Also we need to hear something about mercy dealing with a hitsquad
#lore-discussion
peak escarp
that seems to be what Baptiste's short story is setting up for
lament prawn
wait why would mercy be targeted specifically?
limpid agate
She's a high ranking ex-Overwatch member
Head of medical research, and also a decorated combat medic
devout sable
@limpid agate @peak escarp was Mercy mentioned in Baptiste's short story?
limpid agate
Yes
peak escarp
Baptiste turned on Sainclair’s data pad and the holographic globe popped up, followed by the profiles of the Overwatch agents. Their real names, their call signs, their vital stats. He turned the globe with one finger, reading the files. He spotted a familiar face hovering over the Middle East: a blonde woman he had met at a humanitarian aid site in Venezuela. They had worked together for almost a week before he’d had to move on. There was something about her calm, steady demeanor and self-assurance that reminded him of Roseline. Her Overwatch file read: MERCY. Agent ID: 3945_46. Real Name: Dr. Angela Ziegler. Status: Inactive.
Baptiste decides to find Mercy and give her a heads up that Talon is on their way, and he uses Sombra to get in contact with her
a map of last known locations is only so useful
there's no guarantee they'll still be there
otherwise Baptiste wouldn't need Sombra to help find Mercy - he'd just go to the location listed in the file
I think it's the identities that are more useful to Talon
hazy vortex
I was discussing with @hallow vessel and we were thinking perhaps in a short mercy and baptiste could meet up and fight a strike team spearheaded by sigma
fringe blade
Does Blizzard take part in Gamescom?
peak escarp
usually, but this year they've said they won't be
fringe blade
Dang, that sucks
It would've been perfect for some sort of reveal
Like the new map
Also
peak escarp
they did the map/short at Korean Fan Fest last year
fringe blade
Is it just me, or has Blizzard been kind of 'misleading' us in terms of new hero releases?
peak escarp
what do you mean?
fringe blade
McCree short: an awesome new omnic appears, doesn't become the new hero. Rising Storm: Another awesome character is introduced. Doesn't become a new hero. Mauga is introduced and basically teased, and yet doesn't become a new hero
Don't get me wrong, I actually really love that
And I know, not every character introduced has to immediately become a new hero etc.
peak escarp
Echo and Mauga are in the pipeline to become new heroes
the mystery omnic probably is too
fringe blade
I know
fringe blade
Its just that when they released the media that introduced them, they made it so some would expect them to be released as soon as they were teased
peak escarp
that's not Blizzard's fault
they didn't release these things and say "try to spot the new hero!"
it's the fans that get hyped up over things
fringe blade
True
limpid agate
Its just that when they released the media that introduced them, they made it so some would expect them to be released as soon as they were teased
You're using this to argue against Echo
peak escarp
WYLB was just a lore drop, like Bastet
limpid agate
But they used exactly this reason to release Ashe
peak escarp
it just happened to feature new characters instead of old ones
limpid agate
You can't have both in one
They made Ashe playable instead of Echo
Echo was instead just confirmed as a future hero
peak escarp
if Echo had been the new hero, people would be saying "Where's Ashe/Bob?"
limpid agate
^
peak escarp
tbh I think Bars would make an interesting hero, but I know people don't like snipers
fringe blade
He's Ashe's henchman, right?
peak escarp
he's the omnic sniper in the Deadlock Gang
fringe blade
Yea
I actually just found out that Ashe is the surname
And her first name is Elizabeth
peak escarp
his design is interesting
peak escarp
looks like Sigma's cosmetics are up?
white cobalt
Gamescom was lore/hero or map? though blizz isn't gonna be on this year
fringe blade
they're not
peak escarp
there's an update
white cobalt
yeah, sigma skins
fringe blade
This isn't really lore, but I wish that they gave us the ability to try out cosmetics
How they feel in game and such (Practice Range)
No skins
rip
nvm
The skins are kinda disappointing (except for Talon) but holy hell all of the other stuff is awesome
fringe blade
The talon one does
worthy rose
Thank god
limpid agate
What the fuck is this supposed to mean?
spark pine
I think is that think of "both fall at the same speed when 0 gravity"
fringe blade
Yea
spark pine
Jetpack Cat
peak escarp
no
spark pine
Yeah, I know, but it would be kinda funny
fringe blade
I'm actually purely curious, no memes or anything, why doesn't he have boots in his main skin?
Is there a scientific reason for it, or just a design choice?
austere timber
He got an rat face tho
peak escarp
because he doesn't know where it's coming from (it's possible only he can hear it)
fringe blade
What if he really doesn't know what the melody is?
And his captors used it to experiment with him
iron plume
it's not at 0 gravity
nothing falls at that
it't with no resistance
and I think it's a neat reference in a spray
the original was a cannonball but still
unreal olive
fringe blade
Maybe they tried to control him that way?
To control his abilities
And when he uses them, he hears the melody that they used
iron plume
doubt it, I think that was something inherent
unreal olive
the melody made me triggered
iron plume
although it could be an interesting take
where he thinks it's "the universe" but that's just because he hid into himself and that came to him from the outside
fringe blade
Melodies can be used as a way of brainwash
worthy rose
Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
peak escarp
it could be the Music of the Spheres
iron plume
it's what it points to
but it would be a cool idea if he thinks it's the spheres but actually it's some kind of device on him
although idk if overwatch wants to go that fucked
peak escarp
here's what the bowling ball and feather are a reference to
in a vacuum, a bowling ball and a feather will fall at the same speed
valid shell
Shoulda been a pound of steel and a pound of feathers.
iron plume
no it shouldn't
peak escarp
it's not about what weighs more
iron plume
because that's not the point of the experiment
it's specifically about different weighted objects
behaving the same in gravity
peak escarp
it's about the way gravity affects them
iron plume
not air resistance
that actually screws it up if you try to do it off a tower or whatever
Galileo's original experiment was just two different sized balls
people were surprised the bigger one didn't fall faster
peak escarp
the reason they fall at the same speed in a vacuum is because of the lack of air resistance
iron plume
yeah
peak escarp
wasn't there someone here who was Dutch?
we need translation on some of his voice lines
I think one might be Doe maar Normaal, dan doe je al gek genoeg (Act normal, as that’s crazy enough)
and I think the "If you can't handle criticism" line might be Wie boter op zijn hoofd heeft, moet uit de zon blijven (He who has butter on this head should stay out of the sun)
broken willow
Im dutch but currently am not at my pc to have context
worthy rose
I am dutch
peak escarp
do I have the sayings right? I was just guessing based on some lists of common Dutch idioms and what his phrases sounded like to me
peak escarp
I like the way he says it
worthy rose
My mom always says it and its a playful kind if voiceline
peak escarp
very casual
worthy rose
When people are acting funny its usually a thing you say
peak escarp
what about the spray with the salted herring
worthy rose
Oh yeah thats a dutch thing we eat here
I live near the beach and in summer theres herring stands all over the place and people just eat it
peak escarp
I'm loving all the details they put into his sprays and voice lines
worthy rose
Its very common
Yeah me too
I loved hearing everything to he honest
The voice actor did so good on everything especially the dutch ones
peak escarp
makes me wish they'd reference Pharah's Canadian heritage more
because her dad is from where I live and I want to see the references
worthy rose
Yeah i understand, i didnt expect a dutch hero especially since i started playing recently so i was like "oh wow thats awesome" and to see they included lots if dutch referencesbis just another plus
peak escarp
but knowing my luck, if they added a full Canadian hero they'd be from Toronto or Quebec or something
worthy rose
Are there any known interactions with other heroes he has?
peak escarp
he has a few elimination lines, but no interactions so far
worthy rose
Yeah Den Haag is a common place in the nl, im born there so most likely they did it because its a known place
Hmm i wonder what kind of lines he might get then
Those could get pretty interesting
peak escarp
I need him to have lines with Moira
worthy rose
I would love that
I could see them be pretty good friends
Even though Sigma supposidly is aware he is being used
peak escarp
is he? they said he is being used by Talon without his knowledge
worthy rose
Ive seen people say he is aware though i am not sure if anything got confirmed
worthy rose
Ah well makes sense
I wonder if he will find out at some point and how
What will he do, what can he do, etc
limpid agate
Even though Sigma supposidly is aware he is being used
His whole thing is
He is unaware
From his bio
hazy vortex
In reference to the short suggestion doctor six, we know that mercy and baptiste will meet up, and Jeff has said he wants sigma to be explored more in some kind of media. Realistically he'd be with a more senior member of talon to basically be his handler but that would make a very crowded short
I couldn't respond earlier because England
last inlet
If anything, a more plausible short for Sigma would be Talon's acquisition of him
Because it'd likely be another infiltration
Plus I have a feeling that, like it could be with many other heroes, he doesn't actually fight all that much except within the game.
You're right that if he had to be fighting Mercy and Baptiste in a hypothetical movie, he'd have to be brought there by another member of Talon
somber bridge
Sigma probably does have a handler
i mean come on
somebody of that strength left by themselves?
timid eagle
Mauga would physically be the only thing to hold Sigma at bay. Or Sombra.
I can’t see Moira having the patience to tolerate Sigma for short moments at a time.
peak escarp
he's probably a pleasure to work with when he's lucid
his bio describes him as kind but eccentric
timid eagle
Ehhh, I’ll wait and see how Sigma gel’s with the rest of Talon, once more voice interactions are added.
He seems like a very dangerous person to have around if his mind continues to fracture.
teal meadow
Maybe moira is studying him in secret
worthy rose
I guess she is
north flame
I actually assume Moira is best considering she does so much unethical testing. That and they'd probably get along well being leaders in their fields
fathom falcon
Sigma is god
iron plume
needing a space to quote with meme arrows
worthy rose
gray texting
limpid root
I don't think so. It is stated that talon learned about sigma's existence only after he spent some time in the facility
meager folio
K so I’ve been thinking about this and to me it seems like Sigma is very obviously dealing with psychotic stuff most definitely, and I’ve heard people say he might have DID but the way I’m looking at the origin story it seems to be like the three different Sigmas we see could be him seeing time in a nonlinear perspective. To me it seems like in the moment of the black hole experiment going wrong he somehow unlocked potential in being able to see multiple events in his near future at once along with also mixing up the past and present. Given how it isn’t linear and how in different scenes he is shown in the wrong place. I.e. him in hospital clothing while in his workspace. That seems to ring pretty well to me but I want to hear other thoughts on what’s really going on in these clips.
peak escarp
he's broken mentally, but there's still only one Sigma
if anything, his exposure to the black hole might have given him a heightened awareness/perception of the universe around him
so that he can hear the Song of the Spheres
limpid agate
... Song of the Spheres?
peak escarp
the music of the universe
it's a philosophical idea, but for Sigma it seems to be a real thing
limpid agate
Oh that's cool
peak escarp
it also has a connection to mathematics, so it also makes sense in that context
I always figured his "the universe is singing to me" was a reference to this
trail walrus
does sigma have a comic?
peak escarp
no
trail walrus
ok
high glen
Sigma deserves a comic
worthy rose
Lot of heroes deserve comics
lament prawn
^
hazy vortex
Sigma is likely to be involved in something
north flame
I would say he's split in only two based on what we've seen. An aggressive side and nurturing/curious one. It's possible the black hole fused two different ones together from different dimensions, but there's nothing in formulas to support this theory as far as I know. Based on the fact his head appears to be warped/and the fact his personality somewhat changed after the incident implies he's had some sort of brain trauma, and this is likely the best solution to what has actually happened to him. There's only one of him, but he can switch moods with a trigger. None of this can be confirmed, but it's a decent theory based on what we have for now
autumn kraken
Just the fact that “in theory” a black hole is a rip that connects do dimensions- and seeing as Sigma was obsessed with them... maybe while the one that he created (as we see in his origin story)- when it got out of hand they fused since theoretically if you and I were in space and you got sucked into a black hole I would see two of you- one getting demolished and mangled and the other perfectly fine so one of the “two” Sigmas from each dimension got pulled into each other’s worlds
autumn kraken
Oof *two
limpid agate
He was mind broken until he learned to harness the harness. He was not given split personalities
Not two. One.
autumn kraken
Maybe another harnessed the harnesses harness
limpid agate
There is one personality.
You're welcome to find a source in his bio or in game to prove otherwise
The origin was not three personalities. It was one over like 6 years
pliant sparrow
Do we know anything about how talon are manipulating him or what they’re making him do?
autumn kraken
I mean they’re taking his research and presumably using him as a test subject
valid shell
Sigma/Widowmaker Talon defection when?
autumn kraken
When?
valid shell
When.
autumn kraken
Well widow wasn’t a defect...
iron plume
that's not what a defection means
iron plume
defection and being defective have nothing to do with each tother
autumn kraken
Isn’t defection like a country/religion thing
iron plume
it means abandoning your side
devout sable
@autumn kraken I didn't see any "alternate versions" of Sigma
it's just him from different points in time
digital light
is it canon that mercy can rez?
lament prawn
she brought genji back from the brink of death, but she cant literally raise the dead with a flick of her arm
i'll say unconfirmed to be safe, but very unlikely
peak escarp
Mercy can't resurrect anyone any more than a real doctor can resuscitate someone who is clinically dead
hazy vortex
The common theory I think is along the lines of her teammates aren't dead, they're out cold and she heals them back up and wakes them aswell
peak escarp
yes
autumn kraken
(Not my words) yeah ok i headcanon mercy’s work to heavily influence telomeres. ok short explanation telomeres are like the aglets of chromosomes. they are at the end of chromosomes. you know cell division? well every time a cell divides into two daughter cells these telomeres get shorter. and once they’re short enough, they can no longer do cell division. this is kinda like the basis of our mortality. it’s what makes us grow old. our cells have an expiration wherein they no longer replicate. how does this tie to mercy’s rez? well, from my headcanon, i think mercy’s work make it so that when cells undergo cell division their telomere’s don’t get shorter (at least to a degree). meaning they can replicate themselves at faster speed allowing faster regeneration. also “rez” doesn’t actually bring back the dead, in my opinion. it’s based on mercy bringing genji back from the brink of death. also why mercy hasn’t “aged” as mei put it.
peak escarp
but Mercy does age
Mei says "you look like you haven't aged a day"
because Mercy takes care of her appearance
white cobalt
Mfw Chu avoids to reply about Liao and have only one mention
peak escarp
he's been avoiding answers about Liao since forever
paper gazelle
Maybe because...
Ok this is gonna be crazy
I once actually thought Liao is/was from Taiwan and was supposed to be playable as well but that would mean being CCP disapproving of the game
peak escarp
CCP?
paper gazelle
Chinese Communist Party
paper gazelle
Because it probably would mean the government of China would ban OW and the devs wouldn't want that
Tensions between Taiwan and China had been high lately
paper gazelle
Fair point
peak escarp
I doubt Blizzard cares that much
paper gazelle
Maybe the devs just decided to retcon them
peak escarp
and I doubt China would ban a game just for having a Taiwanese character
paper gazelle
Maybe because they felt they didn't really fit in
peak escarp
Liao was supposed to be a large part of the First Strike graphic novel, but that got canned
now Liao is in limbo, possibly retconned out
paper gazelle
Yeah maybe retconned
peak escarp
Schrodinger's hero - both exists and doesn't exist until the devs say something
paper gazelle
But if they were retconned then why the devs wouldn't speak about them
peak escarp
because maybe they're still going to use Liao in the future
the devs don't like giving away more than is necessary
paper gazelle
Hmm
Anyways I have something to say about Sigma, I noticed there are people accusing Blizzard of purposefully using stereotypes for mental illnesses for Sigma
Even though he isn't suffering from a mental illness
peak escarp
basically all of Overwatch's hero design is stereotypes
paper gazelle
Though it does appear to be so
peak escarp
he does have mental illness
paper gazelle
Then again, don't we all have stereotypes towards others
Wait I thought his body was just ripped apart mentally because of the back hole
peak escarp
De Kuiper was only exposed to its power for a moment, but he suffered serious psychological damage.
But the same experiment that had opened his mind had also fractured it, and he struggled to keep the pieces together.
paper gazelle
Oh...
Still people are whining over the game's representation because of such stereotypes
peak escarp
boohoo
Blizzard doesn't care
they didn't care when they gave Symmetra her Devi skins and a religious leader denounced it
paper gazelle
I'm not surprised by such stereotypes. After all I thought that mental institutes were referred to as asylums
Well yeah they don't care. But do they need to...?
peak escarp
its a reference to the history of mental asylums and a nod to Hannibal Lecter from Silence of the Lambs
paper gazelle
I see
limpid agate
The character is an homage to a specific extreme kind of asylum.
Its not just Hannibal
The character is exactly the type that would go into Arkham Asylum
Its also not like he's the only character with mental illness.
Symmetra exists and is perfectly normal.
peak escarp
people are just looking for something to be upset over
limpid agate
^
peak escarp
wait a few weeks and they'll switch to something else
limpid agate
Between that and "another old white man?"
But who cares. People will complain about anything.
peak escarp
when this gets old they'll go back to demanding a black woman and arguing over whether Ana and Pharah count as black or not
paper gazelle
RIGHT
There will always be people who will find fault with sth. Why did I have to care
limpid agate
The other big one is "Why is X character a villain? Do you mean to say Y personality or racial trait is villainous" in regards to black Doomfist, androgynous Moira, and mentally ill Sigma.
Its tedious and counter productive.
peak escarp
I mean, it's better than spreading misinformation, but a lot of those arguments are based on misinformation, so idk
fringe blade
Are the Talon skins even really canon?
I though that the base skins of Reaper, Widow etc. were their uniforms?
worthy rose
i'm pretty sure they are canon
it's just that they don't have to wear them anymore because they are higher in ranking or something
robust sinew
oi
hazy vortex
Most skins aren't cannon
last inlet
or even ballista
timid eagle
Is there a flattering way to talk about mental illness?
It’s a mental illness, by that name alone it is not something good, Sigma’s mind is not function how it should be, so exactly how do you make that look positive?
Then again, Sigma doesn’t have anything to do with mental illness in its common clinical sense. He had his mind fucked by black hole exposure, which isn’t even a fucking thing, he’s not bi-polar one.
sand igloo
Zenyatta lore.. where is it
copper vale
We need the Zenyatta lore
devout sable
@peak escarp archetypes, not stereotypes
limpid root
@timid eagle I feel like you don't need to find a special flattering way to talk about a mental illness. It's a mental illness and that's what it is and you can talk about it in any way you want as long as it's not something like all mentally ill people should die or something like that.
devout sable
people are worried that characters like Sigma reinforce harmful stigmas about mental illnesses
I don't think this sort of... dismissive scorn is a good response to that.
paper gazelle
His mental illness isn't really caused by natural causes
limpid root
Well yeah and a mental illness is usually something that is genetic
paper gazelle
So that was why I was actually somehow skeptical towards calling his illness a mental illness
limpid root
Well yeah. That's why I said usually. But again I could be wrong
devout sable
a traumatic event can result in mental illness – and that's what Sigma is an example of
paper gazelle
Actually to me his cause of illness is both natural and man-made in a sense
paper gazelle
Then people are complaining about Blizzard stereotyping mental illnesses even if they didn't intend to show that he really had a mental illness
limpid root
I actually never thought of Sigma's condition as a mental illness
devout sable
it definitely is one
paper gazelle
But to me it seemed that the government in the lore felt that he had a mental illness so they put him in a mental institute
devout sable
it literally says that his mind was fractured, and he's been clearly shown suffering from psychological complications
what is that if not a mental illness?
limpid root
Interesting how they mention that in Sigma's bio but Symmetra's autism is almost completely forgotten
paper gazelle
I mean, the origin trailer's powerful imagery gave some people the creeps so I do understand why there are people who really mind
devout sable
look, personally? I don't have any problems at all with Sigma. I just don't feel the need to berate those who do.
paper gazelle
I actually found the origin story exciting and really fresh out of the box
A female I guess
Sojourn?
paper gazelle
I'm starting to wonder
devout sable
at least we'll have that one covered, cause it's been far too long
paper gazelle
This year the devs told us the heroes they are working on
Idt they've done so before
What are they doing? An expansion pack or sth?
devout sable
I'm still disappointed my Caribbean pirate lady concept won't be a thing
Baptiste already got dibs on Haiti
paper gazelle
Issok
limpid root
I'm still waiting for echo
paper gazelle
She will come don't worry
paper gazelle
At least not in 2 decades time
limpid root
we are not ready to release her yet
limpid root
Ep?
paper gazelle
Expansion pack
limpid root
Oh
paper gazelle
The devs never ruled out the possibility of expansion packs so I'm speculating that
Idk actually
limpid root
Well to be honest I don't really care about hero 32 right now
I just want sigma on live
- role queue
paper gazelle
Go ptr
limpid root
Yeah I know but my game keeps crashing on the ptr.-.
paper gazelle
Rippity rip
limpid root
Oof
paper gazelle
And then we have the PvE game in the works
paper gazelle
Finally, the lore can move on
worthy rose
@paper gazelle thats 100% rumor to be fair
limpid root
I don't care if it's a rumour or not I just want to believe
autumn kraken
Wait that’s not official??
limpid agate
Not yet
frosty shell
the rumor did come from a reliable source, hence why people are still talking about it
robust sinew
press e for mor torb lore
limpid agate
He actually has quite a bit
limpid root
I require sym lore
iron plume
read A Better World?
devout sable
we need an animated short for Zen, Lucio, Pharah, and/or Mercy
limpid root
Well too bad the next animated short is probably coming out in 2021 and it will be about a character we knew a lot about already and answers no questions
devout sable
nah, there's a fixed schedule
Gamescom and Blizzcon
@limpid agate when's the next one?
I don't keep track
limpid root
Honestly I don't really need animated shorts. I actually enjoyed the Baptiste story way more than any animated short
peak escarp
they're not doing Gamescom this year
but last year's summer short wasn't at Gamescom, so we're still likely to get one
also re: Symmetra's autism not showing up
when is the last time Symmetra was mentioned or appeared in the lore?
limpid root
Wait it was mentioned IN the comic?
peak escarp
yes
limpid root
Damn I'm so blind
peak escarp
so complaining that Symmetra's autism is never brought up isn't really a fair complaint if Symmetra herself hasn't been seen or mentioned since the first time her autism was revealed
Sigma's condition also impacts his life to a much greater degree than Symmetra's
peak escarp
it would be nice to have a spray or voice line that acknowledges it
but I don't know how they would do that
limpid root
Damn I feel like I should know more about this stuff since I'm on the spectrum myself but I don't know anything 
peak escarp
last inlet
See, I really think they could've worded that better
Made it more obvious, since I thought of other spectrums there supposedly are.
But writing be like that, I guess
limpid root
Yeah true
Well now that I'm thinking about it they didn't have to word it better just make it a bit more obvious that she's autistic. Now I love sym and blizzard but when it comes to her autism they definitely could have done a better job.
last inlet
I gotta go back and read that one
limpid root
Have fun
peak escarp
there aren't any other things I could think of that you would describe as being "on the spectrum"
limpid agate
Other than light
But that doesnt make sense in context other than Sym works with hard light
limpid root
Well the main problem is that an autistic person wouldn't go to a war and kill in the first place. But if you really want an autistic person in your game rel from Warframe is in my opinion a great autistic character.
But again I could be wrong
peak escarp
why wouldn't they go to war? I'm sure there's some percentage of enlisted members who are on the spectrum
iron plume
even that aside, Symmetra doesn't go to a war to kill
peak escarp
also, Symmetra isnt going to war, and she says she avoids killing if possible
limpid root
Well lore wise that is true
And apparently (I didn't test this) autistic people are much more likely to refuse to kill a person
peak escarp
I would think good people are much more likely to refuse to kill a person
regardless of their neurotype
last inlet
There's sexuality and even asexuality. Whether or not I agree with the terms, people will refer to them as a spectrum. Plus, light is enough of a theme with her that I kinda also thought it was just comic book type themed monologue
limpid root
And (in my country at least) you don't have to go to war at all if you're autistic. Even if it's mandatory
last inlet
If she had gone on to describe what she experiences as someone with that condition, how she feels, how it affects her perspective, it would've been more obvious without having her say "also I've been diagnosed with autism"
peak escarp
peak escarp
it's still her perspective
last inlet
You've been given the opportunity to work with hard light
Not everyone can do that
It's her perspective, it doesn't really convey that she's all that different from the average person.
We all have things we can do that others can't quite do
peak escarp
the neurotypical writer probably didn't think about that
last inlet
It's not a big deal now. Someone had to receive a letter from Blizzard for it to be confirmed, but it's been confirmed.
And yeah, I agree that there's little reason to keep bringing it up now, since she doesn't feature much to begin with
frosty shell
Symmetra being a savant makes sense
bright edge
Symmetra's autism if i remember correctly, was need of perfectly organized things, everything has a right place. Don't put every kind of autism to the same bag
peak escarp
she does like order
neon wraith
so OCD?
peak escarp
and she was seen ignoring a conversation to straighten out a picture frame
not quite
OCD is a more specific disorder
neon wraith
so what does this qualify as then?
peak escarp
it's just how her autism manifests
that's why it's a spectrum
different people have different symptoms
bright edge
I think it is OCD, you HAVE TO classify that autism as something, and OCD is closest to her symptoms
peak escarp
OCD is repeated compulsions
Symmetra doesn't repeat actions, she just needs things to be neat and orderly
iron plume
it's what internet says OCD is but it's not actually OCD
peak escarp
yes
it's "OCD"
just like how all the heroes have "PTSD"
you don't have to classify autism as something else
autism is the classification
peak escarp
the nearest depiction of PTSD was the description of Baptiste's memory/dream in WYLB
devout sable
Bastion has something resembling PTSD too
like, not exactly
but it's definitely a parallel
an ordinary occurrence interpreted as gunfire
resulting in a combat response
peak escarp
it's definitely a good depiction of a trigger
a lot of people either forget or don't know about the other symptoms of PTSD and just focus on the flashbacks/triggers
peak escarp
tbh I didn't know about the other symptoms either until I saw a video of a doctor analysing the depiction of medical conditions in MCU movies
devout sable
I think some of you guys theorized that Bastion never actually saw any combat? though I think it's odd to rule out any previous deployments
peak escarp
there's clues that suggest Bastion was still in the drop pod when it woke up in the forest
so unless it is a survivor of previous deployments, it probably hasn't seen combat before
iron plume
but then how does he get flashbacks if they didn't happen to him
peak escarp
the flashback is from reading the memory of another bastion unit
the sound of the woodpecker triggered its combat programming somehow
iron plume
eeeeeh idk, maybe
devout sable
I'm still inclined to think that Bastion fought in previous deployments
peak escarp
it's possible
iron plume
but I think him being in before is the more
devout sable
its bio is definitely meant to imply such
iron plume
occam's razory explanation
peak escarp
Though "Bastion" appears to be gentle—even harmless, at times—its core combat programming takes over when the unit senses danger, utilizing its entire arsenal to eliminate anything it perceives as a threat.
so Bastion hearing the woodpecker mistook that for gunfire and activated its combat protocols
devout sable
Once a frontline combatant in the devastating Omnic Crisis
this is the part that I believe implies Bastion already fought before
peak escarp
yeah
so it's likely Bastion has fought in other conflicts, but when it was dropped in for the battle (was it the Battle of Eichenwalde?) the drop pod malfunctioned and Bastion was damaged
devout sable
yep, it was damaged in the drop.
and I don't think it was the battle of Eichenwalde, but it was a part of that offensive
peak escarp
its programming sent it towards Stuttgart
devout sable
it happened before Honor and Glory, since Balderich is still alive
I suspect that the omnics were first ordered to attack Stuttgart, but were repelled by the Crusaders
so then the strategic/command program redirected them to Eichenwalde, Crusaders' base of operations
peak escarp
that would make sense
devout sable
it's somewhat amusing that E54 was basically a single drop pod malfunction away from killing/getting killed by Crusaders
peak escarp
if there is they'd probably be from the same facility that Sigma was kept in
steady fjord
This is what I mean XD 👍
peak escarp
we have enough factions already
they should deliver on some of the heroes they've promised us first
steady fjord
Maybe they will be a hero which have lambda on his body (half life 3 confirmed)
Yeahh, like Liao! Mirembe, Kimiko
Sojourn, Echo, JunkerQueen, Mauga, Ares? maximilian?
peak escarp
Sojourn and Echo are the ones I want most
steady fjord
Yes, me too
peak escarp
and I don't care if he's a hero or not, but I want to see more about Casino
wait
Ares?
steady fjord
Probobly the omnic on the Storm Rising (speculation)
peak escarp
you know Ares was made up by the community, right?
steady fjord
In the comics there is a God AI named Ares
worthy rose
Why him specifically?
steady fjord
Casino..well maybe some day
peak escarp
because he might be connected to Maximilien
covert patrol
worthy rose
Or just cause his name
steady fjord
The true question is...
peak escarp
Casino is an F1 racer whose mech is named La Princese Sereine (the title for the Princess of Monaco)
steady fjord
WHEN will be the next comics!
peak escarp
Monaco is also best known for casinos and the Monaco Grand Prix
worthy rose
Oh dang
worthy rose
Yeah that does sound like it could be something
Ah the more you know, thanks for educating me haha
steady fjord
What if the Widowmaker saw that Gerard Lacroix killed himself and that's why she rembember some thing of her past
peak escarp
Widowmaker killed Gerard
worthy rose
Widow killed him herself
steady fjord
Yes I know
peak escarp
she remembers doing it
steady fjord
But what if XD
peak escarp
no what if
worthy rose
It doesnt make sense
steady fjord
I know xd
peak escarp
this isn't the channel for "what if"
unless you've got good evidence for that argument
steady fjord
You're right, this isn't the MCU future show
worthy rose
Pretty confident Talon didnt focus on memories either, they focussed on creating a sniper like she is now
peak escarp
even just appearance-wise, I think Casino is the most interesting
he reminds me of Quicksilver
worthy rose
Feel like knowing more about the entire meka thing would be great as a whole, feel like theres much more to come other than just d.va
quicksilver?
worthy rose
ohh
peak escarp
but it would be cool to learn about the dynamic in the MEKA squad
how Hana gets along with everyone else
peak escarp
maybe
it's hard to say just from design
I want to see her rivalry with King and her friendship with D.Mon
steady fjord
Another topic: Sombra web conspiracy
peak escarp
something occurred to me today
steady fjord
I think that is High noon
peak escarp
Overwatch as an organization wasn't around for very long
only between 19 and 24 years
depending on when during the crisis they were formed
steady fjord
Neverendingwatch
worthy rose
oh wow
steady fjord
Em eseler
peak escarp
in his origin trailer, Soldier says "I led Overwatch for 20 years", although that may be a rounded number
steady fjord
So...?
peak escarp
I'm just pointing out one of the sources for my numbers
we like it when people have sources around here
steady fjord
Oh ok xd 
So basiclly: Reaper-psychopath, Symmetra-autistic, Sigma- biopolar disorder
peak escarp
closer to dissociative identity disorder
north flame
Yeah, Ive never heard of sym being autistic and sure as hell didn't consider her it from the comic. So is there concrete proof somewhere she is?
desert hawk
Since when?
limpid agate
Since 2016
frosty shell
"I suspect that the omnics were first ordered to attack Stuttgart, but were repelled by the Crusaders
so then the strategic/command program redirected them to Eichenwalde, Crusaders' base of operations"
Was it their base of operations?
I thought they were just holed up there
in order to drive away the Omnics
Balderich chose it because it was his castle probably
limpid agate
Their base was Stuttgardt
Eichenwalde was the lastion bastion of defence before Stuttgardt
peak escarp
Eichenwalde is near Stuttgart - you can see it off in the distance on the map
devout sable
lastion bastion 👀
cunning ledge
catchy
stray hinge
does anyone know what sigma was diagnosed with after the black hole incident in the origins ?
steady fjord
He might have biopolar disorder
But
Dissociative idenitity disorder is more possibly
deft hollow
Schizophrenia maybe, hearing hallucinogenic sounds
steady fjord
Schizophrenia no
Cuz sounds is from the talon system that make him stabilisited and under controll
Em eseler
deft hollow
Could be positive symptoms though
devout sable
@steady fjord that's... far from established
somber bridge
We don't know what the music he hears is iirc
It could be something like the Musica Universalis like DoctorSix pointed out
despite Musica Universalis being metaphorical, for Sigma it could be a literal harmony he hears
so, whether it's diegetic and everybody hears, or it's pseudo-diegetic and only Sigma hears it is unclear
steady fjord
@devout sable You mean?
deft hollow
Talon are controlling him somehow but yeah before he were broke out he seemed mentally affected
rain kiln
steady fjord
Well, yes: I mean that he have psychic problem even before "the talon Stuff"
steady fjord
@everyone what's Your favorive lore hero?
deft hollow
Reaper, a tragic anti hero who plays a good villain
iron plume
don't... do that
and Reaper is a full villain at this point
But for the question, mine would be Mercy
deft hollow
I don't think he's fully evil though there's still good in him
sterile sky
O.O
steady fjord
I agree with shadowjt, Reaper is something more than antagonist,
Ok so Reaper, Mercy... What more? What else
lean ravine
Sp
iron plume
mercy wasn't about villains, that was about favorites
steady fjord
👍
peak escarp
“It’s interesting, because I can see how people in the community have identified with Sigma as someone who is struggling or dealing with mental health issues,” Chu said. “But with the idea of the character, we never intended him to be an example of someone who’s going through mental health issues. He’s really supposed to be more focused on this very specific thing that happened to him, which is that his body and his mind were literally ripped apart by the momentary exposure to a black hole.
“The feet thing reminds me of a couple of funny stories, because I remember when Jeff [Kaplan] was like ‘He floats. Why does he have to wear shoes?’” said Chu. “It’s something he felt strongly about, and it was like... OK, that makes sense. He floats, he doesn’t need shoes. Jeff was also like ‘It... it’ll be a thing’, which... [laughs].”
it was Jeff's idea
steady fjord
Xd ok so lesson: never go to Black hole
deft hollow
I remember the seagull live stream where jeff said why does zen wear shoes if he floats
peak escarp
its interesting that people latched onto him as a person with a mental illness
late torrent
I mean the origin story trailer definitely made it look so
but in game it's completely different
peak escarp
so really, he wasn't locked up for being mentally ill - he was locked up for being (potentially) dangerous
which makes the Hannibal reference more fitting
limpid agate
I mean
He was also mentally unstable
Just physically/supernaturally unstable too
Like I said
He would have fit in perfectly in Arkham Asylum
But with extra emphasis on the asylum part
half pasture
I'm he's obviously coded mentally ill
frosty shell
and he was locked up because he was a scientific subject who needed to be contained
peak escarp
my favourite hero should be obvious
deft hollow
I love Rein, I remember when the overwatch team remiscined about him sneaking on an enemy mission and how it sounds crazy but I love sneaking behind the enemy to slam
lament prawn
i dont really have a favorite, just ones that i like more than others
core members such as tracer, winston, mercy, mei, ana then ones that came a little later such as brigitte, hammond, sombra
limpid agate
Mei was never a core member
She was just another scientist in the original Overwatch
And in modern, she hasn't done anything other than join and then do her own environmentalism
lament prawn
not core, sorry, i mean came with launch and was in the lore from the start (i put ana there because she was a core member and was already in the game by the time i started playing)
limpid agate
ANd after reading little later I now see you meant launch
I was confused because the other 4 are all core Overwatch members
lament prawn
yeah, my bad
considering mei isn't a core member, her short is easily one of my favorites
one tragic scene after another with the determination and pixar-ish symbolic "destiny" at the end with the aurora and her response to winston's recall
recall had that sort of vibe too with the flashbacks, i love how they had winston leave the "initiate recall? yes/no" prompt up when reaper almost hacked it, so when it got restored after the flashback and fight, it appeared right in his face without him having to bring it up
and by then the answer is obvious
peak escarp
(my favourite is Mercy, btw)
peak escarp
I like McCree, but his background isn't as interesting
Mercy, Reaper and Soldier are the ones I'm most interested in
lament prawn
reaper and soldier are the core heroes where its more curiosity than interest that's driving me to want more lore for them - since they're so central and important in the universe. aside from that, they're a little too realistic and serious story-wise for my taste. of course there's not a single hero that i outright hate or dislike at all, its just i find myself attached to other characters more than the likes of them
i may have directly worded that to say i dont have interest in them. scratch that, i do, quite a bit, just not as much as others.
peak escarp
I'm interested in all the heroes
but those three are directly involved in things I want to know more about
what happened at the Swiss HQ, why Reyes joined Talon, is Mercy going to answer the Recall, what will she say when Baptiste shows up
timid eagle
Sombra’s backstory is cool. Didn’t like how she was sandbagged in the Zarya comic.
I want more Zenyatta and Lucio lore.
lament prawn
sombra is already presumed quite relevant lore-wise with her being in talon, but considering the huge bigger-than-everything conspiracy she's after, she's outright worthy of being the main character (if we look at the lore as one big movie) so i really want more on that
lament prawn
that's the thing, the main plot is recall and the overwatch-talon conflict, but seeing the connections the conspiracy has on both sides and how big and mysterious it appears to be, it might as well be the plot. maybe im blowing it out of proportions, maybe they're saving it for something bigger than a short or a comic, but they cant let us down with how much mystery there is behind it
its not like i want it to be the main plot, im more interested in what currently is the main plot, but that thing is hovering in the background somewhere
peak escarp
Sombra's conspiracy isn't that big
Sombra is the only person who cares about it or even knows it exists
it could be nothing for all we know
lament prawn
realistically it could be nothing, but i feel like that would be bad writing regardless
obviously it wont straight up take over the main plot, but the way i see it, it has to be something at least somewhat relevant
peak escarp
she just wants to find out who runs everything
lament prawn
"there's something bigger going on. it will affect everyone - everything."
if she just finds the owner to some small organization and takes him out and that's all, it wouldnt be a good end to her story
limpid agate
This is lore discussion
steady fjord
My favorite at now: Sigma
neat pivot
Well her central target according to her web diagram is The Iris
or at least, she posits they are the centre of everything
Personally I'm looking forward to a conclusion/continuation of the Infiltration short (i.e. the part where Zarya gets called in) and them actually making use of www.volskayaindustries.com
limpid agate
Personally I'm looking forward to a conclusion/continuation of the Infiltration short
!!wiki Searching
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Searching
peak escarp
yeah, that arc has been concluded already
clear smelt
There's a comic
neat pivot
That's the end of it? Seemed to end on a bit of a cliffhanger, they didn't even use the website either 😦
limpid agate
What cliffhanger
peak escarp
the website was for the Sombra ARG
wary ether
I know this might sound stupid but people say that in the short Hero they say the little girl is a younger sobra. But what if the younger girl was sombras little sister? And that's why her mom tell the girl about the hero's.
peak escarp
I've seen theories that Alejandra's mom was part of Sombra's adoptive family or grew up with her in the orphanage
Sombra was orphaned by the crisis, so she couldn't be her biological mother
worthy rose
What made zenyatta become a monk?
peak escarp
we don't know
worthy rose
who else has mei as their fav hero
stiff quail
I thought the little girl in the short was Sombra
cunning ledge
Sombra literally meets the girl in searching
gentle kelp
why do we barely have any reaper or zen lore in general?
worthy rose
Cause thats not where chu wants to focus?
Like the way I would describe it is
Whenever they introduce a character or so; it’s for either the purpose of world expansion or game play or character design
Hammond for example expanded more on junkertown and horizon lunar colony
Sigma was fairly new in creation and while is a part of talon, did not add much lore wise
Because they initially wanted to make mauga but the kit didn’t fit mauga’s character
Zen if you did him, wouldn’t necessarily build upon the world other than perhaps the shambali but they don’t necessarily need building upon cause they really just be “new omnic religion thing that is good”
And any lore on him would focus too much on him as an individual
Reaper I personally think they dont wanna give too much away about Talon yet as they are still writing and the juciest bits of the lore like his conflict with soldier 76 would easily be huge but they either have yet to write it or dont wanna reveal it yet
gentle kelp
k
worthy rose
I am personally waiting for the comics that were promised
lament prawn
tbh i doubt any of the characters exist merely for design and variety, i think most of not all will tie into the lore one way or another
worthy rose
They do
lament prawn
sub plots and background plots are still important
worthy rose
They exist for design and are then afterwards given a place in the lore
Baptiste was like that
Ashe was like that
lament prawn
d.va was the "winky face peace sign ^_^" character type until they gave her more depth and lore, which still doesnt tie into the main conflict directly but is very enjoyable. perhaps at some point her and other characters will get roped into the real spotlight
oh yeah, they are definitely designed first, but i what im saying is i doubt they'll leave any of the characters at that without giving them a proper place in the lore
blizzard are all about visual appeal, that always comes first
limpid agate
Shooting Star and D.Va's other character was still handled horribly
D.Va in game does not exist in that short.
D.Va in that short does not exist in game.
They just wrote a new character and called it "the real D.Va"
worthy rose
By the devs and I believe Chu’s own admission
They create a character for the following purposes
- Game play need
- Character design was cool
- Story need
The game needed an anchor tank and thats how orisa was made;
Ashe got made first over others cause she looked cool by the team’s own admission
Moira got made because Chu wanted a sort of symmetry where talon had tanks and healers and also to give a more legit reason to reaper’s condition since a vast bunch of the community thought mercy messed him up
lament prawn
tbh, i think its pretty creative that she uses her d.va persona in-game considering the players can be seen as her "audience" and she's technically on one of her missions. (besides, the d.va persona fits her appearance and they want to appeal to a certain group of people with her in-game character) the short opened making us expect her to appear and act as she does in-game "now she's out enjoying some glamour!", "i play to win!", her kissing her trophy. and then the very direct comparison of 'd.va' and 'hana' when dae-hyun held up the nano cola can with d.va posing for the camera with her "nerf this!" line plastered on it, and then he lowers the can to show hana checking over her mech for any scratches, getting flashbacks, and genuinely worried about korea
i really dont mind the way they went about her tbh
worthy rose
I do kinda mind
Mainly cause I think they really screwed themselves when they made it apart of the lore that DVA and the rest of Meka “Stream” their escapades against the gwishin
Doing so created that “Streamer” persona that we see often in game
lament prawn
yes, i assume she acts as she does in-game during her streams because her audience is watching her, unless things get really tough like in the flashback
worthy rose
But in lore we see her and she isn’t like that at all which is kinda odd. Cause if the dva we see in game is the same dva the people in korea see and if that was her only character then I wouldnt mind
But it’s like odd cause we are an audience who is aware of the greater overall thing
lament prawn
it was a surprise attack, i dont think she was streaming that
worthy rose
Dva’s persona is meant to calm down the rest of korea to let them know they are fine
But we as an audience and gamers don’t necessarily need to see that when we play her so we should be able to see her real character and nature but we do not
I say “Stream” instead of stream because I do not think they’re actually streaming said fight
Mainly cause that would be actually awful or gruesome to see
And instead have a set of pre recorded things to show possible contingency as “Streams”
lament prawn
the game isn't canon and very stylized. like i said, she's meant to appeal to a certain group of people with her design and persona, not all gamers use the emoticons she uses and act like she does. tracer murders reaper and mocks his "death comes" voice line, ana sleep darts pharah and says "i think justice could use a little nap", mei gets a multi-kill and says "wow, so fun!"
worthy rose
Where they put on the persona cause remember these are young adults
That’s not what we mean tho
limpid agate
D.Va has a very set and definined personality in game.
There is not one instance of that personality existing in the short
While for your 3 examples
All 3 of those personality traits exist in their respective character shorts/stories
Tracer is a playful and energetic fighter
worthy rose
Every character has a voice line or so that gives off something they would say. Everything DVA says and how she says it is not the same as in lore
Everything Tracer and the rest say are fitting to their characters in lore as well as in game
lament prawn
the short very directly implied her in-game personality is the one she puts on for the public audience, while she was only being genuine in private
worthy rose
DVA is the only one with a very contrasting in game persona vs in cinematic
limpid agate
Yes
It did do that
And it did it poorly
By not showing "public D.Va persona" a single time.
Nor does her in game character show "private genuine Hana" a single time either
The closest you get is a map specific sad line about Eichenwalde reminding her of Busan
Which might not even be in game anymore, and also doesn't break her original character
Because they were written like two different people
Rather than the same character
lament prawn
my opinion is that the short went about it fine, they dont need to throw the in-game d.va in our face considering they implied its existence and role in the intro and news at the end. what i can agree on is that she needs more genuine interactions in the game because those are non-existent aside from like one map interaction
limpid agate
It was not a good short. This is only ne of the flaws it had
Its arguably the worst short.
lament prawn
i personally liked it
limpid agate
Ok, that's fine.
But it was not good.
Aside from D.Va's poor and jarring characterization
The dialogue was all just forced exposition
The fight made no sense
And the whole moral of "you can't do everything by yourself" was moot because D.Va did, in fact, do everything by herself
lament prawn
dae-hyun is the one that overloaded the reactor after she admitted she needed help, it just wasnt going fast enough so she had to speed it up
lament prawn
they showed him typing in commands, a shot of the reactor going crazy, and then says "i got it! your reactor's going critical, you have 60 seconds until it blows."
limpid agate
And then she blows it up herself anyways
Dae-Hyun's contribution in that was useless
lament prawn
the reactor began acting up, blew up pieces of the mech, and in the process exposed itself from within the mech, i doubt three shots from her pistol would have blown it up in the first place
limpid agate
The entire short is a mess
It was good at the start with the news reel, then fell apart after that
Dae-Hyun is Lynx.
He does technically contribute in the context of the short
But if he didn't exist
His contribution would have been done naturally anyways
lament prawn
you may not like the short, but my point there is that dae-hyun did help - you said his only contribution was merely mentioning the reactor. the moral was admitting when you need help and that that's okay, not having someone do all the work for you
limpid agate
And exists solely for character reasons
Its a horrible way to do that message.
Because his help
Wasnt even him trying to help
For the reactor thing
In fact, he was trying to say the exact opposite. Dont do that
SO fine, you convinced me that the most useful thing he does is blow the top off of the reactor.
Something that probably would have happened anyways with the omnic attacking and crushing her mech
Much like Lynx 17 saying that SOmbra was in Dorado
Even though that was also international news
lament prawn
yes, what would it have portrayed if he instantly was like "blow up the mech you're in? let's do it". they also want to show his concern for her, and before even mentioning the reactor he was listing off a bunch of the mech's statistics trying to provide any assistance he can.
limpid agate
And even still
That doesn't change that Hana Song and D.Va
Are still poorly written as "the same character."
Even something as small as a transition from "act to real" or "real to act" might have been enough to alleviate that
Or having a handful of Hana Song lines in game
And that was poor writing.
lament prawn
having a handful of hana song lines in-game is what i'd like
limpid agate
It would be like if they were to write a Lucio short where in the whole short he's just acting haughty and malicious when he's not the international DJ/Freedom Fighter, because that's "the real Lucio"
lament prawn
is your argument that they wrote two different characters which isnt right? or that that they didn't show the act/real transition well enough?
limpid agate
Both.
Hana Song as a character does not exist anywhere outside Shooting Star.
Even though she's been in game for 2 years
Coincidentally
D.Va, the character that everyone loves
Does not exist in her own short.
lament prawn
its pretty common for a public celebrity figure to put on an act for the public. what would be surprising is if they did the same for someone like tracer
limpid agate
The "Real Hana Song"
Is not the D.Va that people have known for 3 years
And this change in character had 0 indication in the years leading up to it
And it wasn't a character development change in character either
It was just
"OH she's always been like this, you just didn't see it"
lament prawn
its not a change in character, we were always seeing her public persona
that persona still exists, whenever she's on stage
limpid agate
That is a change in character by definition.
frosty shell
We do have some OOC D. Va lines
frosty shell
Yes
lament prawn
i dont think we're gonna get anywhere arguing about this, i think its best to drop it
frosty shell
And D. Va's interactions are with someone she's familiar with in Shooting Star
So in the environment thr game seems to take place in it makes sense for her to act different
limpid agate
Sure
But that doesnt change that the entire Shooting Star D.Va as a character
Is a new character
Hana Song is someone we have known for a long time.
Shooting Star Hana Song
Is a different character than the one that led to people asking for Shooting Star.
Its comparable to Junkrat being a sane inventor when he's alone, but we've never seen him when he's alone.
And its just proximity to other people that encourages him to put on the act of a madman
With the "OOC" part being that Junkrat does make competent explosives despite being an unhinged lunatic
Is it a technically possible path they can go down?
Sure
Is it good writing?
FUck no
frosty shell
I agree that D. Va in Shooting Star maybe should've had more D. Va like things
It's not terrible writing quite though
limpid agate
They went so far to distance her from D.Va that she didn't even have her facepaint
Before someone starts attacking me for a stupid and useless comment
I was just making an addition to the idea that D.Va and Hana are seperate not just in personality, but visually too.
frosty shell
She has some D. Va-ish traits though agree it could be bigger
She is a little cocky and all
frosty shell
Ok
limpid agate
Hana Song is confident and also tries to take on the burden of everything herself
D.Va is cocky and thinks she can do it all because she's the best.
frosty shell
That might just be how it comes off
frosty shell
Maybe being cocky is how D. va expresses her feeling that she wants to handle it by herself
I think that Mission Statement would've worked as a D. Va story
limpid agate
Maybe being cocky is how D. va expresses her feeling that she wants to handle it by herself
lament prawn
im just gonna end it on this, your junkrat example isnt really that good of an example because he's not a public celebrity figure that needs a persona, and the persona of a madman isn't one the public would find appealing anyway compared to d.va's cheery optimistic persona (putting on an act as a celebrity isnt unusual and is pretty cliche, so they didnt need to go too far to show it). her lack of facepaint make up as clarified in the behind the scenes video was to be visual representation of her being outside her d.va persona, as well as the ponytail for a more casual look. could people have predicted the way real hana song is? probably not, but its welcome development in my personal opinion (i certainly wouldnt have wanted her speaking in emojis in private with dae-hyun) considering they aren't directly breaking any previous character, but merely clarifying that character was the persona she puts on for the world. keep in mind this is just the way i see it, im not gonna argue longer about this topic but ill be back later on to read replies.
limpid agate
Yeah that's probably the intention
her lack of facepaint make up as clarified in the behind the scenes video was to be visual representation of her being outside her d.va persona
Yeah I know
It was going the extra mile to show that
You're not watching a D.Va short
You're watching the short of a character who is D.Va, but isn't.
frosty shell
She might put on the in-gane persona with her team
However, you do have a point that D. Va could probably express her short personality in-game but doesn't
limpid agate
That would have been a good way to fix that.
But even then
In the 3 second flashback
It just sounds like general serious chatter and emergencies
frosty shell
That was a pretty intense moment
limpid agate
Yes it was
It would have been out of place to show D.Va in that context and maintain the serious mood
But every time I rewatch the short, I just see another thing that makes me think "Yup that's not D.Va"
Like... What happened to streaming her operations?
frosty shell
As an example of your point, the D.Va from the short would want to prove herself, which many heroes (like Brigitte and Pharah) reflect in the voicelines but D. Va doesn't
limpid agate
If you go to the whole retcon "Oh its just prerecorded propoganda"
frosty shell
D. Va probably does stream her operations
limpid agate
Then like... That's dumb. And also makes no sense in context
Because you could easily see that the fight on stream and the fight out your window
Are two different fights
frosty shell
We just don't see it
limpid agate
Well we didn't see it in her solo fight
Nor did we see it in the flashback
Or anywhere
Not even a reference to it
frosty shell
How do we know none of that fight was streamed?
limpid agate
Exactly
How do we know it was?
All we see is emergencies and a surprised/frightened D.Va
frosty shell
Nothing really implies it wasn't
I agree I would've liked to see a little clip of streaming D. Va on the news
limpid agate
I just think this shot alone
Would be something that would break the personality of "D.Va" and go into "Hana Song"
And I would have liked to see that fight some more and see that transition
That would have been a better way to do it
Than just "Yeah this is D.Va, trust us"
frosty shell
I kind of agree
I don't think it undermines the short quite as much as you do
Though I agree the writing could be better
limpid agate
I just remember thinking "What the fuck was that?" when it finished.