It wasn't until recently for me that I was able to actually play games that released in recent years, when I was a kid not only was my computer far too potato-y but I obviously didn't have any money so I'd have to settle for old games that my computer could run 
#Zelda Legend of Link The Legend of
civic hawk
TF2 was one of my only online experiences as a kid that game has been with me for practically my whole life 
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now I'm gonna run all over the map ||lifting big rocks|| just because I can do that now
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big
civic hawk
I don't know if it's safe for me to click that yet 
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it's not
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||Nire's gonna be so mad that I left the dungeon half-finished to do this instead of rescuing Airin 
||
I think this is the first time I've seen ||a big chest outside a dungeon|| 
omg this has such an obvious answer I just thought of
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I think this is the first time I've seen ||a big chest outside a dungeon|| <:coc...
ah, it was another one of these things
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I like that they came up with plausible in-universe reasons for two of the NPCs in random caves to say minna ni naisho = it's a secret/don't tell anyone
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turns out in at least one case ||they are stolen rupees||
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lmao there's rupees in Skyward Sword that make you lose rupees
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oh yeah, there was a pegasus boots micro-dungeon down here
I am really bad at this
OH
that was a good puzzle
civic hawk
I find myself saying that a lot everytime I find one of those small puzzle dungeons
''oh, that was a good puzzle 
''
much more entertaining than giant green glowing rock delivery 
visual folio
does anyone else find it odd that the dark world blacksmith gets a save point, but not the light world one?
lol, I love it when the solution to a puzzle is "stop trying to solve it, then the puzzle gets lonely and comes after you"
✨ BANANA OF DESTINY ✨
oh wow, I was just double-checking this area for maimais, I wasn't even trying for a record time
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flashback to the postmans game in MM where you have to press A on 10.0 seconds
civic hawk
I thought that emote was twilight spinning in a chair 
there's so many of them in lorule
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civic hawk
now there's a relatable emote right there 
I'm guessing you liked the blue tunic's look
either that or it's permanent 
visual folio
like LttP, the blue tunic is a permanent upgrade that halves damage taken
civic hawk
well I guess Link isn't the green boy anymore
visual folio
there was also a red tunic in ganon's tower so I'm expecting one of those later this game
civic hawk
right, colored tunics in this timeline games are damage reducers, not ability specific like zora's blue tunics for swimming and gorons' red tunics for heat
civic hawk
To be fair his hat isn't a different color from his tunic so it makes sense it's gonna be blue too
the arms are yellow though
that looks nice
visual folio
yep, I'm happy with it since the yellow is still there
plus Link's hair is not pink this time and you can actually see his arms this time, so clothing colors work out differently
unique dagger
they should bring back the pink hair
civic hawk
Fun fact
Link's iconic hat is called a Phrygian cap/known as a 'liberty cap'
it's a hat that has come to symbolize freedom and liberty
and Link is.. technically wearing it 'wrong'
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o
civic hawk
Minish Cap Link is technically the only one that wears it correctly (bent forwards and on top of the head)
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ezlo moment
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Ezlo mentioned
civic hawk
ezlo posting
civic hawk
you've been visited by the minish cap of happiness and good fortune
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Hey Link did you see that guy? Thats the guy
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thanks Ezlo
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been tempted to start the Majoras Mask + OoT multiworld rando where you can get items for both games
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whoa
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ye its pretty cool you can go from OoT to MM through the Masked Mans shop
you end up in Clock town
supple quarry
I've been peeping that
Looks super fun
I loved alttp x super Metroid crossover rando
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only problem is this summer ive done 2 OoT randos, 1 MM, 2 Wind Waker and 1 TP and I dont wanna burn out in the middle of a big one 
supple quarry
You might get a really easy/fun seed tho !
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this looks fun
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watch out for that pink thing looks scary
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that was fun 
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it bothers me that the hearts are on the bottom left instead of the top eft
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about time we found you
oh no she's mad I did her dungeon last 
nice, that'll get a good reaction later
roll credits
civic hawk
Really?
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no lol
civic hawk
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it's all fun and games until the X gets placed on the middle of the map
bright girder
enjoy. I really like the story during the climax
civic hawk
enjoy. I really like the story during the climax
Oh so he is at the endgame then
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He did just post a screenshot of getting the triforce 
civic hawk
Yeah I thought he already finished when I saw that
Well, a piece of the triforce anyway
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yeah its only the triforce of courage
just like you get it before the end of the game in wind waker
civic hawk
Huh
Usually Link already has that one
I assumed it was wisdom because that's the one you have to go get more often than not
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it is interesting that some Links are born with the bravery triangle and others have to go find or earn it somehow
civic hawk
The first Link didn't even earn it either
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was Hero of Time born with it?
civic hawk
He just didn't have it period
bright girder
i think you have to assemble courage more than wisdom
yeah he was
Which game do you have to find the triforce of wisdom?
civic hawk
Zelda 1 I remember
I haven't played many games where I actually have to go physically get the triforce
Is it on alttp too?
visual folio
soooooort of
in LttP the triforce hasn't even split into three parts yet
that's why the origin story you read in LBW talks about it breaking into three parts: that happens after you defeat and seal Ganon away in LttP
in LttP the whole dark world is supposed to be what the sacred realm turned into because of Ganon's wish
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^this was the final cutscene of LttP btw, showing Link just walk up to all three triangles right after pwning Ganon
...also that triforce talks
civic hawk
Triforce waifu 
To be fair the triforce is technically just all the three goddesses
Technically
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You have to go get the triforce of courage in Zelda 2, Wind Waker, Skyward Sword, and ALBW
civic hawk
Oh yeah Link 1 does get it but in Zelda 2 because it was sealed away
Interesting
How do you even seal a triforce piece
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Only OoT and TP Link are born with it I think?
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civic hawk
I guess so
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(TP definitely is born with it, game and manga)
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ye those two are for sure i was wondering if I missed any
civic hawk
Skyward Sword Link too maybe? But I don't think they had it yet then
bright girder
No you have to go get the triforce of courage in the penultimate dungeon
the ass skykeep one
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I guess it is the final dungeon
civic hawk
Well only OOT and TP then
Huh
I guess it technically works to have the hero actually have to prove themselves by getting the triforce
... Does BOTW Link not have it?
I only saw Zelda use the triforce once in BOTW but the triforce never comes up in those games lol
bright girder
Not as far as we know
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iirc BotW never really goes into it much, the only reason we're sure the triforce is even a thing is that you see the mark on Zelda's hand at the end?
civic hawk
Not even Ganondorf had it
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Botw makes it look like Zelda has the whole thing
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how have I still not figured this out 
civic hawk
If you haven't figured it out I'm never figuring it out
Did you figure out the piece on death mt? The one we couldn't get to at the top
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the one I remember posting here was relatively easy once I fully explored the dark world death mountain
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you should find the other entrance to that cave
civic hawk
Ni-nice-ce
Oh wow two rows
Damn
And the banana
Why isn't an upgradeable master sword a thing on more zeldas? Seriously
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i can name a lot of them
civic hawk
Name every single one /s
bright girder
Fusing in totk counts 
then of course you have wind waker and TP
botw with trial of the sword
visual folio
in TP you mean when the Twili's sols charge it up?
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ye!
civic hawk
Okay I don't mean that
That's kind of required and part of the story
I mean regular good old upgrade that also turns your sword into an orange/gold popsicle
visual folio
does the sol charge increase the sword's damage? iirc it mostly allowed it to dispel dark mist, and disappeared when you left the twilight realm
civic hawk
Yeah that's why I don't count it
Or BOTW since it's dlc and is less of an upgrade and more of an activated form or something
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now you're being picky
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I did not figure out the heart piece but I did find a cave I hadn't seen before
wait
ok nvm got the heart piece
there was a lot of stuff in this swamp I hadn't found before
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you won!
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Nice™️
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might as well try for the only other heart piece I'm aware of but didn't pick up
hm, is that good enough?
yes that is good enough
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get the last one or i will cry
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I have no idea where the last four are though
or actually maybe it's a boss heart at the end?
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I'm gonna do the endgame now anyway
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crying
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have you done the one where you race from one side of the map to the other
very crazy heart piece
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i dont remember a heart container in ganons castle
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use Ultrhand
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oh no, not the ||purple cheeseburger||
that was a good ||bomb and switch maze||
...really should've seen this coming
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hamburger cheeseburger
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<:cocothink:908027043776724992>
oooooh this is tracking ||how many of the boss refights I've found and done||
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for Cap to judge:
green sleeves are good
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oh good, I think this is technically ||the first confirmation that this Zelda has the brainy triangle||
uh... should I be worried that you just did that
ooooh I like this twist
||if I understood that right, this was never LttP's dark world / our sacred realm at all; Lorule had its own triforce that they destroyed, which is why it's falling apart, and Hilda wants to restore it by taking Hyrule's triforce ||
well buck
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you understood it right
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yeaaaaaah, the banana was too much for you wasn't it
it was at this moment she knew, she fucked up
||I'll make you the greatest artwork of them all...||
||ooh, we don't normally do the Zelda light arrows thing in 2D, do we?||
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Courage may not be remembered, for it is never forgotten 
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||I'm still terrible at ping-pong! 
||
loooool ||if I light arrow him from a wall so far away I can't see him, then he also can't see me and I get a hit in the back immediately 
||
I hope that's part of the speedrun
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wait are you fighting Ganon ?
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||sort of; it's Yuga who summoned and merged with Ganon, hence the wacky hair, and then also merged with Hilda||
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||fusion is just a cheap tactic to make weak gems stronger !||
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why are we doing this camera angle now, this has never happened before
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its cool
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dude, read the room
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||I really like when you turn around and shoot the light arrow across the entire wall before it hits him in the back||
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||did you defeat Ganuga||
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||Sorry your princess is kind of a bitch keep up the grind brother||
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what is that creature
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its name is Shiro-kun, but it is never explained
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just assume its lorule ||navi||
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swats him like a fly
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just assume its lorule ||navi||
||Navi isn't in thisbgame||
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who cares just assume
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and everyone lived happily ever after ||except all of Lorule I guess||
I think Zelda's thinking what I'm thinking
BWAAAAAAAAM
dramatic gasping sounds
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this is really pretty but i think i prefer the random curtain place in LttP
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||the Triforce must be pretty OP if it can just make more triforces||
wet forge
Oh no it flipped over
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sorry for comparing this game to LttP so much
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its the same video game just give and take a little
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spoilers: it's called Triforce of the Gods 2 because ||it ends by asking the gods to make a 2nd triforce 
||
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:0
wet forge
||I wonder if an upside-down Triforce would be considered a heretical/evil symbol, culturally speaking||
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it was right there in the logo
wet forge
Well I mean for Hylians
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||I wonder if an upside-down Triforce would be considered a heretical/evil symbo...
||kinda like how the Yiga Clan symbol is just the Shiekah's logo upside down?||
wet forge
||Yeah, or how an upside down cross is taboo||
Just seems like it would be an interesting avenue for a little world building detail shrug
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||it's interesting how the upside down cross is considered satanic when that was how St Peter was crucified||
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oh we've switched back to green
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THAT MURAL IS SO COOL
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this is my son he has every disease
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yeah afaik Link puts the Master Sword back in every incarnation
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Link
Total Rupees Acquired
Game Over Count
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thats a lot of money
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did this one have the message that says "the Master Sword sleeps.... forever!!!"
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nope
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lol
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forever 
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yes 
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why are you rdwuting me
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I wonder where those last four heart pieces are...
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i am bad at reading if people like things or not
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oh yeah fair
guess you missed the conversations earlier where I was explicit about this?
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or i just forgot like i so often do
guys only about 50,000 more messages and we can beat #1032716748887179434
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Ixrec — Today at 3:27 PM
to be clear, most of my LttP complaining falls into the "you were so good but then you did this one silly thing" category
it stings more when it was nearly perfectIxrec — Today at 3:34 PM
I do think [LBW]'s better but it's the sum total of a lot of small things, most of which are things we take for granted in modern games
because I went into LttP mentally prepared for "old game stuff", and had the luxury of save states, it wasn't nearly as bad as if I'd tried to play the game completely legit on original hardware or whatever
so overall I would say I'm enjoying LBW more, but it's by a relatively small margin
if I'd done LttP as Miyamoto(?) intended then it'd be a bigger margin
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as long as ixrec and nire have zelda games to play its only a matter of time
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that should clarify things
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ixrec play Zelda 1 now
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lol
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maybe you should play one of the many 10/10 zeldas you havent played captainmario
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i want to play Wind Waker but it's not on Switch
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Have you played ocarina and majoras mask
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i tried but couldn't get into them 
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better try again
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lemme see if any of the missing heart pieces are somewhere that'd be fun to go get
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oooh that mt hebra / death mountain heart piece Nire was talking about earlier, I thought he meant a totally different one
OH
well that explains why I don't ever remember coming out of this cave
ah right the baseball minigame had a piece of heart, and it wasn't clicking for me so I didn't retry it
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and... everything else on this list sounds like one I'm pretty sure I got
no clue where the last two are 
maybe I forgot to save one day and it deleted some overworlding
I think I might be done then
I'm not feeling the battle tower's highest difficulty or the infinite cucco mode
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here goes
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good luck friend
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it finally hit me that I "need" to pick a game to play next
so while I'm definitely not going for 100%ing the Zelda series
at this point it does feel like I might as well go for "all the really good ones"
I assume Majora's Mask is the biggest gap
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gap?
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in what I've played
wet forge
If you’ve done all the other 3D Zelda’s, then yeah, MM is a major omission
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to recap, I have played Link to the Past, Ocarina of Time, Wind Waker, Minish Cap, Twilight Princess, Link Between Worlds, Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom
wet forge
If you can do the 3DS version that would be ideal. It did a bunch of QOL improvements, but some would argue they were too heavy-handed
Which I can understand, they are kinda… interesting sometimes
But the original might be too obtuse? It’s up to you.
visual folio
that is essentially why I've avoided it historically
OoT was definitely too obtuse for me
wet forge
MM3D is easier than the original for sure
unique dagger
play Zelda 1
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and it sounds like MM would be either even more so, or in the remake would swing too far in the opposite direction (I've seen a breakdown of the good and controversial changes and man it does not make me want to play the remake)
wet forge
I adore MM and only real complaint I have about the remake are the changes to the boss fights
The rest I’m basically fine with
I think the big red target they put on the bosses was a bit too clunky (also like.. removing a mechanic from one of them)
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play Zelda 1
I should probably check: is this a serious suggestion?
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I should probably check: is this a serious suggestion?
yeas
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I've already kinda spoiled myself for Z1 with speedruns and the like, and a very long time ago I actually did try it and bounced off almost immediately
and the strong impression I got from most sources is that, as good as Z1 was at the time, whatever people consider "the thing that makes Z1 special" to be has been done better by either LttP/LBW, or BotW/TotK, or Tunic, etc
so I guess I'd need a pretty great pitch to consider it
wet forge
to recap, I have played Link to the Past, Ocarina of Time, Wind Waker, Minish Ca...
Well you’ve basically done all the good ones that are must-plays aside from MM
unique dagger
so I guess I'd need a pretty great pitch to consider it
cries
ok play Zelda II then
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lol
unique dagger
that's not a joke
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Dont play Zelda 2
wet forge
Even Nintendo doesn’t like Zelda II
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i like Zelda II
wet forge
Well the guys who made it wish they hadn’t released it
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to be fair, Nintendo's been in two minds about at least a few good Zeldas (I wanna say MM and WW?)
unique dagger
Zelda II is awesome and the combat is really fun
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so the footage I've seen of Z2 makes me think it's less like "a Zelda game" and more like a Castlevania or a Shovel Knight
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oh no he was shot
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is that broadly true?
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then yeah, I'm just not in that mood regardless
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humph
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I still haven't done any of the Shovel Knight campaigns after the original
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I'm not claiming they aren't good
wet forge
Yeah. Although when asked, Miyamoto said that while he doesn’t particularly regret any Zelda games, he wishes that they had spent more time with Zelda II specifically because it doesn’t stand up to their own standards.
unique dagger
I'm not claiming they aren't good
i wasn't insinuating you were
wet forge
so the footage I've seen of Z2 makes me think it's less like "a Zelda game" and ...
Pretty much
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Yeah. Although when asked, Miyamoto said that while he doesn’t particularly regr...
this is why it should get a remake 
wet forge
IIRC they actually considered it once
bright girder
Can we get some pogs in the chat?
unique dagger
mm
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MM is Majoras Mask
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yes
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oh right, to complete the question I raised before
while I'm fairly sure no one would be distraught if I never played Skyward Sword or Phantom Hourglass or Four Swords Adventure
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IXREC PLAY THE LINKS AWAKENING REMAKE OMG OMG OMG
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Links Awakening is a 2D Zelda which is pretty good but not as good as ALBW and Minish Cap
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the original hasn't aged all too well on account of Gameboy limitations
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Artiks: referring to original or remake or both?
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remake I never played the original
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he is lying to you LA remake so good best game of 2019
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I've already found the goron and zoro mask in shops 
but they need a wallet upgrade to buy
civic hawk
awesome the game just turned into a survival horror now
since I've opened the game today I've finished this minigame that was kinda fun and gotten a bunch of the collectable dudes and a couple of heart pieces scattered around this sector of the map
unique dagger
holy shit baseball
civic hawk
I also bought this from some random guy in the forest
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you hit the ball with the bat
civic hawk
I kind of got a feel for it and noticed that I couldn't actually control the movement of the ball, so after a number of tries I looked it up to find any sort of general guide on the 'rules' of the game
It turns out you pretty much control the direction of the ball with the timing of when you hit it
If you hit it early, it goes right, if you hit late, it goes left, to varying degrees of left and right and what not
Eventually I realized I got a bird that gave me 20 points everytime I hit 3 in a row, and when I looked it up sure enough the guides mostly told you ''GET THE BIRDS!!! 
'' so after I practiced a bit and got a good feel for it I just tried my best to do a run where I got the most amount of pots possible in a row so I could get the bird and I got it on my very last ball in my last attempt
I also hit the octo a couple of times which causes you to lose attempts becuase he fires twice at you 
Oh also the crabs reset the pots so that's useful too
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ah so it was about the timing
my reflexes are just not good enough for that minigame then
civic hawk
It's definitely an annoying way to go about this minigame
Hah, I had to use the hand to press the button, that's neat
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civic hawk
man these platforms.... sure take their time
I like the whole ''get out of the temple and come back in through the hole in the top'' thing
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oh wait until you see the [spoiler] and [spoiler] dungeons
LttP and LBW both love playing with dungeon/overworld boundaries
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or hookshot the painting
civic hawk
that's two already
boss time
that was fun
aaaand two rows
I like how I can move around this little area
and we all do a victory pose lol
oh pff
well that was easy and quick
12 hearts now
There's 5 more temples/dungeons which means 5 more hearts... that would leave around... what, 2-3 more hearts on the overworld for me to get?
wowza
aaaaahh so that's how you get here huh
civic hawk
well this cuccoo dungeon is stupid
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^
at the time I left after 3-4 attempts and getting the closer targets
muuuuch later in the game I happened to look around there again, gave it a few more shots and finally managed the silver
but there's no non-rupee reward so up to you
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oh wow that was fast
civic hawk
I'm very stubborn
lol I love that this giant bomb hops around behind me
I'm trying to enter that spot in the lower left but I can't seem to figure out where the entrance is
hm
visual folio
"that spot" meaning the whole corner of the map or something more specific?
civic hawk
yeah the one under kakariko
I also seriously gotta figure out where the titan gloves are
what are you doing here now...
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(I'll assume you don't want a hint unless asked)
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wow you found her fast
civic hawk
''what do you think of this mask? kind of scary huh?
I found it on an abandoned house. well, I think it was abandoned, since there was nobody inside''
this girl....
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hm
civic hawk
(I'll assume you don't want a hint unless asked)
If I can get to them now I'd appreciate a hint maybe
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is there a house in the game which had that mask before?
I don't remember finding it
civic hawk
I can't say I've seen one myself
I'm going to assume she's talking about Ravioli's house
since that's the only vacant house I've been to
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If I can get to them ***now*** I'd appreciate a hint maybe
ok, I think the weakest meaningful hint I can give is that the titan gloves ||are in a dungeon||
civic hawk
considering where I am right now.... is it cold or hot?
Since I got the gloves at the house near death mountain I'm going to assume that's where the titan ones are
visual folio
like, are they in a cold or hot dungeon, or hot/cold as in how close are you now?
civic hawk
hot cold at how close I am
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actually let's just do this: ||they're NOT in the death mountain dungeon||
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if you decide you want to know which dungeon: ||it's the one in the southwest corner||
civic hawk
I made it into the desert area so that's where I'm going next now
visual folio
I do like how you immediately did the opposite of my dungeon order
which has the two major advantages that you'll find this item and that girl much earlier
civic hawk
I don't know if this guy with a bird mask is giving me a quest hint or just a regular enemy attack hint
Also I like how Hilda keeps saying ''....I'm Hilda of Lorule'' at the end when I go into a new area
Like she's signing an e-mail
civic hawk
something something ''I can't approach these yellow birds since they spit bombs... if only I had a shield!''
Oh pfff I can swim through these waters
I thought the vines blocked me off
quite a lot of entrances here
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oh THAT guy
yeah I think the point of that is to remind you that you actually have a shield and it actually deflects things
it's super easy to just never use it
unique dagger
they look like a plague doctor
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especially in boss fights where it would be useful
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or the birds from Super Mario USA
civic hawk
Oh we're here
Alright, before this
let's stack up on some delicious gyuunyuu and upgrade this sword
that's lame....
civic hawk
I guess I never found it to bee too much of a problem that I felt I needed or wanted this
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I mean it's not a big problem either
civic hawk
I mean I'll take it but... a heart piece would've been nice too....
civic hawk
Ugh, I need to find Rosso before I upgrade my sword? 
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...you do?
civic hawk
The blacksmith guy won't take my minerals I found and upgrade
also the insignia does more than just not get attacked, now the bees follow me too so I guess that's nice
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weird, I could've sworn I upgraded my sword long before I found Rosso
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yeah now when a bee spawns I never have to worry about getting damaged by it, I just decide whether I want to spend a bottle on it to sell later (which I did a lot earlier on)
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yep
civic hawk
man that's a rather full equipment screen right there
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come to think of it I should look up what the other colors are since I also skipped multiple steps
oh
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shows you how little I visit the blacksmith
civic hawk
oh my actual sword is red now too
sweet
the particles are red too 
am I really getting stuck on the first room of this temple...
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that's right, this upgrade was more of an orange than a red in LttP
visual folio
oh huh, I didn't even think of the BotW guardians
I believe these are called "beamos"
visual folio
yep
civic hawk
lol I love Link's effort grunts when pulling these statues
visual folio
and now for a very pedantic game comparison
in LBW, you probably noticed the statues move discretely, one "tile" at a time
in LttP they could be in pretty much any position you were, so I was often never quite certain if I needed to move it another pixel or two to count as being "on" a button
civic hawk
Gee I wonder what the dungeon item will be
civic hawk
in LttP they could be in pretty much any position you were, so I was often never...
I'm having to pretty much mentally adjust to the fact that I'm not seeing this ''perfectly'' top down but rather tilted so I always have to assume there's one tile/pixel in front of Link when facing north
visual folio
ooooh it's doing the "ground floor" = 0 thing
right I'm so used to Zelda dungeons being ...2B, 1B, 1F, 2F...
even though I live in a country that does ground = 0
visual folio
yeah, no one thinks about this stuff until they bump into it being the other way
and now for something completely different
I happen to be watching another LttP speedrun (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAqbCGHPi0k), and the runner's dog is interfering hilariously
civic hawk
''no way, i'm on WR pace!''
🐶 not if I have anything to say about it
oh, I can already get the boss key for this dungeon but I haven't gotten all chests yet
huh...
visual folio
that's happened to me a few times
civic hawk
Oh!
not the boss key
}
wahoo
hah, cool
I have to get out of the dungeon and go back in to access the second floor
visual folio
usually the dungeon map having an entrance/exit symbol feels a bit redundant, but then there are dungeons with 3+ entrances
visual folio
it's nice to know that speedrunners also consider LttP's Mt Hebra boulder hits to be a "well, it just happens sometimes" thing
oh right you did skull woods already
I believe that did the most overworld/dungeon interaction
but I'd say this is one of three dungeons that have this mild form of it where you go in and out a few times and it's as if a few small rooms or hallways were overworld-ified
civic hawk
skull woods?
visual folio
this is ridiculous when you realize I could literally just hop on over <:sweetie...
this place
civic hawk
oh yeah it's called bosque de las osamentas in spanish
pretty much the same, I just keep thinking of it as lost woods
visual folio
yeah lost woods would be the light world area
visual folio
or arguably just the bit with the poes that's not really on the map
civic hawk
I notice you keep calling them light/dark worlds and I call them by their name
visual folio
I guess I'm more used to every place having a different name in the dark world because in Japanese it is every place
while you've got Mt Hebra going through its edgy punk phase in both dimensions
weeeeeeell
that's partly because of the LttP precedent
and for a while because I wanted to avoid any mention of Lorule and Hilda until you got to that cutscene
and now it's because I'm often making statements generalizing over both games
and it's much less weird to call Lorule "LBW's Dark World" than vice versa
civic hawk
Right
well it does feel similar although I don't think these two worlds are meant to be the same as the light dark worlds of lttp I think
but yeah I get it
visual folio
I can't respond to that point without story spoilers so yeah we mutually get it
civic hawk
oh whoops boss key
this feels early
man the music so far has been excellent
I love Lorule's version of Hyrule Field
If only the Gerudo were here
I don't think there's a single 2D Zelda with the gerudo
civic hawk
I was waiting for that interjection with the ''actually they show up in...''
civic hawk
I guess it counts, Four Swords is after Twilight Princess officially
so these are the TP gerudos that didn't appear in that game
visual folio
"technically in the Age of Calamity timeline there's a 2D sequence where the Goron princess teams up with Ezlo and-"
unique dagger
AoC is a game that exists
visual folio
and it will never be on the official timeline chart
civic hawk
Funnily enough the Goron and the Zora appear in at least ONE 2D zelda
and by Zora i mean the actual zora
the cool ones
unique dagger
the monster ones are cool !
civic hawk
They're good as monster types but after being introduced to the shark-looking zora as a society of beings alongside Hylians and other races I can't go back
aaaahhh you.... youu....
damn trickster game devs
hiding stuff away from me knowing I can't move the camera
boss time!
visual folio
ah, now I can tell you the dumbest thing I did in this dungeon
every time I found a chest buried in sand on 2F, I thought "okay obviously we're going to lower the dungeon's sand level later" and moved on
it wasn't until after I did the sand level change that I realized it did not affect nearly as many rooms as I was expecting it too (and it was a raise, not a lower)
and it still took me a few minutes to think of just using the dang sand rod on the chests
civic hawk
oh no
my immediate thought was ''ah dammit if only I had ultrahand....'' looks down at sand rod ''hmm ''
Aahh!!! 
there you are!!! I've been looking everywhere for you 13th heart piece
''Link! I knew you'd bring me good luck!
a-ahem! Why did you take so long!? 
what did you expect making me wait all this time?!''
cute
visual folio
Ixrec — Yesterday at 4:13 PM
now I'm gonna run all over the map lifting big rocks just because I can do that now
...
Nire's gonna be so mad that I left the dungeon half-finished to do this instead of rescuing Airin
...
oh no she's mad I did her dungeon last
civic hawk
''Link... u-uhm....
Well, I hope you don't get hurt out there. Good luck...''
the tsundere levels are off the charts
civic hawk
> Ixrec — Yesterday at 4:13 PM
> now I'm gonna run all over the map lifting big ...
gets titan gloves
''ah man sick!! '' forgets about sealed sage entirely
visual folio
they put me outside halfway through the dungeon sooooo
civic hawk
well don't just leave!
aaand save, seems like a good spot to stop for now
two temples down, one tsundere witch gf rescued, titan gloves acquired 
gonna be destroying some rocks next time
Not one will be safe from me
visual folio
now that you have the sand rod and the gloves, I believe everything in both overworlds is accessible now
those were the only non-Ravio items needed to progress
civic hawk
Yep, that should do it
I hadn't come across too many sand related stuff outside of here but definitely big rocks
visual folio
I do believe sand only shows up in that desert and one tile in Kakariko
but that tile is important
civic hawk
Yeah I got that first thing first when I got the sand rod
vast dawn
hai all :D currently obbsessed with tears of the kingdom and oricale or ages :D
balmy wagon
I was about to guide them to here but then i realized what channel i was in
vast dawn
TotK very good game
it so is!! eee /)^3^(\
unique dagger
tepid depot
supple quarry
Hilda 
bright girder
Pretty good deal
wet compass
legendary sword of the hero:
best i can do is 40 rupies
wet forge
I appreciate the fairy too
1/15th of a great fairy: now 20% off
How much is the rupee?
wet compass
wait what game makes the master sword a buyable item? its a transition item in oot and not existing in mm
theres a randomiser option to add it in?
is this a cross-game randomiser?
wet compass
i didnt think the master sword could be a randomizable item
how would that even work
wet forge
¯_(ツ)_/¯
wet compass
you need to take the sword from the pedastal to become an adult, so unless you start as an adult in oot that makes no sense
visual folio
honestly I don’t know if OoT randomisers work without sequence break glitches
does anyone play those glitchless?
wet compass
sequence breaking glitches is a... weird thing to say for randomizers
glitches, some people do some dont
but sequence breaking is the point, not a glitch
wet forge
Some randomizers are designed to avoid (major) glitches
supple quarry
At least for me, you start picking up tech/glitches the more you play. It feels really cool to go through the MMR logic and check all the boxes of tricks you've learned.
supple quarry
Some randomizers are designed to avoid (major) glitches
The ones I've played you get to choose tricks you know which will be taken into account when generating the seed.
civic hawk
I don't find it that wild that a randomizer would fuse MM with OOT and make the master sword an item you can buy
with the amount of insane crazy shit that happens in randomizers that sounds pretty tame
bright girder
does anyone play those glitchless?
yes me
all of them have a logic that lets you beat them with no glitches
civic hawk
Do any of the items ever cause any softblocks or anything like that or is it not a problem?
visual folio
in general randomizers are designed to make sure the game is still beatable despite the shuffling
bright girder
at worst you can enter a room you cant exit because youre supposed to get say the slingshot in there
so you have to save and reset
visual folio
"logic" is often a special term that refers to the internal rules that say "item X can't be reached without item Y" and so on
and some randomizers have a "no logic" mode which typically means sequence breaking glitches are required
bright girder
i didnt think the master sword could be a randomizable item
how would that even ...
In the OOTMM rando you start as a kid and you have to get the master sword before you can become an adult
visual folio
with the amount of insane crazy shit that happens in randomizers that sounds pre...
and yeah, #1119170161518334004 was much crazier
bright girder
Just like in the normal game except the master sword has gone hiding
Normal OoT rando doesn't do that because it would limit the amount of checks by quite a lot and make it so all randos start the same
But OOTMM is much bigger so master sword is shuffled too
I really like it
Love having to work towards becoming an adult like in the vanilla game
dang
visual folio
sequence breaking glitches is a... weird thing to say for randomizers
glitches, ...
in this context I mean things that would be sequence breaking in the vanilla game, which may enable completing an otherwise impossible/pre-softlocked randomization of the game
like clipping through a locked door because the only key is behind it
civic hawk
my brain is already proper fucked when I see zelda speedruns that use a bunch of super specific glitches like the OOT ones I can't even comprehend randomizers
visual folio
they usually also have options that affect whether glitches might be required
bright girder
botw randomizer would never be a thing
the only 4 things you get are the runes at the start
and you HAVE to get those at the start or the game doesnt work
civic hawk
so much for player freedom smh smh /s
visual folio
the other day I learned that in the original Zelda 1 you can just... not pick up the sword
and up until the Ganon fight you can make that work
bright girder
If anyone else is tempted to do the OOTMM rando (its sooo fun) make sure you set the bunny hood and song of soaring as starting items.
unique dagger
the other day I learned that in the original Zelda 1 you can just... not pick up...
correct but only psychopaths do this
bright girder
kinda sucks if you get those at the end of the game
Im traversing Termina right now without song of soaring and its pretty painful
civic hawk
Considering how open Majora's is (at least in my eyes) I think a randomizer combined with OOT would absolutely defeat me I'd never be able to finish that
visual folio
well, if we do another Archipelago thing, LttP's definitely on the table for me now
visual folio
Nire: turns out Airin/Irene has the best skip in the LBW speedrun, they never even enter her dungeon
visual folio
||I'm still terrible at ping-pong! <:sweetiedumbfabric:649319691319377923>||
it is so validating to see a speedrunner also suck at this
visual folio
TIL there was a golden bee in LttP: https://www.zeldadungeon.net/wiki/Golden_Bee#A_Link_to_the_Past
apparently every missable item that involves pegasusing into things, I missed
unique dagger
whoa
civic hawk
Nire: turns out Airin/Irene has the best skip in the LBW speedrun, they never ev...
Why would anyone skip her dungeon
heretics
visual folio
to get to her faster lol
wet compass
In the OOTMM rando you start as a kid and you have to get the master sword befor...
Yeah I figured
I was just trying to work out how that worked gamewise, the master sword is a world item not a player item at first
wet compass
botw randomizer would never be a thing
That exists, the main challenge is that the paraglider is somewhere on the great plateu and you have to find it
Other than that all chests are randomised and shrine orbs are in chests
bright girder
Sounds like the randomizer is kinda done when you find the paraglider
I guess it can be a thing, just sounds real bad
wet compass
Yeah it didn't look great when I saw someone play it
bright girder
I finally found the fairy ocarina after spending 20 minutes trying to figure out what I could have forgotten to check
only song of time left before I can become an adult
supple quarry
Where did you find it?
visual folio
so after coming down from the LttP/LBW hype, and after pointing out many of the improvements LBW made, I wanted to also think back and try making a list of things that I liked about LttP which either just weren't in LBW, or were very different in LBW, or in one case was imo better in LttP:
- the bow was more useful in LttP, mostly because Link is smaller and rooms are bigger so there's just more time and space to aim at things
- Eyegores (the red or green one-eyed statues that won't move until the eye opens) especially are more interesting to fight in LttP since you can and often must aim at the eye, while LBW almost forces you to spam your sword instead
- all the cool stuff in the Turtle Rock dungeon (LBW's Turtle Rock is also cool, but is basically a completely different dungeon with the same name)
- not having the dungeon map at the start; I like the sense of progression you get from having to start a dungeon with no information at all, then eventually finding the map (in addition to the compass)
- nearly every LttP dungeon gave you a necessary item, which made those dungeons feel a little more rewarding (the flip side of the flexibility LBW's Ravio provides)
- I really like the Flute/Ocarina Boy sidequest (despite mixed feelings about locking fast travel behind it)
- some dungeons had extra small keys, which could be used to open optional shortcuts or optional rooms with health/ammo/rupees
- the Magic Cape is cool
- Link has to get a book on ancient Hyrulian to read a handful of ancient inscriptions, including one on the Master Sword's pedestal
unique dagger
Book of Mudora is cool
bright girder
I had to talk to the mountain scrub as a goron, he sold it for 200 rupees
supple quarry
I had to talk to the mountain scrub as a goron, he sold it for 200 rupees
Ouch. That's a pretty weird check
civic hawk
felt like going out of my way to listen to this track specifically
I think it has to be one of my favourite overworld themes
visual folio
you all know I've never been much of a music person, but even I could appreciate how much of LttP's soundtrack was incorporated into LBW's
so, for Nire especially: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bK-ttWxl4CI
civic hawk
Oh well that makes sense
Sounds good, I do prefer the LBW version but that sounds good
visual folio
I think it's interesting how the LttP one feels more... intimidating? oppressive? while LBW's is more "fk yeah, dark world time!"
civic hawk
LBW sounds like what that would be meant to sound like with actual instruments
visual folio
which is probably appropriate, LttP was much more likely to murder me if I let my guard down lol
civic hawk
Both give me a big sense of adventure so I don't know if I find it oppressive and intimidating, I found the Lorule theme to give me a much bigger sense of adventure than the actual Hyrule theme with the epic orchestra after you get the master sword
visual folio
true
civic hawk
Maybe the Lorule theme has a bit of a higher pitch and the pace is a bit faster so it ends up feeling a bit more whimsical, but Dark World theme also feels sort of whimsical so I don't know
I expected the Dark World and Lorule to have much darker themes I didn't expect them to have the same one and to be like this
visual folio
context might also be a factor
civic hawk
https://youtu.be/t6JgG__XbRA?t=222
I expected, going into this blind, for the Lorule theme to be something a bit more gloomy and darker kinda like these portions of the TP overfield theme which is also one of if not my favourite
visual folio
in LttP you get thrown into the dark world immediately after the hyrule castle boss fight with no real explanation, and only novel monsters as far as you can see
LBW puts you in a safe house with NPCs that are kind of jerks but clearly not trying to murder you
civic hawk
I guess so, although to be fair when I first went into Lorule the monsters were significantly more intimidating (though now that I'm on 13 hearts and Lvl. 2 Master Sword I'm getting more comfortable)
visual folio
yeah, it's all relative, the core structure is of course still very similar
civic hawk
though I assume Lttp is harder for obvious reasons
visual folio
I still died a few times when I first got to Lorule despite that experience
visual folio
well, carelessness was a big factor
civic hawk
Yeah I got very close to dying some times because I can get impatient and make mistakes during fights but luckily that always seems to activate survival mode in me and I do my best to not take risks until I get at least a couple more hearts
Thank goodness there's just human hearts everywhere around in the grass in these games
visual folio
mm-hmm, most of my deaths were early in the game when certain things could 2-3 shot me, so there wasn't time for a "oh I should be tryharding this" moment
unique dagger
i have a very obvious bias for LttP so i won't weigh in 
visual folio
like the lynel
civic hawk
That's why I remember telling you if you missed the convenience of just having food on you constantly in TOTK
visual folio
obviously the safe and smart move is to just stay away from lynels
but that's not fun
unique dagger
killl
visual folio
||they can, it just takes way too long with the equipment you have when you first see them||
civic hawk
Now that i have the lvl 2 master sword I wonder if that's a significant enough damage multiplier to take em on
visual folio
I never did look up what the actual difference was
civic hawk
the only measurement I have is that it takes fewer swings to kill gibdos but still quite a bit
but a good amount less than last time with the base master sword
unique dagger
gibdos gibdos what for
visual folio
I know lots of 2 and 3-shot overworld enemies became 1-shots, but I didn't take notes
the hinoxes are another enemy where the sword upgrades are very noticeable
civic hawk
oh, hinoxes huh, that's what they look like here
visual folio
just having more heart containers later on is also huge, even before you get the upgraded tunics and stuff
civic hawk
heh, I became used to the far more stylized fantasy monsters of TOTK that I didn't even register those guys as hinoxes
quite sturdy enemies too
the heart containers are definitely helping a lot of course, but it does make it far 'harder' to refill
so I gotta remember to keep delicious milk bottles on me at all times
visual folio
maybe the strongest indication of the difficulty gap is that in LttP I would often go out of my way to restock on potions but in LBW I mostly didn't bother or just picked up random fairies I ran into
though part of that is also the magic meter; in LttP there's a potion which restores both health and magic, so I'd try to fill all my bottles with that, and more than one boss had me consume a potion for both bars' sake
oh and in one of my Ganon attempts I failed by running out of magic rather than health
civic hawk
To be fair the fact that it's a portable game and that around this time Zelda games were being criticized for being far too easy and extremely hand-holdy despite the free nature of this game I do find it relatively normal that it's not extremely hard although it's definitely aiming for the audience of Zelda fans that love this more traditional style
visual folio
yep, difficulty is complicated
civic hawk
I do kind of miss the feeling of being challenged that I got from TOTK but honestly so far it's not really ruining my experience I'm really having fun and even side quests and collecting are fun since everything is so compact so I don't end up having to spend 1 hour doing a single thing like I did in TOTK due to the immense size and time it took to do anything
visual folio
I assume you saw my list earlier
there's one or two aspects of LttP's "difficulty" that I would like back but most of LBW's "easiness" is avoiding frustration / not wasting the player's time
civic hawk
Weirdly enough I enjoy that stuff doesn't take too long to complete and isn't incredibly challenging, bosses so far have been getting increasingly more difficult as well as the dungeons themselves but still very fun to go through and not taking far too long at all
visual folio
but I won't deny that there are a few boss fights which are maybe too easy
civic hawk
I did read it but since I don't know very well how lttp plays or feels like I can't say much
visual folio
come to think of it I can't remember if I ever died to a dungeon boss
have you?
I definitely had a lot of scuffed fights
civic hawk
I came very close to dying to the thieves hideout boss with the big shield, literally finished it with my last final heart, mostly because I got careless and impatient but also because it's pretty chaotic as a fight, but I liked it a lot I thought it was very fun to figure out, the one with the big knight hand and the flower thing from the last desert temple were pretty tough too but I figured them out
^
civic hawk
I hope so
I hope the bosses will get even better despite the difficulty 
so far all of them have been unique and very fun
civic hawk
you know it's a good channel when they have few videos all posted within months or years of each other and all videos have at least 1M views
alpine meadow
I need a youtube channel with over 1 million subscribers, and gets 1-10 views per video
glad isle
Found myself in Kakariko Village, is there anything important I shouldn't overlook?
civic hawk
Definitely snap a nice pretty picture of Paya because she's best girl 📸
Real answer though, no spoilers but I'll mark it just in case anyways: || if you haven't already done all the main 4 regions yet, there's not much to do in kakariko just yet outside of fun side quests and general exploring and looking around in shops and stuff, but there will be something to do there later ||
unique dagger
also the gacha machine
civic hawk
For me it was definitely too big of a game
Which is why I'm really enjoying the much smaller scale of ALBW
glad isle
BotW and TotK are really the only games of their kind I've played
bright girder
This seed is really going to make my get all 7 zora eggs with one bottle 😭
and no warp song
visual folio
TotK is definitely a game I'm glad I waited until I was in the mood for
if I tried to play it immediately I probably would've burned out on it much sooner
bright girder
you learn so much about the old games playing randomizers. Today I got the heart piece in the Kakariko village windmill which you are supposed to get after Dampes race, but I got it as a child by throwing the boomerang at it.
wet compass
you learn so much about the old games playing randomizers. Today I got the heart...
I was watching some youtubers play a coop randomiser ans both were absolutely failing to get that check
It hurt to watch, they have the boomerang and longshot already
And both had done randomisers before
civic hawk
By the way Ix you maybe likely saw em already but i posted a couple interesting zelda speedrun videos last night you might enjoy since I know you watch speedrun stuff
they're pretty gud
visual folio
ah right, I’ve seen those two videos go by in the YT recs but never clicked on them
civic hawk
hah
that was fun to figure out
time to destroy some giant boulders
of course there's snails under these giant rocks
hah that's cute, if you stay still Link will stare at the bee following him
is this guy really making me run all the way to the other corner of the map
how even
bright girder
a lot of pegasus bootsing
civic hawk
Seems like it, huh, I didn't know the pegasus boots went all the way until you stopped or reached a new screen
I thought it was like a short sprint not a full on sustained dash
That makes things significantly more manageable, now all I need is to find the more optimal route
visual folio
it took me way too many failed attempts at this to realize the sand pillars aren't even on a timer
civic hawk
yey!
I love how Link just absolutely decimates anything in his path when he's dashing with the boots
visual folio
is this guy really making me run all the way to the other corner of the map <:rd...
for the record, I did the first round of this without pegasus boots, in only a few tries
second round definitely requires them though
civic hawk
it took me way too many failed attempts at this to realize the sand pillars aren...
Oh they totally are, the sand pillars go away after a couple seconds
visual folio
pegasus boots in general are fun to just experiment with during ordinary overworld traversal
civic hawk
That sounds about right, 75 secs is a lot if you manage to figure out an optimal route you can definitely do the whole thing by just regular running
visual folio
Oh they totally are, the sand pillars go away after a couple seconds
oh, well, a far longer timer than I initially thought because I was reusing the rod so fast
civic hawk
Yeah, they don't go away immediately but they do go away, it took me a while to figure out exactly what the dungeon wanted me to do because I mainly used the sand pillars for anything I have in front of me at the moment, but I never thought to use them in the way that cave wanted me to by placing them in this specific place that I jump to from someplace else
bright girder
It's august 2nd. I'm on my way to the shadow temple after finally becoming an adult. I've had hookshot, hover boots and the bow for longer than I can remember. I try to use Dins fire, but I still dont have magic 10+ hours into the seed. Life is daijobou
Here's another picture of me on my way to the forest temple before stopping in Kokiri forest realising I can't go there without Sarias song
civic hawk
Link: 
visual folio
That sounds about right, 75 secs is a lot if you manage to figure out an optimal...
in the 100% speedrun, it's so long that because they get the boots early, they grab three maimais on the way
visual folio
ah, I needed multiple tries to figure out and then practice some key boosts
but I was doing it several hours after the easy boot-less race
civic hawk
of course as soon as I exit out of the dialogue I get viciously attacked by birds
visual folio
universal experience
civic hawk
now... I'm trying to remember where I found giant boulders now that I have the titan gloves
I already got a couple maimais from some of them in the lower sections of the map...
I also got the giant rock in the blacksmith house with the heart piece inside the cave
visual folio
iirc the "important" big rocks are mostly maimais, which you have the special map for
I'm only managing to remember two other significant things behind big rocks
civic hawk
Oh right, I do have the map
I got quite a number of them in Hyrule's overworld 
god dammit with these surprise bush knights
civic hawk
Yeah there's also not 999 of them
And the little mini puzzle caves aren't the same puzzle over and over again
Is there a maimai around hyrule castle?
I'm missing just one in this hyrule castle area
visual folio
iirc ||there is one in the "screen" the castle's on||, specifically ||in a tree||
civic hawk
Hmmm... I already bumped into both trees at the sides of the castle yard I didn't hear any chirping
weird.... I could swear I went through all this central screen area and I haven't found it
civic hawk
I may have done, but I still looked in other places and haven't found it
I'm gonna keep an ear out
visual folio
I can't even remember what shape that area of the maimai map was, I spent so much more time in the lorule one
ah it covers your house, the blacksmith and the... wait, what do we call that square of trees with the big stump in the middle?
civic hawk
the.... stump... woods?
Ahhhh
hold on
I think I know where it is
theeeere you are little guy
visual folio
apparently various sources call the LttP location https://zelda.fandom.com/wiki/Haunted_Grove, Animal Grove or Ocarina Forrest, but those names make no sense in LBW and seemingly nothing ever refers to its LBW counterpart by any name at all
oh wow that was part of the castle's tetris piece
ah that's one of the rocks I put a red pin on so I didn't have to learn that
civic hawk
Yeah just baaarely in the corner which is annoying
visual folio
incidentally
have you gone back to mother maimai at all since picking up the maimai quest?
civic hawk
apparently various sources call the LttP location <https://zelda.fandom.com/wiki...
It doesn't really seem to have an important name or anything, but I did wonder what that tree stump in the middle was for and when you showed the ocarina guy I assumed it was the same location?
I have yeah, to cash some of them in
visual folio
ok cool
civic hawk
She just said thank you and I just went on my way
visual folio
and yeah that stump is where Ocarina/Flute Boy and his ghost are found in LttP
oh
well
do it again lol
civic hawk
well let me get these last ones first
I have 2 in the area next to this one and 1 more in the east temple area so I'll get those and go return them
..huh...
I can't figure out what I can do to these things
...I think I should have every item right now
Oh, it's just a bump into it thing
visual folio
I was about to say this would be a perfect example of how I get stuck on something so simple that locks me out of an "early" item for half the game
visual folio
oh you found that waaaaaay before I did
speaking of ways to get stuck
I know I was consciously thinking "huh, feels like there should be a cave there" at least once when passing by that spot
civic hawk
yatta!!!
I mean I definitely thought there would be something there
I assumed maybe a portal to Lorule but that wasn't there when I started getting the portals so... something HAD to be there
I used everything on these things sand rod, ice rod, fire rod, boomerang, hook
visual folio
I am so glad none of the portals are just hiding under a random small rock this time
civic hawk
I covered them in bombs thinking maybe I need a bunch of them to break them?
and it just... opened a hole in the wall
oh I accidentally ended up creating a shortcut to the witch's house
I did!!
visual folio
oh that cave
I keep forgetting that's there because I've never needed to go between the temple and the witch's hut
civic hawk
and I can sell her stuff 
To be fair there's a TP point right there
but still, useful
visual folio
it's also that there's no reason to revisit most of the temple area after your first visit with flatten and Ravio items
visual folio
that guy is literally the reason I wrote "most of" just now
civic hawk
yeah you can get most stuff in an area the first time you visit thankfully, afterwards it's pretty much just extra stuff that's not terribly important but you may want to get
well, unless you count these as important
visual folio
right, "with flatten" implies all the portals are available
civic hawk
I'm gonna start pinning these since I don't wanna go through them just yet because I know I'm gonna get wrapped up in exploring whatever area they take me to and I wanna finish off these maimais in hyulre since there's so few of them left
visual folio
ooooh
personally I always went in and out immediately just to get them marked on the map even if I was still busy on this side
but it does make a lot of sense to pin an "unused" portal
civic hawk
the temptation is too much for me it's best for me to not risk getting carried away into another thing
since I'm not gonna be exploring it just yet, might as well just pin it for later when I do want to explore it
for me anyways
visual folio
me spending half the game with very few spare pins may have been a factor
though I think I also tended to actually go through each portal very soon after I found it, usually I just needed to finish clearing that screen first
I think I did significantly more overworlding pre-flatten than I really needed to
visual folio
theeeeere we go
civic hawk
oooh what should I get first
visual folio
feel free to ask/google what the buffs are, I don't think that's the bad kind of "spoiler"
they're more interesting than "double damage"
civic hawk
That might be for the best since it doesn't tell me what it does in-game and it'd be nice to know before upgrading
visual folio
the in-game text implies they want you to pick one and then experiment to figure out how it's better, buuuuut yeah you've got choices to make
so first off, which dungeons do you have left?
civic hawk
Uhhh pretty much most of them, I only did 3 in Lorule the Kakariko one, the lost woods one and the desert one
visual folio
oooh there's quite a bit left then
ok so the three dungeons on the west edge
I'm just gonna copy the upgrade descriptions that https://www.zeldadungeon.net/wiki/A_Link_Between_Worlds_Item_Upgrades uses to avoid revealing any other spoilers on that page
visual folio
yep, eventually it's every item
and then one extra reward I won't spoil after all the upgrades to existing items
civic hawk
Oh wow 3 times in a row, I love that the item visibly changes too
visual folio
Nice Fire Rod Bigger, longer lasting, and more powerful fire
Nice Ice Rod Throw 4 ice shards at once
Nice Sand Rod Sand pillars last longer, range higher
Nice Boomerang Throw up to three boomerangs at once and improved speed and range
Nice Tornado Rod Larger affected area
Nice Hammer Doubled Damage and Range
Nice Bow 3 arrows at once
Nice Bombs Wider Range, more damage, and bigger bomb
Nice Hookshot Faster shot that deals damage