actually one of the easiest

Just pull down that all

[fleet brook]

Burst damage

[fleet brook]

RPG is debatable

[hardy dust]

You could swap it for barricade but generally rpg is a stronger pick.

[safe oak]

Duals:
controversal oppinion incoming... I think the deflection is not that bad... the shooting at feet for full damage is not optimal, of course. In that scenario you have to crouch and loose all movement :/
What i would suggest as a step in the right direction is a bit faster attacks, and the ability to go into "parry" faster, when attacking.
at least it would help me out alot
I only play duals (cant aim at all with guns!). I've got well over 200 hours in game with them now.
And for gods sake do something with the cl 40. As a melee medium its just horrible to go up against. all others are fine, perhaps except heavy melee... but thats fine really.
All this, In my opinion.
ps: all other weapons without exception has had a tweak one or the other way. Please Embark team.

[fleet brook]

If you see a light in ranked (for some reason) then yeah but against a medium or a heavy

Medium can DPS / get healed / heal through it

Heavy is just thick

Also the CD is getting rough because it lost a decent amount of value

[hardy dust]

Its still a very strong opener + destruction tool.

[fleet brook]

I mean I play destruction heavy I can't really justify a 45 second CD on a destruction tool vs consistent value of barricades/ dome

[hardy dust]

And there isn't much competition in heavy gadget slots, barricade is the only other really viable pick iirc.

[hushed cloud]

dagger dash is just winning
prove me wrong

[hardy dust]

So it depends a bit on your playstyle too.

[fleet brook]

Grav cube would be good if people didn't immediately shoot it or search for it

I don't understand why grav cube can be shot

[hushed cloud]

grav cube should be a black hole type thing that you just throw forwards

[fleet brook]

I like it pushing things slowly into the air / out of it

[hushed cloud]

its just not interesting enough though

[hardy dust]

Its fine but needs something like googun/winch to fully utilize it.

[fleet brook]

As someone who plays destruction heavy it is for me you can basically drastically change how a building is played

[jaunty creek]

Top3 most toxic light builds

[hardy dust]

On it's own its alright, but not worth taking over other "better: heavy gadgets.

[fleet brook]

Definitely combos well with winch which sucks because winch's range nerf affected that playstyle

But combo it with general destruction/ you can force your own mini low gravity event

Against good players it doesn't last 3 seconds so it's definitely a pub gadget

Since most unranked people don't know you can just shoot it out fairly easily

[hardy dust]

Yeah, really sucks that it gets destroyed so fast...

It ought to at least have enough health to make it a liability to spend ammo on.

[hushed cloud]

tknive grapple, dagger dash, db cloak

[fleet brook]

One of heavies coolest and most unique util that you have to combo things with yourself/ team just gets screwed by any weapon

[hardy dust]

😔

[fleet brook]

Sneezes on grav cube grav cube DUSTED

Medium's jump pad taking half my mag (being overly dramatic)

[fleet brook]

I don't think this game rewards smart gadget's/ smart utility it always seems to favor the brain afk gadgets that don't have multi use

There's also not a lot of combo you can do easily with teammates or obvious ones

[jaunty creek]

Db?

[hushed cloud]

double barrel

[jaunty creek]

What about the sword

[hushed cloud]

the sword i've never had problems with

[jaunty creek]

What's the most Chad light build

[jade talon]

Probably should have posted here instead:

Heavy should have a saddle that lights can mount 🙂

[versed siren]

what do you think the reaction would be if there was laser/energy weapons added?

[jade talon]

Personally hate energy weapons, they always feel weird to play

[inland lynx]

Anybody knows if the riot shield + fire bug is still happening?

[rough carbon]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/4bqN1FcM18U?feature=share what season do you think heavy gets a Model 82A1

4 or 5 round magazine seems apt

[mellow musk]

Real

[hallow leaf]

yes

[spark igloo]

until you fight an actual team

[crisp heart]

Only if he can't shoot it unless he ads, and he can't ads while moving,falling,sliding, etc. In exchange it could shoot through walls destroying said wall in the process.

[spiral pilot]

depends also on the map alot

[rough carbon]

Should have no sight and take a slightly longer time to reload than normal weapons

[crisp heart]

No sight will encourage them to get good at mid ranges. Instead make it have a x8 scope and make them useless once the enemy reaches him

[grizzled narwhal]

:))))))

[crisp heart]

It'll encourage teamplay where lights can scouts guys with the tracking dart or sonar grenade, while heavy shoots them down.

[spring oasis]

What if instead of Pike 5.56 it was Pike .22LR

[lapis tartan]

Another damage buff to the riot shield would save this game

[spring oasis]

Here me out... Blitz shield

[sand monolith]

Or they could finally fix the defensive properties that don’t work

[lapis tartan]

From my experience you cannot block the spear’s alt attack or the sword’s lunge (latter I am unsure on)

[sand monolith]

You’re supposed to be able to block melee hits but it rarely works

[lapis tartan]

Speaking of why does my spear alt do flashy ass moves that hit nobody but I get two inches off the top from another heavy and instantly eat shit

[sand monolith]

I’d much rather they focus on buffing the shields shielding ability rather than damage buff it again tbh

[sand monolith]

Idk spear is weird as fuck and hardly works

[lapis tartan]

It would be really funny if they buffed it to 100 damage

[sand monolith]

Buff riot shield to 350 damage

[lapis tartan]

absolute cinema

[hallow leaf]

they need to buff dual blades before they buff riot again

[lapis tartan]

Dual blades just need a buff to the damage reflection

It’s very inconsistent

[hallow leaf]

they need a buff to damage and deflecting

even riot out damages them now

[lapis tartan]

Does riot have slower swing speed?

[hallow leaf]

their damage just falls off at the end

riot has more damage and more consistent damage

[lapis tartan]

to be fair dual blades does have two swings per click

[hallow leaf]

dual does 50x2 60x2 70

if you put riot vs dual the riot will win

[lapis tartan]

deflect should be buffed so that it’s more effective after a short cooldown of not deflecting anything, and gradually becomes less effective the more you consecutively deflect

by which I mean it deals even less damage to the user

[hallow leaf]

i agree that deflecting needs buffed but so does their damage at the very least it shouldn't fall off at the end and should be 50x2 60x2 70x2

[lapis tartan]

third attack is simultaneous blade swings though

[hallow leaf]

also when it comes to shot guns they only deflect one pellet and you get hit by the rest

[lapis tartan]

should register as 50x2, 60x2, 100 at least

[hallow leaf]

yes that only do 70 damage together

[hallow leaf]

no it needs to do 50x2 60x2 70x2

this will basically do nothing vs lights and med but will help them against heavy

[lapis tartan]

the third attack counts as a single hit

[hallow leaf]

i know then make it 140

[lapis tartan]

medium main mathematics

[hallow leaf]

it shouldnt go 120 then drop in damage

[lapis tartan]

I agree

[hallow leaf]

or make it 60x2 60x2 120

[lapis tartan]

maybe it could use less endlag as well because it sometimes feels like it takes forever to actually get hits out

might just be me though

[hallow leaf]

rn it hurts you to do the final attack

there should be a reason to finish the combo and it shouldnt just drop in damage

[lapis tartan]

Do dual blades nullify melee damage on block?

[hallow leaf]

idk who thought it was a good idea to punish you for finishing the combo but they need fired

[hallow leaf]

yes but its only for m1 (light attacks) and its really buggy

[lapis tartan]

They should make it so it completely blocks all melee damage except that from sledgehammer m2

[hallow leaf]

if you are too close they still hit you, but if you are in the right distance you can block them, its like they didnt know how to do it

[lapis tartan]

because I’m fucking sick of lights spamming dashes and lunges with the sword

[hallow leaf]

dual blades currently are a buggy mess and worse riot shield

worse damage and worse blocking

[lapis tartan]

Super fun though, I have a sick looking medium build that goes with the wakizashi skin

[hallow leaf]

i agree they are fun and i mained them for all of season 3

but that doesnt change the fact that they need a buff

[lapis tartan]

Brother I am not disagreeing with you stop acting like I am

[hallow leaf]

i wish we could main melee rn

but cl-40 stops that

they should buff riot shield so that cl-40 bounces off of it

[lapis tartan]

cl-40 needs to remain relegated to room clearing, they should make its grenades function like the ones in TF2 that bounce and roll around before exploding

[hallow leaf]

or let us stick a bouce pad to riot shield

[lapis tartan]

but like, make it so that you can still make them explode on impact if you’re far enough away

[hallow leaf]

med melee need some love

at the very least remove the bug that has pyro stick to riot

[past parcel]

hi im just here to say
nerf the cl40

[lapis tartan]

that would be too much I think, cause then people would use it like the Gibby gun shield & octane jump pad bug from apex

not exactly in the spirit of the finals methinks

[hallow leaf]

but it would need 2 meds one to have riot and the other to place the pad also the pad has like 50-100 health so if people are shooting it it can be broken

[lapis tartan]

dude pretty much every team that isn’t running a light is gonna be running two mediums, and at least one runs jump pad because the medium has zero other extreme movement based gadgets

[hallow leaf]

i just thought it would be fun tbh

also i would love to see med get a blast grenade that knocks people back

[fleet brook]

So win any melee duel for free?

[hardy dust]

Yes, its the same percentage negation as bullets.

I'm not sure of the exact numbers, but it would be something like only taking 50% damage from incoming hits.

[hallow leaf]

you take 20%

[hardy dust]

I thought it was higher...

[hallow leaf]

and its supper buggy you need to be in the right stop too close and it doesnt block shit

[hardy dust]

Yeah... it really sucks 😔

[hallow leaf]

nope deflecting blocks 80% of damage and reflects 100%

but as for melee blocking they didnt know how to do it so if you are too close it doesnt block like it should

[fleet brook]

I want buffs for the odd goofy gadgets

[hallow leaf]

its stupid, also they also only block one pellet from shotguns so you get hit by the other like 49 pellets

[fleet brook]

Tbf when dual blades dropped it was a AK/ lmg/ smg meta

Too consistent of a block and it just becomes better sheild tho

[hallow leaf]

its kind of useless now

[fleet brook]

It's decent against the pike

[hallow leaf]

cant use it vs other melee and shotguns and they damage is ass

the damage just falls off at the end sadly

[lapis tartan]

Uhh, gee, with how sweaty lights with swords are and how much heavies spam spear alts and sledge m2s it sure would be nice to stand a chance with something other than standing really far away with a pike or the riot shield if you’re lucky enough

I once watched my team get wiped by a light with a sword who ate several 1887 shots to the face and asked for second helpings

[gaunt terrace]

https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/s/zZq9aTUOFV

[lapis tartan]

This will spell disaster for power shift players

[obsidian drum]

this is sick!

[gaunt terrace]

Thanks man I’m also Chris! Would love to see it maybe even as a teenage too!

Yikes I mean grenade wtf lol

[rough carbon]

lots of sniping from goo towers

[crisp heart]

And lots of goo towers will be burning

[lapis tartan]

I fuck with the idea, just saying

But I can’t help but feel that this is 100% gonna be paired with the flamethrower to make power shift a nightmare

[pseudo swallow]

Got a weird gadget idea today, tell me what you all think.
Vision dome: imagine a dome shield where it blocks enemies but not your own teamates. Now take this idea, and imagine it with sight. You and your team can see through the vision dome, but enemies cant! (Obviously this one enemies can shoot through cause it only effects vision which also means they cant break it down unless they hit the core). This would not only be a super interesting part of the gameplay, but also give back some bit of use to the light’s thermal vision gadget, which would be able to ignore the effects of the vision dome.

Tell me your thoughts on this gadget, and what you would do to make it better

[lapis tartan]

It would need a pretty decently sized radius, given that if it’s not that large, it doesn’t take much guesswork for the enemy to pin down where you and your mates are if it’s thrown down, especially, say where the cashout station is. While it would be slightly more beneficial in situations like on power shift where snipers run amock, I still think it’ll turn out very situational (especially given that you stated lights bypass it with thermal vision).

[pseudo swallow]

I did consider its radius would have to be somewhat larger compared to the dome shield its based off of

So great point

[lapis tartan]

Would it be a gadget for heavies? Mediums? Lights? Because then that changes the sort of application that can be expected for it. Like, a heavy could sit inside one comfortably with a flamethrower, a light with a sword and a medium with a turret, not to mention mines and all the more, but then it would also be easily countered with grenade spam and suppressive fire

[spring oasis]

it sounds like a light gadget to me

[pseudo swallow]

I would leave that up to embark to decide honestly. I just feel like it could be fun to use regardless of class

[lapis tartan]

I’m not saying it’s a bad idea, I actually really like how it sounds and I feel like it would be interesting if it replaced smoke grenades or something, but it seems too here and there to be relegated to its own gadget that has to be leveled. A smoke that turns clear for people on the same team but opaque for enemies.

[hardy dust]

poor smoke nades...

[lapis tartan]

I once watched a teammate cause our team to be wiped out because he walked into a mine he couldn’t see (he had thermal vision on from spamming smokes)

[pseudo swallow]

You make some valid points. Rather than adding this, making some tweaks to thermal vision or to the smoke grenade itself may be a better play

So with that aside, i have something that i think is an even better idea.

We have pyro mines and grenades already, so i came up with its counterpart;
Introducing the Cryo mine and Cryo grenade: deals very slow damage, but this isnt where it shines. Upon hitting a contestant, they are slowed down by 50%! This effect lasts for about 5 seconds, and makes the floor around where the activation happened very slippery.
What do you guys think of this one?

[supple oracle]

i'd really prefer a limit to Slow or stun effects

[gaunt terrace]

As default I imagined it as a canister that everyone can use like any other barrel. A grenade I feel like would have to be universal

[lapis tartan]

I feel like it should keep the slippery floor element but not the slow, it’s already terrible enough with the stun

[gaunt terrace]

Sorry meaning the air canister.

[pseudo swallow]

Cryo canister isnt a bad idea

[pseudo swallow]

True, although i was considering the cryo mine to be a heavy gadget to slow down lights.

Heavy or medium having a stun of its own could turn out to be interesting
Or awful, idk i dont make games lol

[lapis tartan]

Could be intriguing, but I cannot really say how it’ll affect the balance. In general, slowing down is ideally avoided in a game like the finals

[gaunt terrace]

Slipping on the slick surface or moving fast sounds cool though

[pseudo swallow]

Instead of a jump pad to keep momentum, you just slide in on an ice floor

[lapis tartan]

Adding onto this, some kind of adrenaline grenade or boost pad for light/medium that gives all teammates in a small radius a temporary speed boost, really good for rushes towards an objective

throw in the slippery floors and gateways and you have Portal 2

[pseudo swallow]

Imagine it being an ospuze can you throw at the floor to splash you and your team with a boost, kinda like how lights can do with the vanish bomb 😮

[lapis tartan]

I was thinking of the vanish bomb when writing that, yes

[gaunt terrace]

Also maybe a bounce or rubbery surface type barrel or grenade 🤔

Maybe it even causes bullet ricochet wooooow ideas

[pseudo swallow]

So like, a liquid bounce pad that ricochets bullets?

BOUNCE-GOO.

[lapis tartan]

oooh, kind of like the jump pad but weaker for players and grenades

[gaunt terrace]

And it burns like goo

[lapis tartan]

whilst ricocheting bullets and whatnot

[gaunt terrace]

And coats your feet for a few steps to let the bounce effect last a bit

Goddamn we’re game designers

The ospuze can you can shake and throw for AOE 😎

[buoyant berry]

Akimbo

[spring oasis]

I want a light gadget that turns me into an inanimate object like a flower pot or a chair

Bonus if you can be picked up and thrown while transformed

[hot shadow]

what are yalls go to loadout?

[sweet trench]

Like a spy disguise thing. I think that it would only work if it was like a 1 minute duration with like a 30 second cooldown

[sweet trench]

V95 stun gun vanish bomb grenade dash

[hot shadow]

is the stun gun x pistol combo still good
(i have not played since season 1)

[spring oasis]

Dematerializer, AKM, data reshaper, jump pad, defib

[hot shadow]

whats new in the game?

Should i re-download the game?

[shrewd quarry]

Yes

1000%

[hot shadow]

alright ill download it

[sweet trench]

Yes. They added Dual akimbo deagles

A shit tonne of other stuff 2

[hot shadow]

oh wow alright

[upbeat anvil]

with the winchester 1887's wonky reload mechanics, when's the best time to reload it?

[lapis tartan]

All the time.

[upbeat anvil]

fair

[north snow]

the guys 1 tapping with the sword are sending me up the fucking wall

[upbeat anvil]

bit of a noob question but how does sword onetap?

[lapis tartan]

Lunge followed immediately by an m1, for a total of 210+ damage on the spot

paired with dashing to make you obnoxiously difficult to hit as WELL as lunging immediately out of a dash

[upbeat anvil]

ah

[hardy dust]

That takes a while

The only "1 tap" with sword is m2 + qm and it does 180.

[lapis tartan]

I always forget quick melee exists until i accidentally fumble and press it trying to hit my reload button

[bitter surge]

I have been trying a lot lately but man.. it’s painful I don’t know if can’t control that weapon all the time, yes it’s good and i get a lot of kills with it but…

[neat hornet]

wtf with granade launcher on medium? Its insane

[bitter surge]

One of best short-range choices for light

[bitter surge]

117 damage is wild

[neat hornet]

how to counter this shit? APS is destroyed with three shots

[valid goblet]

@bitter surge very true i have 50k kills with sword 10k revives also been playing since the beta @neat hornet iso the GL out as best u can ik the play style is very stupid just jumping shooting ur feet but use as much burst damage as u can or out range it , try to get first pick on the GL or their team mates too, force them to revive then keep pressure on that team

especially with the triple medium meta, utilize flanking and holding high ground over the enemy team as best u can also flashbangs are very viable now the time of the flash is about 7 seconds with my estimation, the GL user will most likely start spam shooting out of desperation use that to ur advantage play distance and get the free pick

and ik the damage is to much I’ve seen 208, 186, whole bunch of high numbers that makes no sense just because they got one lucky direct hit

[bitter surge]

Well you counter 3 shots out of 4 is really good, I think you could have the advantage

[crisp heart]

the best counter is to nerf it

[valid goblet]

Truly aps just isn’t viable with this meta, I’d say for mediums if u don’t have a light double movement , and if its MMH two defibs and the heavy with defense options to anchor

if the light can play well an both mediums could potentially frag out as well as the light use , one medium with defense other on offense an team support

[exotic skiff]

Better to play HLM

More utile, just drop TP into people face and wipe fast

[valid goblet]

Flanking is always a option don’t forget that shi an utilize high ground never play the same level as a cashout

@exotic skiff with good positioning it can work but team coordination is key just being in that flow as a team allows for options like that

[exotic skiff]

Not that hard, just com

[merry fulcrum]

is there any tips people can give for Revolver? I don't want to just throw in the towel and say it's inconsistent, but it's hard to make feel reliable. any advice?

[bronze spade]

try not to move and aim long range

aim for the neck or missing shots just go for bod then head

its inconsistent when you start moving and firing

[valid goblet]

@merry fulcrum I feel like it can be played with angles and does good chip damage play off height especially like that parking garage cashout on vegas play on the roof u can use it like a medium to long range weapon with proper positioning , honestly flash , nades, defib could be a good loadout, allowing u to keep pressure with good nade throws to clean up , still having team support

[crisp heart]

crouching helps with hipfire

[valid goblet]

i don’t use the weapon just some suggestions also, utilize barrels every single one they’re are in the game for a reason every single one should be used, and goo u can use as a shield to counter players advancing an trap people in it too the gadgets u run should truly be used to out weigh the util of barrels

fire barrels can be thrown at heavy domes an the fire will stick to it

[torn mantle]

Opinion on FCAR?
A lot of people seem to say it's the weakest AR but I just prefer it over AKM, PIKE, or FAMAS, not even with a particular reason

[restive plover]

It and the akm are essentially the same gun. The scar just has less ammo, making it objectively worse.

And the akm is already mediocre, easily outdone by the famas and definitely the pike.

[exotic skiff]

fcar have better recoil, visual recoil and range because of it

[restive plover]

It doesn't. Set recoil patterns don't affect anything as they can just be learned. Besides most people consider the fcar to be the worse of the two for recoil because of the jump.

[exotic skiff]

Fcar is way easier and have better visual and slightly better range. And one of the best hipfire on the game

that legit just vertical recoil when ak is an S

[late sequoia]

TBH, I want the FCAR to be like an AR version of the V9S.
Up damage from 22 to 37, lower mag from 25 to 20 rounds, lower fire rate from 577rpm to 340rpm (close to same TTK as current FCAR, I did the math).

For reference, the V9S's maximum fire rate is 425rpm.

BOOM!
Now we get the high damage FCAR back, but without the stupidly fast TTKs.

V9S still has massive advantages (provided equally skilled users in a 1v1 situation) under CQC situations with it's faster fire rate and quicker reload (1.3s, as opposed to the FCAR's 2.0s), but FCAR gets the advantage at range.

[exotic skiff]

Just bring fcar dmg back and reduce mag size

No point of just changing mag and firerates

[late sequoia]

The old model was 26dmg firing at the same 577rpm fire rate.

It was insane, tbh.

[exotic skiff]

And that was fine, with less bullet

Because you needed to not miss

[late sequoia]

Not really, it's TTK was better than most shotguns. Especially against heavies.

[exotic skiff]

Heavy need four shoot that was not better

[late sequoia]

It was a V9S on steroids, and the V9S is one of (possibly the single best) CQC weapons in the game (provided your aim isn't trash or the enemy isn't significantly more skilled than you are).
Edit: a melee weapon MIGHT top it, but IDK all their TTKs so I can't say for certain, obviously that's apples-to-oranges though.

[exotic skiff]

v9s is not the best cqc weapons

[late sequoia]

Currently, the FCAR feels like it doesn't fill much of a niche.
All the ARs are kinda same-y.

I'd like the FCAR to get it's heavy hitting niche back, and fill the role of a middle-ground between the AKM and the Pike.

Enough damage per shot to really freak someone out on that initial hit, but also providing a more consistent damage output (as well as letting you hold down the trigger).

[exotic skiff]

if ttk doesn't change that will not solve the pb

[late sequoia]

If you don't miss, and hit at max fire rate, it is on paper.

[exotic skiff]

model, db, m26 sas12

are better

[austere lodge]

looking for someone to play goo with (like goo ships and hiding cashbox)

[late sequoia]

Just did the math:

V9S TTK with body shots against a heavy:
1.271s (more accurately, exactly 1.2705882352941176470588235294118 seconds... but let's just round the numbers for the sake of convenience.)

Model 1887 TTK against heavy: 1.481s
M26: 1.412s
SA1216: 1.28s

Melee really shouldn't be compared to fire arms, but what the heck. Let's see:

DBs were tough because they do 2x50 on the first swing 2x60 on the second and 70dmg on the power strike. AND, I don't know the fire rate, or if it slightly varies (definitely slower on the power strike) between the first and second strikes, then there's the fact that they can't kill a heavy in even a full cycle, so you have a delay after the power strike before the next 2x50 starts up.

Anyway. Instead of doing the math due to not having decent figures, I opted for a more hands-on approach. I started the game up, recorded it in the practice range, and trimmed the recording down to a frame-perfect count to record the exact time it takes to kill a heavy.
That gave me a time of 2 seconds and 47 frames (at 60fps, 47 is 0.783333333333333333333 of a second).

DB: 2.783s

Oh, and that's not even factoring in head shots.
Those kill WAY faster, and none of the weapons you mentioned can head shot (shotguns and melee don't crit).

[restive plover]

It would need that and a firerate nerf.

Below 500 in my opinion.

[late sequoia]

TBH, I'd like to see the AKM get a faster fire rate and it's old mag size back, making it more of an all-arounder that has a slight emphasis on close range.

The Pike and FAMAS already do well for longer range.

And having the FCAR with my suggested 37dmg model would be more of a mid-range weapon that bridges the gape between the two extremes (while still being an AR, as the ARs are meant to be easier to use in general for a beginner than weapons like the 1887/Revolver/Pike).

Excluding melee niches:

CL40 and 1887 are the best performance Medium has for CQC, but offer different use cases and differ greatly in the user experience.

Revolver is great for close and mid range, but not great at significant distances or against multiple targets. (TBH, it could use some better reload speed and hip fire to distinguish it from the FAMAS' 3x burst, which functions almost identical to the revolver if you're landing all 3 shots, but the FAMAS has 9 bursts and the revolver reload is too long to justify it.)

Pike is the opposite of the revolver, being great at mid/long ranges, but extremely difficult to use in close range. Sure, you can spam fire from the hip if they're within distance to hug you, but from 2-8m, you're in serious trouble when up against an equally skilled opponent with an automatic or shotgun from just about any class.

The ARs fill the very similar roles, but are more forgiving with missed shots.

AKM is (or rather, WAS) good up close thanks to it's large mag (which is now effectively gone) and very accurate, but loses a significant amount of it's damage at range.

FCAR is (or rather, was supposed to be, but was a bit too powerful up close thanks to the fire rate) good up close and at mid range, but the mag wasn't too forgiving so it's ideal range was 8-20m where you could ADS and track the enemy fairly easily, rather than letting the enemy get close enough that you had to hip fire.

FAMAS is (and kinda still is, though it could use a little love) good at range, where you can fire a burst of rounds down range like a discount Pike, BUT it also lets you hip fire a 3x burst that functions like a pseudo-shotgun if they get in close.

It's not as good at range as the Pike if you're landing all your shots, but it's still very solid, and it's FAR better when someone jump scares you.

[crystal garnet]

Does medium truly need 2 movement abilities? Should, say, light get access to jump pad or zip line, while removing one from medium?

[late sequoia]

Light gets movement abilities at the press of a button.
Medium has to stop shooting, swap to a gadget, and takes a bit of prep time.

Light also is more of a lone wolf, while medium supports his whole team (with gadgets the whole team can use once placed).

I get what you're saying, but personally I feel Medium makes more sense to have the mobility tools because they don't fit Light's run-and-gun design better than they fit Medium's support role.

[crystal garnet]

Well, one of the issues with Medium is that in the meta, there usually is one who is double movement. Unless they want to only allow one movement ability at a time, I feel this shuold be something that needs to be addressed or looked at, at least

[late sequoia]

TBH, I think the zipline is kind of a double edged sword and generally is more trouble than it's worth at higher levels of play.

It's not great at getting out of sticky situations, and it's fairly easy to destroy with explosives or melee before you can get to your destination (especially across a gap).

If anything, the odd one out is the teleport grenades on light.

But it's kinda half way between light's solo schtick and medium's team support (because it's period of usability is on a timer and then they burn themselves out).

If you're going to mess with meta by forcing medium to only take one movement option, you'll have to force heavy to choose between barricade and dome shield.

And force light to choose between sonar grenades and vanish bomb, or stun gun and glitch grenades. (Or only 1 of the 4.)

---

Personally;
I'd say any of the above stifles player freedom and creativity, and the game wouldn't be as fun without those possibilities. (And I don't even carry both the medium's zipline and jump pad at the same time.)

[deft ibex]

could
could we increase the XP gain on the data reshaper
you need:
9000/75=125
125 uses to get it to level 2 alone

[late sequoia]

Wow, is it really that bad?
I never check it's progress, but that sounds kinda horrible.

Is the dematerializer the same? They work on similar principles, and I have noticed that despite maining it when I play medium, my Dematerializer's not even at lv3 yet.

[deft ibex]

it really is
im trying to level it up to level 4 this season and itd take something like 500 uses (probrably wrong)

[deft ibex]

dematerializer is probably better

[late sequoia]

I just checked the wiki, same principle.

1 charge used = 25xp, same XP requirements per level.

Effectively, it's also a horrible grind.

TBH, I'd prefer to see it be more along the lines of 50xp each.

[deft ibex]

huh
never noticed that
but tbf youd use demat more commonly and more useful than data reshaper, so it feels easier although its just the same

[late sequoia]

Maybe 100 for the data reshaper, given how much more likely you are to need to be frugal with it's charges (in case of turrets or mines)

Reshaping a turret should give more, and mines should provide more than altering ordinary furniture/barrels.

Maybe 250 for a turret, 175 for a mine, and 100 for a barrel/furniture?

That's still 36 turrets reshaped, 52 mines, or 90 barrels/furniture items just to hit lv2.

Which will take a LONG time when you factor in that turrets and mines are going to be far less common finds, and you can't exactly count on finding them too often.
So most of your XP will come from griding for it, by reshaping barrels.

[deft ibex]

fair, i think reshaping agdgets should give more than barrels

we oughta play one day together
The Reshapers

[late sequoia]

It'd be nice if the dematerializer went by surfaces altered too, rather than charges used.

I love using both. Though I only pull out the reshaper when I see turret mediums or play TA and see mediums who'll no doubt have mines.

Nothing like watching a dude think his turret will scare you off him when he's low, only to see you change it to a potted plant on approach.

[deft ibex]

imagine getting fatal florist with the fucking reshaper

[late sequoia]

LOL

Imagine watching a guy carry his turret mounted atop a potted plant or barrel in his grasp, only to watch it change to a desk chair.

[deft ibex]

dude datareshaper vs pre patched nukes
imagine how funny itd be

datareshaper instantly becomes meta if it could remove RPG's into furniture

[late sequoia]

that would be awesome.

change the rocket to a red explosive canister, then toss it back.

Achievement:
"Return to sender" (Alternatively, "Insufficient Postage")
Change an enemy heavy's RPG7 rocket with the data reshaper (always converts them to the explosive canisters), then throw it at him and deal damage to him.

[deft ibex]

we should be hired

[shrewd axle]

would be cool that instead of a red canister it was something like bouncing it off a jumpad

[deft ibex]

you deserve a medal thats funny as fuck

imagine putting a jumppad on something you can pick up
then walking up to a team of CL-40's

its just the dual blade deflection but with projectiles

[late sequoia]

That would be awesome, but we'd have to be able to put jump pads on objects smaller than themselves (IE, goo canisters or oil/gas)

[deft ibex]

i wish we could :(

[late sequoia]

Medium places jump pad on riot shield user's shield, anything but bullets bounce right off.

[deft ibex]

riot shield 🤤

[heady void]

What kind of game level can lead to my account being banned three times in two months? https://discord.com/channels/1008696016318513243/1293174218996977786

[late sequoia]

Speaking of fun jump pad gameplay:

https://reddit.com/r/thefinals/comments/1fyz6wj/the_terminal_placement_locations_are_more_what/

[winged kernel]

is there any niche that revlover has a great strength to?

[stiff vine]

headshot aimbots

[winged kernel]

i feel like if i was gonna be like that the pike would do that better 💀

[stiff vine]

then use it lmao

trying the revolver right now

[crisp heart]

Revolver is more cool than the pike.

Especially with the gun twirling animation

Pretending you're ocelot

[winged kernel]

its in game model is really nice since on ads and hip it doesnt clutter too much

[crisp heart]

Sure, but can't beat cool

And that's what truly matters

[winged kernel]

hoping for a diamond skin later on for it !! wanna feel like a rich cowboy
but also i was thinking you think if they change the mag count from 6 -> 8 would do anything for it?

i think the ttk is fine, it just feels so unforgiving given its niche of range being between mid and short cause it drops off range wise so bad from when i used it

[stiff vine]

just used revolver and it is more of a burst weapon than the pike

[loud merlin]

and less ammo

[stiff vine]

you shoot once then take cover. the pike is more of a hybrid between an antuomatic and the revolver. you try for kills with the pike

[loud merlin]

overall i still believe pike is better than revolver but when the revolver clicks its just so good

[fleet brook]

Close to mid range burst?

[winged kernel]

ive been using pike since new patch since its range just felt better with its 12 mag size

[crisp heart]

The pike might took everything from the revolver, but it will never take how cool it is

[winged kernel]

i was giving revloer a try again since i was getting bored and the sight def made it feel better, but i felt like i was rewarded for hitting all shots till the last 1 or 2 bars on the enemy 😭

[spiral pilot]

nerf cl40 nerf pike buff xp 54

[wide swan]

please

[crisp heart]

it just needed damage drop-off reduced, they nerfed it's damage

[river tinsel]

Tbh who ever is in charge of balancing is being kinda goofy lately.

I think the best way to balance the pike is just reduce the damage but also let it shoot faster

It genuinely makes me miss the old aps turret

[crisp heart]

if only all classes has their version on ap turrets

[hazy spoke]

ok guys i have a take that may be controversial but is still interesting to think about.

embark wants to bring every class in line and equalize their pick- and winrates.

since light will always be the most fun class, there is only one option to equalize pickrates.

• giving every class a unique utility that has a high value to the team and synergises with the other classes. doing this will lead to a team missing a certain utility to use the teams full potential IF there is a class missing.

technically this is already the case through specs and a few gadgets. but there are still a few problems.

1st: lights primary power is speed/movement AND recon. the problem here is, that mediums primary power is heal/support AND movement.
there is the problem.
the fact that medium can provide so much movement power for the team (through gadgets) its taking away the meaning of lights utility.

ideas:

-give light a gadget that can boost the whole teams moving speed like a adrenaline grenade🫠

• take away mediums zipline and give it to heavy, to reduce the movement utility of medium, so light movement can be the best in its utility again.

• there are too little gadgets that match the different classes primary roles and are bound to one class alone.

CONCEPT:

-every class can have more than one primary role
-the different specs are the indicator of the role and there should be more gadgets that match with the different specs to create and expand the different roles.

• of course you can always choose your whole loadout like now so you could choose a loadout that doesnt really match a certain role.

-BUT, matching gadgets to different specs creates unique utility for the team so everyone is happy to have any class in his team.

• the goal is to make a M/H/L team the team with the highest potential because every class brings some sort of high value to the team that none of the other classes can

lmk if this sounds like smth to think about😃🫶🏻

ly embark

[river tinsel]

Also why can the CL-40 knock down boxes but the heavy mgl grenads just bounce right off?

At this point I kinda feel like the mgl and the cl40 should swap. Give meds the mgl as it can't break things and does less damage

[crisp heart]

the cl uses impact grenades,

[astral cedar]

Cl40 really wreaking havoc at low elo

[river tinsel]

Pike and cl40 are just wildly overtuned right now. Like I said whoever is in charge of balance is being real fucking goofy

[crisp heart]

and if you're dealing witha team that has both + the model?

[astral cedar]

cl40 is still not as good as model it’s just easier

[ashen hawk]

k yea that could work too i guess

[astral cedar]

Give healing beam to light trust

Medium keeps defib

[lapis tartan]

But that defeats the purpose of the pike, which is meant to be a marksman rifle. Upping firerate and decreasing damage just makes it a worse version of the FCAR with a stronger scope. It needs a decrease in firerate in order to actually promote the weapon type it’s listed as, punishing players who spam shots and don’t take their time to lock onto targets first

[crisp heart]

light tries to slam into the ground and then died of fall damage

[river tinsel]

Another thing that really annoys me is the mp5 now just feeling anemic compared to the m11 and it used to be the mp5 atleast had the holo sight as a trade off for being less of a bullet hose but now the m11 can just have a read dot so the sights argument doesn't even feel fair

[astral cedar]

Glitch stopping the revive post defib might be heat actually

[crisp heart]

I would gladly swap stungun for glitch if it does that

[astral cedar]

I still think a pike fire rate and hipfire accuracy nerf, glitch stopping the defib animation, and a reduction to the mesh cooldown timer would be healthy I think

[river tinsel]

Thats not necessarily true. The fcar isn't ment to beam people from that far away and its not like I'm saying make it full auto and give it a 20 round mag. Just to tune it so you can't just 2 tap a light in hip fire

[astral cedar]

Glitch useful again, mesh useful again, medium nerfed

[lapis tartan]

funny, I find in my experience that my shots like to go between the legs of lights in hipfire. But yeah, in that case, a nerf to hipfire accuracy would also help out

[crisp heart]

it still a must pick regardless of how you nerf it. instant rev is always helpful

[lapis tartan]

the mesh shield either needs an increase in health (doesn’t have to be crazy) or a reduction in cooldown for lowering it while it’s at full or almost full health

[vale mulch]

Hear me out, mesh gets 1,250 hp. But while it's active it loses 5hp per second and doesn't start regenerating until 10 seconds of being retracted

[lapis tartan]

doesn’t it already regenerate pretty slowly? like it’s true you want it to be reserved as a defense tool that must be held up but I feel as though it already struggles with facing more than one team since one can whittle down most of the health and the other can finish it off before it’s even halfway regenerated and then you’re kinda cooked

[crisp heart]

the cooldown was fine if they want to avoid shield juggling, the health nerf was strange though

[river tinsel]

I'd be okay with the health being upped a bit but the cool down is needed

[vale mulch]

They didn't nerf its hp

[crisp heart]

they nerf the hp alot before s4

[river tinsel]

I kinda want the dome shield buffed a little bit either in its lasting duration or just hp in general

[crisp heart]

the nerf was because they want to prevent heavies from double stacking dome shield and get a free cashout steal

[vale mulch]

12 seconds and 400 hp pls

[astral cedar]

Glitch grenades..

[vale mulch]

GLITCH GRENADE LAUNCHER 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

GOO MINE 💥💥💥💥💥💥

[crisp heart]

not all classes have glitch grenades though

[astral cedar]

Yeah I wish glitch mines could still detonate

then medium could drop them on a dome shield similar to light’s glitch grenade

[astral cedar]

Goo mine could save medium melee trust

[crisp heart]

stealing cashout meta, double stack buffed dome shield + aps

[hazy spoke]

ok guys i have a take that may be controversial but is still interesting to think about.

embark wants to bring every class in line and equalize their pick- and winrates.

since light will always be the most fun class, there is only one option to equalize pickrates.

• giving every class a unique utility that has a high value to the team and synergises with the other classes. doing this will lead to a team missing a certain utility to use the teams full potential IF there is a class missing.

technically this is already the case through specs and a few gadgets. but there are still a few problems.

1st: lights primary power is speed/movement AND recon. the problem here is, that mediums primary power is heal/support AND movement.
there is the problem.
the fact that medium can provide so much movement power for the team (through gadgets) its taking away the meaning of lights utility.

ideas:

-give light a gadget that can boost the whole teams moving speed like a adrenaline grenade🫠

• take away mediums zipline and give it to heavy, to reduce the movement utility of medium, so light movement can be the best in its utility again.

• there are too little gadgets that match the different classes primary roles and are bound to one class alone.

CONCEPT:

-every class can have more than one primary role
-the different specs are the indicator of the role and there should be more gadgets that match with the different specs to create and expand the different roles.

• of course you can always choose your whole loadout like now so you could choose a loadout that doesnt really match a certain role.

-BUT, matching gadgets to different specs creates unique utility for the team so everyone is happy to have any class in his team.

• the goal is to make a M/H/L team the team with the highest potential because every class brings some sort of high value to the team that none of the other classes can

lmk if this sounds like smth to think about😃🫶🏻

ly embark

[crisp heart]

give the light a small whip and make it increase team mates movement speed if you hit them with it

[astral cedar]

also aps deleting mines is bad I also think. Keep it limited to grenades and rockets and give it a rate limit instead of just hp per projectiles

[vale mulch]

Chill

[astral cedar]

stim gun specialization for light

[crisp heart]

aww, I liked the energy drink specialization suggestion more. with the ospuze skin

[vale mulch]

Ohh ospuze gadget

And you can right click to throw it like a speed grenade

[dense inlet]

remove the stupid meshshield cooldown 😋

[crisp heart]

or you could drink it

shake it and spray it on your teammates

and then drink the remainder

[supple oracle]

Any news from embark

[crisp heart]

they are working very hard

[supple oracle]

Damn

[crisp heart]

using sword against a c&s heavy feels like playing a souls-like game

especially if they use hammer with it

[astral cedar]

Riot shield

swordlight mains when their opponent can aim

[crisp heart]

you could just place a jump pad infront of a charging heavy.

[vale mulch]

That's smart actually

[astral cedar]

I do that when I can

but when I don’t have it it’s just a stalemate at best

Riot shield has many losing matchups just off specialization alone

[vale mulch]

Data reshaper is slept on with the triple turret + cl40 strat

[astral cedar]

Thanks for reminding me I need level 3 reshaper for the sound

[uncut apex]

am I insane or does dual blades no longer deflect headshots

[vale mulch]

Can't confirm it ever did

[crisp heart]

medium melees need to rely even more on their gadgets and spec than the average medium

the goo grenade stun is very useful

[uncut apex]

ahh, ive been running turret, defib, juimp pad and zipline

is there a specialization that would work better?

[crisp heart]

Most med melees I've encounter uses the dematerializer

[spiral pilot]

its almost criminal that we dont have molotow skin for pyro grenade yet

[uncut apex]

I really dont, out of every class, they still have the most bs

[uncut apex]

they might be waiting for a criminal themed season

[vale mulch]

It's fortifications have been nerfed 800 times

[uncut apex]

they specialize in killing you and the map at the same time

on top of just, not dying

[spiral pilot]

gangster criminal theme would be cool

like gta san andreas gangs and skins

[uncut apex]

yeah, gangster themed tommy gun and v9s would go hard

[crisp heart]

they only nerfed the mesh shields since a see-through shoot through shield is stronger than a barricade or goo

[spiral pilot]

the new m60 skin is pretty cool, full reload you just throw away your m60 and pull out a fresh one. and the inspect is cleaning

[uncut apex]

and unlike the dome shield, the enemy cant really walk through it

[spiral pilot]

if mesh shield would be a proper wall where you cant pass through it would be so much better

[uncut apex]

you can really just turn in the direction of the enemy whos trying to walk through

[crisp heart]

it would be a pain trying to defend cash out though

[spiral pilot]

or you pull out the mesh shield and you have the option to drop it and have it stationary

and pick it up again for mobility

[crisp heart]

if they nerfed shield juggling, they definitely wouldn't allow that

[spiral pilot]

thats a wholoe different thing

[crisp heart]

same thing, activate mesh shield, drop it, shoot the enemy, pick it up again if the enemy relocates.

[spiral pilot]

picking it up takes like 2 seconds

like picking up any items in the game

the mesh shield would last infenite amount of time on the ground unless its shot down or glitched which would make light much more valueable too for teamcomp

[crisp heart]

that doesn't really matter, it's the similar issue with shield juggling of heavy being over protected while having the ability to fight back, pair it with dome shield and it'll fill the finals game feedback channel instantly

[spiral pilot]

its gone with one glitch barrel or grenade

[crisp heart]

not all classes have a glitch grenade

[spiral pilot]

then light has more value as i said

its only protecting one angle not 360 degree

[crisp heart]

ah yes, the bringer of the glitch grenade

[uncut solar]

i love the new season

[unique swallow]

Nerf CL, Do anything that make shit balanced (increase self damage, decrease damage) whatever make it not too OP

[fickle radish]

Very funny for the first 2 minutes

[uncut solar]

game is fun'

[royal pier]

Vanish Bomb: No longer AoE, the user crushes it in their hand for personal invisibility.

Invisibility Cloak: Makes nearby allies invisible within a couple of meters. Hitting an ally only decloaks them, hitting the Light decloaks everyone.

This makes Cloak team utility that requires less coordination, and works as a way to close the distance on ranged focused teams.

[pallid stirrup]

WHAT

that's not true, literally this morning someone threw a invis bomb on me and it worked

[restive plover]

This is a balance proposition, not patch notes.

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/corrrect-gif-19202916

[icy forge]

That's cool asf, I didn't thought it would drop when you reload

[pallid stirrup]

Wrong

[restive plover]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/816056574102732830/1292267762453839911/makoto-yuki-typing.gif

[iron shell]

Is it just me or are the m11 and the xp-54 not really fun

[pallid stirrup]

m11 is so fun, xp54 is so balanced

[pallid stirrup]

banned, reported, GG

[iron shell]

It's decent to use just not fun

[restive plover]

The xp54 was recently transformed into garbage.

[royal pier]

Nope it is indeed a balance proposition. Atm Cloak is generally obsolete. Meanwhile the bomb lets dash and grapple lights get nearly the same effectiveness as Cloak while being AoE.

[restive plover]

And you may simply not like automatics.

[iron shell]

I do

[icy forge]

Just shut your mouth, that's the most provocative and wrong statement I've ever saw if it's not humor

[iron shell]

On medium I love the akm

[royal pier]

Is it garbage, or just not as busted as before? I still see people using it with good effectiveness.

[restive plover]

It was hardly busted to begin with, now it's significantly worse at every range.

[royal pier]

In fact, if all Light weapons were around the MP5's power level, I say bring them up to 200 HP. More enjoyable for everyone.

[royal pier]

It was better at mid range than all the ARs and LMGs before.

[iron shell]

Yea I remember when I loved it

[fleet brook]

Who is everyone?

[restive plover]

The m60 maybe. The others? No.

[fleet brook]

Weapons in games are designed around breakpoints

Hp being one of them

That would adjust the time it takes to kill lights for all weapons

Making light just significantly better

[royal pier]

Light gets more health so that a single frag doesn't leave them at 1 hp (or kill of unlucky), players fighting lights are happier with the lower DPS.

[fleet brook]

At the same range it was better than lights dmr (at least if you could track a moving target)

It's always been the easiest of lights weapons for me it's a laser beam aim at the head win most to every fight

[icy forge]

Just give heavy a hp buff, lights are not supposed to have hp but to burst enemies hard

[fleet brook]

Light also trades better into every single class

Is far less risky

Still moves around like a rat that needs Adderall

And has multiple breaking points for multiple weapons snap

You'd have to redesign every weapon on a chart primarily damage buffs

[royal pier]

Make them a bit bigger.

[iron shell]

No

[royal pier]

And yes, other weapons will need adjustment.

But Light will always suck at like mid gold and beyond with 150 hp

[royal flicker]

Give light a speed boost gadget you can place down and it launches your character forwards in that direction, putting it up again a wall pointing up would send you flying up

You give this to light cause they are the fastest and can place them down for their teammates to follow

[royal pier]

Sometimes you're the only one available to steal, and having low health will always make that more risky. Not to mention that the need to flank means if you die, it's harder to defib.

[royal pier]

Sounds like Gateway with extra steps.

[icy forge]

Would be a good option because having to pick winch over charge n' slam because you have to grab those little insects so they cannot escape then kill you is problematic

[royal pier]

I'm not a console player, but I can also acknowledge that Light being so small is harder for a controller.

[icy forge]

I play on pc

[royal flicker]

Gateway creates a temporary portal between 2 locations, and can be used through walls,

This item would be more similar to a jump pad but instead of vertical movement it would be for horizontal movement,

Also if you put it just right at the edge you can force people to fall off the map

[royal pier]

Doesn't mean that it isn't another point in favor of Light being larger.

[royal pier]

I'd rather have something like that on Heavy for the Slam combo.

Human cannonball.

[icy forge]

Close range is a nightmare if you don't have winch or the Sledgehammer, making them largger would make it more enjoyable

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/daredevil-extreme-cannon-lady-epic-shot-gif-3438087

[icy forge]

Would be fire

[royal flicker]

I mean just cause it in a light doesn't mean heavy can't use it, just you'll need teamwork for it, can do something similar with the jump pad, and technically grav cube,

Since the slam does more damage from higher up

[royal pier]

We're in agreement, I was just pointing out that there's several good reasons to do it.

[royal flicker]

But what I say is more for sped, like giving the whole team a small light dash

[icy forge]

Mb, I didn't understood it at first

[royal pier]

I was thinking very little vertical rise, making it more for using from height.

[royal pier]

It gives Heavy some mobility, but mostly for making a dramatic entrance.

[royal flicker]

Yeah like the houses in monoco, put it on the roof and go flying through the air, irony is it would have to be on the opposite side then where you would place a jumpad

[crisp heart]

Light energy drink specialization. [Fire] drinks and gets speed buff and jump buff.
[Alt fire] shakes and sprays it to teammates and then drinks what is left, all of them gets the buff but for a shorter duration.

That's what I want for the 4th light spec.

[royal pier]

Potential combo with goo nade for different angles like the jump pad. Takes two gadgets, but with a good potential for reward.

[royal pier]

Yeah let's make the fastest class faster.

[crisp heart]

Hell yeah

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/kermit-lets-not-kermit-the-frog-gif-18626348

[crisp heart]

Let's do

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/baldur's-gate-baldur's-gate-3-withers-no-noo-gif-6455368871201756432

[crisp heart]

Yes

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/dr-evil-how-about-no-austin-powers-gif-17640212

[royal flicker]

Oh you know those yellow triangle jumpads, yeah I want to give those to lights but with no vertical movement

[crisp heart]

It's a spec so they have to sacrifice other specs to use it. Yes

[royal pier]

Still seems like something better put on Heavy.

Gives spear some love, too. Imagine catapulting into battle spinning.

[royal flicker]

Well yeah, a lotta items would be better on heavy, but balance and such would be important, this I rather give heavy the jump pad, so they can combine it with slam and then spin

[royal pier]

The jump pad is kinda iffy for slam with its low horizontal movement.

[royal flicker]

Yeah but it maximize damage

Further the drop the more damage

[royal pier]

And requiring either goo to adjust the angle or height make it so that just using it for only movement would make the slam only do like 80 dmg max.

[royal flicker]

Yep but it has many more uses like giving better angles for rpgs

[pallid stirrup]

weapon proposal: An anti-healing beam lol, it's just a hurting beam

[royal pier]

If you let the heavy set up an entire circus stunt and do nothing, your fault lol.

[royal flicker]

Lol should be a game event

[pallid stirrup]

literally

[royal flicker]

"tis the season of giving, and the biggest giver gets the reward,

Heal others for points, but if you kill someone you can take their points"

[royal pier]

https://tenor.com/view/overwatch-overwatch-league-gladiators-la-gladiators-los-angeles-gladiators-gif-13574793

[pallid stirrup]

https://tenor.com/view/speed-blitz-large-beam-railgun-gif-26550294

[royal flicker]

Ooh

[royal pier]

I mean that's actually just the Flamethrower.

[pallid stirrup]

https://tenor.com/view/discord-embed-failure-epic-embed-fail-double-embed-fail-gif-23538127

[royal flicker]

Turret skin, alien laser

[royal pier]

The flamethrower "beam" basically cancels out healing.

[royal flicker]

Flamethrower has a spread on the flames, a laser would be more precise, basically just a continuous ray of damage/debuffs

[royal pier]

Actually it is just a beam in the center, it's just wobbly.

The fire around it is just visual.

It's not a cone. Or at least not a wide one. Use it at the end of a round and you can see it while in slow mo.

A small QoL addition for the MGL32 would be showing the trajectory while "aiming." It gives the aim an actual purpose, at the least. I don't expect it to show the bounce, just the initial impact.

[vale mulch]

Goo mine when

Imagine a goo trap that would trap you can you had to spam space to escape

Imagine iron sights sr84

[vale mulch]

Is HHM still good

[restive plover]

Kind of dead in the water with RPG, shield and heal nerfs.

[vale mulch]

Double heal beam

[restive plover]

You can't double heal beam with hhm.

Good on hmm though.

[crisp heart]

Should a heal barrel be a thing?

[eager timber]

https://open.spotify.com/playlist/6T0Ep1esXmq6rCTkWt2llm

[vale mulch]

Maybe like 100 hp

[delicate valley]

Maybe

[covert parcel]

heal barrel, flash barrel, goo barrel, sonar barrel

wait goo barrel is alr a thing

OOH shield barrel, make it like orisa shield from OW but it decays super fast + only 75 ish HP

[north helm]

Antigravity barrel would be fun as hell too

[naive glacier]

heal barrel would be kinda op
just place it next to you and if someone shoots it you get healed

[covert parcel]

grab =heal value decay; incentivizing using it in battle

[silent holly]

Can I use the Data Reshaper on Dome shield?

[spiral pilot]

no but barricade

i think it would be cool if light gets a gadget to manipulate statues, they cant be carried away or defibed for x amount of time

something with enemy statues at least

[vale mulch]

Still think glitch should reverse the defib animation so you have to actually take the statue somewhere safe before reviving

[spiral pilot]

or glitch works on statues that they cant be revived with defib for that time

[sand monolith]

HMM and MMM are the only good comps rn