retired-patch-6-3-discussion

[bold condor]

I know this because I read the log they gave me.

The one that you receive after Copied Factory that contains information about the world of NieR and makes it excessively clear that it's the world of NieR?

Also, there's literally no scenario in which the NieR and Drakengard references make sense that doesn't follow the story of NieR.

[maiden lodge]

But yeah, regarding the seas, we know that at least one ocean is rendered non-liquid/existant because we actually have to delve into the Nereus ocean trench as the leyline to release Water Aether.

[bold condor]

Certainly not on bloody Hydaelyn.

[carmine basin]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/678114017339768832/831949789154377758/SPOILER_niv37k1lu2t61.png

[bold condor]

Which not only follows a completely separate set of physical laws but also the moon is kind of actually important to the setpieces we see in the raid.

And if the moon is Zodiark, there's literally no way YorHa wouldn't know and have to account for that, it messes that lore up way worse to try and slot it into Hydaelyn.

Hell, the whole war with the Machines and migration ||(actually total extinction)|| of the human race to the moon is the reason the Puppet's Bunker has the slogan "For the glory of mankind." on it.

Also the Machine Lifeforms were created by aliens.

So that's another level of weirdness you would now have to slot into the dimensional copies of Hydaelyn.

[pine epoch]

If I could pin in here that would be it

[carmine basin]

Pin it in #archived-lore-spoilers when this channel is gone

[bold condor]

This isn't even the first time we've dealt with something that isn't from Hydaelyn or its shards, or the universe that contains them in a raid.

[heady shadow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/308681531776303115/832304654914289674/SPOILER_unknown.png

theres a scythe there\

[pine epoch]

Things to note. All the rules of space are not inherently thought out. Koji and Oda have not decided if each shard has it's own universe of stars. Or if their all in some hammerspace that just sees the same sky as the source.

Aliens exist in FF14. dragons, omega

[gaunt star]

Soooo is it too soon to ship Alphinaud and Arenvald?

[bold condor]

Yes. And half of the Omega bosses aren't even from this dimension.

[pine epoch]

Atleast 3 sigma bosses

[silk cape]

So it's sounding pretty clear that all of the NieR stuff requires material to have traveled from where the NieR games takes place to the First in particular.

[brisk quail]

Julyan would be proud

[bold condor]

Yep. But honestly given what those godforsaken THINGS are, that does track.

[pine epoch]

Phantom train had post mortem retcon with blue mage.

[bold condor]

While I may not like the overall story, thematically the Seed is kind of perfect as something that would happen to the First.

[pine epoch]

So phantom train can be argued it's a butchered story of source history

[maiden lodge]

How is that a retcon? It always was.

[bold condor]

A lot off FF games are also stories in universe but they're also implied to be things that actually happened to people in other universes.

Like, obviously Mina and Shun aren't from our Doma.

[torpid yoke]

where?

[carmine basin]

Final Fantasy Multiverse

[pine epoch]

Oh shit I see the scythe

[heady shadow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/308681531776303115/832296866866528307/SPOILER_scythe.gif

[gaunt star]

I just have this feeling in relation to whatever weapon ol Zenos grabs is gonna be the new DPS class' weapon. Here's hoping it's not dumb

[heady shadow]

this is something someone else posted in a discord im in

[torpid yoke]

that would line up with where he walks

[somber storm]

SMH should have been the WVR item

[heady shadow]

i dont think its the same weapon he';ll use but there is one there

[torpid yoke]

uhhh iirc he is right infront of a zurvan axe when he grabs the weapon

[gaunt star]

Why is that scythe blade inverted?

[torpid yoke]

too bad the pic is small af

also side note. They did wonders for the load times man

[pine epoch]

I mean. The model of that scythe was datamined I believe somewhere miles upward in the channel

[silk cape]

It seems to me that the most straightforward explanation is this: the Interdimensional Rift introduced in FF5 is a space that is accessible from all the different worlds of FF. The idea that Gilgamesh is the same dude in all of his appearances throughout the series is mostly a gag, but the concept of it is enough to suggest that there are ways for beings to pass from one world to another.

[silk cape]

I don't think we'll ever hear Square confirm that openly, of course.

[bold condor]

I mean yeah Gilgamesh in FFXIV pretty explicitly sends Hildibrand into the Rift, too.

[maiden lodge]

Counter argument

[bold condor]

Don't think too hard about the multiverse stuff. I promise you the developers care way less about avoiding crossovers than we do.

[torpid yoke]

Nope thats a lance

[maiden lodge]

The interdimensional rift is a thing that exists because of the sundered an rejoined nature of World R, and FF14's Interdimensional Rift is of the same nature as that of its namesake, just as World R is a sundered and rejoined world.

[torpid yoke]

You go further into the cutscene and you see its a spear

[bold condor]

idk I mean if we include Dissidia, the Rift does link more than just those

[maiden lodge]

And yeah, this.

You'd be lucky if you can have two games in the franchise agree on how crossovers occur

[bold condor]

FFVII and FFX agree on how they cross over and it sickens me but it's canon.

[silk cape]

it's not though?

[bold condor]

It is.

They even reference it again in FF7R.

[dim sigil]

That was much more of an Easter egg than anything

[heady shadow]

makes you wonder how time between ffxv and ffxiv is.
because in the ffxv on ffxv's side Noct was only gone for a few seconds while he was in eorzea for like a few hours probs

[bold condor]

But more importantly it's been stated at least twice by the developers even before that.

[heady shadow]

and now ffxv has a miqote

[torpid yoke]

actually idk

[maiden lodge]

Well, Kitase.

[bold condor]

And yes it's an easter egg but it's one that's consistent with what Kitase said.

[maiden lodge]

Sakaguchi's not made his intent known

[bold condor]

Sakeguchi would probably call you a nerd if you asked him this dumbass shit.

[dim sigil]

I doubt itll actually come into anything or mean anything

[maiden lodge]

Probably, Sakaguchi gives zero shits

[silk cape]

Kazushige Nojima: This story is a bit of a joke. When we created FFX-2 , we wanted to create something, a totally new world. Except that when I created it, I realized that it looked a lot like FFVII ... But without realizing it. Afterwards, when it was officially said in Ultimania, it took a completely gigantic proportion when it was just an anecdote.

Finaland: They were very surprised, clearly they did not believe it.

Kazushige Nojima: (laughs) It's anecdotal, there is nothing that deep!```
Source: https://www.finaland.com/?rub=site&page=news&id=6355

[bold condor]

Mhm. What does he care if FFX is a distant prequel to FFVII? Not his circus, not his monkey at this point.

If he was gonna nitpick every weird thing they did with the VII IP, he'd have gone mad.

[pine epoch]

1 month guys

[heady shadow]

oh oh..... so the light person is the trailer.
bet it ends up being ||emet||

runs

[bold condor]

idk what I'm meant to be getting from this

[maiden lodge]

tl;dr 'it was a joke, it's not meant to be serious'

[bold condor]

I mean duh.

[torpid yoke]

@heady shadow its not a scythe its an axe and a spear

[pastel coyote]

Can someone start off some world-ending shit so we don't see the time pass until the fanfest ?

[bold condor]

It's shocking to me how lore fans fail to realize that something can both be a joke and canon at the same time.

And this is probably why Yoko Taro has as much fun with people as he does.

Like when people try to argue Hildibrand can't be canon.

Hildibrand is a gigantic joke and it absolutely fucking happened.

[pastel coyote]

Should we ask Urianger about Hildi ?

[maiden lodge]

No, he's saying that what was said was taken 'out of proportion'

[bold condor]

Well of course it was.

[maiden lodge]

Meaning that people ascribed a meaning and canonicity to it that shouldn't have been applied.

[bold condor]

It's not like they made a Star Wars prequel.

[silk cape]

This.

[visual spade]

I mean, Hildibrand obviously works on cartoon logic that other things don't

[bold condor]

What they said is it's not that deep.

[maiden lodge]

Meaning they took 'ahaha yeah he's named the same, ahaha maybe they're connected teehee' and turning it into 'yes he's named the same, maybe he's connected.'

[visual spade]

But if you're super autsy, you could argue Hildibrand just has "unique aether properties"

[bold condor]

They didn't say that.

[maiden lodge]

The second paragraph literally states the intent was that it was a new, and different world.

[bold condor]

But this is what I mean about taking this shit too seriously.

[pine epoch]

anonymoose joke theory is you can tell hildy canon when its imagination and when its real if godbert wears pants

[torpid yoke]

its specifically thet susanno axe and byakko spear

[silk cape]

I'm gonna protest the use of "autsy" in this case.

[maiden lodge]

So that implies, strongly, the intent was NEVER there that it's the same or connected one

[ashen violet]

I'm uh still not very over the tower boss so have a pishposh collage of comparing the rhythm bosses

[maiden lodge]

He then states that the similarities to FF7 were accidental

[bold condor]

I feel like arguing this further defeats my point because it requires me to go in depth explaining that canon isn't important.

You're treating the word "canon" like it makes some kind of major impact on the world of FFX or FFVII.

[visual spade]

Well, FF7R confirms it anyawy

[bold condor]

It's just a joke, the creators made a funny connection, it can still be true while also being a joke they didn't expect anyone to take seriously.

[visual spade]

So, it's a joke that's now real

[bold condor]

It's not like Tidus is showing up in 7R.

...Then again, maybe he will.

[visual spade]

You literally see Shinra as a grown up in a photo

Of the original founders of the company

[maiden lodge]

No, I'm just stating that insisting it's canon after the writer (who did both interviews) states that his intent was that the worlds were dissimilar and not connected and that the similarities after the fact were completely accidental... is just clinging to a canonicty that doesn't and never existed

[bold condor]

I mean, I'm willing to call that an Easter Egg but it's also part of the game.

I feel like I'm trying to

[maiden lodge]

Yeah, it's an easter-egg

[visual spade]

Easter Egg or no, that's too much effort to not basically mean it's somehow true.

Romka is right, it doesn't matter much

[bold condor]

Like oh my god this is actually more frustrating to explain

Than a normal conversation with Dis

[visual spade]

But it is now 'confirmed'.

[silk cape]

Whatever, it's a joke.

[visual spade]

Yeah, and a good one.

[bold condor]

That's literally what I'm trying to say, yeah.

[visual spade]

I'm glad they leaned into it.

[ashen violet]

so how did this talk about canon happen anyway

[maiden lodge]

I mean, Rom, I think the fan-need for 'canonicity' is inherently stupid and misses the point entirely

[bold condor]

Yes, that's what I'm getting at.

[silk cape]

Well, different strokes for different folks.

[bold condor]

People try to fit the lore of things they like into neat little boxes when, honestly, a lot of the time, the creator's just having fun with something.

Sometimes 2B eats the mackerel and that's part of the game and it's as canon as anything else..

[maiden lodge]

Yeah. Like for example, PT and Metal Gear Solid

Yes, PT's radio thing is in MGSVPP.

[bold condor]

And sometimes a thing from a different franchise causes a whole raid series to happen.

[maiden lodge]

That... doesn't... make them intrinsicly tied stories where the reference matters any more than metacommentary on Kojima and Konami.

[dim sigil]

That's more because it's like connecting everything as much as you can is veryfun
but other people can see see it as very dumb

[heady shadow]

tbf people been wanting a nier raid for years

[bold condor]

I don't see it as smart or dumb, it's more how hard you cling to it.

[maiden lodge]

It also depends on the property.

[bold condor]

Like, with something like Star Wars people get real heated about canon info.

[silk cape]

If anyone asks in earnest "are there any cases where the FF games are connected to one another?" I'm going to say no, because the whole gag of 7/10/7R is just a gag. To the same extent that Gilgamesh being the same dude hopping between games is just a gag. Whether it's canon or not is immaterial because it's just there for giggles and not meant to impact any of the worlds in any meaningful way.

[bold condor]

I mean Tactics and XII.

[maiden lodge]

Questioning canonicity in, say, Dragon Age... is very important because the series is designed around that level of coherency, and a retcon actually makes it feel bad

[bold condor]

Also they absolutely intended XIII, XV (Versus XIII), and Type-0 (Agito XIII) to all connect.

[dim sigil]

An example would ve the zelda timeline some people roll their eyes and think its the stupidest thing ever, me i love it and massively improves my enjoyment of the games

[maiden lodge]

Canonicity in Zelda as a franchise is like... fuck man, making timelines a thing hasn't made the series better or more coherent.

[silk cape]

Well... that was certainly the initial intent, sure.

[maiden lodge]

XIII and Type-0 do connect

[silk cape]

I don't think that ultimately survived into 15 in any meaningful fashion.

[maiden lodge]

XV kinda got taken out of it

[bold condor]

People say this but really most of the Zelda timeline is ridiculously easy to suss out from the context of the games and the only surprise is that the backstory they gave you in ALttP is accurate.

[dim sigil]

The ceith mark can still be found in 15

Its a on a playing card in any of the camping tents not a big left over but its there

[maiden lodge]

I mean ALttP is accurate because they made OOT to be referred to by it.

[bold condor]

I was more referring to the Downfall Timeline.

[maiden lodge]

But once you get into all the side games... it doesn't matter, each game just kinda... stands on its own.

[bold condor]

In ALttP they established that the Sages gave their lives to seal Ganon and there's no mention of a previous hero, so you could technically theorize that the hero probably failed and died since that backstory doesn't match the events of either timeline shown in OoT.

[dim sigil]

All the games definitely stand on their own but it's incredibly fun to try to connect them

[bold condor]

And since we know Zelda II follows Zelda 1 and ALttP is before Zelda 1, that's the whole downfall timeline's major games already arranged.

[maiden lodge]

I... guess? OoT didn't really display 'timelines' in its ending either.

[bold condor]

Not directly, but the split was canon by the next major game's release.

[dim sigil]

Majora?

[bold condor]

Referring to TWW not MM, which is a very good asset flip made to tide people over.

[torpid yoke]

And then there's breath of the wild

[maiden lodge]

TWW doesn't really... care... about time lines either.

[bold condor]

Yes it does, its literal setting is a take off of OoT's Adult side ending and Ganondorf himself is motivated entirely by the events of OoT.

[maiden lodge]

No, that's explanation after the fact.

[dim sigil]

Botw was clearly made without timeline limitations and devs dont care but its fun to think of how it could fit

[bold condor]

Wha.

[dim sigil]

It's definitely after the fact but it still works pretty well

[maiden lodge]

Nothing in TWW cares about timelines or refers to them. It just tells a story where Ganon won. It doesn't try to say 'when' or 'where', or make any statements other than that. At some point, Ganon wins, the world is flooded.

The timelines thing is extrinsic to the story TWW tells.

[torpid yoke]

the intro talks about oot pretty much though

[bold condor]

What are you talking about the opening LITERALLY tells you the hero in that backstory was the HERO OF TIME.

They LITERALLY have murals of the specific sages from OoT in the game.

[dim sigil]

All it really says is that he was gone

[maiden lodge]

And describes said Hero of Time doing things that the OOT hero never did

[bold condor]

No it doesn't.

[dim sigil]

Nothing about timelines

[torpid yoke]

Link being sent back is the whole reason hyrule was flooded

[maiden lodge]

Yes... it does.

[bold condor]

What does it say he did?

[maiden lodge]

It said he used a sage from the Kokori (a male, not Saria), and a sage from the Zora (not Ruto) in order to give power to his sword.

[bold condor]

No it did not.

[maiden lodge]

Yes it did.

[bold condor]

No it did not. It said that those sages' prayers empower the Master Sword.

[maiden lodge]

And those sages were in the temples of Earth and Wind respectively

[bold condor]

The Hero of Time is never even IMPLIED to have met Fado or Laruto.

[maiden lodge]

And they appear as ghosts to their decendants

[torpid yoke]

arnt the earth and wind temple new to ww though since they were never mentioned in OOT

[bold condor]

I'm aware of what they appear as, I'm saying you're incorrect that the game ever states the Hero of Time met them.

Because it never does that.

[maiden lodge]

So how can they be the sages of those temples of the Hero of Time loses and those temples are flooded?

[dim sigil]

Oot forest was originally wind confirmed by beta leaks but that's probably not canon

[bold condor]

The Hero of Time didn't lose.

[torpid yoke]

the hero of time won in that timeline. The flood happens because zelda sent him back

[bold condor]

The Hero of Time vanished.

[dim sigil]

He ceased to exist when he was sent back at the end of Ocarina in that timeline

[maiden lodge]

Okay, fine, but then Ganon wins, right

[pastel coyote]

Just like the Wol

[dim sigil]

Gannon broke out after a undetermined amount of time

[bold condor]

He comes back after being sealed away, which is what he promises he'll do at the end of OoT, yes.

[torpid yoke]

ganon returns and the people pray to the gods to do something. They flood everything

[maiden lodge]

Okay. So follow me here.

[torpid yoke]

They uh....dont pull no punches

[bold condor]

And again

[maiden lodge]

Pretend timelines don't exist (because when WW was released they didn't)

[bold condor]

Yes they did.

[maiden lodge]

Nothing WW does implies a timeline thing happening

[bold condor]

Yes it does.

[ashen violet]

should i come back later?

[maiden lodge]

because in OOT, canonically, in the game, directly--that's exactly what happens

[bold condor]

Just because you say something authoritatively doesn't make it true.

[torpid yoke]

i mean it implies that its following after the end of OOT

[maiden lodge]

There is no version of OOT where link stays an adult

When WW is released--that's it, that's the ONLY version of events there are.

[bold condor]

Dis he didn't stay Adult in TWW either.

[torpid yoke]

(Plus hyrule historia puts it in its own timeline after OOT anyways) Unless thats a fan one too

[maiden lodge]

Right, so how does TWW insist timelines exist when it just follows exactly what OOT does.

and exactly what it shows you?

[bold condor]

Because the story literally only makes sense of the Triforce is split across three people.

[maiden lodge]

Which is exactly what happens in TWW.

[bold condor]

No, the Triforce is split from the beginning of TWW.

Because it was split during OoT.

[torpid yoke]

Are you arguing that there is no timeline but just different stories that all happen from different results?

[maiden lodge]

Right, but TWW follows the timeline that is already the canonical ending of OOT

[bold condor]

Hold on let's go to DMs

[torpid yoke]

i wanted to know the conclusion though QuQ

[heady shadow]

im sure they'll say the conclusion in a hour or so

[dim sigil]

Then go to a battle not for Mortal eyes

[dim sigil]

You can come back now

[somber storm]

Nerd eyes

[torpid yoke]

Tell your friend to have their eyes check again for another scythe shape XD

[ashen violet]

ANYWAY. if they come up with how the machines got in contact with the drakengard flower eventually with the lore that comes by in nier remake that'd be splendid

[torpid yoke]

it could come from reincarnation

[somber storm]

Weeklies

[torpid yoke]

if taro wanted it to

[dim sigil]

It seems like it's a lot more implication for the neir series while adding nothing to 14

[torpid yoke]

or like madlaw said could be reveled in the weeklies

[dim sigil]

Yeah the story technically isn't over

[ashen violet]

considering it's basically 'nier automata/drakengard catching the first in its woes' as the setting it does work like that yeah

[dim sigil]

Its a shame

[heady shadow]

i mean its there but the second image is bad.
but thats okay xD

[torpid yoke]

its a axe and a spear

[dim sigil]

I doubt theyre gonnna throw in the styche if there will be one on open anyway

[ashen violet]

why do i feel like zenos is going to grab a gun

[heady shadow]

nah your missing it, try looking at the first image better

its further back from those

[ashen violet]

and also wasn't there this twitter post about wanting the 'meanwhile in the imperial palace' cutscenes to literally just be zenos picking up a weapon and going nah and tossing it away

[torpid yoke]

could you link it again?

[dim sigil]

It's a pretty easy thing to predict

[heady shadow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/308681531776303115/832304654914289674/SPOILER_unknown.png

right by the steps.

upside down blade

[ashen tundra]

He picked up a tenga egg

[heady shadow]

your pic is wrong angle

sucks because the image is so small

[indigo shale]

but why does the angle matter you can see its clearly an axe and lance

those 2 match up with the one you posted

[heady shadow]

because those arent in the same spot

[indigo shale]

they are

[heady shadow]

or are my eyes not seeing that its luiterally right by the first step on the big staircase

[torpid yoke]

This right?

[heady shadow]

ah i get it.

[indigo shale]

surprisingly things look different when viewed at different angles

[heady shadow]

yeah my eyes are shit

[indigo shale]

if it was a scythe they wouldnt hide it anyway

[ashen violet]

do we have any weapons to compare the handle to?

[torpid yoke]

susano axe and byakko(?) Spear

[indigo shale]

because of the cut away as zenos draws a weapon, why would they hide him revealing what we can already see

[torpid yoke]

you can see the red design on the axe from certain angles

[heady shadow]

yeah like i said, my eyes are shit.

[torpid yoke]

oh i saw i just like admiring the design

[heady shadow]

i wonder if hies weapon will have an eye in it

[ashen violet]

i wonder how they'll make the augmented versions look

[torpid yoke]

augmented versions of wa

[ashen violet]

luigi?

jokes aside though they've taken up the water aspect of it by having seiryu's weapons have that and the storm aspect by byakko's weapons so i'm wondering how they're going to make susanoo's weapons theme after

[grand parcel]

question, i heard there was some kind of new furniture that's like a TV in the game?

how d'ya get it

[ashen violet]

i remember one of them comes from tsukuyomi ex

unless those are the extra large wall decorations in which case whoops

[obsidian pagoda]

One is from Tsukuyomi EX and the other is just from the general housing vendor guy I think

[iron scaffold]

Phantasm can be brute by house supplier servant

[grand parcel]

alright, thanks

[quasi zodiac]

Wait I feel bamboozed

I thought the custom delivery was going to be fixing the brume, not helping a infermary

[somber storm]

Well the Firmament is built to replace the Brume

[quasi zodiac]

The Brume still looks like a piece of shit though

[wet crown]

and it's unlikely to change

[tiny wind]

can hilda get a more prominent role tho

[wet crown]

as a main character? no

[tiny wind]

but shes cute

[balmy mesa]

Maybe in recurring sidequests, idk

[ashen tundra]

Did they add new crafting/gathering main hands for skysung or whatever

[dawn basin]

So it turns out the red girl fight has a thing where it can Jumpscare you. Idk what triggers it though, maybe it's random. But in any case

Thanks Yoko Taro you smug little pissbucket

[tropic frigate]

wait it doesnt always happen? i thought it just does it on the phase transition attack

[ashen tundra]

happened to me on my first run and I thought it was dumb as shit

[dawn basin]

I never saw it on mine. Had to image search just to find it since my Sister kept talking about it

[ashen tundra]

block more of my screen during that fight

thanks taro

[wet crown]

you don't need to see to fail at mechanics

[tropic frigate]

damn im surprised no ones repeatedly farming 2b hair at this time like they were for the armor

[ashen tundra]

Honestly the only fight I disliked because of the ocular vomit that perpetrated that fight

[dawn basin]

That is the smile of a DEMON

[balmy mesa]

does this mean that if they want the hair they have to pencil in their plans to do so

[tropic frigate]

i just mean people normally queue'd it a ton for her armor

[dawn basin]

Why would I want the hair?

I already farmed most of my soul away to get Early to Rise

[tropic frigate]

i just want to collect things

[dawn basin]

If I go for another I might just murder somebody

[balmy mesa]

I was making a shitty 2B joke

[tropic frigate]

o i havent played any of the games

[dawn basin]

You see there's a REASON why people went for the armor.

[somber storm]

Yeah that jumpscare is randomised

[dawn basin]

The leggings

[tropic frigate]

if its a line in ffxiv i also skipped it probably or just dont remember

[dawn basin]

Like thats it

The only reason why people farmed the armor coffer is because it gave our characters ASSES

[carmine basin]

It's a sign you're about to enter the hacking phase

[balmy mesa]

2B as in pencil?

[tropic frigate]

[placid sail]

the 2B hair is cute but it's no 2B ass

[humble heath]

gaaaaaaghhhhh!!!! show me the scythe you coward! show me zenos's scythe!!!

[dense hull]

i have gone over that cut scene countless times frame by frame at no point any weapon is shown that xenos picks up. there are 3 rooms they used for the video. One has part of the weapons showing this is the first room. You can see it in a few cut scenes especially the beginning. Room 2 has all the weapons loaded but very compressed space this appears in the middle and ending of the cut scenes used for mostly no movement and talking only. The final room has all the weapons spread out used to show xenos and fandaniels character movment you can tell this because in a few frames Nodhigg and the suzaku ax are close but during that final frame they are very far apart. the only way we can tell what rooms these are is if somone can find the ingame rendered room in the final scene and go inbetween the axe and nodhigg. but that cut scene may be a .mov file so no dataminers can ruin the suprise. i have a feeling his character model picked up nothing because out of the stuff shown no mined models of the weapon has appeared unless he isnt picking up a scyth but another weapon only he will use.

[drowsy belfry]

Yeah I'm gonna go out on a limb and say there was no weapon model there in the first place

Dataminers would've found it by now

They're saving the surprise for the full Endwalker Trailer/5.55

[ashen tundra]

He picked up a tenga egg

[dense hull]

anyone mined the 5.55 relic weapons yet or no

[carmine basin]

It's not in the game

[dense hull]

ok

you know whats gonna be a pain i just realised looking though the mines stuff cruise chaser isnt a pvp mount he is gonna be the moogle tome prize for fanfest

[rain onyx]

he's not from the fanfest tomes, we already have the shop table for that.

[dense hull]

really YAY

anyone know what he is from yet?

[rain onyx]

still unknown looking at search history of the discord

[carmine basin]

It's not tradeable/sellable so not loot box at least

[drowsy belfry]

Well considering Yoshi already said that Zadnor would "have an item that everybody would want"

safe guess it's a super duper rare drop from Zadnor's Castrum

[dense hull]

zondor thing Savage

[drowsy belfry]

There's no savage for Zadnor, it's just a public dungeon

[dense hull]

nice

[carmine basin]

Hopefully reward for clearing, like BA

[dense hull]

i wish i could have done ba

eureka was not nice to players starting late like basja

they did not build it with casual players in mind

[wet crown]

they didn't make Eureka without masochists in mind

look at how much they nerfed it and it's still largely a chore

[rough kestrel]

Eureka is pretty casual

You can solo your way kind of

[rain onyx]

Eureka was pretty hell before they added the challenge log for it.

[wet crown]

And added the echo.

[rain onyx]

Which was like late anemos or early pagos.

[wet crown]

And increased drop rates.
And increased light gains.

[rain onyx]

It's definitely one of the easier relics to do the second time around due to not needing to level/do story

[wet crown]

And lowered the level requirement for some aetherrytes

[rain onyx]

and you can stockpile the entire relic

[gaunt star]

We all know he,s welding the new fishing rod

[rain onyx]

Also if you can manage to run BA a few times, the Elemental +2 gear makes you a god in eureka

It's basically magicite in every element.

My WHM with what's basically BiS Eureka stuff can solo the bunny fates with little effort.

[torpid orchid]

in-game model for you 😉

[wet crown]

is that the new pre-order earring?

[torpid orchid]

Yeah

[clever flume]

ye

[wind bough]

Menphina huh

[wet crown]

do we have its effects?

[torpid orchid]

noticed the images they posted were the ones I tweeted yesterday.

just the standard Lv 80 & below EXP buff

[wet crown]

adaptive stats again?

[torpid orchid]

yeah

[wet crown]

is it 30% bonus EXP again?

[torpid orchid]

yup

[wet crown]

poor Bozjan earrings

[torpid orchid]

||Menphina's earring

Increases EXP earned by 30% when level 80 and below. Attributes and item level vary according to class/job and current level when equipped.||

[wet crown]

Well, hope people get that every job will want to wear this right as we start EW

[torpid orchid]

if they don't have any i530 earrings, these will be a good choice

[wet crown]

the 30% exp still works at 80, is my point

[torpid orchid]

If any expansion has taught me, normally your max ilevel gear from previous expansion is good to around Lv. x5-x7 before you need to start changing out the gear

but with the stat reduction I have a feeling that might no longer be the case.

[wet crown]

or the reverse

[torpid orchid]

I doubt it'll be the opposite tbh

the defence stat scaling is what kept us able to keep the gear on for longer, if they're reducing it but keeping the scaling the same (won't know until when the expan drops) might need to gear up more often.

[wind bough]

https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Alfonse FFWiki is good actually

[drowsy belfry]

The Previous Expansion's max Ilevel cap can last you well into X5-X7 however you will get new gear thanks to the leveling loot system they implemented, so if you start getting upgrades it's always nice to put that on

[wary pond]

is zenos becoming pld main now?

or was it drk

i saw 2 potential swords near that rdm suzaku weapon

[wind bough]

Probably scythe.

[carmine basin]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/678114017339768832/831949789154377758/SPOILER_niv37k1lu2t61.png

He's CUL now

[wary pond]

lol

i saw no scythe

[wind bough]

you cracked it

[rain onyx]

just like eggs

[wind bough]

Yeah there's nothing actually in his hand. It's being hidden from us.

But c'mon it's probably a scythe. Why else even hide it if it's just some sword

To build new job hype

[wary pond]

if he becomes pld or dri

[carmine basin]

Was other jobs as hyped as this before

[wary pond]

it make sense why we become pld

[wind bough]

There's no chance he's gonna be using one of the weapons that were actually visible in that scene, which are all existing player weapons

[wary pond]

in 6.0

[wind bough]

Zenos rocks up with Faust lance

[carmine basin]

He's using the mogstation tonberry knife

[wary pond]

damn zenos farmed alot of EXs but he didnt get mounts

also another question

i may have forgetten 5.4 details but who is telophoroi again ( i assume its fandaniel real name just like emet real name is hades )

[wind bough]

It's Fandaniel's "group"

i.e. him, Zenos and a bunch of tempered. Possibly others we don't know about.

[wary pond]

a faction then ok

[wind bough]

Yeah, hence why the robots in Paglth'an are called "telotek"

[placid sail]

so Endbringers

the Telophoroi are neither Bringers of Light nor Bringers of Shadow, they're Bringers of the End

[wind bough]

No, not Endbringers unless the devs made a mistake in their Greek translation (which they could have, idk)

Literally "end of that which was brought" or "Final Tribute"

Or it's deliberately a weird portmanteau that's not necessarily perfect Greek grammar but is meant to mean "bearers of the end".

[placid sail]

oh

I wouldn't be surprised if "bringers of the end" is what they had in mind

because the Ascians refer to us as the "Bringer of Light" on occasion

[faint dagger]

late to the party but i'm almost certain this goes off every time in the raidwide prior to the hacking section

sublime transcendence iirc

[crystal arrow]

yeah it's a raidwide, it scared the shit out of me

[faint dagger]

hadn't considered that's the first time you actually see that if you haven't played automata, which makes it even funnier

[wet crown]

I'm just gonna muddy the telo- stuff and just say it stands for death and is meant as a new version of the Terminus beasts.

[faint dagger]

if you have, you sorta expect it

[crystal arrow]

I was expecting some fuckery but not that

[wet crown]

[crystal arrow]

also https://twitter.com/qestirs/status/1382904027697008647?s=20

lyss 🍑 @ semi-hiatus (@qestirs)

thanks yoko taro https://t.co/y0xTcDwBE0

Retweets

1730

Likes

2104

Twitter · Apr 16, 2021, 3:49 AM

[hollow vigil]

Jjjk

[wary pond]

looking at trial again

i guess we gonna fight alot of lunar primals

saw ifrit ravana and odin

[crystal arrow]

yeah, seems like a solo instance where we play as graha

[wary pond]

also idk if graha can swap jobs in the instance

he was pld at mobs
then he became white mage at ravana

[crystal arrow]

graha is an "all rounder" so maybe that's a mechanic in the instance?

[wary pond]

inb4 its beta test for ppl swapping jobs mid content

i guess im too hopeful

there is that thing that shot a ball on a airship like cid one

i assume bismarck

[stiff charm]

that would be bozja content but idk maybe bozja people got a donation from damdaniel

[gaunt star]

@ the pre-order earring, will it become available before 6.0 drops

[clever flume]

yeah

well the other ones did but depends i guess when pre orders open

[crystal arrow]

probably

but you can get the same thing from bozja by approving 1k fragments

[wary pond]

but it was 10

[stiff charm]

i would assume fanfest but might be later

[gaunt star]

For 10% instrad

[wary pond]

not 30

[stiff charm]

wait huh

[crystal arrow]

it's just a 10% increase but pretty helpful nonetheless

[torpid orchid]

imo that extra 20% is useful in the long run.

[crystal arrow]

for sure, my comment was mostly sarcasm cuz the majority of people would never unlock that

[torpid orchid]

should be yeah, might hear about when we can pre-order next month.

[wary pond]

the question is how summoning lunar primals will lead to summoning the terminus mobs from the end of days

[crystal arrow]

but me? i'm not sane https://i.imgur.com/FFFx4P5.png

[gaunt star]

Pog. Shame I'm already nearly all 80 though

[crystal arrow]

just use it for reaper and sage then

[clever flume]

can just buy fragments tho

[crystal arrow]

true but they're expensive on my dc

[wary pond]

fragmetns cost 3 digits of gil

[torpid orchid]

tbh fragments are super easy to obtain

[gaunt star]

Tru

[wary pond]

should be easy to have 700k gil to buy 1000

[torpid orchid]

Only use I'll get out of leveling is the 2 new jobs next expansion

[gaunt star]

Pretty earring at least. Better than an aetheryte

[ruby hull]

That's correct

Telos (end) + Phoroi (plural of Phoros, deriving from Phero which is the verb meaning Bring)

aka Endbringers

[crystal arrow]

also what's up with lunar bahamut's title card? his title was "telotherium"

[wind bough]

But Greek grammar isn't English grammar 👀

Telophoros = end of that which is brought

So, either deliberate or accidental shoddy Greek

Or "Final Tribute" which is a pretty nice interpretation

[wet crown]

the earrings still work at 80

[placid sail]

remember that during the first Final Days, everything was called "Terminus"

[wet crown]

you'll wear them on all jobs for 1 more level at least

[placid sail]

Terminus is Roman

and Telo is Greek

as far as I can tell they don't have the exact same definition though

According to Merriam-Webster: "In the Roman empire, a terminus was a boundary stone, and all boundary stones had a minor god associated with them, whose name was Terminus. Terminus was a kind of keeper of the peace, since wherever there was a terminus there could be no arguments about where your property ended and your neighbor's property began. So Terminus even had his own festival, the Terminalia, when images of the god were draped with flower garlands. Today the word shows up in all kinds of places, including in the name of numerous hotels worldwide built near a city's railway terminus."

[wind bough]

Telo is a prefix, not a word on its own (the individual word would be telos). It means the end of something, or final.

[placid sail]

you know... based on this definition... I almost wonder if there was a Dark Souls kind of thing going on, where the era of the Ancients was supposed to come to an end as the natural cycle of things, and they tried to artificially extend it

[wind bough]

If it's intended to mean "Bearers of the End" then either they got it wrong or they deliberately portmanteaued telos by removing its last letter English-style

[placid sail]

so rather than "endbearers" the term would mean something closer to "the final bearers"?

[wind bough]

e.g. telophase -- final phase in mitosis

yeah, lol

[placid sail]

the last of the bearers

[wind bough]

Or, last things that were brought

Hence the "Final Tribute" interpretation

[balmy mesa]

the final dragon

[unreal wadi]

https://twitter.com/Shino_Kayakis/status/1383042070911197191?s=19

しの (@Shino_Kayakis)

さいっきょ！！！！！！！！

Twitter · Apr 16, 2021, 12:58 PM

who do I kill

[balmy mesa]

Bahamut is referred to as "Telotherium"

Origin: Ancient Greek θήρ (thḗr). Meaning: beast. Used for supposedly monstrous animals. The suffix "-therium" is often used to denote extinct mammals.

[wind bough]

Final beast 👀

[clever flume]

so basically "Final beast"

[balmy mesa]

that said, wiki definition says

Telos (/ˈtɛ.lɒs/; Greek: τέλος, translit. télos, lit. "end, 'purpose', or 'goal")[1] is a term used by philosopher Aristotle to refer to the full potential or inherent purpose or objective of a person or thing,[2] similar to the notion of an 'end goal' or 'raison d'être'. Moreover, it can be understood as the "supreme end of man's endeavour".[3]

[wary perch]

Th dragon mobs are also telosomething

[balmy mesa]

telodragon, I think?

wow, wtf,
they drop materia

[clever flume]

all 80 dungeons have a chance to drop materia from the mobs

[balmy mesa]

that's pretty cool though

miss the days where materia was 20k per piece back in SB

SO, I've noticed that the hotfixes SE implemented have resulted in instances seeming to perform worse than they used to

[wet crown]

wouldn't Telotherium better work as Beast of the End in our context?

[balmy mesa]

supreme beast of the end sounds about right

[teal geyser]

Grandmaster supreme beast overlord of the end

[wind bough]

Y'know I'm pretty excited that the big bad of the game's final arc ended up basically being the Lambs of Dalamud V2

[balmy mesa]

...and knuckles, featuring dante

[teal geyser]

Could you imagine if they actually showed up after the tease they did in EE2?

[misty yoke]

SMT:3 Alliance raid when?

[balmy mesa]

ooh, which page?

[teal geyser]

I'll find it

[wind bough]

furiously flips pages

[teal geyser]

Also "thousands" what the fuck

[wind bough]

024!

[pastel coyote]

[wind bough]

and 025

damnit

[balmy mesa]

lambs of dalamud would be an excellent brick thrown at our faces
they're fond of doing that with random shit from earlier expansions

[teal geyser]

They be teasing some weird resurgence

[balmy mesa]

hmm, the dusk mother 🤔
would that be the opposite of Azem?

[teal geyser]

Opposite of Azim

[wary perch]

I miss the day when materia is 100k minimum

[wind bough]

Nhaama and Azim are the Xaela's gods. (Well, they're involved with the creation myth of all Au Ra but we don't know to what extent the Raen population still observes that tradition. Maybe the ones that still apparently live in mountain enclaves...)

[balmy mesa]

this is ridiculous, I need another retainer

[misty yoke]

Dont we all man

[wind bough]

The Raen are said to be the children of Azim, and the Xaela the children of Nhaama. The Oronir are a clan of Xaela who think that they are also children of Azim unlike the rest of Xaela, which is great for confusing people trying to learn the lore.

[balmy mesa]

why won't people buy my shit

[balmy mesa]

idk man, I think it's good to get a different perspective on in-game lore - after all, religion is messy

[misty yoke]

Ig people are liking crafting and gathering more

[balmy mesa]

and I want my damn bozja runners' headgear to sell already - prices are around 980k atm

[teal geyser]

Man the Oronir are kinda fucked up. In the MSQ Magnai was like "Oh yes we are Azim's children and we must rule over Nhaama's children to protect them and love them...through force

[misty yoke]

Patience man. The more you chase the gil the more empty you’ll feel

[wind bough]

Xaela be like that

[balmy mesa]

joke's on them I already feel empty anyway

[faint dagger]

oronir always struck me as 'we needed an excuse to be better and racism is a good one'

[misty yoke]

[teal geyser]

It's one step away from like "Women can't work jobs, they should be kept in homes where they are safe and the men can watch over them and keep them happy"

[balmy mesa]

"their brains might overheat"

[faint dagger]

come to think of it, what were the oronir women doing anyway

[strange wing]

S t u f f

[misty yoke]

Things

[faint dagger]

cause as opposed to the Mol and the Dotharl, I seem to remember 'not much'

[clever flume]

same as the male oronir

[wind bough]

The same stuff as the men

[misty yoke]

Like playing yanxian yugioh

[clever flume]

male and female aren't given separate roles

[balmy mesa]

so, triple triad?

[strange wing]

When Sadu and Magni hook up I expect some cultural changes

[misty yoke]

With more rules

[balmy mesa]

I don't think Sadu's all that hot for Magnai tho

[clever flume]

like one of the npcs in the dawn throne is teaching the two dudes how to wrestle, and is female

[strange wing]

She's textbook bully love interest. Although she'd be a better fit for the WoL. Or zenos I guess.

[balmy mesa]

yandere?

[strange wing]

Love through murderboners

[stiff charm]

dont bully me, miss sadu!

[pastel coyote]

No, Zenos is yandere

[balmy mesa]

also reset is in 55 minutes and I'm because I miss the 2am reset (since my timezone went back an hour)
also I have legitimate concerns about some members of my FC - they've already done 99 runs of diamond ex

[teal geyser]

Honestly imagine if Zenos heard of the Dotharl

[stiff charm]

how

[strange wing]

Reset? But it's like friday

[balmy mesa]

daily reset tho

[stiff charm]

he would genocide them, zenos is fightsexual

[strange wing]

Imagine if Zenos met Omega and lived through his fight hell for all time.

I guess there would be a Shinryu raid series in that case.

[stiff charm]

assuming omega is 6.0 (if we get 2 ultimates) they could integrate zenos as one of the fights if the ultimate is just "omega want to see big fight and then fight you itself"

[strange wing]

Omega Ultimate would be fun.

[stiff charm]

cant wait for that from the heavens remix

probably just the orchestral version from eorzean symphony but thats fine

[rough kestrel]

You know I often wonder if a female WoL really shifts the tone of Zenos's obsession with you

[stiff charm]

idk, ive always unironically seen zenos as completely uninterested in anything other than fighting

seeing any zenos simpage on twitter feels like its not zenos to me lol

[rough kestrel]

And you're right, he's probably Asexual, but in a more joking sense I feel like some people would read it as "Dude he's obsessed with this girl"

[coarse pond]

So many people playing girls they think Zenos has crush on them

[rough kestrel]

I play a male WoL so I always read it as dudes fighting manly fights.

[gaunt star]

if they are going to have an ultimate it should be thordan

[coarse pond]

This

That's the exactly that

But people get the uwu context when they play female

[stiff charm]

i and my wol are both disaster bi so i think everyone has a crush o nme

[rough kestrel]

Yeah thats what I kind of wondered, if it feels different playing a female.

[gaunt star]

for me its 2 dudes fighting over who has the super primal weapon collection

[coarse pond]

Well, graha just feels Bi while Zenos is as you said, man wanting manly fight

[gaunt star]

graha is super gay for my wol can tell.

[coarse pond]

Ye

Graha defo bi

[balmy mesa]

graha is a nerd

[rough kestrel]

I get those vibes too, I don't like catboys just in general, I cannot stand their entire vibe, Graha is only kind of tolerable.

[coarse pond]

Makes him even more adorable

[gaunt star]

and alisae has massive crush on wol for sure

[rough kestrel]

I think they eased off on that a bit

[coarse pond]

We don't talk about Ali, she is underage

She just admires you. End of discuss

[teal geyser]

[pastel coyote]

Well underage, depend of the country you kn........

[rough kestrel]

No but its like a schoolgirl crush thing she had for awhile, but the game/story has left little room to have those moments, so it might have passed.

[balmy mesa]

also zenos wants to just erm, sheathe his sword in you

[gaunt star]

i didnt even realise she was underage.not like she could compete with merlwyb anyway

[rough kestrel]

HAVE YOU THE STRENGTH!?

[coarse pond]

Sounds like Tencent and certain fire bird

Tencent, Tencent it is I! Sheathe your sword I beg of you

[balmy mesa]

that bird is going to horny jail

[gaunt star]

i notice ultros gave up on trying to seduce the ladys of eorza and just spends his days now as a striking dummy for blus

[teal geyser]

My favourite company Tencent™️

[pastel coyote]

I don't need to ask but how do you plan to..... disguise our dear lord Charlemend ?

[viscid monolith]

It pays the bills

[pastel coyote]

Maybe we should talk about Aenor to him

[gaunt star]

chicken suit

[rough kestrel]

What's Zenos going to do if he loses again, gif up and become a good guy? I fucking laughed realizing that he actually considered it briefly once he found a body, but then was like "No I need my rematch!"

[teal geyser]

Ultros isn't man enough for her

[pastel coyote]

How do we get it ?

[rough kestrel]

Does the NPC glam system allow armor?

[viscid monolith]

Die

[gaunt star]

grindadia.hatchling event

[clever flume]

has to be gear all classes can equip

[rough kestrel]

@viscid monolith I'm not sure he can, unless we just delete him outright.

[gaunt star]

still annoyed they weouldnt let us glam the dragon

[pastel coyote]

wait..... there an event right know ?

[torpid yoke]

If he becomes a good guy that'd be incredibly dumb imo

[gaunt star]

there is

[pastel coyote]

why i never know that

[viscid monolith]

We can kill Zenos like an Ascian

[gaunt star]

maybe you dont look at lodestone? xd

[balmy mesa]

I wonder if Zenos will ever go to the "Body Shop"
"hmm, no, that's not fast enough"
"too expensive, costs an arm and a leg"

[gaunt star]

most fc discords usualy have any updates on lodestone autolinked

[rough kestrel]

It's possible due to his motivations @torpid yoke He might not be a good good guy, but I could see a modicum of potential where he just goes "Alright, I'll chill, kill time, then we'll fight again someday, yes? If not I may get rowdy again"

[pastel coyote]

If people don't spam me during the night i wouldn't know we have E3 or some shit this year

[viscid monolith]

The only problem is getting him out of his body

[clever flume]

better yet why dont you pay attention to the little blurb that tells you an event is running when you log in

[rough kestrel]

The Zenos body is a weapon unto it's self.

[torpid yoke]

yea i can see him becoming a Gilgamesh type person but not a good guy

wander the land collecting weapons to fight with and such

[rough kestrel]

The superior Garlean body is a marvelous thing indeed

Like a Saiyan's body in a way

[gaunt star]

my concern is actually them streamlining zenos as this reoccuring villain and not killing him off.Like 'oh no it's zenos up to his old tricks again'

[coarse pond]

!juicy

[balmy mesa]

!faq juicy

[lusty shadow]

Juicy

[coarse pond]

Thank

[balmy mesa]

could be fun in side quests though
kinda like Hildibrand
but like, y'know, repeatable and random

[rough kestrel]

In that image he just looks like he could be Lyse but bigger

Lyse: Who are you?
Zenos: I'm you but juicier

[dawn wave]

surely they’ll resolve zenos’s shit in endwalker

[gaunt star]

make it random encounter.and have him randomly attack you anywhere at any time xd

[dawn wave]

they’ve been teasing him too long and bringing him back AGAIN after EW is gonna feel so cheap lol

[balmy mesa]

so kind of like Odin?

[gaunt star]

I dont think they are so braindead that they'll keep him

[viscid monolith]

There isn't ending where Zenos lives. He's an existential threat to all life on the planet.

[gaunt star]

more like majima anywhere kind of scenario xd

[rough kestrel]

Depending on how he responds to the WoL in EW I'd be okay with him surviving, but I do not think he will.

[teal geyser]

Dw just bump him on his head so he forgets

[rough kestrel]

@teal geyser ZENOS TSUKI ARC

[coarse pond]

Am not sure if we resolve anything

We are on 5.5 and only NOW Scions actually think about WoLs connection to Hydaleyn

[balmy mesa]

nah, he's like Susano in that he revels in the fight
Fanny is just a convenient way for him to come along

[rough kestrel]

LETS GOOOOOOO

[teal geyser]

Also dw, the game will force us to be like "hey I'll try to understand Zenos and make him good instead of just knowing he needs to die" again Lance

[torpid yoke]

they could find a way :)

[gaunt star]

yeah scions finally bringing up the fact that hydaleyn been acting sus

[rough kestrel]

Maybe he'll be like "I'm just gonna live on the moon, fear not, I'll leave Hydaelyn alone"

[coarse pond]

When Y'shtola finally asked the question when I last heard Hydaleyn I was like FINALLY SOMEONE ASKED THAT QUESTION AND IT'S NOT SHRUGGED OUT

[gaunt star]

Not sure much sus as her just not communicating AT ALL

[rough kestrel]

@coarse pond Y'shtola asking the meta questions.

[dawn wave]

that’s sus

[gaunt star]

that itself is pretty sus

Which she had valid reasons for considering shes been drained of energy for 3 patches

[torpid yoke]

not really since we knew she was weak before

[rough kestrel]

I've been shouting forever "WE LEARN EVERYTHING AND NO "Hey so uh..." from Hydy?" Come on woman, what's keeping you!

[viscid monolith]

I threw up in my mouth when they made us say "We'll try to understand Fandaniel"

[rough kestrel]

"We'll try to fan the flames of his demise"

[balmy mesa]

Zenos and Fandaniel will get Ishikawa'd

[indigo shale]

I hope ishikawa doesnt take him in this direction, just let the man be a fight horny bastard, he doesnt need to be anymore than that

[gaunt star]

No need to try to understand a Kefka clone. And that's an insult to Kefka btw

[balmy mesa]

that's like "isekai'd", but with competent writing, I guess?

[gaunt star]

its bound to happen just so he gives us some more sobs stories about the ascians and fills out the lore

[rough kestrel]

I think Zenos is going to die being pity'd by the WoL

[balmy mesa]

nah he'll die happy

[gaunt star]

No understanding. Understand this Lance through your throat

[rough kestrel]

And the WoL will pity that because he's obviously broken

[balmy mesa]

no sob story, but it'd be nice to learn more about how and why he's nuttier than squirrel turds

[coarse pond]

Zenos wants his fight. He will probably get it and die because we have plot armor

[dawn wave]

we already have a zenos sob story and he totally doesn’t care. dude’s got zero empathy left lol

[gaunt star]

why though?they have the same hobbies.killing everything

No pity. Only violence. Glorious violence

[rough kestrel]

Give Zenos a Gaia arc!

[balmy mesa]

give Zenos Gaia's lips 👁️ 👄👁️

[dawn wave]

agree

[rough kestrel]

Hold on then.

[gaunt star]

!faq juicy

[lusty shadow]

Juicy

[coarse pond]

Fuck Zenos. I just want to know what's up with WoL and Hydaleyn

[balmy mesa]

you're going to photoshop Gaia's lips onto Zenos aren't you?

[gaunt star]

if anything i'd be hyped.like a guy willed himself back from the dead just for a rematch.worthy opponent.

[indigo shale]

i dont think he willed himself, it just sort of happened and he just didnt care and wanted to fight us again, he would have fought us in the elezen body if we werent at the first

[dawn wave]

wow how romantic

[gaunt star]

either that or.'i hate this guy but atleast i get to kill him twice'

[dawn wave]

nah zenos literally thinks he and wol are pals because he doesn’t understand what friendship means

[coarse pond]

Besides, Zenos and Fandaniel might as well be the start of the new post Hydaleyn and Zodiark arc

[gaunt star]

i play male roe warrior.it's all about the fighting for me

[coarse pond]

Aka seeing them two for next 3 expansions

[dawn wave]

battle is part of male bonding it works out

[coarse pond]

[gaunt star]

i shed a tear when ardbert bro axed me

[iron scaffold]

Indeed

[teal geyser]

[dawn wave]

[indigo shale]

i doubt they'll keep zenos and fandaniel alive, idk wtf we as the WoL would be doing to let them live for 3 expansions

[coarse pond]

It's Yoship

[gaunt star]

My fav moment of the patch was Gaius being badass again. His Prae theme blasting as he OHKOd VvV

[coarse pond]

He will find a way

[gaunt star]

fandnaniel reminds me of wormtongue from lord of the rings

[indigo shale]

nah, at most ishikawa will just give them sob stories and devalue their characters

[gaunt star]

he's just an annoy lacky who's never any real threat

Also The Black Wolf (ULTIMATE) incoming?

[torpid yoke]

i mean its not like we intentionally let him live the first time XD

[gaunt star]

gib

[indigo shale]

I know

[gaunt star]

unless we used the echo to send him a rematch invitation

[indigo shale]

we'll most likely bind his soul with auracite so he cant come back

[gaunt star]

So he'll definitely come back

[coarse pond]

Well then that might have fall under the category: Zenos is our another part like Adbert at this point

[iron scaffold]

Fan is going get off'd hard by WoL and Emet but Zeno's might stick around in some form, probably go off on a journey to the new world

[gaunt star]

No, hes not

[iron scaffold]

or live in the steppes

[coarse pond]

Like we still might have arc of finding remaining WoL parts

[gaunt star]

Live in the Steppe with waifu Sadu. i approve

[coarse pond]

On all remaining worlds

[indigo shale]

no, it means his resonant/stolen echo can allow him to body hop, it has nothing to do with being shards of anyone

[iron scaffold]

delete this

[teal geyser]

Pin this

[iron scaffold]

NOOO

[gaunt star]

i assume after next expansion we will just be known as random dude'aka former warrior of light

confused boner noises

[coarse pond]

[balmy mesa]

I honestly doubt it - they're clearly tied to the HvZ story line

[iron scaffold]

Nah WoL being WoL but doing something

[balmy mesa]

this is cursed
could someone add this to Kupo Bot? @drowsy belfry?

[gaunt star]

also i wonder if we go to the moon.will there be space fishijng and what will we catch?

[indigo shale]

whales

[coarse pond]

One is certain, Zenos will turn against Fandaniel for the touching story.

That's just my guts at this point

[balmy mesa]

Zenos really doesn't give a shit about Fandaniel

[indigo shale]

maybe, but i hope its not for anything touching, just zenos being fed up of his shit, as we saw a bit of at the end of this patch

[gaunt star]

you mean along the lines of zenos gettign annoyed with him and killing him and then wol feeling sorry because it turns out that fandaniel wasnt sucha abd guy after all

[coarse pond]

Yup

[gaunt star]

I hope they don't try to redeem either of them

That would ruin their characters thus far

[iron scaffold]

https://tenor.com/view/pfft-water-spit-lol-gif-14367879

[balmy mesa]

considering how much of a dick Asahi was (and Fanny taking his punchable-face appearance) I doubt they'll bother making him look good

[gaunt star]

what im looking forward to is the adventures of gaius of wol in Garlemand.i wonder who's hated more there at this stage xd

[rough kestrel]

So uh, due to the Gaia pic I found lining up so perfectly with Zenos, I made a fun modification.

[gaunt star]

[coarse pond]

[rough kestrel]

I cannot tell you how fucking hard it was to blend them while fucking dying of laughter.

[coarse pond]

[next pagoda]

👁️ 👄 👁️

[gaunt star]

Somebody PLEASE add this to kupobot

[balmy mesa]

ikr

[next pagoda]

this is what art looks like

[wind bough]

under no circumstances will I do this

[gaunt star]

also i have a feeling that estenian will be a permanent character and immune to being killed off in story

[wind bough]

I hate it

[coarse pond]

How would you even call the command? !faq zenochan?

[gaunt star]

@sterile field we need this added to Kupobot. It NEEDS to happen

[balmy mesa]

faq lips

[rough kestrel]

I guess you'd do like !faq lips yeah

[silk cape]

this is cursed

[teal geyser]

I'd do it if I still had command privileges

[rough kestrel]

WHY

[coarse pond]

Sounds like Reddit material

[indigo shale]

Well i could have went the whole day without seeing that

[devout musk]

they're both shielded?

[brisk quail]

No

[gaunt star]

Suffer

[coarse pond]

Because they are too close

[devout musk]

oh pepega

[coarse pond]

Hover over their buffs

That's usually the wae

[devout musk]

nah cuz we're doing 24 healers hard to maintain aggro

[coarse pond]

Oh right

I just noticed the amount of healer dots

[severe brook]

inb4 we get Lunar Bismarck and it ends up looking like this
i don't know what inspired them to use this design

[gaunt star]

Is there any way to like... smush souls together that shouldn't be possible naturally (aka if wol's shard got rejoined to someone else)

[severe brook]

it's possible that Resonance does this, to funnel aether taken from other people into the person becoming a Resonant

i may be incorrect but that's how i interpreted the way it works, in addition to using a natural Echo user as a 'blueprint'

[torpid yoke]

they imply it to be that way yea

just uh CTRL+C and CTRL+V

[gloomy shale]

diamond ex numbers mechanic is the bane of pugs

[torpid yoke]

then the extra people you

the teleporters are the bane of clear parties i feel since i was murdered multiple times by 7 because they went in the portal

[stiff charm]

wait, "drink a sea of souls"
uh oh

[wind bough]

slurp

[severe brook]

granted, i think he'll be doing a different method this time instead of just becoming Extra Resonant

[stiff charm]

yeah he is reaping souls

[misty yoke]

Edgy blonde man becomes an even edgier blonde man

[severe brook]

he's probably going to reveal he figured out something similar to how Thordan consumed Lahabrea, and then go around slaughtering and consuming others' souls to grow in power in preparation for hijacking Zodiark

[wary perch]

Zenos haven't say the edgy line from the trailer yet

[misty yoke]

He will

[wet crown]

He does in every other language

Talks about his boundless hatred or whatever.

[severe brook]

he'll likely say it in Part 2 before setting out to actually make his words come true

[wet crown]

It's disgustingly egdy to the point of not fitting the character.

[severe brook]

my guess is that frustration with LB failing will motivate him to become active earlier

[severe brook]

lmao Zenos isn't even a hatred-driven villain, not really

[wet crown]

ikr makes no sense

[severe brook]

at least not in his English characterization, maybe he's different in other languages

but even that wouldn't seem right to me, things are usually pretty consistent

[misty yoke]

I will bet my gil that he will say something angsty to the point of being memed on

[wet crown]

we already have a bunch of zenos memes

[severe brook]

he's already talked about voring the moon we have meme material for eons

!faq juicy

[lusty shadow]

Juicy

[severe brook]

that's where the moon juice will go

[wind bough]

He's gonna gorge himself

[misty yoke]

Quriky

[teal geyser]

Going to have to remove some ribs first

[wet crown]

Zenos gonna choke on the moon like it's one of those big sugar candy balls.

[wind bough]

perfect feeder/gainer fetish setup

[misty yoke]

Gobstoppers?

[wet crown]

forgot the name

[severe brook]

you know i was debating on if bringing that up for fandaniel and zenos was going too far, and then here you are

[wind bough]

[severe brook]

zenos in 6.0

[misty yoke]

He wont even chew the man will just gulp it down

[balmy mesa]

https://tenor.com/view/cherry-tongue-lickit-licking-pussy-gif-15152591

could be like this with souls tho

[misty yoke]

Kakyoin without the ginger hair

[carmine basin]

Zenos eating Zodiark

[gusty quest]

https://tenor.com/view/pop-corn-eating-funny-eat-food-gif-17238418

[severe brook]

i do have one theory in case Venat turns out to be a title and not her true name.
and it's that her true name would end up being Minerva.
https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Minerva_(Final_Fantasy_VII)

though that being said, i'm still almost certain that only the Convocation have titles

[maiden lodge]

Try restricting yourself to odds-west evens-east groups, cause it gets a lot more braindead when the color of the platform, and the markers, match the numbers over your head.

[misty yoke]

I dread the 6.0 trials due to first time healers using the Gundam class accidentally making the group wipe

[gaunt star]

Its gonna be fun

[tulip geyser]

Thats why Im still gonna be AST, speed and some pity for levelling folk

[gaunt star]

Mood, I'm prolly gonna sch unless it dies

[tulip geyser]

Fortunately a lot of people will remember "Oh yeah I dont actually like healing"

[maiden lodge]

Eh. Unless its stupidly undertuned it'll be fine.

[gaunt star]

Its not about the strength of the healer, its about the people who are just sht

Unless you mean sch

[tulip geyser]

Though Im half prepared for AST to be a trash fire just like it is at the start of every expac

[maiden lodge]

They'd be shit on previous healers, it's fine

[misty yoke]

Dont hate the healing class. Hate the player
-Sun Tzu

[gaunt star]

Yea but it's the people that wouldn't normally pick up a healer but think "hey it's level 70 and the new expac class why not"

Either way I'm not that fussed, I'm just gonna enjoy the story of baddies

[misty yoke]

6.0 zenos vore

[serene crest]

The HW early access DRK flood was a good time 😅

[tulip geyser]

lmao

[maiden lodge]

Yeah I worry more about new tanks

[gaunt star]

Time to become a tank main until it regulates

[gaunt star]

That's fair actually

[serene crest]

Tbh though it wasn't that bad with GNB this time. At least through my experience. Maybe I just got super lucky.

[gaunt star]

So in essence: disaster. Disaster everywhere

[misty yoke]

Just pain

[gaunt star]

The gnbs who dont pop any cds and just use nebula 😩

[tulip geyser]

SO MUCH fat fingered Super! that first week.
So much

[gaunt star]

And then don't bolide 🥴

[maiden lodge]

Naw, bad healers will overcompensate with healing more I'd be more worried about my own job getting snookered

[gaunt star]

I played w my friend thru the new dungeon and he'd only bolide when his hp was like 1000. It was so slick. I need more good tanks like that in df

[oak pike]

Boiled at a 1000 is a risky game of trust with a WHM

[tulip geyser]

Ive seen some wily sorts bolide stuff like the meteor phase for Nabriales

[gaunt star]

I trusted him to bolide before id bene him

[oak pike]

Benne bolied

[balmy mesa]

feel like eggs bennedict tomorrow tbh

[gaunt star]

It was painful tho cuz the sam was single targeting so we spent ages on the w2ws

Wait no that was another run. Dragoon was dotting everything

[serene crest]

I hope the new melee has good aoe

[balmy mesa]

I accidentally cockblocked my tank with a bene last night cos he had all his nascent flash etc lined up

[gaunt star]

So he also.. wasnt aoeing

[balmy mesa]

in the new dungeon

was down to like 1k health, then I bene'd him before he got off his big heal

[misty yoke]

Whenever you meet First time tanks playing GNB inside the Aetherochemical research Facility

[oak pike]

Oh yeah anima coming in 6.0

[maiden lodge]

They've committed to good aoe going forward for everyone, so probably.

[balmy mesa]

I might run my pally friend (or other class) through ARF, he wants tomes

to gear up alt classes

[misty yoke]

Its not a bad place tbf

[balmy mesa]

it's the most efficient spot to get poetics quick, iirc
150 per run

[misty yoke]

Would antitower be faster though?

Because of how stupidly fast that can be

[balmy mesa]

hmm, you're right

antitower would be faster
ilvl sync on arf would be a bitch

[misty yoke]

That and you can work on resisitance weapons too

[balmy mesa]

ARF = <20 min is best case
AT = <12 min is best case

[misty yoke]

A whole 8 minutes

On a good day you can sweep it in ten minutes

[balmy mesa]

yeah, ARF is more efficient, unfortunately
in terms of tomes/run

150 tomes per run of ARF vs 40 on antitower

[misty yoke]

Ah thats true

[balmy mesa]

think Sohm Al HM gets very close to that efficiency

[viscid monolith]

You could do Baelsar's Wall or Sohm Al HM in 10 minutes

[balmy mesa]

I think Sohm Al HM would be quicker than Baelsar's Wall (cos of the forced wait times with the mobs on the elevator in Baelsar's)

[gloomy shale]

when is bozja patch?

[wary perch]

May end

[balmy mesa]

three days after fanfest is the prevailing rumour

[wary perch]

Doubt it

[balmy mesa]

there will be a PLL at fanfest though.

[wary perch]

The 2nd Tuesday after fanfest is more likely

[balmy mesa]

so, 25th of may is most likely

[wary perch]

Iirc they don't do pll in the weekend before patch though

[balmy mesa]

ya, they don't - 10 days

[maiden lodge]

I'm surprised Gubal Hard or Sohr Khai aren't in this discussion, those were on average about two minutes shorter on content than AT

Or hell, Brayflox HM

[balmy mesa]

the forced gates and last boss in Sohr Khai tend to drag things out a little

[maiden lodge]

Okay but

[open verge]

this tower is so badass

[balmy mesa]

this is assuming people know what they're doing

[maiden lodge]

Objectively--Sohr Khai has been measured to be on average two minutes faster when it was on content.

If 12 minutes is a yardstick you're using, then Brayflox HM was 10 on content

[open verge]

the tower light and the thunder clouds + the castle light 👌

[balmy mesa]

AT and ARF are brain-dead, comparatively speaking. Gubal HM is also the same, but it has issues with mob gating, also extended invuln phases with the boss

anyway, my benchmark is for tomes per run

Brayflox HM is only 40 tomes per run

[maiden lodge]

Mob gating exists doesn't necessarily imply the dungeon must be slower. Some of the most gated dungeons end up the fastest.

[balmy mesa]

yes, but... if you're running it with pugs... you want to eliminate that as a potential cause of delays
it's like what happens with snowcloak.

the yeti boss on snowcloak is shit if people don't know wtf they're doing (for example)

[maiden lodge]

Yes, but when you're looking at, for examle GGLHM vs AntiTower, and you're looking at eying data here 200 seconds of difference...

You got bigger problems.

[balmy mesa]

GGLHM (70) vs. AT (40)
GGLHM wins

[maiden lodge]

Yeah and if it's faster than AT, then it'll win over ARF too

And it's only going to be faster with the introduction of better AoE.

[balmy mesa]

I dunno about that, ARF has 150 per run

and worst case scenario, it's 20 minutes
the ilvl sync is a bitch though

[maiden lodge]

It depends, if you can do a sub 10 overgearing a dungeon that was 10-11 on content...

The ilvl sync is also awful in ARF

And... ARF has more gates in it than 2 GGL runs

hell I think it has more gates before the first boss than GGL

[balmy mesa]

I meant the ilvl sync in ARF specifically lol - it's only 180 vs 270 in GGLHM
anyway, it was an exercise to see how I could help my very time-poor friend get his tomes for gearing up alt classes
sure, there's the daily roulettes (especially MSQ, 500 tomes per day guaranteed if there's a new player), but I wanna make it efficient for him

[maiden lodge]

Understandable of course

[balmy mesa]

he's been really discouraged by the new (current?) relic step unfortunately, hopefully there's more tweaks there
and, bugger
I just remembered I forgot to do DR weekly

[wet crown]

do we happen to have the zadnor stuff, yet?

in the data

[maiden lodge]

I can't criticize too much I'm still on Vex step and keep putting it off

[balmy mesa]

no, I've confirmed, other databotanists have confirmed

[wet crown]

[opaque hemlock]

so that may possibly eliminate Cruise Chaser as a Zadnor-content mount

[balmy mesa]

not necessarily
but I think CC is for the mogtome event

[misty yoke]

No cruise chaser mount?

[wet crown]

armor should be anywhere around 520-525 though, right?

[opaque hemlock]

I did say possibly

[maiden lodge]

Well Cruise Chaser is data mined, so it exists, we just don't know how yet

[balmy mesa]

lunar whale also exists

[opaque hemlock]

Oh right, they have a timed event planned for Fan Fest

[balmy mesa]

and we know that's going to be mogstation

[wet crown]

^

[maiden lodge]

Yeah all signs are pointing to Mogstation or irregulars

[misty yoke]

Fandango got busy robbing the vanu

cruise chaser mount is added
only available in mogstation

[balmy mesa]

yeah I'm thinking CC is irregular tomes
but I don't know when the mogtomes event will run, and for how long

[maiden lodge]

During Fanfest, but the duration is the ?

[balmy mesa]

ye, exactly

[misty yoke]

They start late into an expac right?

[maiden lodge]

Irregulars? Usually late into a patch but this is a special event and isn't on the normal dole.

[balmy mesa]

I think roughly 2-3 weeks, since that's in line with other mogtome events, and it tends to end with patches

[maiden lodge]

Well, we've had mogtomes last for quite a while before too--I expect 5.5's actual one will be a longboi like 4.5s was

[misty yoke]

Prae is alive once more

[balmy mesa]

so maybe the fanfest mogtomes event might only run from the 14th of May til when 5.55 comes out

[maiden lodge]

Maybe.

[gaunt star]

Isnt fanfest mogtomes only supposed to be during fanfest

[balmy mesa]

2 weeks is a reasonable medium

can you imagine the chaos that would happen if it was only 2 days?

[misty yoke]

Reddit would cry. The discord harder

IGC would be sheer chaos

[gaunt star]

I guess if theyre dropping a mount itd be way too harsh to make it fanfest only

[balmy mesa]

50 tomes, with the usual culprits giving 7/10

[maiden lodge]

It depends entirely on what it has. If it's just the normal fare, people might give it a hard pass.

[misty yoke]

Well considering the events of the world rn it would be a little unfair

[maiden lodge]

New shit? Yeah, it'll explode

[balmy mesa]

but I legitimately think CC would be a fanfest mount (as a free alternative to the lunar whale, as a consolation prize for not being willing to spend USD$60 or whatever it'll cost)

• other stuff which is still marked as unknown?

[misty yoke]

Why would it be fanfest only?

[maiden lodge]

hype

[balmy mesa]

^

[maiden lodge]

of course making it fanfest only or temporary like that also guarantees it's in later mogtome events anyways

[wind bough]

Lunar Whale is already the fan fest mount.

[balmy mesa]

it's the paid mount

[wind bough]

There is no "Fan Fest only" mount this time around as there is no Fan Fest ticket

[misty yoke]

Well it would make people lose their shit over a mount like thay

[wind bough]

Fan Fest will be a free stream for everyone

[balmy mesa]

CC could be the "free" mount via the irregular tomestones event
that's what I meant

[maiden lodge]

baby urianger

This is honestly all I wanted