yes
#retired-patch-6-3-discussion
radiant pollen
stable island
A grind with too much luck is no grind, it is a chore. And the other choice is a chore too, i said it before, why forcing players to do old content to get current end-game content done?
gloomy shale
Yeah I wouldn't mind grinding but when they make it old alliance raids it is so boring
wary hawk
I'll say it again, make the drop guaranteed, but require more. Still satisfies the nature of a grind while feeling rewarding
We can have a grind be both long and rewarding
radiant pollen
you do that on the last step lol
stable island
Hah!
That was no chore at all!
Remember that your job rotation was NOT broken back then, you still had all your skills.
Now you lose 1/3 of your rotation, that is a huge difference.
gloomy shale
oh....
stable island
And 15 times that is per relic.
gloomy shale
yeah I wonder if they will make it so you get your whole kit for old content in the future
unique verge
Doubtful
stable island
They never will do that.
unique verge
Old content is already faceroll
gloomy shale
it's just weird though because jobs like BLM is so different
unique verge
BLM is really the only problem job on that front
odd yoke
Than people who are low level
unique verge
They just need to make BLM's levelling process less fuckwitted
wary hawk
Psa for those spamming ST. Play MNK and just map you combo 1-6. Basically optimal damage.
BLM is the tru rng job pre-60 lmao
autumn heron
I havent tried DR as a BLM yet
coral kite
Blm is all fun and games till you forget your leveling rotatio s
autumn heron
It sure looks like hell
coral kite
Just make sure you're using all your instant casts efficiently
gloomy shale
some of the last bosses have a lot of movement could be annoying on BLM
stable island
Still boring Angel.
All jobs are broken when level synced to 50. Because the best openers you are used to are locked. (For a good reason ofc.)
Healers have only 2 buttons on low levels (L60 and below) in general and maybe some extra damaging skills on an oGCD.
wary hawk
It is still boring, but it is mentally efficient from my experience
Only SE can fix this content, but this is prob what they wanted
stable island
The most important thing for gaming is....
Gaming should be fun! When it becomes a chore or annoying players tend to stop instead of pressing on. (And give trouble for the latecomers as result.)
coral kite
Well here's the thing
coral kite
You shouldn't be doing the relic in one day anyways
wary hawk
@stable island I'm with you 100%, but between SE and a vocal portion of the fan base they equate grind as inherently
autumn heron
My mind is curtailed
coral kite
you have a choice to stop for the day and come back later
wary hawk
This is one of the few situations where this quote is relevant, but you don't pay my sub. I will choose to do content whichever way I choose
coral kite
gloomy shale
I wish the grind was for the content you are doing though
wary hawk
SE understands there are multiple types of players and chooses to ignore some even though are the most dedicated
gloomy shale
Wasn't Eureka all in Eureka?
stable island
Well.....
I do know the JP playerbase is complaining about the same issues. An unfun annoying grind instead of a fun but long grind.
wary hawk
@stable island there may be hope yet then
coral kite
SE understands there are multiple types of players and chooses to ignore some ev...
And who is being "ignored" here
next quarry
LL tomorrow will reveal details about the last step
unique verge
ARR books werent fun. Points grind in HW wasnt fun
It was fucking miserable
those were your "long grinds"
coral kite
SE tries it's best to give everyone something to do per expac. More so in this one than previous ones
stable island
They even complain more then the western audience.
wary hawk
@coral kite The ppl who enjoy grinding for hours on end but want it to be meaningful. Who want to feel like the accomplished something
autumn heron
No long grind in an MMO os fun
coral kite
Hell crafters have had loads of shit to do
subtle pasture
To be technical on it, each step of Eureka brought a new zone, thus they were able to retain every relic step to it. This chapter only brought DR, and that’s hardly much for multiple relic steps
coral kite
Somethung they didn't get before
autumn heron
I have never played an MMO where the grind felt meaningful
topaz river
I still really really don’t agree with this relic step but I’ve been trying to break it down into manageable chunks so I don’t lose my mind
subtle pasture
So rather than rehash the southern front for the same shot 60 more times, I’m fine with one step having no Bozjan interaction
autumn heron
And I played XI Everquest WoW and Ultima Online
stable island
@unique verge
Huge difference!
HW grind wasn't with synced levels that break your normal rotations.
next quarry
In hw it was a slog
next quarry
Crystal Sand farming used to be soooo much worse
coral kite
I still really really don’t agree with this relic step but I’ve been trying to b...
That's literally how you're suppposed to be doing the relic
zealous mulch
OH CMON THIS IS NOT FAIR!! I WANT MY ||WoL BATTLESHIP TOO!!||
gloomy shale
it was bad because it was locked out to time kinda
coral kite
Don't be one of these crazies who thinks we should be able to beat it in a day
autumn heron
Be like me
subtle pasture
Best part so far is relic reviving the SoM and RtI queues uwu
unique verge
This is some of the last "time consume" content you're getting until 6.0. 6.0 is a VERY long time away.
zealous mulch
sigh just completed patch 5.45 bozjan. deflat when i thought we won 😭
topaz river
I did complain about it a lot yesterday (and I still stand by most of them) but that’s not gonna get me the relic and I don’t expect it to get nerfed
somber storm
OH CMON THIS IS NOT FAIR!! I WANT MY ||WoL BATTLESHIP TOO!!||
Tataru is saving up money for that
stable island
And thanks to Fortnite and such popular crappy games players are far less patient nowadays.
A RNG grind is never fun and it will be never fun. A good grind is with steady progress, but long progress. And one of the key elements of that, it needs to be fun to do, not a chore to do.
next quarry
I should rewatch cutscenes, I did it super early in the morning
coral kite
Who beats it in 2 days
Sicko mode
autumn heron
sigh just completed patch 5.45 bozjan. deflat when i thought we won 😭
I mean its the .4 patch and they confirmed months ago .5 was adding more bozja
zealous mulch
Tataru is saving up money for that
weeee 🤣 👍
subtle pasture
Yeah, Chapter the Fourth will be another zone,
somber storm
She did spend money on a scion airship so
autumn heron
radiant pollen
you need 15 more dbs @autumn heron
coral kite
And thanks to Fortnite and such popular crappy games players are far less patien...
What is there tp grind in fortnite that's meaningful? The game is entirely based around you playing it and getting good
topaz river
16 thunder god wipes :)
coral kite
🤨
autumn heron
I know but thata step 3
radiant pollen
step 3 is glow
coral kite
The cosmetics are just fluff
zealous mulch
She did spend money on a scion airship so
oh yes i forgot the scions have an official airship now...
somber storm
No longer have to mooch on Cid for lifts
zealous mulch
but i want a|| BATTLESHIP!!. not an airship!!||
stable island
@coral kite
You know why fortnite is so popular then? (It is not really a good game on it's own)
unique verge
A ship that size would actually make an interesting 6.0 expansion hub
coral kite
It's okay Mad, Cid doesn't show up to our birthday parties anyway 😩
coral kite
It is indeed a good game
unique verge
Fortnite is popular because it’s fun and good
fun and good
debatable
somber storm
Garlond Battleship
coral kite
You'll be debating with a brick wall
zealous mulch
Garlond Battleship
whoa not for Cid!! for us!!!
somber storm
Wait, what was Cid's airship in Advent Children called?
unique verge
Fortnite is very well designed to divest the parents of teenagers of their money.
lol
zealous mulch
Wait, what was Cid's airship in Advent Children called?
shery?
open verge
He’s like damn near every game is
somber storm
That's it
open verge
This game has a monthly sub 
zealous mulch
oops sorry its shera
radiant pollen
Can second step dye?
no
open verge
Every game is out to come for your pockets
Wtf
So you can’t dye the weapon without a glow???
subtle pasture
Genshin and gacha prey on gambling addictions, Fortnite and battle passes prey on cosmetic shop and haha Travis Scott Marshm3llo dab
open verge
That’s bullshit
silk cape
game developers want to feed their families, of COURSE games are meant to make money
subtle pasture
Something something thanos memes
radiant pollen
you don't really get anything from step 2
open verge
Game developers making money
radiant pollen
maybe it changes your weapon only slightly but not sure
open verge
CEO have mansions to pay off they need money
unique verge
game developers want to feed their families, of COURSE games are meant to make m...
You mean Andrew Wilson needs to buy another few mansions
subtle pasture
BR’s are a scourge on our society 
—but anyways,
silk cape
game developers want to make money, gamers want to play games, bobby kotick needs a new yacht LET'S FUCKIN GOOOOOO
open verge
subtle pasture
It’s weird to see the Ifrit in 14, I wonder what its make is suppose to be
Bc that mfer sure ain’t Garlean
open verge
VICARIOUS VISIONS DEVS COME HERE
somber storm
oops sorry its shera
Battleship Shera
gloomy shale
What is the predicted job for tomorrows liveletter or whatever it is
open verge
I’m going to be pissed of the weapons can’t be dyed
coral kite
Idk
open verge
Chemist and rune fencer for me
somber storm
CEOs need to spend money to save the yacht market
open verge
I really want to use the monk weapons dyed without the glow
coral kite
So many job ideas have been thrown around
open verge
I hate glows
coral kite
I lost track
unique verge
the real dark horse is Judge
stable island
It is simple, those games are so popular because you get fast results for your time.
Quick and easy matches with steady progression, that is what most gamers want nowadays.
In 2014 a grind like the Atma grind back then was far more accepted, but in 2021 it is not longer accepted. Players want a steady progresson without breaking the way they want to play.
It is quite thoughtful to think about new players that want to do older content, but this is not the correct way to do it, this encourage more players abandoning it then take the annoying grind via the 24-mans. (Because the way to do it without breaking your job or your brain is not an alternative.)
gloomy shale
I think Chemist is a guaranteed personally whether they call it that or not idk
coral kite
I'm personally betting on some kind of caster and melee dps
unique verge
holy shit are we still [CURRENTYEAR] argumenting?
coral kite
Maybe a healer if we're lucky but I doubt it since the balance team is stilll confused about how to balance healera
silk cape
Real talk though, the price of making games has gone up, inflation has decreased buying power, and publishers are still out here charging $60 for games because they're scared about the price going up scaring off players. So they sell the game at a loss and make up the difference with DLC, MTX, and shitty labor practices in order to maximize profit.
coral kite
And give them each a meaningful role
coral kite
It’s 2021 and people are complaining about relic grinds
History is a flat circle
autumn heron
gloomy shale
2022 lets make relics zero grind
open verge
Exactly
autumn heron
Ye
open verge
I don’t understand what you mean by no progress
open verge
When you literally get guranteed progress from every run
gloomy shale
I guess but let's get more creative though huh
silk cape
History is a flat circle
first of all, the correct quote is "time is a flat circle"
second of all, FUCK OUTTA HERE with that nietzchean nihilist bull SHITT
worn forge
we tried creative with eureka
coral kite
worn forge
and people bitched and moaned
gloomy shale
not me
stable island
@unique verge
Well, it is 2021 right?
When was 2.28 released again?
wary hawk
Why are ppl saying this is the last time consuming content till 6.0? Do we know what the 5.55 relic step will be?
coral kite
Comments like that make shit posting worth it
autumn heron
Fredrick Nietzsche was based
worn forge
muy basado
gloomy shale
they should make a meme step and just have you pay 1 gil for the last step
worn forge
Zodiac had a meme step with the relic break chance cutscene 
stable island
@worn forge
Well, doing 51, synced 24-mans per relic is gotta be boring (and annoying) eventually right?
worn forge
the game even says YOUR SHIT WILL BREAK AND YOU GOTTA RESTART
coral kite
Are you trying to do 51 24 mans all at once
gloomy shale
how many raids is it for each relic? like 40 or something?
coral kite
Cause again
silk cape
helps that DR is actually kinda fun tho
worn forge
the devs are never gonna make everyone happy with the relic
coral kite
Not what you're supposed to do
gloomy shale
oh its 51
worn forge
they did farming in ARR
variety in HW
A SUBZONE IN STORMBLOOD
and more variety now
and people are still gonna complain
silk cape
the devs are never gonna make everyone happy
behold the truth
coral kite
😌 this is why devs should just do what they think is best for their game
autumn heron
Therfore double ass
worn forge
^
unique verge
I dont even really understand the complaining. The current relic isnt BIS or anything, and its not gonna meaningfully change your power over just buying a cheap exarchic weapon.
gloomy shale
personally I want more dungeon content
unique verge
The relic this time around is basically purely glamour content
worn forge
afaik stat allocated healer wep is BiS just before raid wep
BUT
If you care that much, you probably raid already
zealous mulch
the RDM relic is wicked though. love it!!
gloomy shale
^
worn forge
it sometimes is BiS midway
unique verge
Yeah but i kinda feel like.....the current complaints are primarily being lodged by people who have nothing to use it on
autumn heron
I want it cause it looks cool
unique verge
I'd bet anything the loudest complaints about the relic are from people who dont use it for anything
autumn heron
worn forge
like it’s fine if people dont like the content
tardy ingot
I'd bet anything the loudest complaints about the relic are from people who dont...
Or people trying to get all of them at once
worn forge
but also see that the devs tried other methods in the past
and people still weren’t happy
open verge
Eureka relics sucked
Because I didn’t do eureka
Pagos was actually unbearable
And many people quit
worn forge
your first eureka relic was buttcheeks because you had to level up too
autumn heron
Eureka was ass. Vast majority of people gave up almost immeidatly
worn forge
afterwards they were fine
autumn heron
How long does it take to level in Eureka now
coral kite
Eureka was ass. Vast majority of people gave up almost immeidatly
Nooooo Eureka was always perfect. B b o z j a b a d
autumn heron
open verge
Revisionist history
stable island
If you look at it as it stands now, Eureka was better then Bozja. (Also because the mobs there never ignores you and the fact you always lose mettle when you go KO.)
And you know, it is not that you do the relic in one day, that is very true and not the spirit of the relic.
But making it a chore or annoying? A good grind should be fun, not an annoying one to to......
open verge
Eureka better bozja
worn forge
what
gloomy shale
I liked the go at your own rate for eureka
open verge
Y’all had fun grinding fates last step 😭
worn forge
Relics have ALWAYS been a resource and time investment
open verge
cluster farming for a weapon was so much fun
worn forge
ARR steps took weeks of farming atmas, books, and dungeons each
HW had unids and sand
and Eureka 
open verge
What was so fun about previous step
open verge
autumn heron
worn forge
tedium and relics are one and the same
zealous mulch
ARR steps took weeks of farming atmas, books, and dungeons each
books...no HELL NO JUST NO... NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
worn forge
it’s the cost for a carefree weapon
gloomy shale
What expansion did you do the most relics for?
zealous mulch
I did 1 arr relic and i killed myself after. no more books EVER...
gloomy shale
I only finished 1 Eureka wep
zealous mulch
What expansion did you do the most relics for?
HW has the best and nicest relics ^^
gloomy shale
Yeah I have a few HW ones
worn forge
but it was ez for me because I had tons of leftovers
from doing eureka for fun and gil
open verge
The funniest complaint about the relic is “but I want to do all relics”
If your doing all relics your fucking asking for it
gloomy shale
that's masochistic
worn forge
wanting all the relics is like wanting to learn all the trades IRL
I mean yeah
you could
but it’s gonna take an eternity
open verge
But like they will get nerfed eventually
worn forge
yeah there’s no need to rush things either
it’s meant to be steady progress that you whittle away every day or so
or whenever you’re on
gloomy shale
Has anyone worked out the average time it takes to complete a relic for each expansion and I wonder which one is the shortest/longest
stable island
Well, it should always be possible to do current content for the current relic, like the ARR, HW and ShB relics.
The books was a steady progress, but more important a traceable one. You could see how far you were.
With this messy relic you can only see where you are when you do old content that breaks your job for current content, that is a huge flaw.
How maybe ARR and HW relics did you guys got after the nerf and when you could do it unsync?
(Unlike the ShB ones, where unsync is coded as impossible.)
zealous mulch
and its not meant to be easy..
gloomy shale
true
open verge
How the fuck is this step not traceable
worn forge
I did Atma step for ARR when it was shit
coral kite
The inventory isn't real Monk
worn forge
it took a month
open verge
Whenever I finish a run the game literally has a pop up of quest progress
zealous mulch
and the nicest. i love most of the Anima Lux weapons.
open verge
These reasons your bringing up make no sense
worn forge
imagine the anger you see on these steps, now teleport back to like 2015 and imagine it being worse
with no guarantee drop
atmas prenerf were sub 5%
gloomy shale
now that's a true grind
worn forge
I’m not saying these new steps are worse because hurrdurr I been through the war
but like, this could be _ much_ worse
at least the raids guarantee the drops
open verge
I’m not saying this step is perfect
But people are complaining about the raids more then the bozja
autumn heron
A friend of mine got all the ARR weapons
open verge
the augment system is way fucking worse
autumn heron
Pre-nerf
open verge
He’s insane
coral kite
Some people in the XIV community as we've seen
autumn heron
Took him a year and a half
coral kite
just can't be reasoned with
autumn heron
worn forge
<:yoshiPain:713612978917998622> the augment system is way fucking worse
you don’t wanna farm delubududu?
worn forge
easy gil too if you get lucky
open verge
Maybe
autumn heron
Farming DR helps in other ways like getting the new Judge armor
Which is also for glam
worn forge
hair is like 6m+ atm
autumn heron
But if u want the full set
open verge
They fucking changed the system
worn forge
dunno about the Gabriel robot
radiant pollen
wish the drg lance didn't clip through the judge armor
autumn heron
Because memes
worn forge
because fuck you
autumn heron
I want to dye it blood red
worn forge
genuinely, whoever signed off on the new aug system
autumn heron
The fending gear looks great with that
worn forge
has never played xiv before
orchid dune
Is this the kicker that finally gets me to find the quest to unlock the 60 allis
autumn heron
You either need to grind several hundred hours for the augments
worn forge
how out of touch can you be to make the dyeable set obtainable by shelling out 20m gil
autumn heron
Or be rich
worn forge
autumn heron
And buy all of them
stable island
@open verge
Because the guaranteed drop is annoying to do in the long term.
I do like the alliance raids, maybe more then the average player, but for me it is also way to much to do it 18 times for one relic. Fates is not a reliable alternative with a 5% drop rate.
radiant pollen
dreamy about to drop another lorem ipsum dolor sit amet
worn forge
like I said
open verge
Just do the fucking raids
tardy ingot
They realized the lengths people go to get some glamour and doubled down
worn forge
it could be worse
unique verge
<@153131147579097088>
Because the guaranteed drop is annoying to do in the lon...
long term
Ya'll fucking smashing this out in one day and talking about long term?
worn forge
the steps could exclusively be in Bozja, a zone people are afraid of it dying and progress halting one day
autumn heron
I'll have step 2 down by today or tomorrow
worn forge
at least we all have access to outside alternatives
autumn heron
ShB relics arent long term at all
next quarry
Healer spec is good for gogo right
topaz river
ShB relics arent long term at all
I beg to disagree lol. 36 alliance raids is very long term
I don’t expect to have mine down for a week or so
open verge
Is a victory lap
worn forge
is in like 4 months
open verge
Next step is the victory lap so it’s also probably going to be easy too
worn forge
dont rush these current steps
next quarry
Hydatos.....
stable island
A traceable progression is a progression with light at the end of the tunnel.
In other words, you can reasonably see when you are done. RNG grind relies on luck without a possibility to see when you are likely done.
Of course the atma grind was also pretty bad, but i am sure players were annoyed back then too.
Some players like the RNG grind ofc, but i am sure at least 90% doesn't. (It is just an estimate of me btw.)
I honestly wonder, did 2.28 had as much content as we have today? (Or was the atma grinding purely because there was really nothing else to do?)
gloomy shale
I will do 1 alliance raid every two days
worn forge
ARR had squat for sidecontent so yeah, grind was there to be grindy
viscid monolith
No 2.28 didn't have as much content as today
open verge
Which makes it worse
Because there’s actual other content people could be doing
Instead of forcing yourself to do a relic
viscid monolith
Anyway we all know why they're making people do Shadow of Mhach and Ivalice
worn forge
this is why I advocate slow and steady progress
viscid monolith
It's to boost optics
viscid monolith
They want to make old content look busier m
coral kite
this is why I advocate slow and steady progress
Slow and steady progress means nothing to these people
😔
worn forge
like, this could instead be that one aether oil step
that took weeks because of a weekly
gloomy shale
is it worth doing the synthetic fabric quest btw?
viscid monolith
15 of each Alliance series is obscene
worn forge
is it worth doing the synthetic fabric quest btw?
only if you want more weight capacity for your actions
gloomy shale
where do you even get them
viscid monolith
Not to mention that this is just for one weapon
worn forge
raredrops from skirmishes from what I hear
viscid monolith
What about the other weapons people will want?
worn forge
yeah Lance THATS something I can get behind
unique verge
Fabrics can drop from skirmishes, CE's and CLL
worn forge
not yet 
next quarry
worn forge
dont tempt them lmao
next quarry
Tradition!
shy flax
i saw a tiny thing in reginae
uh
final boss' attacks
are Ashe's quickenings
in XII
next quarry
The queen
shy flax
okay just needed to get that out thanks bye
tardy ingot
I need more coins
next quarry
Just a reference
stable island
@viscid monolith
Yep, to help new players getting the content done.
But does it truely be done this way? 18 times is too much, just make it 8 to 10 times with higher fate/ce drop chances.
This is more punishing end-game players because they don't do old content to help new players, there is already a solution for that since 2.1, called duty roulette.
Again, it is always easier to abandon things then to take a painful grind, with a risk that new players never get past the things they want to do because the veterans are annoyed too much to do it.
And remember, the majority of the playerbase is not even on reddit and the official forums.
(And what i have picked up in game, well..... not really good signs, most players are annoyed.)
autumn heron
Almost everything Bozja related has been an FFXII reference
digital forge
reference most likely
next quarry
Yep
digital forge
lmao people really are coasting on "this is hard, bring back arr/hw relics"
atma grinds 
shy flax
Northswain's Glow, Heaven's Wrath
gloomy shale
is 5.55 the last patch?
unreal wadi
Imagine thinking book grind ARR is easier than spamming CT
autumn heron
Id rather have this kinda grind where I actually run content
unreal wadi
autumn heron
X.55 is always the last patch before xpac yes
digital forge
I'm just gonna take it easy and Bozja level
digital forge
x.55 is precedent but there's nothing saying they can't break it
autumn heron
But that was weird
unreal wadi
Some people don't remember how much of a pain atma & book grinding was
stable island
Atma grinds were bearable because there was nothing to do back then.
viscid monolith
I'd rather have a grind that favors Bozja, the new content, instead of shit I've run 1000 times
stable island
||A lot can change in 7 years||
unreal wadi
We're all lucky we can fly in ARR zones
as well
Think of the guys who couldn't fly
autumn heron
Atma grinds were bearable because there was nothing to do back then.
They werent bareable even back then
Almost no one finished them
digital forge
gj people who complained that the relic was too quick to get
autumn heron
Until the grind was nerfed
viscid monolith
Back during the atma grind there wasn't even a mount speed boost
You guys are lucky
digital forge
this ain't even the worst of it lol, HW Anima suuuucked on content
unreal wadi
We're quite lucky
digital forge
"Oh but it was just poetics" everyone ran ARF
stable island
But was there something else to do?
And when was the nerf in that?
||i do know it was very fast||
worn forge
doing unid step was ass if you didn’t utilize every tool on your belt to acquire them
unreal wadi
But was there something else to do?
And when was the nerf in that?
||i do kno...
Coils.
worn forge
beast tribes, tomestomes, alex farm
digital forge
the sheer number of people grinding out ARF and then Gubal Hard
viscid monolith
Anyway I don't know how many more ways I can say "fuck Yoshida" for fucking up Bozja this badly.
unreal wadi
Remember that light farming was probably really ass back then for Anima
Because you were levelled synced for a9s
Not like now
digital forge
you did a1s light farm
gloomy shale
what is the best ranged filler for BLU on a side not
worn forge
Light farm was easy
digital forge
a9s only cropped up when you were either stupid or you had your group
viscid monolith
No you did A9S farm back then too
worn forge
it took four hours of 1s
worn forge
or less if bonus hour
viscid monolith
Only idiots and lazy people did A1S
digital forge
i do remember a9s but not as much as a1s
worn forge
you mean to tell me the devs trusted the playerbase to support a sidecontent zone for years to come?
unreal wadi
Hey look Eureka is still alive now
digital forge
^
tardy ingot
"IS THE RELIC GRIND TOO EASY?"
worn forge
yeah you can definitely get shit done in there
unreal wadi
Lots of JP players like Baldesion Arsenal
worn forge
Estelle reached Hydatos a few days ago for example
stable island
Again || a lot can change in 7 years||......
Synced to L60 yes, when the cap was also L60.
Now you need to choose between content on level cap with crappy drop rates or annoying synced content what you already have done hundereds of times for steady progress.
I think i know most players will choose. ||Waiting for the inevitable nerf or not doing it at all||
unreal wadi
I got to Hydatos in 5.3
digital forge
why the spoilers tho
unreal wadi
Again || a lot can change in 7 years||......
Synced to L60 yes, when the cap wa...
watch this be the argument next expansion
Gonna screencap this
and if you make this argument but for SHB
worn forge
the grind may also partially be there because this step is gonna have a 3-4 month gap between it and the next step
so enjoy yourself
digital forge
also good dichotomy there
stable island
The drop is only when you do the content synced, so i doubt they remove that requirement in 6.0
autumn heron
As opposed to previous relics
digital forge
remember
autumn heron
Where it was a 6 month gap
digital forge
there's also the 5.5 zone which will help
worn forge
because expac is expected to drop in August-October
unreal wadi
So basically according to Dreamy's logic
autumn heron
5.55 Bozja gear will need you to have augmented Judge armor
unreal wadi
Eureka was the best
autumn heron
stable island
Well, Eureka was crappy in it's own right. I liked it, but also hated it.
Every relic has it's oddities, but don't break it by forcing players to do content that isn't even at the level for the relic.
worn forge
sora 
worn forge
ARR and HW relics had you go do fates
unreal wadi
and zodiac
worn forge
which are never at your level
digital forge
"Every relic has it's oddities, but don't break it by forcing players to do content that isn't even at the level for the relic."
i'm gonna just...look...at how many times you had to run leveling roulette for umbrite
and book fates, yeah, fates in general
viscid monolith
It being optional doesn't excuse the quest being shittily put together
unreal wadi
digital forge
Remember the completely epic on-level ARR conte- FUCK AMBER
at least there was diadem lol
viscid monolith
All I want is for BOZJA to be the best method for getting BOZJA relic weapon
gloomy shale
Should we be scared for the last step of the current relic?
worn forge
I can agree with that, Lance
autumn heron
Last step is always the victory lap
worn forge
naw Nova, last step has historically been carefree
autumn heron
So do all ShB dungeons
unreal wadi
Should we be scared for the last step of the current relic?
unless it requires you to do B.A. content, no
viscid monolith
So do all ShB dungeons
Do all Heavensward dungeons you mean
digital forge
last step is gonna be one semi-large grind and then victory lap
unreal wadi
To complete eureka weapon, you needed to do Baldesion
gloomy shale
you must complete DR savage haha
stable island
Yep, but you could do it at least while waiting for other things.
Fates are synced yes.
But those books.....
Was the fate confirmation 100% back then or also RNG?
And yes, make Bozja the best method to get Bozja relic.
viscid monolith
Because we have to make opd content look busy
tardy ingot
I just really dont get why memories are easier to get outside of bozja
worn forge
fate confirmation was 100% for books
but also
some of those fates took hrs to spawn
digital forge
relics were always "make people do old content" in ARR/HW
worn forge
obviously that got reworked later
viscid monolith
Memories were easier to get in Bozja during the last step though
digital forge
SB was a different idea because people complained
viscid monolith
Why change it now?
autumn heron
Next xpac relic is kill 8000 mobs
worn forge
autumn heron
viscid monolith
No one told them to make getting the relic easier outside of the contwnt
Stop pawning off the devs' stupid decisions on the playerbase
They were idiots
This is a stupid quest
digital forge
bruh i never said that
worn forge
as someone who enjoys being in Bozja, I have exactly zero reasons to stick around for CE farm for step one
I dont like duels
I got my cluster shit and field notes
tardy ingot
Now people are complaining about having to do bozja after being given options to farm memories outside of the content
digital forge
that's literally what they said lol
worn forge
they really didn’t make bozja enticing for this step
viscid monolith
bruh i never said that
digital forge
yeah for eureka -> bozja "you can do your own way"
viscid monolith
Now people are complaining about having to do bozja after being given options to...
No. People are complaining about having to do old Alliance raids
digital forge
Not
No one told them to make getting the relic easier outside of the contwnt
stable island
@worn forge
Well, it was adjusted very quickly, only took 1 to 3 months before they spawned more afaik.
But what if the chance was not 100% on the book's objectives?
And the only other good way was spamming the Level 16 to 20 dungeons to progress?
meager forum
is there any reliable way to get max quality for the new crafting turn ins?
digital forge
is there any reliable way to get max quality for the new crafting turn ins?
adapt to the rng
digital forge
oh no we're getting into hypotheticals
unreal wadi
on them
lemme see if i can find it
Havent actually done expert crafts, now that i think about it...
stable island
@digital forge
Except that humans have expectations, they can't handle too much RNG.
Who do you like more? A lucky player or a player that have earnt the same things as the lucky player in a way longer time? (Answer homestly)
stable island
Heh, that is the expected answer Ami!
unreal wadi
At least with the SHB ones, i can do something else while queuing, like actually start doing my skysteel tools
speaking of which, those garlean fibers, they drop in Bozja right?
viscid monolith
Dev Psychology: Make content as grindy as possible without completely antagonizing people and making them unsub.
unreal wadi
BDO
digital forge
speaking of which, those garlean fibers, they drop in Bozja right?
yes
unreal wadi
Gotcha~
Guess I can do three things at once then
Hope for the memory, get the garlean fibers, and grind for lvl 15
stable island
But fact is that rely on too much luck is always bad.
People buy lottery tickets again and again because they think they will hit the jackpot somewhere in the future and they earn back the money invested, but that is never the case. It is luck what counts, not expectations what our brain does.
Anyway, Lance is correct. Gaming should be fun, so grinding should be too, not something that veteran players already have done many, many times in order to progress current content in a reliable way.
unreal wadi
so i can actually
gloomy shale
is there a gallery of the new tool glows
gloomy shale
yea
digital forge
ye, i'm planning to grind in bozja for R15, the mount, and fibers
unreal wadi
forgot the link though
digital forge
I still need to clean out the shop anyways too
gloomy shale
yeah ill take a look on reddit
digital forge
nah
unreal wadi
I know JP reached final boss
digital forge
they're "technically" at the final boss
but as it turns out
the queen doesn't spawn lol
gloomy shale
lol
digital forge
so there's an additional boss
digital forge
oh wait she's there
unreal wadi
to that additional boss
gloomy shale
how long did BA take to finish?
unreal wadi
lemme check twitch
digital forge
haruglory
gloomy shale
How long did Baldesion take to world first?
digital forge
yeah it was mostly the start that was fucked because you had to be at the end of eureka
and the portal snipers
the fucking snipers
unreal wadi
I guess its a good thing DR savage is PF only
radiant pollen
10 more DB runs
unreal wadi
@digital forge Haruglory sent a sacrifice to see mechanics
and literally first mechanics
digital forge
i look away for one second
unreal wadi
4 guards, no aoe markers
digital forge
did someone clip
unreal wadi
only 1 safe space on the chessboard
stable island
@unreal wadi
Maybe you can link the twitch?
odd yoke
unreal wadi
@digital forge its a mix of 2 different mechanics
in one
the orange line markers
and guard movement
stable island
Hmmm....
Look at the mettle the player has left. Would be a pain if the rank maximum goes up.
untold hamlet
.
digital forge
what the fuck
stable island
Well, you are thrown out if you release in Savage mode.
unreal wadi
Man
odd yoke
Mainly arise
stable island
That doesn't remove the fact that not only the relic is annoying but farming the pure essences too.
unreal wadi
Pure essences make fucking sense
odd yoke
All the new fragments are in the cluster shop
odd yoke
I need to cluster farm more
digital forge
how dare there be check friction to complete the higher level content
unreal wadi
and tanks drag enemies to a marker to kill
speaking of which
I saw someone in limsa
with full augmented bozja gear
JP as well
odd yoke
They probably had augmented bojza already
So just easy grab for law
Then the savage runs
unreal wadi
Yeah, its an easy grab for law
stable island
radiant pollen
how long would it take to get augmented gear?
autumn heron
Hahahaha
Depends
If you have a shit ton of gil u can just buy the augments off the MB
If not
Its a very rare drop from castrum
U can do 20 runs and not get one
autumn heron
Doesnt help castrum only pops once an hour
radiant pollen
or something like that
gaunt star
What I don’t understand is why they made the dragoon armor fucking blue
There is no blue judges
autumn heron
U can buy the augment with 999 coins yea but that will also take a while
odd yoke
Like totems in EX
autumn heron
Cause fates only drop one
odd yoke
If you dont get the drop then its the pity way to get it
gaunt star
Where do you even trade the coins for the augment
radiant pollen
time to spend a year in bozja 
gaunt star
Ohh
rugged arch
Does somehow know what I have to do in POLD for final steps of the relic weapon. sry for may bad english.
gaunt star
For mental hell reasons I am not going into castrum again
tardy ingot
🧑🌾 judge set farming
tardy ingot
For mental hell reasons I am not going into castrum again
You're lucky if enough people even queue up for it.
gaunt star
All 5 of them
autumn heron
How long would it take to get just 100 bozjan coins via CE and Skirmish farming
Like 3 hours?
Maybe less?
unique verge
Depends alot on what spawns and RNG
since you can convert notes to coins at a rate of 3 per note and those can drop from anything, CE's give i think between 2-4 coins, skirmishes give 1 coin
fluid plinth
Soooo ..... how is the savage raid ( new one ) easy to do ;O ? or am i gonna waste tons of mettle xD
maiden lodge
It's not easy.
maiden lodge
So my group has to carry meh ;O got you
Get enough people doing this, and you won't even come close.
gloomy shale
4 more loathsomes and then the real grind begins
fluid plinth
Dont be a fun sponge ;O thought it was like eureka 😛 because i got told eureka raid was pretty easy
gloomy shale
what raid are people running for the haunting memories?
fluid plinth
Grrr ... i was so excited to get the mount .... and now i cant because i have no friends ;O ? that sucks 😒
thorny sleet
what raid are people running for the haunting memories?
void ark
odd yoke
Its savage
maiden lodge
This wont
It will, just next bozjan gear wave. Yoshi-P's said though they've been holding off on bozjan effect stats for this reason.
brisk quail
it's all savage content?
always hqs been:astronaut: :FeelsGunMan: :man_astronaut:
I was betrayed
tardy ingot
Bamboozled
brisk quail
I HAVE BEEN BAMBOOZLED
worn forge
you mean to tell me I have to socialize and coordinate with strangers if I don’t have a premade!?
next quarry
The savage version needs tons of coordinating and pure essences
odd yoke
And mechanical skill
autumn heron
By coordination you means slamming urself against a wall
next quarry
lmao
nocturne void
you mean to tell me I have to socialize and coordinate with strangers if I don’t...
I don't play MMOs to talk to people
nocturne void
You already have all the skills Aza?
nocturne void
Damn
nocturne void
I gotta work on that this evening
next quarry
I gotta work on relic and get all the spells
coral kite
you mean to tell me I have to socialize and coordinate with strangers if I don’t...
nooooooooooooo
nocturne void
Showcase tomorrow: We've added 50 glam slots
autumn heron
Showcase tomorrow: we are removing MNK from the game
odd yoke
Showcase: we're deleting healers
odd yoke
We cant balance them so out they go
autumn heron
nocturne void
DPS faster so there are fewer raidwides
hollow lily
nocturne void
quick, hand me some nethicite and an angry fran
gaunt star
Watch the instance involve saving “Ashe” or whoever her leader is and fighting gabranth as the final boss
autumn heron
In terms of FF games. Its 3.
autumn heron
12 is one of my favs
autumn heron
It has one of my fav plots in FF
digital forge
i couldn't get into ff12
autumn heron
All the Ivalice storylines are a lot less character driven
And more politics driven
gaunt star
I like those stories in limited doses
Kinda sick of the same thing over and over again at this point
serene crest
Yoshi’s gone on record that 3 is his favorite but he wanted to work at SE specifically to work for or with Matsuno. By the time he got to SE, however, Matsuno had already left.
gaunt star
Fun fact most monarchies are happier places than most “democracies”
coral kite
Showcase tomorrow: We've added 50 glam slots
Finally my job is done
digital forge
showcase tomorrow: Beastmaster Limited Job
gaunt star
I hope it caps at lvl 50
wet crown
The unicycle throne freaks me out because the upper limbs are legs
actually, the whole raid makes me weirdly umcomfortable because of what happened to the Blades
Gosh, Trinity Seeker is so...
autumn heron
But yea FFXII is based
wet crown
wet crown
No, it's XIV
next quarry
True
autumn heron
Not counting MMOs
Cause on going storyline
Who knows XIVs plot might shit the bed one day
gloomy shale
what ilvl is the relic now btw?
next quarry
515
serene crest
Who knows XIVs plot might shit the bed one day
I expect the first post Zodiark expansion to be a slow start, really. Probs going to lose some people.
gaunt star
white mage is nasty in DR
i had div + card + deep essence of profane + seraph strike
crit misery for 265k
lime igloo
why would I ever use a limited resource??
next quarry
I'll kill you
gaunt star
so u hoard them until you have no reason to use them?
next quarry
I'll rescue you into the wrong hot cold
serene crest
“I might need them later” leads to the thing never getting used ever.
gaunt star
i love it
lime igloo
(I use essences but there are people who think like this)
gaunt star
this time
i have
dragoon buffs + dnc buffs + ast cards + div + seraph strike + deep essence of profane + lost font of magic
gonna see how much my misery does
autumn heron
Hot cold fucks people up
Cause they cant just follow everyone else
You have to be hit with a specific aoe
digital forge
Savage Queen enrage seen
gaunt star
Critical! The dahu takes 394790 damage.
lime igloo
Savage Queen enrage seen
gotta wonder if there's more to that fight...
unique verge
Are people who dont use essence why some runs feel slow
Yes.
lime igloo
the thing I like is that, unlike with regular Savage, there's no way WF is going to happen off stream. cause like where are you gonna find 48 WF raiders who can do a thing secretly
unique verge
That's true, thats a nice aspect
and honestly its not like they're gonna gain much from spying either
Its just actually hard and you either have the skills or you dont
ember forum
Guys, are we pretty sure that hair drops on nirmal and not maybe by any chance on survival?
unique verge
....
ember forum
Savage*
gaunt star
Direct hit! The Bozjan phantom takes 516625 damage.
unique verge
We are absolutely 100% sure.
unique verge
You have seen the hair on MB
and there literally has not been a single clear of Savage yet
So it should be pretty obvious what that means
tardy ingot
Are people who dont use essence why some runs feel slow
Considering some just give you free damage buffs, yes
ember forum
I'm not lying when I say that I'm slowly getting to that 50 DR achievemnts and still no hair, no nount or anything xd
unique verge
tbh you're best off just selling it if you get it anyway
shits going for 20-30mil right now
tardy ingot
I've only gotten tabletop pieces so far. Trying not to burn out on it honestly
unique verge
and it WILL plummet in price over time
lime igloo
you have to do 15 DR clears per relic
tardy ingot
It'll probably drop hard like the gabriel alpha key prices eventually
lime igloo
that's like. 200 clears
ember forum
I think hair is going to be evn more expebsive
Aince nobody will probably do dr in future much
It will probably be deqd like castrum
grave raft
DR is going to be more alive than castrum
tardy ingot
But you need castrum to do dr
lime igloo
DR is easier to get into yeah
unique verge
I've been running alot of CLL lately
I'm at three clears today, and i say with a personal point of pride that i lead two Lyon groups with mostly new people to victory.
coral kite
But you need castrum to do dr
A lot of people have done it alreasy but there are quite a few just now coming to bozja
lime igloo
I've been running alot of CLL lately
what datacenter are you on. I've been trying to do it on Primal but every attempt fails lol
unique verge
Primal. Same as you.
coral kite
However, I think cll oughta be dfable too at this point
lime igloo
guess I'm just unlucky lol
grave raft
before 5.45 patch, a lot of people in my dc are running castrum and now? nada