That would be a huge disservice to Widowmaker's character.
#lore-discussion
valid shell
valid shell
Not relevant here, you mean.
peak escarp
I'd like to see Gerard and Amelie's life together, maybe as flashbacks of her remembering him
how they met, etc.
latent iron
Snail Cafe
swift blaze
I don't get the history with McHanzo
peak escarp
there isn't any
peak escarp
as far as we know, they have never met
that can be said about 90% of the ships out there
swift blaze
McGenji is where it is at
In all seriousness I want more depth to the relationship between Reyes, McCree, and Genji
valid shell
Doesn't mean you should exclude her.
swift blaze
Yeah besides we kinda already know what Reyes and Moira are to eachother
He hates her a lot
peak escarp
does he?
they seem to have a good personal relationship during Blackwatch
and we don't really have Reaper's opinion on her now
swift blaze
I swear I remember reading it somewhere
valid shell
Just because a character is antagonistic doesn't mean they shouldn't be present in your fanfic.
swift blaze
???
valid shell
And she wholly agrees with Reyes' decision to kill Antonio.
They seem to get along fine.
swift blaze
Apologies for sounding dumb I have been behind on this stuff
valid shell
It's cool.
swift blaze
I a master of Shimada lore though
peak escarp
Sombra: So what are we doing here, boss?
Reaper: I need to pay a visit to a friend.
swift blaze
Mm
peak escarp
it's hard to imagine Reaper having friends, but there it is
swift blaze
What is Ana doing in the lore atm?
peak escarp
yeah, they seem to be tracking his activity
timid eagle
As far as lore goes, I want to see the original Overwatch Strike Team when they were united for the first time.
It was fun hearing/seeing Gabe during Uprising & Retribution.
But setting the clock to the first Omnic Crisis and playing a campaign with the founding members would be so cool.
peak escarp
that would provide some complications
Reyes and Ana couldn't have the kits they have now, so they're out
if they ever released Liao, you could do a 4-player mission with Jack, Torb, Rein and Liao
with Reyes on coms (since he was the leader) and Ana sniping from a distance
it's weird to think Jack might have been the medic for the original team
timid eagle
It could work.
I mean, given the changes Mercy and Torbjorn have got with their respective kits, it wouldn’t be that breaking to have the team being able to heal each other during the mission.
Or take creative liberties.
peak escarp
could just have a mission with health packs
timid eagle
That could work.
Reinhardt and Torb weren’t really friends at that time, so I would like to see how they’d bounce off of each other.
Or Jack under the command of Gabe.
Or Ana being the teams sniper/recon.
They went through the trouble of re-recording most of Reaper’s voice lines (as Gabe) in Retribution, so I can see them adjusting Ana’s kit to make her into a more traditional Sniper.
timid eagle
Well, what other lore could they explore for the Archives event?
valid shell
They could make new lore.
Instead of butchering established character development in order to brute force current heroes into past scenarios.
Where their weapons and abilities don't belong.
valid shell
I do hope the connection between Casino and Maximilien ends up being true.
peak escarp
that would be a way to connect DVa to the main plot
feral lintel
i still think an archives "mission" where, say, talon crashes tracer's wedding and kidnaps emily would be cool. i would make the playable team tracer, mei, winston and lucio (he would be hired by them to be the wedding DJ, and it would be a way to get him directly involved with overwatch)
but even if blizzard was on board to make a mission like that, they'd have to exclude certain countries from being able to play it
iron plume
I was with you until wedding DJ
that's incredibly hamfisted, and he's also way bigger as a celebrity than that
let Lucio join overwatch because he joins Overwatch
iron plume
Lucio is fine for the event
just not with that ridiculous explanation
feral lintel
calm down, alright?
feral lintel
not really, but yeah, you seem pretty mad
feral lintel
"no monkey business"
feral lintel
"error 404: sarcasm module not found"
latent iron
For real, the idea of an event such as that is definitely not a good one
feral lintel
k
valid shell
I'd rather not emphasize the fact that Tracer's only compelling quality being that she's dating a wymyn even more.
iron plume
how is that her only compelling quality
latent iron
They tried with the first Archives event
valid shell
The fact that the most common thing people say when they come into this channel is, "Tracer's gay."
latent iron
She's obviously proud of her home, in the typical British fashion
iron plume
it's almost like people who just drop into the channel and say one thing aren't interested in proper lore discussion
and instead post a le funny meme
valid shell
Then let's encourage that kind of low-hanging behavior by making an event revolving around Tracer's lesbian marriage.
iron plume
how does that make it her only compelling quality again?
subtle moss
Tracer is pretty much the incarnation of the quirky british gal
like that is all she is.
Oh and she's a lesbian
valid shell
The fact that her wedding was the first thing that came to mind for a Tracer-themed event instead of, I don't know. Tracking down the wreckage of the Slipstream, crashed in the Black Forest or Ayutthaya?
iron plume
Disagreed on her being the only thing,
but is still more than just being a lesbian
okay so you're not actually interested in talking about her gotcha
and why would there be wreckage of it in present day
iron plume
...when it crashed?
iron plume
you'd think Overwatch wouldn't take it apart and into a lab or something to study?
that was at its heyday with tons of resources
why would they just leave it there
iron plume
it's not the Titanic, it's a small fighter plane
valid shell
And I'm suggesting it gets discovered only recently.
iron plume
that doesn't make any sense
valid shell
How so.
iron plume
because how would it be left for a decade when overwatch was in full force
they found Tracer
valid shell
Because a "small fighter plane" can easily disappear into uninhabited swaths of land or, I don't know, the ocean.
The Slipstream isn't a sapient being trying to be found.
valid shell
And you're being intentionally obtuse.
Let's try this again when you intend to actually have a conversation.
iron plume
Look who's talking now lmao
feral lintel
kids, could you lighten up?
iron plume
When anyone actually tries to have a conversation you either move the goal posts every sentence or call them idiots for not seeing exactly what you do
So it's good to know we're not doing that
feral lintel
i mean, that's what you do, too
people who frequent this channel are pretty obtuse in general
feral lintel
at this point it's just a contest to see who's the smartest or whatever
latent iron
Regardless if it makes sense or not, I'd love to have an Archive mission or similar event dedicated to recovering the Slipstream
dire timber
the next Archives mission is likely going to be a Talon mission
Doomfist/Sombra/Widowmaker/Moira
the only thing needed would be a Talon Moira skin
pure kernel
What kind of mission tho 
feral lintel
maybe swap out moira for a new talon character
since she was already in retribution
regal coyote
we wont have a new char for the next archive likely
regal coyote
i am saying unlikely to be a talon character
sinful sphinx
Hey guys I am relatively new to Overwatch and I want to really get into the lore and the characters where would should I start.
regal coyote
gow atch those cinematic, all of them
you can get thsoe from any youtube channel
then go to the main site and read all comic
sinful sphinx
ok thanks
regal coyote
character bio is readable and atlas news articles, but those can be outdated
also remember, Chu's word is absolute
Chu is the lord of all, so if in doubt trust his words. he is thousand times mroe important than any of these fuckers here, me including
iron plume
for a less shitposty answer, check pins for most canon material
regal coyote
yes, but as said, some of the stuff we post is a bit open to debate. so better not ruin his idea, let him read all those first and then go check the pins
regal coyote
saying it on the timeline chart being a bit outdated
due to mccree part
and deadlock gang part
better for a complete n00b to jsut read the official videos and such first
also it is MUCH EASIER to watch thsoe compiled version fo the animated shots than watching them one by one
iron plume
I am talking about the official videos "and such"
with that being the comics and articles
latent iron
Do we know why Reaper was stalking a random family in that comic yet?
iron plume
nope
feral lintel
someone pointed out one of them could be a former overwatch agent he's looking to kill
which would make sense
pearl blade
He had a hand in making the OR-14/15s but he didn't actually make Orisa. Efi made Orisa
I feel like we've had this conversation before
lament mountain
but ive been thinking about it and its like saying since i put together my pc i invented pcs
golden kayak
Hey Guys
Can U explain to me, how genji deflects THE DRAGONS in the Short, but only can deflect THE ARROW ingame
iron plume
more like saying that Wright brothers invented the A380
because the game doesn't accurately represent canon
lament mountain
so the game isnt related to the story?
golden kayak
The voicelines?
iron plume
it's like someone playing with action toys of the heroes
or a battle simulator
lament mountain
like super smash
iron plume
the abilities don't do exactly how they are in lore
lament mountain
on 64
pearl blade
The voicelines are like what would happen if the characters met
iron plume
for the more obvious example, in lore most abilities don't have an arbitrary cooldown
winston can just jump
feral lintel
and sombra hacking soldier's equipment wouldn't make him suddenly forget how to run
lament mountain
what if he has bionic legs
iron plume
voicelines are "what if"
the characters aren't lying, the discussion would be similar if they met and were on the same "team"
feral lintel
he doesn't, as far as we know
lament mountain
i think soldier has robot bones in his legs
cuz no one moves like him
and hes got a robot visor
iron plume
no one moves like him because it's gameplay
feral lintel
nobody moves like him because he's a super soldier
feral lintel
think captain america
iron plume
but it has nothing to do with his legs
lament mountain
i havent seen captain america
iron plume
his in-game sprint represents his general superhuman endurance
lament mountain
his robot like endurance
lament mountain
how do we know
his legs could be disabled and hes wearing bionics to help him
its common disability
to not see it
lean prawn
hacking McCree makes him forget how to somersault but I don't think McCree has a bionic spine
or legs
iron plume
he's never brought up to
iron plume
it's a gameplay mechanic
lean prawn
but headcanon based on gameplay mechanics is a big no-no when it comes to theory-crafting or powerscaling
and the devs have said that they put things in game purely for gameplay
lament mountain
so then how do we know soldier doesnt have bionic legs
lean prawn
because nobody has gone and said he had cybernetics
and a common theme between overwatch heroes is that the heroes with cybernetics don't cover them up
iron plume
why do you need him to have some tech in his legs?
he's a supersoldier
that's why he has that
lean prawn
what if he can just run really fast because he's basically captain America with a gun
iron plume
captain america is already captain america with a gun
iron plume
that's not a requirement
lean prawn
neither am i, but the gist of the super-soldier archetype, which soldier belongs to, is enhanced physical capabilities
soldier and reaper survive a building falling on their heads because of the goo the government puts in them
and we know that the standard super soldier procedure doesn't involve any cybernetics
lament mountain
so theres other soldiers like soldier 76?
lean prawn
reaper underwent the same procedure
pure kernel
He's soldier 24
lean prawn
he only went vape because of wacky shit Moira did to him
pure kernel
Add em up, you get 100 
iron plume
we don't know if there's others
a code number doesn't have to be in order, and even if they were the others may be dead
lament mountain
arent they like 007
pure kernel
But yeah, nothing's been confirmed
lament mountain
all just numbered
lean prawn
we haven't seen other living super soldiers but it's safe to say there were multiple soldiers
nobody just jumps from 24 to 76
pure kernel
True
lean prawn
to make people think there were five other seal teams
iron plume
would you not want that for your supersoldiers?
lament mountain
theres multiple seals teams
lean prawn
would you only want two super soldiers?
iron plume
"want" and "get" isn't the same thing
some may have not worked
some may have died either because of the procedure or in combat
a big part of the captain america thing is uniqueness
lean prawn
so the government would just give their two best assets over to the overwatch strike team
and not use the procedure they've successfully performed twice on other men of distinction within the army
iron plume
it was seen as the last best hope and a unified world effort, so, yes
pure kernel
Who's the other super soldier in Captn murica?
iron plume
bucky
pure kernel
Ah yes
lean prawn
Bucky was trained, cap was just injected with the shit
lament mountain
cap is like a witcher
iron plume
but I'm not getting into that because it's off topic for here
lament mountain
?
iron plume
this isn't marvel lore channel, it's an overwatch lore channel
pure kernel
But the mods arent watching Party
iron plume
and regarding "wouldn't the government want this"
of course they would, realistically
but A, plans often don't work out
and B, are you really going to assume that a government in superhero-ish universe is competent at anything
that's like trope #1
dire timber
@feral lintel I don't think we'll get another Talon healer
iron plume
it's why heroes are needed and can function
lean prawn
didn't the Russian government successfully suppress the omnic threat in the first crisis without any help from overwatch or other governments?
iron plume
and look where that got them
pure kernel
They're stronger than Zarya
lean prawn
a second mini crisis that the cause of which is still unknown
whether jack is stronger than zarya is a mystery
iron plume
the cause of it is that the omnium they shut down reawakened
lean prawn
the girl can bench two hogs
iron plume
whereas the ones that overwatch reprogrammed/reset didn't
lean prawn
whether it was Russian incompetence or outside interference is unknown
lament mountain
i think jack might be stronger than zarya
lean prawn
we can decide that when jack Morrison decides to manhandle a weapon meant for an armoured vehicle
pure kernel
Idk but Morrison and Reyes might be able to carry about the same weight
Considering the whole super soldier thing
lean prawn
we know they're super, but we don't know the exact ways they're super
feral lintel
also, we don't know how much of reaper's abilities are "super soldier" vs "undead lab experiment"
lean prawn
i want a Moira cinematic
tawny patio
To be fair we saw Jack take a grenade once
and all he did was limp after
Unless I very misremember that cinematic
lean prawn
reaper got slammed by a mech into a wall then proceeded to dismantle it
feral lintel
and he even seemed to be injured by it
lean prawn
Reaper walked away more pissed than hurt
tawny patio
Zen still has no lore at all
Echo is just a big question mark
Mercy has to answer recall
Don’t think we’ll be getting any Moira for a while
pure kernel
I think we'll see more of echo soon
All the former ow members need to answer the Call first
regal coyote
nope
not all even
just some of them
i mean there might be mooks answering the call too
they dont really need to be shown if they do
they just need to show up, help do slave work like those illegal immigrant, and get shot and die like a mook
wonder how a mook would be payed though, so unless some rich guy is part of the team funding is gonna be a problem
i mean, so far we still need a tony stark kinda guy, or bruce wayne
basicall someone with thsoe line of super power. The best superpower of it all. money
peak escarp
so . . . Doomfist
regal coyote
doomfist is the villian side of the rich guy
only that he is also a brawler as well
unlike the smart bald guy in DC
(but also unlike the caped bald guy in anime which is butt poor and dumb)
peak escarp
I can never understand a word you say
reef thicket
doomfist is bae
daring pilot
@regal coyote ya mean lex luthor and saitama? :D
iron plume
If by Mercy "answering recall" you mean signing up, that's not happening
regal coyote
2 hings most likely:
- mercy is unlikely to join, but she may send someone along the way
- if some ow and related member goes to mercy for healing she would gladly provide it. Then again, i dont think she will ever deny soemone of healing
limpid agate
@worthy rose Echo and Athena are entirely unrelated
safe locust
iron plume
please don't spam emotes
potent vapor
The biggest shame with Ashe lore is that she doesn't have a crush on McCree.
tho she misses him like a brother figure probably
especially since she has massive tsundere feelings, like keeping the torn up picture on her bike
peak escarp
seems like she has a crush on him to me
just because they never dated doesn't mean there aren't feelings there
maybe McCree rejected her - he does say she isn't his type
potent vapor
Hanzo x McCree yaoi writers live on for another day.
peak escarp
Hanzo wouldn't be his type either
potent vapor
Speaking of Ashe, is Jeff Kaplan canon within the OW universe?
iron plume
it's a throwaway joke
potent vapor
My headcanon is that he killed someone during a wrestling match.
mystic summit
mccree and ashe never in a relationship? i dont believe it
mystic summit
how long were they together in the deadlock gang?
feral lintel
a few years
potent vapor
McCree was the one who introduced to her to the outlaw life.
and yea, according to Michael Chu, all of your McAshe erotica is DEAD
mystic summit
nah it's comin back
peak escarp
not exactly
mystic summit
i can smell it
valid shell
Stop.
mystic summit
hammer time?
potent vapor
What does Reinhardt have to do with any of this yeehaw discussion
feral lintel
widowtracer is still going pretty strong long after emily was introduced
so how canon mcashe is won't stop the shippers
mystic summit
what's the most unusual ship that has a chance of happening
potent vapor
BOB and Ganymede
mystic summit
🤔
valid shell
<@&397922982632226816>
brisk bay
potent vapor
Frankly, I believe Ashe will get picked up by Talon at some point.
desert arch
I wouldn't say she would fit for Talon, she has her boys as she is the leader of Deadlock gang and she is the main arms provider for Talon and other organizations as we have seen Deadlock gangs weapons on Talon troops in the Retribution event (I think that is how its called, with Mcree, Moira, Reaper and Genji)
Her gang is their supplier
ember rapids
So is there a known name or anything interesting about the character that showed up next to mcree at the end of Reunion
dense estuary
Echo I think
But other than that we know little
Was she in the list of folks seen on screen in recall?
ember rapids
No idea on that
Possibly
She's part of the Overwatch team, so does hold some importance (I think)
limpid agate
She wasnt in Recall
spring kelp
Yeah she's called Echo. If you watch the Dev Update right after Blizzcon Jeff explains it all
valid shell
Recall robot, 'Iris', Echo, and 'Athena' from the Cinematic Trailer group shot all look different.
Not to mention the bodies in Anubis.
worthy rose
Or perhaps they are a race or a model of a possible omnic
worthy rose
dude it’s seriously obvious that they went through changes like most heroes
peak escarp
but the one seen in Recall is a big difference from what has been a fairly consistent design
it doesn't make sense that they would change the design and then go back to the original design
so the logical conclusion is, the Recall robot is not Echo
worthy rose
What if it is a conciousness that can upload itself onto other bodies. That would mean they could be the same thing
peak escarp
there isn't any precedent for consciousnesses jumping between bodies
sure it could happen, but it hasn't yet, which to me makes it unlikely
dense estuary
Omnic “minds” could be bound to the core they first initialize on.
regal coyote
@peak escarp for omnic though, body is even less than skin deep
if we assume that you only need the head to be "alive" like BOB then body can be replaced, and faceplates are just that.
So changing the look of an omnic would be easier than plastic surgery
peak escarp
we still haven't seen that happen
regal coyote
indeed
peak escarp
this is just theory with no evidence
regal coyote
cause we see bob being alive with head only
peak escarp
that's not the same as switching bodies
peak escarp
that's just showing that the head can remain active separate from the body
regal coyote
this is a world where high tech limbs is everywhere and easy to put on
how hard it is to replace all limbs
and a body plate
it is like rplacing the shell of a car
peak escarp
but we haven't seen it happen
regal coyote
internal function types probably dont change much yes bt ahtat is not a problem here since we know nothing of the capability
does it matter? we ahve not seen an omnic repain themself , but we dont need to see it, we knwo it.
surely they can repaint at will
and omic does customize themselves
you see spikes and what no some of the omnic, surely thsoe are not stock
peak escarp
you're saying that omnics can have cosmetic details changed
regal coyote
that said though, it is most likely all body if an for same omnic is similar
regal coyote
say an Orisa is extremely unlikely to get in a regular 4 limb omnic
peak escarp
into this:
that's more than just cosmetics
that's an entirely different structure
regal coyote
tif the blue thing is like a projector as in the deactivated echo
and the other scene is the one activated with the face"
tthen the rest is just cosmetics
the chin in the 2nd picture and the neck part can be unessential parts
if you take out the white shells
peak escarp
okay
regal coyote
the 2nd picture is jsut a logn enck with a projecting blue thing (not sure blue thing function) and a elongated ehad
peak escarp
say it is the same robot
regal coyote
I am saying not sure if ti is same robot\
but it can be
given characters goes into different literations
peak escarp
why would she go from looking like Echo, to looking like the Recall robot, then go back to looking like Echo?
regal coyote
like how they gain different looks and detail as they become more important
peak escarp
that literally makes no sense
regal coyote
this makes a good point though
since echo seem to stay the same througout development, other than the wing
peak escarp
we've seen the Echo design in the video the boys watch in the museum
which means she looked like that while in Overwatch
regal coyote
yes, given that picture should be retcon, since wronge logo
but design still mroe current echo
so you say echo is NOT in the seen recall sequence then
peak escarp
correct
that is a different robot of a similar model/design
like how Zenyatta and Mondatta are different omnics of the same model
dire timber
@peak escarp eh, I wouldn't base anything on that group shot
and I really mean anything
it definitely doesn't qualify as canon – Lucio and Bastion are there as part of Overwatch
Echo is Echo
anything before Echo is just concept art
and you should not presume concept art to have any lore implications
peak escarp
then what about from a design standpoint
they had Echo's design more or less finalized in 2014 - it wouldn't make sense to redesign her for Recall then go back to the first design for Echo
timid eagle
The only thing that I wished was kept was the original face design.
The hologram face doesn't work for me.
latent iron
There's obviously more expression in the new one
Considering it's a character that is meant to be a good guy, the lack of a facial expression makes them as unnerving as a character like Reaper
valid shell
@latent iron Zenyatta?
Both Bob and Orisa only have articulation in their eyes, and they're obviously supposed to be friendly folk.
latent iron
Indeed
But those eyes offer all the expression they need
Zenyatta is an outlier, but it's not too strange when you consider the fact he's half light and half dark
valid shell
Bastion has no eyes or face.
He's considered one of the cutest heroes.
Echo could have worked easily with her OG face.
latent iron
Depends if that character and the early concept with a similar body are intended to be the same person/identity
limpid agate
?
Most machines in Overwatch dont have distinguishable expressions
Orisa, Snowball, Max, and Lynx have them. And arguably Bob to an extent, but its minor eyelid movement
Bastion, Zen, mostly Bob, and every other omnic we have seen has a stoic face
Snowball isnt an omnic, and Orisa was customized by Efi to have her personality
So its just Max and Lynx that are true omnics with visible expression.
latent iron
I suppose this would be so much easier if we assume Echo is not an omnic
valid shell
And Max just has a jaw hinge.
limpid agate
Id say its likely she isnt
latent iron
Indeed
worthy rose
Im surprised i havent seen anyone complain about ashe being a 4th american character
iron plume
you haven't been looking very widely then lol
snow star
I don't get how ppl are annoyed by new stuff anyways (says the girl that flipped her shit when the last Smash Direct dropped)
analog shell
I'm guessing that means you got mad
iron plume
?
dire timber
@peak escarp well, Echo is not in Recall
the white omnic doesn't look much like Echo at all
long ermine
you're talking about the pic with all the old heroes?
dire timber
sure, they're both white with blue lights, but the Recall omnic's design seems more masculine
iron plume
the Recall cinematic where it shows pictures of heroes one by one
dire timber
and I think Echo's current design is actually intended to indicate that she's not an omnic
long ermine
that was scrapped and turned into echo iirc
dire timber
yeah, that's the base concept for Echo
iron plume
that's a concept picture that's not canon
long ermine
ahh
dire timber
but he really doesn't look like Echo
like, he's similar to Echo's initial concept
but it's very clear they're not one and the same
regal coyote
on omnic expression
I would consider Bob having the ability to have facial/eye expression
while not as extensive as orisa he probably have them
(srsly hope that in the far future we have bob as a hero with the ult being ashe)
I guess it makes sense Zen having no emotion. He is supposed to model after a super enlightened monk, and as such he should be beyond plebian shit like motions. (yes, going beyond emotions is a thing)
pure kernel
Maybe he's another ai (or whatever echo is) and will be sent in place of another former hero
regal coyote
well we dont know if he is born with the same faceplate, or he choose that faceplate later on
most monk statue have the same types of faceplates
regal coyote
when i mention model after i mean his character design, not his lore journey of becoming a robomonl
regal coyote
we have mondetta which has no emotion faceplates
lament mountain
or have we already hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
lament mountain
they could change bodies at the monestary
like how human monks wear the same clothes
iron plume
we've seen torb's wife in Reflections
iron plume
no, her siblings do
lament mountain
are they superheros
iron plume
...what
lament mountain
heros of a superb quality
lament mountain
brig and torb are heros
iron plume
which is not the same thing as a superhero
their in-game powers come from training and tech
iron plume
we're getting into marvel-lore-discussion again but I'd argue Ironman's skills are superhuman
whereas torb's are on the level with the world's technology
either way, the siblings aren't notable if that's what you're talking about
lament mountain
u dont think they will ever be in the game?
iron plume
I don't think that word means what you think it does
iron plume
who was hired because of their family connection
lament mountain
brig
iron plume
where?
iron plume
neither of them were in old Overwatch
Pharah isn't joining the new one yet
and if Brig does it's because of her being a squire to Rein, not Torb's daughter
lament mountain
rein is a knight?
iron plume
not officially with a title, but that's kind of the thing of his character, yes
regal coyote
well he is literally a crusader
dire timber
@regal coyote uh, whenever someone talks about being "above things like X", they're usually wrong
also, he wasn't made to be a monk, no omnic was
regal coyote
well, as i said " He is supposed to model after a super enlightened monk" as in by the dev by character design
Yes he is probably not manufactured to be a monk
would be silly if an omnium does that really
but the fact he shaires similar face plate with rest of monk/statue suggest there maybe a faceplate swap during his indturnation or whatever it is, at least
strange if all of them ahve similar face plate by coincidnece
dire timber
I have this theory that while civilian omnics are sapient beings, capable of thinking, they're still programmed for specific jobs – waiters, butlers, bartenders
dire timber
it doesn't define them, but it does make them inclined to do these jobs
and rarely question their jobs
lament mountain
so like bender from futurama
dire timber
and what Shambali did was overcome that subconscious programming, and, well... branch out, choose who they want to be, all by themselves
regal coyote
i would say it is most certain that their initial installation of their AI system is bundled with knowledge for specific groups of jobs at least
like for physical labour for some,a nd war for others, and probablly service industry for a bunch
no reason to teach from zero reall, if you can install a knowledge package to start with
pearl blade
Hopefully not for war. Remember what happened last time the omnics went to war?
flint briar
I think they meant that originally, some were designed for war
regal coyote
well at least some are stilld esigned for security, like the or15 series
feral lintel
bastion seems to have been specifically designed for war
regal coyote
well so did many of the obvious war series
i mean, it is unlikely the bastion series was designed for school nanny right?
pearl blade
I was more talking about the labor omnics like Zen
regal coyote
zen is less likely labour pieces of shit
those are unimportante people/pmnic
more likely at least service industry, probably the assistant type
those would start with better programming in terms of mental capacity stuff
feral lintel
it's interesting that zen was built with forehead dots
i would've thought he added them himself later when he became a monk
regal coyote
while it is not official
but is is for sure some corelation between dot number and mental capacity on average?
at least for these labour mode
like the mooks are 3 dot, basically dumb fuck that is good for lower physical jobs
mortal garden
Since mondella is a machine why didn't they just rebuild him after he was killed by widowmaker in the alive short?
peak escarp
she destroyed his core
tepid abyss
He was an omnic too, not a machine
feral lintel
presumably for the same reason you can't clone a human brain or whatever
too complex
peak escarp
I don't think there's a correlation between the number of dots/sensors an omnic has and how intelligent they are
vestal dome
Hey i play on ps4 but i want to get on pc is pc better?
limpid agate
@vestal dome WRong channel
vestal dome
Ok
regal coyote
whatever omnics are machine
but yes the AI in an omnic cannot be replaced once destroyed.
you can copy pieces of memory but not the whole things as a clone
so yeah mondetta he dead
dense estuary
I always assumed an Omnic could not be copied or backed up. At least not the sentient ones, My headcanon is usually due to quirks in every processor means if you did copy the program it might end up a whole new person anyway. Well and Widow shot him right in the Hard Drive so no chance of recovery anyway
peak escarp
people are more than just their memories - their experiences and memories combine to make the person they are
I assume it would be the same with omnics - you could copy the raw data, but it wouldn't be the same omnic
that's why Orisa can "remember" being defeated by Doomfist - she has the data from the OR15 used to build her
mystic summit
what makes an omnic not a traditional robot
peak escarp
it's like Kleenex vs. tissue
omnic is a brand name robot
In Overwatch, omnic and robot are just about interchangeable as colloquial terms (it's the equivalent of Kleenex vs. tissue paper). In this sense, people would refer to Orisa as an omnic (as they would for Zenyatta and Bastion), particularly because the model she is based on (the OR14) was originally created prior to and during the Omnic Crisis. But people would also be correct in referring to her as a robot.
feral lintel
it seems to have evolved into a general word, since it's almost always written in lowercase
peak escarp
like xerox
feral lintel
like calling a bandage a band-aid
peak escarp
yeah
plenty of brand names become so commonplace that they become the general noun for the object
omnic is the same
runic scroll
hey so are those omnic waiters in oasis canon?
the ones without legs
i wonder if they're strictly built for indoor waiter/butler stuff or if they go outside like that
or... snap into a set of legs if needed?
feral lintel
they probably float everywhere like zenyatta
runic scroll
but is zenyatta floating everywhere canon?
feral lintel
he floats in the reflections comic
limpid agate
We dont know, we havent seen Zenyatta enough
runic scroll
i feel like it could be plausible that he has the ability to float, but i feel like it's less realistic that he's almost always floating like he does in gameplay
more like the typical meditation floating you see in depictions of old asian masters cliche
cedar moon
Has Orisa fought doomfist
runic scroll
as Orisa, I don't think so
cedar moon
Smol bean would get wrecked out there 😦
How much tanks have animated shorts
I know there’s Winston
Reinhardt
runic scroll
she was destroyed by Doomfist when she was a regular OR-15, iirc
cedar moon
And Dva
peak escarp
she "remembers" being defeated by Doomfist
feral lintel
orisa was given upgrades specifically to counter doomfist, so she might be able to take him in a fight
peak escarp
I'd like to see that rematch
lean prawn
is orisa the or-15 or the personality core
feral lintel
@subtle moss he's in one panel in the reflections comic
subtle moss
Is he floating?
iron plume
yes
subtle moss
then he can float
peak escarp
@lean prawn Orisa's personality is defined by the personality core Efi made
@subtle moss we know he can float, we just don't know if he always floats
since we have only seen him once in one panel
it's like assuming McCree can speak Spanish because he used one Spanish phrase
cedar moon
I mean if there is voicelines and I game stuff to back it up that point would be irrelevant
feral lintel
@peak escarp so, we should then assume torbjorn can't speak swedish because he only ever speaks in english?
peak escarp
he wrote a letter in Swedish
subtle moss
I feel like it's fairly simple to assume every character speaks English + Their country's primary language if applicable
Otherwise you run into stupid shit.
Like, McCree can speak fluent Korean in the Korean TL of the game... Probably.
peak escarp
omnics have their own language
iron plume
what we can assume is their native, plus English for those we've seen speaking it
long ermine
i forgot that
cedar moon
So that means none of most hero’s understand eachother
peak escarp
Bastion speaks it, and doesn't seem to have the vocal processors for human languages
cedar moon
Like is Sombra speaking English In the English playoverwatch short canon?
frosty shell
I assume Omnics can speak whatever language they want to
As long as it's been programmed into them
feral lintel
i think it wouldn't be wrong to assume that doomfist can speak yoruba
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoruba_language
peak escarp
that's likely
frosty shell
I wonder if Omnics communicate inaudibly with each other through radio transmissions
peak escarp
but he probably uses English more though, due to Talon (and probably his family's company) being international
feral lintel
doomfist has several references to yoruban culture
like his name, and two of his skins
long ermine
Mmmh, I still think it's unlikely#
peak escarp
it's also one of the major languages spoken in Nigeria
long ermine
one of doesnt mean it is tho, its got about 30million speakers in total around 4 countries iirc
feral lintel
why do you think it's unlikely? people can be from minor ethnic groups
long ermine
Because it's very minor, I don't think there's enough proof for it and I don't think they would have thought / intended it for him
there's around 210million people in the area yoruba is spoken, about 30million yoruba speakers
feral lintel
Akande is a male Yoruba name meaning "firstborn." Ogun is a Yoruba god of war and metalwork, and dimu is Yoruba for "grasping."
so, they just happened to lump in all these references to the same culture by accident?
peak escarp
"only" 30 million . . . that's almost the population of Canada
long ermine
"there's around 210million people in the area yoruba is spoken"
relativity boi
im looking up what you said rn adi
peak escarp
30 million is still a lot of people
long ermine
not in relativity to the population of where its spoken
Ok researched it, ye the name makes sense ^^
I'm still not sure about him himself speaking Yoruba
But I can accept that he was inspired / heired (born? predecessed? english) from yoruba
peak escarp
I think it's likely he speaks Yoruba because of his "base of operations" being Oyo, Nigeria
the people in Oyo are predominantly Yoruban
but like I said, English is his dominant language due to his businesses being international
similarly, Pharah was probably raised speaking English but still knows enough Arabic to get by
I remember back when Symmetra got some Hindi lines people thought it was weird, since she is from Hyderabad and they mostly speak Telugu and Urdu there
but if Utopaea is in a Hindi-speaking area, it makes sense
since they would have indoctrinated her into that culture
dense estuary
Is Hindi the majority language of India? Like how Chinese has many flavors but Mandarin is the defacto standard.
limpid agate
China has a national standard of Mandarin
But different parts have different other official languages
And Cantonese is also official across most of the country
India has no national language
It has 22 official languages
In Hydrabad, they speak English more than Hindi
lament mountain
hindi is pretty common it translates pretty well to other languages so alot of people know it
its basically like if u understand hindi u can kind of understand some other languages too
frosty shell
Telugu isn't related to Hindi
lament mountain
idk what telugu is
if u know hindi u can understand punjabi and urdu
or at least understand some words
frosty shell
but it makes sense that Symmetra would've learned Hindi if she spent a lot of formative time at Vishkar (given that Vishkar is a national company)
Yeah, most of the Northern Indian languages are closely related
Urdu and Hindi are mostly the same
lament mountain
yeah its basically all from the same language and then cultural differences
i know punjabi is from hindi idk about urdu
runic scroll
is doomfist higher ranked than moira/reaper/widow?
or is everyone the same rank once you're in the council
or whatever the higher ups was called collectively
peak escarp
Doomfist does seem to be the leader of the council
maybe not officially, but he acts like he is
valid shell
I wouldn't say he's the leader. It functioned without him.
But he's definitely the driving force.
And everyone follows along as long as it makes them money, or gleans scientific results, or leads them to Overwatch agents, or etc.
valid shell
I guess I'm overlooking the difference between leader and boss.
Leonardo is the leader, but he's not the boss of his brothers.
peak escarp
right
and the rest of Talon follow along because they have no reason to object
(and because they don't want to get thrown from a balcony)
timid eagle
I’m just saying. If Doomfist tries to toss Reaper from a high balcony, he could turn into a cloud of smoke and survive.
valid shell
@quasi fern False.
Moira and Reaper are on the council.
Widowmaker's just a weapon.
quasi fern
🤔
timid eagle
And Sombra is expendable.
valid shell
I doubt that. Sombra's definitely got safety nets.
quasi fern
Sombra has her uses and she of course has her own agenda
peak escarp
valid shell
@quasi fern Why do you think Moira and Reaper aren't leaders?
Moira's first appearance was in shadow at the head of the council table, like Dr. Claw.
quasi fern
I didnt remember correctly then lol
peak escarp
the Talon council, ft. Sanjay, Doomfist, Maximilien, Reaper and Moira
valid shell
Doomfist/Maximilien/Reaper/Moira/Sanjay > Sombra > Widowmaker
Heavy > Sniper/Assassin > Enforcer > Trooper
...Arguably Doomfist > The Other Four.
peak escarp
arguably
I'm sure they would object if they didn't agree with his plans
for now they seem content to go with it
timid eagle
And Reaper is just “happy” being a grumpy gas cloud.
peak escarp
those leaders all stand to profit from another omnic crisis
infrastructure, medical science, prosthetics
regal coyote
put it this way, if youa re in the council youa re ina leadership role, one way or another.
Currently Doomfist seem to be the head of the group. Vialli and followers are gravitated towards retirement.
That said, currently the ones shown on the council seem to at least agree with doomie's plans, for now.
Sanjay would benefit, and Max probably would, with whatever he is investing on.
moira dont care
reaper dont care either as far as this goes.
widow/sombra are underlings in this regard so they ahve no vote
limpid agate
I wonder when we will learn more
Hopefully adding Sanjay or Max will expand Talon lore
Or Hamid will expand the extent of Talon's influence on Oasis
regal coyote
Sanjay-lucio-sym would be good
it is like lawful evil vs chaotic good, in the msot classic sense
with sym in the middle
feral lintel
sym seems to be pretty lawful good
worthy rose
Chaotic Neutral?
limpid agate
Symmetra is lawful, but she is not good
timid nova
She wants to be good
Vishkar is largely duping her into believing she is doing good
Sanjay specifically
limpid agate
Good implies altruism, respect for life, and a concern for the dignity of sentient beings. Good characters make personal sacrifices to help others.
Evil implies harming, oppressing, and killing others. Some evil creatures simply have no compassion for others and kill without qualms if doing so is convenient or if it can be set up. Others actively pursue evil, killing for sport or out of duty to some malevolent deity or master.
People who are neutral with respect to good and evil have compunctions against killing the innocent but lack the commitment to make sacrifices to protect or help others. Neutral people are committed to others by personal relationships.
and Symmetra says she doesn't kill unless necessary, so she's definitely in that last category
worthy rose
So lawful neutral or chaotic neutral?
peak escarp
100% lawful
worthy rose
Since she likes helping Vishkar I don't like the Lawful aspect
peak escarp
she opposes chaos in all forms
worthy rose
well I mean Chaos in terms of the world, not her company
worthy rose
regulatory lawful or ethics lawful?
peak escarp
limpid agate
@worthy rose
Law implies honor, trustworthiness, obedience to authority, and reliability. On the downside, lawfulness can include closed-mindedness, reactionary adherence to tradition, judgmentalness, and a lack of adaptability. Those who consciously promote lawfulness say that only lawful behavior creates a society in which people can depend on each other and make the right decisions in full confidence that others will act as they should.
Chaos implies freedom, adaptability, and flexibility. On the downside, chaos can include recklessness, resentment toward legitimate authority, arbitrary actions, and irresponsibility. Those who promote chaotic behavior say that only unfettered personal freedom allows people to express themselves fully and lets society benefit from the potential that its individuals have within them.
Someone who is neutral with respect to law and chaos has a normal respect for authority and feels neither a compulsion to follow rules nor a compulsion to rebel. They are honest but can be tempted into lying or deceiving others if it suits him/her.
Lawful doesnt mean follows the law
peak escarp
he's convinced her that they're doing the right thing
limpid agate
It means follows rules and code.
worthy rose
I read that, thanks for the copypasta again
limpid agate
She doesnt obey the law. She obey's Vishkar's law, and abides by a view of perfect order.
That's a different copy pasta.
The first was Good vs Evil
This is Lawful vs Chaotic
limpid agate
Symmetra is the embodiment of what it means to be lawful.
peak escarp
she doesn't seem to be struggling that much
worthy rose
hmmm
limpid agate
She is perfectly compliant. The only doubt she has shown, she got over.
peak escarp
she's reassuring herself that what Sanjay says is true, that they are making a better world for these people
peak escarp
she may or may not believe that - we haven't seen anything after that to show how she processes this information
worthy rose
and is battling with it
"Am I really making this better?"
and then says to herself over and over again "this is for the better, this is for the better"
limpid agate
We have seen stuff after that.
All of her Lucio interactions
The comic predates Vishkar's oppression in Rio
peak escarp
in all her interactions, she seems to fully support Vishkar and defend them to other people
peak escarp
the comic is set in Rio
worthy rose
man I can't type
limpid agate
Meaning it was before Lucio led his rebellion.
So all the Sym/Lucio interactions should be based on after the comic
peak escarp
and there's a "several months" timeskip in the middle
worthy rose
interesting
limpid agate
Yes, but the comic is about Vishkar taking root in Rio.
They havent yet exploited the locals, or had Lucio revolt.
That comes after
Which means that any further interaction she has regarding Vishkar's presence in Rio are set after the comic
worthy rose
good implication
I am struggling to get over my initial bias of her though, thanks for sharing
iron plume
not the place
ancient jackal
Oh Sorry. );
shut jasper
did i just get pinged in multiple places lol
iron plume
yeah apparently someone really wanted to get in touch
quasi fern
Yeah by the same person
iron plume
less shitposting plskthx
valid shell
@worthy rose Correct.
worthy rose
See party magician i aint lying
iron plume
you aren't
you're still shitposting
now will you leave or will we keep dragging this out
ebon laurel
You know you can get banned or whatever for shitposting, I suggest you stop
peak escarp
the only heroes whose families we know about are Ana/Pharah, Genji/Hanzo, Torbjorn/Brigitte
and we know the general family backgrounds for Winston, Wrecking Ball, Soldier and Ashe
and kinda Symmetra
limpid agate
Also Orisa was built by Efi
Doomfist's family owned a prosthetic company.
And Mercy/Sombra are war orphans
limpid agate
Also, Widowmaker comes from wealth as well
But that's the Guillard family
And Lucio's dad made the core tech for Vishkar's sonic technology
I think that's everyone we know a bit about the family of?
peak escarp
I thought about making a list of each hero's family, but more than half of them would be "family unknown"
timid eagle
We don’t know much about McCree’s past (pre-Deadlock gang), for example.
I figured he either ran away from home or was an orphan.
peak escarp
runaway makes sense
timid eagle
Yep, and a healthy diet of old western films could’ve also influenced him leaving home.
But, again, we don’t know.
dense estuary
without knowing what the SW is like other than it had lots of gangs. Its possible he like many when he was a kid fell into that life
Kinda like how today kids in the inner city can fall into gang life just because of the world they are growing up in.
peak escarp
maybe
regal coyote
@limpid agate while most likely not blood related, mercy is somepart of the torby family
funny how torby family and associates is a huge part of the current ow cast
the other group being winston & company most likely
solar inlet
How long after the Petres act dose overwatch take place
peak escarp
the Petras Act was signed/came into effect 5 years before current day OW
runic scroll
when did soldier and reaper first meet?
were they in the military together before the super soldier project, or did they meet in the project?
peak escarp
they were both in the SEP, and joined the original Overwatch strike team together
As governments tried and failed to neutralize the machines, the United Nations was busy forming an international task force called Overwatch. This small, experimental group would bring together the best and brightest from around the world to wage asymmetrical warfare against the robots. Overwatch's short list of prospective agents included two members of the soldier enhancement program: Morrison and Gabriel Reyes, a senior officer. Reyes, a hardened and highly respected veteran, grew up about as far from rustic Indiana as you could get—the sprawling urban melting pot of Los Angeles. Despite their differences, the two soldiers became friends. Their decision to join Overwatch together would change the world, for good and for bad.
that phrasing implies they were friends before joining Overwatch
willow vector
The lore = the blue robot from ashe trailer combines with Bastion to make a new robot that looks like eve and wall e combined
100%
pearl blade
No shitposting my dude @willow vector
willow vector
i dont like lore-discussion anymore they arent fun :(
grand nimbus
You can use the general-discussion then
regal coyote
that said i am 100% sure the echo-bastion type of contrast is indeed inspired by wall-e
pretty sure the personality is totally different though
dense pilot
may I ask what is lore
peak escarp
Lore is the story and details of the world and characters of Overwatch
worthy rose
GUYS I HAVE A THEORY, WHAT IF TORBJORN IS ACTUALLY THE ENGINEER FROM TEAM MINECRAFT 3? I THINK THAT MEI, BEING THE LESBIAN SHE IS-WENT TO TRACER AND THEN THEY BOTH GRINDED ON A PICKLE TO MAKE TORBJORN, AFTER THAT TORBJORN INHERITED THE BUILDING FROM MEI AND MENTAL RETARDATION FROM TRACER; IT ALL MAKES SENSE DONT YOU GUYS SEE IT??/
worthy rose
thats gay
brisk harbor
Were there going to be more gay characters or did like Michael chu forget
peak escarp
they're probably waiting for an appropriate time to reveal it
iron plume
hasn't had the chance to show one
peak escarp
they don't want to just give an info dump and say "these heroes are LGBTQ - happy now?"
they want it to come out organically as part of the story
feral lintel
most lgbt fans who want representation don't really care anymore, i think
they've moved on to other things
flint briar
while im happy that they've included LGBTQ characters, and more would be nice, im not going to pester Blizzard for them. id rather they take their time (plus my pestering would get me nowhere).
peak escarp
I trust them to reveal things when it feels right