for chaotic
#endgame-lounge
fiery jewel
I think when it comes to blizzard
ppl genuinely do feel betrayed
it's like ff turn based vs action argument
vestal hollow
wow is probably the best it's ever been, rn
fiery jewel
wow is probably the best it's ever been, rn
that's what matters ye
fiery jewel
for chaotic
is pf still active for it
visual geyser
theres one in aether thats almost full
fiery jewel
chaotic the one content they truly cooked with this expac
visual geyser
but i remembered i dont wanna play this game rn
fiery jewel
I think BST might cook tho
visual geyser
who cares
whole estuary
chaotic PF is all private
whole estuary
if I ever see one up, it's 999 ilvl to point people to the discord
fiery jewel
forked tower purists genuinely think FTB is too hard
visual geyser
purists?
fiery jewel
forked tower magic extreme will most likely be harder
so ppl will get filtered
but at least we are getting a normal
boreal pumice
the hells this about
fiery jewel
people genuinely think FTB is too hard though which is a big issue
fiery jewel
chaotic PF is all private
I think Chaotic is first on priority for pf or smth
vast jacinth
Most people just thought it was too hard go get into 1 instance as a premade group
boreal pumice
i have never seen any of these "purists" and i run FT every week near enough
fiery jewel
In the field op servers I'm in
whole estuary
I also think they intended Chaotic to be closer to Advanced
fiery jewel
most ppl want FTM to be easier
and I don't think that will happen
tha'ts why we're getting a normal
worldly grotto
i have never seen any of these "purists" and i run FT every week near enough
Can you make good money from that?
vestal hollow
forked tower purists genuinely think FTB is too hard
what????????????????????
vestal hollow
we're just saying stuff
vast jacinth
fiery jewel
no
vast jacinth
Chaotic
fiery jewel
ask ppl about snowball
vast jacinth
And hard
wicked delta
Who is saying chaotic is too hard lmao
boreal pumice
Can you make good money from that?
oddly yes the minions are profit but im there for the kills
fiery jewel
a lot of ppl
whole estuary
easy and 2 pain points involving 24 people
fiery jewel
the reputation of Chaotic on release was it's too hard
boreal pumice
i think your in the wrong servers for these things
fiery jewel
too much body check
wicked delta
I don’t think thats true
rapid whale
i think this goes b ack to the point i made earlier about " you look hard enough you'll find haters regardless of what se actually does"
vast jacinth
As much as i cursed out pf in chaotic i had fun too
worn bluff
chaotic tiles were funny though
worldly grotto
oddly yes the minions are profit but im there for the kills
Just for the hell of it?
boreal pumice
chaotic tiles were funny though
wicked delta
Chaotic tiles are still awesome I killed like 5 people through it
fiery jewel
which I think when something is too hard for the intended playerbase
that creates big issues
but I think both are fine
vast jacinth
chaotic tiles were funny though
Me getting killed by the bard im still mad i didnt save a clip of that
boreal pumice
Just for the hell of it?
no 100 runs gives me a title so im doing it
wicked delta
Okay but the “intended” playerbase enjoyed it and fucked off after it stopped being relevant content
worldly grotto
Ah
wicked delta
It was well received
fiery jewel
ye
worldly grotto
Good luck with that chief
fiery jewel
Chaotic was well recieved
wicked delta
I have not heard anyone who complained about it being too hard because the intended audience can clear it just fine
vast jacinth
I literally was in chaotic everyday
boreal pumice
24 clears in so far so nearly a quater
fiery jewel
Reddit
also this is a big post where every commentor is actively saying it's current form is too hard
but is it a minority idk
boreal pumice
ah yes 265 speak for everyone
vast jacinth
Also these ppl
wicked delta
Redditor speaks for whole group of people
vast jacinth
Probably werent there when it dropped
vestal hollow
cod is NOT difficult content
wicked delta
There’s always someone out there who thinks something is too hard man lmfao
fiery jewel
I'm just saying
wicked delta
By this logic they should dumb down msq even more just because theres people on the forums whining that it was too hard
vast jacinth
Some people sure but not all
boreal pumice
the content is legit not that hard or bad , granted i do orangized with call outs but its not that hard
fiery jewel
There’s always someone out there who thinks something is too hard man lmfao
it depends really
vast jacinth
Most people in chaotic pf
fiery jewel
I don't think anyone is complaining about this savage tier besides m11s
vast jacinth
Fckin / random their positions
worldly grotto
All I know from Chaotic was that guy who macro'd their rotation
boreal pumice
so dont fall
vast jacinth
So you get back to your spot? Or adjust
fiery jewel
which fundamentally fucks the fight
boreal pumice
its that easy
fiery jewel
I agree
but it just makes it harder
especially since this is extreme level some ppl can't do something like that
vast jacinth
Like i had ppl adjust and use eyes
fiery jewel
but I agree I think the difficulty is good
boreal pumice
i love being on tiles because i suck at platform
fiery jewel
I do hope we get maybe 2 chaotics next expac
vast jacinth
I can do both xD
fiery jewel
at this point they should consider having chaotic replace v&c or something
whole estuary
who was the intended audience for chaotic? raiders working to bis for FRU?
fiery jewel
who was the intended audience for chaotic? raiders working to bis for FRU?
any high end raider pretty much
wicked delta
During prog I mostly got thrown from tiles to other side of tiles
boreal pumice
glam collectors
worldly grotto
The people who really wanted the hair with the flowers in it
jolly flume
chaotic didn't come out until well after many had cleared fru anyways
fiery jewel
ye
chaotic should've been in 7.3 but I get why they placed it during more active patch
it might've performed worse in 7.3 but could've also performed better
wicked delta
The people who really wanted the hair with the flowers in it
Get your Limsa raider e-bf to buy it for you and profit instead
whole estuary
if that was the intended audience it seems successful
worldly grotto
boreal pumice
i just want the mounts /hair/minions then i can chill on it and well torture myself somewhere else
fiery jewel
if that was the intended audience it seems successful
it 100% was
whole estuary
if intended to be low difficulty EX onboarding for casuals into high end it seems like it causes those reddit complaints
wicked delta
I didn’t farm for chaotic hair because it makes my viera look bald somehow
clear plume
Chaotic is almost assuredly not too hard to clear, as I’ve seen some absolute specimens clear it
But to farm without wipes? Yeah that’s not easy
whole estuary
like vets can just bring new people blind in PF without discord
vast jacinth
who was the intended audience for chaotic? raiders working to bis for FRU?
See there is alt BiS :)
whole estuary
and the stable base of vets can get them a clear
fiery jewel
most vibes in chaotics even during farms are due to lack of understanding a fight
boreal pumice
like vets can just bring new people blind in PF without discord
least there is incentive to bring newbies for extra rewards
fiery jewel
chaotic is special because 1 person can make a huge difference and save a fight in 24m content
which is good design
specifically tanks
fiery jewel
advanced is good but it will die so fast
fiery jewel
advanced some of the best normal content in the game tho
actually they might classify advanced as high end
idk exactly
fiery jewel
Chaotic I wouldn't recommend for that at all
Chaotic is good to just learn high-end fight pacing and practicing dps rotation
boreal pumice
chaotic never fully "dies" since there is profit to be made , people want hair with flowers pay up , want this dias mount money
fiery jewel
24m should be ideal to practice imo
whole estuary
same with advanced then
fiery jewel
nobody should really be sweating in 24m content
dapper zealot
filling chaotic would be more of a challenge than the fight itself for me
boreal pumice
not really oddly enough it still gets a stupid amount of sign ups that sometimes i dont get to go
whole estuary
that's why it has dedicated PF advertisers for their discord
dapper zealot
coughs in oce
fiery jewel
chaotic is active you just have to join servers
boreal pumice
cant help ya with oce
fiery jewel
in pf it's basically non-existent which is expected
content that syncs that isn't ultimate will be non existent in pf
whole estuary
compounded by the high player requirement
vast jacinth
I should probably do chaotic of Forked tower again but atm 0 motivation for ff
boreal pumice
i dread needing to look for 3 ppl to do hoh with just so i can get the mount
wicked delta
Well on discord I can directly call someone a shitter and in PF I cannot
whole estuary
you will never get enough curious people even in a populated server
vestal hollow
I should probably do chaotic of Forked tower again but atm 0 motivation for ff
come play wow with me
wicked delta
I should probably do chaotic of Forked tower again but atm 0 motivation for ff
I need to clear M12S and I just don’t want to
Like I want to but I don’t have the motivation
vast jacinth
I need to clear M12S and I just don’t want to
Same
whole estuary
MiNE still gets rando fills
vast jacinth
Same
whole estuary
24 is no way
wicked delta
I stopped giving a shit a long time ago 
fiery jewel
I think Chaotic content can eventually get a reputation of being active even in PF
vast jacinth
Its like i want tp but at the same time i wont
fiery jewel
but we need more iterations of it similar to Ultimate
it's still new content people are not used to it
whole estuary
maybe if they make it like advanced
fiery jewel
when we have like 2-3 chaotics next expac
whole estuary
but not CODCAR
fiery jewel
ppl will be way more comfy with the content
vast jacinth
I fear i need to forcr myself to study m12s p2 in VC or smth
fiery jewel
and chaotic actually has good rewards unlike criterion
wicked delta
My friend is dragging me in this week
fiery jewel
criterion is probably too hard to fill in pf tbf
wicked delta
Dont have a choice in the matter
But
I may have to heal that shit
The humble unmitigated fixer
fiery jewel
m12s?
whole estuary
I still see old criterions get rando fills in pf, they only need 3 other people even if they have to wait
fiery jewel
gl
vast jacinth
I may have to heal that shit
Go gogo!
fiery jewel
12 on healer prob the hardest
vast jacinth
P1 is doable
vestal hollow
cherry hates me 
dull drum
next chaotic is 2027 team that what my uncle said
boreal pumice
I still see old criterions get rando fills in pf, they only need 3 other people ...
i mean the title for all 3 is pretty cool
vast jacinth
P1 i have my stuff down
fiery jewel
next choatic needs to be like 8.1 or smth
vast jacinth
cherry hates me <:cri:1358935030772007123>
No i just cant spend the money on wow
fiery jewel
chaotic 8.1 and 8.5 will heal the game
wicked delta
Equipping my whm jobstone bc im in healer jail now
vestal hollow
No i just cant spend the money on wow<:rynepat:805853118461640734>
check your bank account.
wicked delta
Idk if this static will let me free from healer jail once next raid tier drops
Or if this will be my life forever
fiery jewel
if you enjoy a healer it's fine ig
thin fox
next chaotic is 2027 team that what my uncle said
you think we're even getting the expansion in 2027
fiery jewel
I just hope it's like december-january
wicked delta
Its fun to prog as a healer but during reclears its kinda 
fiery jewel
I can see them trying to line it up with ff7 p3 or smth
dull drum
you think we're even getting the expansion in 2027
what is this tiktok LMAOOOO
vast jacinth
Its fun to prog as a healer but during reclears its kinda <:ch_dead:762763198478...
Unless someonr fcks up xF
fiery jewel
shit is just cooked
wicked delta
Unless someonr fcks up xF
I watched melees troll in m11s over and over earlier and almost said something that would get me 3 day’d
fiery jewel
the DoT on healers is probably the biggest culprit
dull drum
you think we're even getting the expansion in 2027
imagine if they said at fanfest “yeah so beastmaster not only pushed back the blue mage update to next expansion but the expansion is now pushed to 2028”
whole estuary
Give them a new role action, Descue
dull drum
whole estuary
It's a 25y knockback on an ally
fiery jewel
the DoT being so much potency takes away from other stuff
wicked delta
Like either they killed each other or they’d kill one of the tanks and I was just like
Brother…
Im a spoiled mf I miss my dnc dashes
tulip wraith
wicked delta
Prange players deserve nothing
thin fox
- healers should have more of a focus on gcd healing
- more healing actions should require setup (like how spreadlo involves recitation -> adloqium -> deployment tactics)
- we should have separate combos for generating resources and spending resources
fiery jewel
the issue with making healers focus more on gcd healing
the skill gap might get so large that dps checks will be too hard
fiery jewel
I think healers already have the largest skill gap
it's a legit issue rn
everyone week 1 was saying 11 unclearable without a high dmg healer
thin fox
healers are skill gap in everything
fiery jewel
but I agree
thin fox
well heres how i think of it
fiery jewel
I think they need to force the healing community to get better more out of any role
thin fox
if the healers are already the problem
then its fine to make healers harder
because theyre the problem anyway
so we're not introducing a new problem
fiery jewel
people in this game are radical they would genuinely quit / stop raiding then try to get better
vast jacinth
I watched melees troll in m11s over and over earlier and almost said something t...
Peak
fiery jewel
and will make the casual experience worse
it's really hard to balance
idk how I would even approach it
but I do agree game needs more gcd healing or smth
thin fox
casuals already fucking only use gcd healing 
fiery jewel
ye
maybe lowering dps on healers can be a solution
but that's probably the opposite of what needs to happen
thin fox
go ask the average non-raiding scholar player what a spreadlo is. go see if the average one even has deployment tactics on their hotbar.
fiery jewel
if anything I think tanks / healers should get dmg buffs so they are allowed to get more actions
but don't think that will happen
thin fox
i think basically every tank needs to have their mit cut in half
fiery jewel
since you can't really make healers complex when your gcd moves do 50% of your dmg
thin fox
i would delete rampart from the game and make the 120s mit a 180s mit probably
fiery jewel
tank def need more interesting rotations also
I think mit is kinda fine but tanks should get more party utility
thin fox
tanks should need healers to stay alive
or each other - encouraging tank swaps solely as a form of mitigation is also fine
fiery jewel
I agree
thin fox
chaotic did it
fiery jewel
I think autos need to hit harder
thin fox
and it was a thing that made chaotic good
fiery jewel
they need to switch from tankbusters hitting hard
to autos hitting way harder in general
and tankbuster the same or less
that would skll check ppl
thin fox
i would basically put the stacking vulns from chaotic in every piece of raid content in the game
fiery jewel
i would basically put the stacking vulns from chaotic in every piece of raid con...
yes exactly
thin fox
doesnt have to work the exact same way
fiery jewel
since I understand the argument
thin fox
so maybe its every second or third auto
instead of every auto
but it would be the same idea
fiery jewel
for healers not needing to actually mitigate tanks alot
but healers 100% need to heal tanks more than they do now
wicked delta
i would basically put the stacking vulns from chaotic in every piece of raid con...
I have trauma from this in early chaotic
fiery jewel
the only issue I see with that
OT basically does nothing
since they don't take autos in most fights
but maybe requiring auto swap like chaotic is good
wicked delta
Watching the vuln go up on me while im literally a dps player
fiery jewel
chaotic does alot of good things fight design wise that's why the content was so promising.
wicked delta
thin fox
i do not like that you can basically say 'this is the mt, and this is the ot' and thats going to be true for basically the entire fight
i like fights that blur the line
chaotic blurs the line
fiery jewel
Watching the vuln go up on me while im literally a dps player
this is a hot take
fiery jewel
but I do think they should give dps more utility also to counteract this
thin fox
m10s is kind of similar
fiery jewel
esp in solo and 4 man
thin fox
outside of the first phase with the solo fights obviously
you are both tanking
but in 11 and 12 you have a tank and a blue dps
fiery jewel
of the opinion every dps should have at least 2 meaningful utility buttons
unless it really fits job theme to be selfish like blm or smth
fiery jewel
you dont really have a mt and an ot
ye
the best designed fights in this game are usually one with double autos or dual boss
or adds
fiery jewel
but in 11 and 12 you have a tank and a blue dps
and blue dps not even fun which they also need to imrpove
thin fox
and there's still room for variety. p8s phase 2 had tank stack autos which theyve never done again.
fiery jewel
the more I think about how in-depth the combat system is I realize it's actually pretty hard to balance it while giving everyone what they want
so cbu3 sould get more credit kindof
because you can't even give tank / healer more interesting rotations with the current design
fiery jewel
and there's still room for variety. p8s phase 2 had tank stack autos which theyv...
pandae ult bringing that back hopefully
thin fox
idk I think there's a lot they've already managed to do within the limitations of the game, its just that they introduce a good idea and then never iterate on it
they do stacking vuln autos and then never do it again
fiery jewel
the more I think about how in-depth the combat system is I realize it's actually...
but then I see braindead stuff like this and I'm like why does a DoT do that much in the first place when you can add another interesting action if you nerf it by 50%
even assize 2 charges would work atp
fiery jewel
idk I think there's a lot they've already managed to do within the limitations o...
ye
tepid briar
because you can't even give tank / healer more interesting rotations with the cu...
it feels like it's hard enough to find tanks and healers sometimes
fiery jewel
I agree
tepid briar
idk if making the rotation harder will burn casual players out
fiery jewel
but you can argue why nobody wants to play Healer / Tank is because dps players find them boring
so much more boring that it's not worth the positive tradeoffs
fiery jewel
At least that's how I feel I don't speak for anyone else
fiery jewel
something they should 100% do is nerf the healer dot though
tepid briar
glare iv
fiery jewel
I think this game honestly needs a universal combo potency nerf or smth
tepid briar
something they should 100% do is nerf the healer dot though
how much
fiery jewel
by like 100 potency
tepid briar
oh apparently it's 935
fiery jewel
that would add for another interesting move
thin fox
its 85 + 850 (85 base potency + 85x10 dot)
fiery jewel
tepid briar
that's actually insane lmao
fiery jewel
I don't think glare needs to hit this much also
300 or smth would be better
that hits more than rdm attacks
fiery jewel
the only reason I argue this
is you can replace that potency with new actions
which if you just add new actions that would make jobs op
unless you universally buff tank & healer dps
but then that hurts old content design and even current
so it's complex tbh
and they aren't willing to touch old content they never do
fiery jewel
that's basically how SQEX treats it
tepid briar
at the same time not many people like playing old content either
because the feel is very different
fiery jewel
Ik why u think this
but a huge portion of the community state they don't play old content becase of how it feels so ye u right
I think something they really need to change is old content and the feel of it
thin fox
they don't care about new actions destroying old content, see: smn having a 1500 potency nuke every minute in uwu/ucob
tepid briar
not even in terms of locked out actions but the overall design
fiery jewel
tbh I would argue that's the #1 issue
besides cross datacenter rn
but it's subjective
no cross datacenter is killing the game more than that for sure tho
tepid briar
no cross datacenter is killing the game more than that for sure tho
they need to incentivize people not to just jump over to aether
fiery jewel
also so much ppl do roulettes
why do u think everyone leaves crystal tower
because they don't want to play vpr with lvl 50 2 butotn rotation
tepid briar
and cross dc is honestly hurting the new player population so much
thin fox
one of my biggest hopes for 8.0 is cross dc pf
tepid briar
because their home worlds are just empty
fiery jewel
no cross datacenter connection
is the biggest issue
but it seems yoshida understands that 100%
tepid briar
oh you mean that cross dc
fiery jewel
since he addressed it in liveletter
IMO I think DF and PF should both be cross datacenter
wind cypress
I went from aether to crystal yesterday and checked pf like hardly any raid groups 😬
tepid briar
IMO I think DF and PF should both be cross datacenter
it should and there's no reason why they can't throw people into a slightly longer loading screen
fiery jewel
but one or the other is something they need to do
tepid briar
however I think it's a technical issue
tepid briar
given how you can't change dcs without being fully logged out
fiery jewel
on NA for example
crystal / primal are way less active than aether even for normal content
wind cypress
have NA data centers group together -> if paired have them auto transfer to the required data center -> start duty?
fiery jewel
in raiding it's unplayable on crystal / primal but ather is constantly lockd
tepid briar
or they can merge datacenters
I'm pretty sure datacenters are physically separate
fiery jewel
I went from aether to crystal yesterday and checked pf like hardly any raid grou...
crystal raiding only exists like
the first week
but that was only the first tier because it was easy
tepid briar
otherwise they wouldn't need datacenters in the first place
tepid briar
most probably separate server racks with connections between them
fiery jewel
I'm pretty sure datacenters are physically separate
they need to find a way somehow
wind cypress
I just assumed all data centers had the same amount of raids as aether, turns out nope
fiery jewel
I know it's hard but they need to find a way
tepid briar
they need to find a way somehow
hopefully they find a way
fiery jewel
since if you think about it that's 100% the main issue with the game rn
tepid briar
because again it's really killing new player stuff
fiery jewel
even beyond content quality
tepid briar
when everyone just moves to aether
fiery jewel
aether you can't even make new charcaters
tepid briar
it's demoralizing to log into a MMO to find out your world is naked
tepid briar
all the new players are forced to other dcs
fiery jewel
the biggest reason they are probably addressing it
is because it's even a huge issue in JP now
tepid briar
is because it's even a huge issue in JP now
ah the classic
fiery jewel
so it's unavoidable
fiery jewel
it's demoralizing to log into a MMO to find out your world is naked
shouldn't be called an MMO if you are playing in crystal / primal
only for roleplay
wind cypress
that would drive players away, not being able to join a server because it's full up on a new character, then playing said character for awhile and learning your data center is devoid of groups
tepid briar
that would drive players away, not being able to join a server because it's full...
yeah 1000%
I feel bad for everyone in #beginner-lounge who started on dynamis
fiery jewel
dynamis shouldn't even exist tbh
tepid briar
and are like "why isn't my df popping"
fiery jewel
it's just a way to fix the housing issue or smth I think
fiery jewel
there's no reason for it to exist
especially when crystal / primal are not that active
I mean I just hope they fix this issue by like 8.0
tepid briar
but back then crystal or primal was pretty full too right?
fiery jewel
since it's genuinely horrible if you're not on the main datacenter
tepid briar
I think that was the main reason
fiery jewel
the game just feels horrible it's depressing
tepid briar
but that was when DT first came out
fiery jewel
but back then crystal or primal was pretty full too right?
I think before DC travel
they added DC travel when
endwalker?
fiery jewel
before DC travel you were only where you started so communities were more balanced
it was like each datacenter is actually it's own datacenter
now it's like each datacenter is part of a whole region
tepid briar
I agree with your idea about cross-dc queueing then
fiery jewel
which is good
tepid briar
that would even it back out
fiery jewel
dc travel is good for the game
but they need to address the other major issue with adding it
tepid briar
now you give nobody incentive to stay at home
wind cypress
would you deal with waiting for someone's character to transfer to your data center when queuing?
fiery jewel
but they apparently are so idk why I'm yapping so much
😭
I just hope it comes 7.5 for next ultimate
tepid briar
would you deal with waiting for someone's character to transfer to your data cen...
that's why we said they'd have to make major architectural changes
tepid briar
because right now you can't dc travel without logging out
fiery jewel
if 7.5 they add cross dc compatability
tepid briar
presumably anyone in pf or df would get top priority
fiery jewel
dawntrail is the best expac
tepid briar
if 7.5 they add cross dc compatability
I wish
fiery jewel
rn I would rank DT like 3rd best imo
wind cypress
maybe have tiny instance servers that everyone travels to temporarily when in queue for a group
fiery jewel
I think StB > EW > DT > ShB > HW
tepid briar
rn I would rank DT like 3rd best imo
dt living memory is peak tho
tepid briar
I think mid DT was really rough though
fiery jewel
but 1 ultimate and no experimental content is cooked
fiery jewel
I think mid DT was really rough though
7.2 felt rough because the main content flopped and was clowned upon
7.3 was objectively a good patch content wise but the game suffered from severe ddos attacks the entire patch
tepid briar
7.2 felt rough because the main content flopped and was clowned upon
idk why they decided emo lab boy was a good idea for a character
tepid briar
yeah
fiery jewel
he might cook
tepid briar
actually maybe he's doing a good job
fiery jewel
I think he's fine if he's not the main villain
tepid briar
cause I really wanna smack him
tulip wraith
i love little shit characters
fiery jewel
if he's the main villain
tulip wraith
im excited for more of him
fiery jewel
ye fuck no
tepid briar
also calyx x the new ascian would be lmfao
boreal pumice
hes doing better then i have daddy issue ja
whole estuary
He has commited the sin of why does no one I kill ever die
fiery jewel
if calyx actually died
tepid briar
He has commited the sin of why does no one I kill ever die
FR???
fiery jewel
he would be an awful charcater kinda
whole estuary
at least Ja died when he was killed
fiery jewel
but he is still being worked on
dapper zealot
especially shaaloani
There's very little I would call filler, but that bandit sheriff plot really felt like it
fiery jewel
I mean he's in next patch I think it's ocnfirmed
fiery jewel
I think StB > EW > DT > ShB > HW
this not just msq btw
tepid briar
There's very little I would call filler, but that bandit sheriff plot really fel...
honestly I think it's cause everyone knew S9 was right there in the dome
so people were not paying attention at all
fiery jewel
if it was MSQ I prob go
tepid briar
(also I really don't like deserts)
tepid briar
I agree that the bandit plot was completely worthless tho
fiery jewel
I think 6.0 is the highest peak but post EW gets worse each patch
tepid briar
it added nothing to the actual story
tepid briar
I think 6.0 is the highest peak but post EW gets worse each patch
I feel like post-EW contributed nothing
dapper zealot
honestly I think it's cause everyone knew S9 was right there in the dome
The dome doesn't appear until after tho. It fills like filler cause it barely adds to the story
wind cypress
to be fair, the only things about dawn trail I remember, was the cowboy town/character, doom train, some lizard people with 2 heads in a competition and some lion lady dragging you around trying to make a name for herself, some people with snowball cupcake looking toys on the sides of their heads and having souls and the robot protector guy
thin fox
dt/stb/ew are all kind of the same to me because they all have the same problems (trying to do two things at once; doing neither well)
fiery jewel
I treated the rest of the expansion as a joke
because that whole sequence was fucking ass
tepid briar
The dome doesn't appear until after tho. It fills like filler cause it barely ad...
hmmm you're right
also lowkey
fiery jewel
but how they killed gulool ja so comically
tepid briar
I was hoping there was more across the bridge
fiery jewel
and unearned
like ye no bro
they didn't even use that to build wuks character
for the second half
tepid briar
they didn't even use that to build wuks character
wuk be like
fiery jewel
tbh I think Wuk should've been evil or smth
tepid briar
getting stronger because of the power of FRIENDSHIP
fiery jewel
or at least struggle with evil
tepid briar
idk if I'm thinking in the right direction
fiery jewel
since she should hate Zoraal after killing their father
tepid briar
but I was hoping there would be more filler of wuk doing diplomacy as the new dawnservant
fiery jewel
but nah Wuk just a perfect character with zero emotion or struggle
but idc Wuk wasn't my biggest issue anyways
I don't want to start Wuk debate
tepid briar
since she should hate Zoraal after killing their father
bonus points for wuk lamat being taken advantage of like three times
wind cypress
here fight me, you barely survive - mean while gets whipped by some nobody later in the story, like bro I'm the hero of light or whatever that saved the universe and you did better?
fiery jewel
If anything I'm maybe slightly positive on Wuk
because everything else was equally as bad for the most part
so when she was funny she was funny ngl
tepid briar
I'm fine with wuk though I kinda wish they toned down the monologues
fiery jewel
it's like a bad movie
whole estuary
I think she should have kept the turban on
tepid briar
it's like a bad movie
I think the beginning was a little too comical for me so I couldn't take her seriously
fiery jewel
you just pick a narrative and ride with it so that's what I did for Wuk I never treated her seriously
tepid briar
like the whole alpaca thing
fiery jewel
😭
dapper zealot
I hated that shaaloani and xak tural had absolutely no bearing on the rite of succession
wind cypress
I barely remember the backpack bunny as I call him
tepid briar
I hated that shaaloani and xak tural had absolutely no bearing on the rite of ...
given how much they hyped up going over the bridge that was closed the whole time, I was expecting more than desert and grassland
fiery jewel
the villains were the best part
and 2 were absolutely comical jokes
1 had decent writing kind of
tepid briar
the whole storyline was awful
they really tried to squeeze in way too much idk
tried to build wuk from nothing and also refine her within like
half a msq
fiery jewel
I don't even think villains are the best part of shb
so like
it's not a compliment
😭
whole estuary
Hildy is having good villains
fiery jewel
gilgamesh and omega are my ffxiv goats
tepid briar
hmmm
fiery jewel
1A 1B
tepid briar
maybe they could've had just tulli as an entire msq
whole estuary
Buff Motorcycle Cactus is peak villain
tepid briar
if they focused on succession rite + as a new country or some shit
fiery jewel
But at the same time
tepid briar
and then s9 stuff as post-dt
fiery jewel
ppl acting like DT completely ruined the lore and story
I don't agree with that
DT is mostly a side journey for the most part
one they can easily edit down the line if they really care
it's like post ew
tepid briar
DT is mostly a side journey for the most part
wol sighs and pulls out the orange gummy
dapper zealot
given how much they hyped up going over the bridge that was closed the whole tim...
I find it bewildering that the whole rite was about Wuk bringing everyone together but it's only limited to yok tural, the entirety of the north is just untouched until after the rite is done
tepid briar
no more vacation fo rwol
wind cypress
blonde haired sephiroth wasn't too bad of a villian early in the game
tepid briar
I find it bewildering that the whole rite was about Wuk bringing everyone togeth...
I really felt that they could have just had the succession rite + across the bridge (and some more regions north of the bridge) as just dt by itself
and then left s9 to post-dt
wind cypress
but he down graded classes from samurai to reaper
tepid briar
they really tried to cram all of s9 and living memory into half a msq
fiery jewel
I think SQEX being against adding zones in patches
fundamentally ruins the storytelling kind of
tepid briar
idk that's just my thought
fiery jewel
since you can tell they want to add zones
tepid briar
tulli didn't have enough time to ferment
fiery jewel
like this patch we basically got a new zone kinda
dapper zealot
The instance zones are nice but they need to use them more
tepid briar
could've been a new city like Idyllshire tbh
we went into the city and I was like "wait there's not even a fucking aetheryte"
fiery jewel
u just gotta expect it atp
tepid briar
"how unimportant is this place"
fiery jewel
I think yoshida literlaly state
wind cypress
my fav storyline was the chonky guy eating pastries that turns into a spear weilding angel guy
fiery jewel
they never adding actual zones in post expac patches
which I don't understand
I think DT could've benefitted from it alot
DT the home of the blue mages
make a blue mage zone / city why not?
major BLU update easily
whole estuary
even a backwater village like Swiftperch has an aetheryte
dapper zealot
I really felt that they could have just had the succession rite + across the bri...
I would have rather s9 start much earlier and have more time to breathe and develop
fiery jewel
wind cypress
I like blue mages, but plz no more circus or whatever the arena is called
tepid briar
I would have rather s9 start much earlier and have more time to breathe and deve...
or that as well, but really it felt like both stories were struggling to breathe
whole estuary
Carnivale!
tepid briar
maybe the rite was a little too long tho
fiery jewel
if they replace field ops with zones I ain't even mad
wind cypress
yeah carnivale lol
fiery jewel
real shh
wind cypress
"have the right skill equipped or die" I call it
dapper zealot
Considering the rite was presented as a "vacation" it could have been shorter for s9 to get more time
fiery jewel
but whoever was saying earlier that the #1 issue is the zone design & strucutre themselves I agree
whole estuary
If we don't get new Carnivale stages, Martyn will starve to death in a ditch
fiery jewel
idk if it's #1 but that's like on my top five easily
fiery jewel
Considering the rite was presented as a "vacation" it could have been shorter fo...
s9 for what it was
was handle okayish
only thing I'm really mad about s9 is I think the zone could've been cooler and had a night cycle for the citizens
since who wants to live in a zone where it's eternally bright
but nitpicking
dapper zealot
I liked it but it was too much to fit into just 4 levels of msq
tepid briar
the 30 year time skip was really rocky
fiery jewel
I agree
tepid briar
felt like it was shoved in at the last second
tepid briar
like, when did the time equalize?
fiery jewel
7.0 I think is fundamentally flawed though
like to make it great you need to rewrite the entire script for the most part
raw sand
where my apartments in s9
raw sand
fiery jewel
is genuinely fine
tepid briar
where my apartments in s9
condo blocks when
fiery jewel
90-95*
raw sand
WHEN
whole estuary
like, when did the time equalize?
when they stuck a straw in it
fiery jewel
90-95 is inoffensive but the fetch quest complaints were fair
the dungeons were sick asf tho
and trial
96-100 is where 7.0 became gigatrash
tepid briar
felt like two separate stories and they had to somehow stick them together
fiery jewel
how they handled the 2nd half was fundamentally flawed
tepid briar
once you got to s9 I liked the story
fiery jewel
it felt like the first half set up the second half pretty okay
tepid briar
but between the two arcs it was huh
fiery jewel
tbh
I think characters should've been introduced earlier
Sphene for sure
but I get why she wasn't with the current writing
whole estuary
I don't think Krile should have had an echo vision when staring at ZJ
fiery jewel
Sphene being somewhat present in Yok Tural
would've been more interesting
which we see that during the invasion she was there
that's the first time we see her
tulip wraith
the 30 year time skip was really rocky
i mean it fit with how shards work, but 30 years in a matter of second vs the first taking days to do iirc max 7 years?
dapper zealot
I remember way before playing ff14 I saw a clip of meeting sphene for the first time in heritage. I thought it was in Mor Dhona lmao and was expecting her to show up
fiery jewel
I think 7.0 biggest crime
is putting out a REALLY FUCKING GOOD story trailer
and then the story being completely different
tepid briar
i mean it fit with how shards work, but 30 years in a matter of second vs the fi...
I never quite understood when the time normalized though
fiery jewel
it's like ff15 almost
tepid briar
was it when the barrier was officially "opened" by the fortress?
whole estuary
I never quite understood when the time normalized though
isn't it when they built the exit tunnel
fiery jewel
tepid briar
that's what I was thinking
whole estuary
like, stuck a straw in it
fiery jewel
if you watch this trailer blind
you will genuinely think 7.0 is the best msq
but it's a completely different product
tulip wraith
isn't it when they built the exit tunnel
^ yeah my thought on it as well
fiery jewel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BghYTigv8E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcUSXub_ypU same exact vibe
tulip wraith
idk if its explained for the first, but im guessing once the exarch opened a full door for us to go back and forth it and the source also synced
tulip wraith
i think a consistent open gateway is what syncs them up
tepid briar
i think a consistent open gateway is what syncs them up
yeah that's what I guessed
dapper zealot
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcUSXub_ypU same exact vibe
At least 15 is understandable considering how much it kept changing during development
fiery jewel
and then none of the plots shown are expanded upon
whole estuary
wuk lamat's babysitter for half the msq
Hrothgyaru
fiery jewel
At least 15 is understandable considering how much it kept changing during devel...
ffxv for the development hell it had is still borderline unfinished masterpiece
tepid briar
and then none of the plots shown are expanded upon
> contest to determine the ruler of a nation
does basically nothing with the actual nation other than instantly getting invaded
dapper zealot
15 was my first main ff game, I enjoyed it
fiery jewel
ye I genuinely think it's unfinished masterpiece
fiery jewel
\> contest to determine the ruler of a nation
*does basically nothing with the a...
idk who DT is even for
7.0*
very childish writing but 90% of the playerbase is above 18
tepid briar
I stand by my belief that they should've extended tullioyal to be the entirety of 7.0 and actually had wuk do something with the nation to build her character
fiery jewel
but ppl under 18 can't really comprehend how confusing the 7.0 story is
so who is it for
dapper zealot
Also I find it hilarious that all the tural cultures get their time in the spotlight but most of the shetona lore is brief during msq and most are from missable dialogue and sidequests
whole estuary
they got domed
tepid briar
next expac just needs a return to adult writing
17+ game now 
fiery jewel
I don't think the game should be dark unless it's really justified
but atleast make the dialogue for adults or smth like 16
tepid briar
yeah but some of the comedy was really...
fiery jewel
16 prob goes too far tho
whole estuary
but atleast make the dialogue for adults or smth like 16
they brought back horny ARR writing for the Hatchingtide event!!!!!!!!
whole estuary
He's good with a spear, and oh so lonely
fiery jewel
DT is extremely childish and FF16 is borderline chatgpt
Ivalice chronicles they maybe cook I gotta play it
fiery jewel
they brought back horny ARR writing for the Hatchingtide event!!!!!!!!
arr the goat for this
dapper zealot
they got domed
get in the bowl
fiery jewel
ARR story is not even bad lowkey
pacing just dogshit
and outdated
but the dialogue kinda good
tepid briar
I think the pacing only sucks if you know how far you are from endgame
midnight furnace
they brought back horny ARR writing for the Hatchingtide event!!!!!!!!
What does this mean lol
fiery jewel
ARR main objective was to just make a game world
so not really mad the story is eh
but they should update it 100%
more voicelines and rewrite some stuff
dapper zealot
DT is extremely childish and FF16 is borderline chatgpt
DT was genuinely the first time I went 🤨 at some of the dialogue
fiery jewel
DT dialogue is just bad compared to any other FF game
I don't think any other FF game is close to this level
tepid briar
DT was genuinely the first time I went 🤨 at some of the dialogue
I wanted to claw my face during the alpaca thing and when wuk got kidnapped
whole estuary
What does this mean lol
one of the 3 NPCs you talk to during the quest reminds me of ARR crude humor
midnight furnace
Ah nice
tepid briar
doesn't help how much of the tulli arc was foreshadowed hella hard
midnight furnace
(I was about to ask if it was the Arcadion girls lmao)
fiery jewel
ff7 remake writing is childish but at least the characters have crazy aura and are likable
dapper zealot
Wuk chasing after Gulool Ja going 'hey I want to kill your dad but dw let's be friends' was peak huh????
fiery jewel
and ff7 remake intended audience is a new generation anyways
tepid briar
BAKOOL JA JA IS PLANNING SOMETHING BAD
did you know bakool ja ja is planning EVIL stuff?
fiery jewel
they def thought DT would bring in new players
bakool ja ja being a terrorist was the best side arc
tepid briar
Wuk chasing after Gulool Ja going 'hey I want to kill your dad but dw let's be f...
also wuk lamat just going :o at sphene betraying them for the 2nd time
fiery jewel
bakool ja ja they cooked with his character ngl
but when you realize he's a literal terrorist it's hard to justify him from a lore standpoint
whole estuary
I liked it when he arrived home and acted like a kid with a bad report card
tepid briar
bakool ja ja they cooked with his character ngl
bakool ja ja was fire
whole estuary
it was so cute
tepid briar
and then he just magically reforms 180
fiery jewel
bakool ja ja shoukld've been disqualified immedaitely after the terrorism
it makes no sense he was allowed to continue
dapper zealot
I love rizzkool ja ja but that complete 180 from terrorist to chad was wild
tepid briar
like at the very least wuk should've been like
tepid briar
"I'll let you live but you have to atone for your sins"
fiery jewel
bakool ja ja should be in jail from a moral standpoint
whole estuary
I love rizzkool ja ja but that complete 180 from terrorist to chad was wild
still less whiplash than Tales of the Abyss
fiery jewel
but I like his charcater so fuck it
tepid briar
bakool ja ja shoukld've been disqualified immedaitely after the terrorism
and threatening the uhhh
what are they called
threatening during the reeds thing
dapper zealot
tbf SE has the 180 issue with a lot of villians
fiery jewel
I dont' even want to hate but I forgot the bird ppl name
tepid briar
bro should've gotten instantly disqualified after that
fiery jewel
forgotten 7.0
tepid briar
hanu hanu or something
tepid briar
hanuhanu
fiery jewel
ye
tepid briar
but ye he should've gotten instantly disqualified for that shit
I think they made him into too much of a meathead
tepid briar
they just turned him stupid
fiery jewel
making Bakool Ja Ja atone for his sins in ff11 even more
maybe give him a top tier arc or smth
I mean he even gets redemption 96 msq
bakool ja ja prob should've snuck into solution nine or something
tepid briar
they should've at least told bakool ja ja to atone for his sins by giving back or some shit
dapper zealot
also the 180 of the kkk mamool ja
fiery jewel
they should've kept bakool ja ja around
tepid briar
but nope just magically forgive him
fiery jewel
he should've been sent to jail after 93 msq
then redeem himself somehow during the invasion
tepid briar
bakool ja ja prob should've snuck into solution nine or something
he should've been comedic relief in s9
smh smh
fiery jewel
fuck it
whole estuary
the Blessed Twins lobbying group is too strong
fiery jewel
he could've been one of the ppl sending backup
whole estuary
he literally can't go to jail
fiery jewel
DT mostly introduces new charcaters than doesn't even use them as party members
GG
that mf Otis should've been real party member also
they did him dirty
tepid briar
that mf Otis should've been real party member also
sacrificial ass member
whole estuary
Metem should be a permanent addition to the Scions so that he can commentate all future dungeons
fiery jewel
it would've been the same at worst
but then u might actually get to build these new characters
make new party members like you did in stormblood
what made HW - StB - ShB goated was you were actively building a party during msq
tepid briar
MSQ would've been better without scions
bro why the fuck was THANCRED AND URIANGER here
fiery jewel
and then Endwalker was the big payoff
where it all came together
but like
All of the scions are not even official true party members
until like ShB
at least a lot of them
but 5.0 ending and 5.3 is when scions start to feel like a real group
tepid briar
I swear thancred and urianger didn't add anything to the msq
other than being koana relief
they're like "idk we don't feel like making helpers for koana let's stick some scions in"
mf what is this conflict of interest
dapper zealot
Another big issue I had was Valigarmanda having such little impact before we beat it. Yeah I get it was super weak and it was just another tuesday for the wol but the story kept hyping it up as really really bad from before we even step in Tuli. All that happened was it give first degree burns to some people, set a couple fires and we beat it in a minute of it being released.
fiery jewel
For me personally 5.0 is genuinely the first time in msq where I was like
okay now this is a legit final fantasy party
but I think that's the point
we just need that again somehow fuck the scions until 10.0
fiery jewel
10.0 when we are end of service
tepid briar
they hype up krile's family and then give her this fuckass 7.4 ending
tepid briar
"where is my real home" portals literally exist
fiery jewel
is a top 5 msq patch in the game
but that's recency bias
but the quality 7.4 has compared to 7.0-7.3 is shocking
dapper zealot
they hype up krile's family and then give her this fuckass 7.4 ending
If the poster is anything to go by, it feels like Krile's gonna get benched again in 7.5
fiery jewel
it still has the childish writing but it's actually justfiied since it's a lalafell clan
7.5 looks good msq
but I have no clue where it's going
idk if that's real garlemald or a reflection
I think they confirm real garlemald but isn't it all destroyed
whole estuary
it has blown up machina in the previews
dapper zealot
which section of farlemald were we even in?
true beacon
The Magitek Academy
whole estuary
the southern outskirts
fiery jewel
true beacon
AFAIK
fiery jewel
8:10 is the first time I felt real emotion in msq
whole estuary
mostly ceruleum processing plant
fiery jewel
shit was peak
true beacon
Based on the JP text
fiery jewel
5.0 ending might be the peak
true beacon
And name
fiery jewel
ngl chat
worn bluff
All of the scions are not even official true party members
if i had to rank the FF main parties i would put FF14 scions dead last
fiery jewel
when ppl say they will never top shb
I think of the ending and I kinda agree
😭
even 5.3 ending was peak
dapper zealot
the southern outskirts
wait so the giant fuckoff tower isn't even central garle?
fiery jewel
FF3 BEST FF
fiery jewel
if i had to rank the FF main parties i would put FF14 scions dead last
the party is too big so I agree
but it depends on the iteration
whole estuary
the giant tower is inside the city area which we don't get to see I think
whole estuary
there's a huge wall seperating the outer city from the inner
fiery jewel
EW scions were similar quality
worn bluff
why do we get the most boring rhul sister following us for a decade of expansions
dapper zealot
oh just scaling shenanigans
true beacon
There’s the tower that’s further north that had the Blasphemized Nerva in it where Varis’s heart was
fiery jewel
HW-StB it's not really about the scions tbf
but the parties in both of those expac were cool
ARR literally has no party so doesn't count
DT was the only time where I was like this party is ass
whole estuary
ARR party is you and Alphinaud
fiery jewel
if ARR had an actual party the other expacs wouldn't be as good
so that's the defense I have for ARR
fiery jewel
why do we get the most boring rhul sister following us for a decade of expansion...
tbh I like all of the scions individually
that's not really my issue
the only reason I dislike them in DT is because only 2 of them had actual relevance
Y'shtola maybe my favorite personally
fiery jewel
the only reason I dislike them in DT is because only 2 of them had actual releva...
Erenville not really a scion until he gets a new job 8.0 so it's really just 1
worn bluff
i don’t dislike them as characters per se but i don’t think they’re nearly cool enough to stick around
fiery jewel
and Krile is barely a scion herself
fiery jewel
i don’t dislike them as characters per se but i don’t think they’re nearly cool ...
ye
worn bluff
most of them are less interesting than a lot of side characters
fiery jewel
I think Y'shtola is a good charcater but it's completely subjective
I get most reasons why ppl dislike her
worn bluff
sadu >>>>>>>>> yshtola
fiery jewel
she was memed on until ShB
whole estuary
Sadu is a high bar, and less of her is more
fiery jewel
Y'shtola is mostly a meme / filler until ShB and ppl never recovered from that rlly
but Y'shtola has been getting major arcs
dapper zealot
I don't see Erenville being any combat job
fiery jewel
Y'shtola since 6.0 has probably been the most featured Scion I want to say
dapper zealot
like maybe bst but stretching it
fiery jewel
Personally I see Erenville being the new phys ranged
I don't think they're going to replace a scions expansion job
whole estuary
Bring Matoya out of retirement and make her magic dps
fiery jewel
he's really the only option to give a job to unless you introduce a completely new character
unless you only give WoL a new job
whole estuary
WoL will be the new tank in the trailer
fiery jewel
most likely yes
whole estuary
John Finalfantasy is meleebrained
fiery jewel
I can't see WoL being anything besides melee / tank
maybe Summoner but the iteration of summoner in xiv is completely shit
at least canon WoL like how he looks
actually if the phys ranged is a melee hybrid I can see it
or a gun job
fiery jewel
John Finalfantasy is meleebrained
I think he used a bow in 1.0 / ShB but it was more archer than bard somehow
bard who doesn't use raidbuffs so he's just griefing
whole estuary
Derplander playing a ranged job nearly killed SQEX, he will never be a caster
fiery jewel
only caster I can see is RDM but Alisaie is RDM
well Summoner
if Summoner was more like Clive just having baddass summons I could see it
but it's a joke in the current iteration
whole estuary
overlap is okay, he did a cool sequence with Lyse on the Hand of the Destroyer
but no casters
fiery jewel
ye
so unless we bring Wuk back and make her a new tank
god forbid
well we can meet a new character 7.5
but I really hope not
7.5 I hope they bring Zero back that's my main goal from that patch
whole estuary
Make Hoary Boulder the new tank and give the new ranged dps job to Aenor
fiery jewel
7.5 I think will bring Ryne / Gaia / Zero into the msq fold
if it's garlemald related
and the boss is a voidsent
which is what I predicted I always thought chapter 3 or 4 would be about 1st / 13th
whole estuary
the new expac name is Cockburners
fiery jewel
since 1st / 13th will play a big role in the next arc 100%
fiery jewel
the new expac name is Cockburners
Will prob be a winter theme I imagine
they talking about the winterers and stuff
honestly could be FFX expansion
dapper zealot
almost certainly something with Frost in it
fiery jewel
seems like a universal snow calamity or something
dapper zealot
Nah that was 5th Calamity
boreal pumice
we literally had a tour about this
fiery jewel
they can do anything
I feel like they'll just find a way to repeat it if they really wanted to
we need more surprises like that non formulaic
whole estuary
Patrolling the Sagoli almost makes you wish for a Calamity of Ice
boreal pumice
bring back ice fishing there is this one fishing hole in corthas would be fun to see alot of ppl around for big fish
dapper zealot
they can do anything
oh wait hang on, it could work if they do the opposite polarity
fiery jewel
FF type of series to just do some random shit for good or bad
pure hawk
hi is there a discord community for criterion svgs? i kinda remember there being one but never joined it
iron jewel
jolly flume
BappleTrees has found their mama MEOW =^w^=
dapper zealot
Is it you?
jolly flume
yes 
pure hawk
im dum i was in it LOL