Every characters with robotic arms and cybernetics have an utility fot them. So it would be weird if it was just for artistic reason only for Sigma
#lore-discussion
grand wedge
grand wedge
oh
peak escarp
wait
nevermind
I thought they only appeared on his character model, but he has them in the comic too
grand wedge
On his forhead? I mean, they must hav some kind of utility to improve something, when you look how he want's to improve humanity, he must be better than the others
He embraces the augmentations on his body
peak escarp
maybe they're relays or something, to help fine-tune control over his cybernetics?
grand wedge
I like the tune-control over the cybernetics idea!
peak escarp
as for Sigma's head . . . maybe it's something that helps him control his powers?
grand wedge
He had no control over it after the accident, so it's a possibility
peak escarp
you can't really see if he has it from this angle, but there does seem to be something on the top/back of his head
with cables coming off of it
grand wedge
Poor Siebren ... I wonder what they did to him to try to cure him/fix him
It doesn't seems it's just to be monitoring
pastel ocean
the thing that glows in the back of sigma's head is the singularity inside of his skull
god i can't imagine how sigma feels
its probably such a insanely odd feeling
tender perch
@peak escarp look at @limpid agate s pic its prob the ealry stages of that
peak escarp
yeah
pastel ocean
also i dont really think mccree's cybernetic arm really serves any utility
peak escarp
you mean, aside from replacing his missing arm?
pastel ocean
yeah of course
peak escarp
@tender perch McCree doesn't shoot with that arm
pastel ocean
it doesnt really.. do anything besides be an arm
peak escarp
yeah
tender perch
ok so the story is mcree and junk just escaped from prison and they had to use a LASER CUTTEr to get their handcuffs off turns out it also cut his arm off
peak escarp
no
pastel ocean
what
we dont know how mccree lost his arm
and junk probably blew his legs off with explosives
peak escarp
that doesn't mean they're connected
tender perch
llook it up
pastel ocean
i thought you were kidding
peak escarp
Torbjorn and Symmetra also have robot arms
tender perch
then how?
pastel ocean
might be wrong but we dont know for symmetra either do we?
peak escarp
nope
it's theorized that it was intentionally replaced with cybernetics to aid with her job
pastel ocean
i used to think it was just a big ass glove on her hand or something
tender perch
llol
"As of Uprising Comic (1 year after Venice Incident) - last shot of McCree in that comic was him Fanning-The-Hammer against an Omnic with a clearly normal left arm."
peak escarp
yes
so he lost his arm some time between Uprising and present
Torbjorn has a voice line asking about it, so it was likely after McCree left Overwatch
pastel ocean
im mad that he doesnt even hint at it in his dialogue he just jokes about it
i was about to reference that voiceline lol
tender perch
also my theory on roadhog is he has radiation in his eyes thats why on the butcher skin when he dosnot have a mask he still wears goggles
peak escarp
the Butcher skin isn't canon
tender perch
ok then what about my first question
peak escarp
which question?
peak escarp
she got a computer installed in her spine
the head implants probably help her interface with it
tender perch
do u think they might help her so she does not hack herself?
tender perch
on accident idk
peak escarp
how does one even hack themself?
tender perch
valid terrace
It’s likely just an advanced version of google glass
Where she can see data flowing kind of like Iron Man
tender perch
how ?
valid terrace
By having a computer in your brain that can access the internet?
valid terrace
Her fingers can project holovids
tender perch
struck by lightning
pliant sparrow
Chances are she'd be severely wounded
pliant sparrow
If she has wiring in her spine she'll probably never walk again
tender perch
ouch imagine a computer frying but INYOUR BODY
valid terrace
She could replace it just as easily
pliant sparrow
Not sure about that
tender perch
same
pliant sparrow
We don't know the limits of overwatch medical technology
tender perch
all the wires would be everywhere in her body
valid terrace
If you can replace torn limbs, why would replacing the fakes be any more difficult?
pliant sparrow
Not her computer spine
Her biological spine
The damage to that would be immense
And repairing/replacing the spinal cord is extremely difficult
tender perch
@drowsy nebula stop spamming that in all the text chats
tender perch
wait it isnt
spark tangle
And I haven’t spammed that?
valid terrace
We know that full on cybernetic arms exist, which are more complicated than legs to begin with, I’m sure she’d be fine replacing a few nerves
tender perch
i saw it on the general thing too
pliant sparrow
You'd be suprised
valid terrace
Please stop regardless
peak escarp
!!loreonly @tender perch
twilit nacelleBOT
@tender perch This channel is for serious discussion strictly related to the lore of Overwatch. Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
pliant sparrow
Nerves are very difficult to replace
If the wiring is along her entire spine that could mean repair is almost impossible
valid terrace
The woman has a mecha head, it’s probably not beyond her
tender perch
sorry
pliant sparrow
Hell that would probably mean she'd be dead within minutes
valid terrace
It’s not exactly built with durability in mind
pliant sparrow
It probably is meant to take at least a few hits
valid terrace
Either one
tender perch
in the doctor strange movie it mentions that doing a full spine reconnect or something is impossible
valid terrace
Extremely difficult expensive
pliant sparrow
Those usually go hand in hand
peak escarp
he was unable to walk
pliant sparrow
He had most of his spinal cord still intact
zenith prawn
Genji has a face and a brain right?
tender perch
yes
pliant sparrow
That gave them quite a bit to work with
peak escarp
and a bit more
zenith prawn
So it’s not like his mind was uploaded like people initially thought was the case with Liao/Echo
pliant sparrow
The biggest problem with sombra surviving something like that would be stabilizing her in time
Because that's a hell of a lot of internal damage
pastel ocean
you have to be mindful that its in 2075
limpid agate
Give or take
Genji's surgery was ~9 years before present day.
Sombra's is an unknown amount of time prior
The earliest we have seen her chronologically is the ARG.
Excluding parts of her origin short
pastel ocean
🤷♀️
limpid agate
Where we see her starting as a child and playing her game until present.
pastel ocean
we dont even have distinct timestamps do we?
peak escarp
we have vague numbers
Overwatch is set "roughly 60 years in the future"
dates of other things are given in relation to Recall (Uprising is 7 years before Recall, Retribution is 8 years, Storm Rising is 6 years, Overwatch shut down 5 years ago)
supple laurel
Yo unironically
Talon are the good guys
overwatch is just a bunch of people who think they're in the right cuz they dont understand the consequences of their actions.
and i wont go into it cuz im bored.
peak escarp
. . . Talon are literally terrorists
supple laurel
So are overwatch technically
tender perch
lol
supple laurel
an organization that is committing illegal actions is a terrorist group technically, the only thing different is the intent
talon does it for various complex reasons, ow does it cuz they think they're doign the right thing
peak escarp
intent is a very significant factor
Overwatch does not intend to cause terror
also current Overwatch doesn't do anything that be remotely compared to terrorism
supple laurel
but technically, a group of vigilantes is not much different from a "terrorist" group.
They are a group who acts outside the law based on their own moral code. Intent im not sure is something that matters much.
Talon is also a group acting outside the law based on their own moral code.
They're basically 2 sides of the exact same coin, except i side with talon more.
peak escarp
- the state of fear and submission produced by terrorism or terrorization.
- a terroristic method of governing or of resisting a government.```Overwatch does none of those
supple laurel
Yes they're not technically a terrorist group but them and talon operate based on the same conduct.
Think about it.
They are both groups who acts outside the law based on their own moral code.
peak escarp
that doesn't make them terrorists
peak escarp
Overwatch's moral code aligns with the dominant moral code of the public
supple laurel
That doesn't matter.
Law matters.
I can't explain well without delving into real life politics.
supple laurel
"technically"
peak escarp
there is no "technically" about it
supple laurel
Also ur missing my point.
peak escarp
what is your point then?
supple laurel
Moral code is subjective to everyone, the law is not.
Talon sees themselves as the good guy. So does Overwatch. But under the law, they are both criminals acting outside the law based on their personal moral code.
peak escarp
are you trying to say that saving lives and trying to stop a war are morally equivalent to assassination, kidnapping and torture?
supple laurel
Thats a very black and white way of thinking about things.
peak escarp
I have a feeling you're going to anyway
peak escarp
yes they are both criminals
but Overwatch is trying to do good
Talon is not trying to do good, they don't even pretend to do good
supple laurel
Based on what do you say that? If i remember correctly, Talon has not killed a single human in any of the cinematics.
And Omnics, based on your personal thinking, may be "lives" or may not be lives.
peak escarp
they killed Overwatch agents in the comics, and blew up an Overwatch base in Oslo, which also killed many people
they assassinated Gerard Lacriox and kidnapped and tortured his wife
supple laurel
Ah, never been into the comics much.
Didn't know that one. Either way, both groups have killed a whole lot of people.
If ur right on that, which you probably are.
peak escarp
modern Overwatch hasn't killed anyone
except Null Sector omnics, who like you said, may or may not be considered "people"
supple laurel
Ehhh, not really. Shooting someone in the face tends to kill them.
pliant sparrow
What makes overwatch activity overwatch activity?
Couldn't they have made a seperate organisation following its fall
supple laurel
peak escarp
I'm not talking about Blackwatch or Overwatch before they were shut down
peak escarp
they got shut down because they did questionable things, like you said
I'm talking about Winston's new Overwatch
pliant sparrow
Say if winston and tracer rescued some people from an omnic, would that be deemed overwatch activity?
It seems like one massive grey area
peak escarp
the media called Winston and Tracer fighting Reaper and Widowmaker at the museum "Overwatch activity"
pliant sparrow
But at what point does it stop being overwatch activity?
supple laurel
Okay look, here's the complexity in the whole Talon, Overwatch thing.
This whole conflict between the two is based on several conflicts. Doomfist wants war between humans and Omnics, moira wants... fk knows what, sombra just wants information, reaper's just a merc who hates overwatch. The main thing they want to do is to remove the Robots from society, which is a morally good thing if you think about the details of the situation. @peak escarp
pliant sparrow
I doubt someone acting alone in a spur of the moment counts as overwatch activity
peak escarp
The main thing they want to do is to remove the Robots from society, which is a morally good thing if you think about the details of the situation.
what
Talon doesn't care about what rights omnics have - if anything, they're pro omnic, since they have an omnic on their council
pliant sparrow
Talons agenda is conflict isn't it?
peak escarp
also denying rights and freedoms to sapient beings is NOT morally good
supple laurel
Doomfist wants war because war makes humanity stronger. This is historically correct. Technology in times of war accelerates rapidly, in every single war u can think of (big ones atleast), including the Omnic war, technology progressed rapidly, making humanity stronger. Conflict always makes strong men.
He also has voice lines pertaining to the fact he doesn't think omnics are a group that can coexist with humans. "The Omnics will not be kept down forever."
@peak escarp
Same voice line points to the fact he does not consider the Omnics equal to humans.
But more complexity! They are not sapient beings. Is Orisa sapient?
She has multiple lines talking about her programming.
Is programming a "sentient" being possible? Not really.
peak escarp
yes, she is sapient
peak escarp
it doesn't matter what's possible in the real world, in the fictional world of Overwatch, we are told that omnics are sapient
pliant sparrow
peak escarp
it's just part of the narrative
that's why they're fighting for rights
they're trying to be recognized as people
supple laurel
Yes, the narrative told from the point of view of overwatch. As are most of the cinematics, besides the volskaya one with sombra, i think?
pliant sparrow
Shooting star
peak escarp
and Reunion, and Shooting Star
pliant sparrow
Last bastion?
peak escarp
and The Last Bastion
supple laurel
Thats not necessarily true though. You don't have to be sapient to do something. You can easily be told to do so, or simply look into AI learning to see what machines are capable of.
Those don't matter, talking talon/ow rn
not side characters
supple laurel
Yes, but we are guided by thought, that was written by the natural process of life. A machine with AI learning was made by a human being is not natural, it is crafted.
pliant sparrow
Your thought was crafted
peak escarp
an omnic with learning programming can analyze the world they observe, and craft their own thoughts about it
supple laurel
Also i don't think you quite understand how horrible the impact of a society full of robots would be for humans.
peak escarp
why does that matter?
this isn't a "what if" - in the world of Overwatch, omnics do exist and they are sapient
real world impacts do not matter
supple laurel
Not real world, in the overwatch world. The existence of robots would be terrible for humans if you thought about it.
Think about it. Omnics don't need sleep. They might need to charge, but u can probably get around that easily. Maybe even just put a wire in them to charge them while they work. Omnics don't require nearly as much maintenance economically, allowing them to have more disposable income. More disposable income means a massive increase in robot-oriented products, and a reduction in human oriented products.
They also are LITERAL machines. Any work that a human can do, an omnic could surely do it better. A machine has perfect control of its body, and a robot is infinitely more powerful than a human, obviously.
Manual labor for humans would be impossible, cuz Omnics would be much more suited for it. Thousands, hundreds of thousands of human jobs would be gone in an instant with the introduction of Omnics into society.
In a cinematic, we also saw a human with a romantic partner being an Omnic. Should this become a trend, the lack of reproductive capabilities by Omnics would steadily decrease human birth rates. Our populations would decrease, and the omnics would only increase, because you can simply make them in a factory and throw them as another "sentient" being.
Not to mention, have you thought about politics in the world of overwatch?
pliant sparrow
Well you see all this is true
But most people in control of these things aren't complete idiots
supple laurel
Imagine if someone had the power to MANUFACTURE voters, like an Omnic. Omnics would surely vote for any politician who promised them better life, whatever, etc. If production of omnics was unrestricted, this would literally be a case of a democratic breakdown. Omnics would just vote eachother into power, giving them more and more power by their manufactured votes.
Democracy would die, and humans would essentially be ruled by mobs of robots voting eachother into power.
peak escarp
congratulations, you understand why omnics don't have universal rights
supple laurel
Yeah, do you see what i mean now?
These are catastrophic consequences for the human race.
peak escarp
but you're thinking of worst-case scenarios
supple laurel
Talon trying to start a war with the Omnics is a good thing, regardless of intent.
peak escarp
Overwatch is about optimism, a future where omnics and humans can coexist
supple laurel
Yes, but if you look at overwatch from a non-fairytale perspective as if its being to a 10 year old.
The world suddenly becomes much more interesting.
peak escarp
that doesn't sound very interesting to me
supple laurel
Realistic view of the politics and conflicts of overwatch are a trillion times more interesting than "ow good talon bad"
Yes but what is the point of stories that are completely unrelatable to our human life?
peak escarp
because fiction is escapism?
supple laurel
Fiction is escapism, but it still needs to be related to us for us to make an emotional connection with the story.
pliant sparrow
Not necessarily
supple laurel
For fantasy, a genre completely insane by comparison to our own world, we bond with the feelings of struggle, emotional or whatever, that the people in these situations go through.
@pliant sparrow Have you ever read a children's fairy tale as an adult?
Like a rly young child's fairytale.
supple laurel
Its... obviously really boring and unrelatable and uninteresting though. Because its childish. There is no depth.
pliant sparrow
Think of overwatch as 'what if we don't fuck up?'
supple laurel
The more depth a story has the more captivating it is.
And thinking of OW in the super simplistic sense that the devs portray it as, is extremely boring.
peak escarp
simplistic?
supple laurel
Bringing it into a more realistic scenario the story has 100x more depth.
peak escarp
it has plenty of depth
supple laurel
Yeah, the OW story is really simple if taken at face value.
peak escarp
it deals with a lot of the issues we face today
pliant sparrow
???
supple laurel
Don't even go there bro
peak escarp
isn't that what you were doing?
peak escarp
you said it needed to be relatable
supple laurel
Im not talking about our current political climates or situations.
peak escarp
well it is relatable
pliant sparrow
Depth doesn't always mean a grim outlook
supple laurel
Well if its relatable that means you have this super simplistic view of life too
which is frankly pretty sad
peak escarp
what
pliant sparrow
Huh?
peak escarp
there's nothing simplistic about Overwatch's story
pliant sparrow
If you want a less childish part of overwatch
peak escarp
if you don't see the depth and complexity, then you probably don't understand it
pliant sparrow
20 million children were orphaned during the crisis
supple laurel
If you relate the politics of OW to real world problems and issues, then you simply have a really simplistic view of politics in general.
As they are portrayed by the devs atleast.
@peak escarp What is the complexity, that you see that i don't though?
peak escarp
yeah, because the omnics fighting for their right to be recognized as people doesn't relate AT ALL to ANYTHING we've experienced in real life 🙄
supple laurel
Have you considered that this situation with the Omnics and the "relation" it has to anything we experience in real life is also not simplistic at all like you believe?
supple laurel
As i said, your view of politics, both fictional and real, is pretty black and white, or shallow since u dont like simplistic.
Also, can u answer the complexity you see in Overwatch's lore?
peak escarp
I already did
supple laurel
But you didn't.
supple laurel
Well, you got into them so ill follow.
pliant sparrow
??????
supple laurel
Again, you see the world from your perspective only.
If you think it reflects modern issues, do you not consider that some may not consider these same things an issue like you do?
pliant sparrow
?
pliant sparrow
I'm not following the point you're making on the last part
As in, what it has to do with overwatch having depth
supple laurel
Ah, my point is simply that if you have a shallow understanding of real world politics, u will also have a very shallow understanding of videogame politics.
pliant sparrow
Ah
supple laurel
Ow's politics are a fairy tale if you don't think too much on them, completely unrealistic.
If you relate fiction, fairy tale politics to real world politics, your understanding of politics is on the level of a child, pretty much.\
peak escarp
we barely know anything about the politics in the OW universe
supple laurel
not to be insulting or anything, that sounded kinda mean
Yes but we have a LOT of information that guides us down paths from logical conclusions we make based on the info we have.
King's row is shock full of politics.
Grafitti, signs, etc, character dialogue.
peak escarp
yes
the omnics there want to be recognised as people and want to have rights - which is a very relatable subject for a lot of people
supple laurel
Yeah, but the politics of overwatch have a very childish presentation. "This good, that bad." If you begin to think about these childish politics realistically, you will gradually see so much more complexity that was not intended by the developers.
Frankly, you could make an incredible book if you took Overwatch's politics and world building and took them to a more realistic turn, rather than a happy-go-lucky optimism trip.
peak escarp
but that wouldn't be Overwatch
supple laurel
Do you kind of understand what im talking about? Don't be so stubborn, you'll start seeing things you previously couldn't have possibly noticed, both in real life and in stories.
Well it would be the world of overwatch, on a more realistic turn.
So it would be a different version of it i suppose.
peak escarp
Overwatch is about optimisim, seeing the world for what it could be, believing in heroes
that's part of its core theme
supple laurel
Yeah, does that not sound like something extremely childish? Personally, its insanely boring to me. The characters with the most depth in my opinion is actually soldier and doomfist, and im pretty sure its all unintentional.
supple laurel
Besides, maybe i didn't understand the point of the chat, but i simply wanted to offer a new perspective on the world of Overwatch from a more believeable scenario.
peak escarp
there's too much dark gritty realism these days
supple laurel
Huh, didn't expect that.
You just reminded me of my 14 year old self
for a bit
got curious
peak escarp
I'm just tired of the trend of grim realism in movies and fiction in the last 20 years - what's wrong with optimism?
supple laurel
Nothing really wrong with it, but it reflects the growing sense of nihilism and meaningless that the world is feeling the past 20 years.
We write stories to express ourselves.
peak escarp
well it's depressing
pliant sparrow
Some people just want a bit of happiness sometimes
supple laurel
It is, that's true.
pastel ocean
optimism is good in stories and i love that overwatch practices it
pliant sparrow
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
peak escarp
there's enough pessimism and sadness already in the world, we should be trying to lighten it up with optimism in stories
do you know how many "apocalyptic" events I've lived through? it's exhausting
pastel ocean
the feeling of overwatch is amazing in general, a bunch of color and diverse and powerful characters coming together and being pitted against each other is so charming
supple laurel
Oh there's many such stories in AOE and such, from people who just want to read something less sad for once, but is 80% cringe and bad writing so i wouldn't reccomend it.
AO3*
pliant sparrow
AO3?
supple laurel
Yeah its a website for amateur writers to post stuff.
Imagine something like a fanfiction website with a large section for original stuff.
Mostly hobby writers, so its not that great.
peak escarp
maybe I'm just defying the "jaded millenial" stereotype
supple laurel
Nah bro im a jaded 17 year old.
peak escarp
lol what a reversal
supple laurel
Im a stereotype of a doomer personally.
which isn't the best admittedly.
But anyway i've strayed off overwatch, so i'll stop for now
pastel ocean
my eyes just rolled so far back in my head reading that corny shit im just gonna
supple laurel
dont wanna flood this chat with random stuff.
u wanna cringe more @pastel ocean ?
peak escarp
let's try to keep it on topic
as hopeful and optimistic as Overwatch is, it does cover some grey areas
like you said initially, original Overwatch was guilty of some pretty sketchy stuff
which eventually got them shut down
supple laurel
Oh yeah also mercy is a bad person
peak escarp
why?
supple laurel
She had discovered a very potent anti-ageing agent, that supposedly also heals her (how they explain her passive regen) and she keeps it to herself
peak escarp
she ages normally
peak escarp
I'm 100% sure she does
pliant sparrow
No
pliant sparrow
There was reyes, Morrison, amari and who else?
There was a fourth guy
Not reinhardt
peak escarp
Morrison, Reyes, Amari, Lindholm, Wilhelm and Liao
pliant sparrow
Huh
peak escarp
6 founders
pliant sparrow
I could've sworn there were 4
haughty furnace
hello
limpid agate
We were talking about it earlier
ANd skins can be a bit iffy
See: Vishkar Sym
But his head is in tact here in Subject Sigma
hoary condor
huh i never noticed
valid terrace
Dang chat blew up and I wasn’t here
supple laurel
@valid terrace i mean i suggest scrolling up to see what i typed
cuz i think its pretty fascinating stuff and something ive never heard anyone talk about b4
may be tooting my own horn slightly
peak escarp
we had a bit of a debate about Overwatch's theme of optimism
primal escarp
so how does mercy's resurrection work in the overwatch universe?
the image isnt loading for me
and now it's gone
peak escarp
peak escarp
she gives a burst of nanobiotic healing to revive someone who has been incapacitated
primal escarp
but if they are dead, they are gone?
peak escarp
yes
primal escarp
so as long as they are on the brink of death, with a real world version of being on 1hp, she can "revive" them back to perfect health again?
peak escarp
something like that
primal escarp
now is there some sort of container for this?
like, she can't have an infinite amount of times she can use this, right?
so where is it being stored?
peak escarp
I dunno, in her suit?
lament prawn
these are probably details that neither we nor the writers know
lament prawn
if she's ever in a position where she can't heal because it "ran out", there'll be a plot reason for it
it wont just happen randomly just because it works like that
peak escarp
she wouldn't be a very good healer if she just ran out of healing
lament prawn
eh, i mean if anything happened to her tech
the abilities are vague with no set limitations, the characters will do as much or as little as the plot needs them to
peak escarp
(I was poking fun at Moira, but that too)
lament prawn
oh lol
primal escarp
but moira's character has a feature that explains how she can run out and replenish her healing juice
i think all the healer's have some sort of explanation for how they heal and how they replenish, with the exception of Lucio
who's healing is still arbitrary to me
peak escarp
Lucio doesn't heal in canon
lament prawn
its similar to brig's passive healing, "inspiration" where she heals by inspiring, he just heals with his soothing tunes
peak escarp
Brigitte just knows first aid, and Zenyatta's healing is probably more psychological than anything
primal escarp
and the healing orbs, it can nano tech that is within the orbs, which then latch onto someone and distribute the nanos into them
peak escarp
nanos?
primal escarp
she gives a burst of nanobiotic healing to revive someone who has been incapacitated
@peak escarp
im sorry, what?
primal escarp
what's the difference? one uses robots, the other changes things at the molecular scale
in the end, they accomplish the same thing
peak escarp
a car and a bike will both get you from point A to point B, but they're not the same thing
primal escarp
so what's omnic energy?
peak escarp
nanobiotics is different from nanobots
omnic energy hasn't been explained
and probably won't, since OW is soft sci-fi
primal escarp
imma just keep calling Zenyatta's healing abilities, spiritual healing
but back to my main point, all the healers have some sort of explanation behind how their healing abilities work
like, their healing weapons have some sort of explanation that works
then you have mercy's staff
peak escarp
do they?
limber nebula
the cadecus staff or whatever
lol!
u know
ana's rifle
sounds really painful
like to get healing u have to get darted???
peak escarp
yeah
limber nebula
how does it even tell who is an enemy and whos a friend
twin mantle
^
peak escarp
healing darts for allies, harming darts for enemies
peak escarp
twin mantle
Can we talk about how tf did roadhog become part pig?
peak escarp
he isn't part pig
peak escarp
he's just a big guy
twin mantle
Ah
peak escarp
who likes pigs
twin mantle
I thought Moira did something's to him
peak escarp
and other cute things
pastel ocean
moira doesnt even know hog
deft glacier
Moira is a piece of shit
pliant sparrow
Why is that?
worthy rose
I reckon wintson likes peanut butter
pliant sparrow
worthy rose
Moira is a piece of shit
@deft glacier Why?
Moira is great
She's my support main uwu
deft glacier
I mean, she betrayed and maybe even brainwashed her comrades, she's a double agent for both Overwatch and Talon
worthy rose
That's super evil
and I love it
Maybe I just like her for the similarities between her and thicc boi
pliant sparrow
She hasnt been confirmed a double agent
deft glacier
Reyes maybe was jelous for Morrison taking the head of OW, but he respected him and they were friends (and my fujoshi side says MORE THAN FRIENDS) so he would have NEVER tried to kill him if it wasn't for Moira's attempt to "cure" him
pliant sparrow
And she hasnt been confirmed to brainwash anyone
deft glacier
That's my theory, but I'm pretty sure it's plausible seeing in-game dialogues
teal meadow
there's a rumor that they teased an underwater map in the "captain hammond" background of the skin
has there been any lore about an underwater base?
pearl bear
teal meadow
doesn't really seems like any maps
valid terrace
If we ever got an underwater map, the best candidate would be wherever the Gwishin come from
Presumably an Omnium in the East China Sea
teal meadow
A map like that, would fit in ow 2
grand wedge
I second that the underwater map has more chance to have something to do with the Gwishin and the giant Omnic coming from under the sea. It's the only lore we have about something going on undewater.
valid terrace
Besides Bastion’s Scandinavian Escapade 
teal meadow
It's the only lore we have about something going on undewater.
For the moment.
lavish elm
The underwater map isn’t real. It’s just a bunch of reused assets
teal meadow
tecnically, they showed at blizzcon some art about a underwater map
so, perhaps in future?
ionic summit
they did?
teal meadow
yes
there was some concept arts about some scrapped maps
that's not lore
and that's an unoriginal joke, so fuck off
grand wedge
Here, the Project Titan concept maps
And yes Mauga main, we know that it's reused assets for the promotionnal picture of Hammond.
sonic sleet
I would like to see Galapogos be an actual map in OW2
pliant sparrow
The iris and galapagos I like
gaunt token
I really would like an omnic factory map
Like in Star Wars attack of the clones
And we could see everything being built
The omnium at the end of Kong’s row isn’t as cool as it could be
loud quartz
I
WANT
ZEN
LORE
or at least some
bc
we don't really know a whole lot about him
limber nebula
how would an underwater map even work
iron plume
it wouldn’t be fully submerged
it’d be underwater in the same way horizon is in space
gritty raft
AHAHHA IMAGINE SEEING EVERYONE JUST SWIMMING EVERYWHERE
iron plume
maybe one gimmicky section
limber nebula
dang
i thought u would be able to swim in the water qq
but that makes a lot more sense
loud quartz
orrr
gritty raft
d r o w n i n g n o i s e s
gritty raft
idk if they would do that all for a map;;;;,,,
limber nebula
it would require probably new physics stuff too
loud quartz
or maybe they would only use the underwater map for the story mode
limber nebula
u would probably be in a building like horizon lunar colony
loud quartz
bc
limber nebula
another thing is the blue tint would probably get annoying
gritty raft
idk, it would be neat if there were little aquariums throughout the building
gritty raft
idk, im stupid so i cant really think of things, plus i havent slept in two days
gritty raft
sad
loud quartz
and think of the glitches that you could do
maybe you can get stuck
or glitch into the wall
gritty raft
i cant , theres too many lmaoo
gritty raft
i honestly have no idea
gritty raft
pharah- up up uppity
valid terrace
If the only issue is rendering fish, they’ve already done that
Lijiang Gardens has them in the pit
loud quartz
i was going to say like vehicles?
gritty raft
not like its gonna become a map anyway lmfao
loud quartz
yea
gritty raft
there should be a map with like this abandoned wrestling place and then zaryas all like "i remember this place, this is where i beat the shit out of reinhardt that one day" and boom, connection
loud quartz
eh
gritty raft
im just joking-
valid terrace
They haven’t met yet in the lore
loud quartz
yes they have?
valid terrace
Most characters haven’t
gritty raft
i thought they did-
valid terrace
Rein and Zar?
loud quartz
they have some lines saying zarya to rematch rein
valid terrace
Zarya has only met Sombra
loud quartz
saying something like
gritty raft
reinhardt and zarya
valid terrace
In game lines are not canon
twin mantle
I really would like an omnic factory map
@gaunt token Volskaya
loud quartz
"you too scared rein?"
valid terrace
They represent what if situations
valid terrace
Widow and Tracer wouldn’t team up irl
valid terrace
It’s all hypothetical situations so gameplay isn’t hamstringed by lore
valid terrace
She wouldn’t most likely
loud quartz
or did she already?
gritty raft
why would she join talon lol
valid terrace
She’s fighting in Russia with the military there
twin mantle
ah
loud quartz
yea she is just a Russian solider
twin mantle
The motherland
valid terrace
She’s closer to OW than Talon, but is allied with neither
twin mantle
f
loud quartz
OUR MOTHER LAND @twin mantle
twin mantle
wait but wasnt she protecting volskaya from talon?
loud quartz
yes
twin mantle
ah
loud quartz
bc of sombra
valid terrace
She was protecting Volskaya from blackmail
loud quartz
yes yes
valid terrace
Talon isn’t attacking Russia
gritty raft
oh yeahh
valid terrace
!!loreshorts
twilit nacelleBOT
Animated Shorts:
Cinematic Trailer: http://bit.ly/1yhzaCC
Recall: http://bit.ly/1T1Aky8
Alive: http://bit.ly/1PSJV5x
Dragons: http://bit.ly/1WAZs3c
Hero: http://bit.ly/1ToCD1E
The Last Bastion: http://bit.ly/2b3TsNN
Infiltration: http://bit.ly/2emetBC
Rise and Shine: http://bit.ly/2xcMYoH
Honor and Glory: http://bit.ly/2A4FxRa
Shooting Star: https://bit.ly/2MCgtuP
Reunion: https://bit.ly/2AJhhHo
Zero Hour: https://bit.ly/2JGfNBP
Origin Trailers:
Tracer: http://bit.ly/2fDNQxI
Soldier 76: http://bit.ly/1FpWpDB
Ana: http://bit.ly/29zamjl
Sombra: http://bit.ly/2fMt3aJ
Orisa: http://bit.ly/2liKFy8
King's Row Uprising: http://bit.ly/2p2pukK
Doomfist: http://bit.ly/2tWoWzZ
Moira: http://bit.ly/2hF7GXZ
Brigitte: http://bit.ly/2GSto50
Hammond: https://bit.ly/2lKVlU9
Ashe: https://bit.ly/2F2SPor
Baptiste: https://bit.ly/2TeM1Kq
Sigma: https://bit.ly/2JJTVWE
Echo: https://bit.ly/2IYIwRq
Other Videos:
A Moment in Crime - Junkers: http://bit.ly/2fMsVYB
Are You With Us?: http://bit.ly/2fle4Uw
We Are Overwatch: http://bit.ly/1Pd9XmJ
The Plan: http://bit.ly/2uZiitC
Retribution: https://bit.ly/2EI9RCZ
Roadtrip: https://bit.ly/2RLk08M
Storm Rising: https://bit.ly/2VOkcXh
valid terrace
Watch Infiltration
twin mantle
mk
loud quartz
they president or something was doing business with some omnics
valid terrace
It’s a Sombra vod with a follow up comic
loud quartz
yes yes
valid terrace
She’s a military provider, but is a hero to the Russian people
loud quartz
actually
valid terrace
Sombra found out she was trading tech with the enemy
frosty totem
do you think sombra will betray talon at some point?
valid terrace
Talon isn’t going after Russia
gaunt token
Talon wanted information on Russia’s new tech and hires sombrs to get them in
loud quartz
well they are going after something
valid terrace
A leader named Vialli wanted to punish Volskaya for refusing to join him
loud quartz
tech, weapons
gaunt token
But since sombra is not affiliated with talon she did the first part and then went after her own motives
valid terrace
Doomfist killed Vialli and prefers Volskaya alive
Most of that information is in the masquerade comic that the new Reaper skin is from
!!lorecomics
twilit nacelleBOT
Comics:
Train Hopper: https://bit.ly/2vaOY0I
Dragon Slayer: https://bit.ly/2GpRZRk
Going Legit: https://bit.ly/2InZUkm
A Better World: https://bit.ly/2DeJGpK
Mission Statement: https://bit.ly/2UFLC5o
Destroyer: https://bit.ly/2XcYZ9G
Legacy: https://bit.ly/2DgM1jQ
Old Soldiers: https://bit.ly/2KLILTV
Junkenstein: https://bit.ly/2Is3WZ4
Reflections: https://bit.ly/2IoZQkr
Binary: https://bit.ly/2IzNvJy
Uprising: https://bit.ly/2UCymhE
Masquerade: https://bit.ly/2IzNTI0
Wasted Land: https://bit.ly/2DeKB9G
Searching: https://bit.ly/2Gh3jy6
Retribution: https://bit.ly/2XePmHG
Mini-Comics:
Return of Junkenstein: https://bit.ly/2Gqp7Z8
Yeti Hunt: https://bit.ly/2VPmxRI
valid terrace
Sombra sabotaged the mission to get Volskaya in her pocket instead of killing her
loud quartz
so what is mccree going to do?
valid terrace
We don’t know yet
valid terrace
He feels like they are better off without him, rather than not wanting to join
loud quartz
yea
valid terrace
He can’t imagine himself as a hero
valid terrace
Yes, that’s why it’s sad he can’t see it
loud quartz
he only does missions if he thinks they are for a good cause
maybe echo will try to find him
and also
this just occurred
maybe he doesn't want to be in overwatch bc of Mina Liao
bc he was to protect her
but he failed
pliant sparrow
I doubt it
loud quartz
so is he in guilt
valid terrace
He wasn’t on guard duty when she was attacked afaik
gritty raft
. . . Moscimer is typing...
valid terrace
Unless that’s where he lost his arm, but Echo would probably know if that was the case
gritty raft
all of this is giving me a headache lmfao
valid terrace
I feel like that’s normal for this channel
loud quartz
well doesn't she say "what happened to your arm?"
loud quartz
that "Killed" jack and reyes
valid terrace
!!loreheroes echo
twilit nacelleBOT
To learn more, please visit https://playoverwatch.com/en-us/heroes/echo#story
loud quartz
hm
valid terrace
<When Liao was killed in attack on an Overwatch facility, Overwatch’s leadership was reluctant to continue pursuing such a dangerous project, and all development on Echo was shut down
twin mantle
wait was not liao the creater of echo?
loud quartz
yes
valid terrace
She was probably still active prior to all of Overwatch shutting down
loud quartz
or something like that
loud quartz
dva?
valid terrace
!!lorewiki syvatogor
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/syvatogor
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/volskaya
twin mantle
or they should put someone with that kind of mech as a hero
valid terrace
!!lorewiki russia
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/russia
valid terrace
!!lorewiki svyatogor
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/svyatogor
grand wedge
If they put someone in mechs, the better candidates are MEKA squad and Junkerqueen
loud quartz
no
valid terrace
She’s a mech battle champion
loud quartz
she has a mech
twin mantle
ah
grand wedge
She was a mech pilot yes
grand wedge
Is she still doing battles, we don’t know I think?
twin mantle
Dva is enough
valid terrace
She was the unbeatable champion, which let her claim the Junker throne by force
twin mantle
hm
valid terrace
We haven’t seen much of the arena
twin mantle
isnt wreckingball fighting in junkertown?
grand wedge
He was before he left
twin mantle
where did he leave to?
grand wedge
He is traveling the world now
grand wedge
No
valid terrace
Nope
valid terrace
He’s one of the most separate characters from the lore atm
valid terrace
Maybe he will be in Utopaea unless he goes back to Junkertown
grand wedge
He has potential to randomly get into fighting omnics in OW2
If they want to connect him with the pve
twin mantle
i sorta see him finding winston and then winston convincing him to join overwatch
valid terrace
If he even wants to
twin mantle
yeah
he would be a cool member of overwatch
i can see voicelines with mercy saying stuff like: Omg he is soooooooo cuuuuuuute
molten rune
alright so this is important
valid terrace
He seems almost like a more neutral Sombra type where he uses opportunities to come out on top
grand wedge
I just picture him rolling out of nowhere like a wrecking ball into hordes of null sector omnics because it’s fun 
twin mantle
xd
molten rune
so i’ve heard briggite called brig-itte and bri-ge-tuh
grand wedge
And leave just as he came
molten rune
WHAT IS HER CANON NAME
valid terrace
Brig-eet-ah
molten rune
that’s her canon name?
valid terrace
Rein says it and he named her
molten rune
oh ok
valid terrace
It’s spelled Brigitte
grand wedge
Like how she pronounce her name in game
molten rune
thank you lore chan
valid terrace
twin mantle
where is bastion rn
loud quartz
woth torb
grand wedge
With Torbjorn
loud quartz
*with
valid terrace
With Torb in Gottenburg
grand wedge
In Gottenburg
valid terrace
They will be connected in Ow2
valid terrace
Upgraded
grand wedge
And Bastion will be important for the story in OW2 Jeff said
lavish elm
There will likely be a mission featuring Bastion, Torb, Brigitte and Rein in Overwatch 2. There is even gameplay for it in the trailer
twin mantle
so if he is being uprgarded, do you think his hero kit will change?
grand wedge
No
twin mantle
f
valid terrace
It’s unlikely any pvp builds will change drastically
peak escarp
Bastion's kit has already been changed to match its upgrades
the Ironclad passive represents new armor Torbjorn gave it
valid terrace
Though with new characters and modes they might do more heavy tweaks
grand wedge
We’ll see - they already redesign kits to match the lore ( Reaper and his soul orbs )
They got rid of it before Moira came out
valid terrace
That was more for gameplay, since Mercy souls still exist
grand wedge
And thus new lore that was closer to Moira own powers
valid terrace
They wanted him better suited to Tank duels
Fighting Hog with a neutral payoff at the end didn’t work well
grand wedge
They exist because you need a visual to rez
But when they create a kit - it still has to fit a character - it’s part of the process
valid terrace
Souls were never canon, but they were removed from gameplay for mechanical reasons, the Rez still needs them mechanically
grand wedge
Yes
grand wedge
And that’s also a good reason to get rid of the soul globe for Reaper : both mechanics and story wise. It’s not exclusive to one or other reason
Yeah I liked the aesthetics of it
valid terrace
The listed reason in patchnotes was for gameplay purposes, though it does help for lore accuracy
Not that lifesteal is canon either
Or most abilities
That’s why the DJ makes you fast
As far as we know, less than half of Zen’s kit is canon
Because gameplay != lore
grand wedge
God where is Zen lore anyway ??? When is Blizzard soon Jeff????
valid terrace
Ow2 
grand wedge
( i know I’m one of the preacher of gameplay isn’t canon)
valid terrace
Kk just making sure for any observers
peak escarp
what's there to know? Zen was probably a shop-bot who had a spiritual awakening one day, ran off to the mountains, ran away from the mountains, met Genji, boom end of story
grand wedge
Poor Zen, I love Zen ><
valid terrace
More lore on the Shambali would be welcomed in open arms
They are one of the closest things to magic in terms of what we know
Specifically the Iris
Also I forgot to mention it earlier, but point C on King’s Row is NOT an Omnium
It’s an Omnic slum called the underworld
Junkertown is the only in game Omnium and it’s gutted and defunct
!!lorewiki kings_row
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/kings_row
serene scaffold
valid terrace
Top 5 Omnics maybe
valid terrace
Top 5 when there’s barely so many
There’s roughly 5 I can even consider
Max-Bastion-Orisa-Zen-Lynx
Actually I’d put Hector above Orisa
limpid agate
Who
valid terrace
Unnamed Omnic
I enjoy the Null Hector nickname
Do you need the Regular role to use reactions?
I’d like to mark bad links I make
limpid agate
I deleted it
valid terrace
Cool thanks
peak escarp
we really do need a name for that guy
calling him Predator/Null Hector/Mysterious Omnic gets confusing
young knoll
Hector is a good name
valid terrace
Is Mysterious Omnic his wiki name?
worthy rose
:v
peak escarp
that's one of the two things I want to see most out of OW2
who this omnic is, and what is going on with Maximilien
valid terrace
I’m mostly just hype for the campaign tbh
Like for the gameplay more than lore
But both are massive
solar sluice
I REQUIRE LORE
peak escarp
!!loreguide
twilit nacelleBOT
This is a guide for people who don't know where to begin with the lore of Overwatch. The first thing is probably to go watch the shorts. They're popular, easy to consume, and pack a lot of story and character.
Shorts Playlist: https://bit.ly/2UQyTeL
There are many comics, short stories, and blog posts as well. The most important ones are:
Binary: https://bit.ly/2IzNvJy
Masquerade: https://bit.ly/2IzNTI0
What You Left Behind: https://bit.ly/2Fh7MRz
There is also an important chain of events following Ana and Soldier 76 (and Mercy at the end):
Legacy: https://bit.ly/2DgM1jQ
Old Soldiers: https://bit.ly/2KLILTV
Bastet: https://bit.ly/2QuXHmM
Valkyrie: https://bit.ly/2CF5JVE
The rest of the stories are mostly optional. Special mention goes out to the Junkers, who have an entertaining string of stories:
Wasted Land: https://bit.ly/2DeKB9G
A Moment in Crime: http://bit.ly/2fMsVYB
Going Legit: https://bit.ly/2InZUkm
The Plan: http://bit.ly/2uZiitC
peak escarp
dig in
jaunty girder
Not sure if anyone noticed this but the guns on reapers new skin reads, "Beneath your dancing feet are the tombs of tortured men !" Just a fun fact I found.
peak escarp
it's a quote from Phantom of the Opera
jaunty girder
Kinda cool
pastel ocean
i say we call the unknown omnic assoziieren
formal crystal
limpid agate
What do you mean
Genji and Hanzo were raised by their father Sojiro.
Sojiro was the head of the Shimada crime syndicate and trained them to succeed him.
Genji was a playboy that spent a lot of time at the arcade.
Hanzo took his studies seriously and strove for perfection.
When Sojiro died, Hanzo was next in line to take over the clan.
The clan elders ordered Hanzo to straighten out Genji and make him take clan affairs seriously so he could help rule.
Genji refused. He liked his easy life.
The clan forced Hanzo to kill his brother.
Hanzo was heart broken and left the clan after he thought he killed Genji.
The clan is sending assassins after Hanzo for deserting.
@formal crystal
flint flame
kk
pastel ocean
if you mean whos the bad guy like hanzo or genji then i feel like the answer people would usually give you is hanzo because he tried to kill genji
limpid agate
I gave the full story so you can decide yourself what is considered "bad guy"
Sojiro's grooming of his kids for organized crime.
Genji's negligence to duty.
Hanzo's murder of his brother.
The elders forcing Hanzo to kill his brother.
pastel ocean
i feel like genji neglecting his duties are not the same as everything else mentioned 💀
limpid agate
No one is without fault.
pastel ocean
also i never really thought about it like that, sojiro is pretty shit
wicked widget
is zenyatta related to mondatta? or is mondatta just a big inspiration to omnics and humans
peak escarp
they were members of the same order of monks, and both had the title of Tekhartha
wicked widget
is echo an omnic?
young knoll
no
wicked widget
then what is she
wicked widget
omnics vs robots whats the difference?
young knoll
where they are made
swift mason
Does that mean Orisa isn't an omnic?
wicked widget
orisa was made by a little girl in numbani i thought
limpid agate
Or a Scion is still a Toyota
young knoll
no, she altered Orisa
wicked widget
oh right
limpid agate
Orisa was an OR15. She was destroyed. Efi rebuilt her and gave her a personality.
wicked widget
i just realized zenyatta is 20.
young knoll
I did not realize that for a while either, thought of him as a sort of older mentor to genji
limpid agate
It was Nepal.
limpid agate
You also have to realize that being 1 year old for Omnic is different than being 1 year old for a human.