hence why they killed the scientists
#lore-discussion
primal escarp
but winston had no real issue with them, in fact from what I have picked up, he saw Dr. Winston as sort of a paternal figure, or a mentor type of deal
then again, if someone is giving me butter for being a good boy, i would die for that man
celest zenith
raw butter or peanut butter?
primal escarp
peanut butter
peak escarp
IF they were going to give us another specimen, I'd like to see either Simon or Hypatia
valid terrace
I think Simon is the main candidate if we do get another
peak escarp
they were the two main troublemakers
preferably Hypatia so not all of our animal heroes are male
valid terrace
Fair
peak escarp
peak escarp
probably something related to his enhancements
primal escarp
something that helps his brain is what i assumed
like some sort of chip
i mean every important hero/villain to the lore so far has became a playable character, if they were to add another specimen from the lunar colony, they can't really make them a new character as they already have winston
peak escarp
what do you mean?
primal escarp
and there really isnt any evidence that they left the space station after they killed the scientists
peak escarp
they're still on the moon, as far as we know
primal escarp
i mean that if they add another primate from the lunar colony, they will have to give them abilities that make them unique and distinct from winston, otherwise it would sorta be a copy of winston
peak escarp
of course
primal escarp
but then what role would make sense other than tank?
peak escarp
it depends on the character
peak escarp
right now the only things we know about Simon and Hypatia is that they're gorillas and that they had the same genetic enhancements as Winston, but didn't get as smart as him
primal escarp
like they all have one thing they are known by
peak escarp
it's impossible to predict without knowing more about the character
undone storm
what are the places you would like to see as a map in overwatch, and what would they look like ? what would be the hotspots ?
we were talking about seattle, earlier, for example
boreal egret
Los Angeles
peak escarp
Utopaea and Rio were the top of my list, and it seems like we're getting those in OW2
boreal egret
I would imagine la kinda being like kings row
undone storm
we already have Los Angeles
boreal egret
What, am I being dumb?
peak escarp
Hollywood
boreal egret
Oof
peak escarp
something in South Africa would be neat
undone storm
yeah
what are the things we first think when we're thinking of "south africa" ?
what is South Africa known for ?
that's the questions that must be asked when designing a OW map
peak escarp
I don't think SA has been referenced in Overwatch yet
undone storm
yes, but it surely exists
peak escarp
yeah
limpid agate
South Africa has been mentioned exactly once in a throaway line in Hero of Numbani
At least once that I can remember, maybe twice
But I remember when Efi was trying to find a voice for Orisa, 3 joke voices were played
peak escarp
oh yeah
limpid agate
- Cheery Brit
- Cowboy
- South African Surfer
So speculation ho about there being a South African surfer from Overwatch
But that feels borderline crack to me
peak escarp
if it wasn't buried in the middle of a $10 book about an unpopular hero, I'd expect all sorts of crack theories to pop up
boreal egret
I was thinking... a map in.... Hawaii
undone storm
yeah, good idea !
boreal egret
took me long enough lmao
undone storm
besides, isnt hawaii the place where ana like to take vacations ?
undone storm
south africa is also known for its rugby team
lime flax
Cape Town was mentioned briefly in the Retribution comic
Gerard apparently saved Reyes there on a mission
peak escarp
oh yeah
undone storm
I see
so Gerard wasnt just a man planning missions
he also was on the field
he got the face of a secret agent
lime flax
I can maybe see him as part of Mauga's kit or a talent in PVE
limpid agate
Mauga is confirmed to be someone they are revisiting
peak escarp
Nguyen . . . probably not
limpid agate
They also have big plans for the Queen
limpid agate
There are 3 main groups who want the queen
The people who want her because she is a former gladitorial mech champion, and a new abstract mech would be cool (like Recluse) (Or they just want more tanks)
The people who want her because she looks like she has some kind of axe in her poster and forget that Overwatch is an FPS (Want a melee hero)
The people who want her for two big reasons.
peak escarp
I don't care either way if she becomes playable, I just want to know more about her
particularly her history with Roadhog
there have been a few hints about their history
undone storm
is roadhog from new zealand ?
boreal egret
i think he is australian
lime flax
I believe it's implied he has kiwi origins
peak escarp
it's implied that he has NZ/Maori heritage
boreal egret
i should stop trying to answer these questions
lime flax
well you got it right so no worries
i do wonder what his life was like pre-crisis
like what made him a moral-nihilist?
I get the whole "my entire home was destroyed" would play a part, but i bet theres more to it than that
peak escarp
maybe he became disillusioned because of how the government was willing to give up land to the side that lost the war
undone storm
perhaps I'm wrong, but havent he lost his daughter because of the omnics ?
peak escarp
his family was never mentioned
that's just a theory people have because Hog likes cute things
but can't a guy like cute things for himself?
undone storm
oh, I see
well, most people like cute things, its stupid to think that its only for girls
lime flax
youd be surprised by some people
peak escarp
it would be nice to learn more about Mako's life before the crisis
and before the ALF
undone storm
I'd love to have a skin of him as a farmer
peak escarp
I don't mind
undone storm
they dont need to to make a farmer skin
undone storm
perhaps he could wear a mask to protect himself from pesticides
considering his arms are completely white (like a corpse), he probably look like a dead guy
perhaps something like voldemort
but with a nose
solar tiger
he must still look recognizable tho
undone storm
probably
peak escarp
yeah
undone storm
but I dont think we will ever see his face now
peak escarp
most fan interpretations lean too heavily into supernatural ideas
I haven't seen any that look believable
undone storm
well, supernatural things, outside of a few stuffs, are "scientific" in overwatch
peak escarp
but I mean like, multiple eyes and in-human features
undone storm
hmm
I dont think he got a portal leading to an eldritch dimension that replaced his face
peak escarp
exactly
undone storm
any theories on what is the treasure of junkrat ? I think is something similar to what the black omnic gave to katya volkskaya
and that it is related to the omniums
after all, a lot of power is probably required for her factory
lime flax
Maybe something relating to Omnic production, either a way to increase it or halt it all together
undone storm
junkrat doesnt care about knowledge
he cares about money
and its probably something that is worth a lot of it
peak escarp
He came to notoriety when he discovered an extremely valuable secret in the bones of the omnium. Though few knew the nature of what he found, he was nonetheless pursued by bounty hunters, gangs, and opportunists wherever he went, until he made a deal with the Junker enforcer Roadhog, who grudgingly agreed to be his personal bodyguard in exchange for a fifty-fifty share of the spoils.
valid terrace
He hasn’t tried selling it yet
peak escarp
it never says that it's treasure or anything physical
it just says "an extremely valuable secret"
valid terrace
Even when he needed a massive quantity of loot he never pawned it
peak escarp
people just assume it's a treasure
undone storm
my guess is that it is something that was in the australian omnium
solar tiger
sounds more like its information to me
peak escarp
information can be worth a lot of money to the right people
it could be what caused the omniums to wake up and wage war on humanity
solar tiger
yeah
lime flax
For a game about Human/Omnic relations, we sure don't know a lot about Omnics huh
Hope OW2 changes that
subtle geyser
also is there anything new about decoding the omnic language?
peak escarp
it's impossible
subtle geyser
i think i remember reading a reddit post like 3-4 years ago
but he didnt get very far
limpid agate
You need cybernetic enhancements to understand it
subtle geyser
just that theres lots of omnic language around the maps
limpid agate
Like Sojourn
subtle geyser
oh, how do we know that?
limpid agate
Hero of Numbani
peak escarp
Efi laughed again, certain that this was the hilarious part of the story. A non-augmented human reading something as complex as Omnicode? Efi had studied the omnic’s written language for nearly three years, and she couldn’t understand more than the occasional word here and there. If she couldn’t read Omnicode, the chances Isaac could were slim-to-none. Efi’s laughter morphed into a forced cough, but Naade gave her another blank stare.
undone storm
would a map at sydney works ?
I think we will get one, some day
after all, two of the three lucioball maps became/will become a location for a normal map
lime flax
Possibly
It's been in the lore with Junkrat + Roadhogs comic
and I believe there are paintings of it on Hollywood
limpid agate
As of Blizzcon 2019, its the only Lucioball map with no current core counterpart
But it released alongside Junkertown so
lime flax
I def think its on their radar
limpid agate
I think they meant it as a companion to Junkertown
peak escarp
we're expecting 10-15 new maps with OW2, so they need to come up with a lot of ideas
limpid agate
One big request and possibility is an underwater map
They had the Galapagos concept from way back when
lime flax
God yes I want one so bad
limpid agate
And recently, there was the screenshot with Hammond underwater
lime flax
I can see it being an Ecopoint
valid terrace
Gwishin base would be the biggest candidate imo
limpid agate
Which admitedly used a lot of reused assets
peak escarp
they could make part of it in an undersea base/dome and have a low-gravity area where you go into the water (like with Horizon)
lime flax
If they ever give us a map creator I'm making it asap
primal escarp
so the omnic factories are self aware right?
does that mean they can create new factories?
peak escarp
seems like it
primal escarp
hmm, interesting
peak escarp
Null Sector had factories on their ships
primal escarp
and are they able to transfer "conscience" between factories?
like, one is getting damaged a lot, so they transfer over to a newer factory or something like that?
or is that not possible?
peak escarp
we don't know if the omniums have a consciousness
primal escarp
yeah but they are self aware though arent they?
peak escarp
omniums are automated and self-improving
primal escarp
but self improving would eventually lead to them becoming self aware
like some sort of age of ultron type of deal
peak escarp
not a lot is known about omniums
primal escarp
and one final question, are the omnics independent?
as in, the omnium can not take control of the omnics
peak escarp
they aren't a hive mind - they do have individual thought
primal escarp
ah, gotcha
peak escarp
but certain AI "god programs" can hijack their programs and control them
we only have one known "god program", Anubis
and it's currently quarantined in a tomb in Cairo
primal escarp
so the omnium can't make omnics and then once they have assimilated, they can't just take over the omnics and rule the world from the shadows?
peak escarp
we don't know
gusty sluice
So omnics do function at least like us in their programming?
peak escarp
omnics simulate humans, generally
undone storm
I really wonder
what do omnics need to live ? can they update new skills, new langages, to their brain ?
why do they even "die" (if you can call that dying) ? did omnica corporation made a mistake (spoiler, yes, they did) ?
peak escarp
in the novel Orisa downloads new protocols to deal with new situations
I assume omnics can just download protocols from the internet when they need them
peak escarp
omnics can die if their "brain"/CPU is destroyed
undone storm
and that will be with mankind until the end of time
peak escarp
but if it's not destroyed, it can be moved to a new body
undone storm
I wonder if, in the overwatch sequels, we will get, like, a game set 200 years after the current events
peak escarp
probably not
undone storm
I hope we wont, yeah
peak escarp
they're focused more on heroes than on the world
undone storm
much to my displease, I find the world of overwatch more intersting than the heroes
how they have this optimistic view of the world, which is a perfect match between the past, present and future
peak escarp
I think the optimistic view is refreshing
undone storm
speaking of which, I really wonder
in our world, a man on mars and a permanent moonbase will probably be these next 20 years
so I wonder : could we get something about mars in the overwatch world ?
peak escarp
too many things lately have been grimdark/pessimistic
undone storm
yes
look at r/futurology if you feel depressed
or at r/upliftingnews
but anyway
we got the moon, but what about Mars ?
undone storm
yeah
hmm, speaking of space :
https://i.imgur.com/dBc6Uch.jpg
quite interesting !
peak escarp
it's probably exaggerated so it can be seen from Earth
umbral temple
speaking of optimism
it’s a big assumption that we’ll have that kind of tech by 2070
peak escarp
if Horizon was to scale on the moon, it wouldn't be visible
@umbral temple not that big
a lot of the tech in Overwatch is in its infancy now
peak escarp
AI, robotics, nanobiotics, sonic weapons, cybernetic prosthetics
genetic manipulation
umbral temple
that’s great and awful
peak escarp
it may not get to that level in 50 years, but remember, Overwatch is an optimistic future
also there's a bit of sci-fi thrown in
umbral temple
the ability to fight wars with no casualties on your side
a visor that almost guarantees a kill with every shot
peak escarp
hard-light is a common sci-fi trope
umbral temple
it wouldn’t be good
undone storm
because if robots are fighting instead of humans, there wont be casualties
but enough talking about the real world, its just...grim
umbral temple
I know the omnic crisis had casualties but I meant like
if you have technology that advanced why bother to send anything sentient in
peak escarp
because technology is flawed and human judgement is impossible to replicate
umbral temple
okay okay
in that case, good
undone storm
perhaps we should get back to talking about why pachimaris are cute before we start to have an existential crisis about our grim future ;-;
umbral temple
yeah so how about pachimaris
undone storm
umbral temple
: O
undone storm
I wonder whats the brand behind those cuties
anyway, it was a nice chat, but its 0:40 am here
so, later
umbral temple
I guess it’s back to arguing about robotic terrorist wars! : )
gusty sluice
Thats interesting, omnics cannot age. So basically they are immortal
Except if they get hacked, idk
peak escarp
unless they have planned obsolescence built in
they could be designed to slow down or start to fail after a certain age
or after a number of active hours/days
gusty sluice
Based of that, they can age more like computers instead biologically.
peak escarp
yeah
pliant sparrow
They still erode and rust like all metal
How would repairing an omnic work I wonder
Can they feel pain?
gusty sluice
About in Retribution, I was wondering if Enforcers were really genetically modified or just really high skilled troopers with shotguns.
frosty shell
I have a theory that the rings on the Moon are particle accelerators
peak escarp
compact eagle
Ah thanks
Wait so is this theory just based off of that picture
Like what other evidence is there
peak escarp
I think that's the only thing
compact eagle
Ok I don’t think those are accelerators
Like why would there be lights that bright on an accelerator and why are there other lines that aren’t circles
Maybe it’s a bigger colony
peak escarp
I think the colony just isn't shown to scale
compact eagle
Probably
frosty shell
The lines might just be artistic
I agree they probably just didn't think through how big the colont was
zenith prawn
@frosty shell Ah yes, the Superdupermegaultrauberconducting Superdupermegaultraubercollider
😉
limpid agate
!!shitposting
twilit nacelleBOT
Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
limpid agate
@zenith prawn
subtle geyser
@peak escarp 10-15 maps with ow 2?! i thought we'd get like 5-8 maybe, why that many?
also id imagine (probably not possible in this universe, but who knows) that in this kind of civilisation the omnics could do backups of themselves periodically to a cloud kind of service and whenever something happens to them they could just be rebuilt
peak escarp
Jeff said multiple maps per mode
multiple = >2
and there's 5 modes including Push
so minimum, 10 maps
the issue with uploading themselves to a cloud or whatever are the Shambali
they believe omnics have souls
if they believe omnics have souls, then they probably believe an omnic can't be replicated/reproduced/stored somewhere
or maybe omnic AI is just too complicated for that
subtle geyser
does his statement include arcade gamemodes too?
like deathmatch, elimination, ctf, lucioball
peak escarp
not sure
if it does, that increases the number by a lot
it's probably just the core modes, maybe some new deathmatch maps
subtle geyser
yeah im sure there's an excuse for why the backup thing can't happen
since well, mondatta could've just been rebooted into a new omnics body
peak escarp
that would kinda defeat the purpose of killing him
subtle geyser
yeah exactly
gusty sluice
Mondatta can be repaired easily if he was shot on the neck
steel peak
I would imagine the reason Omnics can’t be backed up and rebooted is because they are an extremely advanced AI, to the point where they learn and grow as humans do, and the only thing you could really back up would be the core data, but none of the experience or adapted code the AI has because that would be, as I would imagine all the data omnics learn, would be maybe 1-2 petabytes per omnic
That’s a completely made up number I have no idea actually about how much data an omnics complete memory would be
But backing up the core program for the Omnic AI would be like, storing a human’s DNA but not their minds, memory, or personality, which means you could make a physically identical person/omnic, but with a completely different mindset and personality
Or another aspect could be that in order to be accepted by humans, something like backing up Omnics is outlawed in order to make omnic life more treasurable
steel peak
Ty
onyx zodiac
Have u seen the leak
steel peak
Nope
steel peak
Did they leak a character, or are you talking about the new zarya skin?
steel peak
Probably, I doubt they would let anything get out anytime soon, unless it’s the OW2 release date
It’s an OWL MVP skin
onyx zodiac
Yea must be a glitch.
undone storm
what do you think we will see as new troops for talon ?
in other videogames, what are the usual things when it comes to autoritarian military sci-fi troops ?
I think we could get things like wardogs
grand wedge
I saw a new alien character three times
@onyx zodiac It'sd Sinatraa MVP Skin. It's Alien Zarya, not a new character
BAck to the maps in OW2 , on the press website, you can see Rio in the PVE setting AND PVP Rio (that look a lot like a KOTH map).
Jeff also basically implied that Anubis will be on PVE, with an extention inside the the temple (he teases on an interview about we don't know what's behind the doors in the defender spawn)
I expect a lot of map for the story mode. The maps are the ones that are more important for expending a story. Characters too, but the story will be way to short if we don't have a lot of maps to play, or if they don't adapt adctual PVP maps for PVE.
undone storm
oh, they will, the same way they adapted the Kings row, Rialto and Havana maps for the sake of the pve (but hopefully more than what they did for the Havana map).
undone storm
ye
I really wonder if the symmetrical maps will have pve missions other than hero missions
undone storm
everytime I see these massive spaceships, all of those machineries, I always wonder : where do they find all the ressources to do that ?
that's why I sometimes wonder : could there be an omnium hidden in space ? after all, there are a lot of ressources in the asteroid belts of our solar system
besides, during the kings row uprising, all of the omnic seemed to have been launched from veeery high, it reminded me of an orbital launch
pliant sparrow
Wdym the symmetrical maps?
Also null sector seems to have support from talon, and talons resources are extreme
undone storm
I wonder what is the goal of talon
surely it cant be the destruction of mankind
grand wedge
Doomfist want the mankind to rise, and think the best way to rise humanity is through conflict and war.
Also, for an economic point of view, they probably have some financial interest too (weapons, mechs, mercenaries...)
undone storm
hmm...
It can only end in two ways
talon will betray the null sector after it has fullfilled its purpose
or the null sector will become too poweful and will betray talon
well, there is also, of course, another way : they are both put down by overwatch and its allies all around the globe
grand wedge
Null Sector "betraying" Talon is probably something that will happen at some point.
undone storm
I hope we will know more about the operation "white dome"
wise mural
talon thinks they are making the world better and stronger thou conflict, and killing corruption
undone storm
but in the end, they are making even more corruption
reminds me of something
eh, they're radical terrorists, we cant expect them to be logical
valid terrace
In regards to the control maps, they technically are all connected
Usually vertically from eachother
The most obvious example are in Nepal climbing the mountain from village to shrine to sanctum, or Lijiang climbing the tower from night market to shrine to control center
You can see the airships very clearly for Lijiang if you look on either side of the shrine map
Since the drop ships are part of the map
Nepal is a bit harder but I’m sure some of the other maps are just as possible
grand wedge
Yes they are one map, with different sides / parts for the rounds
If they want, they can expand and modifie them for PVE
valid terrace
It could just be objectives taking you higher up the map or to the different locations
Similarly to the Uprising mission
carmine wraith
is blackwatch like a special force for overwatch or they made a special team to be cool?
and why doesnt genji still where that sick skin
frosty shell
Blackwatch was the Overwatch black ops program
And Genji got a better body, and even then he wasn't happy with it until he met Zenyatta
undone storm
This first body was a prototype
peak escarp
ask in #general-discussion
iron plume
or #overwatch
violet burrow
i asked dude no one answered
gusty sluice
@violet burrow eh, this server can be overstacked with a bunch of replies that it is difficult for your questions to answer. I think this is not the right place to ask in-game questions. Hopefully someone can reply yours.
violet burrow
dude i asked also in overwatch disxscussion and no one helped me
iron plume
You won't get an answer here either, because it's not a related channel
worthy rose
I think rein and ana
Where together
Ro support this (ana) " Reinhard your looking as lovely as ever"
iron plume
Moreover: Ana isn't the one who says "as lovely as ever", rein does
Ana just says he's looking well, Rein is the only one who's even mildly suggestive
and Rein is a charmer in general
undone storm
yes
but its ok, we all make mistakes
I wonder if there is a really cyberpunk city in the overwatch world, something that would look a bit like "night city" ?
I imagine it could be Detroit, for example
radiant valley
Minneapolis lmao
undone storm
uh ?
sorry, i'm not american, so I dont understand the joke
oh...
....right
nah, detroit would be an interesting location for a cyberpunk place, I think
but again, i'm thinking on the american side, so idk if there would be other places in the world that would work
tiny briar
hold up
sigma's voice line when facing zarya is
The Tobelstein's work remains flawed. Tragic
hmmm
peak escarp
Simga is familiar with the research behind Zarya's gun
Winston also mentions it in an interaction with Mei
undone storm
perhaps the RDF particle weapon is actually a derivated from sigma research
peak escarp
undone storm
he is an old man after all and he worked his whole life, so maybe something like 40 years, on black holes and gravity as a hole
so surely his researchs were used during these 40 years
tiny briar
tru
subtle geyser
by the way, is there a list of blizzcon interviews about overwatch 2?
tiny briar
tho his origin story is creepy
tiny briar
tiny briar
origin story
peak escarp
no
subtle geyser
also about doomfists goal that humanity needs conflict to evolve, i feel like he has a point in a broader type of view, people are more dedicated to solve the problem and well, a lot of inventions have been made due to conflict
peak escarp
the year has never been confirmed
peak escarp
it's "something like 60 years in the future"
we don't know exactly how many years
or when to start counting from
undone storm
shame
peak escarp
they've been saying that since the game was revealed in 2014
undone storm
but I guess it is during the 2070s decade
subtle geyser
what do u guys think about what i said
peak escarp
undone storm
oh, sorry sammy
hold on
well, yes and no
its not that a lot of inventions are made
its more that we put a lot of efforts to destroy the others, forgeting about the other field of research
subtle geyser
wait i also have something else, i just rewatched the dragons short (because its amazing) and at the end the narrator says "reunited, the two set out to rebuild what they once destroyed", does that imply they will actually reunite?
i really hope itll happen
celest zenith
wait why did hanzo kill genji?
peak escarp
because Genji didn't want to be part of their criminal empire
celest zenith
did they sell guns?
peak escarp
Upon the death of his father, the clan elders instructed Hanzo to straighten out his wayward younger brother so that he, too, might help rule the Shimada empire. When his brother refused, Hanzo was forced to kill him. This act broke Hanzo's heart and drove him to reject his father's legacy, ultimately leading him to abandon the clan and all that he had worked so hard to attain.
the Shimada family dealt in illegal arms and drugs
peak escarp
"the clan elders instructed Hanzo to straighten out his wayward younger brother"
probably by any means necessary
in Dragons Hanzo says "it was my duty and my burden"
celest zenith
where did he hide from the clan?
celest zenith
yeah wouldnt the clan go after him after he declines the throne?
peak escarp
probably
Hanzo has had assassins sent after him
he assumes Genji is one of them at the beginning of Dragons
celest zenith
they didnt mention where he hid?
static pelican
man can we just give a shout out to zen for managing to beat genji in a 1v1
peak escarp
?
undone storm
it is never written anywhere that genji was defeated by zenyatta
he was just his spiritual master that teached him how to deal with his cybernetic body.
peak escarp
He drifted for many years before crossing paths with the omnic monk Zenyatta. Though Genji initially rejected Zenyatta's wisdom, the benevolent omnic would not be deterred. In time, Zenyatta became his mentor, and under the monk's tutelage, Genji reconciled his dual existence as both man and machine.
undone storm
I wonder : genji is 35. When was he almost killed by hanzo ? I would say something like 10 to 15 years ago
after all, overwatch existed for a loong period of time and he worked at it
peak escarp
I'd say around 10 years ago
he still seems to be in recovery around the time of Retribution, which was 8 years ago
white panther
I wouldn’t say he’s still in recovery then because he had been part of the black watch team for quite some time and acts calm like everything is normal during the mission leading me to believe he had passed his recovery at the point of retribution
carmine wraith
why did hanzo try to kill genji again?
undone storm
ugh
undone storm
its explained a bit upper
"Upon the death of his father, the clan elders instructed Hanzo to straighten out his wayward younger brother so that he, too, might help rule the Shimada empire. When his brother refused, Hanzo was forced to kill him. This act broke Hanzo's heart and drove him to reject his father's legacy, ultimately leading him to abandon the clan and all that he had worked so hard to attain."
carmine wraith
ah
thank you
one more thing
what turned reyes into the reaper was it mercy? cause i herd a suspicious voiceline between the two
carmine wraith
oh thats kinda lame
peak escarp
peak escarp
it's in Moira's origin story
carmine wraith
hmm
peak escarp
carmine wraith
must of been me not paying attention
gusty sluice
As I suggest, I think we are living 56 years ago from the current year of Overwatch.
peak escarp
why 56?
gusty sluice
2076(current year of Overwatch approximately)-2020 (current year)
undone storm
shame they are not more precise
gusty sluice
Yes
grand wedge
So @peak escarp , were you able to set a proper timeline within Hero of Numbani? ||With Doomfist escaping prison, Masquerade, contacting Efi and such?|| I'd love to see it if you made one ^^
peak escarp
so far it matches roughly with the timeline I had before
I'll have to go through it again and note down all the time reference so figure it out more precisely
grand wedge
Yeah, I was taking note the first half, but but then just stopped and enjoyed the book itself
undone storm
do you think we will get a singapore map one day
I hope we will :
https://blog-content.ixigo.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Blog24.jpg
its beautiful and already very futuristic
besides, since Liao was from Singapore, it would make sense
peak escarp
would be interesting as a deathmatch map
as a nod to it being the place they fought Doomfist
undone storm
that what I was thinking, yeah
on top of a building
make me thing of something :
there are three city states in the world : monaco, singapore and the vatican city
two of these three appears in overwatch and will (probably for singapore) get a map
so will Blizzard add a map set in the vatican ?
spoiler, no, but it would be funny
frosty shell
Not really
grand wedge
And Doomfist was in Singapore for a reason... who was he meeting there? That would be interesting to know ^^
undone storm
hmm...imo, either an important talon person, someone he wanted to recruit into the terrorist organisation, or a target.
perhaps it was related to Liao and/or Echo ?
grand wedge
Liao was probably already dead at this point.
peak escarp
definitely
undone storm
yes, but it doesnt means that the peoples she worked with were all dead too
grand wedge
She worked with Overwatch.
undone storm
and with Omnica Corporation
grand wedge
True. we don't know what the members of Omnica corp did after they shut down the Omniums
undone storm
true dat
there were theories that the big guy with the opened arms behind liao during her cinematic was actually antonio bartalotti, but I dont really believe in that
perhaps he was one of the project supervisor of the omnic research
so personally, I think it was related to Liao or Echo
even if she is dead, perhaps there was still something or someone worthy of investigation for talon at Singapore
blueprints, a relative, a former assistant, who knows
undone storm
I know
thats why I said I dont believe in that theory
but it is still worth mentionning
peak escarp
how would anyone even come up with that theory 
undone storm
idk
After all, peoples changes quite a lot in 20 years
but again, I dont really think that's him
but since he is taking quite the space in the pict, that he is right behind Liao, I wouldnt be surprised if he was/is someone important
peak escarp
he's probably the CEO of Omnica
undone storm
at least he looks happy
that's one thing we can be sure about
limpid agate
Of course he does
He's the CEO of a company that is said to revolutionize robotics, and is raking in a hefty profit
Until it shuts down because of fraud later
And then results in a war even later
undone storm
outstanding move 👍
I wonder how far will Echo go in learning things
and if it will be a new dawn for mankind or the beginning of its end
I would think of the first option, but who knows
peak escarp
I don't see Echo turning bad
that seems unnecessarily dark for a game that's supposed to be optimistic
undone storm
yes
but so far, the good guys doesnt have the advantage at all : they are outnumbered, still considered as vigilantes by the U.N, while Talon seems to have extreme, virtually infinite ressources and the null sector to its command
but hey, that's also why we are going to play to this game
or why we love to see Avengers, for something similar
umbral temple
woah liao’s face :0
umbral temple
I’ve never seen it before
just heard the name
boreal egret
Do we know where Dr Liao is from? her last name is pretty cool
peak escarp
Singapore
umbral temple
doctor how do you know everything about overwatch lore
peak escarp
because I pay attention
umbral temple
...
umbral temple
ah
peak escarp
nothing like 4 years of university to drill into you the need for research and good sources
umbral temple
- exhales and winks * I’ve been kind of busy.
undone storm
doctor has a PHD in overwatch lore
gusty sluice
Is it the same skin that Soldier presented himself to Liao with Strike Commander Morrison?
peak escarp
looks similar
boreal egret
Like how we mostly only saw Reyes in his blackwatch uniform
peak escarp
(even before Blackwatch existed)
boreal egret
lol
peak escarp
Soldier: 24 fixed that
boreal egret
Yes
jolly python
I wonder if Liao somehow survived and will join the recall group. I would be nice if she and Echo got together
.
boreal egret
That’s blunt even for a fictional character lmao
jolly python
limpid agate
There's no way around it.
She died
We see her die
There's no way around unkilling her.
boreal egret
Sadly
limpid agate
It undoes the entire purpose of Echo being a hero.
The idea is that Liao lives on through Echo, who spent the majority of her time copying Liao's mannerisms and beliefs.
boreal egret
I’m not sure if Liao and mercy met
limpid agate
Liao has been dead for ~a decade
Best case, 6-7 years
The corpse has long since decayed
umbral temple
wait mercy can’t resurrect?
peak escarp
no
umbral temple
oh
peak escarp
people can't be brought back from the dead
peak escarp
Mercy's "resurrect" is seen in Zero Hour - she touches Mei and gives her a big dose of healing her
it can revive someone who is incapacitated
young knoll
kind of weird they can't do that considering some of the other stuff they can do
I mean, they have sentient robots
why not copy human minds
peak escarp
umbral temple
so it’s less Rez and just rev
umbral temple
also seeing that for the first time
it was so cool
like as a mercy main
peak escarp
it would be impossible to replicate a person exactly
young knoll
what do you mean infinitely complicated?
it was made by random processes
surely that can be replicated
well, not true randomness
more psuedo randomness
limpid agate
We have sentient robots now
peak escarp
how do you recreate all the years of memories and experiences a person has?
a clone will be genetically identical, but will not be the same person
young knoll
well, if you keep the brain intact, you could use stored memories
digital reconstruction
perhaps
peak escarp
a person is more than just memories
young knoll
how so
umbral temple
I’d think that it would be just a more complicated version of using a defibrillator
like just get them back and running or something
I guess it would depend on how you die if that was the case
lament prawn
copying minds and resurrections will probably not be a thing because of the complications that will add to writing, where anything can be undone (regardless of whether they're human or omnic)
umbral temple
like a bullet wound, you would have to fix that
peak escarp
two people can remember the same event differently, experience it differently, have a different emotional response to it, etc.
umbral temple
and then they might be too far gone
young knoll
two people, yes
but getting direct memories from a dead brain could be equivalent to simply getting it from that person
however, this is getting a bit off topic, I think
peak escarp
it's basically the Ship of Theseus
limpid agate
The technology to copy minds is not existent in Overwatch
I dont think you can even copy Omnics
young knoll
I doubt it, considering how mondatta's death was treated
young knoll
just saying it seems odd that they wouldn't have technology like that considering how advanced they are in other areas, though I would say that death being permanent also enhances the narrative
much as I like comics, for instance, they kill off and resurrect people all the time
takes away the significance of some stories somewhat
limpid agate
Or heavy retcon
Like Illidan Stormrage
Who we literally kill
And they retcon that
young knoll
not all the time, there are many tech solutions in comics as well, but I get what you guys are are saying
limpid agate
The tech in comics are also way above the tech of Overwatch
Overwatch doesnt even have space travel
Its still using rockets to go into space like they did in the 60s
young knoll
to some extent, that is true, but the weapons and barriers they have are actually pretty sophisticated compared to much technology in the comics
limpid agate
And robotics are still very flawed.
to some extent, that is true, but the weapons and barriers they have are actually pretty sophisticated compared to much technology in the comics
I think the Batmobile or Iron Man suit alone shit on Overwatch
Other than Hard Light
young knoll
depends on the iteration
comics are also wildly inconsistent
the comics frequently still use bullets, for instance, and the militaries do not tend to have hard light or shields
young knoll
by that I mean there tends to be nothing like pulse munitions, except in the case of superheroes
not sure if pulse munitions are common
limpid agate
Pulse Munitions were rare in Overwatch too
McCree's gun is custom made just for him by a legendary gunsmith
And the Heavy Pulse Rifle was a prototype that Jack stole.
young knoll
interesting
young knoll
plasma is a good example, then
lament prawn
eh, i think overwatch could be twice as technologically advanced as it is and i still wouldnt find it surprising that they cant just bring people back from the grave all the time
peak escarp
bringing people back also gets into ethics
young knoll
that certainly is not too common in the comics for "the regulars"
limpid agate
Bringing people back also gets into bad writing
peak escarp
maybe they don't want to bring dead people back
young knoll
that is a good point
but I do think that if the technology existed, some people would use it
it doesn't seem that it does
peak escarp
the Shambali believe they have souls - is it wrong to put that soul in a new body after an omnic has died?
umbral temple
Where did tracer get her pulse pistols if they’re that rare?
young knoll
probably for the shambali
everyone else, I don't know
probably soldier, since he is catholic iirc
young knoll
well, I would say that copying memories is not the same thing as transferring a soul
souls seem more metaphysical
it would be debatable if memory transference is tantamount to transferring a soul, I guess
but you can't really measure a metaphysical thing scientifically, so that is a bit moot
peak escarp
how would you even transfer memories? what are memories? it's not like a computer, where things are stored as data
human brains are weird and complicated
umbral temple
but wouldn’t an omnic have like a memory bank or something
young knoll
they are stored electronically, within brain substrata, so I understand
peak escarp
neurons and synapses combined with emotions and feelings
umbral temple
or do I not understand omnics
young knoll
also chemicals
tame osprey
are there any heroes that are Christian or any other theist
young knoll
Soldier is
peak escarp
there was a line implying Junkrat to be theist
young knoll
so it is at least technically possible to recreate a human by copying parts of the brain, but the technology does not exist now
possibly, it never will
peak escarp
but it seems to have been removed
umbral temple
speaking of junkrat
so how is he? in some things of him I’ve read he seems to be really dark and murderous and in others he just seems petty, even childish
limpid agate
He isnt murderous
peak escarp
he's not all there, but I wouldn't call him dark and murderous
peak escarp
he just hates bots
umbral temple
he blew up a whole skyscraper that’s kind of murderous
limpid agate
He just likes blowing shit up
umbral temple
“business tower” smh
peak escarp
after he was betrayed by someone who used him for insurance fraud
umbral temple
I guess.
peak escarp
that's not murder, that's revenge
limpid agate
And even then
He didnt know nor care if there was anyone else in the building
He just likes blowing things up
That's not murderous
peak escarp
like Junkrat says, there's two solutions to every problem
limpid agate
That's just an obsession with desctruction
umbral temple
you two are both being really forgiving
umbral temple
it would be on worldwide news they wouldn’t just say “ yeah he likes doing that”
peak escarp
I just understand his character/motivations
umbral temple
I mean it was a rlly big building
lament prawn
the point is he doesnt enjoy murder, he enjoys boom
young knoll
he also seemed to not care about whether there were actually hostages or not when he blew up the ware house
he seems to view others with antipathy more than anything
umbral temple
okay maybe I’m using the wrong word.
limpid agate
He is chaotic
He is remorseless
But he is not murderous.
If someone dies its just collateral damage
zealous canyon
like Junkrat says, there's two solutions to every problem
@peak escarp Money and EXPLOSIVES!
peak escarp
exactly
if he can't solve a problem by blowing it up, he probably doesn't see the problem
umbral temple
but isn’t that a murderer’s mindset
if they die it’s fine at least there was a boom noise
zealous canyon
No, he just is not the sharpest tool in the shed.
Not exactly the kind of person to think things through.
young knoll
that and he isn't seeking to murder
young knoll
it just happens
limpid agate
He was hired to save some hostages from some "omnics" in a factory
So he blows up the factory and blows up all the omnics
zealous canyon
He sees explosions and that’s all.
peak escarp
he was smart enough to realize the Suit had lied to them
limpid agate
He wasnt trying to kill anyone. He just didnt care to think about human lives
Socipathic might be better
But not murderous
Murder requires intent
He has none
umbral temple
okay okay I get it I used the wrong word
peak escarp
I'm curious about Junkrat's history/family
zealous canyon
Same.
umbral temple
my point was sometimes evil boom sometimes stupid boom. which is real junkrat
peak escarp
it was a common theory that Roadhog adopted him, but Wasted Land debunked that years ago
same goes for Roadhog's history - what did he do before the ALF?
I mean, aside from being a farmer
zealous canyon
I kinda want to talk about Sombra lore.
umbral temple
she kept hacking
peak escarp
people complain about a lack of Zenyatta lore, but we know just as little about Roadhog
limpid agate
And unlike Zen, Roadhog has had 2 comics, an origin short, and a mini short
zealous canyon
<I has no lore.
peak escarp
we've seen Roadhog a lot, but haven't really learned much about him
umbral temple
he’s quiet
umbral temple
how old is zen?
peak escarp
20
umbral temple
he’s younger than I expected
zealous canyon
Really?
peak escarp
Occupation: Wandering Guru, Adventurer
Base of Operations: Shambali Monastery, Nepal (formerly)
Affiliation: The Shambali (formerly)```
umbral temple
so do omnics have a life cycle or do they just get “born” as fully grown ppl
peak escarp
and consider this - he met and trained Genji <6 years ago
I think omnics are built as adults, with probably a short period of learning how to function in society
zealous canyon
As a robotic person this is acceptable.
peak escarp
Orisa is only a month old according to her bio
umbral temple
in that case it would make sense for Zen
zealous canyon
As a robotic person this is acceptable.
umbral temple
like assuming they’re born as adults (we’ll say at least 18) +20 years he’s pretty experienced
like his mental age anyway
lament prawn
perhaps they have basic skills such as the ability to read, speak and the ability to understand language "installed" but they still need to learn the ins and outs of life on their own
peak escarp
Zen is pretty worldly, but his immaturity sneaks through sometimes
you can see it in his emotes
zealous canyon
Yes, this is true.
peak escarp
and in the Reflections comic where he's about to destroy Genji with snowballs
I'd say he's similar to the Air Nomads from ATLA
lament prawn
but his immaturity sneaks through sometimes
i really like those touches in his emotes and some lines, really takes him away from the "generic wise guy" route
peak escarp
serious on the outside, but with a sense of humor
peak escarp
because that would be creepy
umbral temple
at least something that looked mostly human
limpid agate
I think they explained them in Hero of Numbani too
peak escarp
so the slits may not be eyes at all
limpid agate
Those are Orisa's eyes
umbral temple
I know
peak escarp
you want to make robots look human, so they're relatable and easy to interact with, but not too human, or else it gets creepy
umbral temple
I’m saying omnics should have those
peak escarp
umbral temple
I wonder if omnics get sensitive about that
peak escarp
for example
umbral temple
I imagine humans would
peak escarp
humans like to put faces on things
umbral temple
I also wonder if omnics get [sentimental] about cars and stuff
like the fact that they, too, could be alive
sentimental isn’t the right word for that
peak escarp
stuff like wanting rights for drones and factory robots?
looking out for their lesser kin?
umbral temple
don’t tell me. That’s a major point in the story.
peak escarp
we don't know much about omnics or what they think about drones/non-sentient robots
young knoll
I mean, that would be a bit like humans wanting freedom for other biological beings that are not sentient/sapient
umbral temple
really?
young knoll
they are similar in that they are carbon based life forms that can breathe, but they aren't like humans
peak escarp
there are groups who want personhood for whales and apes due to their intelligence
umbral temple
yeah but like with omnics it’s achievable
young knoll
true, but I doubt all omnics would be like those groups
peak escarp
lament prawn
we do care about stuff like animal abuse, but i think omnics would know that drones dont have feelings or "souls"
peak escarp
an omnic might yell at you if you smack your computer when it doesn't work
umbral temple
like cars and stuff could probably be given the same state of existence that omnics have
peak escarp
(Winston probably made the Great Ape Personhood movement freak out in-universe)
umbral temple
yeah
young knoll
if Winston actually did exist, or omnics, we would all be in immense trouble
umbral temple
elaborate
young knoll
imagine us trying to coexist with another species as smart as us
we can't even get along with our own biological species
umbral temple
it would be almost like aliens I guess
but we could phase them in at least
like hey guys monkeys are pretty cool right
by the way they’re scientists
lament prawn
i still dont know what to think of things like athena or wrecking ball (mech), i know they arent omnics with feelings and souls, but they are characterized beyond what you'd assume a non-living AI would sound like. i take it thats just creative fun and artistic license so they dont appear boring?
peak escarp
probably
Athena was made by probably the world's best artificial intelligence engineer, so it makes sense that she seems so advanced
she's Echo's older sister
umbral temple
Hammond makes no sense to me
why would he make wrecking ball say “ he says, thank you”
Hammond doesn’t seem to want to appear to be reliant on anyone
peak escarp
Wrecking Ball is pretty much an off-the-shelf AI that can translate hamster??
Wrecking Ball is on the level of Siri/Alexa/Google Assistant
lament prawn
but athena being sentient while also lacking a body and being solely used as an assistant would raise some ethical issues, so ill assume she doesnt have feelings and any hint of character is just artistic license
umbral temple
what I’m saying is why would Hammond allow it to appear to be on that level
lament prawn
wrecking ball seems to go a bit further than directly translating words, which is the only reason i brought him up. doesnt he like, add to or very lightly alters the literal words that hammond says?
umbral temple
to me he seems really independent
umbral temple
I don’t think he’d want ppl to know he relies on Siri.
peak escarp
that too - he needed to make the Junkers think he was a person
lament prawn
i dont think hammond is literally saying "he says thank you" or "the hamster is pleased"
umbral temple
yeah exactly
peak escarp
although I have a theory that Bruce might have helped with that
Bruce might have even gotten the AI for him
umbral temple
why didn’t he make wrecking ball just say thank you
limpid agate
Hammond is not Wrecking Ball
lament prawn
its very minor stuff, but i can push that into the "artistic license" category and not the "obsessive evidence that wrecking ball is independent" category
limpid agate
Wrecking Ball is a different character
Beyond just hero stuff
It was an extra thing to cement that for players
The mech is not the hamster
umbral temple
I thought Hammond piloted wrecking ball
limpid agate
Yes
The mech also says a few things on its own
It is low level AI
But it has AI
And speaks
young knoll
sensible that he wouldn't be the one doing all of it, but a bit irregular for stories like these
peak escarp
a lot of people give the heroes too much credit
they'll think Mercy saved Genji's life AND built his cybernetic body, or Moira "brainwashed" Widowmaker
specialists don't tend to be generalists
umbral temple
so what I’m trying to say is. hammond got wrecking ball’s tech from somebody. It was clearly a special and specific order (the hamster is pleased). So if Hammond didn’t want to seem like an omnic OR like he relies on anybody, why didn’t he just get a human voice for wrecking ball
peak escarp
lines like "the hamster is pleased" are for the player
he would probably never actually say that
and he did get a human voice for Wrecking Ball, it's just not a very good one
young knoll
that, and some of his lines are probably meant to reflect that he was basically a pro wrestler of sorts
peak escarp
pro wrestlers are known for speaking in third person . . .
young knoll
I mean, he wasn't actually a pro wrestler, but the setup for the mech fighting arena makes me think that he was probably close to that equivalent
I doubt the junkers would dislike that sort of thing
peak escarp
the scrapyard is entertainment, there is probably a lot of playing to the crowd
umbral temple
but the voice I’m not giving up on the voice
zen’s voice sound more human. only batman has as deep a voice as wrecking ball and Hammond was trying to sound human with wrecking ball
young knoll
he was trying to pass as human
the voice of the ai has no reflection on his humanity
I doubt anyone thought it was him speaking
umbral temple
then why have a voice at all
Junkertown prob has a commentator at their matches
young knoll
because people expect it of pro wrestlers, as I and Doctor_Six mentioned
young knoll
is the likely reason
also, he may have interacted with other people who did not know his secret
which would require communication on his part
young knoll
Bruce may have helped him
young knoll
No shitposting
fervent jewel
who's that?
he reminds me of torb's partner(? i'm not sure if that's the right word)
peak escarp
you're thinking of Sven
fervent jewel
ah
fervent jewel
OOO
peak escarp
he's a friend of Roadhog's
and Bruce's Wreckyard is where Hammond built his mech
meaning it's likely that Bruce knows Hammond is a hamster and may have helped him out
peak escarp
there's a lot of hidden details on the maps and in the origin trailers
fervent jewel
hmm, is there anything else interesting about junkertown/characters related that not a lot of people know about
pretty interested into this now
peak escarp
Junkrat and Bruce are fans of Wrecking Ball
they can be seen in the crowd in his origin trailer
fervent jewel
well i'd hope bruce was a fan of someone he helped lol
safe trout
A fun junkertown related fact it’s that Hammond is called Hammond cuz he’s a hamster
fervent jewel
otherwise that'd be a little weird disliking someone you're helping
atomic cosmos
do you guys think....every ex overwatch member that brought their OW equipment is fugutive ?
peak escarp
technically they are breaking the law
atomic cosmos
like
reinhardt bring his 08 armor
mercy valkrie suit
mccree peacekeeper
tracer chronal accelerator
genji Ryuichi moji
soujorn her railgun hand
fervent jewel
what if they created it themselves... does that count as their own equipments?
peak escarp
most of it was made by Overwatch
atomic cosmos
mei and winston doesn't counted cuz...
winston technically never leave OW facility while mei created her cryo blaster herself
peak escarp
Mercy made her valkyrie suit (with Torbjorn's help)
Winston made the chronal accelerator
Mei made her own gear
McCree's gun was made by an expert gunsmith
peak escarp
he stole it from a former Overwatch base that was being guarded by Helix
atomic cosmos
ah
i think only torbjorn who legally allowed to use his equipment because he with ironclad Guild ?
peak escarp
yes
atomic cosmos
i wonder how petras react to winston's Overwatch team
peak escarp
I hope Helix are the ones who have to enforce the Petras Act
atomic cosmos
so we will meet pharah ?
peak escarp
it would create an interesting dynamic where Pharah has to decide between her dream of joining Overwatch and doing her duty as a Helix officer
spiral merlin
atomic cosmos
so there is chance that they made her betray Helix and join us
peak escarp
maybe