this is the last thing I ever expected to hear another peep from, I'm so happy
#general gaming
worldly summit
fresh bane
Oh god he's moved on from demon ladies to ghosts now
random steppe
Game looks fun but I know myself enough to avoid buying bullet hell games
I am dreadful at them
It's very cute tho
unreal idol
How do you check the Steam summary rthingy
cerulean herald
How do you check the Steam summary rthingy
where ur username is, hover and click Year in Review
right of the Community tab
cerulean herald
at least its an increase from last years 
visual hill
A Modern day classic, PREY by Arkane has been brought into 2024.
Thanks to the talented developers Pumbo (Graphics) and Ersh (Reverse Engineering) HDR, DLSS, 240 FPS, Better Ultrawide Support and improved Graphics have been brought to Prey via one simple mod
Arkane fans rise up!!
gaunt marten
Hi
river veldt
hi
gaunt marten
I'm ruthlessly getting rid of games in my wishlist I no longer think I could play or enjoy. Did I miss anything? https://store.steampowered.com/wishlist/id/Violet6/?sort=reviews
I need professional haters
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2165810/Streets_of_Rogue_2?snr=1_25_4__318
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2717160/WebCraft?snr=1_25_4__318
These two games are slated for Q4 2024. They have ten days to come out
Ah, looks like he didn't get around to pushing back the release date https://bsky.app/profile/mattdabrowski.bsky.social/post/3ldooij2blc2x
bronze abyss
I'm ruthlessly getting rid of games in my wishlist I no longer think I could pla...
goodbye volcano high - has its charm but its very unrefined and rough,also lacks quality of life features that would make it replayable considering its a choice based story especially for the price they are asking
rivals of aether - dead,everyone moved onto rivals of aether 2 and the community was inactive even prior,single player is irrelevant past 1 repetitive mode thats basically waves of minigames
rocket league - despite being free straight up would not recomend ever playing it,community is fucked,esports scene is fucked and its grave is just getting dug deeper
echo point nova - seemingly fun at first,then by the time you figure out the basics the game becomes boring cuz of lack of content variety and movement mechanics
gaunt marten
No
Oh, I actually do have all of these on my wishlist
Thanks. I'm getting rid of rocket league. I won't get rid of rivals of aether, goodbye volcano high or echo point nova
I do in fact intend to buy rivals of aether 1 for the singleplayer. I do want to see goodbye volcano high despite the roughness, and I think I'm pretty bulllish on Echo Point Nova.
I want echo point nova specifically for the movement
visual hill
@green fulcrum did you see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_1s24tidOA?
green fulcrum
No I didn't, but I actually don't really care for Enter The Dragonfly. Still, this is cool to see. The game, despite being a piece of junk, had a lot of shockingly dedicated fans, and it's nice to see them finally win for once. :)
bold sonnet
For EA Play/Game Pass Ultimate members Sims 4 Home Chef Pack is today free to buy 💖 and i remind Sims 4 is free to play on all platforms
cerulean herald
I'm ruthlessly getting rid of games in my wishlist I no longer think I could pla...
I'm surprised Stray is there, I thought you didnt like the visual style
gaunt marten
Oh yeah good point
bold sonnet
I'm ruthlessly getting rid of games in my wishlist I no longer think I could pla...
On mobile is this. Do you want to make a screenshot?
bold sonnet
End of my microphone on Microsoft Wireless Headset just chipped off and I never dropped it and was always touching gently and it was less than one month from new what happened?
gaunt marten
That sucks but happens sometimes
gaunt marten
Yes, this happens not because you are negligent but because Microsoft is cheap
bold sonnet
Why would they make cheap their flag headset?
gaunt marten
Because they would make more money than if they spent more on each headset
bold sonnet
But just from finger touch plastic falls of?
gaunt marten
Microsoft is not in the business to make the best headsets, and are not known for good hardware
bold sonnet
It was very gentle touch
That's super silly. If I touched gently and gamers are sometimes rough.. It doesn't make sense
I don't like this I'm going on a call tomorrow and ask a bit
gaunt marten
I can't really comment on your specific situation
If you bought it a month ago, you probably can get it replaced under warranty
bold sonnet
Yes I can there is three years warranty, but problem is I really like the dials on left ear for between game and a call, and right ear on volume. Im not sure any other headset does that
gaunt marten
With a warranty you can get it fixed or replaced and try again
With the same headset
bold sonnet
I already sent this headset three times to fix, but last time they said okay let's give her a new one 
and now plastic chip off. I think I want different if any other does dials on ears
But i dont think there is
gaunt marten
Personally, I prefer headphones with zero buttons and as few things that can break as possible
Plus a separate microphone so I can replace only the microphone when it breaks
bold sonnet
Dials Flitter it's about dials. Left ear, right ear
gaunt marten
Yes, I don't like or want dials because they are a problem
bold sonnet
You don't want left dial to do audio between call and game and right dial to do volume?
gaunt marten
No! I want headphones that give me sound and never break
That is the one important thing for me
bold sonnet
But what if someone on call is too loud or the game is too loud
gaunt marten
I will reach for the volume button on my keyboard or controller
random steppe
I do like volume buttons
Also the current Bluetooth headaset has a button that stops or starts the current video, which is very handy
random steppe
Yeah but I am not always at my pc when I am listening stuff from it
gaunt marten
If I'm not at my PC, I can remotely control my PC with my phone and turn it down
random steppe
True, but it's a lot more annoying than reaching my ear and tapping a button a few times
They are large and positioned intuitively so I don't have to remove the headset in the process
gaunt marten
If you like it, that's fine. I prioritize durability as much as I can
random steppe
Yeah, I like it's buttons and not a dial for that reason
Buttons usually last decently well, dials did sometimes break on me
bold sonnet
They are large and positioned intuitively so I don't have to remove the headset ...
That's why I like dials it's just so intuitive. But it turns out the one company that does on ears makes headsets that break
They broke four times and I never dropped it!
random steppe
Even though I don't know if I can complain too much about my previous radio headset, it lasted enough that I had to buy a replacement internal battery
bold sonnet
That sounds like good long live headset
slim thorn
my headset has a dial but I never remember it exists until I have one of those days where audio stuff decides to stop doing audio and I try it and can't remember which direction on it is loud or quiet and it's never the solution anyway
gaunt marten
A good compressor would be a lot more valuable than a volume dial for minimizing the time someone is too loud
quiet swift
New set of games from prime
gaunt marten
(it can result in reduced range but that's desirable)
gaunt marten
New set of games from prime
I recommend Hero's Hour
It's a Heroes of Might and Magic style game with fun design
random steppe
That sounds like good long live headset
The reason I abandoned stuff like that is that I realised where the true weakness was, like most things in life the weak link is 3.5mm audio jacks
Now if something doesn't connecth through Bluetooth directly or USB I refuse to entertain the idea
Fuck those 3.5mm traps, they always break in a way that to make it work you need to keep it bent at all times
craggy vine
Does anyone here know is the rog ally has a high powered headphone amp? I swear that, maybe about 8 months ago, I used my rog ally with my 350ohm headphones and it was loud. But I did it again today and I had to play with max volume to have a reasonable amount of sound. I thought it did have a high powered amp at first because of that but maybe it doesn't, and maybe I am remembering wrong.
Only thing I changed is that I use bazzite now instead of windows but I doubt that would change how much power the headphone jack can provide
I can't find anywhere online that says it can be used with headphones requiring high power. Only that the headphones can do high-res on the official tech sheet.
bronze abyss
B-buh what if im cracked
slim thorn
oh, for me that's just any soulslike metroidvania 
random steppe
I am so fucking lost in POE 2 that I saw what I assume is the Aztec inspired mask and my head went "oh, the Vaal, cool crossover for The Finals"
The Vaal are legit some of the coolest lore in that game world but no Gen, the Aztecs came first
slim thorn
I’m currently playing Bo Path of the Teal Lotus, so I have to keep reminding myself that no it’s not an Okami reference
unreal idol
I'm thjinking about getting a replacement CRT. The one I have kinda sucks and I don't use it much anymore, but I'd like to go back to playing on real hardware. Anyone got any tips on what to look for in a TV for older systems? Price ranges, brands, etc. Don't wanna get ripped off or buy a junker
rancid herald
do they even make crt anymore?
unreal idol
Probably not in the US
So I'm already dealing with "eventually this one will break in a few years" ad nauseum
gaunt marten
They do make CRTs nowadays
They're specialist systems though, not for games
Apparently some companies also sell consumer level CRTs from unsold brands https://youtu.be/GpJZrrJohU8
Thomas Electronics still do deals with companies to produce new CRTs today https://www.thomaselectronics.com/manufacturers/
But I doubt they will even look at you for less than a million dollars
green fulcrum
rancid herald
"it's fuckin roblox"
light gate
"oh... leave it... LEAVE IT... LEAVE IT!! The DUCK's BURNT!"
cerulean herald
it cant be complete without his excessive swearing 
light gate
Honestly, Gordon Ramsay's swearing is the stuff of legends you just don't expect. Its like a whiplash of emotions lmao.
visual hill
But I doubt they will even look at you for less than a million dollars
a big problem with modern CRT manufacturing is complying with RoHS and other environmental regulations
it's the likeliest reason why we haven't seen something like Dough attempt to revive CRT manufacturing
but anyway, OLEDs are getting really close to CRT motion clarity at 480 Hz refresh rate, or even 240 Hz - with none of the CRT downsides
for playing on old consoles, I'd advise buying a scaler instead or modding the console for digital output
or just use emulation, it comes with digital output for free 😛
unreal idol
I've been emulating but I want to use my original hardware again
gaunt marten
Even when emulating it sometimes makes sense to use a CRT monitor if the game relies on CRT-specific rendering tricks
visual hill
CRT shaders have also gotten really close, assuming you have high resolution and HDR output
(HDR lets you get a brighter image, compensating for the CRT shader's loss in brightness)
I still prefer playing with a raw image despite having a great display for CRT shaders, but that's just me
I did try them out and they look good, but I prefer the visual clarity
(it's also less tiring to look at in the long run)
gaunt marten
Yeah, I prefer my normal monitor over RCT or a shader
visual hill
that reminds me, someone is working on adding better high FPS support to Dolphin through VI overclock: https://github.com/dolphin-emu/dolphin/pull/11486
it'll allow more games to run at 120+ FPS, or even 60 FPS with correct audio
there are some 120 FPS videos in that thread, make sure to watch them on a 120 Hz+ display (or at half speed)
the Wii era already had many games that were coded around delta time, so some of them handle 120 FPS without needing any cheats to correct their game speed
white phoenix
After 7 years, tf2 comic #7 is finally out with absolutely no prior warning whatsoever lmao https://www.teamfortress.com/comics.php
wind stump
After 7 years, tf2 comic #7 is finally out with absolutely no prior warning what...
absolute fucking masterclass
no notes.
it's everything you could ask for and more. A celebration of what makes TF2 TF2
||"We couldn't have done any of this without you."||
i am in fucking shambles
god DAMMIT I LOVE THIS STUPID GAME
visual hill
quartz pawn
lmao
chilly mural
slim thorn
yeah, sounds about right
was not expecting to see Phoenix there, but counting 3 games as 1 game would make it count more compared to what I normally play
river veldt
where's fallout new vegas /j
proud warren
1 game away from the funny number
slim thorn
speaking of, back to Japanese Hollow Knight
random steppe
You mean Nine Sols? Or it's another game?
(FTR I though Nine Sols felt more Korean than Japanese in inspiration)
slim thorn
Nine Sols is Chinese
random steppe
Oh, gotcha
slim thorn
like, very specifically, half the Sols are named for Chinese mythological figures
I was referring to https://store.steampowered.com/app/1614440/B_Path_of_the_Teal_Lotus/, my current new-to-me metroidvania
random steppe
That actually look extremely like a Japanes HK
river veldt
im chinese
slim thorn
it also plays like one
random steppe
How does it compare as far as difficulty?
slim thorn
though it goes super hard on the pogo-based platforming early on
my impression at the moment is that the combat is easier but the platforming is harder as it's trying to do more of the latter compared to HK (and especially compared to 9S)
but I'm also still pretty early, I only just got to the hub area where all the NPCs hang out
random steppe
Makes sense
river veldt
im chinese
i just want to clear my consciousness and say i was lying here
slim thorn
might as well stream some
cerulean herald
i just want to clear my consciousness and say i was lying here
How dare you provide false cap lore. I am disappoint
slim thorn
also every time I pass through the load game menu I think of Ori, why does no one else do circles here
random steppe
From the trailer there is a bit where the duders do slingshot himself from something, very "ori-like"
So there is some inspiration from there too probably
river veldt
How dare you provide false cap lore. I am disappoint
im sorry
slim thorn
also some part of me finds it deeply amusing that in Chinese HK Nine Sols you heal by smoking an opium pipe, while in Japanese HK Bo you heal by drinking tea
fresh bane
oooohohoh yeah this is an old ass game alright
I'll say maybe I don't have a good frame of reference since I obviously wasn't around at the time but for 1995 the amount of narration and fully animated cutscenes feels very ambitious, the opening cutscene of this game is a good 2 and a half minutes long or something and obvious dated visuals aside it actually doesn't look that terrible, I can imagine a remake doing a 1:1 recreation of the opening cutscene with just better visuals and lighting and it really wouldn't feel dated at all
river veldt
what is this game
fresh bane
maybe it's because I'm using a patch to even get this game running at all but the game also doesn't even feel that bad at all! I was expecting it to control and feel much much clunkier but everything feels very nice and responsive 
fresh bane
what is this game
Legacy of Kain: Blood Omen
river veldt
oo
fresh bane
It's basically Zelda but with Shakesperean vampires in a gothic decaying world
slim thorn
so that one bit of Ocarina of Time
fresh bane
I'm not even joking about the Zelda thing, they even have the sliding/floating spiky orbs that every dungeon in a zelda game is legally required to include
fresh bane
~~so that one bit of Ocarina of Time~~
the one creepy dungeon under Kakariko?
slim thorn
part of the joke is there's a few things it could refer to, but my first thought was when you first get to the adult time period and there's these freaky undead enemies around castle town, partially because the temple of time's exterior is probably the closest you get to a proper gothic vibe
fresh bane
Yeah I was wondering which bit you were referring to since there's more than one possible answer but yeah sort of, except in this game you're the monster fighting humans and sucking their blud
but you do also fight magic creatures and stuff too
river veldt
part of the joke is there's a few things it could refer to, but my first thought...
redeads are so scary
shell shore
It was twilight all along..
fresh bane
hah, okay game 
fair enough
light gate
what happens if you do it again?
fresh bane
It already shows you, it drains your health
It's also a one time power up too so I don't think there's much reason to even drink from it again too
bold sonnet
Oh I played few minutes of it but couldn't get what I was supposed to do
light gate
It already shows you, it drains your health
I meant if you kept healing yourself intentionally and redoing it.
Like, is there any more dialogue?
fresh bane
Probably just the same dialogue again
This game is very ambitious for its time, but not that ambitious
slim thorn
finally, I can afford to upgrade my teapot 
slim thorn
lol, I don't think I've ever seen an NPC spawn after I died to an optional boss just to say "Whoa, you're braver than I thought. Your death was inevitable, but still!"
gaunt marten
Crystal Project has a fun NPC called Gokue that shows up if you die at bosses considered difficulty spikes and gives advice you probably missed the first time
He also shows up at various places to prevent people from getting too lost, but you wouldn't even notice it's the same guy unless you talk to him
slim thorn
aww, I can pet the dog nine-tailed fox after I beat it up
dire gate
So basically Hades
slim thorn
I just realized something that's probably supposed to be super obvious: the Triforce is a reference to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_Regalia_of_Japan
They represent the three primary virtues: valour (the sword), wisdom (the mirror), and benevolence (the jewel).
not quite 1-to-1 but still
river veldt
oh shit
dire gate
I like how they couldn't come up with an exact word for magatama thus just translated it as the jewel
slim thorn
yeah even Phoenix Wright calls it a "magatama" in English
dire gate
Also you may think it's "an obvious reference" but it's not seen as a reference for the three treasures in Japan
slim thorn
oh?
dire gate
I think they see the concept to be too general to directly connect to the treasures
What I find more is that the shape of Triforce is actually identical to the emblem of Hojo clan, although most assume that it's not really related at all:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hōjō_clan
slim thorn
maybe "reference" is too strong, but it seems likely to have been part of the inspiration either way
that wiki article did claim that Link to the Past's magic mirror, moon pearl and master sword make up a three treasures reference, which also makes sense, and ties the master sword directly to the courage triforce
dire gate
That makes much more sense, another possibility why Japanese people don't find it as a reference is that, well, triforce is not "sword, mirror, and magatama" combination
slim thorn
separately, I like that my down spell in this game is a mochi hammer
quiet swift
Hojo clan, you say?
slim thorn
FIRST TRY
game devs, please rip off borrow from Mantis Lords more often, that was great
slim thorn
mm-hmm, its only flaw was that we had to wait for Godhome to get the proper 3 mantises at once battle
the tengu fights are also a really interesting comparison because in HK, the Mantis Lords are an early and "easy" boss, while in Bo the tengu bosses come much later and thus are significantly harder (on top of the obvious differences like being designed around Bo's move set and so on), and ||when Bo adds a 3rd tengu, which was also excellent, it has completely different attacks from the first 2, so it's not exactly a Sisters of Battle situation||
sacred grove
cerulean herald
static bluff
I really need to keep playing that game. I enjoyed it, I just got stuck
fresh bane
https://bsky.app/profile/farfin.bsky.social/post/3ldr3ebnvfk2l
by god this horse is doing strings!
I never know if Umamusume stuff goes in gaming or in anime
cerulean herald
do both just in case
quartz pawn
I'm playing Phantasy Star 1 on Sega Master System right now. I keep dying lmao
bold sonnet
I heard that name before
quartz pawn
Probably because of Phantasy Star Online 1 and 2. But Phantasy Star was Sega's oldest RPG
bold sonnet
Is it like Final Fantasy or different?
gaunt marten
It's the Star Wars of Dragon Quest
slim thorn
what I've heard was Phantasy Star was a console-first action RPG series, compared to its contemporaries, and still has some standing in that niche?
gaunt marten
The original was a traditional JRPG
slim thorn
ok I'm probably thinking of Phantasy Star Online
bold sonnet
I heard of Dragon Quest. Gosh so many titles I've heard but haven't played
slim thorn
oh right the original stood out by having a sci-fi setting back when JRPGs were so new that hadn't been done yet?
gaunt marten
Yeah
slim thorn
ok, yeah, I have watched The Entire History of Japanese RPGs
dire gate
They wanted to sound cool so they wrote Phantasy instead of Fantasy
slim thorn
I heard of Dragon Quest. Gosh so many titles I've heard but haven't played
Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy more or less are the core/defining series of what we usually call JRPGs these days, but Final Fantasy is the one that really broke through in the west, especially 7, so that's why most of us have played more FFs
bold sonnet
I really like the idea of jrpgs and on my phone I have ff7 PS1 but when I open menu and see stats I'm like oooookay 
quiet swift
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QuuORJnvuE a whole new set of reactions, twice as long as the previous compilation. So many people losing their minds 🥹
bold sonnet
slim thorn
my impression is that if I were to try a Dragon Quest I'd probably find it too generic/cliche to really enjoy, suffering from the classic "it's a cliche because I started it" problem
bold sonnet
And Okami I have it but haven't played!
dire gate
my impression is that if I were to try a Dragon Quest I'd probably find it too g...
idk you might find it interesting as you can start to learn how many references Japanese media make out of DQ
slim thorn
see I'm so western-pilled I still read that as "Dairy Queen"
dire gate
There are so many Wait this was from DQ??? moments
visual hill
I've never played Dragon Quest, but Hero is a fun character in Smash
walking slot machine 🙂
if you can read fast, it's the character for you
bold sonnet
I play now Doom 2016 and try to convince myself into like, feeling brave 
But mostly it's just blasting everywhere until it calms down and then I don't know where to go
gaunt marten
my impression is that if I were to try a Dragon Quest I'd probably find it too g...
Dragon Quest 3 is the first one I like. It has interesting systems and mechanics that are unique enough to still be fun
slim thorn
how many have you played?
gaunt marten
Like three
slim thorn
actually did I ever ask how many of the FFs you played, I just know it's a lot
gaunt marten
For Final Fantasy, I played 1, 2, 3, 4, 7, 8, 9, 10, 12, 13 and some of the side ones
slim thorn
omg how have you not played 6!?
gaunt marten
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2701660/DRAGON_QUEST_III_HD2D_Remake/
The remake looks really nice, and has pretty good reviews from people I trust. Biggest concern is it doesn't have cheats like Final Fantasy does (no encounters, auto-win)
bold sonnet
Why you skip 5 and 6 if you played so many?
gaunt marten
I intend to play both 5 and 6. It's just that at the time I was buying physical games, and these two were not for sale
slim thorn
why did I skip Federation Force when I played every other Metroid including the literal pinball game
bold sonnet
I love pinball 
bold sonnet
It's so cool that you like metroidvania games and also played Metroids
dire gate
I personally recommend playing DQ1 and DQ2 before DQ3 if you haven't been spoilered about those games, but honestly it's so old that even SE themselves aren't hesitant at spoiling it so I guess whatever
gaunt marten
I definitely don't think Ixrec would like them
slim thorn
it's also funny that someone made an actual pinball metroidvania game, and bizarrely it's another of my favorites
how long are the DQs and how do they relate to each other, coming from the FF "every game is its own thing usually" situation
dire gate
DQ 1-2-3 are trilogy
bold sonnet
it's also funny that someone made an actual pinball metroidvania game, and bizar...
Is it stand alone game or is it in pinball FXs launchers?
slim thorn
oh I'm referring to Yoku's Island Express
dire gate
Honestly the fact that 1-2-3 are trilogy is already a spoiler, but it's kinda official at this point so
slim thorn
fair, and that's kinda important for deciding which if any to play
bold sonnet
I think it's natural to think they are trilogy no?
dire gate
4-5-6 is a trilogy, 11 is a sequel to 1-2-3 trilogy
slim thorn
unlike e.g. FF7 remake ||being a stealth sequel||, no reason to give that away for anyone
dire gate
7~10 are all separate by their own
slim thorn
I think it's natural to think they are trilogy no?
I wouldn't have expected it since the FFs are mostly unrelated, and the larger DQ series is way more than 3 games
dire gate
Yeah franchises with long series often have this "only some have continuities" issue
bold sonnet
About that pinball game sorry again 
is stand alone game or in other game as one table?
slim thorn
Fire Emblem is a similar mess of mostly independent entries but now always
dire gate
Meanwhile Falcom's franchises tend to have one huge continuous timeline
Ys has 10 games all in a single timeline, Trail goes insane
slim thorn
ah the game I was referring to is not a "table" at all, the structure is closer to a metroidvania but the world is made up of parts of a pinball table like flippers and bumpers and tracks that only sometimes form an identifiable table-like cluster, it's definitely not the sort of thing you'd play on something like Pinball FX
visual hill
Jazz Jackrabbit 2 has a level that's almost a pinball table
dire gate
Although I guess Trail series is already a part of LoH series and that one isn't continuous for the whole franchise
bold sonnet
Holy ship JJ2
slim thorn
also add this to "games I love despite sucking at"; turns out I am terrible at pinball but that was no significant obstacle to enjoying this lol
dire gate
Although I guess Trail series is already a part of LoH series and that one isn't...
The whole family tree of this series is weird, LoH(Legend of Heroes)1 is DS(Dragon Slayer)6; meanwhile the first Trail game, Trails in the Sky, counts as LoH6
bold sonnet
https://store.steampowered.com/app/334940/Yokus_Island_Express/
It's on gamepass 
dire gate
And LoH1+2 is a series, LoH3~5 are trilogy
bold sonnet
The whole family tree of this series is weird, LoH(Legend of Heroes)1 is DS(Drag...
You guys know so much games, I really want to play so many when I read here
dire gate
Like it's overly complicated
slim thorn
Like it's overly complicated
<inserts DrakenNier and Kingdom Hearts flowcharts>
dire gate
I mean KH at least is a single franchise with weird flowchart
This one is like multiple series
bold sonnet
Kingdom Hearts 💖 Like Destiny, you play and is super cool but story is so confusing
slim thorn
You guys know so much games, I really want to play so many when I read here
tbf, it probably sounds like a lot more than it is because I doubt any of us have played every game mentiond here, e.g. I've played exactly 0 of what Jay just mentioned, I've played 0 DQs, and only FF7 and 9, and only ~2 Fire Emblems
bold sonnet
https://store.steampowered.com/app/334940/Yokus_Island_Express/
Do I see right on screenshots that you play as... ball in pinball? 
dire gate
It's closer to how complicated Megami Tensei franchise or Xeno franchise is
slim thorn
technically you play as the dung beetle pushing the pinball around, but yeah
slim thorn
I guess you also "play as the flippers" but it's not like anyone ever tries to justify how pinball island works lol
bold sonnet
I heard if Megami Tensei. It's like women are consoles and it's anime no?
gaunt marten
No
dire gate
That's Neptune
bold sonnet
Which one is it then
dire gate
It's the original of original of Persona series
gaunt marten
Shin Megami Tensei is where demons are Pokemon
slim thorn
iirc Persona is the SMT spinoff that added the social time management mechanics?
dire gate
Megami Tensei exists -> Reboot series of Megami Tensei is SMT -> SMT's spinoff is Persona
gaunt marten
Imagine if they called every reboot New
slim thorn
New Metaphor: Re Persona
dire gate
They have like 7 different series under the name of Megami Tensei
bold sonnet
I heard if Megami Tensei. It's like women are consoles and it's anime no?
Hyper Dimension Neptunia says Google. Shows to how many titles Ive seen but played so little
dire gate
If you dive even deeper the whole thing starts from a novel called Digital Devil Story(DDS)
So Persona spinoffs are technically like,
cerulean herald
TIL Persona is related to MT
dire gate
They made a game based on a novel, then reboot the series, and then made a spinoff of the series, and then made the spinoff of that series
slim thorn
one could argue Kingdom Hearts counts as a joint spinoff of Final Fantasy and all the Disneys
bold sonnet
I really tried getting into Persona but I think it's really if you like anime
slim thorn
then it's a really wild flowchart
nah I like anime but Persona's not my thing
it's one of many kinds of "RPG" where I really like the story being told but all the game mechanics are to me not fun/interesting enough to feel like anything more than an obstacle to getting that story
bold sonnet
I love cartoons very much but I was like.. and don't laugh, why do they talk so much and I just walk around the city?
dire gate
slim thorn
that'd be the social time management mechanics
that's unique to Persona even among "anime RPGs"
dire gate
bold sonnet
I want cool things to happen
cerulean herald
it's one of many kinds of "RPG" where I really like the story being told but all...
what sort of game mechanics do you look for in an RPG? or which ones do you dislike
slim thorn
hoo boy is that a broad question
bold sonnet
I think if I confused shin megami Tensei and something something Neptunia I should watch YouTube videos about both
slim thorn
especially with the modern dilution of the "RPG" term
dire gate
"what is rpg" is as vague as "what is gundam"
slim thorn
they're giant robots that aren't evas, obviously
dire gate
aka no one fucking knows
bold sonnet
Big Robot flying and fighting
slim thorn
exactly, evas can't fly
dire gate
except when they do
bold sonnet
hoo boy is that a broad question
It very is, but if you find time and want to, I would be very curious too
slim thorn
I guess the glib answer is "this is why Disco Elysium is my #1 favorite RPG"
slim thorn
but if we want to try for a serious answer
keeping in mind this is extremely specific to me, anyone who actually likes RPGs for their RPGness (hi Flitter) will take issue with this
To make my points most clearly: the extreme typical RPG in my eyes would be Planescape: Torment. Some of the best writing ever seen in a video game (up with DE), meaningful narrative choice, lives up to the hype there 100%. But everyone agrees the gameplay is a slog, and anyone revisting it now should just use a walkthrough from the start so they can focus on the good parts. Also that gameplay is just D&D mechanics in computer form.
river veldt
i played a bit of Disco Elysium but i think a lot of the commentary went over my head, some bits are funny though
slim thorn
with the overwhelming majority of traditional stuff-people-call-RPGs that I've played, as opposed to games-that-grew-RPG-elements-later, I have this dual experience of great story and rubbish mechanics getting in the way of that story
that's why Disco Elysium is the glib answer: it has so few mechanics it's almost correct to say it's "nothing but dialogue trees"; there's no combat system of any kind, there's only the simplest possible form of skill checks
and it's impossible to give a complete answer because of that massive gray area of RPGs that shed their RPGness (Mass Effect 2) and non-RPGs that gained RPG elements (arguably many shooters and metroidvanias?) muddying all the waters from both sides
bold sonnet
I've heard Planescape Torment also gosh 
As Disco Elysium, with my impatient butt I played very short time and didn't know what to do
Also to make blow harder, same with Kotor which is loved too
slim thorn
it's interesting how many of the best video games involve not telling you what to do, and either the player gets confused by that, or it becomes the best experience they've ever had with a video game
bold sonnet
Only one game did that and I finished, The Myst
I was super determined to finish and I did. I hold it as my most difficult thinking game i ever played
river veldt
i love you Myst
slim thorn
oh yeah, Myst-like point-and-click puzzlers are another high-risk, high-reward genre
you've seen my short list of similar-to-Myst recs right?
bold sonnet
So many games you say, Ixrec, I want to put in backlog but the shelve is barely closing in that cupboard
Hollow Knight being most important from your recommendations
slim thorn
Hollow Knight's a funny one to bring up in this context since, even within metroidvanias, it's one of the most non-linear and easy to get lost in (by design of course)
bold sonnet
Ayayay 
I already get lost in Ori
What is a difference between Ori and HK you would say?
Except of colors and theme
hushed onyx
you've seen my short list of similar-to-Myst recs right?
No 
slim thorn
what sort of game mechanics do you look for in an RPG? or which ones do you disl...
anyway, hopefully with all that context, it makes sense why my direct answer to this question would be "I don't" and/or "the mechanics associated with the term 'RPG' are exactly the ones I dislike; all the ones I like are associated with other genre terms" (like all the action RPGs that have good action-y gameplay)
bold sonnet
You have such smart grasp on games
slim thorn
only the ones I play lol
cerulean herald
anyway, hopefully with all that context, it makes sense why my _direct_ answer t...
makes sense! it sorta reminds me of ppl arguing about whether or not BotW was RPG or not
slim thorn
(if I ever do get the urge to try "giving (J)RPG mechanics another chance", it'll probably be Crystal Project, based on what Flitter's said about it)
bold sonnet
If you play jrpgs does it maybe corelate with if you read books?
slim thorn
No <:Lurk_Base_still_waters_no_text:1131751306139279400>
#manechat message
river veldt
i wish i liked hollow knight as much as everyone else
hushed onyx
I know Myst 1 and 3 well enough (despite not actually playing them all that much) that I just know where the puzzles are 
Which can be fun ofc but also not.
slim thorn
yep: "high-risk, high-reward"
if someone asks me about puzzle games I'm gonna recommend stuff like Monument Valley first, stuff like The Room second, and only then get to the big scary Myst-likes
river veldt
best puzzle games is Portal 1 and 2 😎
slim thorn
true, Portal's a pretty safe bet, especially for people familiar with other first-person games
bold sonnet
again a game I heard but couldn't get to what the buck
hushed onyx
yep: "high-risk, high-reward"
The point is that it's not high-risk any more because I know exactly where the puzzles are and how to solve them so I can pretty much speedrun it
slim thorn
oh you know them that well, whoops
well there's always Obduction and Quern and maybe Riven
river veldt
hbomberguy has a great Myst video
bold sonnet
I really need to work on my backlog
hushed onyx
well there's always Obduction and Quern and maybe Riven
Riven is definitely the thing at the moment, yeah. Never did get particularly far in it so I don't actually know everything without really thinking about it.
Obduction and Quern maybe sometime if I ever actually play through any significant part of my backlog.
slim thorn
enjoy your ten-layer fire marble puzzles
hushed onyx
oh you know them _that_ well, whoops
TBF I exaggerate a bit, but definitely for Myst III it is the case that I know all of the puzzles and worlds well enough that I can solve the puzzles pretty quickly without much trial-and-error and generally know where they are.
(Not coincidentally it is also the only one I finished as a kid)
slim thorn
3 is the one where I solved the most stuff on my own, ofc it's hard to judge how much that was learning from 1 and 2 and how much was 3 being more solvable
Obduction's the only "true Myst-like" that I 100%'d on my own, still hard to believe I manged it
hushed onyx
In a meta-sense it would make sense that 3 was the easiest, since...it was literally designed to be a tutorial on world design for kids :V
(If I may be allowed to spoil a 25 year old game)
slim thorn
I don't think that's even a spoiler? but it has been a long time since I played it
hushed onyx
And even though Saavedra rejiggered it to test Atrus, he wanted to test Atrus, not trap him forever.
hushed onyx
I don't _think_ that's even a spoiler? but it has been a long time since I playe...
Technically you don't know that at the very beginning, but you're right, Atrus gives you his journal that says so very early on.
quartz pawn
ok, yeah, I _have_ watched The Entire History of Japanese RPGs
I just watched that one a couple weeks ago lol.
slim thorn
yeah, I usually default to something like "first five minutes"
slim thorn
clicks Add to Wishlist
fresh bane
I also found these other ones today
https://fxtwitter.com/HideWorksGames/status/1869798864229937157
I don't know how good these two will be, but I'll at least keep an eye out for any news on these for later
that last one apparently features the og Brad Vickers from RE3
slim thorn
Signalis inspired
fresh bane
you know you made it big when people use the name of your game as an inspiration for their game
saying Signalis-inspired is a little funny though considering Signalis is already inspired by Resident Evil/Silent Hill, but I guess Signalis is more isometric in style than fixed camera
slim thorn
that does happen a lot within a well-defined genre like this
you could say the same about "Hollow Knight inspired", but for a lot of people these days, that's their reference point for the genre rather than Metroid or Castlevania (especially since Castlevania kinda stopped existing? at least by that name)
ofc it's as much a marketing choice as anything else
fresh bane
I wanna say I feel like Metroidvania is a genre name that is just too ingrained in gaming culture to be forgotten or replaced like that, but ''Doom-clone'' was a very widespread and popular but short lived term too so what do I know really
I feel like most people especially the young'ns nowadays probably don't even know that was just how you referred to FPS games in general before
cerulean herald
but do we still call it FPS if theyre third person 
slim thorn
to be fair, "first person shooter" is an unusually straightforward and self-evident name
as game genre names go it's hard to beat
not like soulslike or roguelike or metroidvania-like or zelda-like or doom-clone/like where the term is likely to be meaningless if you haven't played any of the relevant games yourself
slim thorn
game devs, please ~~rip off~~ borrow from Mantis Lords more often, that was grea...
...and, uh, while you're at it, maybe don't copy ||Delicate Flower|| 
cerulean herald
What's wrong with that? 
slim thorn
How does it compare as far as difficulty?
Now that I've 99%'d the game: my first impression was correct. For me, overall it's significantly easier than Hollow Knight. IMO the hardest boss fights in Bo are maybe 70th percentile of HK boss difficulty. In particular, Bo is a shorter game and has nothing like the dream bosses or godhome or other harder-than-default DLC content. However, Bo requires much more platforming skill than combat skill: hitting things gives you an extra jump + dash, so you can often stay airborne forever, and many of the boss fights effectively require you to be in the air a lot. So it could easily end up feeling easier or harder overall depending on how you feel about that.
As a concrete example of what I mean by that, here's the optional Kitsura fight (one of the few that took me >5 tries): https://youtu.be/FickwmD62qU?t=45
gaunt marten
Where the fuck is the Hoshi no Tama
craggy vine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrTMkdtTbEY 
Not enough Vram for 16k and 8x msaa
gaunt marten
Yeah
With resolution, each time you double the size, you quadruple the memory required
gaunt marten
Yeah, but with MSAA, each time you double the resolution, you quadruple the processing requirements
craggy vine
Yeah
It's sorta like, if you have a 4090, you may as well just go to 8k and use 8x msaa. At least without any graphics mods.
Also would have been interesting to see it on custom maps, some custom maps are way more gpu heavy then any of the base game content.
slim thorn
are you really going to notice >4k pixels anyway
craggy vine
Sure if I have a tv over 50 inches and I am close to it
(I don't)
I watched the video at 1080p and the game looks absolutely no different between the start and end of the video lol
This is jsut for fun anyway, to see if an old classic game can push a new top end gpu to the limit
slim thorn
the real question is why isn't it Crysis they're cranking up to 16k
craggy vine
I'm pretty sure they did that
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JpH4naHzW8 They did 8k at least
Also damn this video is 2 years old... The 4090 is older then I thought. I guess I am not used to technology coming out in slower cycles like that, which I actually kinda appreciate. Getting used to new models of phones every year, new apple M processors every year.
slim thorn
we did outlive moore's law after all
I'm still not sure if technology as a whole is slowing down, or if it just feels that way to me because now I'm old enough to not be as shocked or impressed by every little development
cerulean herald
I think it's still rapidly growing
AI videos is kinda showing that
slim thorn
eh, LLMs already peaked, and that's a very small piece of "technology as a whole"
gaunt marten
Individual pieces of hardware are no longer capable of following Moore's Law, but general processing power hasn't slowed down.
gaunt marten
eh, LLMs already peaked, and that's a very small piece of "technology as a whole...
Have you seen this graph? https://x.com/goodside/status/1870243391814152544
Twitter
slim thorn
nope, no clue what metric this is
gaunt marten
ARC-AGI is a set of visual puzzles designed to be easy for humans to solve and hard for AI.
You can check out the public set of puzzles and try them out
slim thorn
to be clear, "peaked" doesn't mean "absolutely everything that can be done has been done", just that the biggest impact has already been made
gaunt marten
And here for the evaluation set https://arcprize.org/play?task=00576224
I think LLMs are not going to massively improve without another Chinchilla-scaling style breakthrough, but I think we'll get plenty of those still
slim thorn
yeah, that's been my impression for a while
random steppe
Now that I've 99%'d the game: my first impression was correct. For me, overall i...
Makes sense, I did buy and start it the other day and the movement feels so hollow knight-y that I literally keep trying to do HK attacks despite the fact it's the wrong game for it.
I also noticed the focus on platforming when the siren boss was preceded by a 10 minutes (well it was 10 minutes for me since I kept fucking it up) platforming session to get to her 
It's quite a lot easier to stay airborne than HK, since comboing an enemy while in mid air keeps you suspended in mid air and also gives you extra jumps, even if it isn't a downward attack, so that part is not too bad
The game feels a bit derivative for sure but also it's gorgeous and plays well, more games should shamelessly copy the games I like
gaunt marten
I feel like you would enjoy Rogue Legacy 2 a lot
If you played 1 before, don't take it into consideration. 2 is a very different game
random steppe
I do tend to bounce off rogue likes I learned, Hades being the exception, and Slay the spire I guess
IDK if Rogue Legacy 2 fits the description
gaunt marten
It is story-focused and has significant metroidvania elements
Specifically, I think you'd enjoy the boss fights
random steppe
I will look up a couple of videos
gaunt marten
It has super customizable accessibility settings, as well as a special game mode designed to be done in one go (more difficult)
Like Hades, every time you die, you get to pick a weapon that defines your playstyle for the run
It's surprisingly hard to find a good boss video with no spoilers
This one is fine https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfzJQWhZAtE
It uses a Valkyrie, which is a newbie-friendly class, but doesn't use it very well
https://youtu.be/U3sEa3_y8q0 This one's more advanced but still uses no relics (items that grant special effects you find mid-run)
quartz pawn
so there I was, playing Phantasy Star 1 on an SMS emulator I got on Google Play, then a full screen ad flashed and crashed the emulator. I hadn't saves in two hours. I lost 8 levels. I am inconsolable.
gaunt marten
It sucks that happened. If you like I can help you find a replacement emulator with no ads
quartz pawn
It sucks that happened. If you like I can help you find a replacement emulator w...
Thanks, but I think I'll just get KEGA or something on PC instead. That way I'll have a larger screen lol.
gaunt marten
Sure!
quiet swift
And on GOG, one of the xmas discounts is 90% off on Othercide
static bluff
Remember to play Cave Story plus
Apparently I stopped playing right before the final dungeon and it's really hard
blissful sand
anyone here would like to play codenames someday?
i've only played it in french and would like to try in english
visual hill
I just finished Spyro 1 (remastered), it was pretty quick
outside of the difficulty spike because one level is broken at > 30 FPS 🙂
fresh bane
huh, close enough, welcome back Onimusha
this game is very Resident Evil 1 inspired, probably the closest one I've seen visually and in feel, unfortunately that's as much a good thing as it is a bad thing I appreciate wearing an inspiration on your sleeve but little things like having to interact with stairs to go up or down...
It seems like this game is much smaller scale than the others I've played though so I'm not gonna be too harsh on it
bold sonnet
I just finished Spyro 1 (remastered), it was pretty quick
How quick is quick? Do you have option to check how long you played?
static bluff
Yeah the bit that unlocks the true ending is an insane difficulty spike
Good grief, you're not kidding. This is extreamly hard.
bold sonnet
huh, close enough, welcome back Onimusha
This is Onimusha? I heard this name. It looks like Alice Madness Returns and Resident Evil made one game
quiet swift
green fulcrum
dense crypt
been playing GTA Online a lot. It's a lot of fun, and hackers arent as common as i thought. Started a crew and got 3 other people already. Wonder if anyone in Mane plays too?
craggy vine
Probably because they added anti cheat recently. Too bad I can't play it now though.
little badger
Twitter
quiet swift
needs the base game though
little badger
Ah
random steppe
I have been progressing in the visual novel content they have put in Warframe with the last update and 
I heard they hired a romance novel writer to write it and I believe them
fickle garnet
Theres a visual novel in warframe?
fickle garnet
gay furry romance visual novel set in the warframe universe
Please tell me this is real
bronze abyss
i caught the chromafin as well jsut a couple days ago,idk whats with my luck in sun haven
i have like the most basic gear possible and no skills that increase fish quality or anything either,so im at the base rate of 0.80% for both fo them
random steppe
Please tell me this is real
Well...furry maybe not, one of the ladies has a very long tongue but I don't think it counts
Gay it can be, if you romance someone the same gender as your character
So to explain what it is.
In Warframe 1999 the most recent content for the game your Drifter ||which is an adult version of your operator, that exist because parallel universe, what is an operator is too complicated to explain here|| gets sent back to 31st december 1999 of the Warframe timeline, where they meet the Hex, 6 people that are trying to stop a ||nuclear explosion|| before it's too late
They ||fail and all die||, but as your Drifter can ||create time loops, yeah don't worry about it, they just can||, you find yourself at the start of the year, and you can befriend them by chatting with them through a chat app, and ||you have to if you want to save them||...you can also chose to romance them, and get a kiss at the end of the ingame year.
It's really cute,
fickle garnet
Interesting
random steppe
The writing is really well done, which is really the part that doesn't make the whole thing collapse on itself
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6McCtGP5wiY just to link the cinematic they presented them with
visual hill
How quick is quick? Do you have option to check how long you played?
3 hours, fast enough to complete in a day like I did
I got to the credits, didn't 100% the game
green fulcrum
Spyro 1 is pretty short, yeah. Spyro 2 and especially 3 are a good deal longer, especially if you're 100%-ing each one.
Spyro 1's levels are super small, and it doesn't really have any bosses.
bronze abyss
For any of yall who like stardee valley would highly recommend sun haven,its an absolutely amazing game
gaunt marten
I've seen scathing reviews that made me very hesitant to give it a try
eager bane
For any of yall who like stardee valley would highly recommend sun haven,its an ...
It's been on my wishlist for a while. 
Does it do anything special?
bronze abyss
more gameplay variety,much more content,and the game doesnt make you feel as limited as stardew does also the progression is much nicer imo
static bluff
Welp, I beat the normal ending in Cave Story+. It was pretty hard!
quartz pawn
Here's Alis. The main character of Phantasy Star 1. She's probably the first ever female protag.
Gameplay is split between normal looking RPG like this, but then go into first person view when in a dungeon. It was pretty awesome for Sega Master System.
The battle screens are like this. A lot of people had problems with Phantasy Star over other JRPGs because the battles relied on RNG. So, when fighting multiple enemies, the character would attack at random. The only thing you could really control is targeting your own party members with healing or items.
Also, expect a lot of spelling errors in the game lmao. "Sworm"
dire gate
I feel like there should be at least 1 female protag until 1987
quartz pawn
After every battle, there are chests left behind by the enemies, some of them will be trapped, also relying on RNG.
slim thorn
Metroid was 1986 in Japan
quartz pawn
Is Metroid a JRPG? I would have called it more of an Action in the classic sense
slim thorn
lol google just gave me a list of female game protagonists before Metroid
oh no, but you didn't say JRPG, just "She's probably the first ever female protag."
quartz pawn
oh lmao oops, I meant for JRPGs.
slim thorn
then yeah I could buy that
quartz pawn
Because around that time, the main ones being male heros in Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy.
slim thorn
what was the first FF with a female protag? 13?
dire gate
Yeah for JRPG it's harder for it to not hold "the first" title
It's like one of the first JRPGs
quartz pawn
You know, I find it funny that, during the cutscenes, her hair is blonde, but in the field, her hair is black
The grind in this game is too real. At lvl1, really you can only kill the mosquitos with ease. everything else hurts a lot. By level 3, you can start standing up, but when they don't give out too much money, you're basically farming to get at least a decent weapon.
Heck yeah! Going to another planet!
I like how Alis doesn't even care that this cat is talking. I wonder if Myau will allow a few pets here and there?
Now that I have more party members, the numbers of enemies will increase.
Poor Odin isn't too bright, but he can pack a wallop. (And he's nice on the eyes.)
quartz pawn
The abreviations of these weapons are hilarious. I know it means 'Short Sword' but Shit Sword is more like it!
hidden elbow
Since its December 24 already in where i live , i obliged to post this
green fulcrum
The abreviations of these weapons are hilarious. I *know* it means 'Short Sword'...
"Ya found shit."
worthy rose
fresh bane
I've heard the Switch store seems to have a problem with these shovelware type games
blissful sand
What's a shovelware
dire gate
Nowadays Nintendo eshop is, both ironically and unironically, one of the best indie platforms, but that means it also has to suffer from low-quality shitstorm
river veldt
I've heard the Switch store seems to have a problem with these shovelware type g...
:yea:
slim thorn
What's a shovelware
welp I just aged another decade
fresh bane
What's a shovelware
Shovelware refers to any software, although nowadays it's mostly games, that are very low quality and were mostly made to make money quickly, it's called shovelware because it's meant to refer to the same way you'd carelessly throw a bunch of material into a pile with a shovel
If you've ever seen cheap knock off games of popular titles, that's a shovelware
slim thorn
what do people call low-effort games that are bad in the not-even-trying way these days?
fresh bane
It also refers to software of any kind, because at the time they'd just throw these useless low quality softwares into CDs, but it started being used more to refer to low quality cheap games that are churned out on masse for quick money
green fulcrum
welp I just aged another decade
I feel like this is less of an age thing and more of a culture/language thing, seeing as Yanis is French.
blissful sand
Yeah I can think of one or two ways to refer to those in french
I just haven't come across the term much in English
Thanks for the answers! Gave y'all awards
sour hill
what do people call low-effort games that are bad in the not-even-trying way the...
asset flips or shovelware
rugged flax
☃️
river veldt
what is this
steep flax
That game looks very photorealistic
static bluff
Going back to a save after 2 years is always challenging
gaunt marten
I have no clue what that game is
static bluff
Clue 2
gaunt marten
I don't think you get it
shell shore
Question for the sims challenge im doing, its the princess challenge and the first one is snow white should i start with snow white or start with the evil queen
young creek
its final fantasy
gaunt marten
My hobo with a bindle eyes have not seen a game anywhere that level of graphics in years
young creek
look at the hair
gaunt marten
Is it uh
static bluff
Oh i see
young creek
Oh its Nier Replicant
gaunt marten
Yeah I was going to guess Nier
young creek
I didnt guess I clicked on his profile
gaunt marten
But nearly no gratuitous butt shots here
young creek
work smart not hard
static bluff
But nearly no gratuitous butt shots here
That was going to be clue 3
gaunt marten
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2334493648?t=00h12m24s @random steppe might be interested
It's a Rogue Legacy 2 any% and any% seeded Speedrun, time of one hour and half an hour
(took me like 60 hours to get true ending)
shell shore
Oy ny god..
wind stump
new Fatal Frame looks fire
quiet swift
smoky sonnet
dredge is also on prime gaming with a gog code, for people who don't like epic
drm free 
visual hill
I've heard the Switch store seems to have a problem with these shovelware type g...
this is a Switch exclusive
visual hill
What's a shovelware
in French, people would say pelliciel-- oh wait
French has lots of translations for freeware, shareware, framework, middleware... that sound funny even to native speakers
adware/spyware too
gaunt marten
The switch doesn't have much bloatware
Today I learned steam has absolutely no shovelware
https://store.steampowered.com/tags/en/shovelware
fickle garnet
I got the contagion quick hack in cyberpunk and wow, it is super good
fresh bane
It's OP as hell
rancid herald
how can we clear our driveways without shovelware
cerulean herald
I'm sure a firewall would melt the snow so it wouldnt be a problem
river veldt
i wanna play Cyberpunk 2077 so bad, especially since i love Keanu Reeves, but man am i bored. im only on the like 3rd mission and haven't even met Johnny yet, i assume it picks up right ?
eager bane
i wanna play Cyberpunk 2077 so bad, especially since i love Keanu Reeves, but ma...
I sadly didn't get into it myself, only played for about maybe two or three hours - but I get demotivated by games pretty quickly, so 
who knows
Plenty of ponies love the game though!
slim thorn
part of the reason I haven't played Cyberpunk is that I'm pretty sure it's one of those really big games that I'd only appreciate if I came into it ready to throw a minimum of 10-20 hours at it even if it doesn't grab me right away, and I just have not been in that mood for a long time
fresh bane
Cyberpunk is only as long as you want it to be, the main experience alone is actually not that long at all, but honestly you'd really be losing out on... so much if you decide to not do the side quests
A big complaint that I have and I see a lot of others have though is that this really conflicts with the story, the main story is all about how V is pretty much about to die pretty soon and you're constantly on a quest to find out how to get this guy out of your head, preferrably without killing both of you in the process (this is all stuff you learn early on it's not spoilers), but because you can do so much side quest stuff, to the point that I think I got 30-40 hours without having done a single main quest, it kinda has some friction with the main story
But also yes the ''tutorial'' part of the game before you actually get to start the game is also quite long, deceptively long
slim thorn
another part of it is that I already watched Edgerunners
slim thorn
A big complaint that I have and I see a lot of others have though is that this r...
remember in FF7 when you did 20+ hours of sidequests with ||a literal meteor floating over your head on the world map||? good times
and yet another part is that there are a lot of 50-100 hour story-focused RPGs out there, and I doubt Cyberpunk would be top of the list if I tried to pick just one to sink that kind of time into again
fickle garnet
I wanna try 100% Cyberpunk on steam
river veldt
But also yes the ''tutorial'' part of the game before you *actually* get to star...
ok cool
i'll just keep powering through then
fresh bane
to be fair Edgerunners has little to do with Cyberpunk 2077 the game, and also to be fair 2077 is a really good game to be fair, especially right now, even if I may have some problems with it it really is a very very awesome game, but I also understand that not everyone wants to put 100 hours into it of course, especially if its ''''''required'''''' to put many hours into all the side stuff to really squeeze out all the goodness out of the game
slim thorn
it is the same setting though, right?
fresh bane
It's the same setting yeah, a year before the events of 2077, some of the areas from the show are straight from the game, but the actual story and characters are completely different and have very little to do with each other
slim thorn
oh yeah, I'm aware it's different characters
like, I was surprised when my wiki skimming told me that Adam Smasher is in both stories
fresh bane
yeah everyone loves that one song, until you watch the anime/finish the game, then you do everything you can to avoid it
slim thorn
"hey Nico it's your cousin!" 
fresh bane
in Cyberpunk's case it's just because the song is really sad and inexplicably makes every player want to drive their car off the road as soon as it starts playing
some people may see it as super cheap that the anime keeps repeating that song all the time but it does a really good job at using it in the right places and really making it get stuck in your head
fresh bane
gah of course I lose in such a lame way against a Zangief, twice
you really can't make a single mistake against a grappler 
slim thorn
not that I play fighting games, but Nine Sols' final boss has an attack that's mechanically a grab/grapple, and dying to that one always felt worse than my other deaths
fresh bane
by the way, since you're here, I don't know if you saw my posts about Alisa but I did finish the demo, it seems like the game is very short based on a guide I read while I was going through it, it's also very old school
slim thorn
I did see your posts but last I heard you'd only just started
fresh bane
Signalis and Crow Country have a lot of that modern game polish and feel, but Alisa feels very much like you're playing Alone in the Dark or RE1
The demo is pretty short it was like 30 minutes
slim thorn
yeah I got that vibe
leaning towards a no on it myself
the bar is so high these days and I'm sure you'll tell us when the next Signalis or Crow Country does come along
fresh bane
I'm on the fence about it, it's 50% off right now and it's already a very low price so honestly it seems worth enough to check at least once, it's also short enough that it probably takes 2 hours tops to beat so I'd be fine with getting it, but I'm not gonna stress about it if I don't end up doing it, it does have some fun stuff like how you can just punch your way through ala Silent Hill Origins and the sword combat Onimusha style (although really it's more like RE1 knife only)
also, just to note, I wasn't expecting the game to do a Stellar Blade and allow you to... customize the main character
fresh bane
the bar is so high these days and I'm sure you'll tell us when the next Signalis...
well I appreciate that yeah a Signalis or Crow Country this very much isn't
I'll keep an eye on some of those other projects I saw pop up recently just in case any of them seem good
slim thorn
yeah, part of why I say that is you've made it clear you're really following the subgenre, making a point of looking for and following new projects
meanwhile I can't even keep up with my favorite subgenre, much less follow more than one of them at a time
(although the last time I saw a "best 15 metroidvanias of all time" list I had played 12 of them already, with 2 others wishlisted, so I might finally be getting close to caught up)
speaking of... should I start Crypt Custodian today, or Aria of Sorrow
random steppe
I have been progressing in the visual novel content they have put in Warframe wi...
This is goddamn fucking adorable
quiet swift
"Keep the change, ya filthy animal"
slim thorn
decision made
oh good, unlike SotN, I was able to guess how to use a save point as soon as I found one 
ok this is already way better than SotN, now it feels like it's balanced around being a modern metroidvania instead of a reset-heavy arcade game
slim thorn
good manticore fight (first non-tutorial boss), took a few tries but perfectly solid combat this time, even felt rewarded for changing spirits
the main thing against it is that PoP: Lost Crown had a way better manticore fight but that's hardly a fair comparison
slim thorn
1 hour and 12 minutes... that's gotta be the earliest I've ever received double jump in a metroidvania
wind stump
ARIA OF SORROW MENTIONED
graceful bridge
little badger
Twitter
visual hill
I had it already, I also have Ultimate Edition on gamepass but I'd need to transfer my savefile to play just the DLC
graceful bridge
https://www.reddit.com/r/civ/comments/1hm1u1c/civilization_vi_free_on_epic_games...
Apparently it was supposed to be Civ today, but got switched to Control at the last minute.
visual hill
Apparently it was supposed to be Civ today, but got switched to Control at the l...
heh, again
too good to be true... like DS Definitive Edition
uneven epoch
@hasty patio in yet more news i just learned about of "the country tryin to capitalize on KCDII's anticipation", one of the banks offers special credit card prints if you start a bank account there
stuff's wacky 
is that, normal for video games??
hasty patio
Can be at times if the local area is okay with it.
uneven epoch
i learned of this thru tv ad
gaunt marten
The primary draw of Civilization for me is having all the DLC nations
So offering the base version which normally sells for two dollars, without any DLC to go with it is not super appealing
Oh it's three dollars in the US
wind stump
Aww shit, here we go again...
This is the second time NIKKE and Eva have collabed... In a row. (The previous one before Eva was with NieR Automata)
strange habit of crossovering with series about a post-apocolypse with angst and drama, sorta weird. (See also Re;Zero collab)
quiet swift
cerulean herald
should there be something here? or am I missing something
gaunt marten
Scroll up
cerulean herald
ah ok, thx
gaunt marten
Here's a screencap of what shows for me
blissful sand
Control free on steam
Played for 2 hours with a friend jsut now and it's very good
I recommend
will play more later tonight
gaunt marten
You mean on Epic?
cerulean herald
https://store.steampowered.com/sale/bestof2024
@sage iris The Finals reached Bronze tier for "Top Seller" and Silver for "Most Played"
bold sonnet
The Finals has fantastic visuals and technology of destruction, super fun idea of a show, but also very good players and difficult objectives
I really wish I could get into it, it's a spectacle
And don't get me started on trailers 💖
sage iris
<@245197038231355393> The Finals reached Bronze tier for "Top Seller" and Silver...
oooo sweet I saw the bronze but didnt notice there were other categories
yeah best fps ever
bold sonnet
Maybe I should install and try again
And really focus on what they actually want me to do in a match
blissful sand
KILL and DESTROY and MONEY and and and
cerulean herald
I rly stick to Power Shift mode
I'd say it is probably also easier for beginners (me lol)
bold sonnet
When I played I remember everyone using zip wires (if they are called that in english, like lines between buildings) and I was like 
But the whole atmosphere, announcers, how great it was, it was amazing and captivating
sage iris
it's easily the most fun and refreshing fps game
I literally cannot play any other fps game anymore because they feel too slow and sluggish and boring
bold sonnet
Isn't destruction amazing? I was flabbergasted
little badger
Isn't destruction amazing? I was flabbergasted
Are you still playing BO6?
gaunt marten
I literally cannot play any other fps game anymore because they feel too slow an...
Have you played Echo Point Nova?
sage iris
Have you played Echo Point Nova?
oh yeah I've seen it already, it looks fun
will try it out at some point
bold sonnet
Are you still playing BO6?
I was just thinking about that, like how is finals faster than BO6
fresh bane
decision made
Oh heeyyy Aria nice, I never got too far on this game before not playing it again but I gave it a try like 3 times now
little badger
I was just thinking about that, like how is finals faster than BO6
I’ve not played the finals so you would be better asking merc what the finals is like
sage iris
echo point nova is a little unfinished from what I've seen though
bold sonnet
I’ve not played the finals so you would be better asking merc what the finals is...
It's free to play on all platforms (except of switch)
gaunt marten
True, I'm waiting for it to be finished but I've heard good things
little badger
It's free to play on all platforms (except of switch)
I’ve seen some gameplay it does look fun 
quiet swift
I'm impressed that BG3 is still in platinum sales for 2024 since it came out in 2023
bold sonnet
Ive heard it's very very good and smart. Waiting for cross-platform patch to play with Lemony because two heads to think is always better
For me at least
quiet swift
Yeah BG is fantastic, I played it last year. Just impressed the sales are still strong a year later to be in the top ranks
fickle garnet
I got Mario and Luigi Brothership and Space Marine 2 for Christmas
river veldt
i got Chrono Trigger and Final Fantasy VII Remake with my gift card
fresh bane
oh good, unlike SotN, I was able to guess how to use a save point as soon as I f...
speaking of, I found this video on my recommended this morning, maybe you'll find it interesting, I haven't seen it yet
https://youtu.be/zjc6gRBoubQ?si=PnDDSSGQk21j4XEV
hushed onyx
Started playing Riven, immediately got stuck
slim thorn
if you didn't get stuck I'd worry you mixed it up with another game
hushed onyx
Or I'm just that smart 
slim thorn
speaking of, I found this video on my recommended this morning, maybe you'll fin...
oh good he does talk about the ❤️ thing, that is so annoying when literally every other game in existence uses ❤️ for health
hushed onyx
(I don't mean the scene where you get "imprisoned" but immediately let out...)
slim thorn
granted I got over that in Rondo of Blood already so that specific weirdness wasn't an issue by SotN
fresh bane
oh good he does talk about the ❤️ thing, that is so annoying when literally ever...
It's one of the first things brought up
slim thorn
but yeah most of this is stuff I chalked up to old game syndrome and mostly tried not to hold against it
what I do hold against SotN is the combat and movement consistently feeling more tedious than fun, can't really gloss over or make up for that
fresh bane
The video also does bring up how the original Castlevania could get away with this weird UI nonsense, but by the era of SotN it's a little harder to justify
slim thorn
I did watch the full video btw
gaunt marten
The original Castlevania only got away with it because I wasn't there to hate on it
I'm there now so I'm sending it a lot of backlogged hate
slim thorn
and now flipping over to miscellaneous praise
fresh bane
I did watch the full video btw
I somehow read your first reply to me as: ''Oh god, does he talk about the ❤️ thing...'' instead of ''Oh good, he does talk about the ❤️ thing'' so I was under the impression you haven't seen it yet
gaunt marten
The world design of symphony of the night is so cool
fresh bane
To be fair I just woke up a little while ago...
slim thorn
I forgot the GBA had a "sleep" function that some games would use to implement a sort of one-off quick save feature in case you had to pause before getting back to a save room
and I kinda love that the icon for that sleep quick save is a coffee cup with a skull
gaunt marten
Why gbsp and not mgba?
gaunt marten
Okay uh
Since it's a very popular game they might both run fine, but in general mGBA is the biggest one and is available on retroarch
slim thorn
yeah retroarch tends to have 3-4 different emus for the popular consoles, I often just pick one at random
gaunt marten
It's considered the most compatible
slim thorn
especially since when I emulate games these days it's often a different console and thus different emulator every time, so looking up the "best" emulator is not a good use of my time
gaunt marten
You can use https://emulation.gametechwiki.com/index.php/Game_Boy_Advance_emulators as a basic resource for any emulator
Has a quick and easily digestible list of recommendations per console and platform
slim thorn
this "whip sword" feels like an even bigger upgrade than double jump just because of the range
gaunt marten
It is a really cool weapon
However, have you considered picking the worst fucking weapon just because it has the highest DPS?
It's a fist weapon with nearly zero range
slim thorn
that sounds like a great way to make Aria combat as bad as SotN
that's interesting, my first fast travel point in Aria lets me use a 2nd fast travel point I haven't been to yet, presumably because I have a map revealing that room exists although it was unreachable at the time
gaunt marten
This is done intentionally in ||Crystal Project|| and ||Axiom Verge 2||
slim thorn
I assume it's intentional here too, I'd been planning to just kinda keep pushing forward since until five seconds ago I had zero fast travel or other shortcuts back to the earlier areas, but now it does make sense to revisit them, especially since I met that NPC saying he'd put up a shop at the start
yay I finally have a weapon I'm allowed to swing up instead of forward
slim thorn
It's a fist weapon with nearly zero range
just found the Cestus, is that what you were referring to?
gaunt marten
I don't remember
slim thorn
nice moon
gaunt marten
Oh it was a dagger weapon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKXP0kZWbtY shows up before 200 seconds in, Japanese language run
slim thorn
the Japanese title is "Minuet of Dawn"? huh
gaunt marten
Makes way more sense than Aria of Sorrow when you look at the box art
slim thorn
not to mention the whole story about being sealed in a solar eclipse
oh no, are they going to deliberately put all the fast travel rooms awkwardly far away from all of the save rooms
gaunt marten
Koji Igarashi gave you a dash button so you have to use it
slim thorn
it only works for dodging though, it doesn't speed up total travel time
(ime that's pretty typical of the "castlevania side of the genre")
slim thorn
plus, in context, "it works for dodging" is a massive improvement; it very much did not before
woo, found the slide
dire gate
the Japanese title is "Minuet of Dawn"? huh
Another interesting fact about its Japanese title: It's one of two main Castlevania games that's actually called "Castlevania" in Japan
obsidian ridge
slim thorn
I liked the Headhunter fight
gaunt marten
I liked the Headhunter fight
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gaunt marten
Those headhunters are vicious
slim thorn
castle map 3 is weird (in a hopefully good way)
you know what would really improve this game
let me bind multiple weapons to multiple buttons, so I'd have an incentive to not just stick to my highest damage longer-than-a-knife weapon the whole game
(I'm aware the GBA didn't have enough buttons for this)
I found the obligatory clock tower
river veldt
scissorman
slim thorn
very mixed feelings on the Death fight, it's almost a great boss, but every other attempt it feels like the little scythes keep spawning in places where they can't be dodged and I just have to tank several
slim thorn
I love this loading "bar"
cerulean herald
https://fxtwitter.com/sentakubasami1/status/1871869405078102301 <:rdsnrk:5877803...
took me like 5 attempts to figure out what order to read this
dire gate
The embed made it overly complicated
slim thorn
catching up on Josh Strife Hayes videos and it's hilarious how many people apparently can't tell the difference between MOBAs and MMOs
wind stump
my cells are dead.
slim thorn
finally killed (CV:AoS) Death
I have no shame in putting a save state between phases lol
wind stump
"Well not Death Itself, you can't kill Death. It's kind of his whole thing."
- Cordie, 2018
sour hill
Cordie probably didn't have save states
wind stump
no but she does have them spider arms
slim thorn
that's actually the only save state I've used so far this game, which compared to most games old enough to need emulation is a shockingly good result
(I did make a bunch of other save states preemptively, but didn't end up using them)
astral steeple
Twitter
slim thorn
slim thorn
haven't heard of it
though after SotN I have been expecting a "see invisible stuff" item to turn up eventually
wind stump
the eye with a scorpion tail?
slim thorn
haven't seen it
wind stump
oh it's a soul not a item
slim thorn
remember I'm only 55% done with the game (map?)
wind stump
... 
WHY DID I EVEN BUY THIS COLLECTION IF I'M JUST GOING TO FUCKING PIRATE ARIA
thankfully the Collection has a full list of Souls, I'm sure this guy is in the first or second area
wind stump
Soul never dropped?
slim thorn
nope
wind stump
oh right, i was playing the trilogy in order...
and then Circle turned out to be turbo garbage
I'mma try HoD
(Harmony of Dissonance for context, is the game betwee Circle of the Moon and Aria of Sorrow)
... The first enemy i see is a Peeping Eye,, god dammit.
slim thorn
I can't quite tell if I'm underleveled for these underwater areas or they're just that much harder to get through or I'm having rubbish luck at finding the save rooms
wind stump
Is it the "Forbidden Waterway" or something similar?
slim thorn
not sure if I got an area name
wind stump
Hmm, I'm a bit rusty with Aria, but I think there's a semi-optional water area that you might have stumbled into by accident
Oh wow, so the Encecylopedia includes every obtanible weapon, including one I didn't know the existence of!
slim thorn
ok, "Rahab's Sword" was worth the trouble
wind stump
ah okay, you're NOT in that optional area
slim thorn
after dying horribly in the ice caves below that last save point I decided to instead go left and see if it would quickly reconnect to the opening area
so it's possible the part below I left unexplored in this timeline is what you're thinking of
wind stump
meanwhile i'm trying to RNG manipulate the first boss
wind stump
oooh, there's a guaranteed way to make the soul drop
https://youtu.be/9J7n9MMsFIc for anyone curious
slim thorn
I thought Pseudoregalia any% had been <20m for a while
gaunt marten
This is a Japanese community marathon speedrun, so the par should be roughly 25% slower
slim thorn
JP commentary on a run I already know seems fun though, this is a lot of vocab I'm not as familiar with
wind stump
after multiple minitues i give up
slim thorn
come to think of it, I also haven't seen a run of this on the map update patch, that changed a few things but I don't think it altered the route
wind stump
little badger
Twitter
visual hill
https://fxtwitter.com/sentakubasami1/status/1871869405078102301 <:rdsnrk:5877803...
wake me up until you rest
wind stump
being able to rewind is cracked for Soul collecting
static bluff
Free game https://x.com/epicgames/status/1872311754270634428?
huh looks kinda cool
wind stump
this RNG manipualation is fucking complinated
it doesn't help that Aria has a broken Luck system so there's very few ways to actually raise Soul drop chance
slim thorn
I still don't know what any of the stats mean since the game never tells you and it's not like I ever get real build choices that'd require knowing anyway
static bluff
That always reminds me of Earthbound. You increase the RNG by looking around. So, speed runners often just look at a random plant or some patch of dirt over and over again.
- No problem here
slim thorn
walk halfway across the map to a door I didn't check before
behind it is one new tile, and a clear one-way barrier
wind stump
I still don't know what any of the stats mean since the game never tells you and...
The 4 main stats:
STR (strength): increase damages of your weapon and Bullet Souls (no, INT doesn’t increase your Soul’s overall damages)
CON (constitution): increase all defenses (except for spikes, they do more damage the more CON you have)
INT (intelligence): increases damages of your Guardian Souls (not a worth while stats to built in my opinion until you get one of the three rush souls: Manticore, Curly and Devil in which case, do it to the extreme and cheese your way through the entire game)
LCK (luck): Supposedly, it increase chances of getting items… but the settings for Dawn are at 0,01% and in Aria, possibly just broken, so ignore it
Bullet Souls are red and Guardian ones are Blue for context
Enchanted are the yellow/passive ones
slim thorn
oh wow, that's even more unbalanced than most RPGs where I've looked up how the stats work
does that mean ATT and DEF are some kind of effective/total/derived numbers, not separate base stats?
ok, I think those underwater areas I died to earlier are now the only thing left to check...
oh I just randomly got Curly
wind stump
yay
slim thorn
I don't think I'll be using it, but I have it
wind stump
Hey, Ixrec.
Soma's belt looks like a smiley
slim thorn
since the game is mostly unvoiced it really sticks out when they do choose to give someone a voice line
I think Mina's the only one who always plays a voice line every time I see her
fwiw, after a shopping trip this is the build I'm at now (ofc the yellow soul is getting swapped constantly now that I have both water ones)
wind stump
good GOD, finally.
slim thorn
I can't quite tell if I'm underleveled for these underwater areas or they're jus...
the answer was: "rubbish luck at finding the save rooms"
fickle garnet
Mario and Luigi Brothership is very fun
slim thorn
Legion was kind of a slog but that's over with, pretty sure I know where to go next with "recognize where time has been stopped", map says 74.5%
assuming Aria isn't going to pull an upside-down castle and go "actually max % is 200 lmao", this is good progress
gaunt marten
You ever play Timespinner?
slim thorn
yes
gaunt marten
Well it's not as good but it does that
slim thorn
pretty sure I finished it, iirc I did not feel like 100%ing it but did at least reach the end of the main story?
gaunt marten
That's basically the whole thing
slim thorn
oh, I have the 100% map achievement, so I guess I did one kind of 100%
anyway that was a long time ago
gaunt marten
Very excited for Timespinner 2
All Timespinner 1 needed was a lot of polish and more content
slim thorn
that sounds right, I remember liking most of Timespinner but not being impressed by any of it, so it kinda faded out of memory oddly more so than some worse games
dire gate
Oh yeah, if anyone knows classic Japanese game(1997) "moon"; it's spiritual sequel, "Stray Children" just released like yesterday(for Japan rn, they are planning for western release one day)
gaunt marten
I really, really liked the music
slim thorn
I always forget music so that tracks lol
me for using save states then
slim thorn
omg how did I miss that
proud warren
I never did
ah, the roundabout 
gaunt marten
Wait until you learn what Alucard is backwards
slim thorn
I like how the full non-student witch releases a cat with a witch's hat, as if the cat also graduated from witch school at some point
wind stump
yup, lmao
also while i didn't get the Great Armor Soul I got the weapon drop and yeah this is kinda busted 
oh hey, i don't think i knew you could just go back tp the first teleport point after discovering the second one in the chapel
proud warren
**GO ATTACK KITTY**
Go, do a crime
fresh bane
WHY DID I EVEN BUY THIS COLLECTION IF I'M JUST GOING TO FUCKING PIRATE ARIA
Oh yeah these games and the ds games came out in a new collection right?
I'd say I'd check them out but I just know I probably wouldn't finish the games since I don't seem to enjoy Castlevania as much as I thought, but they look great
slim thorn
mostly same
I never bought any of the Castlevania collections since I knew I wouldn't be playing that many of them
even me playing Aria right now is more like... I feel I can't keep saying "metroidvanias are my favorite genre" and then never play a vania, it's literally half the name
I've gotta at least check that I genuinely prefer 'the metroid side', that it's not just a historical accident I got exposed to Metroid first and glommed onto that
fresh bane
I'd have to play a full session of a metroid and a castlevania to really get down to the reason why I just can't seem to get into them despite having tried a lot, it also doesn't help that not that many metroidvanias actually take a lot from castlevania and take more from metroid
slim thorn
so when someone conveniently made a video essay about every Castlevania ever I watched it and settled on 3 titles based on their descriptions that would seem like enough to be confident I'd seen the best it has to offer
wind stump
in very bad Harley Quinn voice
MISTAH JAY
slim thorn
I'd have to play a full session of a metroid and a castlevania to really get dow...
weeeeeeell I actually feel like most borrow from both, and quite a few times I've gone into a modern/indie metroidvania and found myself thinking "oh this is on the castlevania side of things" (most recently, Touhou Luna Nights; it even had a clock tower! )
wind stump
i do wonder how the DS collection holds up given certain... MECHANICS>
slim thorn
oh right, didn't Dawn expect you to draw symbols on the touch screen to finish off bosses?
gaunt marten
the remake fixes that
slim thorn
I'd have to play a full session of a metroid and a castlevania to really get dow...
actually, I have a lot of concrete thoughts on why I "prefer the Metroid side", and what exactly I mean by "most borrow from both"; do you think it'd help if I rambled on about that in more detail?
gaunt marten
I have two hours free
fresh bane
I ramble all the time about survival horror without anyone prompting me to so why not
slim thorn
well in that case
fresh bane
Touhou Luna Nights to be fair is one of those games that is just trying to be Castlevania even the music is similar
slim thorn
yeah, and on the opposite extreme there's Axiom Verge looking almost too Metroid-y
of course most metroidvanias pick a setting that isn't colorful alien planet or gothic horror castle
gaunt marten
Hollow Knight picks both
slim thorn
at least to me, all of the things that separate metroid-likes from castlevania-likes are gameplay mechanics and systems, since aesthetic/storytelling/etc aren't nearly as influential or imitated or in many ways even that different beyond the obviously different setting
the first big gameplay difference I'd point to is that in Metroids, your primary attacks are ranged, and in Castlevanias, your primary attacks are melee
on this specific point, most modern/indie metroidvanias actually favor melee-as-primary / the Castlevania side
looking through my personal "favorite metroidvanias" steam collection... the only exception is Rusted Moss, and even in that game the guns mostly don't shoot as far as Samus' arm cannon
the second big gameplay difference is that Castlevanias have way, way more RPG mechanics: levels, experience points, character stats, equippable gear, buying/selling gear, an inventory of consumable items, all that stuff
wind stump
so that's how they sort the dual screen thing
slim thorn
this is a point where most modern/indie metroidvanias heavily lean toward the Metroid side of just doing far less of all that, especially after Hollow Knight codified the modern "charm system" which imo is an excellent balance of genuine build customization with far, far less of the menuing busy work and obfuscating overcomplexity that RPG-like systems tend to come with
(ftr: charm system copycats include Ori 2's "shards", Nine Sols' "jades", PoP: Lost Crown's "amulets", Ender Lilies' "relics", etc; it really is a standard now)
and this is also one of the biggest parts of "why I prefer the metroid side"
this is also where the overlap with soulslikes comes in, e.g. a lot of modern/indie metroidvanias basically do estus flasks, including most of my favorites, and that's just a great system for all sorts of reasons, but it is fundamentally more like the traditional Metroid experience than it is the traditional Castlevania experience
in fact all the "not estus flask" modern metroidvanias I can think of off the top of my head are either Castlevania-y in other ways, or doing the Hollow Knight approach of healing through magic/energy/soul you build up by hitting enemies (Bo and Rusted Moss)
honestly these days it's probably best to call HK the new 3rd most influential game for the genre, and the term "metroidvania" is now only including 2/3 of the standard influences
wind stump
okay so to explain
The third "screen" is just what you can do to swap between your status and the map
so you can have both the stats AND the map on at the same time
and on the Compendium they actualy show you what the weapon attack animation looks like!
slim thorn
showing a minimap during normal gameplay should be way more standard of an option than it currently is
fresh bane
To be fair it's not just the melee thing because while playing Blasphemous I never thought "this feels like Castlevania" personally, there's something about Castlevania even in the most basic things like how movement and traversal feels in comparison to Metroid that makes me not get into it as much, the rpg elements are certainly part of it, and castlevania games tend to flood you with enemies a lot more in my experience
It's strange because I know that the games seem similar on the surface especially to someone who doesn't know much about genres they may as well look identical, but I legitimately wasn't hooked with Castlevania nearly as much as Metroid or any Metroid inspired metroidvania
And it kinda sucks honestly because the music and aesthetics of those games are incredible
slim thorn
oh yeah it's definitely not just that
so maybe that's a good segue into my spiciest take
the Castlevanias just have worse movement, and games emulating them also tend to have worse movement as a result
this is a bit hard to explain properly because I don't want to say that their movement is bad because it's slower, you can do slower-moving combat well (see many 3D soulslikes)
fresh bane
Those games always have some trick people and speedrunners especially do to go fast in a way that skips or loops animations, but it feels like putting a bandaid on a gaping wound
slim thorn
it's more that you have so few options, so little control, on top of the slowness, that it often leaves you with no choice but to tank damage or stand still waiting for enemies to move around or do some weird AI manip to even the odds
this is things like how you can't swing the weapon up or down, and the swords/lances have these extremely thin hitboxes that frequently misses the enemy you're trying to hit, and how many actions glue your feet on the ground unable to switch to another action until it's too late
which just doesn't happen in Hollow Knight and games with similarly wide and fast swing arcs and interruptible everything
slim thorn
Those games always have some trick people and speedrunners especially do to go f...
exactly! I think the most extreme case was when I got to the doppelganger fight in SotN, and the doppelganger was straight-up faster than me in so many ways that the fight was totally unplayable until I found a way to trick its AI into only doing one specific move over and over; but even that trick wasn't fun so much as it was unblocking
bitter stream
yeah fair enough
wind stump
oh good, OoE has weapon profiecnency 
i didn't miss you from Borderlands...
basically
Use weapon a lot > it get stronger
but then that disincentives expermentation because you know, this new type of weapon is weaker than my go to!
slim thorn
yeah... "leveling up"/experience systems in general have this foundational problem with either inevitable imbalance or incentivizing minmaxing
IME it only works out to be a net positive if either the amount of leveling/upgrading is fairly small, not expected to take up the entirety of your playthrough, or there are more interesting upgrades beyond raw power increases
gaunt marten
I love minmaxing
slim thorn
e.g. the Ratchet & Clank games have per-weapon level ups, but each weapon only has a few levels, so you're at least incentivized to use weapons you haven't max leveled yet when you're fighting weaker enemies, plus those levels often come with secondary effects/complications
or as a far simpler example, Nine Sols has experience points on enemy kills, but only for earning skill points that you then spend in the skill tree; scaling issues simply aren't a concern there
slim thorn
I love minmaxing
I should clarify: when I say "minmaxing" as a categorically bad thing, I'm talking about the kind where the player goes "I shall spend my entire playthrough doing X, and completely ignoring that systems A, B, C exist, because any experimentation would be punished"
if minmaxing refers to solving individual fights or puzzles with a highly situational strategy, like swapping your charms for one boss battle, that's totally fine
wind stump
oh and there's a combo spell/weapon system so like if you equip two swords, you can use a big sword spell
and thank FUCK the Compendium gives you the combos because I don't want to spend half an hour trying "invalid" combinations that burn through my Hearts.
This is Cirlce of the Moon all over again