Effect needs to be put somewhere else, that poor boi
#esports-discussion
torpid charm
balmy wolf
If effect got transferred to Outlaws it would be the best transfer of the league.
balmy wolf
Put Effect on Outlaws lol.
torpid charm
too bad nothing can be done until next season
balmy wolf
Effect + Linkzr would be pretty good imo.
hidden osprey
Trade Jake out for effect and I might actually be happy to support Houston
balmy wolf
Jake has a similar situation to Akm, but with Junkrat instead of Soldier.
vagrant niche
it's suicidal
supple crow
Why is Fuel's management so shit?
balmy wolf
Jake is a junkrat bot.
balmy wolf
He's a good guy and I respect him,
vagrant niche
and I aint fan boi of him
balmy wolf
But he's kinda sub-par at any non-junkrat hero.
hidden osprey
Mhm
balmy wolf
Their supposed Tracer specialist is not very good at Tracer either.
torpid charm
I mean he can play Soldier pretty well but Junk and Soldier are his top tier heroes
vagrant niche
you know who is worse than Jake? Clockwork
balmy wolf
Clockwork hasn't been in stage 3 at all.
hidden osprey
All the control maps they took last week we're when they were running junkrat
torpid charm
omg I forgot Clockwork existed
vagrant niche
Jake has good synergy with the current team
balmy wolf
I remember Clockwork from his TF2 days.
vagrant niche
and works team out
supple crow
Seoul should do everything in their power to get effect
hidden osprey
Let mendo fuck
vagrant niche
even if his other DPS are not that good
balmy wolf
Clockwork in TF2 on Scout was something else.
balmy wolf
But it's just so sad to see him in OWL now.
vagrant niche
but yeah, it would be more beneficial i guess to run Linkizr and Effect on some situations
balmy wolf
Just give Effect to Houston.
Free of charge.
But rosters are locked now so whatever.
torpid charm
Jake to Dallas would be a huge fucking meme come true omg
torpid charm
I know they can't, they never would but if we were in a different world and he did go, it would be hilarious
Twitter
y'all seen this
supple crow
fleta and effect would be a scary duo
vagrant niche
if i would put my Korean team
it would be
Ark, Jjonak, Fissure, Meko, Fleta + Pine /Effect
hidden osprey
wow, Effect saying that is pretty telling
also this idea of Jake being part of a brand isn't that important imo
Fuel picked up Seagull/xQc for their identities
hidden osprey
didn't he technically get released?
warm quartz
And was signed to NYXL, then dropped to join Contenders
Released is a code for “He left”
At this point with Fuel
supple crow
if effect leaves I wonder how Fuel's investors would feel.
torpid charm
I thought Flow3r was just too young to play in the League so he's playing in Contenders until he's of age?
vagrant niche
do you think investors care about OWL as sports?
red anvil
Effect is pissed about losing his dps partner
vagrant niche
they only care if they have a lot of fans
the main case
is Seagull
who brings a lot
supple crow
Yeah but if Effect leaves it's the beginning of hte end
supple crow
seagul already hinted he wants to be traded
supple crow
so I doubt he'll sign back for s2
supple crow
I don't really understand Fuel's management, other teams keep hiring coaches
but Fuel only had one coach
Is money really that tight?
hidden osprey
I like how Fuel released this statement late in the night
fucks over Slasher so that's great
vagrant niche
ye i saw that
they both going at each other
I don't think they are investing too much or the right resources on their players
supple crow
I don't understand Fuel's moves right as they start improving
covert oracle
dull scroll
I think investors care because OWL in its structure, is inherently a new thing in esports
And takes on a western mentality to sports
A la NBA
So to see that replicated in an eports setting, is something that is interesting I’d imagine to an investor and something they obviously want to succeed
balmy wolf
The problem with Fuel is that their roster was hella stacked after winning championship after championship in non OWL seasons/tourneys (i.e. Apex)
So they took it easy
Where every other team practiced hard af with new team comps and hero changes and such
They were so used to the normal team comps including triple tank meta era with Harry's Lucio, Chips' Ana, Taimou's Histcan, Cocco main tank, Mickie's off tank, and Effect's Tracer
Now that other teams rose to the plate with other team comps and skill levels, they're struggling to keep up with actual competition
forest raven
I remember Kyky talked about how, right after he joined EnVy in APEX season 2, he was amazed that the team really didn't strategise
They were like "we'll frag out" and he was like "what"
balmy wolf
they dont need to strategize
theyve been together for so long they knownwhat theyre gonna do
forest raven
They'd been dominating NA and all but the tippy top of EU + a nascent Korea with their mechanical skill
royal acorn
hello
balmy wolf
taimou would try to set up some play with cocco in front of him trying to build space and chips/harry enabling them tovget out there quickly and with full hp
supple crow
which team would seagull even find playtime ?
balmy wolf
effect and mickie would chase off low hp heroes or contest far/high ground enemies
@supple crow none, everyones roster is stacked just fine
Seagull is genuinely a good projectiles player, but everyone has one already.
lilac atlas
Why did they release Rascal?
supple crow
Because Fuel's management is shit
balmy wolf
^
torpid charm
you could tell Rascal wanted out anyways
balmy wolf
Taimou has been main tanking for a month and a half and then the coach put him in on hitscan
like for real?
torpid charm
I'll never understand Dallas, just like the NFL
balmy wolf
He went from shot calling without focusing on his aim to having to listen the calls and aiming
taimou is incredible at hitscan but you can't put him in that rusty
im pretty sure Harryhook could've done a better job
not even knocking taimou, he hadn't been practicing because he was moved to main tanking
supple crow
Mickie is still savlagable, he has good mechanics. A good coach needs to personally coach him how to peel
that's all he needs
toxic yacht
All rogue players grinded for years in EU and then went to stomp NA. Suddenly NA think they created monsters. lol. NA is region of bitches. They will bend to the strongest. Praise the french praise the eu. You trashcans cant even produce god tier players
lilac atlas
Have they announced the new head coach yet?
toxic yacht
meta, yes
lilac atlas
Because i know they have a decent assistant coach
toxic yacht
not sure which one though
forest raven
Fuel's new coach https://cdn.blizzardwatch.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Voljin_darkspear_leader.jpg
tacit swallow
who is shitposting?
forest raven
I'm giving out correct and sought for information
supple crow
I mean Mickie can pop off from time to time, but there's something missing in his playstyle
torpid charm
boi
limber pine
Hi lily
forest raven
Sprite 
toxic yacht
when that shit
was in chat
grand finals
eUnited vs Rogue
this isn't shitposting smh
balmy wolf
Mickie is genuinely one of the best D.Vas around
limber pine
Looks like I slept through some great stuff
balmy wolf
I've played against him before, his peeling is insane
Our dives didnt work because of him
Someone has to be telling him not to peel, it comes to him second nature
torpid charm
I feel like Mickie's performance is slacking off a bit, like he's not horrible but not as good as befor. that's just me though
royal acorn
What are you guys talking about?
royal acorn
lilac atlas
Drama Fuel
torpid charm
Dallas Dumpster Fire
balmy wolf
imo I think the problem is that EnvyUS performed remarkably well without proper "coaching" or "strategizing"
But now, they want to change that to fit in with the OWL crowd
limber pine
If half of what xqc said is true, then yes
hidden osprey
Mickie's Dva isn't OWL tier anymore
balmy wolf
Well he's not the best anymore
hidden osprey
He didn't adapt well enough to the Dva changes which means he's not great
hidden osprey
hence why he looks better on Winston because he understands the limitations of the character he mains
balmy wolf
Like, Seagull on tank? Really? He was picked up for his projectile dps and they put him on tank
torpid charm
he did so much better when him and Seagull switched places but since OGE is in then it's like "okay Mickie, go back to your place now"
supple crow
eh Mickie's aim is still pretty good with D.VA
hje only needs some coachign and he'll be back in OWL level
hidden osprey
@torpid charm absolutely, they could even sub him out on some maps if they wanted to but nah, they'd rather keep him jailed
balmy wolf
The new roster changes I'm sure messed with things
torpid charm
#FreeSeagull
hidden osprey
Hope Effect, Taimou, Seagull all find new, better teams after this season ends
RIP core EnVyUs :(
balmy wolf
AKM on hitscan messed with things as people are used to Taimou's playstyle etc
supple crow
Where can Seagull play ?
hidden osprey
AKM hasn't really played that well
balmy wolf
Unkoe on off support not shotcalling when it used to be Harry's more aggressive style of shotcalling
played well, not aittle bit
balmy wolf
i think he performed fairly well in their match against seoul (i didnt watch the whole game)
hidden osprey
His pharah was nutty in OWWC, and in the OWL it's like, meh
torpid charm
Boston needs a projectile player but it's too late to do anything about that, Mistakes can step up in enough time but they need one more person I feel
limber pine
Aimgod
ruby pendant
???
balmy wolf
Boston could use seagull tbh but the comms are (to my knowledge) mostly in korean
silk linden
Isn't aimgod a support
deft valley
Aimgod is a support
torpid charm
oh shit you right
toxic yacht
neko used to be a projectile dps but okay
balmy wolf
Used to
limber pine
He was listed on the site as a dps
torpid charm
really?
balmy wolf
jjonak should be put in as damage
toxic yacht
lul
deft valley
silk linden
Probably just a listing error because he's taking kazpers spot
balmy wolf
look at how well learning new/old roles worked out for Fuel lmao
warm quartz
No jjonak gets his own role
deft valley
doesn't even have to change heroes for that
torpid charm
yeah I figured they signed Aimgod as support so Neko could flex over
limber pine
Either or
silk linden
Rip Snow
torpid charm
free my boi Snow, deadass
balmy wolf
also real talk, how is Geguri doing?
silk linden
Good
warm quartz
She seems good
toxic yacht
going back to old roles is not something fuel ever did though?
torpid charm
she played pretty well last week
balmy wolf
i didnt watch the Shanghai match, hope shes performing well
warm quartz
Needs a better team and comms
silk linden
Not enough to carry
supple crow
i wonder if it's Tazmo who's acting as coach. I bet he gets to decide who plays and who don't
toxic yacht
they literally put people on completely new roles
silk linden
But individually she's good
toxic yacht
and seagull -> dva worked out very well
torpid charm
you could tell her nerves have gone away, not phenomenal but definitely better
balmy wolf
I have said before that I genuinely see her Zarya on par with Zunba and Spree
Glad she's able to show it off
silk linden
She shotcalls but there's still a language barrier
balmy wolf
her off tank in general is godsent
I've beaten spree before but her bubbles are ridiculously on point
always keeping track of cool downs 
supple crow
if effect leaves, DF is going to be worse than shanghai
fresh turret
Geguri seems good yeah
vestal berry
Geguri and shanghais genji (forgot his name) are really good
forest raven
Ado
wary iris
Dallas and Shock are worse than Florida now 
forest raven
Shanghai and Florida seem a bit chained by their support line
toxic yacht
Freefeed
wary iris
True
vestal berry
FreeKill
toxic yacht
Z E B B 
wary iris
Florida and Shanghai are my favorite teams
deft valley
I'm really sorry
toxic yacht
but yeah FL are amazing at wasting their support ults
vestal berry
shanghai is the 3 legged puppy of the league
toxic yacht
DPS line is honestly perfect rn
balmy wolf
Shanghai was chained by their tanks
vestal berry
Every one loves and pity's them
forest raven
Zuppeh's too busy admiring himself in the mirror to properly train
toxic yacht
cwoosh has improved a ton and awesomeguy is... awesome
forest raven
And frankly I don't blame him
toxic yacht
manne always gud
forest raven
That man is a looker
toxic yacht
zuppeh is fucking hot
toxic yacht
too busy playing osu
toxic yacht
quad tank bad at OWL level 9/10 times
wary iris
Hey
forest raven
wary iris
I wanna see Sym
toxic yacht
lul
torpid charm
Zuppeh is so handsome
balmy wolf
is that the crimson chin
toxic yacht
to see that
NGE winter premiere
tank meta
quad tank was being run
sym was being run
forest raven
Zuppeh is the most 
man in OWL
toxic yacht
etc
deft valley
inb4 they actually pull off a quad tank and NiP the OWL
toxic yacht
team ran quad tank or trip tank 76
fresh turret
Zuppeh hot???
torpid charm
Shanghai needs better supports
fresh turret
Interesting
wary iris
Where would y'all play the teams?
toxic yacht
although, quad tank was kinda bad back then trip tank 76 was the best comp but quad tank worked vs worse teams
wary iris
Looking at Dynasty rn I'd probably out the Glads or Boston above them
torpid charm
I agree
torpid charm
toxic yacht
S E U L
wary iris
For the 12
torpid charm
Fusion forever
wary iris
I'd say
fresh turret
Top 3 Excelsior Houston Boston fite me
wary iris
#1 New York
fresh turret
Also the Houston pick is very questionable IK
toxic yacht
I just wanna watch houston because of arhan
seeing ARHAN LUL
and J LUL K E
at the same time
torpid charm
nah, London dropped. they're not a bad team, much talent but right now they're in a huge slump
toxic yacht
I'm actually going to die
toxic yacht
was one of the best genjis in the game in the early days
very questionable ult usage
he became a meme because of his ults
fresh turret
Oh thats why lul
balmy wolf
Yeah Twitch chat loves to spam ARHAN whenever there's a shit blade.
forest raven
He rekt shop in WC 2016 where all the teams besides SK were memes then failed and failed and failed
balmy wolf
But there's nothing good in Twitch chat anyway.
deft valley
It would've been funnier if they actually knew what a shit blade is
torpid charm
Twitch chat
toxic yacht
he became a meme during APEX S2
deft valley
one kill while forcing transcendence = wew arhan lul
torpid charm
that's funny af
torpid charm
LMAO WHAT
fresh turret
Btw how's Linkzr's tracer? Like I know the win records and stuff but how is the guy individually on Tracer?
toxic yacht
basically, arhan said he was a better genji
than shadowburn
and haksal
then apex S2 happened
wary iris
#1 New York
#2 London
#3 Fusion
#4 Boston
#5 Gladiators
#6 Valiant
#7 Dynasty
#8 Houston
#9 Mayhem
#10 Shock
#11 Shanghai
#12 Dallas
torpid charm
Linkzr's Tracer is solid enough but isn't at great as others in the League
wary iris
That's pretty much where I'd place them
With a few being able to top others every so often
balmy wolf
Just move Effect to Outlaws.
torpid charm
I gotta make my master ranking list soon enough
fresh turret
I think Linkzr's Tracer has incredibly high peaks but isnt consistent
torpid charm
yes
wary iris
Yeah
fresh turret
Yay analyzed smth right
torpid charm
good job
fresh turret
Thanks man
wary iris
I think Shanghai can beat Dallas now that they have 2 DPS
balmy wolf
Fun fact: JJonak is the only Zenyatta in the league to have killed more Tracers than Tracers have killed him.
torpid charm
Jjonak professional Tracer killer
wary iris
He can 1 shot then so
fresh turret
Holy fuck
wary iris
He's like a Healing McCree
balmy wolf
JJonak is the sole reason Zen got the alt fire nerf 😠
fresh turret
Dmg boost discord headshot mmmmhmhmhmhmh
torpid charm
it's the Balenciagas that give him all his power, I'm telling y'all this rn
vagrant niche
Jjonak IMO is the best player of the league
balmy wolf
Tracers complained about getting one shot by Zen with the argument "muh counters tho" so Blizzard hit the nerf button.
torpid charm
who do y'all think should be MVP
fresh turret
Jjonak
wary iris
Logix
forest raven
Jjonak
wary iris
Thank Mr. Logix
balmy wolf
Obviously Twitch chat is gonna sabotage the vote and say xQc.
forest raven
Jjonak came into OWL with zero LAN experience as a pub stomper in Korea and has outclassed literally everyone he's played against for months
vagrant niche
Saya looking so good
torpid charm
I've got that Philly bias then I really really love tanks so it's either Carpe or a half of a really good tank duo
vagrant niche
I need to see him playing with Logix
torpid charm
Saya has been doing well
balmy wolf
xQc isn't stupid.
torpid charm
and xQc is funny ashell, I won't lie
wary iris
Saya Logix will 2 handedly take out all the non good Korean teams
Logix out performed SBB
balmy wolf
If you saw his stream about Fuel yesterday, you'll see that off-stream he's pretty chill and actually has good points.
wary iris
And Sayaplayer is already crazy good
forest raven
Sbb is a better Tracer than Saya
vagrant niche
@wary iris are you a Mcdonals fanboi?
balmy wolf
What is it with Zuppeh always switching to Moira?
vagrant niche
Hi five brotha 
wary iris
I love the underdogs
vagrant niche
Shangai, wait let me go wash my hand
wary iris
There are always hype matches
I feel bad for them and I don't want them to get depressed
torpid charm
forever
silk linden
xQc is an akward manchild who makes up for his lack of social skills by acting like a monkey. He's not a bad dude
wary iris
Logix has been carrying pretty hard and throw in Sayaplayer? Ggs Bois that's a win
forest raven
You think Mayhem can beat NY?
vagrant niche
yes
silk linden
Too bad they haven't been able to experiment with those two yet
forest raven
k
wary iris
I don't like that they're running Tviq on trace I think he's much better on projectile
silk linden
NY aren't unbeatable
wary iris
@forest raven I never said that?
forest raven
Not talking to you
toxic yacht
okay
silk linden
@wary iris logix is having personal issues so they're forced to play tviq
toxic yacht
I'm saying this as the biggest tviq fanboi
wary iris
Yeah I know
toxic yacht
known to man
toxic yacht
and someone who has been supporting the mayhem core
since they became a thing
in 2016
vagrant niche
Pine infected Mr. Logix
wary iris
I wanna see more Genji Pharah and Junk from Tviq
forest raven
Watching Soon at Dreamhack was fucking poggers
wary iris
Eh
toxic yacht
I mean, tviq's tracer is better than linkzr's but logix is straight up better
much better
toxic yacht
but tviq's tracer is p good because he onetricked her for 2 months straight
wary iris
😩
forest raven
As soon as Logix got over his LAN jitters Florida started looking good 
toxic yacht
during summer last year
toxic yacht
mayhem are kinda lucky because they have 3 OWL level tracers, although tviq and saya are more meh when compared to other tracers
vagrant niche
Soe said that whoever does better on scrims gets to play
so Awesomeguy has been beating Cwoosh
toxic yacht
there's no need for him atm
I mean, zappis played like
everything
at some point
but there is nothing he'd add to the starting lineup atm
wary iris
True
toxic yacht
tviq, saya and logix better on all DPS
manne better on all off-tanks except maybe dva
wary iris
If they did triple tank they have Awesome Guy Cwoosh and Manne
Can't wait to see Brigette and 3 tanks
In the next Stage
I never thought I'd see the day where I'd be saying
That Florida has a good shot at the play offs
torpid charm
fuck Brigitte, I'm not excited to see her in pro play
torpid charm
hell no, keep her ass outta comp.
wary iris
I hate Bridgette in FFA but
vagrant niche
PJSalt
wary iris
She's not bad
toxic yacht
I mean
I've watched tournaments with brigitte
with brig trip tank vs brig trip tank
it's like the tank meta but more cancer
torpid charm
sounds bad
toxic yacht
dive still seems to be favoured on lots of maps though
toxic yacht
but yeah, nothing
fucking
dies
they basically run 3-3
zen bc DPS
lucio + brig healing and speed to deathball
rein, zarya dva as the tanks
or variations of that
vagrant niche
why not Roadhog?
wary iris
Roadhog is probably my favorite tank to play
toxic yacht
not sure but mb they want to combo with grav so that they can actually kill things
toxic yacht
comp is beatable on dive favoured maps
atm at least dunno about later
well executed dive still seems to be better
it's just that they're much harder to do well vs such a comp
it's all really wish washy atm, would like to see at least contenders level teams play on the current patch
toxic yacht
I'd say the same thing but people rather ran their own trip tank thing
I'll just wait and see
nova pelican
rip rascal
solar trout
Kyky out: FINALLY
Rascal out: I'm really bummed about this. He must have been real toxic BTS, because he did well on stage
nova pelican
i feel like they didn't help ease him in to the team, and since they were sucg a shit team going in matches with no plans he must've been really pissed
balmy wolf
Which team do you think had the best cohesion?
I.e fun times playing with each other
I say Outlaws but I haven't paid attention to BTS of other teams
vague prawn
anyone can help me to find a discord server for searching teams in Asia/SEA region?
limber pine
Boston
balmy wolf
that's true, pine and sbb have known each other for a while
pearl stratus
@solar trout Rascal out also made Effect basically give an ultimatum of the team fixes shit or he leaves though
So Effect could be out too
nova pelican
when did effect say that
balmy wolf
I don’t think effect said that lol
nova pelican
wow he's pissed
nova pelican
no matter how toxic rascal was it was incredibly stupid of them to drop him in the middle of the season
cunning cove
Hi
balmy wolf
Hello
nova pelican
they literally just hired a new Korean coach who could have worked with rascal to chill him out
balmy wolf
And yeah they should’ve waited for the next signing period
pearl stratus
Also AKM is kind of whatever. I guess we get to see more of his Genji
nova pelican
can't wait to see my boy akm whiff every blade
lilac atlas
NA Blade
nova pelican
but now they have no projectile player other than seagull
lilac atlas
I mean Akm can play pharrah
pearl stratus
Can he though?
I mean sure he can select it.
But every Pharah I've seen him pull out has been bronzr af.
AKM is bronze as fuck on everything but Soldier, tbf.
nova pelican
seems like every player on Dallas fuel wants out right now taimou seagull and effect
solar trout
https://twitter.com/tisrobin311/status/985774353496227840
This adds a ton if insight though. Really makes me feel for Rascal. If Rascal feels the way fissure does that makes this even more tragic. Specially given that they just got a SKorean coach.
I really want to see more teams based in SKorea season 2. I'd also like to see many of the Skorean players move to said teams that can be basied in Seoul and Busan and such. It isn't fair to fill every American team with Koreans just to win games. There is just too much of a language and culture barrier. Granted, SKoreans are supposed to learn English in school, but clearly it isn't a priority.
cunning cove
Hi
solar trout
Its sad seeing a team like London Spitfire be based in America with all Korean players.
torpid charm
it just be like that
pearl stratus
I mean its not really sasd.
If I was investing 20-45 million dollars.
I'd want the best team possible.
Which means not british people right now.
nova pelican
damn fissure a good friend
torpid charm
@pearl stratus that's what a lot of people don't understand but frfr
burnt token
is rascal still likley to be picked up by another team then?
solar trout
not til season 2
pearl stratus
Most he could do now is contenders.
nova pelican
did df not have a Korean translator already
pearl stratus
Different time and place.
Bischu did a lot of on the spot in game translating.
Its easy to translate a meeting after the fac.
*fact.
But you can't have a translator running in real time in scrims/games.
solar trout
Hope the new coach is fluent in English.
pearl stratus
All of it means nothing if the organization doesn't change.
Western teams are lazy.
Thats all we learn from this.
And Dallas chose to protect its laziness.
nova pelican
pretty shitty of df to blame rascal like that not taking time to understand why he acted like he did
pearl stratus
It's really not subjective.
If you're a shit team, literal laughing stock of the league, and you don't adjust your training roster and make fun of the culture that wants to work harder?
That makes you a lazy piece of shit team.
Fissure just acknowledged as a whole LAG came together and 'adopted' the korean training for the most part.
And look at how LAG looks now.
Does every team need to do that? Probably not.
But you're a laughing stock, you do.
limber pine
Dallas's problem is that they tried to mess with things too much
Mickie to offtank, taimou to main tank, seagull to off tank
i understand xQc is what it is and Cucco is whatever, but you gotta just play players where they're best
pearl stratus
You can see, in my opinion, that xQc has a fundamental misunderstanding of the game that comes from him being a Ladder player.
He went on a mini-rant that the ability to click heads is more important than Cohesion.
And from his point of view, being 98% ladder and 2% a team that had no cohesion, I can understand his point of view. But its wrong.
limber pine
he was simply never fully invested in being part of the league
pearl stratus
I mean... I think he could have been but he's not able to solo moderate. And by that I mean he made a good point that I feel like OWL could do well with a person who's job is basically player management.
Who can try to put out some fires ahead of time. Like with the emote shit or different memes. They handle it better now, but it should have existed from day 1
But Hindsight.
torpid charm
I forgot that Cocco still exists tbh
limber pine
i don't think the two are mutually exclusive
even if a Player Personnel Manager existed, I'm not convinced xQc wouldn't be in the same predicament
but yeah, hindsight
nova pelican
if only uprising could take rascal
pearl stratus
Eh I said it before, I think Mistakes is going to be their go to either way..
Boston is built on a very moneyball-esque "We want the most coachable growth oriented players" mantra.
And it works for them.
limber pine
plus Genji is no-go for next stage anyway
even less than this stage
"if" bridgitte gets played of course.
hidden vault
Why is Genji a no-go in the 1st place even before brigitte?
pearl stratus
Eh, from all I've seen of the Brigitte play in some tourneys she's a niche pick and mostly for defense on 2CP.
hidden vault
I seen quite a bit of Genji-Tracer combos tbh
At the start of the league of course
pearl stratus
Ladder she'll be oppressive, but thats about it.
nova pelican
is the cree coming back
pearl stratus
Doubt it. Takes too much to pocket effectively, he'll stay niche.
hidden vault
Cause window-tracer is much more favoured?
limber pine
This stage has been less. with Moira you see more triple tank and with Dive you often see double hitscan
widow/tracer, mccree/tracer, soldier/tracer
pearl stratus
Also the skill cap in the league has increased.
More blades get whiffed than connect now.
hidden vault
Sucks to be Shadowburn
pearl stratus
The last big blades we saw come out of Shanghai, and I think its because no teams expected it from Shanghai.
Shadowburn has been useless since they signed Eqo.
You can't just play two heroes.
hazy arrow
I wonder who will be next DF coach
pearl stratus
Right now the DPS split (minus for LAG is): Tracer play (who usually plays Widow+McCree as well) + The other guy who plays everything.
nova pelican
most likely another western coach
hidden vault
Tracer and Dva is still a must play, I hope that changes
pearl stratus
If you can't play everything your team fails.
hazy arrow
But they said new coach will be announced next week
pearl stratus
Nothing has change to D'va to make her not playable.
hazy arrow
I think
pearl stratus
D'va will literally never be not picked.
Except for the few times you run ball and chain ala Junkertown.
nova pelican
why are they so scared of getting rid of dive, pls just make dva how she was before with a shit matrix
hidden vault
Her matrix isn't shit now
torpid charm
SDB 
hidden vault
Her boosters damage is
pearl stratus
The boosters could heal players she hit.
The fact she has boosters would still make her must pick.
warm quartz
They'd have to nerf her boosters cooldown immensely.
To like 10s if not more if they want her to die
hidden vault
It's her matrix that eats everything
pearl stratus
D'va, balance wise, is not in a bad spot. And theyre not going to dumpster her because a bunch of shitty players can't play around her.
warm quartz
I got one word to counter dva
Sombra
No defense matrix, no way out if she comes in too deep.
pearl stratus
I mean yeah but we're talking pro not ladder.
And Sombra is viable on some maps, not all, for pro players.
warm quartz
Point still stands from a general kit perspective
pearl stratus
Her window of the other teams not adjusting dropped out already.
And her pick rate plummeted.
pearl stratus
I mean focus fire counters her, which we've seen already. She can be demeched insanely fast.
warm quartz
Wasn't her tankiness why she got more health than armor a while ago
pearl stratus
Yeah.
But long story short, Dive isn't going anywhere.
So get used to it and quit bitching.
Just hope, instead, that it becomes something that's a strategy depending on map type.
deft valley
or this place, as demonstrated clearly here
pearl stratus
Because I gaurantee in three months people are going to be complaining about 0:3:3 comps and how boring it is to watch since no one dies.
warm quartz
People bitched about brig hour one of her release
pearl stratus
Welcome to Wood SR.
hazy arrow
Because Brig a shit hero
deft valley
that has nothing to do with sr lmao
hazy arrow
Simple
deft valley
bitching is universal
pearl stratus
Oh I know. But you know what? The kid who keeps trying to play a Genji into a Brigitte deserves to get fucked in the mouth
Because he's a moron.
His complaints aren't valid.
And his parents should have hit him more because he's stupid.
warm quartz
Or the people who complain about brig's stun
hazy arrow
I mean, if I get rekt the whole game by Widow landing headshot after headshot, alright, got rekt by somebody incredibly skilled
pearl stratus
I mean isn't it just you being unskilled if you die to Brigitte over and over again?
I hate to say that Get Good is the mantra here.
But.
Lets be fair.
warm quartz
You're beating your head against the wall
pearl stratus
Brigittes shield being the wall apparently.
Teams that I win overwhelmingly against as Brigitte are the ones that never adjust. They try and keep their shit genji, or bad tracers. Good Tracers stay away from her, which means that her impact is lessened anyway.
warm quartz
Main game that pissed me off involving brig was that anyone i went got countered. The enemy team literally had all of its bases covered.
pearl stratus
Yeah, and you're bitching about her not being in comp and saying she has no skill.
Yet you can't play around her in quick play.
hazy arrow
Opinions based on QP shouldnt be taken seriously
pearl stratus
Whats that say about you my dude?
balmy wolf
Brig isn’t even that difficult to deal with if you just keep her at a distance,
hazy arrow
We know how bad QP is
balmy wolf
It’s just players not knowing how to adjust lol
pearl stratus
I appreciate you have to bring in the QP argument.
But if you can't beat her in QP
You're dumpster.
warm quartz
It's not even brig, but when every base is covered and you're countered by everything no matter what hero you play in your pool, its frustrating
pearl stratus
Shit players will complain about her, that's really the only story.
balmy wolf
^
pearl stratus
Every time something gets changed these shit garbage people who should uninstall the game say its broken.
"NEW SOMBRA IS SO BROKEN"
Lolnope.
warm quartz
New sombra is kind of unfair, but not broken
balmy wolf
The only thing I think should be fixed a bit is her Rally, but even then her Rally isn’t that big of an issue.
pearl stratus
In quick ply.
As your argument would denote.
No quick play argument should be taken seriously.
Right?
Don't contradict yourself.
warm quartz
Imo sombra is unfair because no one can handle her
warm quartz
No one knows how to counter the sombra
balmy wolf
have game sense
warm quartz
So she's feels broken/unfair
balmy wolf
pearl stratus
Also I never said I played her just in Quick Play 😛 So don't bring up the scrim argument.
Going to shut that down now before you finish typing.
warm quartz
Gamesense, focus fire me, find my translocator anywhere it is and camp it
hazy arrow
Not my problem you are an idiot always doing some mental gymnastics over what i say and alwys interpreting it the way you want
warm quartz
Ect
stoic anchor
Can we keep it civil in here please
warm quartz
RIGHT AS I WAS ABOUT TO AT THE MODS
stoic anchor
I understand you have differences of opinion but let's keep it chill
pearl stratus
I was very civil. I didn't even bust out the time and crayons meme!
hazy arrow
Anyway
stoic anchor
back to the topic at hand
hazy arrow
As of now, we know that OW team is surely unhappy about Doomfist and Sombra
pearl stratus
No he means Blizzard wants to buff him more.
warm quartz
The teams that whine dont know focus fire
pearl stratus
And potentially nerf sombra more.
warm quartz
Lol cause niche
pearl stratus
Jeff said recently he wasn't happy where Sombra was at the moment, same with Fist.
stoic anchor
Fist still needs tweaking
pearl stratus
Recently being within 48 hours.
stoic anchor
But what else is new
warm quartz
Sombra if anything needs the translocator reverted, and make the hack less like oppressing.
pearl stratus
I think loosening hack on a few characters and buffing it on others.
warm quartz
50% heals on lucio for example, instead of NOPE PSYCH BITCH.
warm quartz
Or if you get hacked as pharah, it takes away half your current fuel
So if you're out of fuel, you drop, otherwise you have a second to get in a better drop position
pearl stratus
I think Pharah dropping is fine, imo. Because if you're low enough to get hacked by non-EMP you did something wrong.
warm quartz
The sombra often translocates up and hacks her
stoic anchor
Bold
pearl stratus
Eh just make it so hack can't be done vertical movement, imo.
warm quartz
Just make it less oppressing against passives.
pearl stratus
Mostly just make her not turn Lucio into the special bus.
warm quartz
Make everything cut by 50% or something on passives
stoic anchor
I didn't watch any of OWL so I don't know if there were any good Sombra plays
warm quartz
Changed nothing in my playstyle, and 100 hours on her in total
pearl stratus
There were some at the start of Stage 3 before people adjusted to her.
She's dropped off now.
stoic anchor
Makes sense, she's very blitzkrieg
warm quartz
Sombra's stupid good on ladder because adaptation doesnt happen
pearl stratus
She's only as oppressive as the other team is uncoordinated basically.
So it makes her an easy ladder climb.
Especially from lower sr.
It's like Junkrat tires in OWL.
warm quartz
Mhm
pearl stratus
The chance of getting a 2K+ with Tire in OWL is so low now.
warm quartz
"Oh hello my name is sombrero here have my hack in your butt."
I have her golden gun on my main for memes
fresh turret
it feels so bad to be a Lucio main and have Sombra be meta
stoic anchor
I saw a few pieces and the coordination is beautiful
Like sparrows in flight
Oof Lucio mains
warm quartz
Thats why i say small nerfs to her vs passives would be fair
I still want my fucking translocator revert
fresh turret
why
warm quartz
So it feels like the translocator actually takes skill and you have to think about it
Instead of chucking and running
fresh turret
that encourages more of a passsive style imo
stoic anchor
At least she's not having much impact on the esport
Which this convo has deviated from drastically 
warm quartz
Eh it would help tone her down in both
pearl stratus
I mean I think we're still tying it back to it, in little ways.
stoic anchor
I'll trust your judgement on that one 👀
warm quartz
Whether it be in OWL, Contenders, or other tournaments played
pearl stratus
One map in all 3 games on Saturday?
Even Danteh didn't really run her.
And he's arguably the best Sombra in the league.
stoic anchor
Quickly Youtubes Danteh 👀
pearl stratus
Western kid out of Chicago, plays on the Shock. Came in as the perceived "Bench warmer" for Sinatraa.
And really stepped his game up.
Plays Tracer, Sombra, Genji, Junkrat mostly.
He's also one of the few DPS who played Sombra pre-buff, as mostly it was relegated to support players.
stoic anchor
Insane accuracy
pearl stratus
Which is why post-buff he's a scary Sombra.
warm quartz
It's fun to be a wildcard for a local tournament team. "If >redacted< is called in, we're all fucked. It means they noticed something exploitable by their sombra play or something. It could be the enemy team being too passive or aggressive, it depends." Was stated by one of the players who keeps going against us in scrims lol
Its why i say sombra could still use nerfs
And yea i love danteh's play
He's fun to watch tbh
warm quartz
Its the supports and tanks rn
pearl stratus
Yep, if they're cohesive you'll do well and enable even mediocre (OWL level) dps to do amazing things
warm quartz
Its why when i played mercy, i duo'd with a zen/lucio main
We worked together absurdly well and could enable a team to wreck ass
I find it ironic that owl is the opposite of ladder
"Fuck the dps."-OWL "DPS IS THE ONLY WAY TO CLIMB REEE."-Ladder
"I dont wanna play support, ive done my time, you learn how to play support." Or "I'm the only person who can carry. Shut up and let me genji whore."
pearl stratus
Cohesion versus non-cohesion, in my opinion.
I think we'd see a change in ladder mentality if they split the queues.
Between a pure solo queue, and a group queue.
warm quartz
Solo, duo, trio, and full team
Four and five i think shouldn't be there due to the solo thrower that can happen, plus the dps duo butting heads with the four man trying to play like NYXL
Cool stop shitposting
Ty
balmy wolf
yeah uninstall
warm quartz
Cool, go to the mods
tacit swallow
@tawdry bane cease
vivid solar
@tawdry bane Stop trying to start something. Final warning
slim summit
Effect threatening to leave too
warm quartz
Lol dallas is a shitshow
slim summit
Wouldn't be surprised if Fuel cleaned house after season 1
I kinda like the Effect -> Outlaws idea that's floating around
balmy wolf
I mean I think fuel is still achieving their monetary goals right now
people are buying their jerseys, their skins, cheering for them on twitch
#1 team in popularity
they're no doubt making money
fixing the team is an issue, but I don't think fuel will drop for s2
esp. since their team wasn't created on their own money
slim summit
All of those purchases are pooled, they see only 1/24th of the total cost of merch, skins, and IDK about Twitch bits, probably even less
(that is to say, every team gets the same for any jersey purchase, they don't get more for their own)
balmy wolf
From sponsorships & other deals they're probably making more than the other teams though
since they're the most popular team
slim summit
that is probably true
balmy wolf
I don't think they can afford to drop anyways
dallas isn't owned by some billionaire or anything
it's owned by envyus' owner who had to take numerous investments to pay for the team
investors definitely getting mad
slim summit
IDK enough about esports or Overwatch in general to know ... like, how much movement there will be between seasons when compared to during the trade window this season
and I don't know how many top tier players there are between Contenders and just "free agents"
but I could see Fuel getting rid of Taimou and Cocco, and maybe even Mickie and Seagull
at which point the question becomes, how hard is it to get 4 top tier players
cerulean plume
another question is after all this bs (if new orgs do arise) why would you join dallas if you could join another team 🤔
slim summit
if they pick up players from other teams, I don't think the players have too much of a choice in the matter
from what I understand, Unkoe, Gesture, and Rascal were all forcibly traded
and Gesture and Rascal didn't even know about the trade until they were told to pack their bags
warm quartz
Shanghai arguably is one of more popular teams
cerulean plume
if thats the case thats horrible, i was referring to new pick ups like contenders etc
warm quartz
You saw the arena the other night
They won one map and the entire arena was screaming
Not to mention, half of the audience at home.
slim summit
they're definitely the underdogs
but I think twitch bits are a good representation of popularity
or maybe not --- Shanghai doesn't exactly have rivals
they could be everyone's second or third favorite team
so in a ranked choice system they would come out being way more popular than they would based on just picking 1
cerulean plume
more than likely for the memes that will follow
warm quartz
Its why i became a shanghai fan
The players are actually adorable, like geguri, and they're not bad...jus language barriers
Like geguri's cursing fit during scrims
(Accidental but still funny)
slim summit
I think they'll improve pretty quickly
warm quartz
Agreed
slim summit
Shanghai still plays: Seoul, Florida, Boston, Fusion, NYXL, London Spitfire
scarlet spear
F
hazy arrow
Regarding Sombras ult, the worst combination is with Zarya's ult. Sombra - Pharrah/Reaper/Tracer - Zarya - DVa/Rein - Moira - Ana feels like the worst combination
Basically the only way to kind of protect yourself is to have Sombra as well
Once Sombra/Zarya uses her ult, you use yours to shut down any other enemy and while charging, you will have to keep hacking Sombra/Zarya
feral wing
fervent star
I want six party
fresh turret
lfg boy
balmy wolf
Do you guys think koreans need a slight buff to regain their dominance? The nerf seems to be hurting them a lot
toxic yacht
okay here is my ranking for the best tracers in OWL, but only one tracer per team
from #1 to #12
#1 Jake
#2 Hooreg
#3 aKm
#4 Zebbosai
#5 Hafficool
#6 Unkoe
#7 DreamKazper
#8 Jake
#9 Clockwork
#10 Diya
#11 ArHaN
#12 Saebyeolbe
mega lmao
torpid charm
what
wet oyster
scarlet spear
you mistyped TeenGrazper
hidden vault
Why is jake on #1 and #8?
tawdry dew
jake is a meme
hidden vault
This whole thing is a meme
tawdry dew
hold thing?
toxic yacht
Hafficool is some mid-tier player
I made jake #1 and #8 because his impact can be felt a lot when playing a game
his tracer game is so next level that it boosts the effectiveness of the enemy tracer because he's effectively playing the game on his team and the enemy's
tawdry dew
you made 1 and 8 not 1 and 2
tawdry dew
carpe is a fucking madman
hidden vault
It really does feel you are making a joke on tracers
scarlet spear
hidden vault
One tracer per team but jake takes 2 slots along with 2 slots for clockwork and Arhan
And the only Korean tracer present is SBB
scarlet spear
his tracer game is so next level that it boosts the effectiveness of the enemy tracer because he's effectively playing the game on his team and the enemy's(edited)```how do you even try to argue
its fuckin obvious hes joking
hidden vault
Yes I said the whole thing was a meme🤷
toxic yacht
korean tracers are overrated tbh australia has the best tracers
but they aren't in OWL
hazy arrow
r/COW just became more toxic than Competitive mode
what an achievment
I guess time to avoid it for a while
toxic yacht
sub has been bad for like
a year now
tbh
I don't even know why I still go there
I like, open a thread, see misinformation get upvoted, get angry and close it again
hazy arrow
Because r/OW barely talks about OWL
twin dove
summer tangle
SBB is the best tracer in the game
fresh turret
memes my guy
hidden osprey
r/COW has always been toxic
silk linden
r/cow toxic af
jagged crater
fall of envy / dallas fuel is one of the saddest things ive seen in esports
this is upsetting af
silk linden
inb4 they go on a win streak
jagged crater
that'd be neat
hidden osprey
they're hosting an AMA tomorrow?
hidden osprey
can't wait to see the high number of non-answers tomorrow
apparently the Kyky transparency thing was done by Kyky but still unreleased
hmm...
raw zealot
@hidden osprey Can you gimme the rundown on what happened?
hidden osprey
Fuel released Kyky and Rascal, Kyky seemingly was "held" down from giving information to people, and it seemed like Rascal wasn't so much having issues with the team, but a lack of communication and also refusing to listen to players
raw zealot
:/
hidden osprey
hence the whole "korean" culture thing that Effect and Rascal wanted but it didn't happen
raw zealot
This is getting out of hand.
Just overall, all the releases. They're going to hurt and screw the league and damage E-Sports potential as a whole.
hidden osprey
yeah, Rascal has been thrown under the bus quite badly as he can't sign onto another team until the next season starts
raw zealot
That sucks
hidden osprey
Rascal himself was picked up without even a tryout, so that makes it even more frustrating for him
why pay for a player when you don't even know if he's going to remotely fit in with the team?
raw zealot
-sigh-
limber pine
for the same reason you move your main tank to offtank, dps to offtank, dps to maintank, and your best soldier to genji