But why would she need one
#lore-discussion
limpid agate
clever silo
She could deserve one for the same reason any other hero deserves any kind of arc- because the writers have an interesting story to tell about it that they think the audience will be enjoy
silver idol
how so
limpid agate
Because 90% of the time people say Widow redemption arc
They follow it by talking about her "breaking her brainwashing"
Which also isn't really the case. She was genetically engineered and conditioned to be the perfect killer that feels little, but gets a surge of life whenever she removes one from the world.
silver idol
isnt the brainwashing already "wearing off"? widow mentions gerard on maps sometimes. in the comics, she visited gerard's grave. i'm pretty sure in one of her interactions, she says something like "[being emotionless] is the point, isn't it?"
limpid agate
She's not completely emotionless
silver idol
maybe whenever she's waiting to kill, it starts wearing off, but when she kills again, a high comes on her
limpid agate
Its suppressed.
Likewise, I do not see any of her Gerard lines as a sign of it wearing off.
She respects his memory.
That is all.
silver idol
Ok
limpid agate
She's never once shown regret for killing him. Just regret that he had to died.
silver idol
That's probably the case because when she speaks about Mondatta she says she felt alive killing him
I'm not sure she doesn't regret killing him
peak escarp
she doesn't feel the emotional connection to him that would make her regret killing him
silver idol
That's the case im thinking
if she had not killed gerard then she probably would not lament about him as much
peak escarp
she doesn't regret killing him
she sighs and whispers his name because she misses him
she remembers being happy with him
silver idol
ohhh ok
peak escarp
she does seem a bit frustrated by her inability to feel positive emotions though
her tone when she answers Moira seems frustrated, and she's been surrounding herself with things that should provoke an emotional connection (Gerard's grave, her family's manor)
but it isnt working
peak escarp
maybe she can't break her conditioning, maybe Talon did too good of a job
peak escarp
they are confident enough in her conditioning that they let her have freedom to go visit his grave, buy her own house
they know it won't break
it's not like a lot of other scifi where human weapons are locked up constantly, or have their memories wiped every day
they trust her on solo missions
silver idol
could she leave talon or is she too loyal
silver idol
oh ok
peak escarp
she's almost like an addict in that sense
silver idol
yeahh
worthy rose
why is widow so damn blue
silver idol
slowing her bloodflow right?
peak escarp
yes
slower heartbeat means more steady aim, and poor circulation means bluish skin (according to the rules of OW)
worthy rose
why does moira have one deformed hand
peak escarp
because she experimented on herself
silver idol
its the one she experimented on
peak escarp
and it didn't go well
worthy rose
why did she experiment on it
peak escarp
for science
worthy rose
does anyone know any good videos that explain all of the lore so far? id like to know more but cant be bothered going through each post
prisma wren
all of it is pinned
worthy rose
@everyone is moira a man or a woman?
peak escarp
Moira is female
vale junco
is there proof or anything pointed to the fact that lucio is black
friend doesnt believe me
i need to prove it
peak escarp
if your friend can look at Lucio and think he isn't black, I'm afraid your friend is an idiot
vale junco
no he said lucio just has dark skin
vale junco
ok smth like that but point is he said he isnt black is there any proof that he is black
like pictures of parents
peak escarp
no
peak escarp
only his character design, which clearly depicts him as a character of African descent
are you the same person who asked about this before?
worthy rose
So Mercy, Zenyatta, and Lucio are the only heroes left with no representation in the lore
And Mercy and Zenyatta will probably receive new lore in the near future
harsh shale
worthy rose
The pinned message does not count that comic
Which is reasonable since she only appears in one single panel, that's not really representation
bright edge
we literally have so much on mercy, we know her biotic technology, she was part of team in archives operations both uprising and storm rising, we know she worked in overwatch science team alongside moira (that was more blackwatch thing) She is working as doctor now and doesn't think high of overwatch, she is the one responsible for new body for genji
worthy rose
We also have a backstory for Zenyatta and Lucio, doesn't mean they have representation in the lore (in Lucio's case this is obvious). Having a backstory is the bare minimum because you can't make a hero without any piece of backstory
devout sable
Mercy has this problem that she's been featured in a lot of lore, but doesn't actually have a lot of lore her own
no shorts or comics
worthy rose
She is mostly a supporting character for the stories of other characters like Genji or Tracer, but has never been so far the protagonist of her own story the same way that many other heroes have been
craggy vessel
Plus the fact she isn’t actually alive
Look at her no pulse emote.that actually might mean more than we thought it did
worthy rose
Eh, I doubt it
I think Blizzard put it in the game just to make fun of the people who think she is evil
worthy rose
"Sometimes I wonder why I even bother"
limpid agate
@craggy vessel Mercy is not undead
The emote is just a joke that you, the person she killed, has no pulse
desert basin
i do want them to remove. The rushing with shield into the fronline potg cinematic from Brigitte's option list. I also want them to re-write her lore if they insist on this patch. Which also goes directly against what is being advertised and what she actually is.
desert basin
not the bash
the other one. where she rushes to the frontlines apparently blocking a bastion in his turret form and lands a hand to a teammate
limpid agate
Shes also very much a frontline hero still by design
Shes just bad
Lucio does her job better
desert basin
thats my point
limpid agate
They're not gonna delete her lore because shes bad
desert basin
they should. when you consider aside from some of the funny ones that were made for laughs and giggles all of the ptg cinematics are in fact inline with the characters that they tied to. Her being a squire of Rein and not able to go into frontlines directly contradicts with the lore character design and her ptg cinematic
devout sable
@craggy vessel it literally doesn't mean anything
@desert basin her potg cinematic or gameplay balance are completely irrelevant to the lore
desert basin
if i want to play a hero. With a face value. And read her/his role about it before give it a go. To try to form an idea about the character in question and what does she do, it should give me an overview a simplified version of what she is capable. With that in mind it is directly relevant. Now your counter argument probably goes like this. Lore is not a place where you learn characters therefore it is has to be related and they can do whatever they like. In that case i want a lore that she accidently lands on the moon with a makeshift jet pack and makeshift
astronaut suit. That would seem out of place or even stupid but that is how representative she is with how she will be played(If at all) and what is being written in her lore. Lore has to be the backbone of the character where her toolkit what does she looks like, her place are all coming from lore.
lament prawn
rewriting the lore just because they rebalanced a character would be silly. the lore isnt there just to support whatever the character can do in-game, its a universe they lovingly crafted. in a competitive team based shooter, balance has to come first, but they wont change a character's lore because of it
do you also think they should rewrite mercy's anti-violence "overwatch was shut down for a reason" trait just because they gave her an unlimited mag during her ult?
spice lynx
sigma being dutch is the best ever I love his voice lines great, and ofcourse the dutch character is super smart 
desert basin
i also found that some what miss informative. Look all i am saying they should. All right. A player should not be forced to go between overwatch pedia to dozen different sights to learn what the character is capable. It also establish connection between fan base and the dev team not only that it creates two way communication and it creates an image that they actually care.
clever silo
I can’t tell if you’re just shitposting, or have never played a game with a story before
desert basin
i played games with the story don't worry about it.
spice lynx
its more of a side story
tbh
the game is the most important, story must always come in second
lament prawn
they've taken the characters and written a full-fledged story out of their universe, a story that is probably more or less set in stone which they're looking to tell us soon. what the character can do in-game is for a balanced multiplayer expeirence with hints of their characteristics in their emotes, lines, and highlight intros. tracer can blink more than three times in a row in the lore, and doomfist is more of a behemoth that can't merely be taken down in a 1v1, etc
worthy rose
Exactly, the gameplay bends to the lore, otherwise Reaper would be able to use Wraith fom forever
spice lynx
and remember guys, its for entertainment, if you're way too serious about it you might lose your joy in it
clever silo
Sombra can’t hack the Volskaya robots in the game, so do you think they should change her story because she does that in a cinematic?
worthy rose
Is Resurrect even canon in the story?
clever silo
No
lament prawn
her EMP probably isnt canon either, imagine how overpowered she would be essentially disabling any electronics in her vicinity in a futuristic universe (probably including omnics)
if we take it as the EMP that we know today, she would render tracer's accelerator useless and would make her go into the void again
desert basin
Yes tracer can blink more than 3 times. In the cinematics correct. But in gameplay she can still blink only limited to 3 because of the game balance. But take Brig opens her shield and shield goes down in on average 2 seconds(hero dependent). Which makes no sense. It is not even a tracer type thingy with unlimited blink. It is outright false.
clever silo
How do you know how much damage whoever is shooting her shield in the lore is doing?
lament prawn
wow, how are you complaining about that? characters have abilities in the game that they don't even have in the lore..
desert basin
based on character information from other sites
clever silo
You know how much damage is being shot at Brigitte’s shield in her origin story?
lament prawn
her shield is weak for balance reasons, that's it, making her shield useless in the lore too would be dumb
clever silo
Based on character information from other sites?
desert basin
well not in her origin story my point was her being yanked out of the front lines are against her lore. The shield part came inside of the context with the PTG cinematic
lament prawn
honestly if we look at the bigger picture, now she lines up more with the protective mechanic than her previous murder rampage gameplay style.
clever silo
But the game isn’t canon in the lore
pliant sparrow
Reinhardt has been seen killing many upon many bastions and taking a lot of fire from them in turret form with his barrier, and yet a single bastion melts his shield in the game
lament prawn
unlimited MEKAs from the sky
desert basin
jupit. In 2-2-2 scenario none of the versions of brigs were in a murderous rampage. Comp itself was an indirect nerf to her and rightly so. Anything over that was overburden. That goes for every other character that was pre nerfed.
Back to the topic. Of lore. Take sym for example they changed her to dps. But lore stayed the same and rightly so. She was a support now a dps. Because what she is capable is more or less still the same
Take brig what she was capable was in line with the lore
what she will be capable is not. And for the third time i am not forcing anyone to change it. I am just saying they should when they can if ever.
ofc if they are thinking of changing her more morphing into something else perhaps then changing now would be counter productive.
lament prawn
if we take this as an actual issue, then there are way bigger ones than that
again, characters can do stuff in the game that literally cannot happen in the lore, and im fine with that because its for balance reasons
characters can also do stuff in the lore that they cant in the game
desert basin
yes having an unlimited amount of blinks would broke the game. Having a shield but afraid to open it because it might go away in mere seconds is not. or vice versa. You get my meaning
clever silo
Why should they change the lore because of changes to gameplay?
I don’t understand your argument for it
desert basin
consistency between the lore and the game itself where the characters based on.
clever silo
Why is consistency between the lore and the game important? Why should it be maintained?
As strictly as this
lament prawn
whether or not her rework makes her too weak competitively is another topic, personally i agree that her shield is too weak now even for gameplay balance, but in general reworking a character's abilities doesn't have to alter the lore as if the lore only exists to support the abilities. the lore is something else that can be enjoyed in its own way. brigitte's emotes, voice lines, highlight intros, etc all line up with the brig we know from the lore
desert basin
Well first of all. It would possibly does the game a favor. Where people will not be forced to from site to site. All of the information would be in the overwatch game site itself. Directly tied to the lore. Explained in detail. Along with the story bits.
Second, the new comers would have easier time to understand what is what and who is who. Whether they are here for story and lore or competitive game play
Third, when it comes to balancing and reworking existing characters it will give a nice framework to the devs themselves to maybe remind them what the character is created for.
at least my take on this
desert basin
information about lore and the characters within gameplay in detail are in different sites.
peak escarp
gameplay is not canon and never has been
clever silo
They’re on the same sites
worthy rose
The Overwatch gamepedia usually has both an in-depth backstory section and an elaborated gameplay section with tips and tricks for a character
lament prawn
a hero's purpose as the game evolves can change over time, but the lore doesnt have to follow suit. it would be bad writing if they made her weak and useless in the lore just because they were limited by game balance, which doesnt make any sense - the lore isnt a game. you're treating the lore like this lower thing that merely exists to support the game. no, its a story in and of itself that they're revealing bits of as time progresses, and the devs have said that overwatch is a franchise that they plan to expand on, be it through a film or other games - who knows?
desert basin
in detail they are not. If i read the character information about Brigitte. We would come to the conclusion of she is a frontline support. Except that she is no longer.
peak escarp
she still is in the story
clever silo
I will show you specific examples, they very much are on the same sites in detail
peak escarp
it doesn't matter how she plays
worthy rose
And if I read the gameplay section of Mercy I'd think she's a nutjob who mass-shoots people from above
desert basin
which contradicts with itself which ever you take as a cannon
worthy rose
Whereas in the lore she's a pacifist
clever silo
On this site, you can see the exact numbers of all her abilities, read a very well written summary of her story, find links to all of her lore appearances, and find links to videos of her gameplay,
desert basin
https://playoverwatch.com/en-us/heroes/brigitte/ i was talking about the main site.
but yeah i guess you are right
worthy rose
Blizzard's game sites never spend too much time on the lore, that's true for every game
clever silo
The main site shows her story and her abilities, neither in as much depth as Gamepedia
peak escarp
Now Brigitte fights at Reinhardt's side to protect him, and any others in need as knight and squire journey to make the world a better place, one battle at a time.
desert basin
yeah that was the root argument
peak escarp
this part hasn't changed
worthy rose
For example in Warcraft no one ever cares about the info on the official game site, they just go on Wowpedia
desert basin
@peak escarp yeap
peak escarp
and there is no need for it to change
desert basin
Icaro would not be better if they actually did.
peak escarp
it is still her character
desert basin
how so ?
lament prawn
because that's discussing her actions and desires in the lore
she can fight alongside 5 talon members in the game
desert basin
i was on about it being more representative of gameplay. Not completely butcher the story.
but anyway i see your point. I am not sure if i was clear enough
peak escarp
lore does not have to represent gameplay
not a single hero's abilities in the lore match exactly to how they are represented in the game
lament prawn
forget brig not being a frontline protector, what do you think of mei not being in the battlefield at all in the lore?
desert basin
but they are giving you an idea what it is for. Numbers may differ. From lore to gameplay. But difference between the lore that brig has and gameplay she has. You can fit dubai towers in there horizontally.
About Mei. Yes. Exactly. How in the world did she mixed up in this. Did she take on offer of winston. Why winston sent her a distress call about overwatch in the firstplace. How did she come to wield the power of freezing. She was a climate change activist and a scientist.
peak escarp
her numbers may have changed but her personality has not
Brigitte is still Reinhardt's squire and will fight by his side
lament prawn
"Why winston sent her a distress call about overwatch in the firstplace. How did she come to wield the power of freezing." did you even watch her short
desert basin
it completely changed her personality at least for me.
Yes probably i will go insane Icaro
I did. The the antartica thingy. She was put a stop to it by making people understand that global warming is killing the world while they lost in their own petty arguments. And somehow she does that by freezing? What was the transition. At any rate Icaro is right.
actually all of you are right. I was looking for consistency in a place i should not.
lament prawn
you're looking for consistency in a place that shouldnt be forced to have consistency
worthy rose
The main lore of Overwatch is in comics and animated shorts, the only lore-thing the game has are the Archives missions and the interactions between heroes
ruby jewel
is sigma blind
timid eagle
@ruby jewel No, he isn’t.
fickle sail
what info do we have on sigma? i dont know much about him.
peak escarp
fickle sail
ah thank you
worthy rose
he has control over black holes and one of his abilities is that he summons a black hole to suck away bullets such as zaryas ult
fickle sail
cool...?
lament prawn
i like the trailer they just dropped
its what we usually get but the part with tracer is cool
i dont recall them ever using emotes and victory poses in these, and they seem to have made new poses just for mid-blink there
nothing crazy, but its nice
peak escarp
they do use emotes and highlight intro in ability showcases like this
compare it to Baptiste's
lament prawn
yeah the highlight intros are what im used to, and what i meant by emotes is manipulating them and using small bits to work with the shot
this looks new though
oh i can upload pics? cool
worthy rose
one of us now
peak escarp
maybe because Tracer's blink doesn't read as nicely as they wanted for the trailer
so they had to add extra frames?
lament prawn
seems so, but in the cinematics she briefly disappears for the blinks, not moving quickly as she does in her highlight intro
is that the retribution map in the background on the menu?
peak escarp
I think it is
lament prawn
yeah i dont know if its just me but it looks more dimly lit
i wonder why they'd go for that instead of horizon
peak escarp
because he has more of a connection to Talon than to Horizon?
spice hatch
Because gravity, gravity is a harness
iron plume
He's not from Horizon
there's a talon connection plus his whole classical music thing
cultured af
spice hatch
I mean, what goes up, will eventually go down
lament prawn
the map feels a bit different too, but i think its just missing the red alarm lights
its also missing the table thingy in the middle
peak escarp
yeah
iron plume
the menu versions are often slightly different from actual maps they represent
mostly for clutter
peak escarp
good time to get some Talon screenshots
lament prawn
have they done something of this kind before? outside of an event, i mean
lament prawn
this is cool, i like it
iron plume
something of what kind? changing the map menu?
lament prawn
yeah
spice hatch
I mean like, to understand gravity, is to comprehend the shape of the universe
Makes sense right ?
iron plume
Brig's eichenwalde menu was modified
had rein's truck on it and more autumn-ish lighting
lament prawn
oh, neat
peak escarp
it looked like sunset
iron plume
or that
spice hatch
And understand the harmony that hides beneath
iron plume
okay but what does that have to do with him being on horizon
spice hatch
Because the universe is singing to him and because I live on that colony
I might be high
To understand gravity is to comprehend the shape of the universe
iron plume
I might be high
that was my leading theory
peak escarp
you're not being helpful @spice hatch
spice hatch
I’m sorry
lament prawn
he is more related to talon, since he's not related to horizon at all, but in all the promotional stuff so far they put him on the horizon map due to his connection to gravity and space, and i assumed they'd do the same for the menu considering ive never seen them do this before (though now i know they have)
spice hatch
I do
iron plume
what map was for Baptiste's in-game screen
peak escarp
I don't remember
iron plume
no
Havana was made after Baptiste
okay yeah it's horizon gibraltar, same as the video
worthy rose
Wasn't it Paris?
iron plume
i made an oops
worthy rose
Iirc they were released at the same time
iron plume
paris was earlier
they don't double dip on maps heroes and events
well except for archives maps but they don't get a normal version right away
peak escarp
Baptiste's skin event had nighttime Gibraltar
iron plume
roight
spice hatch
Well to be fair, except for Baptiste’s event, he was on every maps from what I can see on google
I might be wrong
iron plume
?
spice hatch
The menu, was every maps, no ?
iron plume
the hero launch menu theme always keeps one map
peak escarp
it usually stays on one map when they're new
peak escarp
check streamers' vids
peak escarp
lol
spice hatch
Can I have your opinion guys on a question ?
Blizzard was really productive first year, with fresh cool new events and content, a lot of animated shorts, etc, why aren’t we getting more content now ? I mean, they did not fire that much employees and they even got new ones, what are they doing ? I know about that OW 2, is it for that reason in your opinion ? Any movie one day ?
iron plume
Blizzard was really productive first year
That's called marketing and they did a lot of that in the first year because it was new. Now the point of adding new things is mostly to keep the existing fanbase, for which a steady smaller stream is more efficient
I mean, they did not fire that much employees and they even got new ones
The fired employees were largely from publishing and marketing (the other kind) and has to do with losing Destiny over everything else. The reason why a largely same workforce seems to do much less work is that on release you saw the result of several years building up
worthy rose
I don't think they'll make Overwatch 2 but they might add more PvE events or even some PvE missions for certain heroes
iron plume
whereas now they're released at the same pace they're made if not slower
spice hatch
I just feel like they could do more
iron plume
I know about that OW 2, is it for that reason in your opinion
Possibly, if the rumors are to be believed
spice hatch
And I’m sure I’m not the only one
iron plume
Any movie
lolno
spice hatch
Wow needed 10 years for a movie
iron plume
warcraft existed before wow
spice hatch
I mean, they did not do it in 10 years but you get the idea
iron plume
and yes, they've had decades of buildup and history as the biggest game in the world, and also a massive backlog of lore and stories to use
spice hatch
I feel like it’s just sad that they made their pace slower, the ow universe is just sooo rich, it’s such a waste imo
iron plume
and the movie was still a disappointment businesswise
Overwatch has trace to nil chances of a movie any time soon
movies are fucking hard
spice hatch
I mean, the day they’ll decide that ow got its time, I feel like we could had more lore
Idk if it makes sense
iron plume
good to know that's not happening any time soon either then
and that's kind of a wash of a statement
you could've said "we could have more" at any amount
spice hatch
They said a while back if I’m not mistaken that they have at least 5 years of hero planed tho
iron plume
which is my point
spice hatch
I understand, my thoughts are just a little fuzzy tbh
I just feel like we could use more content, that’s all
iron plume
i mean
obviously
spice hatch
But I’m just an OW normie to think that I guess
iron plume
i'm just explaining why the pace slowed
you know, your question
spice hatch
Yeah yeah
Thanks
I think I need some rest tbf
Good night
Thanks for answering my question tho
lean prawn
so does zen float in the canon?
iron plume
yes
lean prawn
ok good seeing him walk is going to be really fuckin weird
knotty sentinel
Sigma has more lore than Zenyatta
reef dagger
Poor Zenyatta.
I mean, that's not entirely true. We know of his background, and his relationship with other characters.
But nothing shows him directly yet
peak escarp
you could say the same about Lucio
reef dagger
Well, Lucio is even more vague
At least we know Zenyatta is an essential part of Genji's backstory, and that he had a slight ideological difference from the rest of the Shambali
(They're obviously based on Buddhism, so, I'm really interested in seeing in how those ideas transfer over to their own beliefs. That said, I doubt any Blizzard writers want to seriously tackle details about Buddhism. They aren't ZUN, I suppose)
Zenyatta believes in spreading their ideas through personal mentorship, like a Guru, while Mondatta seemed to want to go for a more dogmatic approach.
gilded kettle
is there ANY lore for lucio?
peak escarp
mostly what's in his bio
there's also an article about the launch of his debut album from 2015
gilded kettle
thanks
lyric bobcat
worn mica
worthy rose
Zenyatta lore
celest fulcrum
Zenyatta teaches how to juggle.
worthy rose
3 years and literally 0 zenyatta lore
paper gazelle
Go raid Blizz HQ if you're that impatient then
paper gazelle
Tbh Goodman had said about the characters' lore in an interview:
I wish we had time to do all of them. I think all these characters are itching to have their stories told.
The devs have other projects in the works
I know it feels like 2 decades waiting for Zen lore (but that's actually Valve soon), but come on, I'm pretty sure Zen lore is coming this year (maybe as a short). Jeff has hinted that
worthy rose
Bruh zen lore is def coming this year cause everyone pissed their pants
crimson olive
Tbh I'm not really interested in Zen lore, it's never seemed all that intriguing to me
worthy rose
The animated short will most likely be about Mercy and Baptiste, with cameos from Sombra and Talon. Zenyatta will probably have a comic or short story, which is enough to flesh him out more
gentle kelp
I would love to see another shimbali member as a hero or another student of zen
worthy rose
Do you think there is actually any significance to sigmas melody?
I figured it was just music that was playing in the asylum and he got spooked by it
limpid agate
@worthy rose There's a theory that's it's supposed to be this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musica_universalis
@gentle kelp Don't think we need another monk. Also not really looking to another student myself when we already have many other potential heroes, and Genji is a very important student to Zen
hasty surge
also question:
I'm sure everyone knows that Winston is from Lunar Horizon Colony and of course Lucheng would too
rare cipher
ashe has big boobs
hasty surge
(also see voiceline with mercy and winston regarding him jumping around and a reference to a Lucheng Scientist)
correct me if I am wrong
but it seems like Lucheng doesn't know what happened to the Lunar Colony
and it also seems they did not ask Winston to/Winston did not give his account on what happened there
Why not?
spice hatch
Did that guy Xenkem got banned ?
hasty surge
Just ignore
spice hatch
Yeah but I can’t find him on the server, I was like « did he left or did he got banned »
peak escarp
this isn't the place to ask about that
hasty surge
That winston did not say anything
Because this concerns at least 6 human lifes and more and also his best friend
And we do not know if winston is trying to establish connect as well
peak escarp
hmm
hasty surge
It almost seems that he chose to gave up on his best friend
peak escarp
that's a good point
hasty surge
Also do you think that winston would escape without the other winston?
peak escarp
what do you mean?
hasty surge
It's a question
peak escarp
Do I think that Winston would escape without Dr. Winston?
hasty surge
I don't think overwatch winston would not leave scientist winston?
peak escarp
he already did
hasty surge
Yup
peak escarp
Dr. Winston was already dead when Winston left the moon
hasty surge
Is that confirmed?
peak escarp
Not everyone liked life on the Moon. All the tests, and the rules. The others hatched a plan. No more injections; no more experiments. Then the doctors - my friends - they were all gone. There was nothing left for me. I couldn't stay. They didn't want me anyways. So I escaped to Earth - my new home.
if Dr. Winston had survived the ape uprising, I don't think Winston would have left him behind on the moon
which is just one more piece of evidence for Dr. Winston being dead
peak escarp
he left Hammond behind, maybe because he couldn't find him or because Winston thought he could fend for himself
hasty surge
The phara you showed
sharp axle
Is ashe and mcree romantically involved
hasty surge
Where did you get it? (okay the video LOL)
Uhh I think what we know is that ashe likes mcree but mcree doesn't
peak escarp
McCree doesn't go for rich people
peak escarp
maybe it'll be a mission for Newverwatch
hasty surge
it would likely be
but also the way that he says that they are all gone
it seems like they are ejected out
peak escarp
that's the implication
the apes tampered with the airlock, Dr. Winston called an emergency, all the scientists got tossed out the airlock and killed
hasty surge
It also seems like only Dr.Winston had his suit on
And winston woke up to the scientist being gone
And that he doesn t exactly know what happened
peak escarp
the other apes made the plan without him
Winston was a friend of the scientists - if he was in on the plan, he would have warned them
peak escarp
why?
silk reef
E
spice hatch
https://youtu.be/Vrbd_uQZf4w here’s a good vid for sigma lore
spice hatch
I love his vids as a fan of lore, guess I’m not the only one hehe
spice hatch
He deserves more subs to be honest in my opinion
humble thicket
Who is the robot from the reunion short
worthy rose
That scene was so cool
With Mercy flying down from the skies and lending her her hand
lament prawn
probably means nothing since the teaser clips are seemingly random and not canon, and they were probably reusing assets
ikr? i always go back to that shot
i need a mercy short, and i hope youre right in speculating the next one is baptiste + mercy
worthy rose
I think it will be that after the Baptiste short story
Plus it has the potential to involve multiple characters
limpid agate
I dont think it means anything.
I dont even think its supposed to be the same character
worthy rose
Furthermore as you said Mercy looks so good on cgi
lament prawn
yeah same, more than likely a reused asset
yeah, just visually she has a lot of cinematic potential
pliant sparrow
She has a comic
stray spindle
No
peak escarp
yes
pliant sparrow
Oui
paper gazelle
不
peak escarp
its interesting that Sigma was on Horizon at some point
I wonder what he was doing there
peak escarp
he has a map interaction for Horizon ("I never thought I'd be back here. It's beautiful . . . and cold."), but he also has a few incomplete interactions that seem to be aimed at Winston
peak escarp
"Do you ever miss it? Being out in space?" or "Do you ever miss it? The Moon?"
"He was a good friend...and you were much smaller back then." (Probably referring to Dr. Winston)
silver idol
hmm
peak escarp
I can't wait to hear the response/other half
peak escarp
there'll be more coming in a few weeks
silver idol
good
peak escarp
Jeff said to expect something "when people are going back to school"
I'm hoping for a short and a map (since we usually get those around now)
although an announcement about the comics would be nice
silver idol
a short would be cool
i would like a symm short or for someone with basically no lore to get a short
peak escarp
I'm torn between wanting more development for a hero with little lore (Zen, Lucio) and wanting a short that progresses the story (Baptiste going to see Mercy)
I want everything
lament prawn
a mood ^
lament prawn
that one was great
clever silo
the last bastion was a short, it was nice, but it didnt advance the story very much
lament prawn
it told a great story with no dialogue
clever silo
it didnt tell much of a story
lament prawn
it told the story of how bastion came to be
the shorts never advertised solely progressing the main plot and nothing else
knowing more about characters, where they're from, what happened to them, etc is nice
clever silo
i agree, but the last bastion
peak escarp
The Last Bastion helped explain part of the history of the omnics, and the omnic crisis
devout sable
@peak escarp Baptiste and Mercy getting a short, with some involvement of Sombra and Moira, maybe?
peak escarp
why Moira?
devout sable
Idk, Oasis? may be nearby?
hasty surge
@peak escarp cause he seem surprised that they were like suddenly gone
Is like Winston wasn't there when it happened
peak escarp
he could have been (locked) in his room
wouldn't have to be asleep to not be aware of something
silver idol
how did baptiste get out of talon?
lament prawn
have you read WYLB?
peak escarp
he went AWOL during a mission he didn't like
hasty surge
I would assume if he was locked in his room he would knew that something is up
peak escarp
he knew the other apes hatched a plan
hasty surge
He could have found out the same way when he woke up
peak escarp
either way it's a bit of a leap to just say he was asleep based on that
peak escarp
Overwatch agents have been sighted in Quebec, Eastern US, Guatemala, France, Poland, Niger (Numbani?), Chad and Algeria
in "recent months" from when Doomfist escaped
I want to see some of these missions
(particularly the one in Quebec)
it's hard to see, but it think there's a dot in England/London too
limpid agate
Poland is also probably Ana
limpid agate
She did. But how long has she been there
And when is recent months
Is it a year old?
Is it from Recall?
A la Alive era?
peak escarp
if they're including Alive then it's at least that long
limpid agate
If they are
Recent months including that
Bastet was Christmas
Recall was earlier in the year
Significantly
peak escarp
Alive is ~10 months before Doomfist's escape, by my calculations
then again, it could be an old article
peak escarp
I don't think most people would count 12 months ago as "recent"
for me recent is 2-3 months
clever silo
I think Alive was very recent in the Doomfist trailer
because
oh i cant upload pictures
let me put it on imgur hol up
lament prawn
alive seems to take place on the same night as recall
limpid agate
2-3 months in recent months, 10 month old article
clever silo
lament prawn
according to Hammeh one of the translated dubs on recall had the news winston was watching mention that mondatta was making a speech that same night
clever silo
This was on the same wall of newspapers
but then again
we dont know how long hes been keeping the papers up for
hasty surge
Also do we have the height and possibly weight for heroes?
reef dagger
I would think Moira would have been somewhat invested, or at least interested, in the experiments being done at Horizon: Lunar Colony
Given all the genetic experiments being held there
But, I can't recall her ever giving it much mention or regard
Not to mention, I'm assuming the Moon still counts as international space, meaning there probably aren't any laws regarding ethics and such
(y'know, like in Prey)
frosty shell
the dubs of Recall do mention Mondatta, which does suggest to me that that was in the script, but they also mention a date for the Petras Act which makes no sense and has been stated to be incorrect
silver idol
how does moira's right hand work? the technology looks very interesting
river dagger
It sucks life force
idk beyond that
converts it into pee
or heal juice. Whichever you prefer
worthy rose
Past a certain point it's "future tech, ain't gotta explain sh*t". My guess is that nanobots take bits of biological material from the target and put them on allies, but it really could be anything.
silk reef
Tracer explain
peak escarp
explain what?
peak escarp
!!loreonly
twilit nacelleBOT
This channel is for serious discussion strictly related to the lore of Overwatch. Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
peak escarp
we don't know how many people were in the organization itself, but of the playable heroes only 12 of them are former Overwatch
silk reef
Mkay
peak escarp
Ana, Genji, McCree, Mei, Mercy, Moira, Reaper, Reinhardt, Soldier, Torbjorn, Tracer, Winston
peak escarp
conditioning
I think Moira was involved in altering her body to have a slower pulse (and turn her blue), but the conditioning was likely someone else
Moira is a geneticist, not a psychologist
silk reef
I forgot that :p
worthy rose
What kind of shoes do you think Sigma wore before he became Sigma?
pliant sparrow
Can anyone explain what nanobiotics are? Or have we never been given more than a brief description?
silk reef
@worthy rose he wore crocs
Thats like a big part of his origin how did you miss it?
Real question is what color socks
Long sock or short socks
worthy rose
Zenyatta is controlled by a god program trying to help prevent another omnic war to preserve itself
worthy rose
Zenyatta is controlled by google and Bastion aswell, why talk more about this! When its 100% logic?!
They're both investing on stocks on etoro aswell
🤔
warped grotto
Nah there both just know there robots and plan to take over
worthy rose
(this might tie into some lore)
But if you play the sigma's orgin story backwards it says The Melody is a harness
I think maby the melody drives him to continue his research.
thats atleast what i hear
@worthy rose According to Michael Chu, "God Program" is just a colloquial term to address the rogue AI Anubis, and not a general term to describe an entire subset of AIs
devout sable
yeah, "god programs" is just a colloquialism for powerful AIs
spice hatch
@hasty surge I already asked myself and that’s the best I found https://www.esportstales.com/overwatch/characters-official-heights-and-ages
No idea if it’s official tho
reef dagger
Correct me if I'm wrong... For Baptiste's regenerative burst, does he just crack open one of his healing grenades in his hand?
Would be neat if he did
lament prawn
judging by his “close up” highlight intro and the ability’s animation in general, no
must be some sort of trigger or button on/in his gloves
worthy rose
@worthy rose shhhhhhh it's ok
quasi leaf
ooooh
baptsie seems to have a hand sensor or something to trigger his burst hence the hand movement
baptiste
worthy rose
His burst is probably created by the same thing he uses to make his amplification matrix. You can see it in the “close up” intro. The backpack he has must carry the tech needed to make it
timid eagle
Really?
worthy rose
Immortality kinda is but thats...
spice hatch
What’s a canon ability ?
peak escarp
abilities are considered canon if they have been seen used in any canon source (shorts, short stories, comics, etc.)
spice hatch
Okay thanks
placid monolith
Is there anything out there beyond what's on the media page?
devout sable
@peak escarp how does it work in the story?
peak escarp
A round, flat shape dug into his back, and he shifted his bag over his shoulder. Wait. He opened it and dug inside, retrieving a disc-shaped device. It was something he’d been working on for months, and it was still just a prototype, but maybe…
The resulting explosion shattered the air. The middle of the pier was blown into the air, chunks of concrete raining into the bay. Some crashed into the decks of nearby boats, capsizing them. Seagulls scattered overhead, shrieking.
When the smoke cleared, Mauga was gone. Baptiste lay on one end of the pier, battered but breathing. The prototype device hummed in the air, emitting a protective field of energy around him. It was the only thing that had kept him alive.```Baptiste uses it to protect himself from an explosion
he's still injured, but it keeps him alive
devout sable
... that's a little on-the-nose
clever silo
how?
placid monolith
Well, any stories, really.
cunning ledge
(There’s a list of canon abilities in the pins)
Curated by me, so you know who to yell at if it’s wrong
placid monolith
Ah well. The pins are really useful though
last inlet
@devout sable it wasn't even mentioned before then in the story
silk reef
Has reaper actually eliminated a ex overwatch agent
limpid agate
Yes
He says he's killed multiple in Masquerade
We've just only seen him fail to kill Jack, Ana, Tracer, and Winston twice.
But those 4 are elites. The agents he killed were probably lower ranking members like Mirembe, Kimiko, etc.
spice hatch
Where are the names Mirembe and Kimiko mentioned pls ?
As OW agents in the lore I mean
Asking because I never saw those names anywhere before
limpid agate
Legacy
peak escarp
limpid agate
!!wiki Mirembe
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Mirembe
limpid agate
!!wiki Kimiko
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Kimiko
spice hatch
Thanks
limpid agate
They're both in Recall too
peak escarp
those two are also seen in the agent files that flash by during Recall
limpid agate
But that's where their names are from
spice hatch
And one more question
Are they somehow « « « important » » » characters or are they names given to make the OW organisation more « realistic » like there’s many people working
spice hatch
Okay thanks dude
peak escarp
they're names planted to fill out the roster, but also to give names to faces we've seen (Recall came out before Legacy) that may be relevant in the future
peak escarp
the faces we see flash by in Recall are a mix of fillers (like Wildebeest, whose concept was incorporated into Reinhardt and Orisa) and characters who will eventually be playable (like Sojourn)
spice hatch
Not sure sojourn will be playable at some point
limpid agate
She was confirmed already
peak escarp
we've been told she will be
peak escarp
why wouldn't she be?
spice hatch
I don’t know, I feel like she is more of a lore character like Maximilian
You know what I mean ?
peak escarp
Ana, Sombra, Doomfist and Brigitte started out as lore characters
spice hatch
Will max be playable at some point ?
peak escarp
maybe
we don't know
he doesn't seem like a fighter, but based on their backstory, neither does Mei or Zenyatta
spice hatch
Apart from Echo and Sojourn, are some other heroes confirmed ? They said that they had a dps and a supp incoming, supp being Echo for sure
peak escarp
Junkertown Queen is someone they have "long term plans" for
Mauga is also being worked on (Sigma was their first attempt at making Mauga, but they decided that kit didn't suit him)
spice hatch
Yeah I knew that but i didn’t know that they would try to do it again
peak escarp
Jeff said they still want to use Mauga
spice hatch
And Mauga is the forgot his name big robot from retribution and storm rising, right ?
spice hatch
Yeah that
limpid agate
Storm Rising has an omnic at the end of it. That is an omnic. That is not Mauga
spice hatch
I miscalled it robot, sorry
limpid agate
Were you talking about the Heavy Assault?
spice hatch
Yeah
peak escarp
who is a Heavy Assault unit, similar to the ones we fight in Retribution and Storm Rising
they aren't robots
placid sonnet
peak escarp
it's the music of the universe
peak escarp
Sigma hears it because he was exposed to extreme cosmic forces
spice hatch
Here’s the real song tho https://youtu.be/PLFVGwGQcB0
peak escarp
it's not that song
peak escarp
Sigma's melody is an original piece inspired by Gnossiene
written by one of Blizzard's composers
spice hatch
Okay you have bigger brain damn
(Not being rude)
But I have to say that you guys are actually really good with lore
peak escarp
we've put a lot of thought into it
spice hatch
I thought I knew lore and I do but you guys are just nuts damn
limpid agate
Lore is like history, but in a world that doesn't actually exist
If you like to study history, you'll like studying the lore of various games as well
lament prawn
i actually hate history lol
like anyone going to a movie or playing a story game, i just want to know more about the characters and what they've been through and enjoy the plot (and cinematography when it comes to the shorts)
worthy rose
how tall is sigma?
peak escarp
in-game he's taller than Reinhardt, but he is floating
so probably shorter than Reinhardt while standing
worthy rose
ooooh, a new contender
fringe blade
Isn't Bastion almost the same size as Rein?
fringe blade
Because I remember that Hog, Bastion and Rein are all about the same height
peak escarp
Roadhog is the same height as Bastion
peak escarp
Approx. height: 1.7m/5'7"
Max height: 2.2m/7'3"
I'm guessing Max Height is Winston standing upright
while the other one is his normal standing/on all 4s height
fringe blade
That's weird, I always felt like he was quite tall while standing up
I guess I underestimated Rein's height
Who do you think is the heaviest char.?
eager jackal
Hog
fringe blade
But wouldn't it make sense to make Bastion light-weight?
I mean, Orisa makes sense to be heavy.
But Bastions are robots created for war, so I would expect them to be as light as possible
Maybe Hamster with his mech?
Does Bastion ever turn into a tank in-lore?
peak escarp
we haven't seen it do it
there are tank-form Bastions in Honor and Glory, but we never see them transform either
it could be a separate model of Bastion
fringe blade
Because I don't really know how to explain the fact that the cannon literally appears out of nowhere
peak escarp
yeah
fringe blade
I guess you could say that the Bastion re-configures some of its parts
Into the cannon, but that feels a little far fetched
worthy rose
I'd think that Bastion is comparatively light, because he was designed to be airdropped in. Orisa is probably one of the heaviest characters though.
fringe blade
Why is the Dragons short NPC notable?
Or do I not know something?
Also, you forgot Petras
peak escarp
he's appeared twice and has a Lego figure
Petras hasn't been mentioned in present day
fringe blade
Ah, are you doing present day?
peak escarp
yes
so no Vincent, no Fio, no Mayor Nandah
also nobody who is dead
only people who are relevant to the present day story
peak escarp
I didn't really consider Anubis as a character, but I guess if I included Athena . . .
fringe blade
I'm actually curious, how is HAL-Fred related to the present day?
peak escarp
he's in the payload on Hollywood
peak escarp
he's also a well-known director
limpid agate
He's as relevant as Luna
An active element of the map
Which is more than some other characters
One of the few NPCs that exist in game
fringe blade
But then characters like Adawe should also hold merit, since he has even more of an impact than HAL-Fred
limpid agate
She
peak escarp
Gabrielle Adawe?
peak escarp
she's a historical figure
she helped create Overwatch 30 years ago
she's not active in present day
limpid agate
I'd say include Adawe if you have Liao
fringe blade
Yea, that's why I pointed her out
peak escarp
I'll add her
fringe blade
But then, if you add her, there is a whole other bunch of characters you'd have to add too
So it might be easier to just get rid of Liao, and settle for doing present-day NPCs.
peak escarp
that could work too
fringe blade
Because if you decide to add Adawe, you'd have to add tons of other characters as well
peak escarp
such as?
limpid agate
Nandah and Vincent are about all I can think of
fringe blade
Petras
peak escarp
three people is hardly tons
someone did point out the other faces from Recall
so I'm adding those as well
limpid agate
So you opted for removing Liao
Rather than adding Adawe, Petras, Nandah and Vincent
peak escarp
eh
I'm trying to keep it to just present day characters
realistically, I don't think Liao will come up again
limpid agate
If you start making exceptions in an arbitrary manner like that
What about Fusionator
Or Soundwave
Or Maria Estrada
Or Ray
peak escarp
they were mentioned in present day context
limpid agate
As was Liao
And Vincent
And Petras
In that, its just Adawe and Nandah who are not mentioned in the present
peak escarp
okay
mentions are not good enough
then I shouldn't have included all the Recall heroes either
or Sojourn for that matter, since she hasn't shown up in present day
there - just characters who are seen or known to be active in present day
pretty sure that's everyone
sadly, if I count only characters who have been seen in person in present day, that would exclude Lucio
limpid agate
But then your list looks silly
Because its missing Sojourn
Who is confirmed to be an upcoming hero
limpid agate
Sojourn being confirmed to be an upcoming hero = An active character that will be returning soon
peak escarp
which I just realized should exclude Predator too
limpid agate
You might as well undo Botruvia too
Consider removing some of the archeologists as well
Bruce has technically only appeared in flashbacks
peak escarp
making lists is complicated
limpid agate
Making exceptions is complicated
It would have been easier to just add Adawe/Vincent/Petras/Nandah
With your only exception being "They're not dead"
And be done with it
If you don't have a backup or want to undo your removals
Chao should also go
My point earlier with Fusionator and Ray was not remove them
My point was, why remove other characters if you're leaving those
You instead chose to remove them, which then led to me pushing you to further remove other characters.
So you can either undo the removals and just add the 4 characters that are historically relevant but not dead.
Or keep thinning the list until we're down to MEKA, Deadlock, Children, Family, and a Pompadour
limpid agate
Fio
peak escarp
dammit
limpid agate
And Anubis
peak escarp
I thought Anubis was killed/deactivated
limpid agate
I dont think its dead
At least not permanently
If that's all it took to destroy Anubis, it wouldn't have been just quarantined
peak escarp
it seems like they deactivated it, at least temporarily
so it isn't a current threat
limpid agate
Anubis is debatable but I'd include it
Only other things I'd consider are from non lore sources, being Helio's name and McCloud, who is in King's Row in a photo
!!wiki Helio
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Helio
limpid agate
!!wiki McCloud
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/McCloud
jade mortar
look, i'm no expert in ow lore but has sigma ever been on horizon?
jade mortar
cool
worthy rose
о
peak escarp
the other half of all his interactions haven't been added yet
but he seems to have them with Winston, Moira, Zarya, Tracer and/or Reaper, Mei and possibly others
the line about seeing someone at Luna's Cabaret could be referring to Widowmaker, who is apparently a regular there
lament prawn
is there a download link for the entire game's audio somewhere? (not just voices)
peak escarp
you can extract them using the OW Datatool
lament prawn
any third party software needed to convert them to playable files after they've been extracted?
peak escarp
they're .ogg files, which can be read by VLC
lament prawn
oh, perfect
peak escarp
if you want to convert the model/texture files, you need plugins for Blender, I think
peak escarp
having the subtitle written in the file name makes it so much easier to find things
iron plume
oh do they have them now? nice
limpid agate
I'd like to see him interact with Zen
Sigma seems very polite and respectful, if a bit scientifically focused
lean prawn
"He was a good friend. And you were much smaller back then." sounds like something he'd say to winston
limpid agate
Talks more about research than Moira
worthy rose
If you can't be bothered to look for the voicelines yourself, Hammeh recently made a video on all of which are available for Sigma right now.
peak escarp
I think the line about states of being might be an interaction with Zenyatta
limpid agate
States of matter, I assumed Reaper
worthy rose
I meant in general to anyone, but yeah i know.
peak escarp
or the one about "all things are potentially possible"
I think the line about "fascinating molecular makeup" is towards Reaper
we'll have to wait and see
hopefully not too long
lament prawn
im thinking the one with the "perhaps we could find a way to stabilize them" might be referring to either tracer or reaper, since their conditions could use stabilizing in their own different ways
im kinda hoping its tracer
peak escarp
I hope this means we're getting another batch of interactions soon
pliant sparrow
How much do bastion and orisa weigh?
last inlet
I don't know if there's a resource for that
if it's not on the gamepedia site, it might not be known
peak escarp
we don't have official weights for any heroes
last inlet
And we only have some heights, right? Like, I know Junkrat and Roadhog have the mugshots
peak escarp
some of the reference kits have heights listed
peak escarp
she's a robot
spice hatch
And what about Hammond, he’s underaged too
Oh damn, what have I done
Maybe there are different laws on the moon
peak escarp
. . .
pliant sparrow
Lmao
spice hatch
I’m getting in trouble
pliant sparrow
Well that’s a mute
iron plume
would hope that goes straight to stage 3
timid eagle
I sometimes can't tell if Junkrat is either crazy, an idiot, or is a genius that has a common sense handicap.
peak escarp
his knowledge is very specialized
worthy rose
common sense handicap is a very interesting way to put it
timid eagle
I know the character is unpredictable and a nutter.
But it's hard to tell, if you want me to be honest.
limpid agate
He has a very one track mind
When it comes to making money and explosions, he's a genius
When it comes to something after that, he's an idiot
For example: Not blowing up in your own explosions
Or not blowing up the money you made in your own explosions
But getting to that money and explosions? I would believe he'd be able to MacGyver a bomb into any safe.
teal meadow
About sigma interactions hid between files, i don't understand him anymore.
Is he good or bad?
pliant sparrow
He’s being used for bad things despite being a good person
topaz dirge
No info
jade mortar
even more reason to get a zen short
topaz dirge
I want a Zen mission
spice hatch
Am i the only one to think that zen lore would be boring ?
I mean, a comic would be cool but no more
Animated short is not required I mean
worthy rose
No, I think that too
He doesn't strike me as an interesting character at all and would like for the animated shorts to focus on bigger storylines
steady hedge
Hey, I heard somewhere that there's no proof that Lucio is an actual human being in the overwatch lore, but just a character, like Tony the tiger (using this example because of his cereal spray) or the Gorillaz (y'know, cuz fake musicians.)
placid monolith
Wasn't Lucio an eco-warrior or something?
steady hedge
Dude idk I bought overwatch yesterday, I'm pretty behind a bunch of stuff
jade mortar
he's a freedom fighter
cunning ledge
Decent meme theory given his lack of lore
I can assure you that he actually exists though
!!loreheroes lucio
twilit nacelleBOT
To learn more, please visit https://playoverwatch.com/en-us/heroes/lucio#story
jade mortar
btw do we know lucio's dads name?
cunning ledge
I don’t believe so
steady hedge
Okay, read his lore... That doesn't make me any more confident in his existence