he looks fairly young here, and Ashe is 2 years older than him
#lore-discussion
old breach
worthy rose
They've probably figured out a way to avoid lung cancer, in all fairness.
peak escarp
there is an interaction where Mercy scolds him for it
worthy rose
they've gone 60 years in the future
they made force fields
super monkeys
intelligent machines
but not no-cancer tobacco?
I more so wanna know what the conversation ashe had with McCree before he was hauled off. She said he promised he’d write and I just wanna know how dramatic or sad or comical that would have been
we might get a mission busting deadlock
Like is he giving her a sad way of saying that while he is being hauled off
archives mission
Or is he cracking a joke while she is hauled back to her family
peak escarp
I'd love that
worthy rose
But they'd have to figure out a way to avoid mccree/ashe dying in-game
Probably have B.O.B. as the final boss
I'd think the ending scene would have something about that
peak escarp
one analysis I saw about that conversation was pretty interesting - they pointed out that Ashe saying "You said you'd write" is her really saying "you said you'd do your time and write from jail, but instead you betrayed us and joined the law"
maybe that's reading too much into it, but I thought it was a good take on it
worthy rose
it is
unfortunately, mccree and ashe didn't really stick around to talk about it
in the short
peak escarp
gotta keep up the pacing, no time for chit-chat
worthy rose
Ik but I want/need the context of what happened as McCree was taken away. Like is she broken up after losing a friend she cared for and life has hardened her a bit more but still has a soft spot for him or whats going on
peak escarp
I think the picture she kept tells a big part of that story
if you look closely at it, you can tell it was ripped in half then taped back together
worthy rose
Mhmm but I still want that specific scene cause I imagine it was pretty powerful
Or comical
And in either case i am giddy with imagination
peak escarp
she probably felt betrayed/angry when she found out he sold out Deadlock to join Overwatch
worthy rose
Didnt realize bob played cards
peak escarp
but then kept the photo because she still had good memories (maybe even still had feelings for him)
also more young McCree
timid eagle
Yeah, Ash’s general upbringing and crew of friends is pretty messed up, if you really think about it.
Her main guardian was an Omnic Butler, who was around to keep Ashe company for most of her childhood/teen years.
And one of her closest friends chewed her and the gang he ran with/founded.
On top of that, said crew can either be the most competent bunch around, or Storm Trooper-levels of idiocy.
noble cliff
i love ashe so much
just her aesthetic and backstory
i want them to delve deeper into their relationship
she obviously likes him and he must have liked her too but what made mccree turn on them?
worthy rose
I really don't think McCree betrayed them then and there. I take it more as like he tried to resist with them but was ultimately taken away and given the option of work for blackwatch or rot in prison blue
acoustic glacier
I haven't seen the Reunion short yet
I need to
Also question, have any of you seen the video of "Bob does every highlight and dance"?
There's one that shows a picture of him and Ashe having a party
Is that a cut highlight?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KszCZff7BKA The first one in this video
worthy rose
Soldier 76 is gay, who got angry at that? Cuz I know some people did
they banned discussion because too many people were arguing about it and randoms came in every five mins asking about it
Oh I didn't realise discussion was banned, my bad
It's fine, they won't hate you for not knowing
Why was there so much arguing?
something something unnecessary something pointless lgbt whatever
Basically people kept saying that Soldier's boyfriend was pointless and unnecessary and even changing the character
🤔
It wasn't even a big piece of the short story, just one of a few subjects mentioned in conversation
Exactly
I find it much more interesting that Ana decided to use a priceless artifact that might be thousands of years old as a disguise in combat.
I don't think the whole Solider 76 thing is that big a deal tbh, I mean Tracer is already gay and out of a cast of around 30 characters, I was surprised she was the only one
That's just my take on it
I just don't care, Vincent probably won't get involved and Soldier's interactions with other people would probably be exactly the same if he was straight.
Tbh as long as they do more with the Meka squad, I don't care what else happens
Not sure if any of them would be added to the game unless they can figure out how to make them work differently to D.va but I would like to see more lore on them
there's probably going to be more updates on D.Va and the squad
But more two-form heroes is unlikely, partly because it seems kinda awkward.
Would it? I mean they could make it so only one of the Meka squad can be on a team at a time
Again, somewhat awkward mechanics.
Plus, having two similar mech heroes gets kinda boring
d.va and hammond are ok because their playstyles are completely different
But if they all did different things then it could possibly work, like maybe one could have active camo or one could heal or shoot poison, it could create a level of strategy to using a character like D.va
If not, I would love a story revolving around the squad where maybe one of them dies or the squad gets dispanded or just explains why they're not around and helping D.va
there's probably going to be more lore
I hope so considering D.va is my favourite character and there's literally almost nothing on the squad she was with before overwatch
she hasn't joined overwatch though
I know that
Was she even invited to join?
no
at least, not yet
I mean they have the same enemy and so that's why they fight together but it does seem strange how she hasn't joined overwatch, I think her and Winston could be great friends as they're both tech nerds
they don't have the same enemy
that massive omnic is almost definitely not associated with talon
Wait so why do they fight together then? I've clearly missed something
peak escarp
because the game doesn't represent canon
worthy rose
otherwise we'd need a reason for why doomfist and mercy can be on the same team
Tru tru, I still think D.va should join Overwatch
worthy rose
Definitely, I feel like it would probably be near the end of the story if it's going to happen
I hope the next lot of story is to do with Mccree and Echo then they add Echo to the game
And then I not play her 😅😂
worthy rose
I just wanna ask michael what percent of the story are they done
Just as like a frame of reference to know what to expect
it probably won't be done for a while
OW almost definitely won't go away in the next few years, and they can't run out of lore.
wraith zealot
ı think they are slowly coming to the present day
but thats not the ending point
they will move forward from there
wraith zealot
not entirely
most of the lore that we get are from cinematics are past
or archives missions
peak escarp
Recall, Alive, Hero, Dragons, Infiltration, Shooting Star and Reunion are all present day
Honor and Glory and Rise and Shine are present day with flashbacks or part of the story set in the past
The Last Bastion is in the past
wraith zealot
ı always fuck up with order of these things ı thought recall, alive,hero were in a way past things
like just a bit before the present day
peak escarp
depends what you count as "present day"
the hero bios and timeline references treat Recall as present day
parts of the story (Masquerade and Searching, specifically) happen about a year later
peak escarp
I'm always surprised by people who think The Last Bastion happens around the time of Recall
but I guess not everybody is obsessed with timelines like I am
worthy rose
to be fair, there are no indicators of when the last bastion happens
you'd have to go into the lore fairly deeply to find that one
worn solar
Why don’t Ana and Jack take Reinhardt more seriously?
worthy rose
because he's kinda funny
worn solar
He’s like one of the founding fathers of Overwatch
worthy rose
they are too
they are old friends, so they have the right to recount reinhardt's fails
especially the funny ones
peak escarp
friend groups often have one person who is the butt of every joke
it doesn't mean they aren't friends, they're just always doing funny things
didnt you ever think it was strange that all the other founders have leadership positions
but Reinhardt was just a lieutenant
I wonder if Reinhardt started off lower ranked and just never got promoted
peak escarp
I know its not relevant to the story, but I want to know more about the heroes's families
maybe they could give us some blog posts about them
I'd be very surprised if Genji, Hanzo and Brigitte were the only ones with siblings
dense estuary
I figure D.Va is good for new OW but I doubt the army would release her or MEKA assets until OmnicZilla is neutralized.
valid shell
So make Junker/Scavenger D.Va canon.
D.Va befriending Junkrat and Roadhog and getting their help to create a new mech on the condition she wins the Scrapyard and gets them back into Junkertown would be great.
worthy rose
seems kinda weird
D.Va would almost immediately get extracted by the south korean military because she's literally the face of the MEKA squad
valid shell
This is in an instance where she's no longer with MEKA.
Like if the Omnic Kaiju is finally defeated and D.Va is left purposeless without MEKA funding her anymore.
And video games don't do it for her anymore.
worthy rose
Probably still hired by the south korean military
assuming she doesn't want to go back to gaming, how does she get to australia?
it would probably be more likely that she would go to overwatch, considering the condition of australia.
limpid agate
I dont see her joining either
Especially since she seems to be more honour driven, rather than fueled by glory
worthy rose
exactly.
worthy rose
She could always end up being an honoury member of Overwatch
So she wouldnt be a full time member but they could trust her to fight along side them if means deem necessary
iron plume
...do you mean honorary
worthy rose
I can't spell very well but yes
iron plume
because that's a different thing
and it's not like it's a full time job for main members either
worthy rose
That's tru 🤔
I don't know how things would work but I believe she would really fit in at overwatch
iron plume
she wouldn't join anything else while she's busy with the gwishin and meka
worthy rose
Yes I know so what if she was made an honorary member until she's done her duty for Korea
iron plume
why would overwatch give out honorary memberships
they're not a charity organization
she'll likely join at some point later
worthy rose
Idk, I'm just thinking of options where she'll end up as a member of Overwatch😅
She may not even join in the end but I think she more than likely will and im curious to how they would go about it
worthy rose
That's tru
past panther
Isn't D.va also an actress? Or is that not canon? Some of the posters on Busan, I believe, show her as an actress in some movies.
Or maybe it was Hollywood.
iron plume
she does have posters on both
sand nest
i think she is an actor
true falcon
For Honor has a poster on a map. I don't remember what one tho
quasi karma
Are there any other monkey heroes that we know of in overwatch lore?
iron plume
there are several other apes that were on the colony, they rebelled and killed the scientists
none of them are prospective heroes though
quasi karma
Aight
uneven sun
What happens after Winston's overwatch recall
is that where the game takes place after the recall
pearl blade
The game isn't canon, which is weird. The places and heroes are canon but having Reinhardt and reaper on the same team wouldn't happen in lore
winged matrix
most of the shorts took place after the recall, but only reunion, rise and shine and some of Rein's short actually involve the recall itself
*that I know of
iron plume
as in the heroes are how they are after recall, which is why Soldier makes references to it
latent wind
I'm not sure what is odder
OW game/canon where Talon and Overwatch agents fight on the same team against their own side or even their own clones
Or Rainbow Six where dudes from the same IRL special forces kill each other
worthy rose
It's just that hero limitations according to lore would be really annoying and hard to implement
lean prawn
overwatch the game isn't canon
worthy rose
Also, there are roughly eight evil-aligned characters, with one tank. That would be a pretty crappy team.
yes, game != lore
chilly peak
Voice lines are mess as well. Some of them are canon, some of them might be, but there are non-canon lines. Such as "traitor!" when you kill Reaper as Reinhardt. It is confirmed that Rein doesn't know the true identity of Reaper and this voice line is not canon. More like "what he would say if he knows"
limpid agate
They all are "what would they say if they were in a given situation"
It's not that complex at all
A line that says "I don't want to team up with you" says nothing but the two wouldn't like each other
A line that says "Looks like we are teaming up AGAIN" tells us they did team up once, but not necessarily again
latent wind
It's just that hero limitations according to lore would be really annoying and hard to implement```
Oh, I totally agree
long ermine
Looks like we are teaming up again doesn’t always mean they have teamed up in canon right? Like widow/tracer have that interaction a lot
I always took it as 4th wall breaking previous game mentions if that makes sense
peak escarp
Widowmaker: Tiens, tiens. [Well, well.] It looks like we will be working together.
Tracer: Don't think I'm happy about that!
they don't say "again"
unlike other interactions . . .
Reaper: Looks like we're working together again.
Widowmaker: Let's hope it goes better than the time at the museum.
long ermine
Ah okay. Guess I misheard the widow line, get it so many times I don’t even listen anymore
cloud escarp
roadhog's nails are black because he has blood under them, they arent painted
just posted that cause i heard some ppl say he paints his nails
valid shell
@cloud escarp Source?
cloud escarp
it was a while ago, on twitter. blizzrd said "bold of you to assume thats thats paint" they didnt say much more so ppl sat down to deduce this (a lot of stuff just for black nails) and the most logical conclussion was blood
to be fair, blizz never said it was blood tho
valid shell
So the people saying it's nail polish are just as valid as your theory that it's blood.
Without either being proven or disproven.
valid shell
Do you have a link?
cloud escarp
im tryna find where they said it rn
wait this is too much if i look and i cant find the link, i'll just delete the message
in my opinion its blood tho
valid shell
Point I'm trying to make is to be careful about stating theories and headcanons as fact.
That's how we ended up with "Mercy created Reaper" for years.
cloud escarp
ye i agree
but i found the source
i was wrong about source info, its a vid not a tweet
remember that old jeff kapln interview
"blizzard answers unsolved mysteries of overwatch universe"
valid shell
He just says it's not paint. It could be engine grease or tarmac. Would fit his aesthetic.
cloud escarp
ye thats tru they never did say it was blood, tbh i just dont like the whole "he paints his nails" thing
at least i proved that part
valid shell
What's wrong with painting nails?
cloud escarp
the image of roadhog sitting down and painting his nails is disturbing
valid shell
Why?
cloud escarp
cause he's like a badass murderer or whatever and imo, him sitting down smiling and painting his nails seems discomforting
i could accept junkrat doing that
not hog
valid shell
And you're okay with him sitting still for multiple hours a day for several sessions to get a cartoon pig tattooed on his stomach with his distended bellybutton as a snout?
I'd say nail painting is the less silly of the two.
cloud escarp
if he did his nails do his nails you think he would smile under the mask while doing it?
idk im not saying its wrong, im saying that i peronally dont like that idea
the tattoo somehow is better in my mind, idk how to explain it
cloud escarp
ok lemme restart cause i did make a claim with no backup to it
im saying jeff confirmed roadhog doesnt paint his nails
disregard everything else i said
valid shell
He suggests it's not paint.
He doesn't say Roadhog doesn't do something to his nails.
wanton axle
I’m highly convinced it’s dirt cause do you really think roadhog even ever cleans his hands anyway
wanton axle
True
frail loom
Wait how is soldier gay how is that confirmed
tepid abyss
On Twitter confirmed by Michael chu
wanton axle
He was revealed he used to have a crush on a guy named Vincent in the new short story
peak escarp
not just a crush - Vincent was his boyfriend
tepid abyss
Might've been more than a crush too, it was referred to as a "relationship"
wanton axle
Oh sorry
quasi karma
We know about the Meka Squad but do you guys think they’ll add another member from that squad? If so which one?
worthy rose
Probably not, blizzard has shown their annoyance with the two-forms mechanic and it would be pretty hard to make another MEKA hero that is appreciably different.
limpid agate
If they do
3/4 of them have potential
D.Mon is popular.
Casino could expand the story best.
Overlord is the most mechanically unique
I'd rather see Overlord or Casino if any. D.Mon doesn't interest me as much
And King is... The least noteable. He has an artillery and was D.Va's main rival
chilly peak
True, but I'm sure they got more experience, and doing mech hero isn't that hard as in the past. I think they might add another MEKA Squad hero, but in the very distant future
limpid agate
Distant yes
quasi karma
Also obviously D.mon looks more like a tank, but some of the MEKA’s look more DPS oriented.
@limpid agate where did you find out King’s Meka is artillery?
peak escarp
his mech's name is Singijeon, which is a type of traditional Korean artillery
also his mech looks like it shoots a barrage of rockets
huh
the same artist who did the stills for Shooting Star also did the group image of the scientists at Ecopoint Antarctica for Rise and Shine
and the early concept drawings for Ashe
quasi karma
Ah aight
Well I mean if king shoots rocket he could be a ground hybrid Pharah, Junkrat, D.va thing
quasi karma
Casino looks dps ish
peak escarp
Casino and King could be tank or damage
quasi karma
Casino looks dps oriented because of his meka’s curvature which has more aerodynamic features
peak escarp
I don't really care if they get added to the game, but I'd love to get more lore involving them
Casino especially
peak escarp
he's an F1 racer with a mech named La Princese Sereine
which is the title of the Princess of Monaco
quasi karma
How did you find out that?
peak escarp
so it's very likely he has connections to Monaco, and maybe Maximilien
quasi karma
Hm
peak escarp
Twitter
also the Monaco Grand Prix is pretty much the most important F1 race
he has 100% raced in Monaco
based on Overlord's mech name and his own username, it's highly likely that he's a StarCraft pro
which is also interesting, but less relevant to the plot
quasi karma
Yeah, I am more interested in the gameplay aspects of them
But i do feel they would be great for D.va’s lore too.
hasty surge
Then that means we have nothing on king?
quasi karma
Wym @gleaming comet
gleaming comet
?
quasi karma
Idk
limpid agate
@hasty surge He's DVas rival. That's about it
dire timber
uh, not really
I mean, why would rivals have matching names
they're more like teammates
limpid agate
They were teammates yeah
King wasn't
People just seem to confuse D.mon's resting bitch face as being mad or spiteful at D.Va
peak escarp
D.Va also has close ties to the rest of her squad, who include her former main esports rival Kyung-soo (“King”) and one of her former clanmates, tough and protective Yuna (“D.mon”). The other two members are the squad’s maknae, Seung-hwa (“Overlord”) and the flashy Jae-Eun (“Casino”, a former racing driver). Finally, there’s their commanding officer, Captain Myung (who you hear over the comms in the MEKA base part of the Busan map).
nimble pollen
Is Gabriel Reyes Middle/South American or African American
wraith zealot
i believe he is latino from california
nimble pollen
His appearance in Moira's origin story there he is dark skin
But in game not ? And his face not like African American very confusing
white cobalt
He could have latinoamerican heritage, but born and raised in LA, California
peak escarp
the difference in skin tone can be blamed on artistic differences
the concept art for his Blackwatch Reyes skin gives him a medium skin tone
it's the same as his in-game model
peak escarp
Reyes is a latino name
reef thicket
oh
peak escarp
I would classify him as Latino, not Black
nimble pollen
That makes ddnse
reef thicket
naked reyes
and yeah probably
although its painyfully obvious that he has different skin tone
just look at moira
nimble pollen
👀 👀 👀
peak escarp
Moira is also freakishly pale
so even a medium skin tone will look darker by comparison
reef thicket
true
she looks like shes a fucking vampire lmao
that or shes been in a basement for 30 eyars
years
nimble pollen
That might have been the case
@peak escarp Don't forget tall
She is tall than roadhog
reef thicket
she looks shorter if anything
also i love her fucking
hands behind back walking
i wish there was an emote ingame where she just
puts her hands behind her back and walks foward
wraith zealot
i mean she is irish they tent to be either reddish a bit from sun or very pale
comparing to someone who is both latino and from a sunny place like california
difference will be extreme
reef thicket
also
uh
why did genji change his like
body?
like in blackwatch he still had actual human features
he had hair shoulder hell even an entire arm
but the genji we know him as today is just entirely cyborg
peak escarp
having parts of your body exposed while in combat is unsafe
peak escarp
he probably still has that shoulder/arm, just under armor plating
during his Blackwatch missions he was still a work in progress
reef thicket
ah
i wonder if they'd ever make this moira into a skin
i mean it looks really similar to blackwatch but it still looks quite different
frosty shell
Moira's suit there looks like Mercy's I think
reef thicket
ye
but he looks
she looks
different probably because she has no hat / tube weapon
like doctor said
peak escarp
I think Moira's lore would mostly be boring
scientific research and getting ridiculed
peak escarp
I'd say Soldier, Ana, Reaper, Tracer and McCree have the most lore
Moira has only appeared in like 2 things (and both were cameos)
worthy rose
yea but the sheer amount of stuff we know about her is huge
regal coyote
well compare to many other heroes moira is moderately known
as in we know reasonabe stuff about her
worthy rose
We know her background, we know her motivations, we know her current allegiances, we know her history with the main overwatch group, and we know most importantly she is a dog person
regal coyote
like we have a reasonable background and timeline about her stuff
and things like personality and what not
also, natural hetrochroma
worthy rose
What more specifics could you ask for her?
peak escarp
I dunno
just pointing out the difference in the quality of lore we know about her vs someone like Tracer or Soldier
granite gazelle
I love heterochromia
worthy rose
I still don't understand what you mean. I feel they're all roughly the same in what we know in putting lore out there. Like there's not many questions I could ask if given the opportunity at blizz con or so that I could think of asking for Moira. Same with Tracer and Soldier if it was just trivia.
peak escarp
I just mean that I want to see stories/comics/shorts involving Moira
she hasn't played a major role in anything yet
worthy rose
besides Retribution
I think that either she's with Talon, in which case she probably goes on a mission with them to do some evil thing like Infiltration, or she isn't, in which case her story could probably go anywhere.
peak escarp
eh, even in Retribution she wasn't the focus - it was more about the conflict between Reyes and McCree
worthy rose
I mean with that argument wouldn't DVA or Lucio be more demanded? I don't remember any comic that either was in and they were in the game since launch
regal coyote
to be fair tracer/76 is the poster child
ajust as reaper/widow being the poster antag, a sort of team rocket
technically winston is poster child too... but less so cause of his look i guess (easier to sell humans)
peak escarp
I made a compilation of every time the full moon has appeared in the lore
I don't think it's accidental that the full moon appears so often
(sources are Dragons, Mission Statement, Hero, Reflections, Binary, Shooting Star and Bastet)
if we knew what year these take place then we could narrow down exactly when they happened
past panther
Does Blizzard know that the full moon is not the only version of the moon that exists, even for atmospheric reasons
What about a half moon for a change
peak escarp
I think the full moon mentioned in Bastet is the same full moon as the one seen through Torbjorn's window in Reflections
it matches timeline-wise
limpid agate
Im thinking its an artistic choice
Now show all the times a non-full moon was shown
winged matrix
Having all the events happening at the same time would be a cooler choice
kind of ties together the timeline in some ways
like when each short takes place based on the earth's rotation
limpid agate
Its either a full moon, or nothing at all
winged matrix
coincidence, I think not
limpid agate
Even Junkenstein is a full moon
peak escarp
I would say it's just for aesthetics if it weren't for Reflections and Bastet
in Reflections, it's an indoor scene with the moon visible through a window
the artist made a conscious decision to include the full moon (or maybe was told to include it somehow)
in Bastet, it's just a description - Chu could have said "the moon" but he chose to say "the full moon"
limpid agate
the artist also forgot Roadhog's tattoo
Bastet being intentional at best is just to call back to Reflections which did have it
peak escarp
but the scene in Bastet happens a week or so before the scene seen in Reflections
I don't think all the events seen on that spread in Reflections all happen at the same time
in an interview Chu hinted that the hockey game behind Pharah was the IIHF World Juniors tournament, which starts the day after Christmas
found the reference for the world juniors
limpid agate
I think they all did end up at the same time and that was very intentional
But I don't need a moon to tell me that
I could tell from the context of Winston's monologue
(Does it count as monologue if it's just Athena?)
jade epoch
http://prntscr.com/m84dkw
Has anyone seen any logical theories for who the these two characters are?
limpid agate
I'm gonna guess the picture before clicking on it.
Bottom left is not Liao or Emre Sarioglu. Might be the guy with the bionic pecs that's had a few appearances and is also speculated to be on the Talon board in the present.
Right is a massive mystery. Its not Mirembe, maybe Gabrielle Adawe?
jade epoch
oooh
limpid agate
He also confirmed that Emre had no backstory
So its not him either
Even though that's the time Emre would have been part of Overwatch
jade epoch
fricking heck
Does Gabrielle Adawae have any back story other than her appearance in that one soldier 76 story?
im just assuming you know everything
lol
iron plume
you wouldn't be wrong
she's a UN official who took a big part in forming OW https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Gabrielle_Adawe
peak escarp
I don't think she's Gabrielle
Gabrielle orchestrated the strike team during the omnic crisis, and was undersecretary of the UN - the woman in that picture looks like she's in her mid 20s
I always pictured Gabrielle as an older woman, maybe with an Amanada Waller sort of vibe
worthy rose
What comic is this
peak escarp
First Strike
worthy rose
Is this new???
peak escarp
the cancelled comic
worthy rose
Oh
peak escarp
no, it was from 2016
the project was abandoned like a week before it was supposed to come out
chilly peak
Most probably she is Gabriele Adawe
I wonder if there was a big shift in OW lore when Chris Metzen left Blizzard and Michael Chu took his job
And that's why they cancelled First Strike
I know the official statement why they did it
valid shell
Metzen just leased Soldier: 76 and named Doomfist, as far as I know.
Oh and I think he "voices" Bastion or something?
round bough
peak escarp
you mean Liao?
unknown - some people think she was retconned out of the story when First Strike got canceled, others think they're still in the story but Blizz is holding onto her for something
valid shell
tf is liall
high nymph
@valid shell its obviously snas undertale
limpid agate
@high nymph Shitposting will result in a loss of access.
dire timber
tfw the only depiction of Hakim we actually have is the Katsuwatch one
peak escarp
I like their animation, but I don't like their art style
limpid agate
I wonder if Hakim can Hulk out or not
dawn knot
yes!!
regal coyote
there is absioultely no reason Liao is indicated to be retconned out
at worst they will keep it as a mystery 6th which can be a storyline in the future
this is especially true since there is no info on liao other than her being one of the founders.
And by her imean loosely, it can still be an omnic
peak escarp
I just call her "she" because I'll be sad if Ana was the only female founding member of Overwatch
regal coyote
yes, another female HUMAN founder would be nice
though as a team having a non-human element would make sense, from the comic book tradition also
peak escarp
I'd like to get an omnic affiliated with Overwatch
Echo seems to be filling that niche
dawn knot
it would seem strange to have non human elements in the foundation of overwatch
considering their main objective in the beginning was to eliminate the omnic uprising
unless not all of them became "possessed"
or perhaps the god ai were not even a part of the uprising
and so they only happened to fight war robots programmed to destroy from the beginning
even then i suppose they are able to change, cite bastion
but i feel as though torbjorn would have been less surprised had that happened before bastion, during the founding
so considering this, i actually retract my statement
it's fully plausible to think that there could have been an omnic element in the foundation, as long as the god ai was not apart of the original omnic uprising
limpid agate
God Programs probably weren't a thing until the past decade
If the Cairo Incident was Anubis
regal coyote
I know the story is not canon, but still, i wonder how much of that is info from blizz
limpid agate
Same
swift blaze
Probably was an incident that actually occurred in the storyline at some point
Like the main idea of it
dawn knot
aren't robot and omnic synonymous
regal coyote
anyone know what extra things you get from buyin g a box of Lucio-oh?
or is it just a lootbox?
limpid agate
@dawn knot Are tissue and Kleenex synonymous?
limpid agate
I wouldn't say essentially
You blow your nose with tissue, you wipe your mouth with tissue, you dry your hands or dishes with tissue, you wipe after using the toilet with tissue
But not all of those are Kleenex.
Likewise, not all robots are Omnics.
dawn knot
well i'd read somewhere that the term "robot" and "omnic" were synonymous. I remember it being a post from some writer but excuse my ineptitude i guess
limpid agate
If you blow your nose with Puffs Plus Facial Tissue, you're still gonna call it Kleenex. Same goes in universe for robots that look like Omnics and act like Omnics, but are not technically Omnics (lire Orisa)
dawn knot
ok i understand
limpid agate
Likewise, there are robots that are obviously not Omnics like how toilet tissue is obviously not Kleenex. Example: Snowball.
regal coyote
@limpid agate on the "katsuwatch being semi-official" part, my actual interest is that if the ana76 eventually contact mercy
dawn knot
i feel as though the whole short is a stylized and exaggerated version of what actually occurred
which certain comics seem to be also to a certain extent, but that's just my theory at that point
limpid agate
!!loreText
twilit nacelleBOT
Short Stories:
Bastet: https://bit.ly/2QuXHmM
News Reports:
Fading Glory; Jack Morrison: http://bit.ly/2f9TPq4
Experimental Weapon Stolen: http://bit.ly/2fMrKsj
Lucio's Synaesthesia World Tour: http://bit.ly/2flja2U
LumériCo: http://bit.ly/1XAJfd1
Overwatch is Back: http://bit.ly/1TAWebT
LumériCo Revealed: http://bit.ly/2e6P5oj
Portero Steps Down: http://bit.ly/2fk8Bes
Efi Oladele Interview: http://bit.ly/2miMZkT
Horizon Lunar Colony: http://bit.ly/2reMSKx
Attack on Helix: http://bit.ly/2tn45mk
Oslo Attack: https://bit.ly/2uHKXUr
Other Blog Posts:
Mei's Adventure: http://bit.ly/2fMxRg4
Oasis Travel Tips: http://bit.ly/2iPTM4K
Torb's Letter: http://bit.ly/2HK4CWa
Venice Declassified: https://bit.ly/2Hs807B
limpid agate
Read Overwatch is Back
Also
@regal coyote Yeah. That house seemed too nice and her stress seemed out of character though. As does Jack's recklessness in the fight.
He's reckless, but not in that way
I want to know if Hakim can, in fact, hulk out
Also, I should remove that embed...
!!loreWiki Omnic
twilit nacelleBOT
For more information about the game, please refer to the wiki: https://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Omnic
limpid agate
If you have trusted, you have access to these commands as well
iron plume
the katsuwatch mercy seemed like the genjicat mercy rather than the "real" one
living in a big chill house drinking tea with ana
peak escarp
the art style felt disjointed
you had Soldier's in-game model next to anime girl Ana and Mercy
I'd love to see what that animator could do with proper Blizzard models/rigging
iron plume
that too
peak escarp
the fight scene was well choreographed - I looked up some of his other stuff, he's very good at animating fight scenes
regal coyote
yes katsuwatch is fun to water.
Obviously the fight scenes cant be canon, even for ow the hulk thing is a bit over the top , not thinking of stylistically.
and siscounting the house (a feature in katsuwatch series, they even had an attack on titan in it) do you guys think mercy eventually met ana76?
peak escarp
Soldier was against going to see Angela
also he seemed to be mostly recovered by the time they went after Hakim, so there wasn't much need for it
dire timber
@limpid agate Hakim used some sort of serum there; if that's something he can do in canon, it'd make him an interesting foil to Ana
chilly peak
Hakim worked with Talon, so as Moira does. Maybe it is some kind of genetic growth boost developed by her.
regal coyote
do we KNOW of the hakin-talon connection as is though
maybe he is just a somewhat unknowing neutral party whose interest is solely on historic dealings
in such case it is not likely he got any talon toys
and if the dealings is strictly funded historic findings, then there is no need for talon to reveal anything or equip hak with toys and mods anyways
in such case it is more reasonable to keep hak simple and unmod and level headed
LAST THING you want is to have a hulk in a china(artifect) store
timid veldt
Ok so what im getting at is that the germans and the bastions had a war and either the bastions or the germans lost
regal coyote
that was many many years ago
basically the crusaders retreated successfully, but the base is sacked and the leaded killed.
and mny omnics got pacified yes.
so that end up rein joining overwatch
peak escarp
that "war" was the Omnic Crisis
it was a world war
both sides kinda lost
I think we assume Hakim is with Talon because Reaper was setting up a trap at his compound
peak escarp
I don't think he's actually a member of Talon, just allied with them and taking advantage of the instability caused by Overwatch
regal coyote
on that particular battle yes it is a loss for both sides
the omnic war though, ends up in humans winning, so in most places humans have total control, and treatment to omnics varies
russian front is still going (again) though, and there is that omnic haressing korean area
but all in all the omnics are either pacified or under control
dire pumice
when did reaper become reaper?
before the fight at the overwatch hq or after?
moira's lore makes it seem like it was before
reef thicket
after
which is why he wears a mask
because apperantly his body is a wreck
or atleast his face is
iron plume
he got his abilities before
reef thicket
a wreck from the hq explosion / fight
yeah
abilites before but the reaper stuff after
iron plume
but his appearance changed during or after
dire pumice
and moira is responsible for it right
iron plume
yes
reef thicket
uh
well there was interaction between them like "what happend to u"
"u tell me doc"
people speculated that mercy caused reaper to be like what he is
because she failed some experiment but this was prior to moira being teased / announced
and the story trailer for moira just confirms that it was moira that made reaper
So no its not mercys fault but it was speculated back then
dire pumice
then what does the mercy interaction mean
reef thicket
nothing much
just an interaction
i think reaper is just being sarcastic or something
dire pumice
also
is it canon that reaper had his powers during the mission in venice
or is that just gameplay
reef thicket
sortof canon
it was when reaper was sortof learning what he could do
basically like shortly after moiras experiments
in lore he probaably couldnt do what he could do ingame but still close to it i guess?
dire pumice
retribution is before uprising right?
reef thicket
aye
1 year
retribution was 8 years before the overwatch recall (present day)
uprising was 7 years before recall
infact retribution is probably the main reason why england didnt want to allow OW to help with null sector
because of the news about the venice incident
peak escarp
during the mission you can hear Moira asking Reyes about his condition, how he's feeling etc.
so she has already started working on him at that point
iron plume
I don't know if he's getting worse, but she refers to the whole transformation
her "well" means functional and deadly
iron plume
it can be pretty damn bad
dire pumice
🤔
teal meadow
Lucio is half xehanort
valid shell
@teal meadow Source?
worthy rose
^
worthy rose
what is a xehanort?
worthy rose
I'm still trying to learn the lore, why does reaper join talon after overwatch dispands?
iron plume
we don't exactly know
he blames Overwatch for his condition so he's motivated by revenge
but why specifically joining Talon is not clear
They have resources, and he may have a connection to Widow
but he's not just joined them, he's in a leadership position
worthy rose
What if he was a double agent all along?
iron plume
The question is, "all along" since when?
he fought in the Omnic Crisis, Overwatch was formed during that
would he be Talon's secret operative while fighting bots on the frontline? wouldn't think he'd have time or a reason for that
if not, when and why
the common double agent Reaper theory puts that point at (somewhere around) Retribution, under the influence of Moira
but we don't have evidence to it one way or the other
worthy rose
Oh, I was only joking 😅🙃
peak escarp
people just want Mercy to be responsible for everything
she's a surgeon, not a cyberneticist, not a psychiatrist
hasty surge
It also means that Genji and Mcree knew that Moria working on Reyes for enhancement (then)
dawn knot
^
iron plume
and then some theories are straight up disproven by canon but keep being propagated anyway
brazen flare
One day we will hopefully get a story mode
spiral timber
id play it
frosty star
Well when a theory is disproven it’s no longer a theory lol. Can just call those people dumb and be on your way.
I’ve been dying for a story mode.
peak escarp
we've got Archives, and that's good enough for me - I just wish it wasn't seasonal
"Mercy is a scientist therefore she must study neuroscience, because that's a field that scientists can study"
🤦
wraith zealot
well their reasoning is stupid for her
but mercy is a medical doctor last ı checked
some medical school actually force their students to study neuroscience
like having couple of lessons in few semesters
peak escarp
also this was in the context of making Genji's prosthetics
I don't see what that has to do with neuroscience
weary turtle
Isnt every aspect of that for neuroscience (atleast of what the doctor could actually know and meaby a little about circulatory)
And the bodys possible denial of the prostetic
peak escarp
I don't mean attaching them
I mean actually designing and making them
which is more of an engineering issue
wraith zealot
ım sure she would have hand in them in case of theory or planning of attaching them and usage of them considering genji's body isnt just a giant prostetic but actualy cyber body that acts with his brain person that made it must know about nerve connactions but ı agree with doctor ı dont think it was mercy who 100% made the suit
peak escarp
Mercy gave him his body in the sense that I built my Ikea dresser
sure I picked it out and put it together, but someone else designed it
regal coyote
mercy is not a mechanic
so i dont think she puts that together
she probably have ideas on the medical and the meaty side of things
valid shell
We know Mercy stabilized him, but it was more likely Torbjorn's team who weaponized him.
regal coyote
the mechanical part is for sure not emrcy's doing
but the interface and neural part maybe
yrah the weapon side is probably part torby part someone else
genji's body dont seem to be torby side, so my guess is there is another techno specialist
other than torby and winston
This is especially true for the final version of genji body/armor all sleak and not clunky like torby style (and with ncie ass)
wraith zealot
maybe ass part was mercy's doing
worthy rose
I'd say that winston did most of the final version
Assuming there aren't any characters we don't know about yet involved
latent wind
Generally speaking scientists is most fiction, especially if it is non-realistic like OW, tend to be multi-disciplinary
More to the point OW takes place 50 or 60 years in the future and we know prosthetics are pretty common
So Mercy could have learned all about them in med-school and fixed Genji without needing an engie
wraith zealot
well isnt genji is bit advanced cybernatics even in overwatch degree
there is having prosthetic arm, leg or both but then there is having a half cyber body
valid shell
@wraith zealot His arms are pretty much identical to Symmetra's prosthetic arm, so we know that it's not Overwatch who has access to those types of prosthesis.
But the extent of his augmentation is likely the first of it's kind, yes.
latent wind
The thing is that his cybernetics are no more complicated than any high end omnic
The only issue is connecting them to the meat which Angela seems pretty qualified for
I mean in canon did she invent medical nanomachines? I don;t know if that is canon or fanon
wraith zealot
actually realisticly
genji requires organs
we dont know extend of his injuries
and omnic doesnt need organs
so it will be harder to make genji than making an omnic
peak escarp
she didn't invent medical nanomachines
she made advancements in the field of nanobiology
nanomachines/nanobots in Overwatch are fanon
I don't think OW is non-realistic fiction
digital quiver
don't you love it when you shove ice cream up your arse and it comes out as milkshake?
peak escarp
they go to great lengths to give pseudo-scientific explanations for things
omni-disciplinary scientists don't really fit
iron plume
during the old overwatch hanzo was still a criminal involved in an organized clan
modern overwatch is still small and mostly former old-ow agents or people very close to them
peak escarp
what has Hanzo done that would get him noticed by Overwatch (a side from most kill his brother)?
iron plume
for modern OW, genji might want him in if he thinks hanzo is ready/willing to fight for good as redemption
peak escarp
I think current Hanzo might seek them out
iron plume
aside from him, nothing
peak escarp
take up Genji's suggestion
it would be nice to see Hanzo trying to change
interesting choice for Reaper's Year of the Pig skin
iron plume
yeah
peak escarp
iron plume
parallels him being a military leader in overwatch and then turning against it
peak escarp
yep
I always enjoy the research put into LNY skins
maybe other skins will be based on the Romance of the Three Kingdoms
guess I've got a new reading topic to look up
frosty shell
is this the first skin based on a real person?
gives me hope for Ben Franklin Winston
worthy rose
suprisingly similar
lean prawn
ow dev team artists giving Jeff more reasons to give them a raise
void tree
That looks so dope
reef thicket
wow
tthat does look similar
sucks i havent saved up much credits this event sicne i been suspended for 10 days
and its only just come off winter wonderland..
fringe blade
the events are not properly spaced out imo
reef thicket
yeah
the time between winter wonderland
tand
lunar
is way too short
lunar - archives is good
fringe blade
we get almost nothing may-november
reef thicket
we got like 2+ months before it arrives
fringe blade
and get like 4 events december - april
hasty surge
Lu Bu also went against his adopted father and rebeled
Much like reaper who switched sides
But it was because of a lady
Whom her father send to seduce both of them and put them at odds
dawn knot
reaper looks like a transformer
peak escarp
@fringe blade we get events every 2-3 months
Lunar New Year in February
Archives in April
Anniversary in May
Summer Games in August
Halloween Terror in October
Winter Wonderland in December
limpid agate
Lu Bu?
I think I'm gonna enjoy this year if this is the theme
Hopefully we get Hattori Hanzo
Or Mei Zetian
Or Ogundimu Nobunaga
Fuck, none of this will be skins 
peak escarp
I think you're mixing sources
limpid agate
Hanzo and Nobunaga are Japanese, yes
And Zetian is from a different dynasty than Lu Bu
Although last I checked, it was not strictly Chinese.
peak escarp
no, but the main legendary skins each year have been taken from the same source
in 2016 it was Journey to the West, in 2017 it was the 4 Cardinal Directions/Heavenly Beasts
limpid agate
Yes
peak escarp
this year it seems like Romance of the Three Kingdoms
limpid agate
And this year we have 1 skin, which is a historical figure
Or did we get a second
All I saw was Lu Bu
tepid abyss
Are there any sombra/tracer skin ideas floating around for this event?
peak escarp
no, it's just the one
tepid abyss
Damn, no leaks then
limpid agate
It might not just be Romance of the Three Kingdoms
It could be
General historical figures
1/1 isn't a great source for that, imo
peak escarp
that's the guess at the moment
limpid agate
But it does fit with the idea of taking specific great stories
peak escarp
Lu Bu is better known from the story than from the historical figure
limpid agate
I guess'
Whereas Xuanzang is known for both
I guess this event is just Dynasty Warriors
peak escarp
great, now people are assuming the details of Lu Bu's story applies directly to Reaper
they have some similarities, but it's not 1 to 1
hasty surge
Dynasty Warriors is based on Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Probably Diao Chan as Moria?
Since Diao Chan was the one who instigated Lu Bu to go against Dong Zhuo
Then probably who should be Dong Zhuo?
The only want who has the size is hog but "repear didn't betray hog"
I heard people suggesting dong zhuo could be torb or soldier(very unlikely)
But the Lu Bu and Dong Zhuo chapter was just a small part of the three kingdoms
So jeff may inculde more famous characters instead of just the chapter of Dong Zhuo's tyranny
And to note: Journey to the West and Romance of the Three Kingdom makes up 2 of the 4 Classic Novels
2 of the unoffical 6 Classic Novels
Hmm they might release Diao Chan as part of the Four Great Beauties
So maybe no Diao Chan this year? Hmm?
hasty surge
Yeah I wanna see representation from other countries who celebrate lny too other then 4 chinese + 1 korean every year
limpid agate
I wanna see Junkship Bastion
hasty surge
In lny event?
limpid agate
Yes
hasty surge
Hmm that would be really cool
limpid agate
Yes
hasty surge
Yup
peak escarp
that would be interesting
hasty surge
I wonder if they would decorate Busan and Li Jiang for lny event
limpid agate
Busan is in the trailer isnt it
... AH FUCK
Now I know why Jeff said "New Map Content"
Rather than a new map
It's just gonna be 3 Busan CTF maps
At night time
hasty surge
New ctf map? Like last year?
dire pumice
is it likely that brig will join overwatch?
hasty surge
What where the core maps?
iron plume
core as in not-arcade
hasty surge
Was it li jiang?
worthy rose
@dire pumice Probably yes, she's with Reinhardt and he's almost definitely going to join.
iron plume
last two years we had Oasis and Blizworld in January
in addition to CTF and dress ups for LNY
seems like we’re not getting the former this time
arctic ether
So is Soldier-76 gay? I've been hearing rumors lol
desert yarrow
regal coyote
so basically ever since he is in ow 76 is on a dry spell
at least on the love front (excluding possible short flings)
dire timber
they pretty much went their own ways during the Omnic Crisis
regal coyote
maybe that why he a bit grumpy
dire timber
with Jack fighting in the war, making it impossible for them to see each other
regal coyote
my guess is they still go long distance for a bit before finally broke up
fringe blade
Do you think him being gay is gonna be important for the story
or is it gonna be just like Tracer's reveal
peak escarp
it's not going to be important
it's a background detail, like Ashe (probably) being from Texas
regal coyote
the fact 76 HAD a lover some long time ago is more important than it being a male or female or otherwise (so long it is a humn and not a fucking omnic)
worthy rose
could have been an omnic
iron plume
...he wasn't
worthy rose
would add a layer of complexity to being in overwatch during the crisis
iron plume
the crisis didn't have civilian omnics
worthy rose
I was saying that it would have been interesting if they had done that
iron plume
now that would be forced
worthy rose
Yeah, you're right. That probably wouldn't have worked
regal coyote
mean can you even see 76 dating a fucking bastion unit? NO
please dont do silly things like that srsly
peak escarp
there are more omnics than just Bastions
dire timber
we don't really know what pre-Crisis omnics were like
but omnic-human relationship, during that time?
there's absolutely no way that'd happen
peak escarp
I know, but hamster is being violently omnic-ist again and it's really disturbing
regal coyote
no
but as far as we know the pre crisis omnic is either labour worker type or war type (at least bastion)
not sure if other exist
but the ones we sure of are hardly as smart and friendly as the one we see currently
and really it is a joke to defend omnics RL i would say :3
but yes, in this case love on a pre-crisis omnic is kinda like some dude loving a vacuum cleaner, at best some kind of fetish
worthy rose
I'm not sure that public opinion on omnics got better after the omnic crisis as compared to before.
depends on what country you ask
peak escarp
some places are still very anti-omnic (Junkertown, Russia), while some places are very pro-omnic (Numbani)
most other places omnics are accepted/tolerated by most people
iron plume
during the crisis it obviously was low
but "now" is likely better than pre-crisis
in the game's present they're recognized as people, at least in some places
whereas pre-crisis they were likely treated as machines that just serve a purpose
peak escarp
it's like the modern situation with immigrants - some countries welcome them, some countries shun them . . . some countries are accepting of them but have very vocal minorities who think they're ruining the country
peak escarp
why are so many people attached to the idea that Echo is some human's consciousness uploaded into a robot?
mental notch
Echo?
peak escarp
there is no precedent for that - we don't even know if its possible in the OW universe
iron plume
people like that and want it to be a thing, and Echo looks more humanlike than other OW bots
there's not really anything more to that
Echo is the white robot from Reunion
the one McCree woke up
peak escarp
every time I point out that it's an unrealistic idea people just counter with Winston/Hammond's existence not being realistic
but I'm using "realistic" differently than they are
I mean it as in "its not something we've seen in Overwatch or know to be possible in that setting"
they mean it like "this cant happen in the real world"
genetically engineered animals are a real thing, and enhancing them to have human-level intelligence is plausible in the near future
as far as I know, its impossible to upload a human's memories and personality into a computer
you can simulate it, but that's not the same
hoary depot
hey man thats why you dont argue with the overwatch community
they come at you with stupid shit
peak escarp
I know
that's why I discuss things here
where people are (mostly) intelligent and rational
and we actually know the lore and don't just make stuff up without backing it up
granite gazelle
Intellectuals because jewvia tells off the shitposters
pliant sparrow
So do we have any idea of who might have designed echo?
iron plume
I get what you're saying but that's not the normal definition of realistic
right now winston-like animals are unrealistic
and it's not really certain they ever will be
apes might be but doubtful on hamsters
pliant sparrow
It really depends on how much neuro-science could logically advance in the next 50 years
And genetic modification of course
peak escarp
I think the word I should be using is "plausible"
iron plume
yeah
peak escarp
I don't see Echo being a human in a robot body as plausible, based in what we know of the science in OW (which is largely based on real world science)
pliant sparrow
She seems to be an A.I similar to Athena
dire timber
@worthy rose before the Omnic Crisis, omnics were seen as tools
now they're seen as beings
whether they're persecuted or embraced as equals depends on location
and plenty of people still use omnics as servants
but omnic personhood became a more common concept, making human-omnic relationships most viable in the Fall of Overwatch era and afterwards
peak escarp
we don't really know much about things from the omnic perspective
getting a story from Zen's POV would be great
white cobalt
normal copper
nooooo
white cobalt
Huang Zhong is portrayed in the 14th-century historical novel Romance of the Three Kingdoms and popular culture as an elderly general with youthful vigour and constitution, and as one of the Five Tiger Generals under Liu Bei. ````So, Huang Zhong is a bad ass 70-something military general that literally cut Xiahou Yuan in half?
Neat!
I like that the Lunar New Year event usually goes with a different theme with Chinese Mythology or folklore.
hasty surge
He's said to be the best archer of his time, but he's old