Baldur's Gate

[quick bobcat]

Double eldritch blast is nasty though

Especially with agonizing blast

[heavy hound]

If you get the one that pushes back it's also great

You can push back 2 people at once

For maximum chasm efficency

[quick bobcat]

I thought that one sucked because eldritch blast has a disadvantage if used next to enemies

[heavy hound]

Yeah it's mostly to throw them down ledges

But it's occasionally useful to help other characters

[quick bobcat]

My cleric got a raise dead for some reason

Now I have a mage and cleric both with raise dead

I have no fucking clue how a trickster cleric got access to raise dead??

[heavy hound]

Yeah, raise the undead is definitely an option.
Some domain in the tabletop specialise into that

But it's not in this game

[quick bobcat]

Is that normal?

[heavy hound]

Yeah raising undead is definitely something an evil cleric would do

So it makes sense for it to be in their repertory

[quick bobcat]

I'm guessing it won't be as effective as my necromancer mage though right?

[heavy hound]

In 3.5 evil clerics instead of turning or destroying undead, could control them

[quick bobcat]

Because he should be getting bonuses for necromancy spells right?

[heavy hound]

Necromancer mages give their minion extra stuff

[quick bobcat]

Oh, how do you mean?

[heavy hound]

I think some extra hp

[quick bobcat]

Oh. Lame

[heavy hound]

But I think you get it at lvl 6

[quick bobcat]

Are there any traders other than those 2 in the grove?

[heavy hound]

I don't know how accurately they ported this to BG3

[quick bobcat]

I'm trying to get better gear since I'm level 5 now

[heavy hound]

But the proficency add to damage at the very least should be there

[quick bobcat]

Oh that's cool

So you get an extra zombie and some more buffs

Can't wait for that

[heavy hound]

The biggest bonus of summoning stuff is still that they can attack the summon and not your party, wasting action on something not that important, so the extra hp is nice especially IMO

[quick bobcat]

I guess yeah

Gonna be fun when both my cleric and mage summon a bunch of zombies, my cleric summons a magic weapon and my warlock cones in with an imp

Gonna have a whole fucking zoo

[heavy hound]

lol

[quick bobcat]

Does warlock get any more summons later down the line?

I also saw that I could've had raise dead on my warlock too, but I'd need a different subclass or something

I don't remember already

[heavy hound]

I think it depends which spells are in the game, there are some spells that summon stuff that the warlock can usually cast IIRC

Doesn't seem so from the wiki

[quick bobcat]

Aw

And no buffs to the imp either?

[heavy hound]

There should be another pact feature

Or maybe not, warlocks are complicated

Oh, seems like the next thing is at lvl 10, and it makes you resistant to one damage type of your choice

So anticipating what the fuck the enemies are going to throw at you will become pretty important

The next thing that is from the pact I mean

[heavy hound]

Oh actually I was wrong

You can get an eldrich invocation that lets you "cast conjure elemental using a warlock spell slot"

[quick bobcat]

Oooh

Now that sounds fun

I was starting to doubt my warlock of the chain choice

Or is the elemental not related to that

[heavy hound]

I think it's available to all warlocks

But I might be wrong, the wiki is still very approsimative

[quick bobcat]

Maybe warlock of the chain was a mistake then. The benefits from the other choices seem cooler now

[heavy hound]

You can always try another version, the respec dude is pretty cheap

[quick bobcat]

Yeah

[heavy hound]

That way you also get to allocate your own stats and be more optimal

[sweet moat]

Pact (Path?) of the Blade for Warlock is waaaaay better.

[heavy hound]

I went with Blade because it felt more Wyll, but man thorn whip sounded like a fun cantrip to have

The tome is probably pretty strong overall

[desert dove]

Gen was right, you only get three Feat/Ability boost choices. Level 4, 8, and 12. You get one every 4 levels.

[desert dove]

Tome is stronger in tabletop, where it lets you learn any Ritual Spell you want + get more cantrips. Here it just gives you more cantrips, which is still not bad.

[sweet moat]

???

[heavy hound]

I think you also get access to one free haste cast per long rest through an eldrich invocation (plus a few other spells) which is pretty nice

That's the tabletop progression

[sweet moat]

Ah, so it might not be the same for BG3 then?

[heavy hound]

I copy pasted that one because I knew where to find it

And it was the clearest way to explain the sneak attack progression

[desert dove]

That's sneak attack progression. The Feats or Ability Score increases are a separate thing, and only every 4 levels.

I'm not sure why that has an ASI at level 10

[sweet moat]

I was talking about the four green marks. Those ones I made, Gen made the red oval.

[desert dove]

Yeah, I see that now. I don't know why it says that.

Ohhhh, I see. Fighters get two extra ones (6 and 14), rogues get an extra one at 10. But that's on the tabletop version, I don't know if they get it in BG3.

[sweet moat]

Anyway, I decided to ||go for Volo's eye surgery in the end, because he gives you the ability to see invisible creatures, and that's awesome. I'll miss my fiery purple eye, but at least I still have one. Lae'zel and Karlach disapproved, but I don't care about Lae'zel, and Karlach is easy to appease as long as you knock a few enemies' heads together, so I'm fine with that too. Everyone else doesn't seem to care about the new look.||

Lol, if anything, ||Wyll actually likes it.||

[heavy hound]

It was pretty funny

Exactly what I expected when I signed up for it

[sweet moat]

Soooo, I just got back from the ||goblin fort, having found some more infernal iron, but upon getting back to the grove, the blacksmith that helped Karlach before won't give her another upgrade, even though he told us to find more.||

Oooooh wait, nvm, I'm dumb. We need to ||meet him at Baldur's Gate first.||

[heavy hound]

Oh actually
Earlier I leveld lae'zel to lvl 6 and she got a feat, so I assume if fighters are getting their extra feats points, so do rogues

[sweet moat]

So, finally decided to take on the bog. First thing I did was ||dispell the illusion cast over the place by talking to one of the "sheep" and discovering that they were all redcaps in disguise. I hated those ugly bastards in the Pathfinder games, and I hate them here too, lol. And, looks like I was right, all the apples that are in this area are poisoned.||

Also, yes, it is a very, very, very good idea to be level 4 or 5 for this area.

[sweet moat]

... ||This hag's a bitch to get to, lol.||

[exotic pelican]

Does anyone else spend too much time turning on every light source in dark rooms? I have to turn on all those candles, torches, and braziers!

[quick bobcat]

Only if I can't see anything

Otherwise I just really on astarion's dark vision

[desert dove]

I've been having too much fun clicking on candles and such, yes.

[weak cedar]

https://twitter.com/baldursgate3/status/1689214949380227072?

Baldur's Gate 3 (@baldursgate3)

Bring your Baldur's Gate 3 companions to the tabletop with these downloadable Character Sheets and Digital Dice on D&D Beyond!

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Twitter · Aug 9, 2023, 10:00 AM

What part of the game you on Masque?

[desert dove]

I've not played since Sunday morning, I just killed all the goblin bosses. But I need to backtrack, because I missed some earlier quests.

[quick bobcat]

Will choosing specific routes cause you to miss out on the others? I say that because I got the popup saying I won't be able to go back when trying to leave the map in multiple places. For example: ||trying to enter the githyanki creche, trying to enter the path next to the goblin camp (to the cursed lands I guess?) and I'm assuming there will be a similar thing in the underdark||

[desert dove]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure certain choices lock you out of other possibilities for that playthrough.

That's pretty typical for these games.

[quick bobcat]

I wonder how much I will miss out by choosing one path or the other

like will I miss entirely new regions or not?

[desert dove]

That I don't know. I'm definitely going to make different choices next playthrough, so we'll find out then.

[quick bobcat]

huh so my warlock's imp should be able to attack twice, but it doesn't anymore. Why is that?

[desert dove]

I didn't know they could attack twice

[quick bobcat]

It's the level 5 bonus for warlock

turns out I can infinitely reapply hex? That seems very strong

[weak cedar]

Ah right.

[night oracle]

Speaking as a not caster here, i saw some enemies casting hex on me but it seemed to be a "concentration" spell. So it stays on until damage interrupts it?

[heavy hound]

Concentration works this way.
Every time you are hit while concentrating on a spell you roll a concentration save

It's based on constitution

The number to hit is 10 or half the damage recieved, whichever it's highest

If you don't hit it you lose the spell you are concentrating on

You roll separately for every hit, which means spells like magic missile are great to try to break a spellcaster concentration

Since it's 4 guaranteed hits, it's 4 rolls they have to do to keep their spell

Oh and you can only concentrate on one spell at a time, meaning that if you cast another spell that requires concentration, you lose the old one

[desert dove]

https://youtu.be/03TwMYuizoI

[exotic pelican]

When I multiclass a paladin and sorcerer 6/6 I should have the spell slots of a level 9 sorcerer when I reach level 12 right? It is confusing.

[quick bobcat]

wait summoned zombies don't despawn? :O

[desert dove]

I'd have to look up how BG3 does multiclassing, I've always hated D&D multiclassing.

[desert dove]

I think they remain for a long time, yes.

[granite thorn]

I never like multiclassing either

[quick bobcat]

heh, all the summons hang around Karlach

necromancy is so cool, I can just have a permanent army of zombies running around with me

it's even better that they don't spawn

[heavy hound]

I think when you multiclass 2 different casters it puts you on a different spell slots progression, it's complicated and I don't remember the details

At least in the tabletop

[quick bobcat]

can you only romance one party member?

[heavy hound]

I think it depends on the party member

[quick bobcat]

Gale just said he won't show me his 'secret' because I talked to Shadowheart earlier

[heavy hound]

You can only romance one on the first night, since you are actively making plans for that night, but I don't think that stops you from flirting with others after

[quick bobcat]

huh, Lae'zel seems to be jealous too lol

[heavy hound]

And how that first partner reacts depend on that partner

[quick bobcat]

'first' night? This is my fourth timing long resting, if that's what you mean

also, I just ||saved the tieflings after tricking Minthara and now there's a celebration which is why all of this is happening in the first place||

[heavy hound]

Yeah but I assume it is the ||celebration for saving the tieflings||

Which is the first real romance scene you get if I understood it correctly

[quick bobcat]

I also had an option to 'truly connect' with Shadowheart for a while now, but I didn't see what it does

[night oracle]

My ||celebration person is Lae'zel. Apparently i've inspired her way more than any others so she "wants to taste me" ||

[heavy hound]

I wonder if you help the ||goblins attack the grove if you get it but with the goblins celebrating in your camp||

That sounds fun

[quick bobcat]

apparently I said something wrong

she got really annoyed

[kindred talon]

Lae'zel be like: ||I can't get enough of yout sweat" and I'm like, lady, I'm a dragonborn... do I even have fucking pores?||

[night oracle]

[kindred talon]

I wish I knew what a balanced party was

Like it's getting into areas where I probably need a character with high dex but I've not had much luck with asteroin

the one time I tried to use him all sneaky like he failed a stealth check and got nuked by a bunch of shit

[quick bobcat]

lol my skeletons are scaring people

[kindred talon]

what are you playing?

[quick bobcat]

I have raise dead on both Gale and Shadowheart, I have a ton of skellies at my command now

[kindred talon]

ah

[heavy hound]

Do you have to keep them out of cities?

[quick bobcat]

I'm not sure yet

I hope not, I don't wanna have to resummon them

[sweet moat]

So, funny thing, I already had a ||romance scene with Shadowheart long before the celebration. I think I might've done some things out of order. That said, her relationship with me is the strongest of all the companions, and she still treats me as if we're courting, so I don't think I did anything wrong either.||

I guess we'll see.

[quick bobcat]

oh yeah, me too

also, she said sorry for getting angry at me during our romantic scene

or not angry, but annoyed lol

lol, I'm at the ||hag's playhouse|| and it certainly is very morbidly amusing

[sweet moat]

Why did she get angry at you? So much of my interactions with her have been nothing but pleasant and relaxing.

[heavy hound]

I think you can push her on some stuff during the romance scene that she'd get angry at

[quick bobcat]

I looked her in the eye, then told her I'm checking for signs of ceremorphosis

I thought she'd laugh

[heavy hound]

lol

[quick bobcat]

can't take a joke smh

[heavy hound]

As a sidenote, I also did romance her and (Act 2 spoilers) ||me as it looks more and more like Shar is getting involved in the story on the wrong side ||

[sweet moat]

I feel like that's less of a joke and more of a mood-killer, because it reminds her that she's on borrowed time like you.

[heavy hound]

To be fair, playing Asterion as an origin that's like, very in character

[sweet moat]

Oh yeah, Merc's Asterion here.

[sweet moat]

Oh, by the way, I did indeed ||kill this hag. She put up one hell of a fight, but I got her on my first try. On the very last turn she knocked three of my companions into death saves, until finally Wyll (who had done nothing for the entire fight) got the last hit on her. Saved the girl, killed the wicked witch of the west, robbed her blind, taunted her corpse, and then resurrected the girl's husband...into a zombie. That said, it sounds like we'll be seeing them again at the city, so I'm not too worried. ||

[quick bobcat]

I'm about to do the fight myself

[kindred talon]

||seeing them again??? I killed the zombie||

[sweet moat]

Positioning is key. Also, be warned, if you have Shadowheart iny our party, prepare the Create Water spell. It is very necessary at the start of the fight. Water bottles for some God-forsaken reason are bugged and can't be flung mid-fight.

[kindred talon]

I actualyl had Katch throw a water barrel

worked the first time

[sweet moat]

I suppose that could work too, but I didn't have any barrels

[clear yarrow]

Water bottles can be flung

I do it often

[heavy hound]

You could probably also ||activate the commands for the cage asap during the fight and that would work, I wonder if you can jump up there and physically shove her ass down||

[sweet moat]

You have to do it outside of combat. They take an action to activate and an action to throw. I've tried it on multiple characters, you cannot throw them in combat.

[clear yarrow]

I've thrown it in combat many times

[sweet moat]

Hell, even cancelling the throw still eats up the action

[desert dove]

There's a Throw action, which should let you select the item after you click it

[sweet moat]

Well then my game is bugged.

[desert dove]

So, click Throw, then click the water bottle, then the target

[heavy hound]

Are all characters you try with low in strenght?

[sweet moat]

Well, Wyll was the one trying, and I tried with my main character, both are 8 in strength. Would that be the reason?

[heavy hound]

I think the strenght determine the maximum weight of what you can throw

I might be wrong tho

[sweet moat]

So I can't even throw a water bottle?

[clear yarrow]

Maybe it's a big carafe?

[kindred talon]

Noodle arms

[quick bobcat]

heh, I used ||magic missiles on all of the hag illusions and she got angry||

[sweet moat]

||She gets mad when you actually find her. Also, here's a tip for when she turns invisible (and she will turn invisible at some point): throw an alchemist's fire in the spot she was just in. More often than not she'll be set on fire and forced to re-emerge.||

[quick bobcat]

ah that's a good tip

too bad I sold all of them

[sweet moat]

...RIP

[quick bobcat]

I can try with my mage's fireball though

it's has a big AOE

[sweet moat]

You can, but that's an expensive spell.

[quick bobcat]

true

[sweet moat]

You could also try with those poison bottles...if you haven't sold them too.

[quick bobcat]

god, extra summons like skellies and imps help so much in this fight

oh yeah I have a ton of poison

[sweet moat]

Good

[kindred talon]

Baldur's gate makes me want to play dnd

then I remember that I have no friend irl or the books and also dragonborns don't have tails in D&D because hasbro is the devil

[quick bobcat]

I ended up ||letting the hag go in exchange for both mayrina and +1 in an ability||

but I dunno if the buff was worth it considering my character already has 19 dex

[kindred talon]

oh was there no trick?

I though there'd be a trick

[quick bobcat]

so I dunno what feat I'm gonna choose next

feels like I don't really need it

plus ||that she didn't even appreciate me rescuing her||

[kindred talon]

choose dungeon delver so you can detect traps just as you step on them and die

[quick bobcat]

I already do that

did she have any good loot?

[kindred talon]

i didn't know what to pick and picked toughness, which feels like a bad mistake

not that I recall. You can rob her house afterwards though

there's a staff in there, bunch of jewels and rings

[quick bobcat]

also it's like a buff only for one character

[sweet moat]

Well, first of all, Flitter is running a Curse of Strahd campaign with me, Rom, and one other person, and we could use another player. And second, Dragonborn can have tails in D&D, to hell with what WotC says. Every single Dragonborn I've seen in D&D has had a tail.

[kindred talon]

yeah! fuck WotC! everyone gets tails

not just the dragonborn, but the humans and elves too!

[sweet moat]

I mean, sure, lol.

[heavy hound]

She has a decent staff but definitely not incredible

Oh wait I think the staff might be in the house

I don't remember then

[quick bobcat]

I decided to instead ||let her go and keep mayrina, because of how ungrateful that bitch was||

though of course I couldn't have known that without trying the other route first, but oh well. I wish we were given more info in advance lol

[desert dove]

Toughness is not a great feat, but it's at least not a total trap like in 3e.

[sweet moat]

Why isn't it good? It sounds good.

[desert dove]

It's more HP, but other feats give you far more useful abilities, which can help you avoid combat entirely. Toughness is only useful if youre getting the shit kicked out of you constantly.

[sweet moat]

Fair

[desert dove]

In 3e, it gave you +3 HP. That's it. It did not scale.

[sweet moat]

That's awful

[desert dove]

Mhm. The designer came out later and said it was intentionally made as a bad feat, to "reward system mastery."

[sweet moat]

[quick bobcat]

LOL

[desert dove]

Yeeeah. I dislike 3e (which is why I don't like Pathfinder 1e).

[heavy hound]

In 3.5 it made some sense in some situations since it was a prequisite for stronger feats

Also you were given a lot more feats in 3.5 compared to 5e through your progression
I prefere 5e when they are fewer but much more impactful tho

[kindred talon]

I guess I should respec but I genuinely don’t know what feat to pick

At all

[heavy hound]

Which class are you playing?

[night oracle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0O2lkom6L5Q

[quick bobcat]

in most cases you wanna pick the first one and just put 2 points into your main attribute

[heavy hound]

That's definitely the safe bet, in most cases that's gonna work out well

[kindred talon]

any of them

[quick bobcat]

str/dex are the obvious choices, the other ones - it depends. For example my warlock scales very well with cha, but for my cleric I decided to level strength

[heavy hound]

For characters that came premade, getting the attribute and rounding up 2 odd attributes to even attributes is probably going to work out the best.

[quick bobcat]

for mage int is a must just like str/dex is for fighters n such

[heavy hound]

If the class you are looking at uses medium armor, keep in mind that more than 14 dex wont benefit your Armor Class

So for example, shadowheart starting a 13, dex, getting attributes and putting 1 to dex and one to wis both gives her 1 more AC and one more to her casting stat

[kindred talon]

my character is a sorc

[quick bobcat]

I forgot, does your spellcasting ability work for spell attack rolls?

[heavy hound]

Yes, both for attack rolls and for raising how high the enemies have to roll to save against your spell

The calculation for attack rolls made for spell is 1d20+proficency+main casting stat bonus

[quick bobcat]

yeah, so in that case you almost always just wanna level your main ability

[kindred talon]

does Sorc not benefit from charsma ?

[heavy hound]

Yes, charisma is their main casting stat

[quick bobcat]

your main ability affects attack rolls (chance to hit) for most of your actions and spells and whatnot. If it' str/dex it also adds extra damange to your weapons. Some actions also scale with your main ability like warlock's blast if you took agonizing blast

[heavy hound]

For casters dex is also good since it adds to their AC
Also Con since it's what you roll to mantain concentration if you are hit (also hp)

But yeah, main casting stat is definitely the priority

[quick bobcat]

only once you have your main stat up to 20 you should consider taking other ones I think

[heavy hound]

Depends on the caster, I definitely agree on wizards and sorcs it beein probably what you want to focus on.
Druids and clerics are more complicated since they don't necessarily use offensive spells every turn, and for buffs for example, your main casting stat doesn't necessarily do anything

For them having more con might be more important, since losing a spell you are concentrating on might fuck you over a lot more

There is also a feat that make you harder to interrupt which is a good consideration

[quick bobcat]

ooh yeah that could be useful

yeah on cleric it's definite not that good

I chose to max strength, but I might re-spec her into con now that you mention it

[heavy hound]

I would still get at least to 16 pretty fast.
Then honestly, a War domain cleric should stop there and just get more Strenght

[quick bobcat]

oh, mine is trickster

I didn't change her

what do the domains actually do?

[heavy hound]

Other domains it changes, a light/tempest domain cleric I'd bring wis up to 20 because they have fireball/lightning and that's worth maximizing

War Domain gives you extra attack at level 5 and you can wear heavy armor and martial weapons, pratically makes you more of a hybrid fighter that can buff and heal

I fucking love clerics

Oh actually I was wrong, you can't quite attack twice every turn, you get some charges you can spend to do an extra attack I think

I'm not sure been a long time

[quick bobcat]

wow, apparently Life domain gives you heal that doesn't require slots

but it kinda sucks =/

+3 health

how is that meant to be useful?

[heavy hound]

Which feature?

[quick bobcat]

I guess it's useful outside of comabt

oh uhh lemme see

"Preserve Life"

oh wait it requires channel divinity

[heavy hound]

Oh looking around it seems like it's 3 healing per cleric level

[quick bobcat]

that's even worse

oh

still, it needs a divinity slot which is not amazing

[heavy hound]

Which it's respectable, and you get more Channel Divinity as you go on

If you don't have to turn undead you don't use those for much else

[quick bobcat]

I might re-spec her to be a life cleric then

because I've literally never even once used any of my trickery spells

that's an absolute waste

[heavy hound]

Yeah, to be fair tho, invoke duplicity if you have all your party go at once can go hard

Especially if you have the big boss you want to kill near to you

It's literally advantage to your whole party

[quick bobcat]

hm, true

but then again, so is bless

and that's like the same thing

[heavy hound]

Bless isn't advantage but it's still very good

But it uses a spell slot which is more valuable than a channel divinity charge

[quick bobcat]

oh wait, invoke duplicity doesn't need slots

[heavy hound]

Make sure you give your rogue the blessing of the trickster too if you start with him hidden

Advantage on those rolls is pretty good

[quick bobcat]

oh

yeah, I should probably do that

[heavy hound]

Also if you ever happen to want your whole party to sneak, pass without trace is good, that said I can't say I ever do that

I'm a barbarian, sneaking is for cowards

Except when I do it

[quick bobcat]

also, do you have any idea why I remember reading that warlock gets 2 hits on his imp at level 5, but my imp never seems to be able to attack twice

[heavy hound]

It should be able to, weird

[quick bobcat]

it just.. doesn't

it worked like once

[heavy hound]

Try to resummon it?

[quick bobcat]

then it just stopped working

[heavy hound]

[quick bobcat]

is it once per long rest or something?

[heavy hound]

Nah it should just be able to

[quick bobcat]

well I've been playing at a disadvantage ever since I reached level 5 then

because my imp only ever attacks once

[heavy hound]

Weird

[quick bobcat]

wait, does bite count as an attack?

[heavy hound]

It should

Unless it's a bonus action move it usually counts as one of your attacks

[quick bobcat]

maybe it's because I keep using bite instead of attacking normally

[heavy hound]

In which case it'd still be a bug but it'd explain why it worked that other time

I think you can pratically test it by going to camp, enter turn mode, and wacking a training dummy

So it shouldn't be hard to test

[quick bobcat]

yeah I'll try in a minute

[night oracle]

https://vxtwitter.com/Dansgaming/status/1689257837027835904

[quick bobcat]

update: yeah it just doesn't work no matter what I do

[quick bobcat]

seems like it works only once per summon

when I resummoned my imp it worked, then on the next turn I couldn't do it

[heavy hound]

Seems like a bug to me, very weird

[quick bobcat]

[heavy hound]

I would respec to a tome or blade pact honestly

At least until they fix it

[quick bobcat]

I never ever use melee attacks with him

as for tome.. yeah. Maybe

an extra zombie is gonna be nice

but not as good as an imp with 2 attacks

apparently other people are also having issues with it

https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/15jempp/warlock_pact_of_the_chain_extra_attack_not_always/

welp, pact of the tome it is

[quick bobcat]

I got the whole graveyard gang

[granite thorn]

Spooky scary skeletons

[quick bobcat]

if only there was a way to get animate dead on my rogue too

[sweet moat]

Wait, you can change their hair colors?

[quick bobcat]

wdym?

those are default

[sweet moat]

Gale does not have grey hair for me, and Shadowheart doesn't have purple.

[heavy hound]

There is probably an item you can get at some point that let you cast animated dead

I'd be surprised if there isn't at least

[quick bobcat]

..huh

[heavy hound]

That's how it looks for me as well

[sweet moat]

For me, Gale has brown hair, and Shadowheart has pitch black. There is no purple at all.

[kindred talon]

Necromancy changes you

[tame thistle]

https://twitter.com/BlondeNerd/status/1688696704550514690

Brittney Brombacher (@BlondeNerd)

While playing Baldur’s Gate 3 I came across a poisonous vent and needed something to cover it. While scrolling through my inventory I FOUND A WHOLE-ASS GOBLIN CORPSE IN MY BACKPACK

it worked splendidly

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Twitter · Aug 7, 2023, 11:40 PM

[sweet moat]

Yeah, I discovered that poisonous vents can indeed be covered with bodies. Made getting to the ||hag|| a lot easier.

[quick bobcat]

Oh I just did some hardcore parkour to get through that part

Didn't even touch the ||gas clouds|| and stuff

[sweet moat]

[kindred talon]

Feather fall is your friend

[quick bobcat]

I wonder if this stacks with magic armor

[granite thorn]

RaW i think you're fine

[quick bobcat]

that's so cool, so you can get like 15 ac without even equipping any armor

[granite thorn]

at the cost of a spell slot

[quick bobcat]

my warlock actually gets it for free

[night oracle]

my monk needs that...

[granite thorn]

the cost of an infusion then

which are stupid powerful btw, especially later levels

[heavy hound]

It does, it's definitely massive for barbarians monks and casters

[granite thorn]

https://5e.tools/index.html i think 5e tools will be super helpful for most people here

[heavy hound]

That said, gale can do without since you can give him a shield, but any non human caster usually don't have proficency in those

[granite thorn]

im not sure the game follows D&Ds rules exactly but this should be a good buide

[heavy hound]

There are some differences

But yeah it's good to get at least a vibe of what to expect

[quick bobcat]

wait what happens if you give someone a shield without a proficiency?

[granite thorn]

you die

[heavy hound]

I think they have disadvantage on a bunch of stuff

I would try but I think literally everyone in my party is proficent with shields

[granite thorn]

this is the armour section, i assume sheilds count as armour so probably this:

[heavy hound]

Yeah basically you stop functioning

Now I have the idea of a cursed shield you can't unequip, that's made as a way to completely disable caputured casters

You strap it to their arm and they fall over as if you grab a cat by the scruff on its neck

[quick bobcat]

wow, the ||underdark|| is HUGE

[heavy hound]

Hey I found a cute interaction

You know how sometimes when you speak with the dead, it says that the corpse isn't willing to speak to its killer

Well, disguise self bypasses that

[granite thorn]

[quick bobcat]

lol

[jaunty basin]

perfect example of a completely legitimate time to ask "is that a bug or a feature?"

and anyone familiar with the tone of this game will say "feature"

[heavy hound]

Oh it's definitely intentional

I assume it also works when you are hunted down for having killed a guard

[granite thorn]

yep

tho theres a chek to see though it

[jaunty basin]

but does the "refuse to speak to killer" thing consume one of your 5 questions?

[heavy hound]

Yeah probably the dead dude doesn't get a check

It basically uses up the corpse

So yeah, it's pretty important to avoid it

[jaunty basin]

when I saw the D&D movie I remember wondering if the 5 questions limit was just something they made up for comedy value or if that was a real game rule

[heavy hound]

It's a thing from the game, even tho the fact that they'd hang around if you don't respond is a comedy thing

[granite thorn]

yeah that part isnt RaW

its a 10 min duration

but its funny, i'd totally see a DM houseruling that

[heavy hound]

Keep in mind tho, that there are a 5 editions of the game and most of those spells are around for a long time, so differences aren't necessarily a mistake, as long as they get the vibes right for it.

[granite thorn]

als DMs can change whatever they like on the fly if it fits the mood

[heavy hound]

Like, many spells work in wildly different ways between editions

[jaunty basin]

interesting, it can't even speculate in that state

[granite thorn]

in 4E, magic missle was a cantrip!

[jaunty basin]

lol

I still get cantrips and caltrops mixed up

[granite thorn]

cantrips are basically super simple spells that are ingrained into your muscle memory

[jaunty basin]

right, those are the ones you don't need to have assigned to a spell slot at the last rest to be able to cast?

[granite thorn]

yeah

but you can only ever know a limited number

most classes let you switch out levelled spells in some manner but cantrips are perminant

basically because they're ones that you drilled for months to let you do them as easilly as swinging a sword

thats how i look at them atleast

[quick bobcat]

spoiler: underdark
I found ||mushroom people||

this place looks incredible though

for some reason they are following me while telling me to go away

[jaunty basin]

you're not away enough yet

[quick bobcat]

oh I think they're freaking out over my zombies lol

probably an unintended interaction

[heavy hound]

Very hypocritical of them given how they animate a bunch of dead too

[quick bobcat]

I think every friendly NPC freaks out over summoned zombies and skellies

[heavy hound]

IDK if the goblins would

[sweet moat]

I am currently at the very start of ||the Underdark||, having completed all (or at least I think all) of the quests I need to in the starting area.

I cleared out the grove, the bog, the High Road, the goblin fort, and the abandoned village...

...

...F*ck, I just remembered while typing this, I forgot to finish up those damn ||teleporting spiders under the ruined village...||

[heavy hound]

So if you play an evil campaign it's probably easier

[quick bobcat]

you can still talk with them, they just start running away which is annoying

[heavy hound]

Unlock the undead and leave them out until you are done with the social interactions?

[quick bobcat]

the underdark is the coolest part of the game yet

[heavy hound]

Keep in mind, this is still act 1

Of 3

[quick bobcat]

yeah, I know. That's kind of insane, I put 50 hours into the game already and I'm still not done with the first area

what is the spellcasting ability for spells gained from necklaces and rings?

the main ability?

[heavy hound]

Ok here is the thing, usually it depends on the item in the tabletop, here they don't seem to tell you

I should do some testing about it

[quick bobcat]

I got a ||fat mushroom guy|| running around with me now

[heavy hound]

It's very weak in combat but I found a couple of uses for it during the game

I wonder if you can polymorph him once you get that spell into something...bigger

[quick bobcat]

spoiler: underdark
this is getting ridiculous, I have a full zoo running around

very fun

also one of the ||mushroom dudes|| got so freaked out by my skellies that he is permanently following me around now

just sayin "shoo, get out"

amusing bug

[heavy hound]

[night oracle]

Clearly 3

[quick bobcat]

spoiler: underdark
holy shit, so I just beat a ||Bulette|| and ||the fat mushroom guy let me raise it|| This is so cool

this area is a dream for a necromancer player

[quick bobcat]

me n the boys selfie

[heavy hound]

lol

[heavy hound]

That'll definitely make what happens in that zone more interesting, i didn't have the guy with me and it went in one way and I had some options, I feel like with him you'll have different options presented to you

[sweet moat]

Big ||teleporting spider matriarch|| slain under the blighted village. But as it turns out, there was more that I was missing from the beginning area. I forgot about that ||red dragon|| I saw waaaaaay back at the grove, lol.

Oh thank God, I don't have to fight ||the dragon.||

Man, screw these ||Gith warriors at the broken bridge. They each get three actions per turn, plus a bonus action and movement, they've got poison-tipped arrows and swords, and they ALL have high AC. Level 5 characters are not supposed to be this strong in any D&D game ever.||

Doesn't help that each of my attack rolls are always below 5, even with advantage...

FFS, two enemies just rolled, and I'm not joking, six natural 20s in a row..

On the first round

[heavy hound]

lol

[sweet moat]

Killed Shadowheart and Karlach instantly

[night oracle]

....

||I just got rolled over by ye olde rolling giant boulder trap||

[sweet moat]

Oh yeah, that thing is hilarious.

Also, finally killed ||those Gith warriors. Screw those guys, seriously.||

[desert dove]

Man, I am so far behind y'all. At least I'll get to play again tomorrow.

[night oracle]

Just recruited ||Karlach. She's delightfully silly||

[sweet moat]

||OOOH SWEET HOLY MOTHER OF ALL F*CK. NOPE!||

There we go.

Still though...NOPE!

I am turning around and going the complete opposite direction. ||This thing can enjoy its statues all it likes. ||

[sweet moat]

Man, the ||underdark|| is making me save every five seconds...

[sweet moat]

Oh, the ||arcane turrets|| are just mean...

[kindred talon]

Me: ||I got to find this missing husband. Hey look, a field of explosive mushrooms, I better blow it up first. triggers the mushroom to release spores, then sets it on fire||
Me, hearing screaming, looks at the quest marker. "ah, shit."

[night oracle]

[kindred talon]

Me, speaking with his wife after: "inflammable means flammable? what a realm!"

[kindred talon]

you know, the game is pretty impressive

maybe I've just not played too many 'modern' games, but like I give a gnome a potion and the animation correctly aligns the bottle (which has an in game model) with the lips

[quick bobcat]

The fuck?! Another one?

[granite thorn]

Lol

[granite thorn]

Maybe not quite appropriate for here tho

[night oracle]

If it was being really graphic about it I'd agree but I'd say that's just on the limit

[night oracle]

https://open.spotify.com/album/6JR4qLOXu96krMWxBTpXSR?si=b9d0b2ca7a354b72&nd=1

[quick bobcat]

I still think DOS2's ost is vastly superior to BG3

[exotic pelican]

I see Nvidia released drivers for BG3. The game told me to update when I tried to launch it today.

[night oracle]

Yup, yesterday evening

[granite thorn]

Yep

[desert dove]

Yes, but I don't think it actively changed anything.

I've got all the same settings as I did before.

[quick bobcat]

I'm assuming it's just better performance?

[desert dove]

Supposedly

[granite thorn]

probably some tiny optimisations or edge case issues patched

[quick bobcat]

also here's a tip to anyone using DLSS: you should disable sharpening entirely

it looks like absolute trash

[quick bobcat]

I was wondering why my game was looking so ugly with DLSS on and then after like only 10 hours of gameplay I realized it was the ugly ass sharpening

oh, you're not using DLSS, you're good

for me though, I can't run the game above 60 without DLSS

[desert dove]

Yeah, apparently my system is able to run okay without it.

[quick bobcat]

you have a 3070TI right?

that's definitely good enough even for 1440p 144hz I think

[desert dove]

3060 Ti

[quick bobcat]

oh

well I have a 3060m and and high settings 1440p it only gets me like 50-60 frames

[desert dove]

But I've also got that AMD 5800X3D CPU, so maybe that's helping with the extra cache

[quick bobcat]

so I kinda have to play with DLSS on

oh my CPU util is at like 20%

while GPU is churning away at 100%

[desert dove]

I may have to figure out how to run some benchmarks.

[quick bobcat]

you can enable a little info window if you have nvidia geforce experience

it shows you your fps, frame times and cpu/gpu util %

[desert dove]

Oh nice

I was using Steam's FPS counter, but forgot GeForce could display all that other stuff

[quick bobcat]

yeah, press alt+z in-game, then you can look around the settings for a performance monitor and configure what you want to see

then you can toggle it with alt+r in-game

[desert dove]

Hotfix 2.1 is out:

CHANGES

• Fixed an issue with save games that could occur if a save file grew too large.
• Re-enabled Larian Cloud savegames.

As it turns out, many of you were doing so much in Baldur’s Gate 3 that some of your personal ‘story’ databases (where your choices and actions are stored) got too big. We now made the size infinite (or at least as infinite as you have storage space), to account for the sheer amount of things you’re all doing on your journeys.

As of today, we’re also reactivating cross-saves as we near our PlayStation 5 launch.

[granite thorn]

lol

im suprised they didnt test that first one

[jaunty basin]

gotta focus on those small, self-contained, repeatable test cases

it's very rare in software that you want to remove a hard limit on how crazy users can get before they hurt themselves, usually you end up regretting a lack of limits when you get weird crashes only in prod

I suppose if a dev had maintained a single save file the entire time they were on the project, they'd have hit this, but during dev everyone's saves would likely be invalidated every other day

[quick bobcat]

they still haven't fixed lvl5 imp attack bug

it makes the warlock of the chain very weak

[jaunty basin]

I wonder how long the bug backlog is at this point

do we know for sure if they consider the l5 imp thing a bug?

[quick bobcat]

I'm almost sure. I've seen other people complain about it on reddit. Also it does make sense considering the pact of the blade warlocks get 2 attacks and that does work correctly as far as I know

[desert dove]

The patch note did say they're working on a 3rd hotfix patch already

[quick bobcat]

https://youtu.be/tg0bGUdJ9hg

[granite thorn]

gah im stuck picking chain, blade or tome
this is someone known for using his blade but i dont like that playstyle on warlocks
i dont really want to have to deal with a familiar
but the tome cantrip options arent my faves either, aside from vicious mockery, but that one is just funny

[quick bobcat]

Pick tome because you'll get animate dead at level 5

That's pretty sick

As well as some other really powerful spells

I think a free chain lightning too?

[granite thorn]

that i think is unrelatedto the pact

its your otherworldly patron feature

[quick bobcat]

What do you mean?

I'm talking about the deepened pact at level 5

Tome warlocks get animate dead and chain lightning for free

Chain warlocks get double attacks on their familiar

And blade warlocks get double attacks on their enchanted weapons or something like that

[granite thorn]

what? that must be a game thing only, level 5 gives you +1 proficiency bonus and 3rd level spells only

oh and one invocation slot

and a new spell

deepend pact isnt a thing

[quick bobcat]

What?? Wait a second

No there is definetely a deepened pact feature

[granite thorn]

i said its a game thing, not a tabletop thing

[quick bobcat]

I mean I literally got it yesterday, it's not like I was hallucinating

Ohhh

[granite thorn]

interesting departure

i suppose thats their excuse for limiting your spell choices

[quick bobcat]

Right, well that's one of Larian's homebrew decisions I guess

[granite thorn]

its not really homebrew, it just restricts your spell choices for balance purposes
which is fine

[quick bobcat]

Yeah but the new level 5 class feature

That's new

[granite thorn]

also knowing there are unknown features later on that dont appear in the char level up screen right now makes the choice harder!

i guess ill go pact of the tome because i prefer that style of play

oh good i get to switch out a spell too, i chose to get shatter as thats the first AOE spell i think i currently have and also i know how it works

oh yay i succeded a perception check to find the other side of the hidden door i just went through

[kindred talon]

it'd be concerning if you had failed it

[granite thorn]

yes and no
you can be aware theres a door but be unable to open it

[quick bobcat]

holy shit

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1081185029885009962/1139218652340691086/image.png

[night oracle]

[sweet moat]

Where is this from?

[quick bobcat]

I tamed a ||bulette thanks to the fat mushroom guy||

so I have a weapon that can cause the user to go mad if they don't attack for a turn. During a fight my shadowheart went mad, pushed Wyll off a ledge which instantly killed him which then gave me the achievement for killing someone by pushing them off a ledge

[sweet moat]

Ngl, that's a terrible weapon, I'd never go for it, even if it tripled my damage output. It's not worth the hassle.

[night oracle]

I looted it yesterday, but been hesitant to use it

[quick bobcat]

yeah I'm gonna fucking throw that thing away after this

funniest thing, Wyll got pushed to his death again in the next fight a couple of minutes later

poor wyll

[sweet moat]

Wyll has had some of the worst luck for me too. In one fight, he got put into death saves, so I helped him out. Then he got knocked out again immediately afterwards, so I helped him out again. Then, after he had just managed to drink a potion, he got knocked out again. My character kept screaming "Wyll, noooo!" every time.

[quick bobcat]

lol

[granite thorn]

you did WHAT

[quick bobcat]

flumph mating rituals

[granite thorn]

lol

[sweet moat]

Oh, you didn't ||pass the investigation (or was it insight?) check, huh?||

[quick bobcat]

No I did

Afterwards

[sweet moat]

Ah, good

[granite thorn]

oh boy i didnt realise barbarians got wild magic

fuck it thats what im picking, cant ever say no to chaos like that

[exotic pelican]

In Act 2 I killed a ||Cloaker|| and didn't get a ||cloak|| from it. So disappointing.

[quick bobcat]

https://youtu.be/iWdZhKFtxKg

state of the game industry in 2023 be like

[night oracle]

That the whole "this shouldn't be industry standard" thing?

[sweet moat]

That's the thing though, this really should be industry standard. That's what we as customers pay them for.

[glossy palm]

Yes

I cant really send the meme here so ill summarize how it really should be

[night oracle]

Depends on what they're talking about. THe sheer size of the game is hard to do since it's almost AAA size amount of people who were working on this, whereas a lot of CRPG are usually a lot smaller

(400+ people vs normal teams of say 40-50)

Now if they're talking about full game, no microtransactions? Agreed

For the first point.. dunno if i agree but I definitely see their point

[glossy palm]

Robin- “baldurs gate 3 sets the bar to high for rpg devs……
Batman slaps robin -“Just put more effort into making quality games”

[night oracle]

BG3 had: massive amounts of funding - to the point of them not having to worry.
No being looked over the shoulder by the D&D folk (as I understand it)
No set release date that it HAD to ship by

It's pretty much a perfect storm of the best conditions possible

[quick bobcat]

I diddly done do'd it

[sweet moat]

I'll be doing this too today if I can. Hopefully.

[quick bobcat]

he stoopid and tried paralyzing my rogue like thrice

missed all 3

I'm assuming it's a dex save

[kindred talon]

the points about it being a perfect storm are true and all but it doesn't really change things about the greater point. If devs need things like no set release date? make it so

[quick bobcat]

companies are too greedy to do that

[glossy palm]

^

Like how we get a new cod every year despite warzone being basically the same game mode just with different skins

Or how games are pushed to be rushed for deadlines due financial expectations being lower than expected such as Microsoft

[night oracle]

Oh absolutely, I don't disagree that it should be like that. But to say that it is the new standard? It has so many things that was going for it that is not the standard that to expect that from others is unreasonable

Would be fantastic, i don't disagree. But unlikely to happen

[glossy palm]

Is it the new standard i wouldnt say

But it definitely raises expectations on what people want

[night oracle]

It's a bar that should be reached

[glossy palm]

^

[night oracle]

That's the key word there. Should, rather than is

[glossy palm]

Ive made a point about this previously but the triple a industry cant continue with its current cycle of pushing stuff out banking on life services to profit it

Weve seen failure after failure the past few years with games trying to do it.

And its going to have to make them adapt as they cant keep losing money trying to be the next fortnite or warzone

[night oracle]

ANd it needs to happen more to a greater degree - as in, it needs to actually make a financial dent. Some of these games are still releasing early like that and making bank - so the punishment of bad PR isn't enough

[quick bobcat]

my companions are trying to ||kill each other||!!

[jaunty basin]

yep, ultimately people get what they pay for; as long as people keep buying games during their buggy launch period, publishers are gonna push to launch while it's buggy

ponders whether I've done that

[heavy hound]

I mean, to be fair, they aren't wrong.
Not every game in this genre can be Baldur's Gate 3, budget alone is anomalous for a game in this genre and the several years dev cycle by industry veterans in the genre that were given the license for the perfect IP for their talents.

It's kind of a lightning in a bottle.
Now ideally the fact that it sold so well will mean that more publishers are encouraged to make game with this level of polish but it's not something the devs can guarantee, it's not really in their hands

[night oracle]

Pretty much what we've been saying

[heavy hound]

Yeah I wasn't scrolled down because Discord sucks

I think that it should be industry standard but it's also unrealistic to expect it'd be.
To be honest the polish and the scope aren't really what I'd even like for it to become industry standards, sometimes it's okay if a game is a bit jank if it's trying new thing or having a game with a smaller scope.

You can't always commit to start a 100 hours RPG and I'd like to have shorter experiences too.

What everyone would like to see become industry standard I feel like it's making a game and not sell a bunch of mictrotransactions attached to it.
But yeah, devs have even less control on that, none want to fill the game they are making with microtransations but in many cases it's the only way they'll get to make the game in the first place.

The soultion would be for customers to stop buying games with shitty monetisation but good luck with that

[night oracle]

Indeed

[jaunty basin]

You can't always commit to start a 100 hours RPG and I'd like to have shorter experiences too.

I resemble that remark

[night oracle]

Case in point, boycotts of big games with such monetization~

[glossy palm]

The 2009 one not the 2021 one

[quick bobcat]

I think it's worth noting that most of the devs that came out to voice their negative opinion about Baldur's Gate 3 setting unrealistic standards are all from massive billion dollar companies with hundreds upon hundreds of developers

[heavy hound]

BG3 landed in the perfect moment after I played dozens of hours of X4, a space sim sorta, and I needed a palate clenser, but yeah, after that I feel like I'll appreciate Armored Core.
After all this D&D boosting towards an enemy mech and cleaving it in half with a laser sword is gonna feel pretty good

[quick bobcat]

we're not talking about expectations from AA and indie studios here

[night oracle]

WHo all have their owners and shareholders demanding money every second of every hour

[quick bobcat]

I see absolutely 0 excuse from huge industry leading companies saying that they "can't afford to make games like that" or whatever nonsense

[glossy palm]

Yeah no ones buying their excuse for that after raising the price to $70 for new releases

[night oracle]

They can't afford to take the risk, difference

The C suite are intensely risk averse

[quick bobcat]

and this is what I mean when I say "this is what the game industry has come to"

absolutely pitiful

[night oracle]

Now, with BG3 paving the way? Yeah, sure, we might get more sometime in the future - but it needed to have the lightning in the bottle as gen said to show that it's out there

Though to be fair, a lot of that success I think is just because Larian is Larian

[heavy hound]

Well keep in mind that what you invest in a game is proportional what you expect to get for selling it.
Just because you have infinite money you probably wouldn't spend the same budget with making a nichè game like a strategy game, vs what you'd spend making Horizon Zero Dawn

[glossy palm]

The closest will see something to comparisons to that is starfield next month

[quick bobcat]

what? no

[heavy hound]

CRPG so far, has been a nichè genre.
Now I am not sure it'll still be, BG3 sold what you'd expect a much bigger genre to sell and no doubt introduced a lot of new people to it

[night oracle]

Nah I'd say he's right

[quick bobcat]

I don't trust bethesda with a single thing anymore

[jaunty basin]

heck, being a CRPG probably counts as "niche" at least a little

[quick bobcat]

they're dead to me

[jaunty basin]

though maybe that's about to change a little

[night oracle]

And that already has the name brand as well - as in, Skyrim in space. Has all these years of elder scrolls behind it to propel it forward

[jaunty basin]

oh Gen just said that

[quick bobcat]

I have extremely low expectations for starfield. If it's good then nice, I'll have a swell time. Otherwise? Who cares, might be another fallout 76 situation for all we know

[night oracle]

Same, personally. I tried Fallout 4 and then skyrim and the pure and utter jank and speed of the game has completely turned me off any of their stuff

[glossy palm]

Yeah

[jaunty basin]

(pretty much everything Bethesda does is "not my thing" so no opinion on Starfield)

[quick bobcat]

I have not a single shred of hope for any Bethesda games anymore

[night oracle]

( I tried skyrim several times. The combat system is utter shite)

[glossy palm]

Im fully expecting larian rpg vs triple a industry rpg videos after it launches

[heavy hound]

Yeah it's what I meant with BG3 being a lightning in a bottle.
Spending that much money making it, is already a big risk.
It's by all accounts, a very risky decision that paid off, and the only reason it happened is that the CEO at Larian is a huge fucking nerd

[jaunty basin]

the discourse around Skyrim almost immediately convinced me I would hate it lol

[glossy palm]

I got a mod that makes it more like dark souls combat which makes it. Sooo much more tolerable

[night oracle]

[quick bobcat]

not since f76 (not to mention the multitude of disasters since)

[night oracle]

I might consider that, lol

[glass veldt]

In a move some might be surprised by, I agree completely and thoroughly with everything he has to say here.

[night oracle]

I don't think most of us actually watched it, what did he actually say? A tl;dr

[glass veldt]

He has a lot to say and it’s better to just watch the ten minutes

[quick bobcat]

compared a bunch of modern similar AAA games to BG3 and showed how greedy and lazy they are

[glass veldt]

And it does quantify much of my feelings about the state of the games industry

[night oracle]

Fair, i'm just mid-acting class atm

[heavy hound]

IDK this discourse has been on for a month now, IDK if watching that dude will add anything I haven't heard about the subject

[jaunty basin]

fiiiine I'll watch the video

[glossy palm]

It probably will be things i already heard but i will also

[glass veldt]

There’s something I’ve been keeping to to myself since the BG3 hype started but it is relevant to this: I don’t get why people think that this game’s mechanics are incredibly unusual. In my opinion, based on what I’ve seen in this game so far it’s just…. What I expect to work in any half-decently designed RPG game.

So I do agree that the standard does need to be raised and BG3 is a good benchmark to compare to.

[night oracle]

It's harder to penetrate than D:OS2's and other CRPG i've played in recent times, I find. But I think that's the D&D ruleset

[glass veldt]

I disagree with that assessment too

It’s not just that it’s D&D, that’s beside the point

[night oracle]

I mean, this is coming from me having played both. Some stuff i'm finding harder to understand

[glass veldt]

Throwing water on a person that’s on fire should put them out in every game. The fact that this blows people’s minds is actually concerning to me.

[heavy hound]

I mean, I can't agree with it because I bounced off DOS2, but being already familiar with the ruleset definitely helped in BG3

[night oracle]

Ah. That sounds like people new to the genre

[glass veldt]

Further, the response from some devs that I’ve seen to BG3 has been just utterly asinine.

[glass veldt]

My point is that things like that are not genre-dependent

[heavy hound]

I think this one has a lot bigger scope than most other CRPGs I played, and it's the 1st one made with modern day everything.
Not perfect, of course, but I've been surprised of what you can do and the variety of outcomes a situation can have.

[glass veldt]

BG3 is doing a lot of stuff that I would think would be a bare minimum for any RPG in the 2020s and people being shocked by it is just… worrying.

[quick bobcat]

Yeah, I'm also kinda surprised that people are calling this a "groundbreaking" and "next-gen" game in terms of gameplay when DOS2 has already had all of this figured out like 5 years prior (and arguably did some things better, imo)

[heavy hound]

I strong disagree it's the bare minium, it's pretty much at least at the same level of every other RPG I ever played

Probably above it

[glass veldt]

Now, scope is a different matter, yes. BG3 is enormous and I’m not saying every game needs to meet this scope in terms of the sheer volume of content. But mechanics? Yeah, that just seems… not odd at all.

[jaunty basin]

yeah the IGN video is mostly saying the same stuff we're saying with way more examples, but it left out the unique dev circumstances

[heavy hound]

Of course it'll never give you the true freedom of a D&D campaign because there isn't an infinite amount of possibilities they can put in the game, but the variety is pretty impressive

[glass veldt]

Right

[jaunty basin]

Magicka had this in 2011, and that's not even an RPG!

[night oracle]

looks through https://www.gog.com/en/games?tags=crpg to see what he's played

(as steam's tag seems to be more polluted)

[glass veldt]

Yeah I could probably list a bunch of games that do this, but it’s just one of many examples that are being put forth as “why don’t AAA games do this?!” and I’m either thinking “they do, though” or “wait, they don’t?” for nearly all of the examples I’ve seen so far

[jaunty basin]

I think we're basically repeating this old conversation from general gaming: #1032716748887179434 message

[heavy hound]

As far as mechanics, it's not as innovative as Disco Elysium because nothing is, obviously
But the conversation system and the way it makes rolls, both the ones you do explicitly make and the one it makes in the background for you, the amount of unique lines you can say depending on your class subclass race, and previous decisions, eh, it's definitely above bare minimum while it's definitely not unheard of.

For combat mechanics it's a competent tatics based RPG, basically DOS2 level which was at the time of its release, considered the best in the market.

Nothing it does I'd describe as bare minum to expect personally

[glossy palm]

Yeah the video was about what i expected

[night oracle]

BG1 I tried but bounced off, too used to more modern game's QoL changes.
Disco Elysium, great stuff.
Planescame Torment, similar to BG1 but I think i might try again.
Pathfinder Kingmager, tried it but stumbled on some difficulty of fights.
Solasta, same. There's one apparently famous fight near the start that's stupid hard. Gave up there.
Tower of Time: a bit janky and a bit different but interesting enough.
Tyranny: Had a lot of fun with this.
DOS 1 & 2. Had fun with both but 2 is obviously muuuuuch better.
Pillars of Eternity: also a very good one. I found 2 easier to get into than 1.

[jaunty basin]

I'm not sure I'd call DE mechanically innovative, the novelty of that perk system is mostly down to how it interacts with the game's amazing writing

[heavy hound]

The problems with all the old D&D game is that I'd have to tangle with 3.5e mechanics, and that's true pain

[heavy hound]

What I consider innovative in DE is the internal monologue

[night oracle]

I think of that list, outside of DOS2, I'd be recommending Tyranny and Pillars

[jaunty basin]

yeah I played Planescape purely for the story, spent a few minutes reading a thorough walkthrough for the gameplay side before even booting it up, would've been very bad without that prep

[heavy hound]

I never felt I had such control and understanding on a character inner world

[night oracle]

I might need that

[jaunty basin]

oh, uh

I think https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/pc/187975-planescape-torment/faqs/78258 was the one I used

[night oracle]

My dad isn't a gamer, his (somewhat younger) girlfriend isn't either but I introduced them to it when I lived with him for a few months. Mostly them watching me play Uncharted. Since then they've gotten into the Syberia games and some Sherlock games.
And this most recent trip, I brought my laptop and introduced them to Disco Elysium and oh boy she got lost into it

[jaunty basin]

particularly https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/ps4/258151-planescape-torment-enhanced-edition/faqs/78258/characters had all the concrete "spend your levels on this" advice that I blindly followed to good effect

[night oracle]

[heavy hound]

Oh yeah, this is wrong
Fuck the inventory system, that's pretty bad.
All else it's great to amazing

[sweet moat]

For Kingmaker, the early fights are indeed veeeeery hard, because you don't get many magic items at first and enemies tend to swarm. But once you actually start building the kingdom, the fights start to get more reasonable, and you also start to level up faster and pick up a lot more magic items.

But if you want a much better game, play Wrath of the Righteous. It's like night and day, with soooooo many QoL improvements, and a much better balance in difficulty.

Also better music too, although Kingmaker had its own fair share of bangers. :P

[night oracle]

The one that really killed me was some... temple ruins and there were spectral boars and/or bears outside?

[sweet moat]

Oh yeah, that was a shit fight. But it gets easier, trust me.

[jaunty basin]

to complete the implied thought from back here: this is why I'm playing Oxenfree 2 while we muse about RPG mechanics

[quick bobcat]

well.. shit

[jaunty basin]

it looks just like in the movie!

[quick bobcat]

there's 3 of them..

[quick bobcat]

wooo mor skellies

now if only my rogue could sommon one too, I really want more

[desert dove]

Ugh, didn't get to play at all today

[quick bobcat]

how are some enemies shooting me twice? I thought double attack was only for melee users?

[heavy hound]

No two attacks can be of any kind as long as they are weapon attack

A fighter with a bow should be able to attack twice in a turn

In fact, a lot of bow builds are fighters

[quick bobcat]

ahh okay

looks like going for ranged rogue was a poor choice then

should've just had lae'zel as my ranged fighter

[heavy hound]

Ranged rogue is a good choice, they are squishier than other classes so they benefit from being able to stay at range

Also they can't wear heavy armor so they tend to have good dex which mean a high chance to hit with bows

[sweet moat]

I find that ranged rogues are best at the start of combat or if they're very high up. But after that, it's better to have them get close and deal as much damage as possible with quick melee hit-and-runs.

Remember, this isn't Divinity. Ranged attacks in that game were OP and amazing, but in this one it's better to not focus strictly on one weapon.

[heavy hound]

As long as you can get in that one sneak attack per turn rogue do fine from any distance IMO, from up close tho, having the ability to dual weild means one extra chance to sneak attack which is pretty valuable

Insulates you from one bad roll preventing you from applying your sneak attack damage for the turn

Also gives you the option to flourish into a melee attack that allows you to sneak attack even if none of your allies is near the target, assuming the enemy fails the save

(since flourish can put enemies off balance, giving you advantage on the next roll)

[quick bobcat]

huh, my game's been crashing a lot lately

that's like the second crash today

or third

anyone else getting this?

[heavy hound]

I'm having the opposite thing, I've had a few crash before, now that I updated my drivers and since the recent hotfixes it has been more stable

[desert dove]

I've not had the game crash at all.

[heavy hound]

If you are using Vulkan, I heard DirectX 11 is a bit more stable

[quick bobcat]

LOL, for me it's the opposite. It didn't crash at all during the first few days and now it's crashing a lot

funny how that works huh

I'm using DX11

maybe I should switch to Vulkan instead

[heavy hound]

Give it a shot

[sweet moat]

My rogue is a dual-wielder, and it's awesome so far. Easily the best choice I could've made early-game. The second strike doesn't do much damage, but sometimes it's just enough to turn the tide.

[desert dove]

Vulkan is primarily for AMD GPUs right?

[quick bobcat]

nah, I think Vulkan works with everything

[glass veldt]

AMD and Nvidia both fully support Vulkan

[desert dove]

Huh, neat

[quick bobcat]

I wanna try to re-spec my rogue into an arcane trickster to get access to another animate dead

that way I'll be able to have more skeletons than party members

[heavy hound]

I think it's just a more performing but relatively young API, in my experience I had more crashes with Vulkan in other games but consistently better performances

[glass veldt]

Nvidia spent some resources helping to define Vulkan and were very quick to put out drivers to support it when it went 1.0

[desert dove]

Huh, neat

[quick bobcat]

Gen, you said there was a talisman of animate dead somewhere though?

[glass veldt]

Vulkan as a concept is vaguely derived from a cancelled AMD venture

[quick bobcat]

I wanna see if I can get that before I try re-speccing

[desert dove]

THat may have been waht I was thinking of

Jesus my typing is shit today.

[heavy hound]

Yes, it should be very early in the game

[quick bobcat]

wait.. really?

[heavy hound]

I had that like, before getting to the Druid grove

[quick bobcat]

no no, not speak to dead

[heavy hound]

Oh

[quick bobcat]

animate dead - raise a skeleton

[heavy hound]

For animated dead I guessed that there might be an item that lets you

What that item will be and where it will be tho

That's another matter entirely

[quick bobcat]

oh I thought you said you knew about one

I must've misread

[sweet moat]

Still using that, btw. Very useful spell.

[glass veldt]

Everyone supports Vulkan except Apple. Because Apple.
Apple’s Metal API is roughly a competitor to Vulkan, so that’s part of why Apple has no interest in supporting it.

[heavy hound]

I have no idea if it's actually there but with the variety of items I'm getting I'd be actively surprised if there isn't

[quick bobcat]

in that case I'm just gonna switch to arcane trickster and get animate dead that way

(if it even gives me that spell)

[heavy hound]

I think that arcane trickster just gets evokation and illusion?

[quick bobcat]

lame

[heavy hound]

For sure not necromancy tho

[quick bobcat]

but I want more skellies

[heavy hound]

I am not 100% sure, lemme check

[quick bobcat]

actually no, that can't be true. My cleric is a trickster and she got animate dead

why can't rogue do the same

[heavy hound]

"Enchantment and Illusion"

So illusion and stuff like charm, which makes sense for the rogue

[quick bobcat]

[heavy hound]

clerics get access to all their cleric spells, plus a few from their domain that wouldn't be in their list otherwise.
Animate Dead is just on the cleric spell list which is why she gets it

[quick bobcat]

Ah

Dang

My next playthrough I wanna do 4 summoners

[heavy hound]

I mean, you could dip 5 levels in a class that gives you animate dead, but it would also weaken your rogue side considerably

[quick bobcat]

Yeah no, I'm definitely not doing that

[heavy hound]

Like 5-Sorc 7-rogue is an option, they cast usin charisma which as a main character, you probably want to be relatively high for social interactions

[quick bobcat]

I just wanted to see if there was like a quick and dirty little way I could get another skelly

[heavy hound]

Too bad ther isn't shadow sorcerer as a specialisation, that'd fit the rogue multiclass theme

I might actually want to play that if it was in the game

[quick bobcat]

okay what the heck, my game crashed again

on the same spot

[heavy hound]

huh

[quick bobcat]

With vulkan

[heavy hound]

Yeah Vulkan tends to be less stable, so it doesn't surprise me it didn't fix the problem

Worth a shot tho

[quick bobcat]

It keeps crashing when I try to trade with that one ||duergar|| in the room before ||nere||

[heavy hound]

I can't go test it because everyone is dead there in my game

[desert dove]

"Arcane Trickster" is just the name of the subclass. It has no relation to the Trickster domain for Clerics.

[quick bobcat]

For some reason when I left the area and returned everyone was dead too

Didn't know the game just does that without waiting for you

[heavy hound]

No it's not that they just died misteriously, they died very deliberately

It was a long process

[quick bobcat]

[heavy hound]

I told you, the game insists that I have to infiltrate the cult, I insist that I don't know what that means and they should have gotten someone else, and instead keep murdering

[night oracle]

https://www.twitch.tv/tchernobogg alright, back to playing! Think I'm behind most of y'all

[desert dove]

Not me.

I hope to get some time to play tomorrow, I really want to get further into this game.

[quick bobcat]

ooookay I'm not sure what to do but my game keeps crashing in that area

it's happened like 5 times already

[heavy hound]

Try to switch everything to low in the graphics setting, eliminate variables.

If it's just trying to buy to the dude, avoid doing that

[sweet moat]

I'm a little bit worried that the actual city of Baldur's Gate might slow my game down to a crawl thanks to all the NPCs. They've probably thought about that though, which is why there's a render distance.

[quick bobcat]

I did, I tried talking to others and it still crashed

[heavy hound]

Also maybe restart the PC, sometimes it fixes things I'm told.
I assume you have lastest drivers and all

[sweet moat]

Might be an actual bug then that's beyond your control.

[quick bobcat]

Yeah I'm gonna try to restart

I do have the latest drivers and I tried verifying the game files

The game was running excellently before

This is really weird

[sweet moat]

I know I have to restart my computer, not just to install new drivers, but also to install some Win10 updates that my computer has been freaking out about.

They will wait their turn, because I've got Pony pictures to download.

[heavy hound]

I have had a few crashes the first few days of release, maybe one or two a day

Also I had a memory leak, that the game started going like really really slow after a few hours it was open, but that was fixed by restarting

[sweet moat]

I've had three crashes since I've played. In the most random of places too.

[heavy hound]

That now seems fixed on my end

[quick bobcat]

Yeah I noticed that too

Only after 8 straight hours of playing though

So not that bad

[heavy hound]

I tend to leave games open so it happened a couple of times but yeah, hardly a problem

[heavy hound]

Man this game is so smart

Spoilers for how to solve a puzzle in act 2, so read at your own risk.
There was a statue ||I could move but the mechanism was stuck and the DC for the atletics check to force it was really high, so like after failing I went: "surely if I throw a grease bottle at it, it wont oil the mechanism and just allow me to move it right?" And it actually worked||

Sometimes you try a cute solution and the devs didn't account for it, but man, it feels so good when they did

[night oracle]

Yeaaaah, fuck the ||hag's|| entire zone

[sweet moat]

It suuuuuuuuuuuucked.

[night oracle]

I suspected as much with the ||door and the goddamn masks, then after beating those guys seeing an entire other zone with traps before we even get to her... yeah. I think i might deign to come back later but meh||

[sweet moat]

You can actually get some good stuff if you ||beat her, but it requires you to get past the traps first.||

Also, ||you can bypass the wood door without needing the masks. After talking to the door, I noticed there was a spot you could actually click behind it to move towards, so I did. And I passed through it without any issues.||

[night oracle]

Huh, i didn't see that. Will try again...

[sweet moat]

Also, with the ||traps, an easy if (somewhat slow) way to bypass them is to grab the bodies of the enemies you killed nearby and bring them with you to the area with all the noxious fumes. Then you simply dump them on top of the vents to block the fumes, and then use your best dexterity character to disable the exploding flowers. It'll take a while because the bodies are heavy, but it gets the job done, and you only need to clear out I think three of the four fume clouds to reach the hag's arena.||

||Luckily, there should be four bodies, so you have enough. Also, be on the lookout for more wooden doors.||

[night oracle]

Yeah i was doing that, but it's getting late and i didn't want to bother also my guys aren't doing so well on perception checks

https://twitter.com/ROSSSAS/status/1689527632537194497

[kindred talon]

well this is a very frustrating scene

[heavy hound]

I just learned a super smart interaction

Do you know that cellar in the village in which ||you have to convince the magic mirror to let you pass?||

||If you try to tell it that you are its master, it will normally recognise you aren't him and have to come up with something else, but if you do it as Asterion, the mirror can't see you because you are a vampire, and you don't have a reflection and you can trick it much more easly||

I assume that also works with an invisibility spell

[jaunty basin]

.addquote @heavy hound No it's not that they just died misteriously, they died very deliberately
It was a long process

[acoustic acorn]

Added quote #19 to Genryu:

No it's not that they just died misteriously, they died very deliberately
It was a long process

[exotic pelican]

I found a note somewhere else in that temple that mentioned using ||grease to fix the stuck statue. But I just smacked it with my sword and that worked too.||

[quick bobcat]

spoiler: grymforge
WTF

[heavy hound]

That's an interesting fight

Took a while to get it

[desert dove]

I managed to succeed on an Intimidation roll.

[quick bobcat]

I got it almost right away, because I read that some ||hammer|| is the only way to ||defeat "the guardian"||

I had no idea what it meant at the time

now I do

[desert dove]

That's basically what I threatened to do.

[heavy hound]

Yeah I just like that they thought about the fact that's a ||mirror and that Astarion is a vampire. ||

[desert dove]

Mhm. They really did cover a lot of things.

Except stacking 47 boxes to get past a wall.

[kindred talon]

I kind of like talking to animals, what's the best way to add this to my character? add bard to my character?

[desert dove]

Any spellcasting character who gets speak with animals as a spell option. My Ranger has it, I think any divine caster can pick it up. Pretty sure Druid has it as an option.

https://baldursgate3.wiki.fextralife.com/Speak+with+Animals

Oh, Forest Gnomes get it as a racial

• Bard
• Druid
• Ranger
• Warlock (Beast Speech invocation)
• Wildheart (Barbarian)
• Oath of the Ancients (Paladin)
• Nature Domain (Cleric)

[kindred talon]

yeah sorcerors don't get it

that's the problem

[desert dove]

Yeah. So you'd need to add one of those classes / subclasses, or a Forest Gnome

There's apparently also a potion of animal speaking

But that would get a bit expensive over time

[kindred talon]

there is, and I've been using it, but I'm running out

[quick bobcat]

holy fuck these stats are insane

[desert dove]

Goddamn. That's great armor for a cleric

[quick bobcat]

I wonder, how many pieces of adamantite are there? I only found 2 so far

is it possible to get more?

[weak cedar]

Masque I’m getting it when it comes out for PS5

[kindred talon]

what's the second one?

[quick bobcat]

also the moulds I found are not great

I don't have anyone who could wield a sickle or greatsword

I think

[desert dove]

Sickle is pretty much only used by druids. Greatsword is mostly a Fighter or Barbarian thing.

[quick bobcat]

there's one right next to ||the forge|| and another one behind ||nere's area||

[kindred talon]

no the second item

[quick bobcat]

wdym

[desert dove]

What second Adamantine item did you recieve?

Besides the armor

[quick bobcat]

oh, I didn't another one yet

I wanna look for moulds of more useful items

I dunno if there are any

[heavy hound]

Found 2 too, I made a splint mail and a shield

[quick bobcat]

oh I was wondering what the heck a splint is

[heavy hound]

Heavy armor

[quick bobcat]

ahh okay, I don't have any heavy armor wearers

[kindred talon]

at times I'm kind of temped to respec into a druid but magic missile and his cha is so useful for like everything

[quick bobcat]

is there a light one?

[kindred talon]

I have like a plus 7 to deception

[heavy hound]

My shadoheart is respecced into a war cleric for some time now, so heavy armor for her

I don't remember

Allowed me to drop the dex and go all out on wis str and con, she is kind of a beast

[quick bobcat]

my shadowheart is the most useless out of the entire party

[heavy hound]

D&D really isn't made to be able to freely respec, you can do some crazy stuff when you can do that

[quick bobcat]

Wyll is an absolute beast

[kindred talon]

I find Shadowheart kind of weird. the healing seems so insignificant she can't really save Gale at all

[heavy hound]

Like, now I have gloves that set my dex to 21,you bet my ass that wylll will respec and put every point he has in con and cha

[quick bobcat]

yeah healing isn't that useful I've found.. you really wanna use those buffing spells like bless, spirit guardian, etc

[heavy hound]

Doesn't need str because the pact weapon rolls on cha

[kindred talon]

and her melee isn't nearly as good as karlatch's

I've not used Wyll at all this game unfortunately

I guess warlocks are more melee than spell caster though

[weak cedar]

What level are you now Merc?

[quick bobcat]

halfway to 7

[quick bobcat]

oh no, my wyll is entirely spellcasting

he basically never ever uses his weapons

[weak cedar]

Is the level progression slow?

Or the xp gain isn’t much.

[quick bobcat]

my Wyll is an absolute beast, he has:

• a free skelly with animate dead
• some crazy spells like fireball and chain lightning
• double eldritch blast
• haste which lets him quad blast every turn

he's a menace

[weak cedar]

Merc what’s the max level.

[quick bobcat]

12

[weak cedar]

I bet that will require lots of XP

Any tips for when I get the game.

[quick bobcat]

Hmm I'm considering which adamantite piece of gear to make

[weak cedar]

What’s the best class for a beginner.

[quick bobcat]

I feel like the weapons are kinda weak and the shield is completely useless

I'll probably get the heavy armor and then upgrade my cleric to heavy with a feat

[desert dove]

So I'll say this: in D&D, like most games, your best way to survive is to kill all the enemies before they can really hurt you. Healing is for those edge cases where they get a lucky hit in before you can do so.

[quick bobcat]

yeah for sure. Healing in this game sucks big time

[heavy hound]

They are hybrids, I did pick pact of the blade which makes him pretty good in melee but usually I'd just use spells or cantrips if that wasn't the case.

[desert dove]

For a pure beginner, something like Fighter or Sorcerer are pretty simple. Paladin if you want a little more flexibility, but they have some roleplay rules to follow. Warlock if you just want to blast the shit out of things all day, but some class choices are not obvious. Most stuff past that gets complicated.

[heavy hound]

Also there are a few items which make it very good to alternate melee and spells on him

There is always the explorer difficulty if you are having a lot of problems as a first time player

[desert dove]

With Warlock, I personally recommend either sticking to pure spellcasting, or going hard into melee + buffs with Pact of the Blade. If you try to split the difference, it gets a little complex and you can gimp yourself by accident.

[heavy hound]

In this game in particoular, there aren't any major warlock invocation to get to go melee

So you can go hybred pretty easly IMO

[quick bobcat]

Gen, is the adamantite shield reaction once per rest or is it like every time you get attacked?

[heavy hound]

I don't remember, I have like 2 shields that can do this so my memory is kind of weird on it

Lemme check if I can read it somewhere

[weak cedar]

Thanks Masque. I’ve watched some gameplay and the game looks amazing also did you see that they had to add infinite saves because stuff people were doing was braking the game.

[heavy hound]

To me it seems once per turn, as in, assuming you have your reaction up

But it's a bit hard to tell

[quick bobcat]

ah okay cool

[weak cedar]

Do we have an idea when The PS5 Version will Release?

[night oracle]

September 6?

I think

[desert dove]

Sept 2

https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP3526-PPSA14001_00-0681576713225017

Though that might be the preorder release date

[weak cedar]

I think it’s the Release date because I can pre order now.

[quick bobcat]

spoiler: underdark
they are V I B I N G

[weak cedar]

Are those NPC’S?

[quick bobcat]

yes

they are very grateful for my help and now they all do this wonky dance when I come in

[weak cedar]

[sweet moat]

Where the heck is this? I want it. That's perfect for Shadowheart, it'll give her 20 AC easily.

[quick bobcat]

I don't think you want any spoilers for this

Just keep exploring the underdark and you'll surely find it

[weak cedar]

I’m guessing the map is huge

[quick bobcat]

Oh, absolutely