Archipelago Multiworld Multi-game Randomizer

[midnight depot]

https://i.imgur.com/EOwUZro.png

I am an unparalleled mastermind of puns

https://i.imgur.com/YoLQR0j.png

https://i.imgur.com/dK9qIJl.png

Mido is all bangers

Hint: My Din's Fire is my hat.

Zora lake owl takes me to Kakariko

Shopkeeper's Key for Chip

Also descending dark, zipline for Ixrec

Serenade of Water

Today I learned giving Anju all her chickens back is a quick way to get 50 rupees when you set it so she only wants one

Siiigh https://i.imgur.com/ZjZnPNo.png

Oh shit I forgot to stop randomizing crates

[lament tusk]

oh
oh no

[midnight depot]

I'll be fine

I did it once already. It's just annoying

Right crystal heart, right mothwing cloak, great slash for chip

Golden feather for me! One of twenty

Nocturne of Shadows for Kratta

[wet field]

Imagine doing this with lethal bonks

[midnight depot]

That's what megaton hammer is for

Link smash!

Bombchu shop has quantum moon signal for Ixrec, song of storms for Kratta, and bomb bag for Kratta

https://i.imgur.com/FK3nHj0.png

Storerooms stag for chip

Voidheart for chip

All right. Golden Skulltula token rewards are all shit

I repeat, they're junk

Hint: My shadow temple is where it belongs.

Iron boots for meganought

[midnight depot]

Saria's song, shadow temple boss key for Kratta

And I'm done

https://i.imgur.com/keJUVOC.png

[lament tusk]

oh i need to do more checks then

mine is still like 50% green i just got bored

[midnight depot]

Just go at your own pace

The goal is to finish by the end of the month

Besides, you did more than me https://i.imgur.com/mqYhYcz.png

[lament tusk]

...how did you give me my progressive scale? i bought one already and can see a second in a shop
did i accidentally make duplicates of items?

[fierce vale]

i will be starting saturday

[lament tusk]

you're gonna have like 50% of your items before you even start lol

[fierce vale]

easy run

[midnight depot]

There is a setting that puts extra major items in the seed

[lament tusk]

yeah im wondering if i accidentally have that set

[midnight depot]

But the spoiler log says there are only two copies of your progressive scales in the world. Let's see the regular log for where they are

[root at 2024-01-04 11:35:18,640]: (Team #1) Meganoot sent Progressive Scale to Meganoot (Market Bombchu Shop Item 5)

[lament tusk]

huh

OOOH

the one in the shop is a trap

riiiiight

[midnight depot]

Oh you have traps on

[lament tusk]

yeah

they're fun!

[midnight depot]

I like traps only when other people send them to me

When I'm the one sending them I feel bad

[lament tusk]

i think the translator was important to ixrec?

[lament tusk]

mine are junk too

hylian flitter

[midnight depot]

Oh yeah I got both shields in my shops already

[lament tusk]

well it was a random scrub purchase so...

[midnight depot]

That's good!

[lament tusk]

blue fure bottle for kratta, i think thats a bottle

[midnight depot]

Pretty sure I already got Kratta one of these

Or did I get you one?

[lament tusk]

yeah you gave me a fish i think

flitter's bombs

thats... a pretty annoying check for zelda's lullaby, i need to be an adult to get the water medallion

[midnight depot]

Thanks! Those are handy

[lament tusk]

i think i sent a bow upgrade to kratta

krattas forest temple keyring

you're gonna hve all the items, goddamn

proressive hookshot for kratta

[midnight depot]

A third one?

[lament tusk]

one might be a trap? i dunno, i just know i found one

[midnight depot]

Oh, running shoes!

Thanks. I need those

[lament tusk]

ooooh this is the scale i was thinking of
i thought it was mine

[midnight depot]

Hah

Definitely a trap

[lament tusk]

pons and georocks are just money, right?

[fierce vale]

ye, but geo is super nice at this point

[lament tusk]

ok

[midnight depot]

Yes

[lament tusk]

everything here is very cheap so i can probably quickly grind for it
im talking about the zora shop

[lament tusk]

right, thats everything i can be bothered to do right now
i have a few items i can get at death mountain crater but.. eeeeh

[fresh hill]

is there a visual indicator that this is a useless filler item?

[fresh hill]

yep, the single most important item in the game, in terms of checks unblocked

[midnight depot]

There is not

[fresh hill]

geo for chip is probably worth more than pons for me, I already bought 3 of my AHiT shop items and all the remaining ones are my own items

[midnight depot]

OoT makes no separation for non-OoT items by type

It renders OoT items using OoT graphics and that's it

[lament tusk]

oot just uses zelda's letter's graphic as a placeholder because theres no reasonable way to render every item for every supported archipelago game in oot's engine

[midnight depot]

They could render items based on whether they're progression or not

[fresh hill]

oh, well, of course, I've never seen a game get fancier than "AP filler item", "AP useful item", "AP progression item"

usually they just use the AP logo stylized to fit the game, like Blasphemous' shops

Tunic has three different chest colors for its AP items

[midnight depot]

Zelda only tells you after you get the item what quality it is

[wet field]

for dark souls 3 everything is just a prism stone and you have to check the log to see what the other player got

[fresh hill]

some of the guys on the AP server just finished doing a sync with 4 Outer Wildses in it

no serious issues for anyone, lots of small feedback to consider, very productive test overall

but that's my AP energy spent for one day lol

[wet field]

hell yeah

proud of you

[fresh hill]

there's really no beating the vibes of spending a little over a month on a mod and then someone in the first big playtest going "I was skeptical of randomizing Outer Wilds but this totally works"

[wet field]

okie dokie lokie, seems like I set up oot correctly!

[midnight depot]

Everything looks good

[wet field]

I'm not sure if I need this or not

[lament tusk]

jail keys unlock the carpenters in the gerudo
4 keys means one check

normally that would give you the gerudo membership thing

[wet field]

So because of this setting I might not need 4 keys for the membership, but I do for the check?

or is it that I get the check with just 1 key now

[midnight depot]

You need one key only

Rescuing that one carpenter counts as rescuing all of them

[wet field]

cool

I think I just set it to fast b/c that's what you set it to and I figured you knew what you were doing

[midnight depot]

Correct

I like it at fast because it's a good middle ground that still allows me to experience the fight with a Gerudo

[wet field]

Ixrec pls

[fresh hill]

oh hi

ok that means I need to find an entrance to Nyakuza Metro

[shy oyster]

hello

[wet field]

Mario's watching me play rn

[shy oyster]

yes

[wet field]

What's this

[fresh hill]

basically a recovery heart

no value

[wet field]

cap is saying the gold skulltulla house is a scam and they're actually faking being cursed

[shy oyster]

yeah

it's a pyramid scheme

[fresh hill]

weird that OoT doesn't generate AP hints for any of these

[midnight depot]

I complained about it and the dev says they don't know of a good way to implement that

[fresh hill]

that's... a confusing statement

[midnight depot]

I may have misread what they said

Obviously archipelago writes the text of the hint to the game so why can't they reuse that?

[fresh hill]

maybe they're worried about some vaguer hints that aren't as specific as player + item id at player + location id ?

but you can still just AP-ify only the hints which are that specific

[midnight depot]

Yeah, just don't automatically write those to the log

[fresh hill]

again my first hat is time stop hat

I might just do time_stop_last from now on

[fresh hill]

my 2nd telescope had only 1 check, and my 3rd is blocked on getting either hookshot or dweller hat (maybe both?)

still lots to do in the 1st telescope though

if I'm parsing the state of the randomized map correctly, most of my blockers to possible ways of reaching kratta's wallet boil down to hats, which means I need Yarn

should be able to get enough for one more hat on my own

@lament tusk goron tunic or GTG small key?

[lament tusk]

Ooh tough choice tbh
I can't use either right now
I can probably get the tunic myself tho?

[fresh hill]

all right, mail delivery contract for the GTG key it is

wow I'm awful at platforming today

all right, hat number 2 is...

oooh, dweller

hm, unfortunately not enough painting unlocks to get to the parts of subcon forest with lots of dweller mask checks

derp, I always forget there's a contract trap across the bridge, guess you're getting goron tunic anyway

on closer inspection I think the dweller mask on its own unlocked surprisingly nothing

I believe I am now in BK mode

(technically I could farm money for 1 more yarn, but that won't get me another hat)

nothing unusual to hint at the moment, just more yarn, more time pieces, hookshot badge, same stuff you always want to get more of AHiT open

except snatcher contracts are valuable right now, and ziplines are not yet, because of which acts I have access to

oh wait I forgot about death wishes

wow that was a close call

I don't think I've ever done collect-a-thon without brewer hat before

...and it's a geo rock

oh boy, Killing Two Birds

definitely gonna call it after I'm done with this lol

all right, that's my AHiT done for now

now for all the Translator checks in OW

[fresh hill]

as my dying act, I found some of Flitter's rupees

[fresh hill]

and that's Outer Wilds BK'd

very much the opposite of session 1, not a single item in OW more important than a GST

so endgame might be more balanced

@wet field this blocks ~4 lategame checks and completion in OW

@lament tusk hookshot's about as useful in AHiT as in Zeldas

@midnight depot and this is my other big OW item, blocks a couple dozen checks

that's plenty for now

[lament tusk]

Well get me the mask of truth then

[fresh hill]

I always forget fury of the fallen is a thing

[fierce vale]

what are ixnauts "nothings" and should i be buying them

[fresh hill]

oh, literally nothing

do not waste money on them

[fierce vale]

mega is safe.... for now

[fresh hill]

the plan is to create some more interesting useful and filler items later; progression came first

[midnight depot]

Hi

Today I will play

Probably a short hike

[midnight depot]

My fucking god

https://i.imgur.com/HRRdL2a.png

Bottle for meganought

Ocarina for me

bottle for me. Golden feather for me

Magic meter for meganought

Ganon's castle key ring for me

Come on, at least make my job a little harder https://i.imgur.com/9u8SR96.png

The random chest generation put a chest right in the road

Hookshot for meganought

Love key for chip

dash slash for chip

king's brand for chip

Here's your signalscope @fresh hill https://i.imgur.com/OUUTK8r.png

Grubberfly's elegy for chip

Dirtmouth stag

[lament tusk]

do it
i dare you

ok the tracker is definitly lying to me. im 100% sure that i've gotten most of these checks

[midnight depot]

You may have forgotten to connct

[lament tusk]

oh i've made a bit of a mistake i think

no my auto tracker

[midnight depot]

You may have loaded an old save

[lament tusk]

my mistake is that the emulators auto saves.. yeah i did that

well i dont have anything major unlocked anyway

[wet field]

It does?

[lament tusk]

*quick save

it was automatically loading the quick save, not my manual game save which is my habit, and i dont know how to change that

so i deleted the auto save thnking that i'd manual saved
i hadnt

but thats an easy fix

[wet field]

I messed up my tracker last night too b/c I increased the rendering resolution and rebooted the core without saving because I was cooked

[wet field]

is this important?

[fresh hill]

I... don't remember

[midnight depot]

I think it's one check

But that guy really needs it back

[wet field]

Oot has been fun, but I really fucked up not using the yaml option to mute background music. I thought that'd be an option in game

Oh also my low hp noise is the "put away item" sound effect

[lament tusk]

you can just take your headphones off and listen to an audiobook or somehting, thats what i do tbh

[wet field]

Yeah but I really want the sound effects

[lament tusk]

aight

[shy oyster]

do you not like the music kratta

[wet field]

Bro ofc I like the music. It's just that it's hard to compete with Chief Keef

[shy oyster]

ok fair fair

just play Chief Keef on your phonr

[wet field]

Also I forgot to thank whoever got me my kokiri sword

[shy oyster]

YOU FINALLY GOT A SWORD

[wet field]

I wish there was a way to tell the AP to always put the kokiri sword really late in progression

[wet field]

Yeah! Also I got the song of time so I'm an adult!

So much to do

I think the last thing I did was get killed by dark link because I didn't want to cheese him with Din's fire, but I also didn't remember what the mechanics for the fight were

[shy oyster]

so how does a Doom randomiser work

like does it randomise the keycards too ?

[fresh hill]

ultimately those are design questions for the randomizer's creators to decide, so every randomizer needs to say a little about what decisions it made

@shy oyster in this case, here:
https://archipelago.gg/games/DOOM 1993/info/en
https://archipelago.gg/games/DOOM II/info/en

looks like it's the same in both of the AP'd Dooms

[wet field]

I killed the water temple boss. Also:

[midnight depot]

There is and it's called plando. You can just put the Kokiri sword at a point in the game you choose and ensure it's nonrandom.

Alternatively, you choose the settings that result in the sword being likely late

[midnight depot]

It makes levels, weapons, key cards, invulnerability, armor and ammo drops that you find in each level into random items and distributes them. It can also randomize enemies and flip levels at random. You need to finish every level in the episodes you chose to win.
You can back out of any level through a teleporter at the start of a level, but may only play levels you have found.

[midnight depot]

Hello. Time to play OoT

Thanks for bombs, strength, boomerang, wallet, hover boots, maps, compasses, goron tunic, ice trap, ocarina, bottle, key rings,

Giant's Knife for Meganought

Wow, this random scrub merchant had a one rupee item

Time piece for Ixrec

Yoooo, convenient teleport https://i.imgur.com/fksttjw.png

Wallet for Kratta

Hint: Ixrec's No Bonk Badge is in goron shop https://i.imgur.com/jFIeqVn.png

Bombchus for Kratta

Dodongo's Cavern is Spirit Temple

Golden feather for me

Grub for chip

[fierce vale]

delicious breakfast

[midnight depot]

Chip, no

These grubs belong to grub daddy

He's the one who has to eat them

[fresh hill]

ok, so the one hidden in my metro stage is less valuable now

[fresh hill]

this would be kinda nice, but not >700 rupees nice; it's not even progression

[midnight depot]

Nothing for Ixrec

[midnight depot]

It's okay, wallets are a hard requirement for some unlocks. The random generation is structured so each wallet unlocks more shop purchases

Can I even beat an axe dude with these items? https://i.imgur.com/4PDxmA5.png

I did it! Only took sixteen explosions total

Spirit temple is forest temple

Soul catcher for chip

Fire temple boss key for meganought

Strength for Kratta

Bombchus for meganought

Another strength upgrade for Kratta

Hint: Sun's Song is Nothing for Ixrec

Feels like this should not be a hint

Death mountain owl takes me to Hyrule field just outside the market.

Zora tunic for Kratta

My bean salesman had Zelda's lullaby!

Just in time, too. Jabu Jabu's Belly is Bottom of the Well.

Forest temple boss key for me

Saria's song for me.

Yarn for Ixrec

200 rupees for Kratta.

You'd better like them. Killing the dead hand with sticks is annoying

That's enough for today

Still plenty to do

https://i.imgur.com/3vtfyY8.png

Wow, Ixrec is already three quarters done. Your game needs more locks and keys https://i.imgur.com/5TxpKGC.png

We are four days in. I need to slow down or I won't have anything to play at the end of the month

[fierce vale]

there is a reason i only have 10% completion

[fresh hill]

1 it is a small game

2 I screwed up yesterday when trying to debug someone else's issue and used my regular profile, leading to several locations being incorrectly checked, including a few I couldn't reach yet

[midnight depot]

2 I like it

That makes sense

[fresh hill]

but I think it was still 50-something % before I did that

which is to be expected since my Translator was found and I got it to hard BK after that

[lament tusk]

done everything i can right now, im definitely in BK mode
also my tracker is glitched now, thanks to the emulator loading quick saves i didnt want it to
nothing major, i just dont need to do the castle town shooting gallery and cant open the compass chest in dondogos cavern because i've already opened it
things that open checks for me right now tho:
ruto's letter
boomerang
song of time

theres a few more but those are the big ones

[midnight depot]

Just double click entries to force remove them from Tracker of Time

[lament tusk]

ah

thanks

[wet field]

Because I got a wallet upgrade I'll be at max rupees, so it's worthless

[midnight depot]

Hello. Time for A Short Hike

Thanks, me, for the golden feather.

Thanks, everyone else, for the seashells

Song of time for me!

shadow temple map for kratta

[fresh hill]

I feel like some AHiT today when I get home

by now I must have another telescope or hat available

[midnight depot]

Hover boots for Kratta

Time Piece and Relic to Ixrec

That's enough for now. I need these items to proceed https://i.imgur.com/BcVVnzI.png

[fierce vale]

i shall strive to do so today, however i have been unreasonably busy as of late

i'm now v glad i didn't end up having celeste too

[midnight depot]

Don't worry too much about it

Meanwhile, OoT would benefit from this:
[Hint]: FlitterOoT's Kokiri Sword is at Dead Bird Studio - Red Building Top in Ixhat's World. (not found)

[fresh hill]

iirc I did not see a DBS entrance in my last session, so we'll see if we get lucky today

[midnight depot]

Oh you're running entrance randomizer

[fresh hill]

we usually call it "act rando" since this is more hub world with portals than entrances between rooms, but yeah, I never run AHiT without it

[midnight depot]

Oh you're not running entrance randomizer

[fresh hill]

in general, getting enough time pieces to open a new chapter lets me see another few act entrances in that chapter's telescope, and completing most "acts" will reveal another act entrance, so I typically prioritize the "Act Completion" locations in my first few sessions

[lament tusk]

Useful but not a progression item

I'm bk until song of time, storms, lullaby, boomerang and/or zeldas letter

[midnight depot]

Hello. I am in the mood for OoT.

[ancient harness]

OoT is not in the mood for you

[midnight depot]

That's correct

The game froze on me

In fact

It did it again

I fixed it.

Apparently the game freezes if I get song of time in bottom of the well

Adult Link achieved https://i.imgur.com/qGfFna9.png

And he's in KV. What the fuck is KV again?

Remind me to get this skulltula later when I have hookshot https://i.imgur.com/hjo1gvk.png

Oh, Kakariko Village

Fittingly, adult link spawns at Impa's house

Ohhh

And since I'm adult link I have a master sword

Fuck the kokiri sword

https://i.imgur.com/MEEYokv.png

Dampe had trash

Also, I finally realized he asks if the present he gave you is useful because the developers didn't expect you could do the race without a hookshot

Oh, my headband

Magic for Kratta

[midnight depot]

Fire temple is Ganon's Castle

Which has a warp song to Kokiri Village

Come on, Navi. Give me a lift https://i.imgur.com/ZCT2iG6.png

Longnail for chip

[fierce vale]

it will make me look pretty if i paint it funny colours

[midnight depot]

I wonder if there's a mod for that

Hint: Big Poes are a small key for Meganought https://i.imgur.com/Rzw2Kz2.png

[midnight depot]

Compass for meganought. Ice cavern is fire temple

I swear they have an irony setting in the YAML

Hint: Toilet is nothing. https://i.imgur.com/snJsSKT.png

Slingshot for Meganought

fire temple key for meganought

And I'm done. Next I have the gold skulltula above Impa's House, Lost Woods Gold Skulltula, Unfreeze Zora King with a potion, sing to Darunia

[lament tusk]

ooo slingshot, i can do deku tree now

thats atleast me not in BK mode anymore

[lament tusk]

found a bomb refil in the bomb bag chest lol

i forgot i could also do dodongo cavern, and as i currently dont have my deku sheild equip after the last one burned from the last time i was at dodongo, seemed like a good idea

[midnight depot]

You could buy a replacement shield

Check your shops

[lament tusk]

i did

note i said "not equiped"

[midnight depot]

Oh I see

[lament tusk]

i went and bought one, realised why my last one broke and ran to dodongo first

i made the right choce, i've already been burned like 5 times

king dodo is as dead as a dodongo

ghoma's a ghonea

last check i can do is the shooting thing in lost woods
hate that one, its hard to move the aiming that presicely

[midnight depot]

Really?

It's not even a moving target

[lament tusk]

yeah but if i move the stick slightly up, it moves over the tiny target
i move it slighty down, same thing
left and right? same issue

its hard to move it slightly up presicely enough for the small target

[midnight depot]

Maybe you need to check your deadzone settings

[lament tusk]

i tried

moving stuff around changed nothing

damnit i cant buy any deku seeds

i dont have a sword to just get them from bushes either

[midnight depot]

Use bombs to gather them from bushes

[lament tusk]

ugh, i need to find a pot that spawns them to grind more

but thats a waste of bombs

[midnight depot]

You can buy bombs

You're basically buying deku seeds indirectly

[lament tusk]

let me see if any of my shops sell bombs

currently waiting for nighttime so i can check bombchu shop

[midnight depot]

I reported the earlier freeze to the developer, Espeon. Gave him the seed, the log, the spoiler log, the YAMLs, the APworlds we used, the generated game. Hopefully he can fix it

[lament tusk]

because someone at nintendo decided it wouldbe a great idea to have ashop only open at night

[midnight depot]

Oh yeah, I forgot that shop existed

[lament tusk]

well that was a waste of time

in hindsight should have checked deku shop

but i was hoping here would sell deku seeds. it doesnt eother

[fresh hill]

I got briefly confused about which server I was in because "no one on Manechat knows who Espeon is"

[midnight depot]

You do

[weary lagoon]

[lament tusk]

just messed around with the settings. literally nothign changes in regards of this specific issue

i remmeber having this issue last time i did this rando too

dont remmeber how i fixed it tho

tried a different controller, same issue

whatever

ill remember to ignore that check next time

[midnight depot]

Hi. A Short Hike time

I got my fishing rod, Kratta's Epona's song

[weary lagoon]

That allows him to summon Epona, the mighty steed

[midnight depot]

Done for today!

Fishing is a big minigame and I'd have to look up a guide to get all fish. Each unique fish gives me money, allowing me to unlock purchases in other places, and getting enough unique fish gives me rewards from the sailor too

[wet field]

A horse!

You can ride the horse to explore the land

At speeds that boggle the mind

[fresh hill]

done with work for the week

let's finally play some hat game like I meant to do days ago

[midnight depot]

A nine to five monday to friday job

[fresh hill]

apparently

of course now it fails to load the mod

oh right Steam has to be running in the background

man, if this mod is any indication of the platform's quality, I am never using Steam Workshop for anything

[midnight depot]

Steam workshop is pretty limited if you want to do serious modding, but in reality it's just a hosting database

Actual implementation is left to the developers of the game

[lament tusk]

it depends on the game

rimworld, zomboid, terraforming mars? it works fantastically
the main issues i have with the steam workshop is the tagging system

if a game was designed with mods in mind, then you're going to ahve a great experience for years

[fresh hill]

1 yarn away from another hat

the regular Snatcher fight feels so relaxing after the Death Wish versions

[midnight depot]

Yeah! Remember when I recommended against Death Wish for archipelago?

[fresh hill]

lol

I haven't done any of those in this seed yet

[lament tusk]

oh boy, the claim check! im pretty sure that unlocks nothing for me
that was the only item i got since i last logged in

[fresh hill]

and it's the first one I got this session

[lament tusk]

lol

[midnight depot]

You could use the tracker to tell you if this gives you anything or not

[fresh hill]

oooh I found one of the time rifts with pages

(every page is a check so these tend to be big clusters)

[lament tusk]

oh hell yeah, a recovery heart! i really needed that, thanks ix!

[fresh hill]

I still need to add the Outer Wilds equivalent of that to its item pool

[lament tusk]

you know, i dont think this emulator is properly re-binding my controller inputs

when i tried to invert the x axis as a test, it didnt

(yes im still struggling with the shooting thing

[midnight depot]

Are you using Steam? Configure the controller via Steam

[lament tusk]

ill try that then

need to be in big piture mode for that, bit of a pain

[midnight depot]

No you don't

[lament tusk]

i couldnt find the button for controllers then?

[midnight depot]

Just right click, manage, controller layout

Your controller should be on

[fresh hill]

apparently today is skulltula day

[lament tusk]

thanks, it doesnt seem to be changing the problem im having though
do i need to restart the game each time i change something?

[midnight depot]

I don't know

Yo stick

I need one for a minigame

[lament tusk]

this is legitimatly so frustrating

the contolls are either "on" or "off"
theres no middle ground
it means i cant fine tune my aim at all, only move in big chunks

[midnight depot]

Yeah that's actually part of OoT.

[lament tusk]

i know

doesnt mean im not going to bitch about not being able to hit a stationary target after 90 tries

[midnight depot]

You can only make it a little better. The rest is up to technique. The trick is to make bigger moves instead of small ones

[fresh hill]

ANOTHER GST

[lament tusk]

there are 300 tokens in the game

*pool

[midnight depot]

You can also slow the game down to ensure you can stop in time

[fresh hill]

and 3 of the game this time

[lament tusk]

tried that, didnt work

ill try again i suppose

[midnight depot]

Ah well

I don't say this lightly but this is actually a skill issue. You'll just have to opt out of the checks that take aiming.

[lament tusk]

nah this is 100% an n64 issue

[midnight depot]

I don't run into it

Want me to do the checks for you this time?

[lament tusk]

its tempting to ask for that

i keep moving to the exact wrong points over and over

[midnight depot]

I can also just look at the spoiler log and tell you if you should bother

[lament tusk]

the same wrong points

[midnight depot]

Yeah, that indicates your movement is too small. Make bigger movements and change your timing up.

[lament tusk]

its like trying to aim nnw when your controlls only let you go n,nw and w

[fresh hill]

is a compass useful, or do you all have the dungeons memorized anyway?

[midnight depot]

I specifically randomized them because if I didn't I'd get junk instead

[lament tusk]

they dont hurt, especially if some of us are playing master quest, but im not and know them all

[midnight depot]

So they're not super useful but they're better than junk

[lament tusk]

if you ahve to put in a lot of effort dont bother

[midnight depot]

They definitely help me find chests faster

As well as see my position on the minimap

[lament tusk]

omg im one pixel off
fuck n64 fine aiming

i did it!

it was a bomb refill!

[midnight depot]

Good work!

[fresh hill]

omg paintings

I've had two time rift openings waiting in the forest, I think that's the painting set I needed to access them

think you have enough ASH coins yet

[lament tusk]

nah you need a fair chunk of change to finish the game

[wet field]

I've allowed a random chance of a couple master quest dungeons, so compasses are slightly useful

[midnight depot]

I need like 600 coins

I could finish the game with maybe seven golden feathers, so coins just give me checks

[lament tusk]

theres one guy who sells you a lot of stuff

mostly feathers

[midnight depot]

Yeah I hate him

I have feathers randomized so he just sells me trash now

[lament tusk]

oof

[fresh hill]

brewing hat!

ok, 10 checks in the new part of the forest, and one of these rifts should go to Dead Bird Studio where Flitter's sword is

[midnight depot]

Nice. I'll finally get access to whatever is behind Deku tree

Likely Deku tree or Jabu Jabu's belly

[fresh hill]

managed 8/10 before the parade trap finally got me

[fresh hill]

bow sounds like the most important item this session

[midnight depot]

Stick

[fresh hill]

ok, now the other time rift, probably go straight for Flitter's sword and calling it a day instead of fully clearing the area

[midnight depot]

https://youtu.be/H5d_eoVB3NM?si=YoHTy2z9Ef1F6vYW

You do not mess with beachstickball

[fresh hill]

and there it is

[midnight depot]

Thanks!

[fresh hill]

ooh, I think I see how to do the 3rd death wish now, but I'll want the ice hat for it

so yeah stopping there for today

[fierce vale]

@fresh hill please get me a funny knife bestie <3

[fresh hill]

another Nyakuza Metro location, unfortunately I still haven't found an entrance to that area

[midnight depot]

You could hint for another one

[fresh hill]

oh wait "at Cheating the Race"

[midnight depot]

Dream nails are progressive

[fresh hill]

so it's in the kitchen telescope

I can't remember what levels were in there

[fierce vale]

its fine for now

[midnight depot]

Hello. Time for a Short Hike

Nice, a pickaxe, silver feather, coins

Silver feathers make all your golden feathers stronger

This normally takes seven feathers to reach https://i.imgur.com/1sVJF9s.png

Oh nice

I also got the boat keys

https://i.imgur.com/jbypwr7.png

It's Greg

https://i.imgur.com/MYQ8oRt.png

That was amazing.

Last time I played I spent like thirty minutes to reach 35ish

Oh, I never even reached 30 https://i.imgur.com/HeuMo4y.png

[fresh hill]

I remember getting a high enough score pretty quick but I have no idea what the number was any more

[midnight depot]

Dream nail for chip

That's enough for tonight

Notable finds: Shade soul, time piece, shadow temple compass (kratta), aweoken dream nail, din's fire for me, glowing womb.

Shopping list: Feathers for the feather god.

[fresh hill]

hm, so now we have 2 games at >70% and the others in 25-35%

I think I'll leave my AHiT at 35% for a bit

[lament tusk]

oh, dins fire and the egg?

i can do a lot with those

[midnight depot]

Better hint for them

By the way!

Someone on the archipelago server said something about the deadzone issue

Ensure the top four bindings are not bound to anything like so https://i.imgur.com/7eKBeFY.png

Instead, set them to analog controls here https://i.imgur.com/5hGt1zl.png

[lament tusk]

that makes sense i guess

[lament tusk]

neat, zoras letter and minuet of forest

plus i can do lon lon checks

requiem of sprit too?

[midnight depot]

Lots of stuff tonight!

[lament tusk]

the egg really... hatched my game

sun song from saria

that would ahve been nice earlier but still good

song of time, i think i just unlocked adult?

[midnight depot]

Yep! Ocarina and Song of time give you adult link and master sword

[lament tusk]

evidence is inconclusive

[midnight depot]

If you turn this option off it'll tell you how many checks are in each area so you don't have to click each of them to check https://i.imgur.com/SHc9SYw.png

[lament tusk]

progressive wallet would have been nice before i got 450 rupees from y'all erlier

[lament tusk]

did a lot of checks today, but i've stil got about 80% of the game to do lol

[midnight depot]

It is a big game

We are halfway through the month so I'm going to play more to help us catch up

[wet field]

@midnight depot can you get this?

[midnight depot]

Yes!

If I have the wallet for it

I'll look tomorrow

[wet field]

About that

[midnight depot]

Finally. Thanks!

I only need one final wallet now

[wet field]

oh also

[midnight depot]

Everything of yours is there

[midnight depot]

Hello. OoT time. Thanks for Ruto's letter, Kokiri Sword, magic, shadow temple boss key, bottle, hookshot, din's fire, fire temple compass, wallet, bow, and five ice traps

As predicted, Deku Tree is Jabu Jabu's belly. I'll do it later

[midnight depot]

No.

https://i.imgur.com/6WvJioC.png

I can get song of storms and the quantum moon signal though

[midnight depot]

Thanks for shadow temple compass!

[fierce vale]

@fresh hill do you need "museum shard signal"

[fresh hill]

nope

the Distress Beacon Frequency is important, but all of the Signals are filler

(the other frequencies are currently filler though we might change that)

[midnight depot]

Thank you for fire temple boss key

Ooh, mirror shield!

[wet field]

[wet field]

SoS should get me the well + a couple other checks, but I need a bomb bag pretty soon

[midnight depot]

Thank you for Requiem of Spirit, Jabu Jabu's map

Thank you for Farore's wind. Won't use it

Wow I had two ice traps for Meganought in a row

Both golden skulltulas next to each other

[wet field]

@lament tusk are gold skulltulas important for you? I don't remember

They're not important for me anymore

[midnight depot]

Biggoron Sword for Kratta

[lament tusk]

No lol

Oh niiice

[wet field]

Eyy cool

[midnight depot]

Barinade was queen Gohma

[wet field]

Randomizing bosses seems fun

I did a dark souls 1 enemy/boss randomizer once

[midnight depot]

It's less fun than Dark Souls 1 because OoT has no RPG systems to manipulate, so doing bosses in most orders is doable anyway

But it's fun!

A golden feather for me!

[midnight depot]

Forest Temple is Gerudo Training Ground

This world is too big

I finally decided it's this one https://i.imgur.com/y7e4mtN.png

Chest fire skip is so much fun

Hiveblood

And that's everything for today. Maybe more tomorrow!

kratta (Team #1) playing Ocarina of Time has joined. Client(0.4.3), ['AP'].

Please update your client when it's convenient to do so. You ought to be on 0.4.4 now that it's officially released

[midnight depot]

Thanks for seashell! I need two more to get the check locked behind 15 seashells

[lament tusk]

i have all 50 skull tokens now
54 actually

[lament tusk]

oh deku nut upgrade for fliter and stick upgrade for me, neato

[midnight depot]

I used a lot of deku nuts for queen gohma

[lament tusk]

well thats most of the game got, stuff thats left i actually cant get for one reason or another
things i need: all progressive strength, zora letter, boomerang, zora tunic probably
i think thats it? theres a few more but i forgor, those wil all get me quite a few checks, progressive strength especially

[wet field]

@midnight depot Can you get this?

[midnight depot]

I'll try tomorrow

Death Mountain crater Deku scrub grotto

Not sure if I can get there because I don't remember where it was

Might need strength or megaton hammer

[lament tusk]

death mountan top entrance, beneath the ladder to the left

theres a bomb rock i think

i think

[midnight depot]

Well I don't recall my tracker showing it as available

But I actually think I can get there

[lament tusk]

well have alook tomorrow then

[fierce vale]

most of my game is still open, its just a massive amount of game that i have to take bites from

i think i got like 30% today

[lament tusk]

That's fair

[midnight depot]

https://i.imgur.com/535A51t.png Need Megaton Hammer

[Hint]: FlitterOoT's Megaton Hammer is at Gerudo Training Ground Maze Path First Chest in kratta's World. (not found)

I need this:
[Hint]: FlitterOoT's Progressive Strength Upgrade is at Jabu Jabus Belly Barinade Heart in Meganoot's World. (not found)

As well as this [Hint]: FlitterOoT's Progressive Strength Upgrade is at Boss_Essence-Lost_Kin in ChipKnight's World. (not found)

[lament tusk]

i need boomerang and ruto's letter for that so...

[midnight depot]

Oh you don't randomize dungeon entrances

[lament tusk]

no

[midnight depot]

Well I'm willing to wait

[wet field]

Damn I don't think I can get that yet

[wet field]

holy shit I just learned you can cook bombchus. This is huge

[lament tusk]

You can cook bombs too

[midnight depot]

You can't cook fish

[lament tusk]

play totk/botw

[midnight depot]

When they come to PC

Dammit, I meant to reply to you

[lament tusk]

isnt the switch already emulated?

[midnight depot]

Yeah, the randomizer is great because you can just learn strategies to do things on the flu that seem impossible.

My PC can't emulate a switch, silly

It struggles to emulate the N64

[lament tusk]

oh

[shy oyster]

wait wtf

[midnight depot]

You just take the bombchu out, wait until part of the timer runs out, then let it go

[wet field]

I've been doing things the hard way

Did some creative no-cook bombchu-ing in bottom of the well

Bomb bag is way less important now

Do I even need it at all?

[lament tusk]

there are a few areas where its easier, yeah, but for the most part not really

bombchu's are OP

especially in rando

[wet field]

I can finish my dongo's cav and water temple checks now

[shy oyster]

would you have a pet dodongo

[wet field]

Before I was like how TF do they want me to bombchu the dodongo skull eyes?

[wet field]

Sounds illicit

[shy oyster]

what do you mean

[wet field]

It sounds like it would be

Even though I wasted a lot of time, it was sort of fortunate that I didn't know you could cook bombchus because @shy oyster got to see some of my epic chu skills

[shy oyster]

this is true

[wet field]

Also apparently I have it so that it's "legal" to skip zora king as adult link even though my tracker doesn't know that, so I can do that too

[shy oyster]

legal

[wet field]

As in it's taken into account by the randomizer

Ooooooo look who's been a BAD BOY and didn't update their Archipelago client to 0.4.4

[weary lagoon]

[wet field]

This incident will be reported.

[fresh hill]

lol

my regular AP client has been 0.4.4 since before it released, but AHiT ships its own client, and I haven't updated my AHiT AP mod

[wet field]

Alright zelda is finally in BK mode

[shy oyster]

Burger King mode

[wet field]

yeah

[shy oyster]

wait really ?

[wet field]

yes

as in there is nothing to do so you might as well go to burger king

[shy oyster]

oh

[midnight depot]

Hi

Time to play uh

A Short Hike

I made it! https://i.imgur.com/6XaETJr.png

https://i.imgur.com/FlsxrMd.png

Now I'm pretty sure my game is done, but I'm going to boot it up every now and then and get one more check

Kokiri sword for @lament tusk

That was difficult to find! https://i.imgur.com/JrSs2WW.png

Mirror shield for Kratta

[midnight depot]

[Hint]: FlitterASH's Silver Feather is at Alpine Skyline - The Purrloined Village: Chest Reward in Ixhat's World at Time Rift - Bazaar. (not found) @fresh hill this would make racing easier for me! Get it at your own convenience but do keep it in mind.

[Hint]: FlitterASH's Shovel is at Geo_Rock-Kingdom's_Edge_Above_Root in ChipKnight's World. (not found) @fierce vale I need this for like fifteen checks or so

[midnight depot]

Now, I'd like it if we could all finish, so I'm going to play some Ocarina of Time too.

Thanks for Gerudo Training Ground key ring

A Short Hike fishing and Ocarina of Time fishing got mixed up in my brain

I did NOT think that my brain partitioned those into the same section.

[wet field]

According to nat, a game can never truly be great unless it has fishing

[midnight depot]

Time piece for Ixrec

True, I cannot think of a good game that does not have fishing

Scrawny ass motherfucker https://i.imgur.com/15lbBbJ.png

[Hint]: FlitterOoT's Progressive Strength Upgrade is at Boss_Essence-Lost_Kin in ChipKnight's World. (not found)
[Hint]: FlitterOoT's Progressive Strength Upgrade is at Jabu Jabus Belly Barinade Heart in Meganoot's World. (not found)

That's enough Ocarina of Time for tonight.

To proceed, I need Epona's song, longshot, megaton hammer, wallet, strength, zora tunic (probably could buy that though), Song of Storms, ice arrows, slingshot, weird egg, warp song that takes me to shadow temple

[shy oyster]

Doom ,

[wet field]

I think I at least need the gerudo membership card and training ground keyring to get your hammer

[midnight depot]

I said good game

[shy oyster]

WHAT

Doom is a good game

[midnight depot]

Then where's the fishing?

[shy oyster]

Skyrim has fishing

[midnight depot]

Oh nevermind, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTBBHnHf3o8

Yeah and Skyrim is great

[shy oyster]

true !

i do agree that all games should have a fishing minigame

[fresh hill]

huh, so that’s where my Alpine Skyline is hiding

not sure if I have access to that time rift yet

[fierce vale]

@wet field 🙏 please acquire

[wet field]

I think I need gerudo membership card & (maybe) lens of truth. Not sure if I need any other items

I had it set to require the lens of truth to get to the spirit temple, but I might be able to just do it anyways

[lament tusk]

no new checks despite sword

things that will unlock stuff for me:
megaton
ruto's letter
progressive strength x3
boomerang
any and all keys
thats it

[fresh hill]

oh wow I fell way behind

time to play my game

[lament tusk]

guess i could try glitching into adult zora's domain to buy a tunic and do ice cavern

wait i cant without letter lol

[fresh hill]

my excuse is I spent my free time the last two days on finalizing a patch release

[wet field]

How come?

[lament tusk]

king doesnt move out of the way

i can go to the shop and melt him with the blue fire arrows i have, thats it i think

[wet field]

You can do this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnzCPcwqydc

[lament tusk]

eh

i dont really like doing glitches. the cookoo one i only learned because i was super bored during the MM/oot rando we did

[fresh hill]

woo, sprint hat

[wet field]

word. I like doing glitches if they're accounted for in logic

[fresh hill]

and enough time pieces for the laundry room

ok, if possible ... I need to find dream nail in metro at the CtR entrance, and a silver feather in alpine at the Bazaar TR entrance

those are both chapter 1 entrances

thaaaaaat's right, nearly all of chapter 1 is blocked on hookshot

[lament tusk]

hmm, im missing 4 songs. one is getting the ocarina of time, one is kakeriko village, one is sun song and last is ice cavern
im not sure which one would come first, and would logically have to be zelda's lulaby

[fresh hill]

so I guess I'll play normally for now then

[wet field]

I need the mask of truth to get you that

[fresh hill]

it says here my hookshot is in mega's world?

or do you mean the end of the chain is your mask

[lament tusk]

where?

[wet field]

Oh you're right

[lament tusk]

oh right

[lament tusk]

I need the mask of truth

[wet field]

I need the mask of truth to give flitter a golden feather

Mixed em up

[fresh hill]

hm... I've already done my sweeps of mafia town and subcon forest (+2 paintings), so without alpine or metro probably most of the checks I can do are act completions

[lament tusk]

well i tell a lie, the tracker tells me i can do two checks, but i literally dont know how to get this one:

[fresh hill]

oh this act also requires hookshot but the game forgot to tell me that

I have two new telescopes to explore, okay

well there should be plenty of act completions at least

nice, first level I can do is a time rift with pages, so should be a decent number of checks after all

[lament tusk]

ok im 100% sure this is lying to me now. i checked. again.
i remember having this exact issue last time i did this rando too, maybe the tracker is wrong?

i also have this check to do, but i cant get that without one hidehout key, so i dont know why the tracker is saying i can do this too:

[weary lagoon]

theres a frozen eye switch in the forest temple you can get without the bow by using dins fire which might lead to the floormaster chest

[lament tusk]

cant get there without progressive strength

also that frozen eye is designed to be gotten without either din or fire arrow anyway, theres a torch you put an arrrow though

[weary lagoon]

yes but I said you can get it without the bow

[lament tusk]

i ahve the bow

[weary lagoon]

ah you're all set then

[lament tusk]

i cant get to that room though

well anyway, im done till i get a decent item or key

[fresh hill]

just found kratta's Ruto's Letter

[lament tusk]

i think stregh upgrade is the thing blocking off the most items, with that i can complete forest which gives water stone which gives ocarina of time check and song

water stone also unlocks the running man i can sell bunny mask to wich unlocks mask of truth which unlocks hookshot for ix...

fuck it i dont normally do hints, i prefer finding things naturally, but im gonna use one anyway

well @wet field needs the member card for this

[fresh hill]

Megaton Hammer sounds good

[lament tusk]

yeah its alright i suppose, only unlocks one dungeon and a bunch of overworld checks

[fresh hill]

wasn't sure it was worth getting the early checks in this uncompletable level, but kratta's boss key was up here on the lamp

[fresh hill]

all right, I think I'm now BK'd aside from the Seal the Deal death wish which I don't feel like doing right now (I did do 2 other death wishes)

aside from the Hookshot Badge, the last Progressive Painting Unlock would get me several checks, but I think that's it

[wet field]

Alright, I have some checks to do now

I can immediately use that boss key you got

lol I got the forest medallion for beating the forest temple. Also flitter got the ocarina of time

The ocarina of time isn't any different than the fairy ocarina in the randomizer, right?

[midnight depot]

Correct! It's almost completely useless

But since they're progressive it servers as a good backup

[wet field]

Oh that's fun, I don't have the keyring for it but I can beat the fire temple because the boss room is immediately accessible

[midnight depot]

You got a megaton hammer?

[wet field]

I did!

[midnight depot]

Nice

[wet field]

you got a toy shovel

and fittingly I got the goron's ruby

[wet field]

mega got the biggornon sword

We are back at the bk lounge

[midnight depot]

Cheers

[wet field]

Cheers

[lament tusk]

Neato, thanks!

[midnight depot]

Time to play A Short Hike

https://i.imgur.com/bDi7BGV.png

Thanks for all the feathers

[midnight depot]

Okay

That's every check in the game aside from the ones requiring shovels and the ones requiring money

Next is more Ocarina of Time

Thanks for Zora Tunic, fire temple key ring, jabu jabu's belly compass, thieves hideout key, ocarina of time, ice trap.

[midnight depot]

https://i.imgur.com/ykxjgl5.png

Who needs lens of truth when you can just backflip over the hole

[midnight depot]

Time piece for Ixrec

Fire temple key ring for @wet field

[midnight depot]

Sun's song for me!

The tracker seems to think I can unfreeze king zora

But how? https://i.imgur.com/fkhUCWK.png

Whatever. I just did the cutscene item trick to unfreeze him https://i.imgur.com/3fztepx.png

Oh!

https://i.imgur.com/RnLGFhI.png

It's because the shop has blue fire

Aaand BK mode

For the first time since starting the game

https://i.imgur.com/5Ztuyy7.png

(The tracker things I can reach these dungeons)

We're 58% of the way there! https://i.imgur.com/uIPYyA3.png

[fresh hill]

since we appear to have a long chain of blockers this time, I'm gonna quickly dip into Outer Wilds for the half dozen checks I can apparently get now

[midnight depot]

That's great

I'm logically unable to proceed, though I can probably do stuff like release a short hike or abuse advanced tricks to get more checks in OoT.

[fresh hill]

I am so good at this game

[midnight depot]

I always get aft, stern, starboard, port and bow confused

Never foreward because that one's easy

[fresh hill]

oh yeah, that'll unblock us for sure

[midnight depot]

Ocarina of Time needs a Triforce hunt but you actually need 80/100 ice traps

[fierce vale]

i can almost certainly unblock some peoples things in my world, i have a lot of open checks

[fresh hill]

whoa, an actually important item

all right, my OW is officially in logical BK status

[midnight depot]

Definitely need that to win

[fresh hill]

I currently have 2/7 go mode items for OW, the remaining 5 are: Nomai Warp Codes, Warp Core Installation Manual, Silent Running Mode, Distress Beacon Frequency, and Coordinates

[fierce vale]

i think the two things i need are herrah and the lumafly lantern

why is it always the lumafly lantern

[fresh hill]

my Tunic runs never get the lantern either

[fierce vale]

oh, and acid+water swim, i swear i get those at the start or not at all

[midnight depot]

You got water swim

It was in the fuck end of nowhere

Secret island peak, takes seven golden feather and one silver feather to reach

[fresh hill]

in retrospect I like how this tells you exactly where I died

[midnight depot]

The death is punishment for not finding enough ice traps

[fierce vale]

[fresh hill]

regarding the "long chain of blockers", ^this is all I know atm

dunno if kratta wants to hint their member card or not

later I might double-check that my AHiT is truly BK'd (except StD), since there's sadly no act rando-compatible tracker for that, but considering how many hints we've had pointing at the OoTs and HK it seems pretty unlikely

oh right, one of my go mode items was already hinted to be in kratta's shop

[midnight depot]

0.4.4 now includes in the generic tracker a list of checks you have yet to find

Very convenient for cleaning up!

[fresh hill]

where is that?

unless you mean the Hints tab, which is very convenient yeah

[midnight depot]

https://archipelago.gg/tracker/PLDkr3BHQ66_hidapwgs5w/0/3

[fierce vale]

kratta boomerang acquired

[midnight depot]

Center table

You can click the checked column and it will produce a list of all unchecked locations.

[fresh hill]

oh that page

[midnight depot]

Yeah

[fresh hill]

I didn't even register that that part was new, thanks for pointing it out

[midnight depot]

The third table also contains a list of only relevant hints

[fierce vale]

kratta progressive strength upgrade

[fierce vale]

only queens garden and distant village left to complete

[midnight depot]

I noticed you did not randomize charm costs. What's your reasoning for that?

[fierce vale]

i forgor

[midnight depot]

Oh

[fierce vale]

i meant to update it to do so after last time but just resubmitted it unchanged

[midnight depot]

I asked because I find that it makes the run easier and also more interesting at the same time so I always have it on

[fierce vale]

that being said, i have 5 notches and 2 slots atm, so like, i dont really have much i can do in that regard

[fresh hill]

hm, do notch costs affect logic in any way?

[midnight depot]

Yeah.

If specific charms are too expensive to equip you can't get the checks behind them

That's spore shroom, grimmchild

[lament tusk]

Who's actually got checks right now

[fresh hill]

kratta probably has some after all the stuff chip and I just found

I'm not sure if chip got all the way to BK or not

pretty sure Flitter and I are BK or very close to it in both our games

[fierce vale]

i still got 2 zones i can do

its just

a lot

[wet field]

Light arrows

[wet field]

Yeah and I also got the fire temple keyring now so I can get checks from there

[wet field]

Oh this is great

[fresh hill]

I dunno how much opportunity you'll get to see checks before doing the work to get to them, but to recap:

Ixrec — Yesterday at 9:18 PM
aside from the Hookshot Badge, the last Progressive Painting Unlock would get me several checks, but I think that's it

Ixrec — Today at 10:49 AM
I currently have 2/7 go mode items for OW, the remaining 5 are: Nomai Warp Codes, Warp Core Installation Manual, Silent Running Mode, Distress Beacon Frequency, and Coordinates

Flitter — Yesterday at 4:35 AM
To proceed, I need Epona's song, longshot, megaton hammer, wallet, strength, zora tunic (probably could buy that though), Song of Storms, ice arrows, slingshot, weird egg, warp song that takes me to shadow temple

and Mega needs the strength upgrade in your GTG Lobby Right Chest

[lament tusk]

I need a lot of things but strength would unlock so much I think

Strength, boomerang, ruto letter, megaton, a bunch of keys, zora tunic...

[wet field]

Mega, how have you been liking oot without keyrings?

[lament tusk]

i prefer it tbh, it add more things to find

[wet field]

Do you feel like you have to be thoughtful about how you spend them?

[lament tusk]

no?

[midnight depot]

I used to go without keyrings, but I found that this incentivized me to wait until after I had a bunch of keys to do a dungeon unless I was fine with doing repeat visits.

Going without keyrings also incentivizes save scumming, where you save, open a room, get the checks behind it, then load

Archipelago will remember that you sent them. The game will not remember that you spent the key

Repeat for every door.

[wet field]

B-but that's cheating

[midnight depot]

And that's why I use key rings

[fresh hill]

yeah, if I ever rando a zelda again I'm definitely looking for key ring options

[shy oyster]

key ring ?

[fresh hill]

having to go all the way down LttP Ice Palace 2-3 times in one run for a single extra check was oof

a randomizer option that combines all the small keys for each dungeon into a single "key ring" item

[shy oyster]

oh that's kickass

[wet field]

It's a good feature

[shy oyster]

youre a good feature

[wet field]

I kinda like that this is a risk

[lament tusk]

well i just like less junk items, even if that means lots of keys

[wet field]

I want more opportunity for the randomizer to fuck me

[fresh hill]

I get that; this issue is very much a matter of degree

[lament tusk]

plus i dont mind doing dungeons a few times

[midnight depot]

Yeah it's a matter of preference

[fresh hill]

every randomizer potentially makes you revisit an area more times than in vanilla because of gradually becoming more available

[lament tusk]

very few dungeons have situations where you have a choice of doors anyway, unless you have most items by the time you go there

[fresh hill]

but there's a big difference between
"now I have left claw, I can do the other half of queen's garden, lemme benchwarp to the checkpoint I found the first time"
and
"now I have the 6th ice palace small key, now I can redo the first 10 minutes of that dungeon that's exactly the same every single time with no alternate paths or shortcuts to finally do the last 2 minutes of it"

[wet field]

The water temple would be one of the exceptions, right?

[lament tusk]

yeah but water temple sucks anyway

keyring doesnt help that lol

(i dont mind the water temple so much tbh, tho its still the weakest)

[fresh hill]

the water temple meme is so weird to me because I don't remember having any issues with it when I played

[wet field]

I think the water temple is cool, it's just annoying that the paths connected to the main room look so similar

[lament tusk]

its the amount of paths that loop and the water levels that all add up to it being inconvenient

especially for newbies

[wet field]

It tripped me up when I was playing it cooked

I think the looping and water level mechanic is fun

When I was a kid the thing I hated about the water temple was going into the menu to take on/off the boots

[fresh hill]

I can only assume I also found it fun since I have no memory of suffering there

plus this doesn't sound that different from TP's water temple which I remember more clearly and definitely enjoyed

[midnight depot]

Every dungeon with keys has a one or more situations where you can save scum keys. No exceptions.

[wet field]

I mean I just won't do that

[midnight depot]

Yeah, you don't gotta

[lament tusk]

if you dont want to have fun thats always an option, yeah

[wet field]

But I get that the temptation is there...

It does feel different when you put yourself in a situation where you're forced to follow the rules vs. actively choosing to follow the rules

[fresh hill]

speaking of "it's a matter of degree"

we always could be playing Manual APs and have every single check be on the honors system

but there's a reason none of us are doing that lol

aw, LttP doesn't have a key ring option

[wet field]

You are free from the burden of choice

[fresh hill]

considering how confusing it was to even figure out how many small keys I had, and Ice Palace and Turtle Rock being particularly bad segmented, that's probably enough on its own for me to not want to rando LttP again

(those dungeons were great in vanilla, but they were not designed to be revisited repeatedly and incrementally)

[wet field]

I'm guessing there was an annoying ice block puzzle or two?

[fresh hill]

have you played LttP?

[wet field]

When I was a child

[fresh hill]

it's not about any specific puzzle or room

it's that for those two dungeons, getting to the bottom again requires basically repeating all of the hard parts of the upper levels, especially the navigation

and often in a very specific sequence where any one mistake has you wasting lots of time or even dying and going back to the top

on your first visit ever, when it's all still new, figuring out these puzzles is a lot of fun

but when you've already executed them it's just tedious having to do it 2-3 times in 2-3 sessions because someone found one more small key

[wet field]

Water temple definitely doesn't have that problem

[fresh hill]

the one time I played LttP here, this happened to me with both Ice Palace and Turtle Rock because I first visited those dungeons when I was missing one IP small key and the... I forget if it was fire or ice rod, but one of the magic rods needed to kill the TR boss

so I got through 95% of each dungeon, and then had to repeat that 95% all over when that last item was found

[wet field]

You play MM yet?

[fresh hill]

of course this is why most modern games, including newer Zeldas, open up lots of shortcuts as you progress

[midnight depot]

What lttp needs is more shortcuts

[fresh hill]

yeah, a few shortcuts would completely fix this problem and make LttP fine without key rings

[midnight depot]

I've read your mind

[fresh hill]

I have not played MM

[wet field]

Oh. It has very few dungeons

[midnight depot]

MM has pretty much no key problem but the few dungeons it has are so annoying to traverse over and over

The charm of the game is definitely in the overworld

[weary lagoon]

ye

[wet field]

Oh I remember really liking the dungeons

[weary lagoon]

thats why the OOTMM rando is so good you get overworld in MM and dungeons in OOT

[fresh hill]

I was just about to ask if this complaint applies to vanilla MM or rando MM

[weary lagoon]

you dont have to revisit in vanilla so

[wet field]

I mean you might

[midnight depot]

Well don't fuck up

[weary lagoon]

Ye if you're a NOOB

NOOOOB

[shy oyster]

MM is scary

[wet field]

just like real life

[wet field]

Ixrec just got Zipline Unlock - The Lava Cake Path

[midnight depot]

The ziplines were neat at first but they're just annoying the third time around

[fresh hill]

huh?

[midnight depot]

They just take too long

I can't change my mind and go elsewhere very easily, and I just have to wait on the Zipline every time I want to move around the level

[fresh hill]

oh you mean actually zipping around in-game

kinda agree, though I see it more as loading the specific level I want than running around within a level

I think when you're doing the little islands on the way to each time piece areas, the zipline segments in between tend to be shorter?

[midnight depot]

Yeah

Those are fine

[fresh hill]

and I think reaching each mountain peak unlocks a telescope entrance directly to that area?

not sure if I ever tried using those since I completed each area when I got there

[midnight depot]

Might be a randomizer feature

[fresh hill]

I'm pretty sure completing a peak adds it to the telescope as a checked off area

[midnight depot]

Hi. Let's play some Archipelago

[midnight depot]

I paid this guy's fucking tuition and all I got was some funny numbers https://i.imgur.com/jb5AtsZ.png

Baldur shell for chip

Progressive Painting Unlock for Ixrec

[midnight depot]

Sun's Song for @wet field

City crest for Chip

Now I need https://i.imgur.com/9nIG7uY.png

Fragile heart for chip

And that's the whole game

https://i.imgur.com/lXazwCn.png

Ocarina of Time is tomorrow

[fresh hill]

neat, that means I have some game again!

looks about right

I'm dumb, I had an arctic cruise entrance last session and never went into it

third set of paintings burned, time to do the checks

oh no the game's having a lag day

[midnight depot]

Don't you have a scooter in this level?

[fresh hill]

you normally acquire the scooter badge by doing the Mail Delivery Service act, which is one of the Subcon Forest acts (and requires sprint hat)

I do have the scooter at this point but I can use it anywhere now that I have it

[midnight depot]

And so lag day is a myth

[fresh hill]

and that's forest clear for now

[fresh hill]

including on the cruise ship

[midnight depot]

The sign does not say you can't scooter around the pool

[fresh hill]

apparently there's an item up here I never knew about?

the stuff you miss when the tracker's unfinished

and final item for this session is Deku Nuts (5)