Theres probably a few other ways he could die but those three are the most clear to me
#lore-discussion
pliant sparrow
grave talon
Sigma tho I feel kinda bad for. He seems nice in-game and hes the biggest candidate for switching sides from Talon to Overwatch imo
shell jay
I thought I was the only one
placid fulcrum
isn't sigma a crazy scientist not unlike moira?
shell jay
It's because Talon is using him and his abilities but I'm not sure if he knows about Talom being evil and all
pliant sparrow
Moira isn't 'crazy'
placid fulcrum
I meant like "doesn't care for safety"
shell jay
No
grave talon
His brain got all messed up from a experiment he did involving black holes, Talon saw this and "saved him" and made him think they were good, and are using him for his abilities @placid fulcrum
placid fulcrum
yikes
shell jay
He talks about check your equations and do your math so I'm pretty sure hes organized
pliant sparrow
Moira just joined for the resources they give her
Her branch of science is all she cares about
shell jay
Moira joined because she didn't like Overwatchs boundaries they put on her work
The type of crazy you're talking about is Moira's way
grave talon
Yea for someone who was stuck in space (Sigma) hes p good at math still, I think that if he does join Overwatch he could probably get the help he needs to get that "melody" out of his head maybe?
pliant sparrow
Overeatch but boundaries talon didn't, which makes me wonder if talons soldiers have been genetically changed?
Would mauga be another test subject?
Probably not to the same extent as reaper
grave talon
Tbh, they (Talon soldiers) probably are or at least the armor they wear is super strong unlike other armor. I also wonder if Baptiste, a ex talon member, will reveal more info
shell jay
I don't think Talon wants Moira using their soldiers as test subjects so probably not
pliant sparrow
I doubt talon cares about a few soldiers being experimented on
grave talon
also speaking of Baptiste, him and Sigma are probably the biggest candidates for joining Overwatch. Maybe Baptiste could tell Sigma "hey talon isnt good they killed my family". And didnt Baptiste tell Mercy that Talon was after her? He has the ties to them
shell jay
So during the Retribution Blackwatch mission when Reyes would use his Reaper abilities Mccree and Genji weren't like wtf I didn't know you could do that or is that not canon and just put that in there because they cant change his kit
@grave talon , he tells Mercy that Talon is after her?
pliant sparrow
They may have knew about what had been done to him
shell jay
Did Jack know?
pliant sparrow
Probably
grave talon
"An hour later, Baptiste sent a text message to Ros, telling her about Sainclair, and to be careful. He knew it would be a long time before he could return, and that Talon would likely keep eyes on Ros's clinic. He scrolled through Sainclair's data on Overwatch, and discovered that a Dr. Angela Ziegler was a member. He decided that if Talon was coming for her, she had a right to know. He'd need help tracking her down however, and to that end, he contacted Sombra." https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Baptiste#Story
speaking of Jack knowing, that reminds me of the interaction between Moira and him
pliant sparrow
Was it 'If I knew what Reyes had been planning...'
grave talon
Soldier: 76: You were a disgrace to Overwatch. If I had known what Reyes had been planning, I would have never allowed it.
Moira: It seems to me that it was convenient for you not to look too closely into Gabriel's business.
yea
putting it there for ppl who dont know
shell jay
Moira and Sombra seem to like making feel bad or sum shit
pliant sparrow
Moira is just in it for results
shell jay
Sombra tells people what she knows about them in dialogue interactions and Moira purposely made Mei cry in one
pliant sparrow
She doesn't care much how others view her work
shell jay
She just wants results
pliant sparrow
Yep
grave talon
Moira I feel is kinda like Sombra in the Joining So They Can Do Their Work but I think Moira may have a bit more malicious intent in the aspect of not caring
shell jay
I still dont like that she made Mei cry that interaction broke my heart
grave talon
like. how far is she willing to go? Who will be next for her?
shell jay
I think for Overwatch 2 Talon having Moira make all their soldiers genetically enhanced like Reaper would be good story and a good fight
grave talon
Yea, and if Reaper (which, this is a low chance but it is a chance nonetheless) does at least team with OW to take down Talon, he could give inside info on how to beat them
Also on the flip side, speaking of Moira modifying things. If Sigma doesn't leave Talon maybe he will be modified somehow?
its kinda scary to think abt since part of me wants something good to happen to him, but Talon Is Talon
shell jay
Brainwashed Reaper is actually still cool to me and I would love to see that in-game
grave talon
Yea, maybe there could be parts where Reyes and Reaper are like switching? Like Reyes wanting to help people but the brainwashed Reaper is like "no stop that". I hope that makes sense-
shell jay
Who do you think that family is that Reaper was stalking in the Refelctions comic
Yes it makes sense like a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde kinda deal
grave talon
I really do think its just a random family he saw and was like "I used to have that" which also makes me wonder what did happen to his family, cause it was mentioned
shell jay
When?
grave talon
it was mentioned in Ana's bastet challenge
shell jay
I wasn't able to read that story, could you please explain
grave talon
Okay so I was kinda tired when I read it so do you want the full part or just the part it mentions Reaper
shell jay
Whichever one works for you
grave talon
Going with just the Reaper part
So Jack has a picture of his ex (Vincent) and Ana is like "oh hey its that guy right?" and he says how he got married n stuff. And Jack says "at least you and Gabriel got to have families". It isn't very much elaborated on from then on
grave talon
And part of me is kinda like "Maybe Blizzard just kinda did it and forgot about it" but him looking at that family in Reflections is kinda the icing on the cake imo
Yea, I wonder what they'll do with that tidbit or if they'll just. forget it. it is sad tho :[
shell jay
Another unrelated thing I wonder is in Reaper's classic skin you can kinda see some skin showing and hes pretty light skinned even though in other skins he has that latino brown, could that be like a side effect of his brainwashing were talking about
grave talon
Yea, I've seen some ppl say its because hes undead
placid fulcrum
it wasn't a random family, the devs said so
grave talon
Oh really??
placid fulcrum
most likely his family
grave talon
damn
placid fulcrum
speaking of reaper and coloring, have you ever noticed that flash of green in his eyes in that scene where he kills antonio and mccree confronts him?
his eyes are green when he looks at mccree, then he blinks, and they're brown
could be just a lighting
shell jay
What if Reaper was brainwashed like you said, and his two 'forms' came out one was Reyes and one was Reaper, and the light skin is Reaper
placid fulcrum
but he's gone trough multiple mutations in hislife, so who knows
he has dark skin in theflashback from the omnic crisis, so he's definitely a dark skinned latino
grave talon
I decided to look back to the scene in Reflections, and the guy doesnt really look like Gabriel at all and I doubt thats his wife since hes rather old and his wife aged
placid fulcrum
could be hisson
grave talon
~~which begs the question, what is so important about this random family 
~~
actually that is a good theory
shell jay
@placid fulcrum What if Moira put something in him, this goes back to the brainwashing thing I won't shut up about, When he killed Antonio Moira smiled I think
I'm gonna watch the clip again
grave talon
What if Talon was giving Moira the stuff she needed to brainwash Reaper? Who wouldnt want the leader of Blackwatch and has a bunch of info on Overwatch on their side?
And what if they made him (or at least, side effects that made him irrational) kill Antonio to expose Blackwatch and put Overwatch in general underfire?
Talon doesnt seem afraid to sacrifice for what they see as a greater good
shell jay
What if that's why they want Mercy, for more information on Overwatch
I saw the clip, I saw the eyes, the way he stops also looks sorta peculiar to me, it also could have been the flash from alarm lights
placid fulcrum
the theory i've seen is that he killed antonio bcause antonio said he expected him, and he realized that thre are traitors in blackwatch (moira), so capturing him wouldn't do anything good, beause he'd be out anyway
grave talon
oo 👀
shell jay
oop
grave talon
Moira does act rather calm in Retribution imo
grave talon
like. standing proper still despite the fact that Your Leader Just Killed Someone He Shouldnt
grave talon
Yea Genji I think is trying to keep calm and in harmony of the situation as to not cause more chaos between the team
shell jay
Even Genji didn't stand still he pulled out his weapons because he knew they'd have to fight
But Moira stood there and kinda smirked
Also, when Reyes is about to shoot Antonio, you can see a blurry Moira in the back watching
And, when he shot Moira stood still like she expected that
I just watched some of the clip again, When Reyes says "Looks like were going with Plan B" he blinks and his eyes turn green
grave talon
I rewatched the thing and I notice, again that Genji did take out his weapon (and like I mentioned before, staying calm as to avoid chaos in the team since thats the last thing they need) and Moira is just calmly standing there
YOO
THEY DO CHANGE
like. his eyes totally lightened wth
shell jay
It's weird
placid fulcrum
told ya 🙂
grave talon
Also I saw her smirk and like
what are you hiding ma'am
its so interesting noticing all these tiny details. esp the eyes
shell jay
Yes, I'm also watching some gameplay to watch out for voice lines
grave talon
So I'm watching this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t08aMMVLzi0
and 2:13 between Moira and Mccree is a bit interesting to me
I'll of course update if I see anymore but this one was interesting Hm
quartz urchin
grave talon
also 3:49 about a masquerade could've been foreshadowing to that comic
grave talon
also right after the masquerade line she says "theres alot of things you dont know about me"
Like brainwashing our commander oop-
also the "how are you feeling, commander?" from Moira to Reyes
also Mccree mentions how calm Moira is
so we have canon acknowledgment on how calm she is which is interesting. the little details
shell jay
I just saw the "how are you feeling commander"
grave talon
also Moira says "You did the right thing Gabriel, no need to apologize" and going by the Moira Brainwashing Him Into Reaper this almost seems like "Hey keep doing that"
shell jay
This is a theory video wondering if Moira was already working with talon
So apparently Jack and everyone not in blackwatch didn't even know that Moira was in Blackwatch yet, reaper unofficially enrolled her
grave talon
Hmm
pliant sparrow
Pretty sure the lightening of the eyes was confirmed not a sign of brainwashing
placid fulcrum
really? where?
grave talon
the assassin stuff?
shell jay
In retribution the Talon sniper
grave talon
YEA
grave talon
how would a Talon sniper get powers similar to Widow and Reaper? Who (Widow and Reaper) have been experimented on? Moira
the Talon sniper was probably a test to see how it would've worked
shell jay
the way the sniper rematerilizes is just like the way moira teleports
The assassian may also have abilities given to by moira but I think they're just fast
grave talon
the assassin is fast as fuck boii
grave talon
the "genetic" stuff in the Talon ppls bios?
shell jay
When doomfist escaped moira was supposedly still with overwatch but in his origin story shes with talon
I'm just now getting to the talon ppl
Ok that video just made this way more true
pliant sparrow
I cant remember where exactly but this was discussed a few months back
Not the sniper but Gabriel's eyes changing colour
shell jay
Yes
Ok so Moira was definitely working with Talon, I do think myself that she brainwashed Reyes and that's what's up w the eyes and her smiling when Antonio was killed
grave talon
and also probably part of how she got up higher ranks in Talon was by Reyes
shell jay
Yes
Archives is returning soon, there probably won't be anything new but if there is hopefully its Moira and Talon lore
But they'll probably just bring back the same modes and not add anything tbh
grave talon
ive seen some ppl say that there could be something abt Talon since we got some Talon skins but with OW 2 coming out they may wait
shell jay
Then again with no new lore that means no skins
Welp, its 2:40 AM where I live and I'm tired so I'm gonna sleep now, maybe we can brush up on this topic another time
grave talon
Alright, this was very fun and I actually learned some stuff :]
shell jay
Agreed, this makes me hopeful for future lore
limpid agate
We were told Archives won't have a new gamemode
placid fulcrum
but archives is a special event, that doesn't necessarily mean there won't be any (past) story missions in the core game in OW2, surely?
I'll be massively disappointed if that's the case
pliant sparrow
What?
lament prawn
have you seen the trailer or any news about OW2 ever
because story missions are kinda the whole point
placid fulcrum
I meant set in the past
lament prawn
oh
if there is, it will probably be very minimal because their goal with OW2 is to take the story forward
we've had pretty much nothing but past so far
placid fulcrum
and yet we still don't know why we're fighting
shell jay
Hopefully one year for Archives we get the battle that happened at the Swedish watchpoint that ultimately led to Soldier and Reapers 'death'
placid fulcrum
if I understand Taigavia's comment correctly, we won't have any new archives missions?
limpid agate
archives is probably a dead event
We won't get @ new mission in 2020
And they said they will add/remove events
Archives will probably expire
placid fulcrum
let's hope that the reason it expires is because these missions will become part of the PVE in OW2
shell jay
I just want to get skins that i wasnt able to get such as the Blackwatch skins or the talon ones
peak escarp
the Venice report confirms that Talon soldiers are genetically enhanced
no confirmation on whether that us Moira's work or not
shell jay
Most likely to me
peak escarp
shell jay
I mean theres a lot of evidence pointing towards it yet no official confirmation
peak escarp
I disagree that Reaper is brainwashed into joining Talon
blackmailed maybe, or manipulated in some other way, but he seems to be in full control of his mind
shell jay
True, perhaps the eye changing color was just the nearby alarm lights, however Moira did seem too calm in that situation
peak escarp
I'm glad someone else noticed his eyes changing colour
when I mentioned it before people told me "it's just the lighting"
it's not the lighting
shell jay
I would love to see a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde deam with Reaper
peak escarp
Moira was calm because she was observing the results of an experiment
not Reyes's mind, but his body
and a sudden change in impulsiveness would be enough to make her cock an eyebrow
placid fulcrum
the changing of the eye-color could be a result of the changes in his biology, not necessarily mind control
is it just me, or is there one extra name in those documents under talon leadership?
antonio, doomfist, maximilien, vialli, and ???
Sanjay?
peak escarp
Antonio [lastname], [unknown name], Maximilien, [firstname] Vialli, [unknown name]
Akinjide's name is mentioned earlier in the document, so one of the unknowns shouldn't be him
Sanjay could be one, but he looks kinda young
placid fulcrum
mte
would be very interesting if it turns out there is some other council memebr operating in the shadows that we don't know of yet
peak escarp
there were a few empty seats at the council table, and a few people whose names we don't know
there's definitely more of them
found it
placid fulcrum
this is such a huge, visible difference
peak escarp
also, Reyes is fairly light skinned - it's not unreasonable that Reaper would have pale skin on his arms
some artists draw him far darker than he is
placid fulcrum
his skin color changes from artist to artist, same as mccrees
placid fulcrum
the colors in the comic are good for establishing that he's a minority without saying it. but then we have the mccree problem, where sometimes he's drawn very dark and some people think he's a latino as well, but then he's drawn very light and what the hell even?
peak escarp
McCree isnt latino
placid fulcrum
he does have that zorro skin
peak escarp
Zorro?
placid fulcrum
zorro the mystery man
in the game it's jsut "mystery man" but it's obviously inspireed by zorro and "mystery man" is zorro's nickname
zorro is latino, and then we see mccree with zombra ina mexican bar. i've also read somwehere that he knows spanish? not sure if the last part is canon
peak escarp
it's not inspired by Zorro
its inspired by old timey radio plays
McCree speaks 1 word of spanish in a comic
Zarya speaks 2
placid fulcrum
but we know zarya's ethnicity. we can't be sure about mccree's. he was born in new mexico, wikipedia tells more than half of the population is hispanic
placid fulcrum
oh, that makes sense
peak escarp
and the yellow skin is a reference to Dick Tracey
McCree's skins are all references to literature and Hollywood cowboys
placid fulcrum
Makes sense
peak escarp
which is why I want him to get a musketeer skin
placid fulcrum
though regarding the use of spanish, I looked at the comics, and mccree does speak two words. most importantly, he speaks them to himself, while zarya only repeats a greeting from a spanish person. there's a difference, though I agree that it's not enough to declare mccree a latino
peak escarp
a lot of Americans, particularly in the southwest, know some Spanish
shell jay
I can confirm that yes slot if Americans know Spanish here
In the Southwest
Mostly Arizona, New Mexico and SoCal (where I live) and that's mainly because were right next to Mexico and we have a lot of Hispanics including myself
Also, latino cowboys were very common in the Southwest
Mccree could also possibly be Indian/Native American
placid fulcrum
welp, I guess both interpretations are good
shell jay
Despite his race, hes still pretty white-washed considering the country accent and 'American-ness' of him
He also could be mixed American-Latino mixed, possibly his mother or father was mexican and the other was white, one died or left and he was raised by the american parent
shell jay
He's based off Hollywood ones correct?
peak escarp
he's based off Hollywood cowboys, like Charlton Heston and John Wayne
shell jay
Ones in old westerns
peak escarp
yeah
he's probably a white mutt, like most Americans
not enough of any one heritage to really claim it
shell jay
I share something specific with Mccree and I would love to see him share a race w me
true
placid fulcrum
like I said, at this point nothing has been officially confirmed, so we can all have our headcanons
shell jay
I do think he could be mixed, y'know? For representation
peak escarp
what makes you special? I would like him to share a race with me
placid fulcrum
alright, then I officially declare him half white/half latino. no need to fight over this.
shell jay
agreed
peak escarp
shell jay
Yes
peak escarp
here's who he's named after
shell jay
I know hes name after that guy
placid fulcrum
meanwhile let me sit in the corner, salty because there are already white american and latino characters in the game, but no polish character
shell jay
A jamaican hero would be cool too
peak escarp
I just want them to hurry up and confirm that Mako is Maori already
grand wedge
Yes please
peak escarp
they've already hinted at it hard enough
placid fulcrum
that might cause problems
shell jay
Native American, Jamacian, Hawaiian, New Zealand, Polish would all be cool to have and still more
placid fulcrum
if he isn't a maori, then he's essentially wearing a blackface with some of his skins
if he is a maori, then the fact that he covers his face is bad, because maori have sacred facial tattoos
iron plume
Jamaican would still be pretty cool but I think we're not getting another Caribbean for a while after Bap
the fuck no it isn't
peak escarp
not all maori have face tattoos
placid fulcrum
really? guess I got the wrong info, then
peak escarp
the tattoos are sacred, but not everyone gets them
shell jay
True, Baptiste was a great addition with being Caribbean and all since those countries are lesser known @iron plume
peak escarp
mostly because they're face tattoos
shell jay
What about a Filipino hero?
peak escarp
and global society is put off by those
iron plume
out of the Europeans, the mediterranean is notably short handed
but we're like
fine on Europeans
shell jay
Greek hero would be cool and we have a fucking Italian map so idk why we dont have an italian hero
iron plume
Iberian or Balkan would be nice too
peak escarp
I want a middle-eastern male hero that defies the stereotype
iron plume
gib Hamid
shell jay
That would be great
I want heroes with disabilities and mental health issues to relate to even though it wouldnt matter
placid fulcrum
I want a hero that shares ethnicity with me, but I'm resigned to the fact I'll never get one. nor should there be hundreds of heroes in the game with barely any lore just so that every player can feel themselves represented
shell jay
A deaf hero would be amazing
peak escarp
as a Canadian, I am absolutely thrilled to have Sojourn as my representation
she is the perfect hero to show Canada's multiculturalism
limpid agate
I'm just glad its not another character from Quebec
peak escarp
that too
shell jay
As a Latino who lives in Southern California, I love having Sombra representing Mexico and Reaper representing Latinos and maybe Mccree
limpid agate
90% of the time, the Canadian character is either from Quebec or a Yeti.
placid fulcrum
I wouldn't be picky. anyone from poland, or with polish ancestry. anyone
hell, if someone had but one polish grandma, I'd be thrilled.
shell jay
Puerto Rican hero would be cool
peak escarp
Ana was in Poland for a while, so there was some mention
placid fulcrum
um, a character passing through your country is not a character that represents it
iron plume
I'm good with Zarya
if only her VA actually spoke the language
peak escarp
she was there when she got shot and lost her memory
shell jay
I want to see spanish convos between Sombra and a Puerto Rican hero
peak escarp
I want Baptiste and Widow to chat in French
placid fulcrum
ah yes, poland, the country where ana got shot. what a thrilling representation. makes me proud to be polish
limpid agate
It has potential to become a map
placid fulcrum
that would be nice
shell jay
At least the heroes representing your heritage aren't villains @placid fulcrum
shell jay
Since were already stereotypes to most middle aged white people
placid fulcrum
soldier is not a villain, and he's the whitest anyone can be
well, moira is a villain and irish, so i cna see why it would be upsetting
shell jay
I'm talking Reaper and Sombra
placid fulcrum
yeah,~~ the double agents~~
shell jay
Double agents?
peak escarp
it's not a secret that Sombra is working for herself
shell jay
True
placid fulcrum
either way, helpng out the heroes isn't very villainous
peak escarp
she's playing all sides to her advantage
shell jay
At least Reaper was formerly a hero
Also, in both Mexico maps and southern California map (hollywood) theres references to gangs
Los Muertos Gang
which is another stereotype to latinos
Hopefully it changes though, its good lore anyway
peak escarp
the Canadian map is Toronto, which doesn't represent the west coast very well
shell jay
Toronto is one of the only Canadian cities I know
limpid agate
Who cares if the local hero is a villain.
Theres nothing wrong with it being a villain.
shell jay
It's not necessarily good representation
For mexicans
But your right it doesnt matter anyway
limpid agate
So
I disagree
Let's look at the reverse argument
Lets say you create a gang
Now you want to choose the least offensive origin for this gang
Where do you choose?
shell jay
I would choose canadians considering how nice they are 🤷🏽♂️
placid fulcrum
oh my god, you guys have heroes and maps and complain, meanwhile here I am in my corner, salty for not being representated in ANY way
shell jay
You make a good point
limpid agate
So don't let it be a factor in the decision making
Unless it will cause she global controversy
Like if Zarya were to be a lesbian
That would cause major political problems
placid fulcrum
how would that be.. oh right, russians
shell jay
Because homosexuality and Russia-
placid fulcrum
I've read the reflections comic was banned in russia
shell jay
Yeah it was
placid fulcrum
mccree could be gay. should be, in fact, because how dare he turn my girl ashe down. she is perfect in every way
placid fulcrum
then he is an asshole, who doens't deserve anyone
iron plume
let's set the shipposing aside shall we
and he explains why pretty well in their interactions
placid fulcrum
oh please, please!
shell jay
They probably are into eachother & just have a love hate relationship
placid fulcrum
even if they were not lovers in thepast, they might be in the future
placid fulcrum
😭
iron plume
shipposting is shitposting
placid fulcrum
hey, talking about shipping isn't shitposting. it's part of the lore, after all
iron plume
it is when the ship has no basis in lore
shell jay
For example, Genji and Mercy have Valentine's ship lines
@iron plume if the ship makes no sense then yes
iron plume
and is a pure headcanon "what if tho"
placid fulcrum
excuse me? mcashe is the best developed relationship between unrelated characters in canon
iron plume
it's not a matter of making sense
shell jay
Ashe and Mccree could be possible, but Hanzo and Mccree is less possible judging by the fact that they'll never meet
iron plume
you can argue about any ship making sense for days
but that doesn't make them lore
placid fulcrum
I will never understand mchanzo. literally anyone would make more sense being shipped with mccree
iron plume
McHanzo exists because they were literally the sole two middle aged somewhat attractive men at the time of McCree's release
placid fulcrum
they both admire each other, so possible
shell jay
They are both celebrities after all
iron plume
!!loreonly
twilit nacelleBOT
This channel is for serious discussion strictly related to the lore of Overwatch. Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
placid fulcrum
i assume dva will eventually join overwatch. she has no connection to the narrative at the moment
this is lore!
you may not like it, but it is
placid fulcrum
it's clsoer connected to the lore than arguing what ethnicity the future characters should be as per our preferences
iron plume
if that's what you need to tell yourself
placid fulcrum
hanzo, dva, junkrat and roadhog all have no connection at the moment, but I expect them to have one in the future, because otherwise it's a waste of character
shell jay
Characters having possible relationships can deepen some plot lines, you dont like shipping I get it, but at least were not shipping two people who may never meet like Zarya and Sigma or Junk and Rein @iron plume
placid fulcrum
this
iron plume
It doesn't matter if I like it but okay
and that you're not doing the even less relevant thing doesn't make what you are doing relevant
shell jay
@placid fulcrum I think hammond was only added for his kit
placid fulcrum
oh right, forgot him. also not connected to the story
shell jay
He makes no sense in the the lore
placid fulcrum
actually, now that i think about it, neither is symmetra, or ashe, or so many others
pity
shell jay
Symm is connected to Lucio
Ashe may try to get Echo back
Symm may show up in the Rio mission
iron plume
not everyone is going to be in on the direct fight
placid fulcrum
hence where shipping enters into the lore: if ashe gets together with mccree, she's liekly to join the fight for his sake
shell jay
Some have their own battles too
iron plume
...
shell jay
I think Ashe may try to steal Echo, and Symm may show up in the Rio mission considering that's where she is rn
Orisa has no official connection to anyone besides Lucio
placid fulcrum
btw, speaking of mccree and the main story, I wonder if his "unfinished business" has something to do with hunting down reaper
shell jay
Lucio may ask Efi if Orisa can help in Rio
I believe he has a connection to her
And Genji may invite Zen
There are heroes who may invite others who they have connections to
placid fulcrum
genji might invite hanzo
shell jay
Zarya has no connection to any of them
shell jay
True
Lynx might join the fight or stay on the sidelines
Baptiste will be useful for info but how will they get him?
placid fulcrum
he warned mercy, and knew her in the past
shell jay
No one really knows him expect Mercy maybe
iron plume
if Bap and Mercy already met overwatch might reach out to him
placid fulcrum
yup
shell jay
For Talon info possibly
iron plume
my hope was that he'll be the one who joins instead of Mercy but w/e
I don't think he has much current Talon info
noble field
hoping hanzo will get his shit together and potentially join overwatch
iron plume
but they could always use a trained fighter and medic regardless
noble field
however it would be interesting if he went to Talon
placid fulcrum
hammond knows winston, so might join for him
shell jay
I'm glad we dont have to worry about how Mei and Bastion will get to Overwatch
grave talon
Even if characters like D.Va, Lucio, Hammond, Junkrat or Roadhog dont really have any connection to Overwatch, they still help the world they live in feel more big and show what life is like
placid fulcrum
the junkers could join because junkrat's "treasure" might be something valuable to one or both sides. or because they hate robots and talon supports null sector
shell jay
I feel Null Sector will attack Junkertown and because of their hate for bots they'll fight, overwatch will get there and they'll meet Junkrat and Roadhog
placid fulcrum
we already know lucio will join. and yeah, dva is already saving her country, so she will be glad to help the rest of the world
but we're running into a rpbolem here
grave talon
ah shit forgot abt Lucio x_x Roadhog will probably be like "hey this is my home and robots arent gonna destroy it again" and Junkrat will probably join in
placid fulcrum
in that most characters are leaning towards overwatch
shell jay
They'll also meet Hammond in Junkertown possibly
placid fulcrum
at least some should join talon for balance
noble field
Another good candidate is Pharah
shell jay
Pharah and Ana will join together possibly
shell jay
I believe Pharah is unaware that her mother is alive
placid fulcrum
jack will enver pass on the opportunity for a fight
placid fulcrum
ana mentions sending the letter to her and not getting a reply
grave talon
oh yea def Jack I think will have problems with reuniting OW, but may join to finish the fight
placid fulcrum
I expect a lot of banter between him and winston
noble field
just be aside
placid fulcrum
imagine being repalced as the leader of the organization you co-founded by a gorilla
shell jay
bruh 💀
placid fulcrum
what? i don't think so, no
noble field
I really want to see more stuff on Sombra and Baps relationship (not shipping btw)
placid fulcrum
from the way jack talks about him, i had an impression he's a civilian
noble field
i too am confused about Vincent
shell jay
I thought they worked together
placid fulcrum
maybe early in the army, before the enhancement project?
shell jay
If he was in overwatch he could join and him and Jack may meet again.
iron plume
he is a civilian
shell jay
Oh
shell jay
Vincent has kids
placid fulcrum
let's face it, overwatch does poorly in terms of romantic relationships. everyone is ina relationship with some whatshisface and whatsherface who are barely connected and are more plot devices than people
noble field
^^^
iron plume
I wouldn't call that poor
noble field
i can agree to some extent
iron plume
It's better than forcing everyone into pairs
lament prawn
romance isnt OW's thing, it was never meant to be
placid fulcrum
who says anything about forcing?
iron plume
you know what I mean
noble field
like they're implying Genij and Mercy's relationship A LOT
placid fulcrum
you wanna talk about forcing, how about forcing the introduction of 50 different characters, half of whom are barely connected to the main story or not at all
shell jay
They did say "these characters are yours you can do anything you want with them" in a way
noble field
that by itself it controversial
lament prawn
overwatch: the current game is prioritizing competitive gameplay over anything else, so they're not gonna stop introducing heroes for the sake of lore
placid fulcrum
character relationships are important to the lore. relationships are what drives people in times of conflict. what motivates them to risk their life.
iron plume
That doesn't change with relationships not being to other heroes
lament prawn
said relationships dont have to be romantic
placid fulcrum
emily sucks as a character
shell jay
ah shit, here we go again
placid fulcrum
she's "tracers girlfriend" and that's all that can be said about her
noble field
YO
shell jay
Yes?
grave talon
from what ive seen shes nice, i wish they did more with her tbh
lament prawn
huh
iron plume
and how does that disagree with "relationships are what drives people in times of conflict. what motivates them to risk their life."
noble field
you siad Emily suck. i was just messing around
placid fulcrum
I prefer relationships between people I care about. not between one perosn I care for and some random background character no 57
noble field
anyway
lament prawn
i didnt say that lol
iron plume
this outlook being flawed in the first place aside
shell jay
I would like to see Emily as a character but Tracer and Emily fighting together in game has always seemed weird to me
placid fulcrum
at this point, i'd rather watch tracer interact with winston than with emily
noble field
oof i read it wrong it was dreamfisher
placid fulcrum
and I'd rather see fanart and fanfiction exploring her relationship with winston (not romantic) than with her girlfriend, who is supposed to be the msot important person in her life. because the girlfreind is an undeveloped background character
iron plume
They could so with expanding NPCs
but that's not the same thing as making them heroes
placid fulcrum
I mean, is torbjorn fighting with his daughter ok in the game?
or reinhard with her?
games are already non-canon
I don't mind emily not becoming a hero
just as long as she has some character and importance to the story beyong being some rando who kissed tracer in a comic once
iron plume
on that I agree
shell jay
I often forget shes British
iron plume
but it has nothing to do with them being heroes
placid fulcrum
true. but them being heroes shouldn't stop them from dating for some magical reason. i'm talking mcashe here, who were perfectly developed
iron plume
did you like
actually listen to McCree
They're perfectly developed as a one-sided relationship
lament prawn
i agree that they should flesh those characters out more, but being more interested in tracer interacting with winston or something similar isnt a bad thing, theyre both key characters in the plot and they dont have to force the lover into it like every movie ever, i actually like that most of the relationships are platonic or familial
iron plume
^
placid fulcrum
and I hate that it's one sided, because ot's the ONLy well-developed relationship in the game
noble field
@placid fulcrum see i think about that sometimes with Genji and Mercy.
iron plume
...how
noble field
"but them being heros shouldn't stop them from dating for some magical reason"
iron plume
even with the hints being mild, Genji and Mercy are developed much further
shell jay
Genji and Mercy having a thing for eachother have been highly hinted that yet never confirmed
noble field
yes
placid fulcrum
true, i'll give you genji and mercy
but mcashe would be second. in a roster of over 30 heroes, isn't that sad?
noble field
I dont ship btw. but i do like those two
iron plume
and that's putting aside all the clearly platonic ones
no it's not, because overwatch isn't a romance game
placid fulcrum
it's also not a freindship game
so if friendships are allowed, so should be romance
shell jay
I dont like ships that dont make sense
placid fulcrum
like mchanzo
iron plume
it's not about being "allowed"
noble field
^^^
placid fulcrum
that one makes no sense
iron plume
but it's not "sad" that we don't have much romance
noble field
As much as this may piss everyone here off
placid fulcrum
but relationships that make sense are great to have
shell jay
Like McHanzo for example, they'll never meet, or WidowTracer because they're enemies and Tracer is dating someone else
noble field
Pharmercy is also non sensical
placid fulcrum
instead of everyone dating randos
agreed about widowtracer and pharmercy
especially since mercy knew pharah since the latter was a little kid
ew
shell jay
To me Pharmercy is a game strat, NOT a ship
iron plume
dating "randos" makes more sense than what you're proposing
that's not true about knowing her
placid fulcrum
but ti's not interesting to watch or speculate about
iron plume
we know they met once, that's about it
placid fulcrum
give me lore I can actually find engaging
noble field
I want to see Genji and Mercy happen personally. Becasue its about time we could use a heterosexual relationship between heros. So i just feel that its could very easily work.
BUT... i wont choke up if it doesnt happen
placid fulcrum
what
shell jay
During Storm Rising is when I felt the most gency
iron plume
there's other reasons for pharmercy to not happen (Mercy's dislike of professional soldiers being the prime one), but that isn't one
placid fulcrum
ana, tornjorn's and widowmaker's marriages not straight enough for you?
noble field
i dont call it "gency" ugh cringe.
jk
there alot more in depth about my opinion on this but i dont want to annoy anyone
iron plume
I'd like to see more exploration of their relationship, whether romantic or platonic
noble field
and get called out for shitposting
placid fulcrum
anyone who calls lore-related discussions shitposting because they're ona t opic that doens't personally interest them, is the one shitposting imho
iron plume
ah, the "no u"
classic
shell jay
Shitposting is memeing, shipposting is just debating a relationship
placid fulcrum
yeah, which is lore-realted and wtherefore perfectly fit for this channel
noble field
see like, i dont want to sound like a shipping fanboy... But seriously... You're going to make implications like chocolates and gifts on Valentines day and white day, the letter in reflection thats quite literally looks the same. and all those storm rising interactions. the dinner line.
placid fulcrum
don't like it, create a separate one
noble field
and then turn around and be like "TECHNICALLY they're just friends".
i just feel would be disappointing
placid fulcrum
which is what happened with mcashe, which i hate
there's plenty of friendships in the game, but 99% of relationships are background garbage
iron plume
you've heavily misread some hints if you think that's what happened to mcashe
noble field
and YES i do know that romance is barely if not, not even a priority for Chu
placid fulcrum
doens't have to be a priority
noble field
eh true i guess
placid fulcrum
with background randos, yes
shell jay
I want to see a characters relationship develop and begin instead of oh btw these two are dating teehee
noble field
oh so like Emily, Vincent, Sam, Efi etc?
placid fulcrum
well, you did get that with genji and mercy, sort of
right now they just excahnged chocolates and letters. it's the begininng of a relationship, but doens't necessarily mean they're already an item at this point in the timeline
wait what, efi, the 10 year old girl, is ina relationship?
bit early
😂
shell jay
middle school intensifies
shell jay
I meant romantic
placid fulcrum
obviosulyt romantic, because I fele like platonic relationships are well-portrayed
then again, I'd love to see deeper exploration of the platonic relationship between mccree and reaper
noble field
Also the Hippocratic oath agrument for Mercy irks the hell out of me
laughs in Mass Effect
placid fulcrum
considering that genji broke all contact with other blackwatch agents after blackwatch was suspended, but mccree still kept going on missions ordered by reyes (king's row, searching for ana), even after their fight in retribution and the fact that reyes no longer has formal authority to order him to do anything
and then when reyes betrayed overwatch, mccree explicitly refused to pick a side
and even now he refused to rejoin overwatch, and instead sent echo
so despite all the mean-spirited interactions he ahs with reaper, he had A LOT of loyalty to reyes
noble field
REALLY interested in McCree's deal in OW2
iron plume
him refusing to join OW seems to have more to do with his low opinion of himself
shell jay
Considering that genji cut off connections w everyone EXCEPT mercy points to potential relationship to me
iron plume
rather than past loyalties
placid fulcrum
not just mercy
iron plume
especially since new OW is led by none of the same people as old
shell jay
Who else?
noble field
Winston
placid fulcrum
he has an interaction with multiple overwatch emmebrs where they say "he lieks us better"
iron plume
Recall isn't really the same
placid fulcrum
Tracer: Must be hard for us to gather intel with Blackwatch sidelined.
Genji: I wouldn't know.
Tracer: Don't you talk to your old teammates?
Genji: No.
Tracer: You talk to us, though.
Mercy: He likes us better.
shell jay
The recall
Everyone in overwatch got that
Doesnt necessarily mean he was in connection with winston and tracer @noble field
noble field
ugh
iron plume
?
noble field
its like everything i say gets shut down. good lord
placid fulcrum
I mean, they literally say that he likes them better and continues to talk with them, but not with his blackwatch teammates
shell jay
Sorry about that m8
noble field
nah its cool
shell jay
When did he say that? In havana?
iron plume
in Storm Rising, yes
shell jay
Oh
iron plume
he also has an interaction with Moira where she says he's more talkative and him saying "I like the current company better"
Moira: Much more talkative now, aren't you, Genji?
Genji: I find the company more agreeable these days.
shell jay
I genuinely enjoyed the storm rising and retribution modes than the kings row mission
iron plume
I can definitely see him cutting off comms after the split, but it's equally likely that he wasn't too open to BW people in the first place
Uprising was basically a proof of concept
placid fulcrum
either way, genji stopped interacting with reyes, but mccree not only continued their interactions, but also continued to follow reyes' orders. that speaks volumes about the respect he had for the man
iron plume
McCree caring for and respecting Reyes more is a double edged sword
placid fulcrum
and i'd like to see more of that relationship in the future
iron plume
Genji not giving a shit for him means his opinion didn't ultimately change much
placid fulcrum
especially with the storng hints that mccree might be the one to kill reapr
iron plume
but McCree caring for Reyes means he has further to fall
placid fulcrum
agreed
iron plume
we saw the cracks in Retribution
placid fulcrum
hopwever, he specifically stated that he wouldn't interfere with talon's attack on the train, if it weren't for the fact that they used blackwatch tactics, which personally offended him (and because he suspected he'd be getting the blame)
iron plume
He got involved with the attack because he realized they would kill people
he wasn't about to get involved with a simple robbery but that crossed the line
placid fulcrum
hm, true, i misremembered
shell jay
I think Mccree cares for Reyes because he somewhat saved him from the Deadlock gang
iron plume
He was McCree's mentor
placid fulcrum
mccree was one of the leaders of the gang
so the only person reyes would've saved him from is... himself
iron plume
But that's a big part of it too
shell jay
Exactly, he probably thought of him as a close friend, brother, or father figure of some sort
iron plume
and ashe
who was obviously not good for him
shell jay
I dissagree
placid fulcrum
also, he was only 17 and ashe's backstory strongly implies that deadlock gang was a family for people who didn't get along with their birth family
so I like to imagine that reyes was a father figure to him
shell jay
Maybe that's what Mccrees 'unfinished business' was, Reyes saved him from a life of crime so maybe Jesse is trying to return the favor
placid fulcrum
which is sad. but also very deep and tragic and i want to see more of it
oh, i'd love that
mccree was one of the leaders of the gang
but it's also possible that reaper has something to do with mccree losing his arm
shell jay
No I think that was Ashe
iron plume
...when?
shell jay
I think she had B.O.B rip it off
iron plume
no
placid fulcrum
the devs confirmed it wasn't bob
shell jay
O
placid fulcrum
ashe was just throwing threats at the wind
iron plume
Twitter
placid fulcrum
anyway, we know mccree had nothing to do with switzerland attack, he didn't pick a side. but then he lost his arm later on, and it's implied to be a very touchy subject for him, sicne he refuses to share it with anyone who asks
so I can see reaper behind behind it
not just some random bandit
iron plume
Twitter
placid fulcrum
also, mccree goes from not picking a side, to saying it's "fitting" for him to kill reaper
and generally saying lines implying he very much wants to kill him
that's a huge change of attitude towards reyes
but losing an arm to him could definitely explain it
iron plume
so would realizing that the person you took as your father figure/role model/mentor was the bad guy all along
shell jay
I was going to suggest the train attack but mccree had already lost his arm
In Reunion
placid fulcrum
he ought to have realized that when reyes started the rebellion
also, notice that he doens't ask "what happened to you?" unlike many other characters (mercy, ana) like he knows why reaper is still alive and what's become of him
like they've met post-switzerland
iron plume
that sounds like a stretch
Reinhardt doesn't ask it either
shell jay
I dont think Rein had a close relationship to Reyes like others
He may not even know that hes Reaper
iron plume
He was there since the strike team days as well
but yes
McCree isn't confirmed to either
shell jay
Hm
placid fulcrum
but he certianly had a close relationship with reyes, so finding out will definitely be hard for him
hey, wait, he must suspect something
someone had to teach talon blackwatch tactics
and reyes was the person who taught them to mccree
iron plume
there's a lot of blackwatch people who defected
as well as at least one "proper" overwatch member
McCree likely is in the group that would recognize him if they ever met in person
placid fulcrum
probably, yeah
though I've gotta say, reaper is nothing like reyes in his speech or behavior
reyes was actually a pretty laid-back fun guy
reaper is very serious and sinister
iron plume
we see glimpses of Reaper in retribution Reyes
it may well have gone downhill from there
placid fulcrum
true, but still would it be enough for jesse to recognize him without reaper hinting at it?
iron plume
if it's enough for Ana and Jack, it should be for McCree
although that might be referring to his looks
McCree saw Reyes's ghosting in action in Retribution so that would make it easier too
placid fulcrum
good point
shell jay
I'm listening to Storm Rising interactions and apparently Winston pays taxes
Who's Dr. Chao?
Mercy brings her up in a conversation between her and Winston
pliant sparrow
What was the line?
iron plume
she's in charge of Lucheng
and was involved in the colony
brisk hinge
thonk*
yep
By the way, in the zero hour why is a french police officer there to defend from the null sector but no one else?
shell jay
"Dont forget Winston,you need to be mindful of your bone strength. Especially if you're going to be bouncing around like that"
"I've been taking my supplements"
"You spent a lot of time on the moon, you need to take it seriously. Remember Dr. Chao?"
"I wonder how shes doing, it can't be easy running a giant company"
"Last I heard, they were working on a new space station"
iron plume
the french cop is just the only person they met
iron plume
one presumes they were busier with evacuation than "defending"
brisk hinge
wow
shell jay
Possibly she was the only one in that area
iron plume
when that level of shit hits the fan, you get the civilians out first
brisk hinge
thats weird
iron plume
in the New York battle in the first avengers we saw like two cops
brisk hinge
I would expect like an army or something
iron plume
and the only thing they did is get the civilians out like Cap told them
an army takes time to mobilize
it's what would be there if not for overwatch
brisk hinge
it depends on how long ago the attack started
iron plume
after the cops take care of what they can immediately
brisk hinge
with a city of that size, there has to be more people that got left behind
iron plume
it's a superhero story
iron plume
if superhero stories involved the Big Bad being defeated by competent law enforcement and military, they'd perhaps be more sensible, but they wouldn't be superhero stories anymore
(see: Avengers, The)
brisk hinge
hopefully we get to know more about the aftermath of the attack when ow 2 rolls around
and how the city responds to it
(The mayor, Leader of France, ect.)
limpid agate
I doubt we will
Zero Hour was the prologue to Overwatch 2
There are more problems across the world
Null Sector is launching a global invasion.
iron plume
I can see France being mentioned off-hand as the country first calling to reinstate OW
limpid agate
If invasion is the right word.
iron plume
but not much beyond that
brisk hinge
hopefully
am i the only one who wants to know more about pharah?
the devs dont pay much to her
limpid agate
Most characters arent too important
I want to see more of Helix as a whole
They are the only organization I can see reasonably becoming the third enemy faction
Everyone else is too small or local
brisk hinge
im hoping pharah gets involved with some stuff related to ow activites in ow 2
i hope ow gets involved with the recoveries after natural disaster
like maybe a earthquake hits Haiti again, maybe Baptiste gets involved with the recoveries as well with overwatch
just a possibility
lament prawn
i wonder how many missions we're gonna get on release, and how frequent they'll be afterwards
jeff said it'll be equivalent to a full on campaign mode you'd see in other games, on release im assuming
brisk hinge
im expecting at least 1 mission for evry hero
i honestly don't know what to expect from them
lament prawn
no, thats way too much
limpid agate
We were told not every hero will get a hero mission, and not every hero will be in the story.
lament prawn
hero missions maybe, but not the actual story missions with dialogue and cinematics
brisk hinge
the announcement for overwatch 2 felt a little rushed
limpid agate
Based on
brisk hinge
i feel like they only announced for fan service
it just seems a little strange
same with Zero Hour
limpid agate
I dont understand.
lament prawn
its clearly not something they decided to do last minute
its too much content and preparation
limpid agate
Like... What would you say is a non rushed announcement
lament prawn
i think they mean too early
lament prawn
players needed to know why there's minimal content for the current game, thats one thing
and yeah there's no release date, but it could be this year or early next year for all we know
limpid agate
Rushed games are the ones that get release dates
That's why they often get pushed back
So they're not rushed anymore
brisk hinge
im not saying the game itself is rushed
limpid agate
And if they do release by the deadline
Its usually a rushed product
Not having a release date isn't a sign that the game is rushed.
Nor that the announcement is rushed
Especially not if it comes with gameplay footage and 2 different gameplay demos.
A rushed announcement is something like
brisk hinge
I just don't know anymore
lament prawn
the amount of content we saw and the fact that they didnt give us a release window is saying one thing about how far into production they are, while the rumors about the release being this year or early next year are giving me two very different ideas of how much they actually have done. the former says super early, some of the missions arent even in production yet while the latter says theyre in the last quarter of production. i want to hear some other takes on this.
pliant sparrow
That skyrim announcement was probably because bethesdas reputation was buried underneath a flaming dumpster fire
iron plume
yeah
prime example of a rushed one though
Diablo 4 might be one too, for similar reasons
although not to the same magnitude as tes6
pliant sparrow
Diablo 4 was done very well so I doubt it was rushed much
That animation was too high quality too have been made in the time period between Hong Kong and Blizzcon
iron plume
it wasn't in response to HK
it was in response to Don't you guys have phones
And yes the announcement itself was done well
but there's still an air of "we would've liked to hold off on this"
I don't have the insight of their inner workings obviously but I feel like if the Immortal outrage didn't happen, D4's presence this year would be "yeah we're making it more info later"
frosty shell
Chu did say the McCree would recognize Reaper
But he doesn't know who he is yet
I'm pretty sure
peak escarp
we weren't given a release date/window when Overwatch was announced back in 2014, were we?
Overwatch took 1.5 years from announcement to launch
but they had already been working on it for at least a year before than
valid terrace
Ow2 is also a smaller undertaking
peak escarp
seems like the same with OW2 - they've been working on it for about a year, and it will probably take 1-1.5 years past announcement to be released
valid terrace
Even if it more than doubles the game, having such a developed base speeds up progress quickly
peak escarp
and wouldnt it be fitting to launch OW2 around the 5th anniversary of OW?
valid terrace
Maybe at the cost of archives but that’s fine I suppose
peak escarp
it will be worth the wait
and it wont be nothing until OW2 - there's still the promise of at least one more hero, more info on Echo, and more lore
limpid agate
Echo will probably be that 1 more hero.
Also, India map was suspiciously left unconfirmed for OW2, just like Echo.
We may be getting that before as well
worthy rose
hopefully new zen lore
shell jay
Let's say Tracer's chronal-accelerator get shot, damaged or broken, kinda like in the doomfist origin story, what would happen to her?
peak escarp
she would get un-anchored from the timeline and need to be relocated and given a new chronal accelerator
she'd be blinking in and out, unable to touch anything or be touched
shell jay
Surprisingly most characters are younger than I thought, Zen is only like 20 and Winston is 29 I believe
peak escarp
yep
placid fulcrum
On the other hand, Sombra and Mercy look at least a decade younger than their actual age.
placid fulcrum
Sombra looks and acts 20 at most
peak escarp
you must not know many 30 year old women
placid fulcrum
McCree has the opposite thing going. He looks over 30 even in pictures where he's supposed to be 17
I am a 30 year old woman
peak escarp
I'm a 32 year old woman, and I think Sombra seems her age
placid fulcrum
She acts very juvenile to me
She reminds me more of my 20 year old sister than myself and my peers
peak escarp
she reminds me of myself
placid fulcrum
Btw, it's nice to meet another woman in her 30s in fandom. It's uncommon.
peak escarp
yeah
I don't get the complaints about Mercy though . . . she doesn't look that young
and when people try to re-draw her to "look her age", they make her look like she's in her 40s
placid fulcrum
I mean, again compare her to mccree, they're supposed to be the same age, but in missions and photos set in the past there's a striking difference in how they're animated or drawn in comics
limpid agate
He looks over 30 even in pictures where he's supposed to be 17
shell jay
Mercy looks young because she uses her healing abilities to make herself look young
placid fulcrum
that was disproven by devs, wasn't it?
peak escarp
yes
shell jay
Sombra probably just has a good skin care routine
peak escarp
Mercy looks young because a) 37 isn't that old, and b) she takes good care of herself
you know who else is about that age?
Lucie Pohl, Mercy's VA
and she doesn't look that old
placid fulcrum
but then you have mccree, who looks young in the reunion short, but then he's drawn looking like this:
peak escarp
that's more because of artistic interpretation
there's a lot of inconsistent art in the comics
shell jay
this image I cant-
peak escarp
yeah
shell jay
I'm legit dying rn
peak escarp
tbh I like Mercy's OW2 design because the short hair makes her look older
also in general, the in-game models make all the heroes look younger and softer
the concept art gives them more unique looks
placid fulcrum
she looks like she jsut died on the inside
placid fulcrum
or like the photographer has been trying to get a good shot for the past 15 minutes and she has to stand still with a smile
worthy rose
She looks late 20's to me at the least
29 but that's just my opinion as a young 21 person
limpid agate
Sombra looks young because she has a small head.
peak escarp
her VA is 34
limpid agate
shell jay
She also wears a lot of makeup
peak escarp
compare her game model to her concept art
placid fulcrum
honestly, she looks like a teenager to me in this image
peak escarp
her concept art looks 30
her game model looks younger because it's rounder and her eyes are bigger
shell jay
She does look older in her concept art
But compare this to her in Infiltration
I cant send the image because im not a regular yet
placid fulcrum
put it up on imgur and post a link
shell jay
She looks kinda Asian in her concept art tbh
worthy rose
I am asian and I disagree
peak escarp
her game model and short model have bigger eyes and a longer chin
I wish her game model looked more like her concept
shell jay
I think her game model looks fine
peak escarp
also I just noticed she wears guages in her ears
everyone is getting updated looks in OW2
peak escarp
I hope Zarya's new look references her military background
shell jay
Hopefully D.Va's, Moira's, and Sombra's are good, theres a lot of room for creativity there
I do enjoy Bastion's hat
peak escarp
I love the visual storytelling of Torb and Bastion's redesigns
Torb is casual, dressed for retirement, and Bastion has a smooth new chassis and Torb's old hat
worthy rose
Part of me hopes Zen get's something but I can't think of functionally what that would be
shell jay
I just realized that that was Torb's hat
peak escarp
for a while I thought he'd get new monk robes, but then I remembered he left the Shambali
placid fulcrum
so what was that "global conspiracy" that sombra discovered, which is why she had to erase her identity?
peak escarp
there's a few theories about it
one theory that I really like is that it's just a passive observer (and the same thing the Shambali worship as the Iris)
Sombra being Sombra, panicked and erased her identity because anything with that much information just has to be using it to gain power over people, right?
placid fulcrum
looking up sombra's quotes and I found this:
Sombra: You know, I've seen Reinhardt's Overwatch file.
Brigitte: What are you getting at?
Sombra: I wonder if he's really told you the truth about his retirement.
are there any theories on that?
peak escarp
someone suggested he might be suffering dementia or some other form of brain damage, which caused him to botch a mission and get forced into retirement
placid fulcrum
ouch
if overwatch was really anti-omnic, reinhardt might've been forced into retirement because he was against it
we don't know when echo was turned off, but the fact that mccree had the key suggests it happened before overwatch was disbanded
which is a pretty mean thing to do to an agent, but I can see overwatch agreeing to it, if that's the price they had to pay to be allowed to operate in UK
and then there's that "overwatch anti-progress" line in the comic
placid fulcrum
that only makes me beleive it stornger than he was forced out due to the omnic thing
peak escarp
why?
placid fulcrum
because he's still employed at the time of retribution, reyes jokes about making hima apart of the team
peak escarp
they don't mention omnics
placid fulcrum
which emans that his departure coincides with overwatch suddenly being allowed to operate in UK
how does overwatch go from being distrusted and not allowed to interfere, to being invited?
peak escarp
they weren't allowed
placid fulcrum
they had to have a deal with the uk
peak escarp
they went in against orders
placid fulcrum
not tracer's team
peak escarp
what do you mean then
placid fulcrum
I mean that overwatch had a deal with the Uk to be allowed entry. as part of the deal, omnic agents had to be let go, because uk hates omnics
reinhard disagreed with that, so he was let go too
peak escarp
where was this said?
placid fulcrum
it's only a theory
peak escarp
what's your evidence for the theory?
peak escarp
okay
placid fulcrum
- mccree had the key to echo's box thing, which suggests that she was shut down when overwatch was still in operation
peak escarp
what does that have to do with them being allowed to operate in the UK?