suggestion-discussion

[sullen heart]

because it ruins the game

[wheat mirage]

And you believe all the solos would just.. join trios?

[long blade]

No... It doesn't... It actually makes a lot more people play the game. If you took away solos at this point it'd be detrimental to the population.

[violet stream]

Cleric "Judgment" should be 10m range or remove the "will fail" out of range. I feel like an idiot just trying to use it as other players can keep baiting me and quickly running out of range. You open yourself up to risk of being pushed, or the other player can toy with you until it is optimal for them to push. What's the alternative? Just stop trying to use it? It seems more of a liability

[civic zodiac]

Im scared it might encouravr rager to teamkill beginners cuz they wont play for pvp but learning and looting also.

[civic zodiac]

If they remove solo without matchmaking or solo buff vs team we can consider the game dead

[merry kestrel]

imagine if fighters reloaded crossbows as fast as dark bolt casts

[sullen heart]

who cares about the solos? f em who needs em

[sullen heart]

solos add nothing to the game, they are purely a detriment to the main game

[long blade]

I dont play solos that often, but I think you're being wildly disingenuos. but whatever.

[sullen heart]

Just remove solos for a month and watch the game get instantly better

[tulip venture]

Imagine if dark bolt had the travel speed or damage of a cross bow while similarly geared

[thick sky]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/502677/gigantic-spider-mummy-boss
new boss while we wait for druid
all features are in game already just smash them together and make a 20x size spider mummy boss with massive health pool

[calm bronze]

does anyone really want mutliclass at all or especially before druids out ?

[tulip venture]

I would hate that more than the spiders we already have

[thick sky]

Yes I want to play slayer fighter with divine protection, shadow touch, and BoC

[thick sky]

I mean a new boss is fun, new mechanics, new stuff to get good at. It’s all right there, small head so needs dialed in aiming to get headshot damage. The monster model itself keeps players mostly hitting limb damage. It could be fun

And what I’ve suggested is exactly the spiders we already have but GIGANTIC

[tulip venture]

I want to multiclass rogue and Druid and rat form pickpocket people

[thick sky]

Yo imagine though cleric pickpocket, no one would ever suspect it

[tulip venture]

It would be a funny thing to do with randoms

[merry kestrel]

good news, dark bolt deals more damage when similarly geared

[tulip venture]

Can you explain your math to me here?

[tulip venture]

Because my dark bolt base does 20 + magic power bonus that’s probably about 20% which will do about 39 to the head while a grey crossbow does about 60 to the head

[merry kestrel]

i have never seen any magic power bonus below 20%, you're also telling on yourself by saying "similarly geared" and only having a base 26 damage dark bolt so you're just saying you don't know how to gear

[tulip venture]

I just did no gear for easy math

[tulip hill]

wait wait wait
a grey crossbow does not do 60 to the head, does it? Did they roll out the x2 headshot multiplier already?

[tulip venture]

Isn’t a grey crossbow like 37 damage? I forget I haven’t used a crossbow in a while

[tulip hill]

36 damage (35-37)
but given that most targets are going to have some amount of headshot protection and PDR is generally much higher than MDR, even with the 20% armor pen, I don't think a grey crossbow will be doing 60 at the same gear level as a warlock doing 39

[tulip venture]

That’s fair I still think I would take a crossbow given the chance it’s way harder to dodge

[tulip venture]

On a different note do you think headshot protection protects from magic headshot damage too or just physical

[tulip hill]

true, but it also has a much lower rate of fire
at default a Dark Bolt only take ~1.23 seconds to charge
and I'm pretty sure it protects against both, but % damage reductions would squish the gap between the two damage numbers

[tulip venture]

Fair in the rate of fire I just think if they’re close enough to get hit by it with any consistency I can just COP them at higher gear COP scales better

[tulip hill]

Kinda?
CoP gets a total of 150% scaling because of it's DoT, but because it can't headshot and at least ~35% of that damage is a DoT, Dark Bolt can still outperform it
Dark Bolt is way better for spamming while CoP is better for hitting it once and switching to something else like your sword or another spell

The more I think about it, the more I like the dynamic between the two spells
ranged meta aside, when looking at just these two spells I think they did a good job designing them against each other

[merry kestrel]

Died 3 times as a fighter in the frontline by simply hitting an enemy who was pushing in.

Which class?

Warlock.

Dark Reflection punishes players for playing the game as-intended and provides no agency for counterplay.

It needs to trigger only on successful blocks.

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[exotic parrot]

Lol

[tulip hill]

I too have identified that design flaw in Dark Reflection, and while making it a blocking perk would be interesting, there is also the simpler option of making ranged attacks put it on its cooldown without it dealing its damage, though if they went that rout I would like its visual to be more clear

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[merry kestrel]

That simply reinforces ranged and ranger

[dense quail]

Nerf warlock dude its insane

[sturdy crater]

Thoughts on having footstep noise while crouching or walking related to a threshold of resourcefulness or dexterity instead of given to all classes? This way classes like rogue, ranger, and bard can be inherently stealthy and ones like Barbarians or Clerics will have to dedicate item slots to improve it.

Like 10 and under would be louder than typical, 15 is average, at 20-25 it's more quiet and audio reaches a shorter range, and at 30-35 it's dead silent. Just an idea for how to shift this universal creep change to one that makes sense for classes.

[somber wind]

I'd love it if they would make the english localization accurate.

[civic zodiac]

Imo sound should get linked to the kind of armor the player wear. Plate should make noise while naked dont

[raw fractal]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543078/pre-teaming-counter-measures

[hallow flare]

People don’t need more incentives to be naked though tbh, the naked move speed meta is pretty lame to deal with

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[upper hearth]

Put a cap on the amount on consumables, throwables and ammo you can bring into the dungeon. Make fights more meaningful, stop people from just shutting doors and medding 20 times a game.

[tulip venture]

I think this would be against how they feel about player agency but I would be all for potion toxicity or throwables being nerfed I’m not sure if the equip time is long enough enough either

[upper hearth]

They said at the beginning of the game that they wanted to make health matter, a dungeon crawler should be brutal and you should always be wary of your resources. I think it would make the game better, it would nerf the movespeed meta a bit too, as running away to heal isn't as much of any option.

[hallow flare]

Maybe only let you take consumables into the dungeon via pockets? The problem with this would be bard obviously, but it would also stop people from bringing a billion heals too

[wheat mirage]

It's hard to balance though and you'd get the train scenario of whoever engaged first is most likely to die to the next person since they can't heal back up

So it encourages people hiding and only going in at the end once everyone is weakened

[tulip hill]

There is also the fact that the less healing items available, the more powerful healing abilities become. Restricting healing items will affect different classes and team comps more than others

[graceful yew]

Windlass needs some sort of rework, being able to start a fight shaving 50% of someone’s HP off with a bodyshot is insane

[tulip hill]

that is quite the insane advantage you grant your team, and between Ranger's crossbow mastery or simply hot swapping it out for something else like a bow, it could be argued that the disadvantages are not proportional
so what would you suggest to fix this issue?

[severe narwhal]

you do have the particularly cripling advantage of it basically only being useful in team fights at range with cover, meaning theres a bigger skill gap to hit farther targets in the head to get the huge damage you want and people to keep you from just getting rushed while reloading, in solo play it's really good to hot swap out of after landing a shot but taking almost any ranged damage before the melee engage almost always ensures your loss in the fight.

[hallow flare]

Honestly, the windlass probably just shouldn’t exist. Maybe it could have a longer stow animation and require an animation to unequip it, but I do think game would be better off with it gone

[tulip hill]

I have a very different view on ranged weapons in a game like this, though one that I haven't seen many agree with
imo ranged weapons should act as support tools, not damage tools
for something like the windlass, I'd probably have most of its damage taken away and replaces with a small but considerable slow that lasts a decent amount of time

[subtle shadow]

Prevent us from skipping weapon sheathing animation using belt items, such an exploit

[toxic forge]

Just make it take longer to equip throwables / consumables on your belt (and equip/unequip armor and weapons while they're at it). Players being able to pull from an infinite pool of healing and ranged options i s the problem, but if they wanna bring all that free healing for me when they die I don't wanna stop them.

[subtle shadow]

Stow animations can be skipped currently, by switching to a belt item instead of fists

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[wicked spindle]

i like this

[vagrant matrix]

Make this game turn based

[abstract veldt]

@ripe yoke lolz barbs have the lest amount of range

like can they revert warlock back to to way is was on last patch maybe get rid of fire walking i dont know but that hugh debuff to spell casting speed for wearing heavy armor was a good change but im sick of seeing these warlocks in base kits just cast a curse then run a way and if you do get on im just turn invincible its not fun fighting them it

and seeing two warlocks is insane in duo they just aggro the whole room run away with fire walking never have to deal with mobs looks so cheesy

[ripe yoke]

buff warlock

[abstract veldt]

also you can buy normal full normal grade armor as warlock have 201 armor in norms turn into demon thats 250 armor have as much health as a barb also life steal true dmg@ripe yoke

then dark stacks

[rich veldt]

Can you place add better filters to the market place. I want to filter after class requirements, and random/static attribute amount, i also want to search for more than one random attribute at a time.

[hallow flare]

Nobody should be able to easily win against a demon form warlock. It literally kills them for you if you just wait it out and push them when they transform back. Just play smarter lol, stop w keying

[fluid shuttle]

I wanted to provide some feedback on the current quest that are available. Overall, I think they are well designed and an improvement on the last wipe, but there are some outlier quests that I think need improvement or are just flat out poorly designed.

Starting with quests that are fun in theory but badly designed.
Crate Chaos: I think this is a fun quest generally but is really poorly designed for any class that has no native way of breaking crates. Namely Rogue: the only way for a rogue to break crates is with a pickaxe. (I only play Rogue and Warlock so I am not sure what other classes might be having the same issues.) Overall, this quest is not bad, it might just need some tweaking.

Sacrifices Must Be Made: this quest is interesting in theory but punishes solo players who cannot use the altar. Either have a way for solo’s to still interact with the alter or remove the quest. I think quest should not punish your solo player’s experience. All quests should be in theory achievable by any player given enough skill.

Next, I want to talk about quests that are technically achievable by any player, but I still think need adjustments.

Mystic Inquiries, Elegance in Execution, Braving the Shadows, Brutish Truths.
I think these quest in general are not bad, I think they need to be tweaked a little. Much like with Saint Nick’s quest line last wipe this quest should not be map specific. The reason behind that is that you are never guaranteed to ever see those classes on any of those maps. If you are going to make it class specific for kills it should be across all maps, this also again punishes your solo players since there is no solo queue on the maps besides goblin caves.

This quest can also deter players of those classes potentially from playing on those maps since they will be hunted down for the quest.

I think the rest of the quest are well balanced and not too grindy like in the past season. Great job Iron Mace Team.

[tulip hill]

if I may add to what you said about Sacrifices Must Be Made
its generally not a good design to have what would be considered a mistake as a prerequisite for a quest. Why? because that incentivizes to purposely make that mistake. The most effective way to complete the quest is to rush to an alter and just kill your friend, revive them, and then rush to the next alter to do it again. While this may play into the name of the quest, literally sacrificing your party member in an almost ritualist matter, the bottom line is such gameplay goes against the normal objective of...well, not dying

I could definitely see people being able to pick up the hearts of fully wiped parties to sacrifice them for some kind of buff or treasure

[merry kestrel]

make slayer apply to all weapons with same penalty

[sharp cape]

remove spider collision

[sharp cape]

cyclops is unbeatable with the felling axe because its collision box is meters bigger than its hitbox :|

[tulip hill]

might cause some people to complain about getting one shot by some of the heavier weapons, not that they don't already
but all weapons? I'd say exclude ranged weapons, even with the weapon mastery penalty, +5 weapon damage on a survival bow sounds like a nightmare to deal with

[tulip hill]

is the felling axe attack range shorter than the daggers?

[sharp cape]

yes haha

[tulip hill]

can't say I ever compared them, I knew it was short but that's honestly hilarious
that very much is a bummer, I probably wouldn't try with a felling even if it could hit

[sharp cape]

im just tired of the blatantly poor game design
i love this game when its not ruining itself

[tulip hill]

I don't take too much issue with stuff like that, seems more like an oversight than a deliberate design choice
like I know they want the felling axe to have a short range but I doubt they want it to not be able to hit a particular boss

[sharp cape]

i meant more poor game design as in theyre bad at making a game

[merry kestrel]

Ok i can agree melee only lmao

[tulip hill]

understandable
that said, its a hell of lot better than a lot of AAA games nowadays 🙃

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[ancient veldt]

Make marketplace's fee 15 coin per listing + 5% on SALE, and not a straight up 5% on listing no matter the amount

[civic zodiac]

there should be 2 thind of quest. the generic one and the squire equipment class one. generic quest would be accountwide and class equipment unlockers like weaponsmith woodsman etc character wise. having to redo every quest on every char is a huge pain.

[civic zodiac]

also it would be nice to have a price-check / trade section in the discord. a/h without the possibility to search multiple affix and also min number is a pain

[rare bluff]

Make it so when you are using demon form and you transform wearing a skeleton skin you are a skeleton demon with bones that match the color, easy to make just recolor the skeleton twice after white and its a cool addition and also base demon form ugly af Edit: id even pay for it fr

[tulip hill]

that would actually be sick as hell (haha)
though that is a tall ask when the closest thing I can think of to that kind of class/race interaction is the fact that barbarians have a male/female yell
would be cool if eventually each race had their slightly different demon form, like maybe the lizardmen could look almost draconic, not sure what you could do with orc and elf to make them significantly different

[pastel basalt]

Ssf mode with bound when looted once you exit the dungeon please and thank you

But dreams aside, a trade history would be nice

[static turret]

remove creep fron non rogues

[earnest wraith]

FOR THE EVER LOVING LOVE OF GOD, PLEASE FUCCKING FIX THESE DOGSHITT SERVERS HOW IS IT THAT I HAVE LESS LAG WITH OVERSEAS SERVERS VERSUS MY CLOSEST ONES. AND ITS SO FUCCKING SPORADIC TOO. LIKE HOW CAN I PLAY JUST FINE ALL DAY, THEN THE MOMENT I GO IN WITH A 50,000 GOLD KIT I START TELEPORTING SO BAD THAT I CANT EVEN CAST A SPELL OR DEMON FORM, JUST TO DIE TO A FUCCKING TEAM THAT SPAWNED IN THE NEXT ROOM OVER

[civic zodiac]

been praying for a self found mode forever. would enhance the gameplay experience so much.

[granite plinth]

have you tried not using McDonalds wifi ?

[gaunt hamlet]

why does shriek of witness give away invisible rogues? the rogue should still receive the debuff but without musical notes surrounding him

[light hound]

This would be a very "rich get richer" type of experience. The Apex predators would rule over the dungeons with an even greater power gap unless you had a very strict gear or skill-based matchmaking system, or wiped it literally every few days. In other words, it would actually make the problem it's trying to solve worse (which is bringing the gear level/gap down on average).

Once anyone starts snowballing and collecting the best pieces off of everyone they kill, the gear gap becomes enormous. Starting back at greys while they stay in blues and purples would feel insurmountable.

With easily accessible gear, the gear gap is actually a lot more approachable - you can get some economy going and buy some pieces for a workable set

[elfin mural]

warloc's karma

[civic zodiac]

its not the same experience. with trading come gold sellers but also more easier time to get gear. with self found come progression and huge rewarding feeling while progressing alongside a harder feeling when losing everything. gear gap might be a problem. but a fully gear player that get ambushed/killed by rats will feel also even worst cuz the gear lost is way more valuable.

[agile nest]

add a clipping system where you can review clips of sketchy people and flag people who you think are actually cheating and have the clips sent to a moderator

[strong grotto]

Because MAGIC! Wizards have wisp spell - bards have shriek. It also can reveal mimics, BTW. Love it. Fast to execute and useful.

[strong grotto]

Wait, can you explain what means "bound when looted"? Are you telling about not losing gear?

[pastel basalt]

meaning if you try drop trading other players will not be able to equip it

[strong grotto]

Hmmmm... That would make it also impossible for team of people to give them back something they've lost in previous run, no?

[pastel basalt]

? The design would likely be something akin to WOWs raiding loot mechanic

you can drop it with people you looted with it when they were in that dungeon with u, but not after youve left the dungeon

[strong grotto]

I mean, imagine you and your 2 buds go in dungeon. One dies and you have no time or opportunity to revive him. So you LOOT him for most valuable things and try to give it back in the next run. But he now can't equip it?

[pastel basalt]

you cant equip you must give back to homie

bound on equip

[strong grotto]

Hmm... Might work.

[light hound]

It might feel good for a while, but my point is that it will only be fun for a very short time before a big gear gap emerges and it is almost impossible to catch up. You would be forced to rat for games and games on end, and you might not even be able to do that with any consistency.

This game type would need to be wiped every few days to 1~2 weeks at most.

[civic zodiac]

i dont think so since its pretty easy to do zero to hero without a/h already. geared peoples wont stay geared forever since they gonna mostly become no1 lobby targets.

anyway. only way to know it trying and having more players. rn theres not enough to try different gamemode...

[light hound]

Are you talking about teaming? Or just that people want to try and fight them?

I mean, realistically, if a person has gathered up +6 all, 8+ added damage, some vigor/armor/movespeed rolls, the chances of other people killing them isn't high

They would likely just wipe the full lobby if they're decent

[civic zodiac]

legit team of ambusher* and not teaming. but teaming would probly happen more often since the risk bigger. more risk will probly make peoples tend to play more stealthy and rats than yolo rushing pvp

its not easy to get a full +all gear by urself. probly gonna endup losing kits midway before to get fully bised

as long the mode dont exist and we dt try it its all theory XD

[light hound]

This is assuming even skill level, and an ideal scenario where someone doesn't snowball and start collecting the best gear off 100 players.

Even mid-level gear would tend to crush,

It's not unreasonable that they would have a near-bis set within a few days, and multiple of them

[civic zodiac]

if someone legit manage to get that much of wealth by themself and are good at the game like streamer level i assume they deserve to be kinda that strong.

[light hound]

Well, that's the point. It doesn't take much for the average player to start steamrolling lobbies with a significant gear gap. Then that gear gap gets worse every time they kill another player and loot the very best pieces they've found.

The difference to the live version is that the players who die basically start from 0 - which effectively makes it a "you die, you quit" kind of game type. You're too far behind now

Generally a nice idea, but I don't think it works unless it's a per-game loot system like Normals (in which case drop rates would need to very high and class specific - think battle royales), or a very fast wipe interval (you get a week to play it before it resets)

[civic zodiac]

sound like a streamer paradise XD

[lusty zephyr]

Ranger traps shouldn't be able to be placed beneath bodies/gear. They should be auto-triggered/break as a result of anything being in its hitbox.

[broken lagoon]

Ranger traps are ass already you just have to be careful

[pine comet]

When a cleric with pfe says this I find that this response may be biased

[merry kestrel]

remove creep from everyone

replace it with slayer for everyone

[tulip venture]

Streamer paradise is what makes me so afraid of multiclassing I’m so afraid of a overheal, advanced healer warlock

[unique seal]

May we please have magical interaction go back to Knowledge please

[hidden hemlock]

So I don’t think creep should be on every class but I do think every class with a shield or block should be able to have a quick follow up attack like the fighters ability, almost like a weaker parry, in some fights the block doesn’t even make sense because the enemy is winding up for their second swing before the block animation happens so there’s no room for a punishing attack

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[hidden hemlock]

Also I think if you give everyone a class ability, that skill should be astronomically better on that class (ex. Creep on the rogue means your footsteps are completely silent regardless of crouch walking or running) obviously that example might be a little busted but it’s just to make sure skills aren’t completely nullified

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[tulip hill]

When blocking, there is a hidden stat called Impact Resistance which goes against the enemy's Impact Power. If the enemy has more Impact Power than you have Impact Resistance, then yes, you will be staggered and they won't be. This is what leads to them being able to continue their combo while you are stuck in the block animation. But even outside of that, I don't think the devs want blocking to allow for consistent counter attacks. When used effectively, blocking can turn a disadvantageous situation back to neutral. Not only can you use it to avoid their weapon damage, but a blocked attack will still use things like Blow of Corruption, Rupture, and Achilles Strike

If I were to make any changes, I'd probably make it so a perfectly timed block gets a +1 to its impact resistance. Currently Barbarians can get up to 7 impact power using Crush and a Warmaul, the max impact resist is 6. That means outside of Fighter's Perfect Block skill, there is no way to block that warmaul without getting full staggered. This change would also help in other specific and more common situations, such as Morning Star (5 impact) vs Round Shield (4 resist)
Though with all that said, messing with the impact numbers might have unintended gameplay consequences, its hard to say just how impactful this would be

[stuck thorn]

the quests that require specific classes are absurd. its possible to not even see 5 bards or rangers in solos in the entire season, let alone have them willing to fight us.

[strong grotto]

To make that "perfectly timed block" there should be a major change in how the animations work in this game. And better yet - to remake the whole fighting system to be more, than just swing in the general direction, where only few classes are even able to have parrying as a viable thing.

[strong grotto]

Have a friend. Find each other. Kill each other. Profit.

JK.

If serious, the questing definitely needs to be updated a bit. It is fine idea and I like it, just needs a bit of polish. Like the thing, that some quests rely solely on RNG finds during your run or some require you to directly go to Hell dungeon as the 1st quest mission, while others just ask you to kill a few goblins? Yeah, BALACNED distribution of challenge, lol.

[stuck thorn]

thats like... rule one. no pre teaming

plus one this !!

[strong grotto]

That's like... If you kill only each other, then is it even pre teaming now? Pre teaming is when you go duo to stomp solo. You only bypass a stupid quest, lol

1st thing about those stashes is to give us easy way to put things we want inside them and not just automatically fill those from up to bottom.

• Removed the ‘dungeon’ requirements from the Character Kill quests.

REJOYCE!!!

That's the first step. Now remove the class requirement too and we are solid.

[stuck thorn]

see you in the dungeons

[cyan fable]

On a real note can we get more CC in the game? Like a frost wall/fog/mist for Wizards, maybe a glowing blood orb for Warlocks (similar to magelight) maybe grease or icy terrain, I think more forms of cc would make the game more interesting and fights take a different turn. Also cc helps prevent +all's from just face checking you. Add more teamplay mechanics!

[flint brook]

ty for class specific filter on marketplace

[formal valve]

maybe not have wanderer in pool with demi god?

[tulip hill]

I love the new Lock spell for wizard so having more battlefield manipulation like this would be cool
being able to summon a small wall would be useful when trying to push a ranged enemies

[final talon]

Spear perk nerf is a straight meme the only viable self defense perk that doesnt just add range modifiers. and lets be real no ranger wins a sword fight period

[floral herald]

The commas are separating the ranks. The only 2 that are together are apprentice and wanderer

[floral herald]

Agreed. Or at least make it "Kill # of bards OR rangers"

[small furnace]

People don't seem to think this, but the devs should definitely elaborate because people are split on what it means./

[floral herald]

They are notoriously bad at being clear about things. Probably just a translation issue

[formal valve]

ohhhhh then i like that a lot. the commas seperate the pools. woohooo!

[ashen nymph]

they should buff rangers its already dead class and they nerfed it as well

[floral herald]

People do seem to disagree with me, hopefully they clarify. Although I guess once it goes live it will be easy to tell haha

[nimble sigil]

This is wrong

They just added wanderers to the big pool
The slash denotes the two pools, it has been blue through demi and neo through wanderer for the longest time

[forest crescent]

buff bonk wizard, give us +5 magic damage with staves back

[upbeat hare]

"All class creep should just make steps quieter like -40% when walking and -80% sound when crouching. Rogue itself should have full silence when crouching and -80% when walking and if creep actually used on Rogue, the speed boost can stay + silent walk but maybe also just quieten down interactions like opening chests/doors to -60%."
In addition, remove hide and ambush they aren't needed imo

[floral herald]

I understand why you think that, but nobody has confirmed either way

[nimble sigil]

Yeah they have

[floral herald]

Who and where?

[nimble sigil]

That's how they formatted it?
That's consistent with how the pools have been working?

[floral herald]

Nobody has confirmed then. You're just wasting both our time. Blocked+reported+cursed

[proud sigil]

make a matchmaking system that needs to be filled completely the lobby, like league or apex

[tulip hill]

so like, instead of loading into a lobby and being locked in, the game would wait until it can make a full match before sending them all in?

[nimble sigil]

rogue

[proud sigil]

Yeah

[tulip hill]

that's tough
a lot of people don't care if the lobby is completely full
and some don't care how many people are in it at all just wanting to get in to do something other than PvP like bosses
but I understand the want, maybe have it be an opt in option?

[proud sigil]

Some people like half filled lobby or withiout anyone so that would be pve only. I like full lobby always because i like pvp and pve experience. Its so sad to dont have a full lobby in an hour. I prefer to wait like 10 minutes to fill a full lobby.

But thats my preference. Maybe normals can be any number of players and hr full

[tulip hill]

oh, maybe simply have a system where people can force start after some time, so the lobby can vote on if they don't want to wait any longer?

[dense rune]

This way seems best. Since having an opt system would slow matchmaking in total.

[small furnace]

idk about you but I'm quittin the game if I have to wait 10 minutes just to start a match

[proud sigil]

Thats you. I already quited because i cant find a full lobby since wipe in hr

[small furnace]

Ok but I'm pretty sure I'm in the majority here when I say I wouldn't bother waiting 10 minutes for a lobby to fill.

[proud sigil]

Thats literally league, apex or valorant players. But the difference is they have hundred thousand or million playing and lobby fill in 3-5 mins. Sometimes can be 10 or more in league

[small furnace]

I have never waited more than 3 minutes for a league lobby, and if it did get to that point I'd cancel my queue and go do something else. I don't really care what other games do, if a game has a 10 minute queue the fact of the matter is a significant number of people will simply stop queueing and stop playing.

Since you lose your entire kit for backing out, and you get banned temporarily for leaving the queue. It is an atrocious idea to force people to stay in when queue times will be as long as 10 minutes.

[proud sigil]

I waited many times because people quit lobby because they didnt liked the picks or lane. In apex and valorant its faster. Yeah league is worse in banning temporary lol they ban u for like 10 mins or more if u quit

For this game would be good if they had inmense playerbase. Or just make a pve lobby since some people want empty lobby

[small furnace]

No, my point is that dark and darker is worse.

If you back out you lose your entire kit and you are temporarily banned for 5 minutes.

With that in mind, NO. We should not increase queue times to 10 minutes so that people have to sit there for 10 minutes doing nothing or give up their kit.

[proud sigil]

Its not the queu time, its the minimum required people to start a lobby. But since this game is dead yeah it eould be like 10 mins or more

[tulip venture]

I liked Dotas solution to when people behave in negative ways, make the queue into special punishment lobbys where you have to play with other people also there for punishment it was effective

[next tangle]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543488/players-dying-to-mob-kills-after-being-hit-once

[tulip venture]

Homie they made the kill quests work for all maps already

[modest ermine]

why cant my slayer fighter wear the heavy gambeson? its cloth now

[merry kestrel]

it's a bug

[merry kestrel]

yes but there's more to it than just that if you read it all the way through

[tulip venture]

Yeah I would agree I think kill assists should count too

[ashen nymph]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543452/ranged-damage-drop-off-adjustments

[ashen apex]

LET US TOON TRADE

[charred fossil]

Hello, You changed heave Gameson to cloth but i still can not wear it as a slayer fighter ? even tho it says cloth and not plate ?

[storm blade]

whats the 5th stash cost 20k

[uneven wolf]

What do y'all think of this? https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543506/item-changes-to-stop-price-fixing-gouging

[peak cloud]

I SUGGEST WE REMOVE EL CREEP.

[cunning gorge]

This has to be the 5th time I'm saying this, but I'll continue. As someone who is able to farm cyclops - I'd suggest that you PLEASE consider removing the RNG rockfall phase, or reworking the fight entirely. Regardless of gear, you can literally die to the rocks in the fall phase due to COMPLETE RNG. This is a HORRIBLE mechanic. It makes the fight not worth doing with any sort of gear. This is common sense. Rework the fight.

[hallow flare]

Ya, as someone who doesn’t I refuse to learn it for this reason. Not mooing to partake in luck based combat

[tulip venture]

Graysun mentioned that they were planning on changing it in someway to fix it but that was like a month and a half ago

[fluid shuttle]

The Gamba Quest is kinda rude to Warlocks. Since you know, their spells all make them take damage. decent quest, but should maybe be only 1 survive instead of 3.

[dense rune]

So true, I HATE rockfall. Sometimes I take no damage, other times the rocks headshot me 4 times in a row

[stable sentinel]

Sorry for adding <@&1019888848773328936> but would we be able to get a chat for quest help other than genchat ? thx for ur help and thx for what u do on the discord much love

[echo gazelle]

This ⬆️ Yes please

For anyone trying to complete the (Sanctified Healing quest) You Need to be the first to use 3 Separate shrines of health! (You can't just use 1 for all 3!)

[sullen heart]

They removed the dungeon requirements from the character kill quests so I will no longer ask for them to remove solo queue, good day.

[hallow flare]

I mean, not really. I assume you still need to go to gob caves to kill centipedes, ice to kill frost giants, crypts to kill demons, etc.

[sullen heart]

Whatever, I know where those mobs are at, I have a map that tells me where to go. The map doesn't show me where a bard has spawned for me to kill

[dense rune]

Tbh I think 5x5 goblin cave is a really good duos map, use like 5~7 teams so total player count if 10~14.
3 by 3 with 5~7 is good for pvp, but for pve you’re definitely gonna get interrupted often.
Y’all think a 4 by 4 goblin caves with 8ish players would be a good balance of the two?

[stable sentinel]

im really happy for the 5x5 for questing atm,
and i agree 5x5 gob duo map would be sick fun both for pvp and pve like bosses.
the small 3x3 and 4x4 are great fun for solo pvp
so maybe put in 5x5 gob cave as a 2nd duo map and a 3x3or4x4 for solos would be great ^

[primal thicket]

Hey maybe remove silent walking? like why was that introduced at all

[stable sentinel]

they are just testing out different things and way to play the game ^^ and u get a 45% penalty for slowwalk/creep

[dense rune]

100% agree with all of this.

[dense rune]

They would have tested it on test servers, but those aren’t ready for large issue testing yet (at least that’s what they said)

[stable sentinel]

i dont think that there are enuff players to test it there yet

[dense rune]

Also true lmao. They said first thing that would officially be tested there is headshots going to a 2x multiplier instead of a the current 1.5x multiplier

IMO if they rebalance the headshot reduction of helmets accordingly it shouldn’t change much except for non-plate classes. But more importantly the rockfall from HR cyclops would become an one~two shot unless you have insane amounts of pdr

[worn lava]

Francisca Axe weapon damage has been reduced. The movement speed penalty applied to the target has been increased from -25% → -35%. this is stupid its a bad change for wizards for a wiz you just got to hit em once roar barbs catch up in no time you should change how many they can bring in and put a cap on it

[tulip venture]

Why rude to warlocks I’m sure the warlock survival rate isn’t bad

[fluid shuttle]

The quest is to survive Goblin caves without taking any damage 3 times. All of the warlock spells do damage to the user. Thus it makes half of their Kit unusable if you are going for the quest.

[hallow flare]

Guess you got to go with the newly nerfed melee lock with BoC + phantomize, still should just make self damage an exception though

[fluid shuttle]

Yeah, it is not impossible but just a slight oversite. Quest is still doable but might just need to be tweaked and looked at. Over all I think it is a decent quest.

[hallow flare]

Should probably read “take no damage from enemies”, would be better that way

[fluid shuttle]

Yeah, that would be an easy fix to the issue.

[opaque notch]

add ruins back

[tulip hill]

I read that as runes and was going to question when we had magic rocks

[twilit void]

Add character customization

[tulip hill]

I want to bedazzle my skeleton's bald head
get me that golden jaw like in Original Sin

[ruby chasm]

does that count as "damage" though code wise? I believe the spell costs are coded differently (as something like Warlock's one perk that stops them from dying to their own spells doesn't stop them from dying to like CoS or Bloodstain blade self dmg)

there is a chance it just doesn't count as damage per say

[fluid shuttle]

I mean, considering they used a blanket statement as damage, it would imply that anything that causes your HP to go down is damage. It is one of those things where it is unclear so have to take it at face value. In till they clarify the wording on either the spells or the quest. I would not risk it and see it as an issue.

[chrome gale]

idea give every map trios and let every map lead to inferno until there down layers are done?

[split trench]

Day something of requesting greens in norms because they're downright useless otherwise

[hearty sleet]

Bring back map rotation:
Static maps isolate players who don't like those maps but make players who do very happy; rotating maps isolates nobody.
It seems likely player counts will drop over time due to static maps.
Players who love the current maps aren't going to quit because of rotation but people who dislike them very likely will.
Plus, to be honest, the same maps are just getting stale.

[dark dust]

Since we can have up to 5 storage tabs now, you should really reduce the cost of them.

[dense rune]

Do they continue to increase in price, or do they continue to cost 10k ?

[dark dust]

No clue, got 3 level 30s with 2 tabs each xD
3rd page should have been 5k to begin with, 10k is ridiculous

[dense rune]

tbh 3k for a 2nd page is already ridiculous.

If it went something like
1k
3k
5k
10k
Then I’d be super happy with it.

Hell, unless you get multiple bags or a chest, I don’t know if you could reasonably store 10k with only 2 pages lmao

[dense rune]

Which classes to level 30?

[tulip venture]

Wait without taking damage?

[tulip hill]

3k is 60 pouches, which is 5 rows or 25% of your storage at that point
buying the first tab doubles your storage with the next tab costing over 3x as much, taking just under 42% of your total storage to buy the 3rd tab.
after getting the 3rd tab I've kind a just been slowly building up my gold and farming for gold bags to store more gold
with the market, liquidating your gear into money and buying new gear later isn't too much of a hassle, so while the prices and storage required to have that money is pretty steep, you can definitely keep a a solid set of backup gear and still have enough space for the gold to buy the next tab

[dense rune]

Rock n roll, thanks for telling me!

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[tulip hill]

what do you mean by "shouldn't be in"?
that seems to imply solos wanting to play against trios are wrong in some way

[civic zodiac]

solo ice cave work very well tbf

[rare bluff]

Delete creep

[tulip hill]

the perk or the global mechanic?

[rare bluff]

global mechanic

[tulip hill]

understandable, I've heard enough good reasons to not have a problem with that sentiment, even if I personally don't mind the mechanic

[rare bluff]

I dont mind it but when im in a god kit fighting a fighter and some random ass naked it just on me with no indicators to then distract me so the fighter gets 3 free hits and wins is so fun and enjoyable and has such a high skill ceiling

[boreal kiln]

Bring back The Ruins it was the best map... Game sucks without it and without map rotations

[tulip hill]

I'm still not 100% clear what exactly you want, but you do bring up a very good point with the quests
the two people I play with don't like playing solo so they are not getting the GC quests done

[granite plinth]

Agree

[strong grotto]

And the reason is your lack of awareness? I have more than one problem with the game and is fighting system, but creep is not one of them. At least now rangers have a reason to have a tracking perk, lol.

[flat rivet]

Release druid please

[rare bluff]

rangers are whatever but the full tank barbs, fighters and whatnot is annoying as hell

[strong grotto]

Dude, if someone like barb creeped to your arse and you didn't notice - it is kinda on you, lol

[rare bluff]

Bro

[void atlas]

Except that the chase perk doesn't let you hear them when they make zero noise to begin with >.>

It DOES show any footsteps they have made in the last 30 seconds yes, I will give you that. But the range is only about 8-ish feet from you I'd say and generally I feel like the person wouldn't be creeping around an area that you are currently in, they would be creeping up TO the area you are currently in.

Point being: Creep sucks ass...

Actually love it as a rogue perk, adds class identity and mechanics that aren't "I pReSs HiDe AnD kIlL GuD" adds a more "skill based" version of stealth imo. Also, it's a PERK that has to be chosen over other valuable options.

But for everyone to have it for free is just ridiculous.. It's basically become "meta" to hold shift the whole match, which was nerfed a bit by the reduced movement while walking or crouching but people will still do it and at that point it sorta becomes a "you do it too or you lose" kind of scenario which is lame af.

Maybe if crouching/walking just reduced the distance that your steps could be heard or reduced the volume of your steps depending on boot type or something, I would be all in for that. But COMPLETE SILENCE is just too game breaking..

.
Not to mention that the reduced move speed while crouched also hinders dodging in general in both PvE and PvP...

[restive otter]

I totaly agree @void atlas

[ashen nymph]

agree

[unborn yacht]

if you double left click it should equip into weapon slot 1 and double right click should bring into slot 2, i been around since playtest 3 and i still cant get used to that it isn;t like this to begin with

[unborn yacht]

always felt the same about the belt with the sides too or at the very least have a config option to set the default side things get put on because the default side happens to be the opposite of what i always liked to use

[limber dock]

you can drag the items

[strong grotto]

I really can't understand all the butthurt from creep. Like seriously. Ambush is a viable strategy of playing. Creep adds to possibility of it happening. And if anything just how much harder it really becomes? Maybe higher in the ranks of HR it does make difference, for people are generally more skilled in playing and ambushing someone is just that much lethal. But I am not that skilled. And I don't like HR very much as it is unfair game mode for stat checking players, who aren't even starting on the same level of equipment. I play normals. And if I die to someone creep on me - it is just another death I must learn from, lol.

[hallow flare]

I think the speed decrease was a step in the right direction, but I still think some changes need to be made. Like, if you have any plate equipped at all, it should still make some noise, but as of now it only does with the boots, which just makes plate boots bad, and encourages anyone that wears plate just to change into some sneakers 👟 and they’re good. Still has a lot of problems

[strong grotto]

Can't disagree with that. Yes, plate armor, any kind aside of helmet, should not allow you to creep. It can be easily done, if I am not mistaken.

[hallow flare]

Maybe noise needs to be tied to move speed? The more you are weighed down, the louder you are, and if you have above 300 you are silent

Has the added benefit of making smaller arms like daggers more desirable for stealth as well

Also, chase for rangers should allow you to hear anyone if they are close, unless it is a rogue with creep equipped maybe

[strong grotto]

I heard more interesting proposal - to tie the noise with how filled your inventory is. It is not only logical, but also much more interesting from the gameplay perspective. Still, no creep with plates on, if it is not a helmet.

[tall raptor]

Wizard invisibility should have after images every 2 seconds not every 1. After casting you should have 1 second then and after image then 2 seconds then an after image and then 1 seconds and it ends. As it stands now the after images are to frequent to allow for creative play against players. It feels like just a pve tool to de-agro mobs.

Also, I can't wait for monk. I'd love a deflect/catch projectiles skill. I also think it could make sense to give them a forward dash. That and some passives to help with unarmed damage and action speed and an unarmored PDR scaling for will would be perfect.

[hallow flare]

Realistically that makes sense, but I feel like that takes away from “fun factor”. If they did that, they would need to make real creep ignore it, but it doesn’t sound horrible

[hallow flare]

All they need to do is make it work like new rogue invis tbh, would trip people up more but still not be abysmal to play against

[ashen pike]

Any thoughts on having Knowledge slightly increase Buff Duration as a secondary similar to how other attributes increase secondaries, i.e. Dex += action speed, Str += Health, etc? This would at least help knowledge not be completely useless on the classes that don't scale anything from it.

[hallow flare]

Ya, it’d make + all less game breaking if everyone benefited equally from it more. Agility and dex both effect action speed, albeit less, they should do something for knowledge everyone benefits from at least a little

[quasi grove]

Maybe make the buff duration attribute more linked into Knowledge, and the debuff one more linked to Will?

[hallow flare]

Not a terrible idea, but it doesn’t solve the issue that those stats are really only useful for casters/bard. I think every stat should have some relevance to every class, at least a little. Maybe shrines could be made more powerful, but have knowledge requirements? Kinda like they did for invis pots

[oak ivy]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543257/each-empty-equipment-slot-minus-cloak-gives-a-certain-percentage-increase-to-dam

[neon zinc]

-Reduce bow/crossbow damage as same like throwable.
-Remove creep let the sounds back.

[strong grotto]

• no, git gud
• no, it needs only to be polished a bit, learn to play attentively

[hallow bronze]

add nudity

[strong grotto]

remove yourself from the game

[gusty lily]

When there is an upgrade in the squire, give us some achievement notice. Remove obsolete Items from Squire, once better grade gear is available.

[tulip venture]

I can’t wait for Druids sticky sap covered feet

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[frigid current]

@keen onyx @dawn grotto @shy fulcrum solo goblin caves feels very balanced rn appreciate yall

also the difficulty level of climbing ranks is hard enough that a solo player in demigod will actually be meaningful, which is sick

👍

[hallow bronze]

add voip to pre game

[brazen token]

Add hard-limited uses to phantomize. If rogues can't have endless smoke pots and caltrops, I don't see why a literal invulnerability skill 85% of the classes can't do anything about should have endless uses.

Ah, wait, its a warlock ability, my mistake, they aren't allowed to have weaknesses that make it seem like they're playing the same game as everyone else.

[fickle plover]

Thanks :)

[hallow flare]

If by 85% you mean only 3 classes, then sure. There are many counters to it, isn’t really a problem. You take bonus damage from magic sources, the ability shouldn’t be changed, but maybe ranger, barb, and fighter could get something to counter it

[hallow flare]

No prob 👍

[hallow flare]

I think they should add an arcane bomb, then maybe give a class “throwing weapon” mastery that makes all thrown weapons better

[sick bronze]

The Torches in the Basement of the Tavern don't have the particle effect

[tulip hill]

If any class would get a throwing weapon perk, I'd say bard or barb
Bard can already use both Fancisca and Throwing Knives, as well as having the drum to throw. Flavor the perk towards jungling or some other preformance based throwing activity
For barbarian, I'd say model it after the dungeons and dragons feat "throw anything" which normally lets you throw melee weapons as if they were meant for that, though I could see it just letting barbarian use throwing knives and drums with an extra small bonus. That said, I will still advocate for the funny but dubiously useful active skill that just chucks whatever you are holding at the enemy. Just full on throw your purple felling axe at them

[arctic flame]

there needs to be more action time on throwables, like a wind up of 1second or something. Long enough, that if you want to spam throwables, you are slowed from the windup and I get time to close the gap and clap dat ass

[abstract veldt]

@brazen token@hallow flarei didnt actually know you can deal magic dmg when they turn phantom but yeachanging it to 28 secs kames the ability whatever to me

[brazen token]

I feel my point still stands, though. I get why smoke pot was restricted to 4 uses and then nerfed even beyond that, but caltrops are basically nothing and still hard-limited. Why should phantomize, a much stronger escape tool, also be unlimited uses beyond "We don't like warlocks having restrictions or weaknesses?"

The class already has multiple ways to ignore the only weakness it was supposed to have, the hp cost on spells.

[abstract veldt]

what i want to see is warlock curse ability have a lot longer cast time or just make it just not heal as much. dumb ass spell dealing 30 health of dmg and i have over 200 mr rating. the lest fun character playstyle for me as a barb is these warlocks or just run away use firewalk, cast curse never have to fight you. just cast spells with no limit cause you know ironmace had to go and add magical healing on tons of extra armor when before wipe magic healing on a kit was really expensive and when you pulled a piece of gear that had this stat you knew that it would sell?

@tulip hill bard can use bows they dont need throwables

[hallow flare]

I mean, they shouldn’t have nerfed smoke pot so hard. Limited use abilities are all automatically bad and nobody uses them. Second wind doesn’t count because it isn’t actually limited

[tulip hill]

...they are the class with the most throwables, they even have an exclusive throwable (drum)

[tender seal]

i know right how are you supposed to SHIFT+W at things if you can't hear them through a solid stone wall or multiple closed doors talk about immersion and game breaking please remove devs

[tulip hill]

I actually quite like the compromise of it simply reducing the sound radius. I'm sure the exact range would be complained about no matter that the devs put it at, but making it a radius thing allows people to still sneak around better without allowing them to literally get within striking range with 0 sound.

Fact of the matter is, as far as sound is concerned, every class can be as quiet as a rogue which simply doesn't seem like it should be true

[abstract veldt]

On another note is the golem and worm boss ever coming back sucks that crypts is gone but what about the bosses they could showup in ruins or ice map gobby already feels like it has enough?

[worn lava]

you all got some issue a bug for the c button every time i put away my weapon i crouch i tried changing the binds or resetting them but every time i hit c i crouch the only way i should be crouching is through my side mouse button even changing the crouch button to y or z for some reason c is still crouch i have 2 crouch buttons now

[abstract veldt]

In that ice room with the lion/gold chess in the middle with the shield giant cant they make it a pit for the worm?

[tulip hill]

iirc there was once a time where a worm spawned in the GC, behind a secret door
as for bringing them back, they could throw a new icy texture on the golem for the cavern
and I feel like the worm could replace one of the centipede spawns in the GC or maybe even put it in the dark trench surrounding the middle of the old HR crypt map

[cerulean pollen]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543794/dynamic-creep-sound-reduction

thoughts?

[autumn raven]

Totally agree

[tulip hill]

plate boots do actually still make sound if I recall correctly, but 9/10 plate users will opt for different shoes. In fact, people have been choosing to wear non-plate boots well before global creep was a thing for a couple different reasons. If you really wanted to have the sound have a more dynamic range like this, I'd recommend considering all of a player's armor, not just their shoes

[fossil karma]

fix load room when moving to hell, and fix ghost king sucking when not even in boss room

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[obsidian fulcrum]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543814/ability-to-sell-entire-gearsets-on-the-market

upvote if agree

[sharp cape]

Gold storage should not cost 5x what it can hold

[frigid current]

how do yall feel about being able to change item prices after posting at no/minimal cost
unless raising price obv

[arctic flame]

Marketplace and trade hall should be abolished. Game would balance so much better, if you had to search for your BIS through many games

[half kraken]

he is playable, two crossbows, run away and shoot people, shit gameplay design but that's how hes played rn

[signal vine]

*Make crystal swords one handed, allow to have both sword and crystal ball

[somber wind]

I'd love to see a map where it's gimmick is it's randomly generated instead of being hand made. Could have a zone similar to Ice Caves to make it less of a problem that no one knows the map.

[tiny patio]

Allow cleanse to work on bosses again, it makes the bossed easier for more casual players wanting to boss. Yes I am bad at bossing and need the crutch

[languid spoke]

make normals solo self found only. two matchmaking buckets: normal mode = neophyte-apprentice, high roller = wanderer-demigod. when an item is put on the market place or traded it should get a new status: "Traded" and not be allowed into that mm pool

[frigid current]

uhhhh this is a terrible idea

[ebon needle]

It'd be nice to have a way to track quests while in the dungeon. Even if you can only track a couple at a time.

[frigid current]

^this is solid af

[brave magnet]

get rid of creep please, it doesn't make sense

[granite plinth]

An option to limit the amount of packets you can send would be game-changing for me as my wifi is really bad.
Valorant has an option called Network Buffering that does it. There could be 4 different options, Off, Minimal, Moderate, and Maximum.
I feel like this would be an awesome addition that people would love especially if they normally have high ping.

[icy spindle]

They should add a new NPC called the Bounty Hunter or Bounty Board where u can collect soul hearts of players and trade them for gold or even gear

[tulip hill]

Did a little research as to how it works and it seems like it would be a neat addition
if your network gets bottlenecked you can start dropping packets which will cause desynch and rubber banding
the network buffer holds onto packets and basically throttles your data so it doesn't lose anything
so average ping might go up for people using it but it should limit how many lag spikes the user experiences
very neat and probably a good addition given how many people are still reporting network issues

[granite plinth]

ya, and also it could limit the things that are generated. Like maximum could just be it only renders in essentials. NPCS, the dungeon ofc, chests, people, etc. No debris or any extra stuff. like me personally i dont care about how good the game looks or any of that. I just wanna stab goblins and go through it and have fun without rubberbanding every few secs and alt + f4ing due to crappy internet

In Valorant i've always got it set to the maximum and it makes me go from it being unplayable due to internet to it being actually playable

[light hound]

It kinds of makes sense though

[sharp cape]

explain how

[sharp cape]

fix the 180 clockwise spin cyclops does with his overhead swing when youre behind him its just a guaranteed insta kill

[light hound]

Because space is valuable, so the price is reflecting the value and convenience of the stash space you save, rather than the gold it can hold. (Of course scarcity plays a roll, which depends on crafting/drop difficulty)

1 gold coin bag is equal to saving 16 stash slots, which provides room for 3~5 pieces of gear. The value of being able to hold a few more pieces to sell on marketplace or to use as backup gear can have significant value.

Alongside that, the gold requirement to get more stash tabs effectively requires gold coin bags to avoid wasting a bunch of stash space that could otherwise be productive.

So in short, the value of the bag is not just what it can hold, but the amount of space it can free up and their neccesity for stash upgrades - players are setting a price they are willing to pay for that privledge. I am happily paying 5k+ per bag to avoid handling hundreds of coin purses clogging up my stash.

[light hound]

I don't blame people for thinking this, but the real-world effect would be the exact opposite.

Making getting gear harder only results in a larger gear disparity

[sharp cape]

its essentially a golden key at the point its at now. it is gold storage it is literally a bag it should not cost 5k gold coins

[light hound]

"Should not"? What do you mean by that.

It's a player driven economy

[sharp cape]

its driven by scarcity which is entirely decided by the devs

[light hound]

Well they've said plenty of times that they want space to be scarce and hard to come by

[sharp cape]

yet they just added more stashes which might i add are more cost effective for storing gold than actual gold storage items are

[light hound]

Well then, there's your solution I guess

[sharp cape]

i dont have a problem so i dont need a solution

[light hound]

Well you were saying gold storage costing 5x is too much

[sharp cape]

yeah but for the feel of the game not for my own sake
im fine with just using them like keys, i loved the golden key hoarding days

[light hound]

Okay, but then you're speaking from two sides. You're speaking for the unnamed majority that it's bad, then saying it's fine for you

A bit confusing

[sharp cape]

youre putting words in my mouth i never said im speaking for anyone i just gave my opinion

[light hound]

Then what do you mean by "feel of the game" that could only indicate you mean for other people, since it doesn't mean you

[sharp cape]

it feels unnatural for a bag to cost more than a whole set of gear and equipment
i just gave my opinion that i think it should feel more realistic
plus id IMAGINE that the average player gets very annoyed with having to spend so much just to store 1k when trying to make room for buying stuff and stashes

[light hound]

Okay, so in short: it messes with your immersion - make them easier to get so the price is reasonable

I'm not sure if the craft is available yet, but I'm sure the price will drop naturally as more are crafted

[sharp cape]

the craft is available but despite the pelts being more common than last wipe they cost wayyyyyyy more

[light hound]

The bags don't disappear, so as long as people get their 5-10 bags, they'll stop buying them and the prices will drop

Might like to see it drop earlier in a wipe maybe

[sharp cape]

shit thats actually a really good point and makes me want to sell my bags
even then it adds to my point
some people (me) are annoyed with the drops in value of their items and would rather be allowed to just store gold and not worry

[light hound]

Probably a good time if you don't need em

[sharp cape]

sorry idk why im editing instead of just sending messages

[woeful parcel]

Warlock should not be able to beat a fighter that is in full plate with a dagger its getting old. What is the point of even having a fighter class if a warlock can ware full plate us a dagger and beat you down with ease? Maybe nerf the scaling of blow of corruption instead of taking 5 damage off of it might help.

[strong grotto]

Shhhh!!! Don't do that! Do not talk bad things about favorite class of IMace! You will be banned!
We are not allowed to talk crap about warlocks and barbarians!

[sacred turret]

Please reverse crouch move speed reduction. Fighting mobs (indigo, Berserker, Centaur, axeman, Frost Giant Berserker) is now significantly harder (too hard)

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[faint dirge]

You do not need to crouch for majority of the listed mobs
Or move while crouching

[strong grotto]

You actually do need it to dodge their attacks. Like to dodge berserker you need to crouch + look down and move to the side his swing starts, so his attack passes over you. I can see how people with lower movement speed would suffer given crouch speed being nerfed.

[faint dirge]

You need to crouch and look down, the movespeed does not matter for this

For centaur axe skele frost giant you never need to move and crouch and for berserker i am 50% sure you can just stand and walk left/right

[strong grotto]

You are wrong. You need to move or you will get hit. It is the minus of such... Limited fighting system we have in the game. You literally have to find breaches in mob's movement. And most of those breaches either require you to turn into a ball or to crouch. I hate it, really...

[faint dirge]

On the berserker? Or every mob?

[sacred turret]

You need crouch to dodge all the listed mobs, also you need crouch movement in fights, to dodge arrows and spells. My making crounch soo incredibly slow they killed like 30-40% of movement skill in this game

[strong grotto]

What he says: "You need crouch to dodge all the listed mobs, also you need crouch movement in fights, to dodge arrows and spells. My making crounch soo incredibly slow they killed like 30-40% of movement skill in this game"

[sacred turret]

The solution would be to make the Shift movement silent and slow and crouch movement loud but as fast as it was

[faint dirge]

The ms reduction does not matter when you can stand still while crouching

But the pvp take is 100% valid

[strong grotto]

The solution is to change this outdated fighting system in general. And I have a proposal how. That will eliminate the stupidity of crouch dodging.
Devs need to implement this: https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/493924/melee-and-ranged-battle-system-improvement
And this: https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/488817/weapon-on-weapon-collision
Do that and the game will become 1000% better.

[sacred turret]

Wow, deep content) will look after. Thanks everybody for engaging and casting some light on this problem

[strong grotto]

Just upvote the suggestions. It is really the only way us, lowly players, can ever knock to those devs on top of the Hill, hoping they will isten and not just railroad game into disaster out of pride.

[north violet]

Make the game more hardcore take off the map in HR

[vocal lodge]

still cant equip heavy gambeson as cloth with slayer perks! man they cant even test that shit!

CANT EQUIP HEAVY GAMBESON WITH SLAYER PERK!

ret@rds

[strong grotto]

Sure, because nothing brings more people in HR, as locking it behind countless hours of memorizing rooms, that are constantly changed with every update. Brilliant idea. Instead of contributing with interesting mechanic you are just removing things. The things that were never a hindrance in the first place. You should go work in government with such ideas. Will fit just right.

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[tulip hill]

counter point
even if rogue isn't powerful atm, there are still people who enjoy the playstyle its perks and skills allow
I for one love being a little rat bastard pickpocketing trios when my friends aren't online

[frigid current]

rogue can deal an insane amount of burst damage
you need to play smart as a rogue, and it has high potential

[runic night]

Dude rogue is in a great spot. Yes you have to play smart and out play people. You can’t just charge in and insta kill everyone. You still can with some classes but rogue is still strong if you know how to utilize the movement speed. Cutthroat is super strong and then ambush with hide is kinda a better version of sprint from fighter at the moment.

This game makes it so that some classes are easy to beat depending on your class and setup while the others are still harder but still killable. That’s balancing for you and it’s in a pretty good spot except warlock probably is on the stronger side at the moment.

[tulip hill]

ngl bro, barbarian is probably the worst example you could use there
yes, the ambush class isn't good in a straight forward 1v1 against the class that is specialized in melee combat
what are you expecting from that match up?

[frigid current]

this is a rock paper scissors class counter style game, so that does make sense
this appears to be a personal skill issue

being unable to kill a "base kit barb" with your "full rogue kit" 100% implies that you just need to get better

[runic night]

Base kit barb shouldn’t stand a chance even if you run straight at him. Maybe you’re missing because you should still be able to kill the barb in 4-5 stabs and he should not be able to hit you twice before that. But to be safe you should still play smart and get a couple crossy shots off.

[frigid current]

https://imgur.com/GqDQo5O

my point being that you can't kill a "base kit barb" as a "full kit rogue"
nothing more needs to be said lol, practice up dude

[stable granite]

Hey guys any chance we can get a Bard # discord chat????

@gentle blade

[gentle blade]

Get yourself the role -> id:customize

[frigid current]

<@&988703997378584596> !

OH SNAP <@&988703997378584596>

[tulip hill]

regardless of any person's sensitivity to insults, I don't think it wise to break the rules a second time in response to the first time being pointed out
that's basically asking to be punished

[frigid current]

super sensitive to insults, bro hurt me deeply and must be punished

[arctic flame]

lol y’all need to stop arguing I blocked jizzames a while ago. Just block the idiot

[vestal oasis]

i think you blocked the wrong dude my guy, he is absolutely right with what he is saying

[arctic flame]

Don’t remember why, just noticed someone arguing with someone I blocked lol. Sorry I didn’t read the covveraatioj

[tulip hill]

I don't even know what the argument is, I just prefer civil conversation and Aye is being unwise with their language
if Jizzames truly is the problem in the situation, it is still not Aye's job to bully the problem away

[arctic flame]

Yeah yeah

[vestal oasis]

it's about whether or not rogue is playable

[frigid current]

the worst thing i said in this situation is that if you're unable to kill a base kit barb with full kit rogue, you'll need to practice more
bro got deeply offended and resorted to insults

[tulip hill]

ah, yes, I weighed in with a counterpoint earlier on that. Surprised such a simple topic could get so heated

[frigid current]

Aye in mid-match vs barb: https://medal.tv/games/dark-and-darker/clips/25CucCZYX7Rhtu/QogpreWE91Uh?invite=cr-MSxUTDMsMjIwMjI0MDc0LA

[torn hazel]

guys nerf warlock

[tulip hill]

anyone else find it strange that Rogue has not one, but three perks that only interact with the Hide skill?
like, I know Ambush/Shadow Runner was getting abused using invis pots and that's why it was change to be Hide only
but from a conceptual level, I find it weird that a perk requires a specific skill to do anything

Needing spell memory is a bit more understandable since that is basically a customizable skill, but even then I kinda hope they add more spell like skills to the casters that can interact with their perks

[normal robin]

Would you mind taking a look at this and giving us an upvote if you have the time and agree with the suggestion? Any upvotes would be greatly appreciated. https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/542961/green-gear-in-normals-or-a-seperate-queue-for-green-gear

[steady harness]

a chat called stash for sexy stash tabs

[whole furnace]

can someone give me best spells for warlock w 9 spell cpacity begginner

[tacit plume]

nerf being naked

[winter wadi]

pls let us get AP from gear we loot of pvp klls

[light hound]

If you're going spellcaster - curse of pain, lifedrain

[raw fractal]

I would not recommend using spells when you only have 9 spell capacity, better to go BoC with phantomize or bloodpact

If you can get to 11 you could go hydra + life drain + curse of pain

[astral warren]

revert crouch slow changes and make creep only work on slow walk (shift)

[lament sequoia]

Suggest letting players leave lobbies with penalty but keep kits cause sometiems we accidently go in with wrong kit

[feral condor]

bring back map rotation

[uncut pivot]

Best classes

[jovial swan]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/544108/ambush-needs-a-rework

Tl;dr: Ambush should work like Barbarian's Berserker perk while Rogue is under the effects of Hide, but requires Hide Mastery on top to gain its fullest effects.

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[civic zodiac]

goblin merchant should have more item to gamble and gamble should have a small chance of legendary for gold sink purpose.

the best way to stop inflation imo is by gambling. rn gold is too easy to get

[ripe turtle]

Ignore Pain perk for Barbarian - Whenever you get hit by an attack, you wont slow down. 3 second cooldown.

[strong grotto]

So you want to make class that is already a menace and hard to fight or run away in melee to be even MORE hard to runaway or beat in melee? Tel me you play barbarian withou telling it, lol.

[tame dome]

suggestion. everyone agrees with me. no debating. REMOVE UNIVERSAL CREEP. thank you for coming to my TED Talk

[upper hearth]

I think we could all agree to atleast add a "ARE YOU SURE?" button when not having the max amount of players in a mode or not picking the lowest ping region. Sometimes the game gets quirky or you make a stupid mistake.

[noble birch]

• All rolls should be removed, max dmg rolls should be +2.
  Fights already end in 1-2 taps and they consider 2x headshots to lower TTK from 2-3 sec to 0.5 ?

[solemn grail]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/544125/highroller-rewards-for-everyone-through-ingame-time-instead-of-earning-aps

I already lost 2 keyboards

[ripe turtle]

A menace? Get outta here. Barbs have been nerfed to the ground and these kiting classes have been buffed to the roof.

[strong grotto]

Suuuuure... Class, that wields most heavy hitting melee weapons, have move speed out of their arse, has the most HP, was also the primary reason throwing weapons was nerfed, BTW, is somehow struggles? Sorry, but I can't shed a tear for that. They are still an absolute power house in melee. And we weren't talking about any kitting, mate.

[ripe turtle]

Yeah...they are absolute power houses, are you kidding here! Sure with the right gear and team they are a threat to cloth/leather classes. In solos? They are the running target dummies right now! What is good with all that strength and power if you can't catch your enemy?! Especially Rangers and Warlocks are the actual MENACE here! They just spam their spells and shoot arrows and there is no penalty for just cheesing melee classes. All you gotta do is just jump back sideways and repeat your spam just like in FPS shooter games! It's stupid, waste of time and straight up unbalanced!

[strong grotto]

I can agree with warlock bit, but not with rangers. Also, mate, if you can't catch someone - that is your problem. I get smacked by barbarians all the time. And I play bard most of the time. Equip some throwables and learn how to ambush people.

[sullen heart]

Why are you guys even wasting time trying to balance classes when the most important thing in this game is the gear difference?

[strong grotto]

Because, while I agree with the "gear difference" statement, any gear is just a multiplier of what class is able of. Sure, geared in gold ranger will two shot you with longbow using quick shot skill. But what allows him to wield that longbow in the first place and utilize quick shot? Fact, that he is the ranger. Same with any other class. Gear is important, but class balance lies in the core of every problem with gear.

[tulip hill]

Gear difference most definitely has a larger impact on the outcome of a fight, even in situations where it doesn't enable a win (how long it takes and how many resources are burned because of the fight are also important to acknowledge, not just who died)
but given you have to pick a class before you start equipping gear and some classes get more value from a given piece of gear than others, its important to have all the classes balanced before addressing gear difference
you wouldn't adjust the position of the top of the stack when the base is in the wrong spot, otherwise you'll just have to move the top again later

[sullen heart]

If all of the ranger enjoyers don't care about optimizing their gear and all wizard players are the most tryhard gear enjoyers, then your experience in the dungeon will be that wizard counters ranger.

Gear diff is too important for anything else to matter, it throws everything off.

[outer lotus]

Please make quests account wide and not per character. Then add class specific quests making us play all characters to complete the quests. Who the hell got time to finish quests on all characters

[granite plinth]

Streamers duh

[feral shadow]

Bards pecemaking should stop spells within the AoE. It doesnt make sense how it says all players and monsters lose the will to fight yet a wizard can still blast you with a fireball.

[tulip hill]

I remember testing this out a while back but forget the results
is it that if they have already started casting they can finish or does it not work on spells at all?

[proper hull]

Biscuits should be removed from ranger, go back to giving them a free campfire. You can tell someone important plays solo ranger.

[lavish jewel]

Remove norms and HR and put them together kinda like EFF you can go in with gear or loot it. Also if the maps were bigger and had more people but spawning more modules away it would allow people to loot up and fight first which I think would be overall better for game state

[feral shadow]

ive seen them start the cxast before then shoot it during but my freind says it just doesnt affect spells

[tulip hill]

hmm, I can see why it might be coded that way, several spells are not attacks, but in that case they should make it so offensive spells are not castable

[feral shadow]

thats what im saying

[tulip hill]

Someone once suggested making it so the global creep only makes you silent outside of a specific radius, with rogue's creep perk getting rid of that radius
so like, walking would be silent to anyone outside of say 10 meters, enough to stalk or sneak, but not enough to get right behind someone

[hallow flare]

I’d prefer this tbh, what is the point of making rogue weaker then the other classes if they can’t do anything special

[tulip hill]

yeah, its kinda funny that because of global creep, every class can be just as quiet as a rogue

its like back in the Invis Ignite meta, wizard was legitimately a better assassin than rogue because he had just as effective sneak attack but could force his way into your backline, you didn't even have to walk forward to get assassinated by a wizard

[mossy kettle]

they should change warlock power of sac to curse of power and have it give dex and str instead of str and vig and do the same DoT

[tulip hill]

I mean, a 30% boost to your creep speed is nothing to scoff at, but it rarely makes the difference between passing and failing a given task, just kinda nice to have

[hazy sphinx]

it will be nice if bard piercing skill works on training dummies

[hallow flare]

I think barb for example is still the better sneaking class because you don’t have to get as close. You can just creep up to them with a Fran out and close the distance when they see you. Rogue however needs to land as many headshots as possible before they are seen to successfully ambush someone

[tulip hill]

I wouldn't say barb is the better sneaker, they just don't lose as much value from failing to sneak. The TTK between the two of them isn't too far from each other when the ambush is successful, the rogue just has a lot more to lose if the ambush doesn't work out. Because when you get outdueled by almost every other class, you have to play like crazy or stay out of reach if you get caught

I fully understand each nerf rogue catches, a lot of the time its getting rid of a very unfun to fight aspect of them
but its rogue, dirty tricks are half the archetype's identity, you gotta replace the dirty tricks with something else if you want them gone

[hallow flare]

Some of them hurt other things too much. Other classes were already not using the hand crossbow at all, now with the damage change that’ll definitely stay the same. I think they should’ve reduced the weight to compensate for the damage reduction

[somber notch]

invisibility potion should allow 10 steps for rogues with the perk

[round knoll]

Lower overall all damage output to have longer drawn out fights vs a high dmg fight that results in 1-2 hits then being KO'd. Suggestion Grey-Whites highest dmg output is 20 dmg. With health is dmg resist being so low its hard to have more engaging fights

[white spoke]

Currently im a solo trying to do the fortune teller alter quest and ive invited a bunch of people in the player list and got one and offered an item for them helping with the quest but im worried about the giving items to people thing from early dark and darker i was thinking they could do like a guild hiring thing for adventuring like in the market place i dont know how they would implement it cause people wanna do specific stuff but like for quest

[somber wind]

Thoughts on special uniques that can only be gotten via the Goblin Merchant? Weaker passives than normal uniques but still that rarity with a passive. They would be in addition to existing uniques.

[tulip venture]

Stinky stick is such a meme it should already be like that

[somber wind]

Yeah I'd be fine with Stinky Stick being a Goblin Merchant unique and us getting something else on the main tables for that weapon.

[unborn yacht]

warlock op, hey devs why can they still solo wipe everybody they should require at least some degree of skill to use not be able to just W and left click everybody to death

[light hound]

If they're w-keying you to death, I'm curious in what scenario it is happening.

Are you playing solos or with a team.

[unborn yacht]

normies trios

[light hound]

Oh, gotcha. Yeah, normals I have no idea about

Not that way in HR

[unborn yacht]

yeah, i was a fully geared fighter can me alone can hardly even take a quater of their health in that form and it took my entire team hitting him simultainisouly only to bring him down to 60% before we all dead

[light hound]

Is this demon form or kris?

[unborn yacht]

demon form

[light hound]

Yeah, the all stat and healing scales the best when everyone is in base kit.

It falls off completely in HR, so not sure how they can balance that while making it viable in HR - unless they swap to a type of % scaling for skills and spells

[unborn yacht]

i think hunting trap and run like hell or attempt to block until its over is only viable option against it in normies, or just hope your lucky and they get really low on health before they get into the form

[light hound]

Typically he has one chance to make use of the 10 stack shards, so if you kite him while he's taking passive dmg, he'll be forced to turn it off and the fight is more manageable

[unborn yacht]

oki

[molten flower]

Please bring back Ruins. Best map has been gone too long.

[civic zodiac]

push matchmaking forward even if its not flawless. being force to do crypt/inferno quest as a solo is extremely annoying.

also quest are nice i would like to have way more of them BUT having them accountwise. doing them twice is not fun. having many to have is a great way to keep having goals while having a accomplishment feeling.

[strong grotto]

For that to happen there must be more people playing. We have one less map and no option to chose what map to play solo/duo/trio, because online is too low for that kind of player separation.

[strong grotto]

True... Still can't kill those two demon bats, it drives me crazy... If I am able to go to hell solo - there is not one to be find. And most of the time I am simply stomped by teams.

[civic zodiac]

been working hard last 2 day to get quest done. gave up on hell untill i got team its just a waste of time to try to get these lucky runs without getting annoyed by others... missing bat gold ore and waiting room also.

[strong grotto]

It is the 1st quest I have to do for tailor merchant. The second is to kill 5 bards and 5 rangers. Developers can screw themselves if they think those are good quests. Pure RNG, I only was able to kill 2 rangers, I've never met a single bard on my way in the dungeon, and to kill those 2 demon bats I must ALSO rely on luck to not only survive the castle, but also on RNG to meet those demon bats in Hell!
Absolute crap quest design.

[civic zodiac]

i mean. pvp quest are fine as long they are on a different bracket and not block normal questline progression. also hard endgame quest like hell... if theres a matchmaking... cuz without it rn solo players having a hard time its not worth completing them at all.

[strong grotto]

It is not PvP that I am against. I am against specific class hunt. It is pure RNG.

[marble peak]

Demonform claw attacks are not reaching cylops hitbox during rockfall

[marble peak]

counterplay to demonform in normals is just close 3 doors on them before you take the fight. they burn themselves half to death everytime.

[strong grotto]

And what counterplay for DoT damage that kills you with one application of curse? The damage that also heals the warlcok, btw.

Warlocks became the best class in game. Totally universal. Can tank, can spank, can cast, has escapes, damage, healing all the checkboxes.
In fact, I believe, that only thing able to balance him out now, without reworking bunch of spells, is to rework his healing from the "instances of damage dealt" to "based on % of HP after target dies".

[molten flower]

Disagree. They can add it back to the crypts as a starting point. Trio players complained it took to long to boss. Most people don't boss. Give us Ruins.

[fast hill]

Locking Regions

Some sort of system so 2 Neophytes aren’t put into a game against a Neophyte + Exemplar

[strong grotto]

And then they've added quests. Now I need to kill those 2 trice damned demon bats i can't either find or survive to get to in hell. Do you want us to go through TWO additional maps before we can finish quest, nay have a CHANCE to finish quest? HELL NO!

[molten flower]

Yea for the 10% of people going to hell i do. Need stats that they do not give us.

[fast hill]

Loot filter

[ripe yoke]

stop letting rogues and barbs go in with 15 throwing axes and knives lower it to 2

[lament sequoia]

Nerf rogue and nerf fighter free 50 ms .... lmao makes tottal sense for a fighter in heavy gear to catch up with someone with cloth..... also cooldown is way to short for such a good ability nerf cooldown or something cause damn feels like a bunch of man babies balancing this game ...

make it where crossbow cannot be equiped by fighter unless they bring the one perks that allows you to wield anything simple fix to plate fighters running around with bis crossbows and playing csgo

Makes it more viable to have ranger to come along lmao

Maybe make sprint a 30 second cooldown that way it be way more punishing if they just spam it

[jovial swan]

I think it's about time we talk about:
-Reworking Ambush completely to be 5% starting physical power that grows by 1% per second while in Hide.
-Reducing Ambush's move speed bonus to 5%.
-Re-adding Hand Crossbow Mastery as a perk but without the +2 weapon damage aspect or making it so that Hand Crossbows can't be paired with other weapons.

[strong grotto]

Sadly - it is not going to happen. You simply can't restrict people from buying their consumables. The only way to do so would be:
Option one - limit your starting equipment load. Introduce the load limit to your backpack to prevent throwable stack meta.
Option two - limit throwables for ONE utility slot only and prevent access to your equipment if you were received damage or done damage yourself in past 10 seconds. That will not only remove the axe/knife stacking from happening, but will also prevent people from constantly refilling those from inventory.

[strong grotto]

1. reasonable.
2. stupid.
3. even more stupid.

[ripe yoke]

What if they made a movement speed penalty similar to having a survival bow out

[strong grotto]

Won't change anything. Yes, you are slower. You still chuck out those axes. No. It should be hard block from accessing your inventory in the fight. It is also reasonable, because no one would allow you to just dig in your backpack during fight, lmao!

[jovial swan]

Yeah I'm definitely convinced on the idea that Bard's debuffs need cooldowns at least. I feel like 45 seconds would be a good starting point.

[calm sedge]

QoL update to instantly jump to particular items on the marketplace

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/544480/add-a-view-on-market-button

[midnight flame]

so the anti-cheat not working?

[light hound]

What makes you say that

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[upper hearth]

The devs primarily rely on reports, I'd say there are probably 10x more hackers than anyone expects, it's just pve hacks. I know on OCE it was common to spectate someone killing an entire room of pve in 3 swings.

[dull sinew]

🥛 https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/482571/add-milk-to-the-game

[balmy finch]

ADD SOUND WHEN PLAYERS JUMP IN THE WATER THAT IS HEARD ABOVE AND BELOW THE WATER

[cursive sluice]

How about they remove body block from spiders. Got pinned to a wall while 3 people ran in...

[ripe yoke]

set magic missle base damage to 4 each hit

[cursive sluice]

minimizing body rotation while hitting, spinning players all over and jumping while hitting heavy weapons should lead to inaccuracy

[worn lava]

fix the surgeon sanctified healing quest I've interacted with 4 health shrines does not complete

[unborn terrace]

have to be the first one to use them

[tidal seal]

#bringjumpsitback

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[last gull]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/544583/5th-perk-slot

[unborn yacht]

this was the only solution i could think of and started deploying this tactic just before reading this, thx for re-assuring me

[untold wyvern]

What if when you take a teammates soul ( like if you cant rez em or somthin) out of the game and then the dead player doesn't lose ap?

[next tangle]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/544594/cyclops-rock-fall IM prob wont pay attention to shit like this but fuck the cyclops rock fall

[tulip hill]

I would be interested in more interactions with the soul heart, but removing the AP cost for the run seems like a strange one

[untold wyvern]

@tulip hill what would you like to see?

[next tangle]

let me sell peoples souls for gold

[untold wyvern]

That and or using it for a quest item would be cool

[next tangle]

nah i just wanna sell the souls of my victims in ice caves

[untold wyvern]

lol

[tulip hill]

well with quest to use a shrine of sacrifice several times, it made me wish there was some way you could sacrifice an enemy's heart
my idea was to have fully wiped teams have their hearts unlocked and able to be sacrificed for some kind of benifit (along with progressing the quest)

[untold wyvern]

ooo what if warlocks, clerics, or druids could sacrifice the souls for a buff

[next tangle]

warlock soul succ

[tulip hill]

I don't see why make it an exclusive mechanic to any given class, though I could see a perk doing something similar

and actually, I could totally see a Warlock spell similar to Cleric's Resurrection that eats the soul instead
a long cast channel to permanently kill the target while also getting some kind of buff
though I feel like a lot of people would hate that mechanic

hmm, maybe not a buff, but rather a big heal, that seems more on brand and a good way to recover after a fight

[next tangle]

mmmm tasty soul

[foggy sun]

add the option for name changes

[zealous cipher]

please add a stealth mechanic against the mobs. it would be nice if they had a line of sight and it would be possible to sneak past them. the mob combat is so tedious and boring.

[foggy sun]

or just add wandering monsters

[woeful parcel]

Make warlock lose more health for spamming hydra put a health lose multiplier on it up to 2 or 3 stacks

[coarse elm]

Creep is terrible for every CLASS fix it

[gilded ether]

Id like to see some inscriptions here and there in the dungeons, would be a start for lore. Could be advices on bosses mechanics, tips to get to secret areas, infos about the dungeon and its dwellers etc

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[atomic yacht]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/544633/gloveless-glove-skin

[tulip hill]

what an odd request
and if its only client side, sure why not

[atomic yacht]

hey man
sick lizard claws >>>>> dinky gloves

[tulip hill]

have you seen Warlock's demon hands?

[atomic yacht]

hng have i hnnnngg

[wanton flame]

you must be disabled right?

walking away from the music man too hard? hell dont even get close its pretty easy to find where they are

[lone plaza]

Stricter pinglock on OCE, tighten ping range to sub 125ms

[feral plinth]

servers so infested in the AM

xaiopi dingyae jaemi crap on US

[lone plaza]

thats all times in oce, its just chinese gold farmers

[small ibex]

please buff the spear

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[small ibex]

Take creep out of this game immediately or at least make it to where barbs cant creep. Creeping barb is actually the most terrifying and broken meta I've ever seen in this game. Why on earth does the powerhouse class now have the ability to walk up behind me without making a single sound and double roar me. I've also gotten away with using creep to absolutely destroy squads as fighter. It's not a good mechanic, all this has done for the game is add way too much paranoia.

[iron palm]

green items currently have no place in the game. dont allow them to have +2 all and increase normal cap to greens

[random junco]

Make random stats on gear depending on item tier. As example like green no all blue all+1 epic +2 leg and uniq +3. Also i would love to see range of roll on item when i hold alt key like in path of exile.

[feral plinth]

on the contrary, I'd say limit +2 all to ONLY greens and get away from this cancer meta of +all stacking that didn't work last time and doesn't work this time

[random junco]

Mayby instead of +all make dual stat? Like +1 up +3 to will and knowledge / strenght and vigor / dex and agility / resourcfullnes and luck

[wet onyx]

Dungeon fishin

[tulip venture]

There is a module with a dock please let me fish off it 🎣

It’s literally called fishing grounds

[wet onyx]

yes yes yes yes yes yes

[wise walrus]

I have a fantastic idea lets put all atts on everything.

[jovial swan]

walks away from music man
puts music man in his most advantageous state to make more music
or have music man continue to follow you until his music spam inevitably hits you
lose unless you out-gear him or he makes too many mistakes, or actually have a ranged option that's worth half a damn

[wanton flame]

see now Einstein maybe you hit him while hes playing said music

also there are like 4 bard players so like its pretty clear you just have 0 clue what your doing cause youve fought like 4 bards ever

complaining about bards using their songs is like complaining about clerics using their buffs. no shit you arent going to stat check a fully buffed guy 🤯 bards cant break doors try closing one and making distance

man you are cooking up something here

[jovial swan]

Clearly you've never played against Bard considering how fast they can actually play their music in combat. If you're lucky, they'll have fully popped Shriek of Weakness by the time you've finally approached them (because they have the Performance perk at minimum), and if you just narrowly avoided being hit by it, then you can expect them to chase you with it until they inevitably hit it.

And hey, good luck going against a Bard through doors, too. It's not like they have the equipment or resourcefulness to just continue chasing you swiftly, or the music to still hit you through the walls (with either a debuff OR the rare attack).

[wanton flame]

I PLAY BARD

[wanton flame]

THEREFORE IM QUITE AWARE OF HIS WEAKNESSES

[jovial swan]

And yet you somehow don't know that you can just spam debuffs freely on your opponent with no counterplay to it? Be for real.

[wanton flame]

do said debuffs damage you?

no! infact all it does is reduce your ar by around 30 and power by 5 i think

and the slow debuff got nerfed like 2 updates ago to -10 movespeed (not even worth using anymore)

your entire argument here is that bards can use songs and not that songs are op

[jovial swan]

Yeah and that's actually a lot more than you think. Reducing physical power by 5 is pretty huge, and armor rating by 30 makes you less tanky.

And it takes, at base 3 seconds (without the performance perk) to complete and get a perfect on. At extremely high gear, you can expect this to pop in 1.5 seconds. With no cooldown. With high range. And don't get me started on their persuasiveness.

[wanton flame]

buddy that does jack shit unless your in starter gear..... wait i see your issue here

maybe save up like 2-3k gold and buy a kit that isnt from the squire and you might have a better shot!

[jovial swan]

You have got to be the single most arrogant prick I've seen on this server for you to assume that.

[wanton flame]

you have to be the single most idiotic person I've seen on here (this is a lie actually but your up there)

unfortunently the collector beats you out there so you really just have nothing going for yourself

please do me and the rest of the world a favor and actually get good at the game before you start complaining about things that do not need changed

[lament sequoia]

esp cheaters on westcoast

[coarse elm]

NO MORE CREEEEP GET IT OUT

[ripe yoke]

rogues fighting backwards throwing knives for ten minutes is the dumbest thing they ever let happen

[weak zenith]

Ive said it before and ill say it again
Even as a bard player i think its bad design that missing a note skips to the next note in a song. It just means everyone runs charismatic and has half casting speed for the same buff. Being able to skip notes like that encorages you to miss notes which is just backwards for having a rythm minigame at all

[pure basin]

Add some purge abilities to counter giga buff please.

[weak zenith]

I think the debuffs are fine as is, i just think its annoying that that is how bard is played, if you hear a bard playing a full song you assume theyre a noob because they dont know how strong skipping can be

[cedar totem]

Bard loses most 1v1s with equal gear, and bard has way more stats to dump into than, say, a barb

you need dex, knowledge, str, resourcefulness etc

+2 All is what makes endgame bard OP, that stat roll should never have been brought back imo

[kindred phoenix]

Add tin foil hats as in game item

[abstract veldt]

@feral plinth exactly all atribute didnt work last time and its horrble for the game again

[light hound]

To make +2 all a more comparable statline, I suggest bumping up the stat ranges of the alternative rolls on Chest and Leg pieces (perhaps necklaces as well) by around +25~+40%

The stats would then be comparable when building for a specific purpose:

+2 all (not considering quality of life stats)=
4hp
2 speed
2 phys/magic power
2 Dex/knowledge (attack speed)

Revised stats=
10 HP (from 6)
or
25 armor (6%~7% pdr) - from 20
or
8 Physical power (from 5)
or
7 move speed (from 5)
or
5 Dex (from 3)

etc.

[outer lotus]

Make quests account wide and add class specific quests, aint no way im requesting on another class, feels like a big ole waste of time

[ivory quartz]

there is no need, the purpose of the +2all is to be overpowered compared to other rolls. It is intended to be a god roll that bumps the value of an item significantly when it is hit.

[light hound]

Is it? That sounds like a pretty unfounded assumption - where did they indicate that

[late dock]

Give windlass a CS AWM like boom sound when you fire it please

[ivory quartz]

I would simply look at the fact, that they continually re-add the enchantment, despite the consistent backlash too it. This game was not originally designed to be balanced.

[fossil agate]

eny1 having issues with the launcher size and 3 minutes loading before character selection?

[fickle plover]

Warlocks need to be nerfed below the ground. They can wear the heaviest of armors, outdamage a Ranger at mid range with hitscan abilities, and can then switch to massive two-handers with blow of corruption that'll chunk 50%+ of your health in one hit. Where the fuck is their weakness? They're insanely imbalanced.

[somber wind]

I think people don't realize that with the increase to minimum armor rating, more magic resist diversity and gear quality on avg. being higher than it's not that bad to exist. Ideally it's less prevalent but it's not in a bad spot right now, it's just boring for build variety. I'd say All Stat should be inherent on gear only, never rolled so they can actually balance gear around having it.

[ivory quartz]

As I said the purpose of the enchantment is to just have an objectively amazing roll, so that you can feel really good about finding the item off some creature you kill. It

[ivory quartz]

I'm curious on that myself, it seems like Warlocks got buffed really hard. Right now it looks like they can kind of do everything. I'm curious if they start to fall off at high gear play

[somber wind]

I feel like it'd be less offensive to add something like Nioh's Star Rarity versions of modifiers (If you don't know it, Star Rarity in Nioh is just a Rare version of modifiers that use the Max roll as it's minimum roll and has a higher Max roll). I feel like it's less offensive because all stat is wacky.

[ivory quartz]

That sounds like a good idea, I think they had something similar in diablo, That might honestly work better. The only issue I can imagine is if you roll that nioh rarity on a shitty stat. In which case it will feel really bad.

[somber wind]

Something that might be worth adding also from Nioh is color rarities to rolled modifiers so All Stat could be rarer and have it be visible that it's rare. It'd also open up space for adding more niche modifiers that would otherwise flood the pool. So there could be extra rare modifiers that are good for very specific things.

[boreal lantern]

Can we make it so we are able to sort by multiple secondary stat rolls in the marketplace? if i remember correctly we used to be able to do that in the old chat-based trade system and I wish it was possible in the new one.

[light pebble]

when multiclassing comes out they really should wipe all the classes and we just have one character to branch into other abilitys

[unborn yacht]

all abilities used in pre lobby should be restored, it hurts when your a fighter and phat finger your second wind, its surprising this hasn;t already been implemented yet

[light pebble]

me campfiring in the lobby

[unborn yacht]

xd

[light hound]

Warlocks are pretty bad in trios, and questionably too strong in solos (taking into account proper counterplay and a decent gear level), and pretty solid in Duos I think

The main issues appears to be when a BOC Warlock is faster than someone, they don't have a lot they can do. With that said, BOC Warlocks are a joke in Duos because they fold pathetically to ranged.

The proper counterplay is seldom used (Firebox's video shows this), where they don't use their skills appropriately to avoid the BOC trade (a lot of players not kiting, using their abilities, or using ranged options at the correct moments). I think this fact makes it hard to determine how strong it really is - it seems like it's very counterable since the build is extremely one-dimensional

[cedar totem]

plz bring back colored player icons in main lobby screen and trade post ❤️ I felt so cool with my pathfinder, voyager, exemplar and demigod badge colors

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[slim hinge]

dont allow the same class type to go into raid together

[gilded ether]

Some mobs should be in packs, that aggro together. Some mobs should be patroling, to annoy campers

[cunning gorge]

Remove sneaking from the game entirely for all classes. It's the most toxic thing in this game, solo. You devs always do this.

[timid palm]

parkour in the lobby would be sick

[foggy sun]

https://tenor.com/view/no-bugs-bunny-nope-gif-4095597578532971838

[dusk kelp]

Lets just make fireplaces in the lobby enable "rest" effect on you. Like an endless campfire 🙂 That would be cool

[tulip venture]

<@&988703997378584596>

[tulip venture]

Why do you feel this way?

[elder bobcat]

i imagine he got shot by a pair of rangers

[jade tide]

Real talk, can we nerf the Nightmare Axemen already? Worst thing in the game to fight. Can't block overhead strike, side-step tracking is whack, 3528345823% action speed

[tulip venture]

Yeah they’re a tad awful I always resort to cheesing them

[ancient veldt]

remove 60 seconds spectator it does nothing but allow players to have a pre-lobby person join their game and tell the location of people

we already have deathcam thats good enough

[tulip hill]

the deathcams are very limited in their scope, especially given their short duration
as well as it being interesting to see if those who killed you survived the direct aftermath of a chaotic death
ideally I would want to be able to review full games from everyone's perspective but I understand that such an ask it pretty big as far as the resources to support such a tool

[ancient veldt]

deathcam does that though they can make it show the KILLER's prespective for the next X amount of seconds as opposed to getting people rushed to you because their friends tells them what you have and where you are

even if you escape you can still spectate for 60 seconds and its the most unneeded thing in the game

you have yet to lose a kumas fang while hiding and not moving for 10 minutes until a blue opens to people rushing in knowing your general location somehow

pre-lobby teaming is a known issue and for some reason they brought back spectate which still gives pre-lobby teamers an advantage

[tulip hill]

I don't have a problem with your claim that the 60 seconds of spectator is not good for the game, I'm arguing your assertion that the deathcam we have are enough

[ancient veldt]

it is enough though i dont see whats not enough about it

the only reason i see spectate was an actual thing was so you know who killed you, and in the case they were cheating to report them

but now that death cam is a thing i see 0 reason to have spectating be a thing

[tulip hill]

it is not always apparent if someone was cheating from the last 10 seconds of a fight

[ancient veldt]

you can tell if someone is cheating pretty easily

also thats still something that can change

deathcam being 10 seconds is a bit too short i can agree, they can increase the time of that

[tulip venture]

? If someone has esp and can see your health bar you can tell?

[ancient veldt]

if someone is rushing at you without you making a single sound for the past 5 minutes yeah you can tell

[tulip hill]

so you agree that the duration is too short but still assert that it is enough? that sounds contradictory

[ancient veldt]

it is enough in the sense of it being there incase you need to report them for cheating

[tulip venture]

I mean fair probably especially if you’re out of circle and not near an extract

[tulip hill]

true, but that is not the problem I have with it, I complained about its limit as an investigatory tool

[ancient veldt]

thats the funny thing who would rush in crouched in the zone while prot potted

[tulip venture]

Fortunately they take screenshots of your pc when you get reported so if you have esp active they can see it and ban them

[tulip hill]

really? that's neat

[tulip venture]

Yeah it’s in the terms of sale under the anti cheat policy

[ancient veldt]

would ghosting be considered cheating?

[tulip venture]

What do you mean by ghosting ?- probably

[ancient veldt]

can you get banned for having a friend tell you information about where players are using the spectator's 60 seconds?

[tulip hill]

given that would require premeditated teaming, yes it is bannable

[tulip venture]

Yes anything that abuses mechanics or bugs in unintended ways that cause harm to another player is bannable in their terms of sale

I read through the whole thing because I wanted to set up my game to enter the lobby over and over and spam Q while I was at work to level my cleric which is indeed bannable

[tulip hill]

wait, what does spamming q do for that?

[tulip venture]

MIKA VISTA YUILIEN

[tulip hill]

ah, understandable

people over in game discussion are too busy arguing so I'll ask here, it may lead to a suggestion anyways
What are yall's thoughts on Tumbling and Backstep?

[tulip venture]

I think those skills have potential but overall aren’t worth it at the moment if they have I frames they might be worth it

[tulip hill]

What areas would you like to see improved with rogue?

[tulip hill]

oh if they had I-frames they'd be one of the best skills in the game
I've actually gotten good value out of tumbling, but Rogue isn't really built to duel people
if they had a swashbuckler perk to use bucklers or a parry dagger, tumbling would be so much better since you'd be safer to go in on a target before using tumbling to get out

[slim hinge]

removes skill and fun in fights. say two rouges jump you at the same time you instant die or say there are two rangers there's no way to fight them when they can just practically instant kill you with longbows

[tulip venture]

If it was effective to do wouldn’t all the best teams run like 3 rangers or something

[slim hinge]

trios is completely different than duos you can have a chance to win. in duos it turns a 2v2 into a 1v2 instantly

[slim hinge]

i also think that there should be a strength requirement for long bow bc you can just buy a long bow for 40g with 5 physical power and it does way too much damage and is unbalanced

[slim hinge]

people dont do it in trios bc its not broken in duos it is. they just instant kill your teammate and then hold their body and its very boring and cringe asf

[winter nova]

ishtere large gold bags i need more room, my gold bags i canbuy take up to much room

[arctic flame]

Coin Chest holds 10,000 coins
Large Gold bag holds 1,000 coins
Gold Purse holds 50 coins

[tulip venture]

I would start with a second stash tab then move on to your. First gold coin bag then proceed from there

[winter nova]

where do i get the large coin bagh?

[proven valley]

Suggestion: self found only next wipe for a short wipe

[arctic flame]

Buy the 2nd and 3rd tab before you worry about that

[winter nova]

2nd stash sounds good

[dull sinew]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/482571/add-milk-to-the-game

[light hound]

Self found would be fun for literally a few days then would get lame (assuming gear matchmaking isn't strict - but then is there a point if everyone has the same gear always?)

It's very hard to find good gear, and the Apex predators can just farm low geared players and take their best pieces over and over

[outer lotus]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/545219/make-quests-account-wide-not-per-character

[tulip venture]

Damn adding milk to the game is getting more traction than this

[unborn terrace]

i understand the wanting quests to be account wide so you dont have to do them each and everytime you switch classes, but i feel like it gives me goals when i play on a new character than isnt as fleshed out as my main. plus they give bumps in xp and gold when you do them

i think its because certain aspects are tied to quests, like making gear or squire stuff, so they feel the need to do them, when in reality, they could ignore all the quests and still be mostly ok

[cold magnet]

perhaps add a feature to pay for more marketplace slots? kinda like paying for another stash for ex: 2500g, and gain 5 more slots ? might be a dumb idea but idk sometimes i got so much i just wanna list it all at once and not wait days to sell stuff from my inventory lol

[tulip venture]

I think a good solution would be to have account wide quests and class specific quests that way each class has something to do and you’re not grinding the same thing over and over and as a side benifit you could lock the highest affinity for specific merchants behind class quests like not being able to craft the best bows without doing ranger quests etc…

[tulip venture]

You could trade the things to another character of yours through a friend and do it that way

[cold magnet]

hmm thats true

[ruby chasm]

gear based match making is gonna kill the game so fast

gear effectively will do nothing (hell, if its not BiS its straight up nerfing yourself in relation to your lobby compared to just using squire gear and going into a "squire" lobby)

and the game is gonna feel even more BR like than before (its literally just gonna be who's gonna find good gear pieces first)

wouldn't be surprised if gear thats not explicitly BiS for its color drops like 50-70% in price on the market due to the minimal demand

[weak zenith]

I can see this happening and i think i remember that being part of the reason they added trade.

But do you think theres a middleground between the two that could have less of the whole "buy BIS or die" stuff we see around? We could argue nerfing/removing BIS rolls or buffing non BIS rolls but i think that just transfers the issue to a new set of rolls.

The draw a lot of people see in self found is making gear that doesnt have the best of the best on it feel useful, less of a "yoooo! This piece has [x stat] on it!... Aw man, and 20% reg interact so now its garbage cuz it wasted a roll"

[light hound]

Aside from a few roll adjustments (like on Chest and Legs to make +2all a bit more comparable to other rolls,) improvements to useless gear types (stuff that nobody wants because there is objectively better gear types,) and adding more strategic stat rolls (like +1 poison/fire damage for 3 seconds, cooldown reduction, or +20armor AND MR while holding up a shield, +3 all when hit for 4 seconds, get 10% Phys/Magic power when below 50%, etc - whatever people might find interesting to build with), I think it'll be in a pretty fun place.

There would be a lot of interesting builds for the high end sets and the lower end gear would still be useful most of the time (instead of just looking for the correct piece + one specific roll, which makes trading a lot easier to gear up than looting in dungeon)

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[weak zenith]

A lot of these could be pretty interesting to see around, you got a suggestion post on the site for it?

[outer lotus]

Wild

[outer lotus]

This one much more thought out, upvote this one

[arctic flame]

Soft caps built into stat boosts, so if you try to +2 all on all of your gear, it caps you at like +4 and you waste the rest of the rolls. This would prevent very pointy builds and keep everyone in the same range as each other

[abstract veldt]

HOW ABOUT GET RID OF CURSE OF PAIN AND THIS GAME IS BALANCED

[sharp cape]

KITED FOR 5 MINUTES BY A CROSSBOW ROGUE
CAN YOU SLOW UNCREATIVE DEVS JUST CHANGE THE MOVEMENT SPEED CAP ALREADY THIS IS RIDICULOUS
I WAS A 105% MOVESPEED BARB AND HAD ZERO CHANCE AT EVER CATCHING THIS GUY
EVEN WITH A BUILD SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED TO NOT GET FUCKD BY KITERS I STILL GET FUCKD

[somber wind]

I'd rather not get gear based matchmaking, I use higher end gear as a handicap since I'm not AMAZING at the game, I'm not bad but not good either so I feel like I'll need to just run blues forever if gear based matchmaking added.

The other issue is I want to beable to punch up.

[steep oak]

give bard pavise

[arctic kindle]

rebrand game as pve only due to a majority of pvp interactions as being unfun

[light pebble]

move speed should cap at 102%

[sharp cape]

agreed

[light pebble]

like honestly what do they balance around?

[random junco]

The main point is frustration when you play your side character and quest item that you need on main character drops. And some quests are just easier with specific classes. So playing multiple classes would be profitable bc you can adapt to quests.

[pastel ingot]

#NerfWarlockBuffRogue

[random junco]

It should work other way if gbmm will take care about not only color of item but also what kind of mods you have on item

[ruby chasm]

Damn we really making gear not do shit relatively huh

[random junco]

Skill > gear should be point of game. Gear should be more tool than have real impact on game.

[white umbra]

There should be a lockpicking minigame

To practice lockpicking, like in the menus

[strong grotto]

I agree. I hate HR, to be honest. Especially solo. If you aren't playing broken class, like warlock, and you aren't wearing like 100500g worth of gear - you will have no chances. You will just be gear checked all the time. I still remember warlock just placing ONE CURSE on me and just walking away. He knew I will die. And I DID. ONE. DAMN. SPELL.

On the other hand I really like normals now. You go in somewhat equaly matched. Yes, you may be lucky and find 1 absolute BiS piece, maybe even two, but that is luck only, that isn't assuring your dominance, neither it makes you immortal, lol!

TLDR, gear is crazy right now, I don't know how people enjoy HR, I simply can't understand it, while normals are just what this game needs, that is: equal footing, adaptability and skill prevails, while gear you find is just adding a bit of spice.

[tulip hill]

306 MS? base move speed (based on fighter with nothing equipped) is 300, they'd have to change most if not all of the MS modifiers for that to be a reasonable cap

unless you want MS to be a non-factor for most builds

[small ibex]

why is the additional 10 movement speed buff in the fighters sword mastery only applied if in a defensive stance? I feel that should be changed. It's called sword mastery not defense mastery

[tulip hill]

the movement speed is there to help offset the speed penalty while blocking, and its not like that is all the perk does, it also provides a bit of extra damage and attack speed with your sword

[light hound]

Hand crossbow rogue needs to kite to win. Don't get too obsessed with killing him and it won't tilt you. Lay traps and use frannies to run him down

It kind of sounds like you weren't able to run down one guy (fastest class in the game) and you're tilted

[light hound]

False, the whole point of a gear system is to have a real impact on the game, otherwise what's the point of looting? Just make it a battle royale arena with preset loadouts

It should remain a balance of both gear and skill - you can adjust the impact, but gear should always be an exciting factor for what it can provide in combat (therefore making the PVE exciting)

[wanton flame]

This is like a major skill issue

[tulip hill]

I feel the need to note, rogue may have the fasted base movement speed (310), but they only have very short lived 10% speed boost available to them in the form of ambush. Negw claims to have been a 105% (315) barbarian which I do believe is high enough for rage to boost your speed to the 350 cap. (correct me if I'm wrong)
if Negw wasn't running rage, that is unfortunate
if they were, however...well, they don't really have an excuse

[static turret]

sounds like skill issue

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[outer lotus]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543012/changes-to-the-quest-system

[wintry wolf]

cave troll needs to be fixed so that it agros on going in room. people shoulnddt be able to hug the wall with a bow waiting to kill people

[tulip venture]

Yeah it’s a tad silly you can go through the whole room without aggroing it

[wintry wolf]

i keep going in to do cavetroll to step into a ranger trap and the ranger is just sitting in the room waiting..... dont get me started on how ranger traps are toxic. should be a skill with limited uses

[dusk olive]

Revert to PT3

[inner quest]

100% agree 👍, Bard and Warlock made the balancing too difficult Revert to PlayTest 3 make cleric and Druid the only 2 support classes

[hollow light]

⬆️

[tulip venture]

Yeah let’s make it so we can stack 4 protection pots and a clerics protection together again

[arctic flame]

its meant for longsword users

[spare fox]

what is your take on a "looted gear only" queue, provided the player base can support it - which is not the case as of today - somewhat like normals where you could carry your gear over games, as long as it comes from raid drops you encounter with your char

[abstract veldt]

wtf can we get a warlock nerf wtf is this

[tulip venture]

Which part needs nerfing?

[abstract veldt]

curse of pain needs longer cast time needs to deal less dmg. its crazy how they can use everything to heal off of without building magic healing and magical healing use to be rare now its on everything. getting plus 20 attribute on warlock is insane alas they can buy full plate in norms to have 201 armor turn into demon get 251 armor 150 health ass load of stats along with cast infinite amount of times on go invincible run away with only a 28 sec cool down at least its not 11 anymore. changes that would help......... reduce amount of dark stacks reduce demon form stats over all and make warlocks have to either wait for charges on spell to replenish or make then campfire

[dusk olive]

@inner quest @hollow light @tulip venture

I was joking

[abstract veldt]

@tulip venturecurse of pain needs longer cast time needs to deal less dmg. its crazy how they can use everything to heal off of without building magic healing and magical healing use to be rare now its on everything. getting plus 20 attribute on warlock is insane alas they can buy full plate in norms to have 201 armor turn into demon get 251 armor 150 health ass load of stats along with cast infinite amount of times on go invincible run away with only a 28 sec cool down at least its not 11 anymore. changes that would help......... reduce amount of dark stacks reduce demon form stats over all and make warlocks have to either wait for charges on spell to replenish or make then campfire

[tulip venture]

Curse of pain does less damage than zap, it takes 20 additional magic healing to get 2 more hp per tick, and if you want them to have a limited amount of spells ? No more health cost? What would warlocks niche be after that

[valid ferry]

i suggest patch notes NOW

[outer lotus]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543012/changes-to-the-quest-system

[royal carbon]

I think it would be nice if while in the pre-match tavern, that if when you hit players it displayed damage numbers so you can see how effective your weapons are.

[brisk pebble]

FIGHTER REWORK:
Perks:
Weapon mastery - [innate] 10% physical damage penalty on non-native weapons
Combo attack - Every third successful consecutive attack gets +50% action speed and +15% physical damage bonus.
Adrenaline spike - When your health goes below 70% get 20% movement speed bonus towards enemies. When your health drops below 40% gain 10% action speed for 12 seconds. (40 seconds cd for each part separately)
Projectile resistance - Gain 5% projectile damage reduction and 95% movement speed reduction resistance when moving towards enemies.
Defense mastery - Gain an additional 30 armor rating. True physical and true magical damage counts as additional against you.
Slayer - While working a weapon in each hand, gain 5 weapon damage and lose the ability to equip plate armor. Works with two handed weapons.
Dual wield - While you have weapons equipped in both hands, gain 10% action speed. Attacks with separate hands advances combo counter on other weapon.
Skills:
Victory strike -> Victory onslaught - For 25 seconds after killing an enemy get 10% of max health back instantly and 10% health regeneration, 75 armor and 10% movement speed for all your allies in 20 meters for 5 seconds.
Perfect block - Gain 5 impact resistance for 6 seconds. After hitting your block enemy recovery phase lasts for 50% longer.
Shield slam - Inflict 30 true physical damage on the enemy, and slow their move speed and action speed by 20%. While performing shield slam your shield block is active.
Breakthrough - Removes debuffs that slow move speed and ignores move speed debuff effects (including performing weapon attack) for 8 seconds.
Taunt - Increases the aggro value to monsters within 10m area by 100%. Gain 12% physical damage reduction and 12% magical damage reduction and your character outliner becomes brighter and emanate constant aura which makes you more visible.

[tulip hill]

what do you mean by "[innate]" on weapon mastery?

[brisk pebble]

I mean that it should be aviable by default

[tulip hill]

if fighter has it by default, that would make the difference between weapons that have a 10% damage penalty and those that do not completely arbitrary, and I while an arbitrary damage penalty is less impactful than an arbitrary "you just can wield that weapon" it is also less intuitive

[brisk pebble]

10% damage penalty is 10 str difference lol

[versed hinge]

Make Goblin Caves a DUO Map, Increase boss health, playercount stays same, insanely good change

[tulip hill]

your point?

[outer lotus]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543012/changes-to-the-quest-system Please upvote

[brisk pebble]

I dont even know what to say. From a storytelling perspective a trained fighter surely can handle a stick. I guess you can say "character is more trained with fighter-specific weapons so he can wield it with full strength grip" or something. Still arbitrary, but better then what we have know.

[tulip hill]

well sure, thematically making every weapon useable by fighter who is described as "a master of arms" by the game itself makes more sense, applying an arbitrary 10% damage penalty on some weapons is very unintuitive gameplay. Also we don't really have precedent for the classes to have innate perks like that. Weapon proficiency, starting stats, skill and perks are the differences. If we give fighter an innate perk that is separate from that, the other classes should get something as well

[pastel ingot]

i must ask, does anybody feel like rogue is getting kind of shafted?

I've played most classes, and I can say I've enjoyed playing a rogue, but literally nobody wants a rogue in their party, the nerfs that have been done consecutively over every wipe is excessive and kind of pushes them in the corner to go play by themselves xD

im not looking for more damage, but more utility would be amazing. with the addition of creep to all classes, i feel rogues need to be able to silently interact with objects like doors, allowing for a reason to have them on your team.

[tulip hill]

Rogue is one of those class designs that provokes negative reaction. They rely on dirty tricks which people don't take well when it works. Each time Rogue gets a viable strategy so many people complain about it that it gets nerfed out of the game, sometimes taking other stats with it. Currently kiting with a crossbow is the meta for rogue as far as I know and the community as a whole dogs on kiting as a strat

I'd love more supportive options for rogue, since a lot of the complaints about rogue come from them being able kill/harass you without much counterplay. Assassins are cool but I've always preferred the skill monkey archetype for rogue

[pastel ingot]

i believe they miss out on alot of what other classes have as a whole, i am consectuively suprised by how little people complain about warlocks being literaly gods of combat and can one shot most classes with a proper build, can face tank if they want to, can get away with never purchasing meds and healing themselves to full in every aspect of combat. yet somehow rogues being able to do basic stuff like jumping twice or having a stealth that actually functions gets nerfed to the point nobody uses those skills anymore.

[unborn terrace]

people complain about warlocks all day wym

[pastel ingot]

alright , so lets say they do. where are the nerfs that completely make those perks/skills useless. because i dont see any

[unborn terrace]

well BoC was nerfed already, and rogues werent nerfed all in 1 patch, it was a slow nerf after nerf to get to this point

[pastel ingot]

yet rogue has had every single thing that makes them unique practically removed. i enjoyed the doubling perks together because some wouldnt ever be taken otherwise, but i was always an advocate for thinking stealth the way it was, if anything was underpowered, and they still decided to make it worse:P

[unborn terrace]

stealth was underpowered the way it was? idk about that

[tulip hill]

it comes down to the dynamics of the fight
warlock might be OP, but if we nerf the numbers enough, the fight will be fair
when rogue is powerful and is able to kill, its not a matter of numbers necessarily, but the actual method of lethality itself
people hate being kited, people hate being landmined, if its not a straight duel people will complain about it (people will complain regardless but less so for a fair fight)

in other words, too many people hate the idea of an asymmetric fight

[pastel ingot]

let me explain why i think it was underpowered, stealth as a skill needed 3 stealth related perks to function fully. all to culminate on 2 things, surprise factor, and an extra hit worth 50% more damage.
at the end of the day rogues are suppose to be stealthy, combat ready sneeky little guys, who pop in and out of combat, and distract and separate enemy team focus.

if they are going to be forced to use hand crossbows that do a fraction of the damage a bow does, just remove them from the game, they are no longer functional as the class was envisioned

and yes rogues, still kill many people daily, weve just been forced to find more creative ways doing so, we literally cant throw on BoC and oneshot 50% of people.

just a little utility is all we need, and maybe reverted stealth nerfs because like come on xD rogues not using stealth is just silly 😛

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[lament sequoia]

Remove MOVESPEED FROM RANDOM STATS 😮 wow no more cat and mouse

[normal robin]

Btw, this isn't where you make suggestions. This is where you discuss suggestions made on the website. The devs don't read this.

[outer lotus]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/543012/changes-to-the-quest-system Please upvote

[tulip hill]

Agility also feeds into movement speed, would that also need looking at or do you think removing the dedicated movement speed enchantments would be enough?

[dry vault]

Please auto complete quests that require other players on the test server.

[celest basalt]

There should be perk / more availability to magic resist for all classes other than warlock / barbarian. This would balance out easily the issues with Wizard / Warlock.

[tulip hill]

agreed
people should be able to prepare for just about any situation, so long as it has an appropriate opportunity cost

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[ripe yoke]

please just remove throwing axes and knives from the game if you arent going to balance them

[outer lotus]

Necessary changes!

[lament sequoia]

Yea or maybe cap it

[tulip hill]

I mean, aside from movement speed, agility dictates Action Speed at 25% scaling and Regular Interaction Speed at 40% scaling. It wouldn't be too crazy to just remove Agility if you didn't want people to be able to built movement speed
since Action Speed and Regular Interaction Speed are handled majority by Dexterity and Resourcefulness respectively

[lament sequoia]

Or maybe change certain things where certain stats dont roll on plate and stuff. Just dont make sense that 50% pdr mdr warlock or fighter or barb having insane ms for amount of defence

[tulip hill]

oh so true
weighted enchantment rolls for more categories would improve stuff a lot
not just because it gives them one more nob to turn when balancing numbers, but simply because sometimes you get a roll that is literally useless on that item
like, spell memory on a stiletto? completely wasted roll

[wicked spindle]

one of the new stash slots should be for 5,000 gold

[unborn yacht]

pre lobby shuld resotere abilities its common sense

[elfin vale]

just lost 5k kit to a fighter in 2k kit after landing rupture cbow, 3 knives, 5 dagger stabs (2 headshot, poisoned weapon) *second wind used AFTER i died

rename rogue to victim

[pine comet]

Did you have weakpoint?

[tulip hill]

let me just tally up those hits using some conservative math
so that's ~40 for the rupture crossbow, 45 for the knives, call it 20 per stab + the two headshots to make 120, then throw in an extra 25 damage from the poison weapon doing its thing throughout all that.
that adds up to 230, but since you were running a kit that number should be a lot more
meaning either the fighter would have had to have been near PDR cap to survive or a lot of that damage hit limbs
either way, it seems plausible, did you think to watch the death cam?

[elfin vale]

yes and i clipped it and watched it back 5 times with friends and we all just concluded that this game blows

[tulip hill]

may I see it?

[light pebble]

ms is dumb

[frigid current]

Gear-based matchmaking will divide lobbies by class, as classes excel at different kit qualities.
White-kit lobbies will be loaded with PDR fighters, green/blue filled with barbs and slayer fighters, purple/orange lobbies filled with rogues and wizards. Not sure where locks fit in, maybe a more versatile class.

If true, and as players catch on, bis low-level gear will quickly rise in price, creating a very similar dynamic to the current gear situation.

Therefore, in the end, I think, all gear-based matchmaking is going to do is separate lobbies by class.

Also, it could make the game very difficult for new-coming wizard or rogue players, as they aren't balanced for low-level lobbies.

This is a solo perspective btw

[light pebble]

it was a longsword buff without buffing warlock

[tulip hill]

Interesting observation
different classes do scale better than others so there probably would be different class distribution in each tier of a gear based matchmaking system
but then again, in a rank based system there is probably a similar trend
while the current system isn't strictly gear based, it is reasonable to assume those who escape consistently enough to achieve higher ranks will on average bring in better gear and therefore be subject to the same class bias, though probably at a much lower rate

[light pebble]

phantomized need an animation like for wraith in apex legends

[tulip hill]

it does have one, though it is very short
compared to wraith, its almost nothing

[frigid current]

Absolutely, and that's why I think the current system is valid af. I actually just dropped about 12k into copper powder/ingots in anticipation of a drastic price increase

Another possibility is that the majority of wizards/rogues struggle in low-gear lobbies, making it difficult for them to even reach the higher tier lobbies, where they'd excel

and then we'll see a bunch of wizard buffs and they'll just be the god class all-around

Though, this would be more prevalent if they implemented this change at the beginning of a wipe. As it is, a lot of people are already made and it'll distort whatever information they receive

[thick sky]

please upvote, trying to get some more visibility on this one. quick push to 420 upvotes by monday https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/502677/gigantic-spider-mummy-boss

[tulip hill]

instead of just a giant spider mummy, thoughts on making it an Arachne/Drider type creature?
if you're unfamiliar, think a centaur but with a spider body instead of a horse

[pine comet]

Creatures with humanoid upper halves usually are civilized because they have thumbs

[tulip hill]

what do you mean by this?

[pine comet]

I mean that a creature with a human upper half and a spider for its lower half would probably not be colluding with a bunch of skeletons and goblins

[frigid current]

unless it's a necromancer drider

[tulip hill]

but the goblins have thumbs
as do the Troll and Cyclops
the demon man-bat and centaur (wait, do bats have "thumbs"?)
the kobolds and giants

[pine comet]

The only other necromancer is the lich so it would probably be wag to strong for us

[pine comet]

Okay what I mean is that the upper half is a human like a centaur upper half is so it would make sense that people would have good relations with them, also the demon bats don’t even have arms

[tulip hill]

looked it up, bat wings do technically have thumbs, but not in the way that is useful to this conversation
in any case, a drider, which is from dungeons and dragons, has the upper half of a drow. Specifically one that follows an evil god
looking human and having thumbs has very little to do with how reasonable a creature will be in a fantasy setting

[pine comet]

No longer looks like a human then, murder it then

Thumbs usually mean intelligence, not our fault that diplomacy isn’t an option in the game, but if it was added wouldn’t it be to big to fit through doors

[tulip hill]

vampires? they are intelligent and look so human that they are able to walk among them in many settings yet are often depicted as monstrous predators in their actions

[pine comet]

I never said they were peaceful human loving creatures I said diplomacy is an option with them

[tulip hill]

fair enough, but diplomacy doesn't work on people who have decided to be evil, such as say a drider who attempts to kill any adventurer that enters their lair

[pine comet]

What is considered evil though? Warlocks turn into literal demons but work with clerics so are they evil?

[frail tiger]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/545541/remove-player-names-in-cinematic-mode

[tulip hill]

I'm not having a philosophical debate over this game lol

[thick sky]

One of the main reasons I think gigantic spider mummy boss would be great is the model already exists in the game, it’s a classic “tough” foe for newer players. The model itself, if you can imagine it being gigantic, in order to get headshots you would need to be surrounded by its front legs, and the head is super small so headshots from a ranger would be difficult. Having spider pots around the room would be thematic. also lore wise, it could be cool to have a gigantic spider mummy boss, and somewhat of an explanation as to where the spiders come from (the spider mommy)

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[dull surge]

I like it all except your last two recommendations. This game doesn't need longer quests

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[dull surge]

Yeah that is true

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[dull surge]

Yeah I'd say its overall an improvement. I'll upvote it

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[outer lotus]

We need this, upvoted

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[unborn terrace]

still on teh account wide quest crusade i see

[dusk fiber]

I think lizards should have +5 unarmed damage and any future beast race should follow.

[outer lotus]

Its a must, or else theres no motivation to play other classes. Upvote for the good cause

[unborn terrace]

I disagree.

[outer lotus]

At least for people with not much time to play, it makes it a much better experience

[buoyant wren]

pwease bring back ruins 👉 👈 🥺

[ripe turtle]

QUEST REWARDS SHOULD BE DELIVERED TO THE STASH, NOT THE INVENTORY! THANK YOU!

[tulip venture]

Reminds me of killing somebody who had handled wolf pelts on them lmao

[brave vessel]

Please make a small quality of life change for Marktplace. When you click on drop-down menu, the cursor is automatically activated for the search, so that you can type directly without having extra to click in it.

[harsh basalt]

Just thought of this but what about making phantomize cause the user to burn hp while in phantomized state but make the ability a toggle with increasing burn for back to back uses.

[ripe turtle]

The worst feeling when you're dying in a dungeon with no medicine, out of exits, final zone closing with thirsty, sweaty team hunting you down...realising you forgot to move valuables to the stash.

[pine comet]

It took you the entire match to realize that you didn’t stash your stuff?

[molten skiff]

Guys do you think they should do the hotfixes in a different day? it always starts in the weekend

[frigid current]

they want to let you know that they're 'busy' working on the game

[bright crystal]

Why is match making a thing!! u que and play how it should be. I don't want to grind to find my self vs others that have done the same thing. You want to be able to play all night. end up with good gear then kill someone who has not done the same thing. If they want to challenge you play more? Matchmaking of any kind ruins the game. we all have equal opportunities to get good gear. When the game first released on steam was the game at its best. no ranks just simple play and die alot and have fun trying

[abstract veldt]

WTF WHY ARE THEY UPDATING ON THE WEEKEND ME AND MY PALS ALL JUST GOT OFF WORK WANTING TO GRIND THIS IS BULL SHIT

[native hedge]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/545670/stop-nerfing-bard-already

[light pebble]

SSAY HI TO THE KIDS ITS ONLY 2 HRS

[light pebble]

nerf bard 150hp 40 action speed 310 ms 25pdr while hitting for 70 a hit

[chrome gale]

a mode where you and a few other players can play as the dungeon master control mobs and mess with adventurers while adventurers work together to defeat them

[tulip hill]

that would be hard to make the gameplay feel good for both sides, but I'm not against the idea itself

[celest basalt]

Is the test servers low fps for others aswell? / laggy

[tulip hill]

I'm not a fan of bard personally, I know some people like how they work mechanically, but I've always found their music system strangely implemented
I expected bard have much stuff more like Din of Darkness and Chaotic Discord; songs that do a continuous effect as you play. But most songs are basically just spells with a minigame. Sure note skipping adds some interest to the mechanic but overall it feels more like you are a spellcaster that jumps through hoops to cast rather than the music feeling like it is the effect.
I'd personally like to see many of the effects be buffed but only be in effect while the bard is playing. That way the bard becomes more of a buff beacon rather than just slapping it onto their ally before pulling out a sword
keep the self buffs for solo and to allow them to hold their own should they get rushed, but I would want the team buffs to be a power continuous effort

[grand gate]

Love im’s hotfix style.

“We noticed that not enough people are playing warlock and wizard despite them being utterly broken. In response we’ve decided to nerf rogue for the millionth consecutive time in a row.

Like rogues were annoying when back when they were solo wiping whole lobbies, but you can’t just nerf a class into the ground because it counters your favorite. Im really needs to start balancing impartially or bring in a balance team who will.

[cunning gorge]

I feel like this is common sense but uh

STOP CHANGING ITEMS MID WIPE? CAUSING PLAYERS TO LOSE THOUSANDS OF GOLD? You devs are SO dumb.

Tens of Thousands.

[graceful frost]

It was needed changes. The gear was ass

[lyric vault]

reamove gear based matchmaking im not finding anyone in my lobbies

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[frigid current]

start up a feature on that link^

ill upvote it

[tulip hill]

what about this last patch was a nerf to rogue? with the resourcefulness change isn't this patch a big win for rogue?

[soft nebula]

yeah little confused if they even read the patch. atp rogues are just complaining to complain, ive been seeing more rogues than warlocks recently anyways. keep in mind i play rogue its really good in solos rn

[tulip hill]

rogue is really nice solo, I have a lot of time on it because of that fact (I play the most out of my friends so I run solo a lot)
I think what it comes down to is rogue is such an appealing playstyle that even people that can't do well on it keep trying and end up thinking the class is the problem
rogue can be super punishing for sure, and because of their nature they are not allowed to be meta without getting nerfed into the ground soon after, but they are probably the best rat class so even when they are weak they are still playable

especially ever since they got hand crossbow base kit, so now they can poke people at a relatively safe distance and still have 4 perks to play with

[soft nebula]

exactly, its super skill based. cutthroat might also be the strongest ability in the game rn tbh

[tulip hill]

I haven't actually gotten much value out of cutthroat
on paper its really good but every time I run it I never find myself in a position to really use it

[pine comet]

Cut throat is only good against a cleric because you just disable their divine prot and smite

[tulip hill]

it gets rid of BoC too, useful to not get 1 tapped

[pine comet]

Only works if you landmine them because the warlock probably has more range

[tulip hill]

speaking of landmine rogue, I've heard people use that phrase in situation that I wouldn't describe as a "landmine"
can you please explain what you mean by it so we can be on the same page?

[pine comet]

You enter an area and a rogue uncloaks and drives his dagger into your jugular usually resulting in your death because you didn’t know he was their, sorta like a landmine

[graceful frost]

Good against wizards and caster locks and stuff too

[pine comet]

Rogues usually never get close enough to casterlocks because those guys are so paranoid they hydra every time they move more then 10 steps

[tulip hill]

I see
I always thought as landmining as specifically situations where the victim had no reason to believe there could be a threat
so, for example, if a rogue's teammate baits you towards the hidden rogue, I wouldn't call that a landmine

[pine comet]

I mean a landmine rogue is basically a rogue that you had no idea existed appearing to murder you, doesn’t matter how you got to that situation

[tulip hill]

yeah, but one situation the rogue gets the kill simply because the victim was unlucky enough to walk close enough to the rogue
in the other situation the victim was tricked into getting too close to the rogue

[pine comet]

I mean in real life landmines work in both situations

[tulip hill]

fair
I still think the distinction is an important one to make
baiting an enemy into a rogue is an active strategy that requires good positioning and actually selling the situation
silently waiting in a high traffic spot is simply a matter of when someone will fall for the trap, its a passive strategy that doesn't create very dynamic gameplay for either side

[pine comet]

Baiting an enemy is also just called an ambush usually

[tulip hill]

then lets call it that
calling the rogue in that situation a landmine carries a negative connotation but baiting the enemy into your rogue feels like that should be how having a rogue in your party works. It doesn't feel like its a cheep strat like landmining is characterized as

[pine comet]

I don’t call it a landmine some people do though

[tulip hill]

I see, understandable
thank you for the clarification

[tulip hill]

With the fighter changes, it got me thinking, should shield slam's stats (damage, slow, etc.) be determined by the shield used rather than being the same across the board?

[valid ferry]

you shouldnt be able to roll perks you cant use, or the perk should make you be able to use what the perk buffs

i got trap mastery on my bard and cant use hunting traps. :(

[hearty sleet]

Multiclassing is up to RNG/Random Roll? I don't even need to state the reasons why that is stupid.

[tulip hill]

yeah, I had the same concern
while they could make hunting traps available while you have the perk, I'd honestly want some kind of rework relating to hunting traps
not even the trap itself but how it functions in a metacontextual way

[dull quail]

shield bash still sucks. just implemented wrong :(

[terse dawn]

the rng on multiclass kinda sucks

[modest talon]

where is my fucking +2 all trousers

[stray kindle]

fuck your +2 all trousers

[jovial swan]

https://darkanddarker.featureupvote.com/suggestions/545710/test-server-isnt-that-good

[primal thicket]

didnt they say druid was coming out as soon as this season drops? when is it droppiiiingg

[atomic yacht]

this month

[civic zodiac]

sooo? if the matchmaking is gear based on high roller what the points of the gear anymore? no use for gear = no use for gold = no more goal or progress in the game i feel the core purpose of the game is rendered useless

[orchid hazel]

Think there should be a way to be able to see your quests in a game/raid so in case you forget you can see what u need to do

[civic zodiac]

quest system need a rework tbf. the quest progression is kinda well handled except they should maybe separate pvp quest (killing player) to progression normal quest. and definatly when we open inventory we should be able to scroll down to our quests a bit like wow so we can track our progression instead of always guessing or memorising everything ( for peoples with goldfish memory its hard )

[civic zodiac]

idk how the gear based matchmaking work but... i brg a kickass amulet and rings with luck and rest being full squire and as a voyager i still get matched with nakeds not even lvl 15 .... like with a pot as a bard i get up to 250 luck i get fully blue/purple in minutes while others still in basic with some blue shit its completly unbalanced. i use to do it to brg back more loot and ap since the equiped stuff i brg with me count and its extra money now i feel like im stomping beginner and its totally unbalanced

[frosty creek]

suggestion : add this character to the game !
Name : Fallen Angle
she is a fallen angle and this its her abilities
Passive : Dark Anguish : the dark energy empower this champ , making dmg to enemy heal Dark Angle for 12 % of dmg
1- Dark prison : Fallen Angle will shoot Dark Bolt and this bolt if its hit enemy it will Root for 2 or 3 second, they are stuck in the prison
2- Dark pool : Fallen Angle will place a Dark Pool at a choosed place , it will make dmg and and become stronger and will reduce cd when its do dmg
3- Dark Shield : fallen angle will make dark shield , able to protect from all magic dmg and make immune to controled effects .
4- Dark Chain : A chain will be place on all enemy , it will do dmg 1 time then again in 3s it will do dmg again if enemmy dont get away ... and they will stunned

what do yall think ?

[civic zodiac]

i dtt think fit in the medieval spirit of the game. fallen angel going to some cave dwelling sound weird asf.

[terse dawn]

i love being a 90 degree angle

can one of the skills be a tri angle

[worn lava]

I feel you devs should do something to throwing knives and throwing axes I truly believe they should be only allowed a certain amount and that's it they can replenish that amount after each round through the starter kit merchant also side note you should not allow people to come into a game with 2 or more windless crossbows how is that physically even possible to carry more then 2 just saying and also side note when you sit down why the heck can't you put a shield or health or bandage on your hotbar I mean that should be physically possible to also side note change the damn spiders I'm sorry but they are a rusty idea coming out of a pot infinite amount of times what are they hatching in there and somehow physically aging at that fast of a rate why don't you just have 3 or 2 already spawned in not infinitely coming out of a pot but already waiting for the players to stumble apon them or have them on a already set web on the ceiling pls i beg of you change them they construed everyone's enjoyment of the game

Also forgot to say this rogues and every other class that can use throwables should not be allowed to have a whole arsenal of them why don't you just take them out of the map do not have them a lootable item make the squire merchant only provide them and if you want gray or white ones you gotta level it up and only should that be grays and whites and get rid of the cheese everyone is doing going into a match getting out but removing the pots they didn't use to get double the squire merchant ones

[dusky pike]

My suggestion is to not add multiclassing. (hot take)

Reasons:
This game is special because of each classes identity and unique playstyle.
The game already has sweeping balance changes every patch - being able to mix and match will be even more of a nightmare.
The main classes don't even have their talent trees implemented yet. Maybe do things in there to spice it up instead of multiclassing.
Being able to identify a target and know their kit is important in this game.

[tulip hill]

I feel like that's a pretty mild take tbh
while multiclassing is exciting with all the possible builds, the fact of the matter is that is going to be a nightmare to balance
I'd love to see global or multiclass perks, but making it a free for all means that every single perk needs to be made with every other perk in mind

[sudden pasture]

Yea going into the game with TWO FREE POTIONS?!?!!!! Oh the humanity. Oh the horror.

[civic zodiac]

i feel multiclassing will be a very good thing. a bit messy at start probly but nothing restrain them to do some nerf. for example x skill is shown to be a bit overpowered when transfer they can just put a slight downgrade on this particular skill when transfered only.

[tulip hill]

That's fair, I forget where I've seen that but there was a game I played a while back that did something similar
Sure Weapon Mastery might allow everyone to wield any weapon, but if the penalty was 20% instead of 10%, the weapon you are using better give you a huge advantage
now that I think about it though, I wonder if Weapon Mastery is programmed to take your class into mind or if it just applies the penalty to non-fighter weapons
would be funny to have your native class weapons nerfed but fighter weapons deal normal damage

[tulip hill]

Do yall think a Barbarian perk that leaves you at 1hp the first time you would die would be OP?
Its a classic mechanic that you see in a lot of games
and there are plenty of things that would kill the barbarian right after anyways: Poison Weapon and Rupture, all of wizards burns, CoP and PoS, Dark Swarm
but idk, because (excluding multiclassing) not every class has a good way to deal with that

[olive needle]

U mean like dealing mortal dmg to barb will let him get some immunity frames for like 2 or 3 sec?

[tulip hill]

no no no, literally just lets barb survive that single hit
without any funky DoTs going on, this would commonly allow the barbarian one more hit on their enemy which given their damage could end the fight with them alive
2-3 seconds is a stupid long time to be invulnerable in a fight when you can still fight back, that's why flamewalker phantomize is such a crazy combo

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[unkempt oriole]

Lute Artifact Weapon : hit enemy with this weapon will auto play music you previously play without playing

[strong grotto]

I'd love the idea of artifact lute, as this is my bard's favorite weapon and way to inflict "peace" and cause "rest" to the enemy, but I don't see any value in this enchantment. I'd prefer something like "hitting enemy causes concussion effect on the enemy, stacking up to 3 times", effect will blur the vision, similar to drunk effect, and slows action and movement speed.

[strong grotto]

I think, that you forgetting the game is based on Dungeons and Dragons tabletop system and there is no such class. So before they will add something like that, there will be druids, paladins, monks, artificers, sorcerers and so on.

[unkempt oriole]

Imagine you previously play din of Darkness and hit enemy/mob 3 time you are walking Molotov without flame

[strong grotto]

Imagine that aside of "cool effects" every legendary weapon supposed to be at least somewhat balanced. Not even to mention, that playing effects of the spells, that aren't able to be cast with lute is questionable.

[unkempt oriole]

why not, bow do poison damge,sword do magic damage,why lute cant play drum music

[strong grotto]

Because the only way for you to play drum tune with lute is to hit someone on the head in that exact rhythm. Which is not possible in this game.

[unkempt oriole]

maybe you re right

[north pewter]

Abandon the random perks from multiclass tokens. This random grindy gatcha bullshit will kill the game once and for all.

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[toxic mesa]

take away gear base match making or widen the range, cant run kumas because i get dead lobbies GG

[frigid current]

@keen onyx @dawn grotto @shy fulcrum
the current state of gear-based matchmaking
https://medal.tv/games/dark-and-darker/clips/272CKb1dILsJku/dSTZpZYChgFd?invite=cr-MSw2cVMsMjIwMjI0MDc0LA

[quick mauve]

yo, multiclass is good? i mean what do you think, fucking good idea to add other class perks/skills to players? rly dont understand ironmace... joke, why not make talent tree where u can add +1 stat and maybe end of tree u can add 1 + lesser heal or something bigger, but not too big, only me tilt this joke?

[stone horizon]

you wanting them to put Morgana from LoL in... lol

[frigid current]

lol fallen angle
hitting that 90 degree

[torn hazel]

Can ironmace please rework shieldbash and breakthrough . The problem with them is not the numbers (cooldown, duration etc) it’s the design they are just bad to use. Shieldbash I think needs to be a rival to sprint so that sprint isn’t a must pick always. Example: put yourself in defense stans and give a movement speed bonus/remove the movementspeed penalty for a short second(shorter then sprint) and perform the slam at the end of the movement. Breakthrough could be a cleanse and a short dash like the rangers but forward with bigger cooldown than rangers. And remove the knockback from shieldslam and give it to victory strike instead of the heal that way victory strike could combo with polearms knock enemy out of close quarters and utilize the short slow with your polearm range. Please that way fighter has more then sprint second wind and maybe only sometimes adrenaline spike. Sorry for the tedtalk but the way fighter ability’s have been tweaked will not work ( feedback would be appreciated)

[rancid vale]

-Cleric Sanctuary should harm/kill Warlocks Hydra
-Cleric Sanctuary should NOT heal enemy Warlocks
-Somehow nerf the constant jumping that's far too prevalent in every encounter. This game is a bunny-hopping simulator. Jump to attack, jump to dodge, jump to run exc...
-Push back mob function would be nice
-Level designs are bland (blocks w/ different textures) and not very fantasy inspiring imo.. Rectangle room to next rectangle room, and so on. Also, Ice Cavern is essentially Goblin Caves, just reskinned.. Crypts is fine though. Maps need to mirror concept/load art for tone and feel
-More less cramped maps would be nice. Ruins sorta had that feel for example
-The Stair Pyramid structure that's in about every map is dumb, useless, and esthetically annoying

[strong grotto]

Preach, brother. Random rewards for grinding for DAYS in sliver of hope you get what you want? PISS OFF. I already play gacha games. I don't want to play gacha in DaD too.

[north pewter]

It's just a single step away from selling the tokens for red shards

[strong grotto]

It is not even about that. It is the fact they really think, that we will grind for ages in hope we get something we want? LMAO! Game is already grindy as hell with every player trying to make his favorite class as BiS as possible, perfecting his strategy and control of it. Now we need to grind double as that to unlock just the POSSIBILITY of becoming better. And then they wonder "Why no one tests our multiclass? Why online is so low?"

[buoyant glacier]

If multiclassing is going to reset every Season/League/Whatever. It needs to be fast. Not as fast as the test server, but not super slow by comparison either.. THe first half should be quiock and it should get slow LATE.

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[buoyant glacier]

The Multiclassing mechanic WILL NOT BE FUN at anything resembling normal progress speeds!

If I have to play 50 matches between getting new choices late in the game, it will be awful and people will just reroll and start anew instead of investing in a character.

[strong grotto]

Agree.
I play every day for like 1-2 hours, also had played few weekends no stop on bard, and STILL have only bard level 32, ranger level 20, cleric level 7.
So, after putting a LOT of hours into game and still can't be able to multiclass is... Discouraging. It will only worsen situation, where disparity between people who play a few hours a day vs people with no life putting 50 hours a week. Now not only economically, but also in sheer power of having absolute broken combinations of perks and skills.

[rich torrent]

You can reset your multiclass perks/skills at the fortune teller. So it may be a pretty large time sink to get to the point where you can multiclass but once there, you can basically re-roll until you get what you want as opposed to restarting a new character entirely or waiting 20 levels till your next token. Also, in case you only play one class or only have one above 30, you can still use your tokens to recieve perks etc. from the generic Class Master.

[north pewter]

The 5 minute ban from leaving the lobby is fucking stupid there's no reason for it in a game like this lol

[hot hemlock]

Yes there is. There was a major problem with people using alts to snipe geared teams in queue. Just wait until the game starts and then leave

[north pewter]

This is non HR though, no one can bring in gear lol

[ripe turtle]

OK Ironmace, I have one good suggestion to balance the whole multiclassing: Allow players only equip 1 perk/skill per class. You can have all 4 different perks from different classes and 1 skill from different class. For example, you equip a skill from a Ranger, you can't equip anything else from a Ranger.

[elfin vale]

rename rogue to victim

[dusky pike]

Keep the classes pure! Then if you wanna play that class.... you go play that class :)

WoW has this issue between classic and retail as well. Classic has great class identity. Retail for a long time every class had a heal and utility moves.

I'd prefer they work on making the talent tree system cool and maybe adding subclasses into that. which would be more work than lazily allowing multiclass but would keep each classes unique identities. idk... thoughts?

[strong grotto]

I support this suggestion. Make one on site and I will vote it up.

[outer lotus]

Necessary!

[strong grotto]

Learn to play rogue. Literally yesterday one rogue wiped my whole team of 3, absolutely solo.

[limber dock]

that kinda sounds like your team being real bad 💀 💀 💀 but yeah. rogue can achieve some stuff, it's not just dead

[elfin vale]

this is the biggest self report i have ever seen im begging you to consider being a solitaire main

[strong grotto]

Sure, bud. I've never mention me being a god in game, neither I refute the fact there was a pretty bad positioning from those randoms in my team. Though, if you want to play this card on me - you gotta realize it works both ways. If there are rogues who able to solo 3 people, while all YOU can do is constantly cry rivers... It means it is about YOU, and not about rogues, dummass.

[hallow flare]

Or maybe they do it the other way around, you can spec into any class as much as you want, but only one?

[upper hearth]

They need to readd the hand-crossbow perk, also to add a greater penalty for reloading/ and or swapping weapons. They should also add more features unique to rogue such as utilizing explosive bottles to rig doors or chests, poisoning potions ect. Right now Rogues in solos do not play like rogues, they are more similar to rangers, and the high ms makes fights less a matter of skill and more of who has more consumables.

[elfin vale]

ive done the same thing many times, having 900 hrs on rogue only and 2k total - just bc its doable doesnt mean the class is fine, u can 1v3 on any class with enough xp on it goofy the ttk in this game is crazy low

rogue is weak, anyone saying otherwise is clueless and dies to rogues bc theyre listening to fortunate son on blast in their $20 earbuds

rename rogue to victim, but muiclassing could change everything so we’ll see

[languid spoke]

class identity isn't useful so i'm all aboard the multiclass train. i wouldn't mind a multi-class path + a class specialization path though. that could be dope

[graceful frost]

rogue aint weak lol. especially not in solos.

[ripe yoke]

Make doors take just as long to shut as they do to open

[lavish jewel]

anyone trying the test server yet?

[elfin vale]

im never counting solos its a joke game mode, completely different game than trio HR pvp - where rogue is weak

[graceful frost]

hes just not gonna count 2/3 modes of the game where rogue is a pretty good class|
where 2/3rds of the playerbase is

even in trios rogue isnt that bad, its just not buff ball which is all you can use.

[granite plinth]

-Death cam to 20-25 seconds

-Report button availability during watching replay

Reasoning is because I would be hiding but when I watch death cam it already show me engage in a fight vs how they spotted me when I am crouched and not moving.

If anything the goal of death cam is to see how you died (at most 3 seconds after death). But everything from beginning to the end. I don't know why death cam is me dying and then I watch them loot my body for like 8 seconds. Counter productive imo

[elfin vale]

rogue with 4 hand cbow poison rupture is pretty good sure, but thats not what a rogue is supposed to be (the hand cbow aspect) yet its the only viable way to play in high skill lobbies. GC is easy but ice caves is a massive joke, loot and xp in abundance and extracts where every person can get out 2x over its literally baby mode so ofc i dont count that in class balance lmao

same deal where i would never balance a class on league of legends based off aram or balance cod guns off how good they are in story mode, those things arent the main game

[late marsh]

Raise all classes in test server to level 100 so we can actually test the feature you want us to test.

[thorn parcel]

Bloodedge griffin ahh post

[graceful frost]

bro is completely neglecting that ice caves may be the most balanced mode lol.

and if gc is so easy i would go play it for a while

[ripe turtle]

Possible choice for balancing. It's up to Ironmace to try to balance it in a way it wont ruin PvP.

[dapper charm]

Fallen 📐

[light hound]

I agree tbh, even at 20x exp, it still takes 7+~ games (3~ hours) to get one character to 35 doing hard exp farm runs, then we need to do that multiple times just to test the multiclass feature - why are they making us grind? Confusing

And none of it stays for the next test environments I assume, so we're just wasting a bunch of time on Test server (not actually testing) instead of the live game

At the very least, start us at lvl 35

[sour sandal]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[graceful yew]

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE for the love of god MAKE WENDIGO CLAWS MORE COMMON. This was a SEVERE oversight to ask for 12 when they are such a low drop rate (seems to be around 2% or less).

[meager sapphire]

Druid will save us

[strong idol]

people will always reverse engineer gear score boundaries to find optimal builds. make gear score clear by itself, add a stat showing gear score and associated gear bracket so we can just put gear on and immediately see the result. no need to make it obfuscated. bard instruments should probably get reduced gear score.
utility should probably have very low gear score (warlock healing = less bandages/pots, bad for balancing)
some kind of weight gear score average should be used maybe (barbarian with savage = no chest piece, probably too big effect in mid rank)

[zenith gulch]

check wiki❤️

[strong idol]

thats exactly my point, its already available on the wiki within a day. it would be nice to have it built into the game and see the gear score immediately to know what the ranking will be

[harsh forge]

I think the multiclass system is cool, I think some abilities and spells should be weaker when put on other classes, like smite should do only 7 dmg when not on native and what not

[tulip venture]

Could not find gearscore on the wiki would you be able to assist in me being blind

[tulip venture]

Nevermind found it

[zenith gulch]

you were too quick)

[hearty cedar]

I've been 2 tapped by enough rogues that I am quitting D&D. It isn't fun when it isnt balanced. All the sweatiest players just play rogue and get to pick any fight they want, and get out whenever they want. It's not "skill issue to be killed in .5 seconds of melee. and 2 seconds with high resistances. Daggers are broken, longsword sucks, warlock is a DLC class. Thanks for the little fun.

Great Idea. Always ruined by 2k hour sweats living with their parents. Hopped up on 4 monsters.

[strong grotto]

Dude. The only victim here is useless you. LEARN. TO. PLAY.

[light hound]

Nah, I feel where he's coming from - the newer player experience is bad right now. The matchmaking needs to be on-point or the frustration will be real

Getting skill and gear gapped constantly would turn anyone away

[strong grotto]

Mate, he complains about rogues being weak, not about new player experience.
And even if he did - any game with similar gameplay loop isn't sweet for new players. They need to suffer, break and be molded by experience. And only those who will see this game and decide to themselves it is worth their time will stay. And that is GOOD. Games are not meant for everyone. It is made for those, who like them.

[light hound]

Actually he's saying they're too strong

This line of thinking You're talking about (just get good - let the new players suffer) was eliminated from the first streams of data IM had - they clearly saw the game would not thrive without matchmaking for new players

[light hound]

I'm assuming you played during the playtests like myself?

[strong grotto]

Are you dumb?
This is his quotes: "rogue is weak, anyone saying otherwise is clueless and dies to rogues bc theyre listening to fortunate son on blast in their $20 earbuds" and "rename rogue to victim"
While you are saying: " he's saying they're too strong".
One is not like the other~
Also, how is this - "game would not thrive without matchmaking " is correlating with me telling, that new players should "git gut"???? I was the one who advocated for splitting the normals and HR for geared and defaults, so caped thugs weren't smashing through new players! I was one advocating for squire like system to be in place and I was the one who asked for gear score! GIT GUT and "let them suffer" are NOT THE SAME, you forehead! Get gut is - GO AND PLAY THE GAME, learn it, learn the tactics, movements, learn to aim, to stalk, GET YOUR PLAYER EXPERIENCE UP!

TLDR: that dude needs to learn how to play, while you need to learn to READ.

[light hound]

Nice start to your comment. Showing some real brains.

Oh, thought you were responding to Dingus initially.

On the hardcore gameloop take - you said "any similar game's loop isn't sweet to new players. They NEED to suffer, BREAK...etc...etc.."

How else is someone to read that than to understand you want the new player experience to make them suffer and even BREAK (because you think they NEED it). And you also make clear you don't care if the gamestate only appeals to a small minority - keeping the game very niche for the most masochistic of players. The vast majority of players would certainly leave a hardcore experience like that (when they are at the bottom)

Well, maybe it was lost in translation, but do you support new player matchmaking - putting new players with new players?

[strong grotto]

"Nice start to your comment. Showing some real brains." and "Oh, thought you were responding to Dingus initially." Back to back.
So, who's lacking any brains, dood?
"any similar game's loop isn't sweet to new players. They NEED to suffer, BREAK...etc...etc.." yes. They NEED. TO. GET. GUT. Simple. Those who will find it worth their time - are going to stay. Just like with Tarkov. I am not telling that nto all are welcomed to TRY, because they are ALL are welcome to try the game. But games are not made for everyone. Games are made for their audience. Just like that. SImple.

I support normal lobbies as they are now. I support gear score. I support squire system, when you can chose what to start with. In fact, I was always for those things exactly because we needed to separate new and old, hardcore and casual fans of the game. But "FANS". Not tourists. I am also for some kind of training zone, where you could train yourself agains PvE and even have some duels. Because, and I repeat, ALL ARE WELCOME TO TRY. It is just not all are welcome to STAY. Games are not made for everyone. Games are made for their audience.

[candid flume]

20 times escape ice caves when no one wants to play it beacosue its fucking boring map 20 times carl or 20 times of interaction with gold chest when the people go to the dangeon finding the chest open it and die instant beacouse its 20 times and you dont want to waste time on it good job(i know you aware of this issue and its just a little reminder how unhappy people about it)

[worn lava]

Y'all need to improve the gear mmr system I been searching and watching a lot of people's videos and there isn't much equal gear getting put in same lobbies y'all should really look into that pretty quickly and correct this people should be put into same lobbies with same quality gear that means same amount of blues purples golds and around the same buffs on their gear people want fairness

[ripe turtle]

I know somebody has mentioned this, but multiclassing should be restriced to one class. EDIT: Even then some class skill/perk combinations are broken as hell.

[strong grotto]

1. No. It shouldn't. That's the fun of it.
2. Nothing is broken, when everything is broken. Put your imagination to work with that system.