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#retired-patch-6-3-discussion
lusty shadowBOT
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brisk quail
Pfft. Doesn't say range. Smh
viscid monolith
15 yalms
sterile moat
i'm used to cure III range
maiden lodge
It's range is massive, unlike Exulv
sterile moat
also angel snack is a stronger med II with 120s cd
brisk quail
Exuiv: 6y
Strotam: 15y
maiden lodge
Angel Snack is stronk
brisk quail
Strotam was HELLA needed
White wind was basically the only way to party heal pre-70
Exuiv was way too small
viscid monolith
Bigger range and it doesn't cost 15% of my fucking MP like White Wind
sterile moat
just don't be social distancing inside the fights and you won't have issues
also white wind is good for 1 hp mechs
snapshot the heal
maiden lodge
White wind is good if you time things absolutely perfect
Whereas Strotham is good if you have internet that isn't perfect
sterile moat
you have 3 seconds to snapshot it due to spaghetti code
viscid monolith
You have let the mechanic fail
maiden lodge
how do you guys
Step 1: Mist Dragon
unreal wadi
oh
viscid monolith
And Diamondback it
sterile moat
time to change servers for you then
brisk quail
tfw 1200 ping when in trial
sterile moat
or get better net
maiden lodge
I for one like my healers being reliant on server ticks in order to not wipe
sterile moat
basically AST healing walking dead
either way
my point is that BLU basically got some reskins of medica I and medica II
sterile moat
that might not mean good for 6.0
maiden lodge
my point is that BLU basically got some reskins of medica I and medica II
'healer got healing spells, what garbage'
They... also got a shit ton of dps spells to go with it
sterile moat
on tanking skills you get a mix of TBN and edge of shadow
on dps skills you have all sorts of weird shit
and for new blu healer spells you get med I and med II
viscid monolith
Blue Mage does crazy dps
maiden lodge
well new dps skills are new healer spells too
brisk quail
Triple Trident, Rose of Destruction, (the big three), tingle, chelonian, cold fog, mantra magic...
viscid monolith
Pulls 16k at level 70
maiden lodge
and those new dps skills are fucking massive
pine epoch
I love being a blue tank now thanks to the new skills
Before blue tank was stressful and came down to managing diamondback
brisk quail
Like Phantom and mantra magic is dumb
maiden lodge
You also got sentinel for tank
sterile moat
what i'm saying is that in terms of designing the new spells, the healer ones are just basically medI/II
brisk quail
Devour went from shit to priimmooooo
maiden lodge
That's shit they needed
sterile moat
it's almost like SE is creatively bankrupt when it comes to healing
brisk quail
There's not many other avenues for healing
Like give me a diffrent type of heals.
Besides...
- Heal shields
- Dot heals
- Times heals
- Life steal
- Raw heals
maiden lodge
Like right now it sounds like 'healer specific spells are too focused on making green numbers appear' and I'm like.... so?
brisk quail
There's not many other ways to heal
sterile moat
so 6.0 is coming
maiden lodge
Blu already has a shield
sterile moat
and on the chance they had to make new wild blu spells, they didn't
maiden lodge
Well what do you -want-
sterile moat
healing spells
maiden lodge
Like what is it, exactly, you want, that is a different way to make green numbers show up over people's heads?
'healing spells do healing, how bad is this' is a hot take
brisk quail
Give me a new type of healing besides the 5 I laid out
maiden lodge
Will the next person come in and complain matra magic makes orange numbers appear?
brisk quail
How else should green numbers go up
maiden lodge
Starbomb?
viscid monolith
I thought matra magic was supposed to be missiles
brisk quail
Thats pure timed
dim sigil
Is it not in 14
sterile moat
fuck if i know i'm not a game designer, point is out of all the possibilities we got the most boring choices for the job that's meant to be the wildcard
viscid monolith
!action Mantra Magic
lusty shadowBOT
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brisk quail
The issue is THERE ARE NO OTHER WAYSA
maiden lodge
It's missiles
viscid monolith
Nope just orbs of light
maiden lodge
YOu fire abunch of missles and they go PEW PEW PEW and 8 orange numbers appear
maiden lodge
Nope just orbs of light
I mean... that's... what it was in FF9
viscid monolith
Not that I mind. I can barely see the animation.
sterile moat
The issue is THERE ARE NO OTHER WAYSA
AND THAT'S WHY I AM SAYING, WITH A POSSIBLE NEW HEALER COMING OUT AND THE CURRENT ONES GETTING NEW SPELLS, IT MIGHT BE THE SAME BORING SHIT WE GOT SO FAR
get it now?
viscid monolith
It will be Dan
sterile moat
THAT'S MY POINT
maiden lodge
AND THAT'S WHY I AM SAYING, WITH A POSSIBLE NEW HEALER COMING OUT AND THE CURREN...
You want a new way to jazz up healing, and we're asking, 'okay, give an example of how they can do that?' Like fucking WoW's been around 17 years and they can't do it
viscid monolith
Healing is a dead end in this game. Fight design restricts how you can approach healing.
sterile moat
fuck if i know, you can make green numbers go up with more interesting mechs
dim sigil
Chemsit mudra like potion mixing is all i can think of
viscid monolith
Or it might just be that healing as an art isn't very interesting. I dunno what to you.
maiden lodge
Healing is a dead end in this game. Fight design restricts how you can approach ...
Well it's not that, it's just that the job involves a single mechanic, and without a meta that supports healing rotations you can't make it more complicated
brisk quail
The roads in the city have been built. The buildings up around them. And yet you complain the road goes around the building.
maiden lodge
It's like, you want something wild. I get that. But no one including you has any idea of what that could be.
brisk quail
They can't fit more roads
viscid monolith
they had the chance to give it something fucking wild
What wild spells did you want? Personally I wanted a spell that summoned Yokai from Seiryu.
maiden lodge
Short of 'I kill myself to heal my' wait they did that
brisk quail
Short of 'I kill myself to heal my' wait they did that
Yep they did do that!
sterile moat
the paper one?
viscid monolith
Paper?
sterile moat
yea they're paper dolls, forgot the japanese name
viscid monolith
No I mean the Yokai Seiryu is summoning through the fight
He summons different types
maiden lodge
No I mean the Yokai Seiryu is summoning through the fight
Shikigami*
sterile moat
yea
viscid monolith
Right my bad
sterile moat
shikigami
viscid monolith
Hm what other crazy spell could they have added
maiden lodge
If I had my way, they didn't because they wanted to keep Shikigami for Onmyoji/Oracle/Mystic
Also in terms of 'wild healing spells'
points to SB enemies
viscid monolith
I wanted Grand Cross
brisk quail
Let's describe it like this.
There's a wall.. you can go... around it, through it, over it, under it.
But what else can you do?
Well you could travel back in time before the wall existed. Or you could move the wall..
But besides that? What else? Well after that not much else can be done. No one can come up with something more that'd not fall under anything else previously done.
That's where we are at healing-wise
maiden lodge
Don't care about it being in Savage
I mean Trine IS literally a Blue Spell
sterile moat
this one is stuck on architecture
viscid monolith
It is?
viscid monolith
I've only known Trine being used by Kefka
sterile moat
and it's full of starbucks, and yoship adds more starbucks to the street
sterile moat
that's how i put more medica like spells being put into the game
brisk quail
AoE heals bad
viscid monolith
Also I guess I've been wrong about Blue Mage for the last 2 years
viscid monolith
Blue Mage can only copy monster abilities I guess
Or machine abilities
It can't copy techniques that people use
maiden lodge
that's how i put more medica like spells being put into the game
Except you're calling every place to get coffee 'a Starbucks' like a grandma would call a videogame console 'a Nintendo' and then wondering why you have to go to 'Starbucks' to get coffee, and we're telling you 'well, short of going to a store or making it at home, there's no way to revolutionize coffee getting.'
And you're wondering why they haven't created some new coffee getting technique
And we're like 'Well, there's that one place that injects it in your ass'
'No that's boring'
'well what do you want?'
sterile moat
Any AoE = medica
so please do tell me, outside of certain gimmicks (ie lilies) or negligible potency differences (+30 on helios), how do medica I, rapture, strotram and helios differ
maiden lodge
'I dunno, just tired of getting my coffee in a cup'
maiden lodge
so please do tell me, outside of certain gimmicks (ie lilies) or negligible pote...
They don't, that much. Because at some point you need a button that just says 'Make everyone's hp go back up'
You just do
brisk quail
Why does every melee unit have a garbage first hit in their combo? (Excluding stance III to boot shine)
viscid monolith
Idk
sterile moat
that's a fucking stupid comparison and you know it
viscid monolith
I wish they would get rid of whatever the fuck Samurai's first hit in its combo is
maiden lodge
that's a fucking stupid comparison and you know it
Well we don't know what you want, exactly.
viscid monolith
Honesty get rid of all of them
maiden lodge
We don't know how to satisfy you, because we can't actually figure out a way to make green numbers appear in some new exciting way.
Like, that's a hard ask
viscid monolith
I played PVP Samurai and it doesn't have the first hit and guess what? It was great.
maiden lodge
'Well do it in a wierd way'
brisk quail
Hard slash
sterile moat
i'm criticizing SE lack of creativity, on the most broken job of the game where they could go all out to add new stuff they chose the most boring spells to make blu versions of
brisk quail
Keen edge
viscid monolith
That's a valid point Dan
maiden lodge
i'm criticizing SE lack of creativity, on the most broken job of the game where ...
A lack of creativity is only a fair comment when there's a lot of room to be creative.
brisk quail
And we're telling you there's not much else to be POSSIBLY done
viscid monolith
Besides some niche one hit kill attacks Blue Mage plays like a normal dps
sterile moat
they could've made a blu version of earthly star or excog or fuck, spread excog on BLU
brisk quail
When there's no more
maiden lodge
Like I'm not even accusing SE of this. MMO designers are literally out of ideas on this
sterile moat
but they went with the most boring possible version of it
maiden lodge
they could've made a blu version of earthly star or excog or fuck, spread excog ...
So, an aoe shield then?
brisk quail
Every MMO has their heals fall under those 5
maiden lodge
Like... do you want a heal rotation? Awesome you have what WHM had. Probably still has, I dunno if they still have Freecure.
sterile moat
doesn't matter, point is that yet another medica ripoff is getting old
viscid monolith
For the record I'm talking about attacks for Blue Mage
maiden lodge
doesn't matter, point is that yet another medica ripoff is getting old
But it was needed.
sterile moat
could've just changed exuviation for 15y and call it a day
maiden lodge
For the record I'm talking about attacks for Blue Mage
And to be fair, you can't make BLU a decent dps to play without it playing like a dps
brisk quail
They coulda. But they decided it was best to be an esuna replacement
It's Blue esuna
maiden lodge
i'm not talking about healing methods
So what would you want a healing skill to DO
sterile moat
.......
maiden lodge
So if you don't know
And we don't know
why are you bitching that the MMO world doesn't know?
sterile moat
i'm .... you because i already told you that's not the point i'm addressing, already told you the point 3 or 4 times and you still
HURR
brisk quail
They can't come up with anything
You can't come up with anything
Your friend hasn't.
Blizzard hasn't.
Arenanet hasn't.
SQEX hasn't.
brisk quail
No ONE CAN
The number of possible ideas around healing have been killed off one by one and created since WOW existed
They've all been done
maiden lodge
Look, dan I want to teleport and repeating that I want the ability to teleport ain't gonna make it possible.
And it's science's lack of imagination for not coming up with a new way to get me to teleport
sterile moat
how is that even related when you can't teleport
maiden lodge
Even though I'm asking the impossible here, it's sciences's fault for having a lack of drive to do so
maiden lodge
how is that even related when you can't teleport
Only reason I can't is because of a lack of imagination, has nothing to do with the possible.
sterile moat
how do we go from SE making a 4th or 5th version of medica I ends up in teleportation?
maiden lodge
I don't know why you're saying the fact I can't do it matters
brisk quail
He's asking reality and science to imagine he can teleport
maiden lodge
Look, I shouldn't have to figure out how to make it happen either, it's the scientists's fault
brisk quail
So it comes true right?
It's just the scientists
They're bad people
They don't want him too
maiden lodge
Stop tellng me it's impossible, with facts and logic.
sterile moat
what the fuck is this conversation
maiden lodge
Why are you telling me it's impossible
sterile moat
also teleport is possible
gaunt star
Looks like I'm skipping relics
maiden lodge
what the fuck is this conversation
ITs called Reductio ad Absurdum
gaunt star
Not a fat chance in hell I'm doing the worst designed content in the game 15x
maiden lodge
I'm pointing out the flaw in your argument by changing the premise.
gaunt star
That's about 35+ hours alone doing the same garbage dungeon
sterile moat
maiden lodge
That's about 35+ hours alone doing the same garbage dungeon
Then do CEs.
gaunt star
Tf is a CE
maiden lodge
Oh so, they can teleport a particle right? That's totally the same as teleporting people
sterile moat
it's one step
maiden lodge
Tf is a CE
If you don't know what a CE is you couldn't do the relic anyways
maiden lodge
Critical Engagements
sterile moat
CE are the blue fates that appear in the map
gaunt star
You can't do those for step 3
maiden lodge
Fair, what's the other option?
gaunt star
Palace of the dead or AIDS x15
maiden lodge
Fates?
gaunt star
Floors 51+
viscid monolith
POTD or what
brisk quail
it's one step
Cool. Then has ANY country development studio ot think tank ever given ANY indication of a new form of healing?
unreal wadi
delubrum
brisk quail
Like any
gaunt star
I don't even have that but apparently POTD is AIDS too from the comments
maiden lodge
Or Delubrum
brisk quail
Have you seen a smidge of new healing types?
sterile moat
Cool. Then has ANY ~~country~~ development studio ot think tank ever given ANY ...
i wasn't talking of new forms of healing
maiden lodge
I don't even have that but apparently POTD is AIDS too from the comments
You don't hae delubrum?!
sterile moat
i never did
gaunt star
No the POTD
maiden lodge
Oh potd
gaunt star
And I'm on the first
sterile moat
i said, i didn't want medica I to be copy pasted once again
maiden lodge
level 17, gridania, House that Death Built
dim sigil
Do you have to go to floor 100 to get one piece or is it 10 floors
gaunt star
All I know is its 51+
gaunt star
Delebrum is about as fun as a root canal
maiden lodge
Then do Palace of the Dead
dim sigil
Imagine if it's a random chance the horde chests
maiden lodge
Literally, go do that.
brisk quail
Why didn't WHM get a heal at level 1
sterile moat
brisk quail
if they remove the first button
Same concept
viscid monolith
Delubrum is more fun and I need the Essences anyway for Savage
maiden lodge
Might as well learn the Savage raid
I mean if you cared that hard, yeah
sterile moat
Why didn't WHM get a heal at level 1
can't heal enemies to death
gaunt star
I'm guessing the last step will complete 15 Savages
brisk quail
Exactly
gaunt star
And the weapons will get another visual downgrade
brisk quail
That's the point
viscid monolith
can't heal enemies to death
Wait for next expansion
brisk quail
There's NESSECITIES
sterile moat
but here's a concept that even exists on ff
brisk quail
Theres staples
viscid monolith
Maybe WHM will finally get reverse
maiden lodge
I'm guessing the last step will complete 15 Savages
So this is your first relic isn't it
viscid monolith
!buff Reverse
lusty shadowBOT
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maiden lodge
'what do you mean it takes a long time in repetitive combat'
maiden lodge
Then don't get your relic and go do Emerald Weapon Ex
Or do 7 weeks of Eden's Promise 4 normal
sterile moat
!buff Reverse
was looking for that
maiden lodge
shrugs
sterile moat
they could've just given healers reverse
gaunt star
I unironiallly almost quit mid way through 1 run of that trash dungeon
sterile moat
or make more spells like assize
gaunt star
2 hours for a dungeon
maiden lodge
I unironiallly almost quit mid way through 1 run of that trash dungeon
Then don't do it, do the other thing.
brisk quail
Isn't that just more forms of dps?
That's not healing
That's not new ways to make green numbers go up
sterile moat
what is healing?
brisk quail
That's what you wanted
viscid monolith
It'a not a dungeon
brisk quail
viscid monolith
It's a raid
brisk quail
You wanted new wild healing ideas
maiden lodge
Literally, do the other thing
viscid monolith
This is a real raid
sterile moat
if you think about it, killing something before it does a raidwide is mitigation
viscid monolith
As defined by WoW
brisk quail
Not starting the fight is also mitigation
sterile moat
now where is that image
sterile moat
no, because not starting the fight implies something is not being killed
and that might end the world
brisk quail
Nope you still avoid damage
maiden lodge
Watching a fight on youtube is watching it get killed but you take zero damage--ultimate strats
thin crypt
anyone get cerberus mount yet
sterile moat
yea
brisk quail
I beat an ultimate
sterile moat
people have cleared savage already
thin crypt
how it look like in game
sterile moat
i didn't yet, trying to get the rare shit from normal DR
and losing my sanity as i watch a BRD die 20 times to the same shit
also
is this just flavor text or do pure essences really have hidden effects?
pine epoch
Gambler will kill you
brisk quail
But. I will say if and when (likely never) if a new... unique form of healing is though up of and created. You bet your ass EVERY MMO will soon adopt it and or integrate it
sterile moat
yea, nobody cares
brisk quail
Hell. Many videogames as a whole
sterile moat
that wasn't the topic anyways
sterile moat
good, better be happy than sad
spiral wagon
if only i could read moonrunes
It's like they made the new BLM Relic exactly for my glam
brisk quail
I think he ded
sterile moat
now do it on ravana
while it's red
actually, how much hp does hard ravana has
778k
you can one shot ravana with a final sting
ex has 1.68mil
rain onyx
clever token
What's the drop chance for these memories from fates?? I've gotten 0 so far :L
vocal sorrel
holy shit they're not guaranteed like the last time? fuck
vocal sorrel
yeah I hear dabout that but I thought that couldn't be too bad cause they'd be guaranteed
but that SUCKS
gaunt star
pls tell me the timeworn artifacts are 100% from potd
T13 is 1.3m hp iirc so yeah with the superecho you should be able to oneshot
clever token
yeah either fates or running alliance raids for the guaranteed ones :\
gaunt star
They had the chance to make golden bahamut have exactly 10x the hp of t13 but it's off by like 0.5% 
viscid monolith
There's a vid on Reddit of someone hitting Shiva for 800k
You won't one shot Bahamut because he doesn't have a phase where takes more damage
The Ravana number is inflated
tidal shell
What's cluster farming like now? :p
stable island
@clever token
It is around 5%, reddit and the official forums are swarmed with complaints about it.
The only reliable way to make progress is to do 2 × 18 24-mans and that is bad, it doesn't help new ppl at all, it turns away people and make those raids not more lively.
tidal shell
If anyone has tried it; in terms of profit/and/or just items you can obtain in general from the random boxes etc for example
stable island
@gaunt star
PotD farm for timeworn artifacts?
Yep it is 100% drop, but only from on 50 or Floor 100 afaik, so no 51-60 spam.
gaunt star
1-50 spam it is
open verge
<@456226577798135808>
PotD farm for timeworn artifacts?
Yep it is 100% drop,...
What do you mean from floor 50
Only floor 50??
Or 1-50
dim sigil
1 50 or 51 100
stable island
Yep, 1 to 50 or 51 to 100.
open verge
But you said no 51-60 spam
stable island
Nope, floor 51 to floor 60 doesn't give any timeworn artifacts.
Gotta get to floor 100 for that.
(Or to Floor 50 from Floor 1)
modern knoll
completing floor 100 or floor 50
so starting at 51 the closest will be floor 100
starting floor 1 the closest will be 50
either way gotta climb 50 floors
dim sigil
Would u rather do dr 15 times
open verge
Yes?
dim sigil
It better f****** be 100%
gaunt star
It's more like when ppl get used to mechanics in DR
it'd be more worth it
still day 2
dim sigil
CEs need to 100% tho likd it's dumb
dim sigil
Giving you need 15 c e has no reason to not be 100% if it was like 5 or something sure they can be random but no
stable island
But you know i smell a nerf very fast.
dim sigil
Are the sb fates 100%
clever token
no
open verge
I’m just spamming raids
open verge
Not sure how fast void ark is with blue mages
stable island
Grinding is not a problem, but give players a feel of progress.
When things feel unrewarding or too much of a hassle (or just too boring) players just stop with it and look elsewhere.
clever token
i don't want to do alliance raids 36 times
open verge
Haven’t gotten a run with them yet
stable island
CT with Blue mages is around 11m
Void ark is also around 11m
@clever token
That means it is better to stop with the relic then.
dim sigil
DR/potd step is just for sub stats right
open verge
Yes
stable island
But doing it 18 times is just too boring for players.
RNG grinding is always bad, because it is no fun, no fun = no game.
open verge
Not sure if that is optional
dim sigil
If i can get glow before that ill do that last step at a slower pace
dim sigil
One dr a week or something with some potd
clever token
because it's current content??
open verge
Yea but it’s relic
stable island
Actually, PotD and DR is REQUIRED to get the relic to i515.
The stat alteration is just 100 poetics.
stable island
Yep, the 2nd quest will trigger the Timeworn artifacts farm too.
open verge
5.5 is far away and 5.55 even further then that
Don’t see the big problem with the grind tbh
clever token
because it's boring?
open verge
Ye but that’s what relic grinds are
clever token
like a grind should be at least appealing and not brain killing.
open verge
That’s how relics always been
serene crest
Anima grind was much worse than this
clever token
i just did anima
open verge
To the point where people were bitching the previous steps were too easy
clever token
it was not as bad lol
open verge
And then boom
stable island
I think there will be a nerf before 5.5, too much players are complaining now.
Not because of the grind, but more because it is no fun doing it, a bogus choice is not a choice.
Players only have one choice for the relics, the 24-mans, the other one has too slow progress.
open verge
What is bad about running 24 mans
serene crest
No no when it first hit it was ridiculous.
open verge
I’m not seeing the issue ngl
graceful sonnet
are the JP players complaining? because that's the only way it'll probably get changed
open verge
Relics are optional anyway
If you don’t want to do them don’t 😂
By the time it’s bis the expansion would be over already
stable island
When ARR/HW relics were current, players only do one or two weapons.....
Nowadays players want more then 2. The playerbase changed.
And yes afaik, the JP players are complaining too.
static furnace
are the JP players complaining? because that's the only way it'll probably get c...
Yes (a lot actually)
clever token
ugh
open verge
It’ll get nerfed soon enough
stable island
The JP players are even more complaining then us US and EU players actually.
unreal wadi
should make fates
open verge
I’m fine with the 24 mans
unreal wadi
guaranteed a drop
graceful sonnet
i mean, grind is one thing; but when you do one thing then have the same thing be a part of the thing and CHANGE how that thing does the thing; that's not fair
open verge
The rest of it is bullshit
unreal wadi
open verge
Like I’m more mad about the augments then the fucking relic
graceful sonnet
Expectation did not match result
open verge
Because the augments r fucking ridiculous
sterile moat
imagine even thinking of doing atma more than once on week 1
we're on day 3 and people are complaining relic too hard to get
open verge
Lol
stable island
Nah, 25% drop rate for fates is enough.
They also did it with the new players in mind, but this was not a good way.
static furnace
Yeah, seems like people are complaining they can’t do it by day 3 tbh
open verge
I don’t know I didn’t expect to get this relic in 2 days like the last one
stable island
@sterile moat, the playerbase changed too.
Nowadays players want more then 1 or 2 relics.
open verge
open verge
Quit bitching about the relics and bitch about the augments
I want dyeable gear ffs
I can’t believe they made the non augmented one undyeble
stable island
@static furnace
That is not the problem, the problem is that the players only have one real choice to do the relic this time. And that is 51 times doing the same thing (15x, 18x and 18x) for each relic.
And doing things again and again is not really humans are build on.
dim sigil
Bitch about not being able to use the SUPER COOL helmets
open verge
Like it’s such an unnecessary change
Doing multiple relics pre nerf
You fucking asked for it
gaunt star
I could care less bout the grind but that's a major bias coming from me
since I play warframe :')
stable island
Nah, relics are always ment to be a grind, but RNG grind is no fun.
(If the alernative is something that is too repeative, something humans are not good at.)
Games are ment to be fun, not annoying.
open verge
This isn’t rng tho
clever token
then we literally just said the raids are no fun and a bore lmao
you're missing the point my dude
open verge
Fates so much fun 
clever token
they're at least different
open verge
So you just want this step to be exactly like the last one?
clever token
No, just give at least a viable option instead of relying on RNG or tearing your hair out in alliance raids lmao
dim sigil
I just don't want there to be RNG especially when there's like 15times per step
open verge
I’m more mad that it’s not doable in bozja
clever token
see i'd do it if it were in bozja
open verge
That both options requires to be doing old shit
stable island
Yep and the other choice is something most players don't want to do because it is boring.
Maybe i can refer to the sleeping night warden? It is not because he is bad, he fell asleep out of boredom.
Humans aren't designed to do things repeative by mother nature.
dim sigil
CEs being slower then ct spam sucks
open verge
Yep and the other choice is something most players don't want to do because it i...
Say that to kmmo players
Human nature
Who cares
open verge
What’s stopping anyone from not doing the content they don’t like
stable island
Well, kmmo players die behind the keybord. And they don't do the same thing again and again in games.
gaunt star
Ignore how late this but me and my friends farmed on the beach of kholusia. Theres a lot of mobs close together so you get xp steadily
open verge
I farmed in yanxia
gaunt star
You get same xp as you do from the 69 mobs
stable island
It is not because of the relic at all i guess, i think more players want to have something to do, but this mess is no fun.
gaunt star
But you dont have to get on ur mount and fly anywhere to find more mobs. You can just run around and keep aggroing
open verge
Atleast that’s my approach to all content is this game
I never force myself to do shit I don’t like but maybe y’all do
stable island
Best place is Kholusia near Mord Souq, i got from 60 to 70 Blu in one hour there.
cobalt crystal
for the last quest of relic weapon to roll stats, for PotD option I heard you have to do it on floor 100, is that true.
stable island
Nope.
cobalt crystal
So any 10 floors?
stable island
@cobalt crystal
It is floor 50 or floor 100, and it is required before completing the relic.
The actual reroll is just 100 poetics.
dim sigil
I never force myself to do shit I don’t like but maybe y’all do
Am i finally not alone
I don't do a single thing in this game if I don't like it and I'm not in the mood
open verge
Same
dim sigil
Maybe today I want to spam extreme
cobalt crystal
is the drop 100% when you do it that way or is the new "raid" 100%
dim sigil
Or maybe i wanna garher etc
I don't do anything because I have to like I only go to it when I'm in the mood
open verge
If the complaint boils down to this content is not fun
Then maybe don’t do the intentionally grindy content
stable island
@cobalt crystal
Only 24-mans are 100% drop.
And DR and PotD F50 and F100
sterile moat
<@145604986770948097>, the playerbase changed too.
Nowadays players want more ...
nah, i wouldn't say the playerbase changed
more like the vocal playerbase changed
people that did prenerf atma are laughing at this shit
dim sigil
I'm not like I have to cap tomes now I'm more like well i dont feel like doing roulettes n stuff such as im only getting my tome wepon next week now
stable island
Dan how many atma weapons did you do then? When it still was current?
open verge
Next step is also the victory lap soooo
sterile moat
most ARR/HW players know relics were made to revitalize old content, not to be a content on it's own like it was back in eureka
sterile moat
Dan how many atma weapons did you do then? When it still was current?
did one, i only make 1 relic
open verge
One
sterile moat
except on eureka where i made 3
open verge
Then you come back because you know they are gonna nerf the step
I thought everyone did one and came back to it when they nerfed the steps
You guys actually do multiple weapons pre nerf?
stable island
Nowadays players want more then 1 relic.
And there is a difference too.
Back in the old days, jobs weren't broken when synced.
Nowadays with the cap on 80, many skills are locked when doing stuff. That is also a mayor issue.
open verge
The sync makes these content even faster doe
Now we got blue mage fucking with these raids even faster
stable island
Yep, but who plays the optional blue mage? 😁
stable island
Anyway, this is not a good grind.
open verge
Should try
versed hill
Blue mages busy with new content to do syrcus
stable island
I have BLU on L70 too.
open verge
Yea but blue mage doesn’t get synced
open verge
Make one then
stable island
But you know, it only shaves off 3 minutes or so.
open verge
It just seems like y’all don’t want to do the grind
stable island
So that is not really attractive.
open verge
Which is perfectly fine
versed hill
Mate i have 8 zetas
grave raft
75 syrcus tower runs 🤔
stable island
@open verge
It is not the grind itself, it is the way the Devs did it. It is not a fun grind, that is the problem.
open verge
How fast do y’all want to get this relic anyway
stable island
@versed hill
And when did you got it? Post nerf? 😀
open verge
Because I guess I view it from the perspective of a goal
stable island
Not too fast RainCloud, but players want a feeling of progress in a fun way. Running 51 alliance raids just for 1 reliable grind progress is annoying and no fun.
No fun = no game.
There is a way bigger problem, if too much players are annoyed and stopping certain content, they will stonewalling players that do want the content, because they can't progress due to a lack of players.
Optional or not, the choice becomes moot then, it will be abandoned content.
versed hill
Id beat up a9s and tam tara endlessly just for light
At least I have my full skillset
open verge
I don’t care about the raids
The problem is
Bozja being garbage for it
Raids are perfectly fine the fact that bozja is not even remotely close in speed is where the nerfs need to come from
sterile moat
Nowadays players want more then 1 relic.
And there is a difference too.
Back ...
that's why i said who changed is whos vocal
stable island
Yeah, but the drop rates really need to becone 25% or so and it has to be farmed in bozja too, with same drop rate.
Relics are ment to be a grind, but again, too much RNG and you will annoy players. Same deal if there is a 100% boring option and a 5% option that is less boring.
pine epoch
Fuckin
It was approximately 1.9 mil so nearly 2 mil in damage. Final sting is second only to Perfect Alexander’s Ordained Punishment. The only thing that hits harder is Ordained Stillness/Motion
sterile moat
a lot of players either do 1 relic or don't bother with it at all for feeling it's a waste of time, some even wait for nerfs to get it for glam much easier
pine epoch
stable island
Well.....
Why are there so much more casuals then nowadays and ppl are also complaining game is too easy?
open verge
Because they are babies
Hotfix will come and buff the drop rates
I can guarantee that 100%
sterile moat
yea
versed hill
Funny how you say that considering how difficult DR is for normal content
sterile moat
they just want the relic NOW
primal basalt
then people will complain it’s too easy
sterile moat
because ShB relic has been a joke so far
open verge
People complained last 2 steps were too easy
open verge
And now we have a relic that takes time and it’s big issue
sterile moat
it's not even a big issue, it's just people being vocal on day 1
strange wing
Oh hey, Debutante Reginald is a really good raid.
open verge
Remember diadem weapons
versed hill
DR is fun
open verge
That no one could get
sterile moat
lol
open verge
At the end of the expansion
versed hill
Wish people used lost actions and essences
versed hill
Hot and cold boss takes forever
strange wing
Castrum is a pretty dumb roadblock though, I feel bad for whoever tries to catch up.
stable island
Nah, i am used to grinding too.
It is not the grind, but how you grind for it.
If players grind they expect progress, so what if the only way to get progress is something that induces sleep on players? :zzz:
The new raid is indeed very good!
gusty quest
I love the new raid, especially the final boss with the queen
versed hill
Isn't the reason the law armor being crap because raiders complained elemental armor being too good
open verge
There is progress tho
grave raft
Oh hey, Debutante Reginald is a really good raid.
right? RIGHT?!?! i love and hate the hot and cold mech and also the tiles mechanic on the last boss.
strange wing
Queen's throne is kinda lame.
grave raft
too awesome
open verge
I don’t get what you mean by no progress??
stable island
Yep, new raid very well done.
sterile moat
Isn't the reason the law armor being crap because raiders complained elemental a...
never heard of that
open verge
This is the best 24 man this expansion
sterile moat
also
open verge
Which is kinda crazy
versed hill
right? RIGHT?!?! i love and hate the hot and cold mech and also the tiles mechan...
Have you seen the savage version LOL
sterile moat
eureka
raiders
strange wing
But I'm all for big women wearing very little.
versed hill
you know e10s shadow servant?
grave raft
yeah
gusty quest
I really like the chess motif in the moves. Really cool idea
versed hill
Its like that
open verge
Fuck shadow servant
grave raft
open verge
Hurts my head
strange wing
I'm probably never gonna touch Savage, but I imagine it's really good as well.
versed hill
They even give a brand debuff now
gusty quest
I only hope for the final part of Bozja we can stick it to Gabranth
sterile moat
I'm probably never gonna touch Savage, but I imagine it's really good as well.
it's faster paced in some cases
versed hill
So if you have 2 ice and 1 fire debuff, means you only need 1 fire to get to 0
open verge
The doom stacks needs to be the go too
strange wing
700k mettle. You ask me for too much game
versed hill
Doom is fine
open verge
Doom stacks are the perfect punishment
sterile moat
so if you felt DR was too slow you'll like savage
strange wing
Oh man
open verge
I thought savage would guarantee the gear
strange wing
What if all damage is turned into Doom stacks
open verge
It doesn’t
grave raft
they can actually bump the rng for CEs on the first step, not 100% but not some bad rng.
strange wing
And they just remove healers entierly
sterile moat
look
gaunt star
Doom stacks are not a good way to teach mechs
versed hill
Vul stacks doesnt stop people
primal basalt
technically all damage is doom stacks, doom just casts instantly when it caps
sterile moat
i don't give a shit about the relic but, these bozja drops are fucking dumb
open verge
Vuln stacks isn’t helpful either
versed hill
Damage down doesnt matter since there is no enrage
sterile moat
that's what people should be complaining about
versed hill
Well
open verge
Vuln stacks just makes you eat shit and say fuck mechanics
versed hill
Only in knights
gaunt star
Can anyone confirm how many times you need to step 2?
strange wing
Oh Bozja drops are dumb that's for sure. I'm only doing one relic, but that's all going to be in raids
gaunt star
Vuln stacks aren’t that good either they just cause problems when you’re playing with new people
My friends saying there's no repeatable quest symbol
I usually don’t have problems with mechs but when you get faced with new people these gimmicks slow the run more than they help if at all
stable island
@open verge
No one is doing something without a reward of some kind.
(It is true that the time want to invest before reward is different for each individual, but it is a fact that humans expect faster rewards for their troubles nowadays.)
So if they only good way is something that is annoying for you to progress, what would you do?
You can stop yes, that is a choice, but was it really a choice in that case?
gaunt star
And he's not sure if its a one-and-done thing or same as the other steps
sterile moat
the new savage dmg downs is the best
grave raft
tfw you're doing 5 relics
sterile moat
to stop people from being idiots
strange wing
tfw you're doing 5 relics <:sadcarby:588388854839377931>
You poor soul
open verge
<@153131147579097088>
No one is doing something without a reward of some kind....
I would stop like a normal human being playing a video game
gaunt star
Id prefer damage down/some kind of enrage rather than the doom or vuln stacks
"We were tired of people abusing mitigation to brute-force through vuln stacks so we made people use mitigation to brute-force through damage downs"
open verge
^
That’s why I like the doom
No brute force
You fuck up and get punished
It’s great
versed hill
the new savage dmg downs is the best
Fuck orbs damage down though
Oh you're in the correct spot but one isnt? Eat a damage down
open verge
What’s the damage down?
sterile moat
80%
gaunt star
Punishing people too much isn’t going to make normal mode runs go faster
strange wing
The only problem with DR is that eventually I'll run out of mettle from dying all the time
gaunt star
is it 80 🤔
sterile moat
you're better off dying
gaunt star
I thought it was 50%
viscid monolith
You don't need mettle anyway
open verge
Not yet
viscid monolith
Also it's 50%
sterile moat
so i'll believe it's 50
gaunt star
Watch gabranths airship become Castrum 2.0
strange wing
Ah yes.
open verge
Imagine next step will be more ranks
strange wing
The SS Freudian Nightmare
open verge
I can’t wait for the last step
drowsy ivy
Cant wait for next Bozja to use Mettle instead of Light for a kettle
viscid monolith
My Drills went from 60k to 30k
open verge
Bozja as a whole has been so fun
gaunt star
Shivas lasted so long it was literally only better than dying because you didn't lose gauge
strange wing
Garleans sure have to compensate for something
open verge
I loved every step of bozja man I think they knocked it out of the park with save the queen
gaunt star
I can’t wait for them to introduce 10 more ranks to really screw people over
open verge
Yeaa
viscid monolith
Alternating between Sfia and Happy's streams
sterile moat
probably not in shb
versed hill
Thatd be a huge middle finger lmao
gaunt star
I mean, mettle gain scales with rank
viscid monolith
I can feel the frustration emanating from screen
gaunt star
And it would be expected too
sterile moat
we'll most like get a raid to the ifrit and relic done
open verge
Yea
strange wing
100 man raid
open verge
Victory lap boyo
gaunt star
So it would take about the same time to go from 0 mettle to 703k than to level from like R13 to R15 the first time
strange wing
3 simulations fights
sterile moat
not much point to get +10 ranks
open verge
I wonder what style of content it will be
gaunt star
Most likely (valnain?) as the zone
open verge
Will it be a mix of all the bozja content?
strange wing
If one person gets hit with an AoE insta wipe 100K mettle lost
primal basalt
I wonder what style of content it will be
vertical shmup
gaunt star
In the end I prefer deep dungeon over bozja
open verge
I don’t
open verge
Deep dungeon sucks 
viscid monolith
Oh you mean Bozja
open verge
Varis and DR
gaunt star
However the judge armor is worth it to me
viscid monolith
DR is a 48 man
open verge
Is it
viscid monolith
Yes
gaunt star
Savage
sterile moat
i still think deep dungeon killed this game playerbase
strange wing
DR is 24 I thought
open verge
Is normal not 24?
viscid monolith
Oh shit
sterile moat
you can shut your brain off and level up
viscid monolith
That's a bummer
open verge
Yea that’s what I meant
gaunt star
Castrum is 7 people if you’re lucky!!
primal basalt
check your facts
open verge
Where does castrum fall
grave raft
dungeon?
viscid monolith
It doesn't have good rewards
open verge
Is castrum also a 24 man?
viscid monolith
Now Castrum is 24-48
open verge
Like I know it’s not guranteed 24
grave raft
a big ass dead dungeon?
gaunt star
The Max is 48
open verge
But it’s structured like one right?
gaunt star
Realistically under 10
primal basalt
it goes up to 48, but it fires off with whatever
open verge
I agree with that yea it’s a big ass dungeon
viscid monolith
Anyway people don't do Castrum anymore because the rewards suck
viscid monolith
And the devs won't fix it for some reason
strange wing
Maybe
open verge
There is literally 3 changes that it needs and it will be fine
gaunt star
Castrum is not hard but when you have people who expect to go in without prior knowledge it’s a disaster
strange wing
They'll take Castrum and turn it into a Crafting contest
gaunt star
3 changes that will never happen because of the pride complex going on
open verge
why doesn’t it give exp
viscid monolith
It needs to drop relic materials too
gaunt star
There's speculation that the 2nd step is a one-time-thing because the quest is not reappearing on the relic guy or the node
open verge
I don’t get why it doesn’t fucking drop exp
gaunt star
Because ffxi nostalgia
open verge
Meanwhile CE that will be spawned in the same time five exp and coins
gaunt star
But i cant confirm or deny until he does step 3 and then step 1 again
open verge
It’s so backwards
viscid monolith
Because the devs are occasionally indefensible morons
strange wing
Better rewards
gaunt star
I thinks it’s they can never admit when they have messed up
open verge
“But people doing bozja now will fix” no
strange wing
But they have, a lot.
sterile moat
Meanwhile CE that will be spawned in the same time five exp and coins
it's even worse now
open verge
They do
viscid monolith
Sometimes I really wish I could get a 1 on 1 interview with Yoshida but it would mostly amount to "What the fuck was wrong with you when you made x decision?"
sterile moat
that you can trade collectibles for coins
strange wing
In fact FF14 spawns from Square's biggest fuck up of all time
sterile moat
Sometimes I really wish I could get a 1 on 1 interview with Yoshida but it would...
me throughout SB
open verge
I also hate the duel system
viscid monolith
Because I cannot fathom why they made Bozja so shit for the FUCKING BOZJA RELIC
open verge
But I’ll let that slide I guess
strange wing
And, wasn't there another Bozja thing that got turned into Ishgard Restoration?
gaunt star
Diadem
Something something complaisn about eureka something something squeenix stupid
open verge
5.55 is literally a stormblood patch
strange wing
How bad does that have to be to get deleted from teh game
open verge
Literally
gaunt star
Aetherial weapons sounds hilarious
gaunt star
You like those piety daggers
sterile moat
you know how in eureka you kill mobs to spawn a NM
viscid monolith
Diadem was deleted from the game twice
open verge
I got the diadem mount in 2 days
sterile moat
it was basically ONLY that
strange wing
Dear god
gaunt star
S... So eureka?
viscid monolith
It was that without the NMs
sterile moat
and when the fate died you had a chance for a chest to drop
gaunt star
Oh no
open verge
I didn’t do the new diadem
viscid monolith
Sometimes a fate boss spawned
open verge
Seemed like shit
gaunt star
open verge
Emergency missions so fun
viscid monolith
Most of the time no fate boss spawned
grave raft
Eureka Bozja 0.1 for 6.0
open verge
Shb is lessons learned
grave raft
viscid monolith
Don't even get me started on Emergency Missions
open verge
Especially the southern front
gaunt star
Diadem two three
viscid monolith
Emergency Missions might have been the worst content they ever added
open verge
Southern front was literally everything good about eureka but faster
sterile moat
so you had to sneak around for aethercurrents
open verge
Wtf was up with that
sterile moat
everytime you wanted to go in
gaunt star
Sneak
open verge
You couldn’t mount in eureka either
gaunt star
open verge
Why???
open verge
You had to unlock mounting in eureka for some fucking reason
gaunt star
No mount
sterile moat
that and the cherry on top
gaunt star
With dragon
open verge
I quit In pagos
gaunt star
Hilarious
open verge
It was actually so garbage
I quit that shit in one day
I was in pagos for like 2 minutes
sterile moat
you could either DF in with randoms who would instantly change to DoL to gather mats
open verge
And unsubbed
sterile moat
or rely on FC airships to take you there with your own party
because yes
you could not queue as a party
open verge
The thing that makes me so mad is
gaunt star
Monkeys paw
open verge
Like please I enjoy bozja let me enjoy it
sterile moat
3.1 was by far
viscid monolith
For emergency missions they had a random chance of spawning. When it spawns everyone crowds into the boss room. It's a total clusterfuck with 5 raid bosses at once and no one ever planned or organized. If you managed to clear, one person out of 72 got an ilvl 280 weapon. Mind you the max ilvl at the time was 270. The weapon that ONE person got was for a random job with random secondary stats.
sterile moat
the most garbage patch this game has ever seen
open verge
Stop punishing me for enjoying bozja please
sterile moat
only reedeeming grace was thordan ex
open verge
For emergency missions they had a random chance of spawning. When it spawns ever...
The devs were on ducking crack
sterile moat
void ark was extremely boring even on day 1
open verge
Jesus Christ that sounds awful
sterile moat
diadem in general was a mistake and was added too early