It's not future, or present. He's speaking after his brothers' fall.
#retired-patch-6-3-discussion
maiden lodge
spiral mica
To be fair, we dont really know what happens to an Ancients soul in the lifestream. i mean, a fully original, unsundered Ancient soul
subtle pasture
I suppose a solid possibility of Pandaemonium is for Lahabrea to have made himself the Heart of a new primal
Maybe even the Heart of... himself?
severe brook
i stick with Firebird Lahabrea theory
maiden lodge
To be fair, we dont really know what happens to an Ancients soul in the lifestre...
""Lahabrea is gone," the voice said softly.
I could hardly continue to feign slumber at that, so I righted myself and turned to face Elidibus. The silence that stretched between us then only affirmed the truth that had gone unspoken.
For us, death was not the end. But "gone"...
"We knew this day would come.""
subtle pasture
The Heart of the Seat of Lahabrea, that is
severe brook
but not a Firebird entity like in Through His Eyes
i think that what's left of Lahabrea's Soul is going to possess the construct he used to set up the IInd Shard's Rejoining
a massive pseudo-primal/arcane entity that consumed an entire world in flame
and that construct will heavily resemble the Emperor of Hell from FF2
from last night
viscid monolith
Why wouldn't death be the end of though? Ancients could die. Really easily actually.
spiral mica
if sundered ancient souls retain their coherence, and are simply reborn as a new individual, which we KNOW to be true, then what can we say about a full, unsundered Ancient soul?
severe brook
with Pandaemonium being a post-Sundering Words of Lahabrea that he used to design primals and other mechanisms to help bring about Rejoinings
subtle pasture
If the soul is strong enough, it can resist the Underworld’s lure
maiden lodge
Why wouldn't death be the end of though? Ancients could die. Really easily actua...
We know that's not entirely true--we know Ascians are fucking hard to kill and stay killed, we spent a long time researching a way to do it.
subtle pasture
Not without a lot of pain, but it can
severe brook
if sundered ancient souls retain their coherence, and are simply reborn as a new...
they don't retain their coherence
though maybe you mean cohesion
but memories/identity are lost through reincarnation
maiden lodge
If the soul is strong enough, it can resist the Underworld’s lure
Emet-selch would be one who could.
spiral mica
but memories/identity are lost through reincarnation
yes, because they arent part of the soul itself
subtle pasture
Though, Hades is— yeah
severe brook
and can only be restored partially through echo visions
maiden lodge
And Emet-selch did NOT die like the rest.
viscid monolith
We know that's not entirely true--we know Ascians are fucking hard to kill and s...
I was thinking of normal Ancients but then again the Ascians have clearly mastered their power more than any Ancient before them
severe brook
or completely through memory crystals
subtle pasture
His strength in manipulating the Underworld, and the heavy mentions he basically lived his life with a foot in its flow
severe brook
emet-selch and mitron both have a similar death animation after passing on
both dissolve into light that then splits into fragments and ascends to the heavens
maiden lodge
emet-selch and mitron both have a similar death animation after passing on
Mitron's body is still there though.
severe brook
no it isn't? he vanishes completely in that dark void
maiden lodge
So that can be 'trapped in Eden' or some nonsense
subtle pasture
But it’s not limited to Hades, the soul that became trapped in the Firebird was also able to resist it— albeit with great pain
maiden lodge
Yeah, Eden IS Mitron
subtle pasture
Or do you mean Hades is likely the only to linger without inflicting pain on himself
severe brook
though obviously that's not as canon
maiden lodge
though obviously that's not as canon
Or at all.
severe brook
it's somewhat diegetic
maiden lodge
Or rather, it's canonical that it's an embellishment
severe brook
because the memory crystal does exist in canon
maiden lodge
And not actual events
spiral mica
you know, now that I think on it....Azem's invocation to "summon his friends to his side" could actually just be creation magic forming Primals of his bros.
severe brook
but it doesn't actually happen yeah
subtle pasture
Shame too, would have been nice to see a measure of Loghrif’s true power
severe brook
i mean that is still loghrif's true power
subtle pasture
She was probably one of the Convocation’s strongest mages
tulip geyser
Might see a bit come 6.0 hopefully
spiral mica
which means we just summoned a primal of emet to help us
severe brook
it's a simulation, not an utter imagination
maiden lodge
But in the case of Emet-selch... I honestly think the tense of the poem is important--he dies differently (he is not trapped in auracite, swallowed by a primal or anything)
severe brook
i mean we already know Ancient magic can be used to move things around
hi y'shtola
so i don't think it's creating primals of allies
spiral mica
i mean we already know Ancient magic can be used to move things around
oh yeah true
subtle pasture
It’s Mitron imagining his girlfriend getting mad and unleashing her full potential
severe brook
azem's spell does call them to the user's side
spiral mica
so then we summoned to us some remnant of Emet himself from out of the lifestream
viscid monolith
Personally I think Loghrif's abilities in E12S are accurate but exaggerated
maiden lodge
And if he's 'doing an encore'... actually it does explain Amaurot giving WoL the memory crystals, and it does actually suggest Emet's death ended his tempering
subtle pasture
Personally I think Loghrif's abilities in E12S are accurate but exaggerated
Yeah this,
gaunt star
Untempered Emet would be a boon to have at our call
maiden lodge
Personally I think Loghrif's abilities in E12S are accurate but exaggerated
Yeah most of it is some variation of what she did as the Voidwalker
next quarry
That reminds me
viscid monolith
The last tier of Savage is from Mitron's mind and he would know what she's capable of
maiden lodge
Untempered Emet would be a boon to have at our call
Right--but rather he's waiting for the right moment to give us a chance to save the star.
gaunt star
Right--but rather he's waiting for the right moment to give us a chance to save ...
True enough
maiden lodge
The first couplet describes him becoming untempered
Now my charms are all o'erthrown,
And what strength I have's mine own,
viscid monolith
But it's also his fanfiction of his girlfriend so maybe not quite that powerful
subtle pasture
Well all three savage tiers came from a weird crystal, so all are probably Mitron fanfic
severe brook
i mean they did consider having her be Zodiark's heart instead
because Gaia becomes the World haha
Toki wo Tomare indeed
subtle pasture
—makes Hraesvelgr a pretty weird appearance I suppose. But maybe he saw the memories we channeled through Eden
severe brook
his power as Eden was clearly able to bring in unwanted influences
see Fatebreaker
should've had a Phase 2 with Maybe I'm a Lion
subtle pasture
See Voidwalker and the Idol, which he was capable of while still bound
severe brook
music for when we find ruins of the Words of Azem on the moon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHbKdI26RkE
spiral mica
Now my charms are all o'erthrown,
And what strength I have's mine own,
that could indicate that for an Ancient soul such as him, total recycling into the flow of the lifestream and reincarnation would require surrendering oneself to the current. Perhaps Emet is choosing to swim by the shore for a while. Thats kinda how I read it
viscid monolith
Does Fatebreaker classify as a primal or creation
maiden lodge
Does Fatebreaker classify as a primal or creation
potato potahto.
maiden lodge
It's not an Ancient creation, there's no summoner with the aether to sustain one.
maiden lodge
It's a sin eater.
severe brook
actually we just fight both Shadowkeeper and Fatebreaker within Eden don't we
so they'd both be contained and even out
in terms of light/dark attunement
maiden lodge
Eden can just make those, I guess
viscid monolith
But thay would mean Eden can create Sin Eaters
maiden lodge
But thay would mean Eden can create Sin Eaters
Yes, which... I mean... that's long established
severe brook
started all of them
maiden lodge
Eden Prime, et all
severe brook
even Eden's Promise
with the animated statue Sin Eaters
Lion Rampant and all that
i guess Eden's like a very imprecise Omega once it really gets going
viscid monolith
Yes, which... I mean... that's long established
Eden created Sin Eaters from people making one from memories and aether isn't long established
severe brook
able to restructure aether on a macro scale
but much more subjective in how it does it
almost fitting
maiden lodge
Eden created Sin Eaters from people making one from memories and aether isn't lo...
Eden created Sin Eaters from lots of things, not just people.
viscid monolith
People, plants, bears and sprites
maiden lodge
In this case though, I think it's a primal
severe brook
Omega can restructure aether into anything perfectly but has no creative ability of its own
Eden can only build from subjective ideals and memories, and doesn't have much control over the specifics of the result
viscid monolith
Hm well he only created Fatebreaker
The Heritors and Cloud of Darkness were all primals we created
severe brook
he also made Shadowkeeper
pine epoch
Tinfoil hat job speculation. Death/Grim Reaper brings final judgement onto people.
Judge 6.0 melee dps
gaunt star
no
heady shadow
hottake: no one is going to like the new meleee because it'll be something no one was wanting
gaunt star
Wait isn’t the Zodiark and Hydaelyn ark meant to end at 6.0 yet they’re having a raid called pandemonium whichlll stretch throughout the expansions patches and it seems to revolve around Asians????
gaunt star
hottake: no one is going to like the new meleee because it'll be something no on...
Onion Knight
😩
Sage and Onion omg
maiden lodge
Wait isn’t the Zodiark and Hydaelyn ark meant to end at 6.0 yet they’re having a...
Specifically, a dead ascian that died years ago in the story.
severe brook
Wait isn’t the Zodiark and Hydaelyn ark meant to end at 6.0 yet they’re having a...
the overarcing story will end. Pandaemonium likely will only focus on one Ascian in particular
well, "years"
maiden lodge
I mean years real time
maiden lodge
Hell, a story about an ascian doesn't even have to be about H/Z any more. See: Eden
severe brook
mhm
left glen
hmm. what kind of physical damage is usually classified with maiming?
slashing damage?
pine epoch
The only maiming weapon we have is spears Lances tridents
pine epoch
Maiming is just strength but heavy armor
Strength is used by blunt piercing and slashing
spiral mica
so you could have a class that wears maiming gear, but has a different damage type than DRG
limber pivot
outside of lore
doen'
t
maiming gear have the stats for melee and physical attacks?
you could have it like Paladin or Dark Knight where they weave spells though
wet crown
What does the gear matter?
limber pivot
well is it not like, if Maiming gear has the stats for physical attack you can't have the new DPS focus on spell attacks
left glen
because it narrows down the possible classes
wet crown
the job just uses maiming because they wanted another job to use it
it's the heavy armor sets but recolored
that's it
left glen
i was just asking as to determine whether a templar class is more likely than a reaper class
because of heavy armor.
wet crown
it doesn't narrow down anything
DRK and PLD still deal unaspected damage (magic) and it scales off of their physical stats
limber pivot
oh ok I didn't know it scaled off physical
Like I know Paladin has that buff for magic spells
and I assumed Dark Knight had the same thing when you have the darkness buff
wet crown
Okay fiiiiiiine
it should make sense for mystery job X to wear heavier armor but....pfff
glamour can make us run around naked
so whatevs
limber pivot
glam is the endgame
left glen
glam *is* the endgame
are you saying running around naked is endgame?
limber pivot
so what gear the new class uses is huuge news
limber pivot
are you saying running around naked is endgame?
being naked is the opposite of glam being the endgame
deft burrow
are you saying running around naked is endgame?
you are not in the endgame until you see a naked catgirl beat up vicious beasts
limber pivot
if you are naked you are failing the endgame 
deft burrow
:D
wet crown
Hrothgar's racial pants are just underwear with a hole for the tail
supreme protection for your walking apparatus
left glen
so what gear the new class uses is huuge news
i'd say it is. i don't think beastmaster/reaper wear heavy armor. i don't think they'll call it templar though. like with gunbreaker, they'll give it a new name is my guess.
left glen
most of it is recolours from fending gear.
limber pivot
that is true
wet crown
it's the fending gear but recolored a lot of the time
wet crown
scouting
limber pivot
yea that
wet crown
but we know it's maiming because it was hard confirmed
limber pivot
doubt they would add another dps onto Fending
left glen
yeah, it was confirmed.
limber pivot
oh did they talk about Maiming gear or soemthing?
wet crown
yes
limber pivot
i see i see
wet crown
"Since DRG is currently at a special position, if we're only talking about slots it was natural we add it there. Which is why we decided on having melee DPS as our second new job."
left glen
out of the "speculated classes", i'd say mystic knight, ravager, rune knight and templar are the best bets. in that order.
wet crown
ahh yes, RDM 2.0
left glen
basically inverted RDM yeah, rune knight.
limber pivot
I agree those classes seem reasonable to me
uhh Paladin exists
has a whole spell rotation
left glen
i just don't see hammer/mace really fitting to maiming. unless it's true that weapon type doesn't matter.
limber pivot
a Flail weapon would be awesome
left glen
historically templars use jousting lances, maces and flails
limber pivot
jousting lance
wet crown
I mean, BLU has a cane.
limber pivot
just paste from Dragoon
wet crown
doesn't scream magical to me
left glen
lmao that's true
wet crown
a gunblade doesn't scream tank weapon to me either
limber pivot
its always weird
yea GNB does not seem like a tank
its like a tiny weapon
and shooting bullets to make yourself invincible? bs
wet crown
can you look at Lightning and Squall and think Yeah, those two are taking bullets for me
limber pivot
its so tiny
wet crown
she had one for 13, 13-2 and Dissidia
left glen
i thought she was like a spellblade type deal
wet crown
it's a gunblade that can retract into a smaller form
limber pivot
wet crown
limber pivot
but i'll believe it
wet crown
In Duodecim, her qoute for Kain is You bring a spear to a gunblade fight?
Why am I even...?
Anyway.
Armor type and weapon don't always equal a perfect match for a role
limber pivot
yea
untold gull
Can't hit something when you're enemy is in the middle of a jump
limber pivot
GNB is the best fact for that argument
pine epoch
You know how shadowbringers samples eternal wind and uses it in the theme. What if endwalker does the same but with the FF4 overworld/main theme
Or the theme of FF
ruby hull
wasn't it on the slides of EW and people thought it was DRK?
wet crown
it was shown alongside other AF5 concepts
pine epoch
But the 2 outfits are different
Tho what pisses me off is I swear yoshida talked about his they were adding more pvp armor sets in 5.5 and showed that one off saying this wont be the only one. Yet that's the feast set
wet crown
remember : these are concepts
can still be changed
Well, I guess PLD's set in stone now thanks to the cinematic but still
limber pivot
BLM's lvl 50 AF gear is my fav
the SAM AF gear concept looks really cool
just hope they give it like a crazy hat or something
strange summit
ALMOST FORGOT
floral aurora
Show that badass PLD gear xD
strange summit
fuck my slow internet
floral aurora
And that awesome looking cape
deft burrow
yes
strange summit
ikr
strange summit
The Queen is back yeah
rugged basin
paper sleet
I thought of something scary.
In Final Fantasy 4, where we’re gonna get some stuff from, there are twin characters.
They sacrificed themself to save the hero, so I’m worried what is gonna happen to our twins.
strange summit
Yoshida said they will have their time to shine
And even said they were like main characters
No Palom/Porom for you
paper sleet
Well the good news is, the twins survived and came back
rugged basin
Well Palom and Porom din't actually die persay.
paper sleet
Well no, you’re not wrong
floral aurora
I want them to be there for the final fight
But now that I think of it...
Didn't that || Hades || fight seem more like the final ff4 fight?
strange summit
It's either Y'sthola, Urianger or Thancred
floral aurora
Least the final scene
strange summit
One of them will get the kill hammer
floral aurora
And if its like FF4, does that mean Zenos and Urianger will fight Zodiark's first form?
(idk who else is old and powerful lol)
strange summit
Matoya
floral aurora
Lol almost forgot about her
deep roost
Yshtola will die, Runar will be sad, he'll try to summon her back like fucking primal, She turns out to be a god YU'shtola, who summons Blitzball arenas around Eorzea.
oak pike
Anima is actually yshtola
severe brook
pog
lime estuary
Yes
floral aurora
Gice us the full song!
lime estuary
Cause it sounds like Nirvana
floral aurora
Hades has the best boss music imo
So its going to be interesting if this is the Zodiark boss music
lime estuary
The second half of the Hades fight had excellent music
floral aurora
Hades > Fake WoL > Emerald > Titania > Innocence > Ruby
Best to least favorite EX fights
limber pivot
Fairy is Titania
floral aurora
Thank you
limber pivot
I liked Ruby more than Emerald imo
the callback to 1.0 was too epic
compared to Gaius cameo
floral aurora
Maybe it was my party finder experience
limber pivot
lol that'd do it 😆
floral aurora
None of them are bad
floral aurora
Shocked me how all Trials are fun and not lackluster
limber pivot
i hope END's final boss isn't just the main theme
like I know Hade's phase 2 is new music
floral aurora
It won't be
limber pivot
but for the most part its just the trailer theme
strange summit
6.0 dungeon boss theme
floral aurora
For all we know Zodiark has a second form
strange summit
pls
floral aurora
And that will be the new music
limber pivot
well yea but will the phase 2 be generic "epic final fantasy" music
or like awesome Shinryu phase 2 music
floral aurora
For all we know Endwalker won't be a boss music at all
limber pivot
also 6.0 dungeon boss theme will be so hype
tropic frigate
the second phase to hades was just in another language
limber pivot
i wonder if it can get better than SB's dungeon theme
strange summit
Can we think about the fact that both Zenos and the WoL could embody an elder primal so if it's the end of Hyda-Zodiark, it could require a sacrifice from the WoL
floral aurora
I'm think Hyda is going to sacrifice herself
limber pivot
I wonder what Graha Tia's role in all this will be?
strange summit
I mean, he's the result of the Ancient's hopes and dream
Doesn't mean Zodiark as a being is evil
gaunt star
Graha pulls his self-sacrafice stuff and gives his life in our place to seal away Hydaelyn and Zodiark forever.
limber pivot
Zodiark isn't evil and Hydalyn is???? big twist
tropic frigate
i dont see zodiark as evil really
floral aurora
Is Zodiark really *that* evil ?
No. I feel the one behind the calamity is the true evil Villian of the story
tropic frigate
and hydaelyns purpose isnt either
tropic frigate
tru
gaunt star
Primals are inherently bad.
limber pivot
isnt that awfully convenient we have a solution to tempering now? HMMM
strange summit
ono
gaunt star
Like Laskmii wasnt an inherently evil premise, being peace and happiness to everyone through blissful ignorance of the real world. But that concept became twisted in the shape of a primal that stripped people of their free will.
limber pivot
Think 7.0 is going to focus on the person behind the calamity
play Coils of Bahamut
strange summit
I want to see the new world and Meracydia
floral aurora
Yes the Ancients
gaunt star
Final Days then
gaunt star
^
limber pivot
so obvi something going on
the enemy from the trailer is a spawn from the final days
floral aurora
I think we are going to find out who it is but we won't fight them. Probably a 6.0 epilogue scene where we see the one behind it all
limber pivot
i assume it was just Zodiark or Hydaelekeyn that caused the final days
tropic frigate
i also am hoping to so much
tropic frigate
that the entire raid tier is unique
like how heavensward had metal
and all that
as their raid tier music
instead of ff8
wanna hear more music with lyrics
limber pivot
that the entire raid tier is unique
i mean tbf ShB's raid tier was also "unique"
tropic frigate
yea
limber pivot
so still expect references a plenty
floral aurora
i assume it was just Zodiark or Hydaelekeyn that caused the final days
SE said Endwalker will answer all our questions about final days, Zenos and Fans's goals, what happens to the first Primals and what will become of Super Mario
I mean WoL xD
limber pivot
also Pandaemonium is a location in FF2 if that means anything
limber pivot
SE said Endwalker will answer all our questions about final days, Zenos and Fans...
MARIO CROSSOVER LETS GOOOO
limber pivot
being answered?
Hildibrand conclusion
tropic frigate
yea
shut burrow
Lyse rejoins the scions
limber pivot
i think shes good just staying somewhere else actually
i hope Minfilia doesn't return
but she prob will
limber pivot
omg what if they un-temper Minfilia
limber pivot
noe
shut burrow
Now open ur eyesss
limber pivot
Haucenfaort comes back as an ascian
floral aurora
I honestly hope! I HOPE! New Endwalker raid is voice acted. We got a little taste is Shadowbringers but I want the full package in Endwalker
limber pivot
however u spell his name
strange summit
There's a big war against the beasts of the apocalypse, G'raha links the two crystal towers so everyone in Norvrandt can join the fight
limber pivot
I honestly hope! I HOPE! New Endwalker raid is voice acted. We got a little tast...
same but knowing SE they will keep the voice lines to the actual fights
"I SENSE AN URGE IN THE AETHER"
shut burrow
Colors weave into a spire of PAIN
limber pivot
thats not Final Fantasy 👀
shut burrow
Sh
floral aurora
Imo raid story is just as important as the main story if it really involves Lahabrea/Ascians
shut burrow
🕷️😩😩😩😩😩
floral aurora
Needs to he voice acted
tropic frigate
o damn i hope they voice act the 24 mans too
limber pivot
they will never have the balls to make raid tiers or A-Raids required bc bad players would whine
tropic frigate
stormbloods was great
limber pivot
lol I hate the voice lines in SB's a-raids
tropic frigate
i dont like nier that much
tropic frigate
yea
floral aurora
I liked the nier raids but i understand if some find the story lackluster
limber pivot
like Crystal Tower raids did
severe brook
but the story is lacking yeah
floral aurora
Exactly
tropic frigate
i dont find its story lackluster or anything its just the raids themselves and me wanting just more to what feels connected to xiv
severe brook
i mean with Ivalice
they're using music from an older era
so it's a bit more of an acquired taste
limber pivot
Nier raids
Gameplay - awesome
Story - bad
severe brook
honestly the dwarves are the best part
but i wish the nier stuff was integrated into xiv's world better
limber pivot
at the end it'll just be "holeee crap this was another ending to Nier all along!! aweoooga shamspooobobbooa"
floral aurora
No way is it Nier Automata story quality
severe brook
it always comes back to "so how did they get here"
floral aurora
Nier Automata story gave me feels
limber pivot
thats what its gonna explain at the end
severe brook
and maybe it'll turn out YT is doing all of this to parody the concept of crossovers
limber pivot
some stupid dimension portal or something like that
severe brook
by just having one literally slapping nier stuff into Kholusia
but
that's just Dismaland lol
floral aurora
You know whats truly disappointing?
severe brook
i was hoping they'd play into some connection between the Ancients and the Androids
limber pivot
it'll end with Alphinaud turning off his PC and saying "Wow that was pretty fun."
floral aurora
No Nier weapons
severe brook
as the Ancients' story has similarities with the fall of humanity in Nier
floral aurora
Nier Automata weapons were sick
tropic frigate
im fine with crossovers as long as its like the monster hunter one was
floral aurora
Idk why they didn't add weapons
tropic frigate
which is pretty good compared to the events we get from ff games
severe brook
i mean i like it being done the way of the FF references and Ivalice
where it's clear allusions to past stuff
tropic frigate
they shoulda added weapons
severe brook
but integrated into the setting
severe brook
MHW Crossover is also just a portal popping out a monster
can't wait for the Monster Hunter Rise one in like a year
taking bets on what we'll fight then
tropic frigate
i dont mind any sort of thing like that because to me its less canonical
limber pivot
where is my Yo Kai Watch crossover trial
tropic frigate
i would like it to be not acknowledged in any meaningful way
but nier sure is big
tropic frigate
yea
severe brook
it's a celebration of the series
floral aurora
Just not FF7 yet
limber pivot
uhh
tropic frigate
and the scorpion in ala mhigo right?
floral aurora
I mean cross over
severe brook
Nael is also a VII reference
long, silver-haired, mad warrior who wields a long thin weapon
limber pivot
i guess so
severe brook
falls to madness and calls down Meteor
floral aurora
No FF7 Remake crossover yet
floral aurora
Waiting until Part 2 is released first
limber pivot
yea
gaunt star
We know it’s not going to be an alliance raid crossover at least
floral aurora
Part 2 is going to REKT part 1
tropic frigate
i want to know our trial series
gaunt star
Part 2 might also be the final part if leaks are to be believed
limber pivot
i hope it is
limber pivot
no way i can suffer through like 3 more parts just for FF7 Remake
tropic frigate
would it feel long enough?
floral aurora
After you leave Midgar in the original, the real game begins. I'm expecting that same experience in part 2
limber pivot
how much did the first game have?
first game had the first hour of FF7 OG
tropic frigate
i see
gaunt star
Yuffie centric, cid is an npc, Vincent unplayable, cait sith and red 13 combined into 1 character
floral aurora
Yuffie centric, cid is an npc, Vincent unplayable, cait sith and red 13 combined...
We aren't enemies are we? XD
limber pivot
all they had to do was REMAKE the game
gaunt star
I would be estatic because I would find this hilarious
severe brook
i mean
if you want just a 1:1 remake
it's available on Steam
if you just want the same game again
gaunt star
Also, they weren’t sure how good part 1 would be so they wrote the ending the way they did in case they didn’t make another game
floral aurora
i mean
if you want just a 1:1 remake
it's available on Steam
Thank you! So many wanted just upgraded graphics only
severe brook
i think FF7R is mostly good, but i have some issues with the plot
limber pivot
i mean I also wanted like a better game too
floral aurora
In FF7R's defense, the story isn't complete
limber pivot
yea
severe brook
that's actually my issue with it
let me explain
i like the idea of it being an alternate timeline/progression of events
but
limber pivot
I like how FF7R uses lore from all the other FF7 universe
severe brook
it feels dumb to me have the Plot Ghosts and then Titanic Plot Ghost God as the final boss
when they're not even out of Midgar
so now the party have killed a god
and they haven't even left midgar yet
i don't think that was necessary
limber pivot
there is a theory where that the ghosts relate to the life stream
severe brook
that's not a theory, it's canon
woven escarp
aren't they an echo of geostigma?
limber pivot
oh ok
floral aurora
They to make the end something different since that Motorball being the final boss wasn't going to cut it
severe brook
the three big Whispers that show up during the final fight are the Sephiroth Kids from Advent Children
limber pivot
I do think Sephiroth shows up wayyy too early
kinda put a sour spot in my mouth when i played
severe brook
with Sephiroth i somewhat understand him showing up earlier
because he's so well known now
woven escarp
I mean, he's the main villain and a remake that played coy with him would be.... weird
lol
severe brook
that it's kind of pointless trying to keep him secret
woven escarp
yeah
limber pivot
but it was so cool with the OG where you don't even see him
severe brook
but it does still leave a bad taste in my mouth
limber pivot
just his sword
woven escarp
everyone knows who he is and what he looks like
severe brook
and i think he shouldn't have shown up in Chapter 2 lmao
floral aurora
I do think Sephiroth shows up wayyy too early
Yeah I kind of agree here, I think the director underestimates how many actually know who Sephiroth is.
woven escarp
uh, you see him in the shinra building when you meet red XIII
severe brook
save him for the ending of Part 1
woven escarp
you just have no idea what the fuck is going on
severe brook
have him briefly appear in the building yeah
floral aurora
Yeah alot of ff fans know who Sephiroth is, but FF7R brought in alot of new fans
limber pivot
uh, you see him in the shinra building when you meet red XIII
is that Sephiroth not JENOVA?
gaunt star
Who is sephiroth??
woven escarp
in the beginning of the OG FFVII?
floral aurora
He could've been more of a mystery
woven escarp
it's sephiroth
severe brook
no it's not
limber pivot
no in the OG its Jenova
severe brook
Sephiroth is in the Crater the whole time
woven escarp
what in the fuck canon is this
floral aurora
But in the Remake, we actually see Sephiroth
severe brook
it's from the OG game
limber pivot
its kinda cool once you realize that
floral aurora
The real him
severe brook
no we don't?
limber pivot
what in the fuck canon is this
after every Sephiroth encounter you fight a JENOVA form
severe brook
it's been a ghost or projection-covered clone every time
gaunt star
Hes just astral projecting
limber pivot
he LIVES in the life stream
severe brook
even in the remake
floral aurora
even in the remake
Yes we do, Seven Seconds till the end, what will you do with it? Lets see..
Thats real Seph
severe brook
that's not real Seph
floral aurora
Not Jenova
severe brook
it is Jenova
limber pivot
no we were talking about the OG
floral aurora
Trust me its not
limber pivot
im pretty sure that Seph is the real one from the future
severe brook
one of the clones takes Jenova's body at the end of Shinra Building
and plummets off the building with it
limber pivot
the one defeated by cloud in the OG
severe brook
and it's just after that
floral aurora
im pretty sure that Seph is the real one from the future
Exactly
severe brook
we encounter "Sephiroth" at the end of the Expressway
floral aurora
Yes
limber pivot
idk about the fight prior
severe brook
his body is still in the Crater
severe brook
oh no
limber pivot
after FF7 he dies and is sent back into the life stream
he corrupts the life stream causing geostigma in AC
limber pivot
uhh some shit happens
he goes to another dimesnion to prevent the loop of his defeat
and messes with the natural order of events
causing the ghosts to go batshit
and during the final boss of FF7R thats the real Seph from the OG FF7
severe brook
i mean yeah that's pretty clear
until that last line
because it seems pretty clear the time travel in 7R is mental
severe brook
Aerith and Sephiroth have not physically come back in time
severe brook
it seems pretty clear they've sent their consciousnesses back in time
i am speaking in terms of how we perceive it
i am aware of the concept of Eternal Now
limber pivot
i believe that
floral aurora
i mean yeah that's pretty clear
Trust me, this is why so many are anxious for part 2. Because there are so many unanswered questions
limber pivot
you actually kill future Seph at the end
limber pivot
but past Seph knows what future Seph was trying to do
severe brook
even if the encounter in outer space is Future Sephiroth's actual body
cloud doesn't kill him
he just fucks off
severe brook
floral aurora
And you all have to realize Cloud isn't himself and hasn't unlocked his true potential yet. No way is he on Seph's level
severe brook
fight ends, sephiroth disarms cloud, "Seven Seconds," disappears
limber pivot
ok yea heres my argument for thats it Future Seph
he is able to disarm Cloud yea
or maybe because Cloud hasnt left Midgar yet
but i belieeeve
floral aurora
During the final fight Cloud tapped into his full potential because of something Sephiroth took from him and that he can never have back
But fate may change
XD
limber pivot
yepp
also weird how it cuts right to Rufus after the 7 seconds scene
and how he can see the ghost thingys
floral aurora
Yeah I'm sure Rufus will have a different plot in part 2
severe brook
you know the theory that i've heard that's really out there?
floral aurora
Zack is the biggest ? Mark for me
severe brook
that the Sephiroth encountered at the end of the expressway is Zack
limber pivot
Zack stupid
floral aurora
Idk what it means if hes alive
limber pivot
stay dead gongagaga
severe brook
Him? Gongagone!
limber pivot
that the Sephiroth encountered at the end of the expressway is Zack
that just makes me laugh wow
i'd be so mad if thats true
severe brook
it's so stupid but i can almost see it
limber pivot
I honestly cannot
floral aurora
I know SE wants to change somethings but Zack being alive is a big azz change
limber pivot
imagine if they did what XIV did
just have a ghost Zack follow you around everywhere
complaining and telling Cloud to be a better him
like Ardbert
deep roost
1000% the PLD AF set is gona be called Mythgraven
floral aurora
I hope the capes can be dyed
gaunt star
Too on the nose
I’m going to edit out that generic ass emblem on the back if I decide to use it in glam but this armor is nothing special
limber pivot
imagine if the Augmented AF PLD gear dyes the armor
floral aurora
limber pivot
but keeps the cape the same color
deep roost
Remember the Odin cape that had physics?
limber pivot
I thought the only cape that had "Physics" was the Scholar lvl 80 gear
scholar or Summoner i dont remember
woven escarp
🤔 isn't there a tank set with a functioning cape?
SE is weird about when they decide to use cloth physics
limber pivot
iirc in the "Making of Shadowbringers" video series
they had a segment on cape physics and how they are not real physics
but close enough to make players happy
floral aurora
Didn't they have one of the developers join a live letter saying its difficult to add cape glamours?
deep roost
Clipping everywhere
limber pivot
here we go
timestamped
pretty sure its because game engine is bad
is why they have trouble adding capes
deep roost
Lots of different reasons why physics has to be emulated rather than actually have physics.
floral aurora
LMAO 🤣 shiiii it seems like the developers want a new engine more than the players
deft burrow
Yeah
deep roost
Devs have had said this many times in the past
deft burrow
Its old
floral aurora
SE: Capcom we have a new Engine. Its called
Fantasy Engine
Yeah I hope they get their Engine later
deft burrow
Its inevitable that they will have a new engine eventually
deft burrow
Considering that they want to go long term with 14
deep roost
I'd be nice if YoshiP was able to utilize his budget for XVI to create an engine for 16 and be a baseline to import Ff14 game into.
Talk about efficiency
Ff14 remastered using the luminous engine version ff16 uses
floral aurora
Yeah stuff like capes shouldn't be taxing for them
deep roost
They had physics in 1.0 that was way too taxing on devices.
exotic shuttle
kind lark
Hammer hmmm
deep roost
I cant wait for them to go back to motion cap animation for cutscenes
Instead of emotes cutcenes
floral aurora
Well see idk about that
It would work for characters but what about us?
And i think the animations from ingame are still good
deep roost
they are good I'm just saying as they increase the quality and production value of the game I'd be nice to see these more expensive elements reintroduced.
if not..its whatever
gaunt star
Add the original flower barrels back into the game
floral aurora
First things first
Better physics
Better textures for stuff like grass and trees
Better hands and feet
And Gear Fantasia like Character set up
Give us that and I'll be super happy
oak pike
ngl the towers in the backgrounds looks cool as shit
floral aurora
When it comes to towns/cities/dungeons, the dev team nails it
Old Engine with great talented people behind it
kind lark
I'm genuienly looking foward to radz-at-han
floral aurora
Just imagine what they can achieve with a new engine
oak pike
i just want to see more of the towers doing crazy shit
floral aurora
I was blown away from the Shadowbringers areas
Can't wait to see the new areas in Endwalker
deep roost
low key at the early access date, "oh btw we added some raytracing to 6.0 enjoy" [gpose now Gpose Ultimate]
errant coral
porting a game into new engine, is not as easy as it sounds. worse case it could bring some bugs.
deep roost
I'd likely be a fork of the existing engine. Theres no way yoship will have both his big teams using shared resources manage two wildly different toolsets.
YoshiP knows all about the nightmare issues going from 1.0 crystal tools to 2.0 luminous. Now he needs to do this work again, but instead beef up his luminous engine to an even higher level.
dull trench
please for the love of heck change stuff like holy and dia to "light aspected" and flare to "dark aspected" instead of unaspected now that aspect doesnt actually matter
or remove "aspected damage" in general since it doesnt actually matter
wet crown
dafuq you talking about? they changed all the aspected stuff a long time ago
wet crown
light and darkness are NOT elements
dull trench
is lame
wet crown
only elemental magic is aspected
dull trench
light and darkness are considered elements in the entire final fantasy series
wet crown
light and darkness are POLARITIES
deft burrow
Its called unaspected because unaspected scales with strength and mind
instead of int
wet crown
what does it matter what they are in other games
wet crown
this is XIV, not 1-3 or 15, 16
deft burrow
¯_(ツ)_/¯
wet crown
it means Ruin leans into no element
wet crown
it means it has no element to it
exotic copper
mace
dull trench
im saying the aspect of magic doesn't matter anymore and so they could add more aspects just to make it cooler or they could remove aspects because the spells kinda speak for themselves
gaunt star
unaspected just means it's magic
exotic copper
thats not true, my mace is unaspected
gaunt star
it's the magic version of delivers an attack
deft burrow
scaling is different for unaspected skills tho
dull trench
if fire damage isnt stronger against anything than unaspected damage is, why do we need to specify fire damage? why do we need to specify unaspected? why can we not specify holy magic?
gaunt star
it's not tho
dull trench
and no scaling is not different for unaspected skills
gaunt star
wet crown
DRK's unaspected skills scale with their physical stats. I dunno what you are trying to get at
deft burrow
and about WHM? @wet crown
dull trench
every single move a role uses scales off of their primary damage stat
wet crown
holy, glare and dia are unaspected
and because they are healers, their attacks scale with their mind stat
deft burrow
Scales based on their highest main stat
dull trench
i think we should either stop specifying aspects or we should specify more aspects because the aspects of damage literally mean nothing
wet crown
magic is either aspected to one of the 6 elements or not
there is no inbetween
it's the established lore
dull trench
even in 1.0 black mage unaspected spells were called umbral spells
we should bring that back
wet crown
yh so? that's still true
earth, water and ice are umbral
fire, lighting and wind are astral
dull trench
okay but that's boring when you could say Flare deals Umbral aspected damage or Dia deals Astral aspected damage
i think they should bring that back
wet crown
dia is light, so it's umbral
dull trench
because it doesnt change anything if they bring it back
wet crown
exotic copper
you're just arguing over the use of a word that doesn't mean anything?
dull trench
exactly
dull trench
i think we should either use all the words that dont mean anything or none of the words that don't mean anything
exotic copper
Oh. Well. I dont think it matters.
dull trench
instead of only using some of the words
gaunt star
An odd stance to have
exotic copper
To be clear. There is no such thing as a light or dark aspect
dull trench
there used to be and there can be again
exotic copper
The introduction is what you're asking for, I think?
wet crown
what are you even arguing about flare being unaspected, it's fire
dull trench
it literally changes nothing except the description of the spell
exotic copper
I think he meant despair
dull trench
despair thats the one
exotic copper
or is despair fire too
floral aurora
Can't wait to see where people don't complain about the job being broken or something and instead just complain about the aesthetics only
gaunt star
It actually is unaspected in some games
dull trench
but flare is traditionally dark magic
exotic copper
Aspect refers to elemental crystal type tho
wet crown
who cares, this is XIV
deft burrow
fire is astral
exotic copper
we don't have dark clusters or light clusters
wet crown
what do other games matter when you play XIV
wet crown
XIV uses the lore IT established for ITS story, so it uses THAT and not what other games did
dull trench
and im sure holy crystals also exist somewhere
floral aurora
what do other games matter when you play **XIV**
Maybe FFXVI xD
gaunt star
And so the lore has established as flare as unaspected
wet crown
flare is fire
dull trench
okay and they can add a word to the spell descriptions without breaking anything now that the aspects don't have a gameplay change anymore
gaunt star
You’re right it’s fire
dull trench
or because the aspects don't have a gameplay change anymore they can just remove the aspect part of the spell descriptions completely and nothing is lost
deft burrow
Lightning does no dmg to Ramuh
exotic copper
aspects are used in crafting aren't they
wet crown
they did for everything that had an element
deft burrow
Rip Red Mages and Black Mages
tropic frigate
did it actually matter when elements mattered or na
exotic copper
it mattered somewhat in 1.0 iirc
wet crown
tooltips only speak of unaspected when magic doesn't have an elemental alignment
dull trench
aspected crystals are used in crafting and they matter there but the type of damage you do doesn't really matter at all
gaunt star
This is just semantics
exotic copper
But what your arguing is counter to the currently established lore, that light and dark are not aspects
wet crown
you're being very petty about this
dull trench
and i say they should add light and dark as elemental alignments because it changes nothing if they do except making white mage and black mage slightly cooler
exotic copper
it doesn't make them cooler tho
wet crown
it changes the lore
deft burrow
It goes against the lore
dull trench
how so
floral aurora
Just give me Ultima already for BLM xD
exotic copper
light and dark are not aspects.
exotic copper
astral and umbral
deft burrow
^
dull trench
okay then maybe instead of saying light aspected they could say light polarity
whatever
see? simple fix
exotic copper
I mean I could be convinced they should say "umbral" or "astral" damage
wet crown
elements lean to either being astral or umbral but can be the other
but light is always umbral and darkness is always astral
floral aurora
Divine Light - WHM ultimate light magic spell
exotic copper
But it's a pretty insignificant change
dull trench
its not
exotic copper
lol ok
floral aurora
Ultima - BLM ultimate dark magic spell
https://media.tenor.com/images/624b7feefb6d51849842a98b92eab878/tenor.gif
dull trench
its just a few words in a spell description
deft burrow
It is a big change
dull trench
oh i thought you said significant
exotic copper
less than minor
dull trench
nubity its not a big change
exotic copper
Using Astral and Umbral as damage types is not a big deal
deft burrow
The reason why we have umbral and astral are to designate classifications of different aspects
dull trench
i dont know how many times we have to tell you that the aspects dont matter anymore gramps
exotic copper
Using them as aspects would change the lore
floral aurora
Shouldn't you all be more happy? This is 6.0 hype train!
dull trench
yeah
exotic copper
but using them just as generic damage types wouldn't
floral aurora
Thank you
deft burrow
You're just saying to fold lightning, fire, and wind into Astral damage?
exotic copper
No
dull trench
no
exotic copper
Replace "unaspected" with umbral or astral depending on the spell
dull trench
or stay unaspected in the case of Summoner etc
because those aren't astral or umbral
deft burrow
But why though? The entire point of unaspected is that it isn't any of the elements and thus cannot be umbral or astral.
dull trench
except if you look at the spells, white mage clearly casts different spells than both summoner and black mage
exotic copper
You really want to argue glare isn't a light polarity spell
and despair isn't dark
deft burrow
It isn't though
exotic copper
Now you're the one being petty lmao
deft burrow
How? I'm telling you what the game is saying lol
floral aurora
Wait Ifrit isn't astral?
deft burrow
I'm not the one being petty for telling you how it works
deft burrow
Yes
floral aurora
So Summoner is aspected?
dull trench
no
deft burrow
No
dull trench
summoner is still unaspected
dull trench
their summons are aspected them but not them
wet crown
fire naturally leans into being astral but it can also be umbral
a heatwave is an example of umbral fire
deft burrow
"Glare" doesn't have an aspect related to it. That's the entire point. Its just unaspected magic.
Its a separate category from aspected magic
floral aurora
What about Ninja?
deft burrow
No you aren't getting it
dull trench
okay but you'd be cool with it if zodiark casted glare?
gaunt star
deft burrow
Elrek, Astral includes Fire, Wind, and Lightning.
exotic copper
Yeah dog
wet crown
ninjustu is aspected
dull trench
should an ascian cast holy?
deep roost
Zodiark! Use leer!
gaunt star
An ascian could cast holy
deft burrow
Yes
deep roost
It was super effective
dull trench
true
floral aurora
Oh so Ninja is aspected
dull trench
that was a bad example
but still, should a black mage cast holy? should a white mage cast despair?
wet crown
I said ninjustu is aspected, I didn't say everything NIN does is magical
exotic copper
Astral energy can exist in all 6 elements, as demonstrated by the odd-numbered months of the Eorzean Calendar. Likewise, The Twelve associated with Astral energy are Halone (Ice), Thaliak (Water), Llymlaen (Wind), Byregot (Lightning), Azeyma (Fire), and Nophica (Earth). Astral energy is most heavily utilized by Disciples of Magic, such as the Thaumaturge.
deft burrow
Yes, exactly
brisk quail
And UNASPECTED IS NEITHER
deft burrow
ASTRAL is a CATEGORY of ASPECTED magic
brisk quail
How hard is that to understand
deft burrow
Exactly
wet crown
but still, should a black mage cast holy? should a white mage cast despair?
from a lore standpoint, a black mage can totally learn to cast holy
brisk quail
Unaspected is not Umbral or Astral
exotic copper
so what the fuck is unaspected magic? Fairy farts? Why do they look like astral and umbral spells?
Lets redo the spell effects to be more neutral.
deft burrow
Its just unaspected magic
wet crown
unaspected magic leans into no element
deep roost
In ff7 isnt it just elemental and non-elemental damage? So casting flare is non-elemental damage and fire 3 is elemental damage