Theoretically, any random dude could get a powerful gauntlet, challenge the current doomfist and take the title, right?
#lore-discussion
runic scroll
Idk if the gauntlet is even needed
I wonder if there’s an actual procedure to taking the title
So far it’s just been usurped
valid shell
Until we know how Savior -> Scourge, we have no precedent.
runic scroll
I thought scourge just killed savior
runic scroll
Huh
valid shell
We don't know their connection.
The Savior might have trained Akinjide, or been killed by him, or they might have never met and Akinjide just adopted the moniker.
We don't know.
All we know is Scourge -> Successor.
runic scroll
I see
frosty shell
Before Doomfist came out, I thought that the Scourge was the Doomfist whom Winston deafeated
And the Successor was a totally new player
austere sage
genji was the first to request healing from moiras during retribution
worthy rose
isn't 1337 something important?
iron plume
1337 is a meme/reference
tepid abyss
Leet
valid shell
Stop.
timid eagle
It’s funny how the scourge is the only Doomfist that was left-handed.
iron plume
well there are just three of them
clever silo
It's actually kind of strange. We're told Akande (current DF) supposedly stole Akinjides (the Scourge) gauntlet after killing him in his bio. We even see Akande and Akinjide side by side in Retribution. But the gauntlet is left handed for Akinjide.
timid eagle
He probably modified it to make it right-handed.
iron plume
The bio also doesn't say he took his gauntlet physically
"This difference in aspiration would lead Ogundimu to kill his teacher and take on the mantle of Doomfist, along with the eponymous gauntlet."
He took over the title and having the gauntlet
either way we know his is new
timid eagle
So.... Did Akande just modified his Talon-made gauntlet to resemble the Golden gauntlet?
I’m confused.
iron plume
pretty much
when he took over the name
this was in some tweet or whatever, let me try to find it
clever silo
Hold on, let me check this. Mid match
timid eagle
That feels redundant, but whatever.
iron plume
we know he had a gauntlet when Scourge was still alive from retribution post-shots https://d1u5p3l4wpay3k.cloudfront.net/overwatch_gamepedia/thumb/0/07/Succession.png/763px-Succession.png?version=a0630a86df057fd0f1916d1efc22f053
timid eagle
I assumed the gauntlet was passed by one user to another.
iron plume
and in shape it looks much closer to his current one than Scourge's does
even aside from being left handed
well for one, the Savior's "doomfist" wasn't even much of anything
he just had brass knuckles and was really fucking strong
clever silo
Ok gonna check this out now
iron plume
So anything passing would be between Scourge and Successor
I presume he also had like
normal weapons
but the fist was his signature
timid eagle
Maybe the next Archive event?
I mean, people have been clawing on the development team to explore the original Overwatch Strike Team.
Seems fitting that would be the next logical step.
iron plume
we can hope
clever silo
Ok I see the sentence, and how I read it makes it seem to me like he did take the gauntlet Akinjide had
But maybe I'm not reading it correctly?
iron plume
we can see it's a different one though
and that he has one when Scourge was still alive
timid eagle
The lower half still looks like the current lower half.
Aside from, you know, being left and right handed gloves.
clever silo
Actually, give me one moment here.
Ok, I couldn't find the actual voice line file like I was hoping
But on Numbani, there is (or used to be?) this voice line
"Coming soon, the Numbani Heritage Museum will be the proud home of the Doomfist itself. Once wielded by the infamous Scourge of Numbani, it will be the centerpiece of an expansion of the exhibit focusing on the men who bore the name Doomfist."
That being the gauntlet that was in the Numbani payload, and supposedly the one Akande weilds.
And stole.
clever silo
I think that's unlikely, because of the way it's phrased in this newspaper.
From 1:37 in the Doomfist Orgin Story
cunning sand
In one of the original vids the gauntlet seemed to be in a museum
It was seen in the game being transferred in high security payloads
Doomfist (holder of gauntlet) was a criminal in my eyes who stole the gauntlet
It was locked away due to its power
valid shell
Locked away...
...On display in a public museum?
Doomfist is a criminal and a terrorist, yes. But the gauntlet does belong to him.
regal coyote
^
by sme legal bullshit you can say he stole the gauntlet i guess.
but yeah criminatl or not it is Doomfist's gauntlet.
So he is taking hsi stuff back
feral lintel
i guess it's like asking if a confiscated weapon still belongs to the criminal it was confiscated from
runic scroll
so you guys know how hanzo beat genji in a swordfight?
timid eagle
Yep, and it’s the reason why he had given up on it.
runic scroll
i wonder if genji's cyborg body now puts him at a significant advantage when it comes to a close range fight
and if hanzo was legitimately much better than genji, or if there was something other than just skill and physical abilities that played a big part in the outcome of the fight
timid eagle
It pretty much enhanced his incredible reflexes, so yes, Genji is a crazy sporadic ninja. Hanzo, however, is slower & more methodical.
peak escarp
Genji might not have taken the fight seriously (until it was too late)
runic scroll
as in "he probably won't kill me," not "lul this is fun" right?
peak escarp
yeah
timid eagle
A bit of both, actually.
runic scroll
i feel like he would have known that this was a serious enough fight
just that he thought hanzo wouldn't go so far as to actually try to kill him
timid eagle
The only reason why Genji had taken up training to be a ninja was so he could score some babes. The dude was the dictionary definition of a playboy.
runic scroll
i don't think anyone pulling actual swords on people/pulled actual swords on them would think this is for fun
iron plume
sparring is a thing
timid eagle
Maybe, but Genji said it himself he was a reckless youth.
runic scroll
sparring with real swords?
that is not a thing unless you're reading some kind of orientalist fantasy
iron plume
well they are yakuza
runic scroll
maybe genji could have thought this was a joke as in
hanzo pulls a sword on him and tells him to get his act together or whatever
and genji is like lol dude stop playing around and put that sword away
and hanzo starts swinging and he's like oh shit wtf is he doing
then slash
peak escarp
That's kinda how I picture it
runic scroll
i feel like that'd be the most reasonable thing to have happened if we're to incorporate genji wasn't serious at any point of the fight
peak escarp
this would be the perfect subject for a novelization
runic scroll
yeah
OW hasn't had any short stories like SC franchise does though, right?
or legit books
i guess the comics and animated shorts are their equivalent
peak escarp
get around the whole "we can't show blood because of the rating" thing
runic scroll
yeah i suppose
i wonder if genji has a dragon tattoo like hanzo does
to allow him to use the dragons
or do you think tattoo is only one form of how the dragon is harnessed
frosty shell
Hanzo could've assassinated Genji
runic scroll
i think the lore has it that there was at least some kind of a fight
not 100% sure though
frosty shell
He might not've seen it coming, and Hanzo just pulled a sword on him
peak escarp
I think the tattoo is part symbolic, part emitter for the dragon's physical form
since it seems to come out of the tattoo in the short
frosty shell
Didn't Michael Chu say that Genji was already collaborating with Blackwatch when Hanzo "killed" him
runic scroll
was he? i don't know
frosty shell
That would explain how Overwatch showed up in time to save him
peak escarp
there's lines in HotS that indicate Genji might have been working with Overwatch
but those aren't canon
all we know is the Shimada clan was being watched
iron plume
Yeah, they monitored their activities even before
frosty shell
just that by itself could explain how they found Genji
peak escarp
yeah
iron plume
so it'd make sense that they saw the fight in some form
frosty shell
One of their spies might've seen it, and Mercy thought Genji would be a perfect test subject
peak escarp
OW agents saw the fight, but couldn't step in without blowing their cover
frosty shell
or something
frosty shell
Perhaps to test whether a person with injuries as severe as Genji's could survive
iron plume
yeah I very much doubt Mercy wanted to experiment on him
frosty shell
I imagine any loyal Shimada clan members must not've stayed there for long
peak escarp
Torb maybe, since he's an emgineer
iron plume
it's likely he at least took part
frosty shell
I wonder when Winston first got in to Overwatch - Mei recognizes him, but it might've been from somewhere else
frosty shell
Unlikely, though, as her seeing Winston is what indicates to her that Overwatch is looking for her help
I assume Winston would've been famous as soon as he landed on Earth - "MOON GORILLA BUILDS ROCKET AND LANDS ON EARTH" would probably be a big headline
peak escarp
probably
frosty shell
Oh, yeah - Winston landed at Watchpoint: Gibraltar
That's probably why he became part of Overwatch
peak escarp
definitely wouldn't have landed unnoticed
frosty shell
I still wonder why Hammond didn't tell Winston that he wanted to go to Earth as well
peak escarp
maybe Hammond was too afraid of the other apes to come out of hiding?
or he was just too busy building his own pod to stop and think that Winston would give him a lift
you ever get so wrapped up in a brilliant idea that you don't notice the simpler solution staring you in the face?
frosty shell
yeah, that could happen
Hammond's probably not that smart by human standards
IDK, maybe he is
Sometimes real life has plot holes too
peak escarp
you can be highly intelligent and not be smart
iron plume
wis dump stat
peak escarp
"I bet Winston's gonna be so proud of me when we get to earth and he finds out what I did!" *tether snaps*
I really want to see Hammond go to Gibraltar and meet up with Winston
peak escarp
see them just making animal noises at each other in front of the other heroes
Tracer would probably think he's cute
dense maple
hammond is a prodigy in regard to the other animals excluding winston
he even kinda counters winston, but lacking in the common sense part that winston has (id assume its because hes an ape, closer to humans in that regard)
hes definitely smart by human standards, they even say so in his short
that theyre incapable of even keeping up with his genius
frosty shell
"IS THAT A FROG IN A BUBBLE?"
regal coyote
All I can say is, that Pharah enchanted armor loks great. Lts hope she is part of the new playable lore in Junkenstein
potent vapor
It would make some sense to bring in Baguette into Junkenstein.
limpid agate
It will probably be all hero
Rather than a set increase of 4 or 6
Especially since the 3 heroes with skins so far are already confirmed playable
And none make sense in the context
potent vapor
Also, pre-Overwatch fall Reinhardt telling a story about junkrat, roadhog and symmetra is super weird.
limpid agate
The parellels are coincidental
Junkrat/Roadhog didnt even know each other back then
potent vapor
It is also weird that they didn't make skins that fit the heroes for Junkerstein.
limpid agate
And Symmetra was likely not operational back then either
potent vapor
I mean, my point is that Reinhardt probably used them as a basis for his story when, yes, those guys and girl were completely unknown to him at the time.
limpid agate
Reinhardt had no way of knowing they existed.
The comparison is just a coincidence with no lore reason
potent vapor
It seems like one of those details that shouldn't be focused too on a lot and just made for gameplay purposes.
potent vapor
I can still see them bringing in Moira as a boss and Baguette as a hero.
potent vapor
Maybe if they're crazy, use hammond.
limpid agate
Its most likely gonna be
No new boss
Because Jeff said they arent making any major changes
And all heroes mode
Because he said there will be some tweaks people will like
And we already have 5 more confirmed playable heroes
Moira, Doomfist, Pharah, a hero that is probably Sombra, and a hero that is probably Hammond
potent vapor
I wouldn't consider adding in 3 more heroes and 1 boss a major change.
long ermine
"Again" -Boovia 2018
limpid agate
We know this
And the ones they are adding are with their Halloween skins in the achievement image
So its most likely
All heroes
peak escarp
the characters in Reinhardt's story probably don't actually look like the heroes we know
they just look that way for the audience
native kayak
So the bride wont be a villian
worthy rose
how do i discuss lore when there is none 4head
peak escarp
you don't
peak escarp
leave it to people who actually care
worthy rose
When you get paid salary to write one tweet a month and a few comics a year
peak escarp
that's more than you've done to contribute
cunning ledge
You think that the lead writer puts no effort into the stories of the maps and heroes?
regal coyote
oh for fuck sick can we get back to lore.
I am sure they have some unpublished lore on junkenstein
Well, jeff blames the shitty summer games this year and the lack of new game mode for halloween this year to "working on balancing issues"
but since such issues does not concern the lore and writing teams, i think we should still at least get a comic of sorts
viral zealot
thonk
why would they bother having ppl write lore for dis
Overwatch isnt a story-driven game in the first place
writing lore for its off-game modes, or well, more than they already have
is kinda strange
foggy snow
they should make lore on how many people the busan train has killed
cunning ledge
<@&397922982632226816>
regal coyote
well i support idea of a halloween event where you get zombie omnic in busan train station
dusky quiver
Train to busan ?
regal coyote
urban folio
Why is Jewvia boovia now
subtle moss
Because boovia is great
worthy rose
GENJI AND MERCY GONNA FUCK TONITE
dawn chasm
Oh yis
worthy rose
XD
dawn chasm
worthy rose
so are bastion and thicc girl orisa
dawn chasm
Spicy
feral lintel
<@&397922982632226816>
floral herald
Cease the shitposts
dawn chasm
Oki
calm shuttle
Why can Anna's sleep dart make a robot sleep
iron plume
because gameplay
rocky vapor
It most likely can’t in the lore, but it’s just for the sake of gameplay
It’d be broken if sleep darts didn’t work on robots in-game
lean prawn
a lot of abilities in game are non-canonical
cunning ledge
there is a clear disconnect between the gameplay and the lore
lean prawn
Zen's orbs and lucio's and Brigitte's auras are not canon
iron plume
yep
at least not in the form they are ingame
lean prawn
and while fortify is a thing an or14 unit does, im willing to bet that the turning gold part is not canon
iron plume
we know it isn’t, we’ve seen an or14 fortify in Honor and Glory
lean prawn
and in her origin trailer, orisa fortifies to stop cars from running an old lady over
valid shell
Zen, Lucio, and Brigitte's healing are all likely game abstractions of inspiration, courage, psychological healing, hype, etc.
While anything derived from Mercy's biotics is true physical healing.
Mercy, Moira, Ana, Jack.
blissful pecan
healo
clever silo
I think Zen is questionable.
And Brigitte doesn’t exactly “heal”, but she definitely repairs Reinhardts armor and whatnot in lore.
cunning ledge
well she doesn't repair it by hitting other people with a mace
limpid agate
Only Mercy's nanotechnology is canon, and even then, it was only shown to function as a glorified painkiller in Old Soldeirs
Zenyatta, Lucio, and Brigitte's healing are all symbolic "inspiration" or "harmony"
lean prawn
Brigitte heals you and gives you armour with the power of friendship and determination
tepid abyss
limpid agate
Doesn't literally heal
And maybe she does have armor, but that would just supply armor
It wouldnt actually heal your wounds
bold bone
Actually if u play the game u can hear mercy say to lucio that his dad created her tech meaning lucio would be able to heal
iron plume
...no
he didn’t create her tech
he created the tech vishkar uses to suppress/control people
which lucio stole and repurposed
limpid agate
@bold bone ^
Mercy: Lucio, I never realized your father invented Vishkar's sonic technology.
Lucio: The Core Tech was his life's work, owned and patented by Vishkar. But it's mine now.
@bold bone You misunderstood that interaction.
clever silo
As far as I know, we still don't have any idea if Zen can literally heal.
lean prawn
Zenyatta heals with the power of good vibes
doesn't he actually do that though? or are the orbs representing something else?
clever silo
Gonna check this out, I've watched it before but it was when it first out
Do you know aprox what time the Zen part is at?
limpid agate
No
vapid orchid
is there a skin being revealed today?
limpid agate
Probably not
timid eagle
That's a shame.
They usually do reveal a skin cosmetic a day before the event launches.
peak escarp
it would be nice to have some surprises
timid eagle
Unless if they are going to do a new mode, eh.
tepid abyss
Still got tomorrow then
uncut dew
is there lore behind hero holiday costumes? or did they just choose a costume for the holiday
quasi fern
Event skins?
quasi fern
I know the Christmas hanzo skin Casual was in a comic
iron plume
The Junkenstein costumes/story are a tale Reinhard tells
iron plume
with inspirations from overwatch people
uncut dew
where are these comics sold? or are they only web comics
iron plume
web only
tepid abyss
Idk tbh I got a hardback book from collectors edition
iron plume
there are some printed editions, but they don't have anything their site doesn't
tepid abyss
Otherwise I think web
uncut dew
i see
iron plume
the links are in this channel's pins
peak escarp
Mercy was wearing a witch costume at the party where Reinhardt was telling his story, but it wasn't as elaborate as the Witch skin/the character from the story
same with McCree, Ana, Torbjorn and Reyes
Morrison's costume was his Stunt Rider: 76 skin
I'm sad we can't get Admiral Reinhardt
feral lintel
you can't really have a reinhardt skin without armor because he's noticeably smaller out of it
feral lintel
still, though, look at his proportions
runic scroll
Blizz loves them ridiculously proportioned armors
And back thrusters when it’s sci-fi
timid eagle
My dreams of Lederhosen Reinhardt are dashed. 😦
regal coyote
disappointed, new skin not called jacking Ball
but even it is expected, it is super cool still
what does it mean "is it junkrat's treasure in the first place?"
@limpid agate Discord/Harmony is not canon
but what are the statue of the orbs themselves,a nd what are they for
we know they do exist at least around his neck, and we know for sure he can juggle despite the vocie line, seeing he can do it with even snowballs
is there other fucntions of the orb?
in design it is a weapon of sort if needed be
also, how accurate is it when jeff emntions, anti-aging mercy magic?
I know it is beauty tech basically, but how accurate is taht statement
he also mentions the tracer aging bit also.
feral lintel
how do we know any of the orbs exist though?
regal coyote
cause he is wear it ffs
feral lintel
just because he wears them in-game doesn't mean they exist in the lore
regal coyote
most mage of him has the orbs around in one form or another
not as an attack thing but at least as ornaments
short cliff
Using ornaments as weapons >Nice.
regal coyote
not sure in game
and weknow nothing in lore really, relatively
zen can be like kung fu panda style kicking and punching for we know it in lore
feral lintel
does he even fight in lore? he seems like he'd be a total pacifist
tawny patio
I feel like if Zenyatta gets lore it’d be circumstances, everyone coming in to his place
I don’t feel like he’s likely combat trained like all the rest of the OW cast with lore
And if he is he’d be more like Brig and not be the frontline
Imo
With the orbs being non-canon
I have no idea what he would do to be relevant?
Unless he gets lore through Genji
clever silo
To my knowledge, this frame in reflections is the only time outside of the game we’ve seen Zenyatta.
And those are snowballs, not orbs.
cunning ledge
I still think there’s a genuine chance those are supposed to be the orbs and the art is just horrible
Reflections isn’t exactly great on the art detail front
feral lintel
no, those are clearly snowballs
white cobalt
Can you stop spamming that in every channel?
iron plume
If you’re convinced that they’re snowballs, remember that this is the same comic that straight up forgot hog’s tattoo
so I’m not convinced either
As for “not sure in game”, no, we clearly see that what he throws is not the metal orb
regal coyote
i would say, we know zen is able to float his balls, whatever it is
snowball if that is what it is.
in that case he can probably float other objects too
assume similar size and weight he can do it
cunning ledge
And, you know, he can float himself
cunning ledge
"Omnic Energies" has been an answer we got a while ago
with no context or further explanation
short cliff
"float my balls zen" 
clever silo
“Omnic Energies”
On gameapedia it says “The orbs he uses were hand-carved at the Shambali monastary and serve as a means to channel omnic energy.”
That’s kind of interesting
And raises a lot of questions in my mind
Is he channeling energies within himself, or are the “Omnic energies” all around?
Do all Omnics have “Omnic energies” within them?
Could literally any Omnic channel the energy as long as they had these orbs, or would they need to be trained to channel them?
And how powerful are these energies, and what is the extent they can used for?
cunning ledge
I think a better question is that does "Omnic Energy" even exist beyond a thing they said for an answer once
I would bet it doesn't
subtle moss
God knows. It could just be ordinary rotation
Levitation
The bots in the training fiekd have it
They seem to have fkoat tech
clever silo
If every Omnic does have these energies within them, how did Omnica Corporation find a way to “give” Omnics this energy?
Does Omnic energy have anything to do with what separates Omnics from robots? Does it make them sentient?
Or, like super said, is it just something they said to BS their way through a question?
cunning ledge
The training bots have floaty engines iirc
Or at least a lil thruster on the bottom
clever silo
I’d imagine Zenyatta standing up looks like Mondatta
And so unless he has some very well hidden thrusters....
He’s probably floating through different means than the training bots
cunning ledge
Exactly
subtle moss
What I mean is that they have to tech to out small accurate thrusters on simething, Pharah too
Zen might be the next step. Ir just an ordinary step, the oayloads seem to float
cunning ledge
What are you saying here
The payloads and Pharah have obvious hover engines or thrusters
clever silo
The payloads usually have thrusters
cunning ledge
Zenyatta doesn't
clever silo
Here is a picture of (probably) Mondatta
Zenyatta is probably very similar to him as far as what “model” of Omnic he is.
He has legs
This is a statue of Mondatta, 100% confirmed
He definitely has legs
feral lintel
i think zenyatta would be able to walk, but he just doesn't feel like it
short cliff
why walk when you can fly
limpid agate
@clever silo Yes that is Mondatta
And Zen probably can walk. He just has no lore appearances
frank gorge
Zenyatta has legs, why wouldn’t he walk
feral lintel
because he's never shown walking
limpid agate
Stelphen Hawkings has legs
long ermine
Oof
frank gorge
Yes but I highly doubt that zenyatta is paralyzed
And he moves his leg to kicj
*kick
long ermine
gameplay != lore
frank gorge
True but why wouldn’t he be able to kick in lore
brisk harbor
Why was he even given legs if he's jus gonna levitate
The omnics in oasis don't have legs
tepid abyss
Why would they have him kick instead of punch
long ermine
all omnics are built for a reason, millitary, labour, serving etc
millitary for example OR or Bastion units
service the omnics in oasis
or rialto
long ermine
and then labour, which i think is what led to the kings row uprising
cuz there's a lot of Zenyatta-esque omnics in the shorts and comics in kings row
dense maple
zenyatta is a monk, meant to always be meditating
thats why he floats ingame i believe
walking would kinda disrupt that
cunning ledge
@worthy rose this is the lore channel
peak escarp
this channel is for lore not group building
white cobalt
And...how related is that comment?
cunning ledge
<@&397922982632226816>
peak escarp
you must have no life to be building a GOATS comp in gold/plat
worthy rose
@worthy rose if you have no interest, then obviously this isn't the channel to talk in then?
!warn @worthy rose needless condescending (not to mention off topic) comment in lore-d
twilit nacelleBOT
👌 Warned Bitcoin#1385
worthy rose
Carry on friends
cunning ledge
Thanks mister mod
terse oak
Take it to another channel please
Talking about playing the game to a channel that isn't lore
cunning ledge
Sure why not
cunning ledge
Daily reminder that Ganymede followed Bastion across an entire ocean while Bastion was on the sea floor
Now that’s dedication
peak escarp
are we supposed to believe that's the same bird that woke it up in Germany 15 years ago?
that seems remarkable for a songbird
feral lintel
gameplay != lore
even though the bird follows bastion around in-game, it probably isn't around anymore in the lore's present day
or it's a different bird
tepid abyss
Maybe a decendent
But I doubt it
Probs has some kind of tune/frequency he emits that attracts close by birds, which would explain the different types of birds on his skins
feral lintel
the other skins (and birds) aren't canon
peak escarp
we've seen the bird in lore though
peak escarp
it was with Bastion in Binary when Torbjorn picked it up in present day
feral lintel
like i said, it's probably a similar looking but different bird
peak escarp
could be
feral lintel
ganymede appears to be a cardinal, which normally live 13-15 years
in captivity they can live up to almost 30 years
also, who named ganymede? torbjorn? bastion can't speak, after all.
feral lintel
unless bastion is able to read and write, but i doubt it
stoic eagle
i want the next animated short to be about talon origins or something
long ermine
next short will probably be junker
peak escarp
it's hard to predict what we'll see in the shorts
valid shell
@long ermine Source?
peak escarp
Winston and Hammond escaping is unlikely because we've already seen that in Wrecking Ball's origin trailer
events we know about are fair game for shorts, but events we've already seen probably aren't
limpid agate
@long ermine The next short doesnt need to be related to hero 29
I think it will be tied to Brazil
But could be anything
dire timber
how many hours until the event?
limpid agate
24-5
peak escarp
roughly 19 hours
assuming the event goes live at 11am PST
they have done it earlier before
long ermine
ik it doesnt need to
it would make sense though
assuming they're releasing a new hero at blizzcon
peak escarp
the only short that featured a new hero was Infiltration
and it was the culmination of the ARG
limpid agate
Not just that
But only half of the shorts end up being promotional
Last Bastion - Eichenwalde
Infiltration - Sombra
Shooting Star - Busan
But then
Rise and Shine - Mei Skins that came out a year later?
Honour and Glory - Brigitte 4 months later
Interestingly
With Rise and Shine
We also got the Plan, which was a minishort that was for Junkertown
So we could get anything
Junker lore is not out of the question, but its also not a certainty
At the very least, I would say its tied to either hero 29 or hero 30
OR if we are unlucky, only the new map
But I would imagine, at the very least, it would promote some new content to come out in the next 4 months. Lets it fill as a marketing expense.
long ermine
would they bring out a new map so fast tho? with a short to go with it?
limpid agate
Its usually an original location too, that was unexpected. But thats not a concrete pattern
long ermine
right, my problem isnt with the map but with the short
limpid agate
Favelas would be nice. But anything goes
dense maple
the scariest thing in this game to me is that according to the theory of how teleportation/time travel would work, each individual atom gets separated, sent to the destination and reassembled. this means that a person time travelling or teleporting would essentially die upon teleporting, and be rebuilt as a new person with the same exact physiology, memories, mental and physical state as before, but the person before is dead.
this means every time tracer "blinks", she essentially dies and it is a brand new tracer on the other hand with the same exact memories, body and everything.
but the previous tracer is dead
peak escarp
what
long ermine
where's that stated
peak escarp
where did that come from?
dense maple
its not stated in lore, its just how the theory of teleportation works
if it were to be possible, thats how it is done
long ermine
... not in ow
peak escarp
there's also the folded space theory
dense maple
since blizz is trying to make ow "firm science fiction", aka science fiction with real science/explanation, the same is true for tracer unless said otherwise
peak escarp
which doesn't involve disassembling atoms
long ermine
its not true unless said otherwise
limpid agate
Thats not what firm science fiction means
long ermine
its untrue unless said specifically
limpid agate
Firm science fiction means:
"We are giving it a self explanatory science name, so we dont need to explain details"
Example
Hard Light
What is it?
Light thats hard
How?
Not our problem - Blizz
dense maple
@limpid agate firm science fiction is where they have an explained science for it, like for example "nanotechnology is used for mercy's healing", but they dont actually explain how the nanotechnology works
but they have an explanation for what the healing is in general
dense maple
ya
dense maple
then again, i dont see why tracer wouldnt fit that theory or what junkensix referred to?
limpid agate
Chu goes into detail about what he means by Firm Science FIction
dense maple
is there something denying it?
peak escarp
just because OW uses concepts that already exist, doesn't mean they work according to the existing theories
peak escarp
saying "they never said it wasn't" is a bad way to argue evidence
limpid agate
Tracer doesnt die every time she blinks. If you want to see enough evidence against that, go watch Alive
You can see her Recall
dense maple
i dont think you get what i mean, tracer dies but at the same time doesnt die because it is a perfect, exact copy of her with literally no difference, so technically she is not dead in the slightest. but the existential consciousness of the previous tracer is gone
limpid agate
Again, go watch her Recall in Alive
dense maple
but replaced by a perfect copy
peak escarp
evidence is ususally "they said it was so it's true"
limpid agate
Alive: http://bit.ly/1PSJV5x
dense maple
ive already seen that
limpid agate
Then you should see the error in your theory
peak escarp
if they didn't say it, then it isn't true
dense maple
youre literally only reading half of what im saying if you think im saying she literally dies and thats it
dense maple
then what disproves what im saying?
explain
besides "they didnt say so or confirm it so no!"
limpid agate
Im not going to repeat myself again
dense maple
.... what does her recall disprove lol
it feels like youre trying to disagree with me when you dont even know about the topic im explaining in regard to the theory on teleportation
limpid agate
Its the exact same time travel tech as her blink and the rest of her disability
dense maple
im not saying its canon
im saying that if she fit how science works in reality, thats what would happen. the tracer before she teleported is gone, and yet at the same time the same tracer is there after she teleported. a perfect, reassembled copy of her with the same exact memories, physiology, thoughts, and even the same atoms making her up.
limpid agate
im saying that if she fit how science works in reality
We already said thats not how it works
peak escarp
but that's not the only theory on how teleportation/time travel could work
dense maple
but the actual "consciousness" of the tracer prior to recall or blink, is gone, and a perfect copy is made upon arriving
limpid agate
And if you want to see an example of exactly that not being how it works
Go look at Tracer Recall
peak escarp
so there's no reason for that to apply to OW
dense maple
ive seen the entire short before multiple times
limpid agate
Then watch it again
dense maple
@peak escarp i like mercy for her storyToday at 4:29 PM
im not saying its canon
"im saying that if she fit how science works in reality, thats what would happen."
not that it actually happens in overwatch's lore.
peak escarp
but that's not how teleportation/time travel works in reality
dense maple
in theory of course, because you referred to the other potential theory
theres always the other version of it
peak escarp
because teleportation/time travel doesn't work in reality
there's only theories on how it might work
dense maple
... thats why its solely a theory and not a law of reality lol
thats what "theory" means
peak escarp
so there's no science in reality for it to be based on
long ermine
z's in the chat
dense maple
except its based on real science, the only exception being that is impossible to actually recreate realistically in any way
peak escarp
you could just as easily say "if she fit how science works in reality, she folds space and travels through a wormhole"
dense maple
theoretically, it may work that way, but realistically, it would never be possible
worthy rose
i like mercy i think your right
dense maple
goddamn i try to express how it'd be scary if tracer's time travel actually worked according to that theory and suddenly people are thinking that im claiming its a real possibility to happen and thats its proven
i was claiming neither of those things lol
worthy rose
i just think its a cool hypothetic lol
long ermine
you said it's not been denied so that's how it would work
limpid agate
Then dont. Because there are a dozen theories on time travel. Its not related to lore, so its not related to this channel
peak escarp
you were claiming that that's how teleportation works in reality
dense maple
i said its not been denied, so how is it that it 100% isnt how it works?
it works both ways
because it hasnt been confirmed, i am wrong
dense maple
because it hasnt been denied, it is not certainly wrong either
peak escarp
if it hasn't been confirmed, it's 100% wrong
limpid agate
I dont bear the burden of proof for trying to disprove you.
You bear it for trying to prove your proposal
long ermine
I think Michael Chu is secretly an ex-member of Overwatch telling his story through the games
It's not been deniedf
dense maple
im not proving anything, reread what i said
worthy rose
no it means it can be right or wrong its not confirmed or denied
limpid agate
If you are not making a comment related to the lore
Then dont make a comment here
And go to #general-discussion where it belongs
dense maple
what a dick
ill go to general
although i understand its job, sorry
just a little heated from having words put in my mouth
your job* lol
worthy rose
boovia chill dude lore discussion is the perfect place for things like this to exist because if your going to talk about the logistics or characters abilities of backstories ISNT THAT LORE?
dense maple
she just dislikes what im saying and wants to use her power to make me shut up
even warned me for it
ill go to general anyways, no need to continue it
his*
limpid agate
@worthy rose He periodically said they are not talking about if it "actually happens in overwatch's lore."
If either of you have a complaint, dm @sullen pagoda
worthy rose
boovia if your going to be that guy who trash talks someones idea because you dont like it, either ignore it or try to make a real disscussion not just the video shows this so your wrong
limpid agate
Im ending this
dense maple
i said it is a potential THEORY
limpid agate
I said I am ending this
worthy rose
tracers abilites actually happened so if we talk about her abilities its a part of her abilities which are a part of her character which is her
ima just dip cause i can
peace
limpid agate
@long ermine As I said before that, the short could be anything. A new map, hero 29, hero 30.
Thats what they've all been so far
Doesnt mean they have to follow this, but I would find it unlikely that its not promoting future content
long ermine
yeah no same here, i'd just find it weird to have 2 map-based shorts in a row
limpid agate
🤷
dense maple
thats what i was thinking as well, since busan just arrived a bit ago
limpid agate
Still got the January map that will be revealed. Whether or not itll be in the short is the question
dense maple
im thinking maybe new hero, or maybe theyll even expand on one of the current hero's lore that hasnt been expanded on?
zenyatta nudge nudge
or not, since they seem stubborn to not give any lore about him
ill take my leave, i guess
long ermine
i dont think they're stubborn about giving lore to him
just hasnt found its time yet
zen's lore is pretty stand-alone from the rest
imo it would also be pretty boring
he doesnt really do much
limpid agate
He is just stuck in that group of characters
Launch heroes with no lore that exist just to support Genji
long ermine
lol
limpid agate
Sure, but Hanzo is the one thats in the posters everywhere.
And while it was about the Shimadas in general, it mostly followed him from start to finish
While Genji just showed up for a fight in the middle
Mercy and Zen havent had their own starring roles either. And while Mercy did get Uprising... She didnt really get much interaction with the rest of the squad.
limpid agate
It was mostly just scolding Torb and Rein
long ermine
I liked her hair tho
native kayak
What is Tracer doing in the lore currently
We know she answered the Recall
But does she have a job?
How she paying dem bills lol
long ermine
She’s in kings row with Emily last we saw
native kayak
But do we know her occupation
peak escarp
not really
long ermine
Nope
peak escarp
she's listed as an "adventurer"
native kayak
Lmaoo
limpid agate
@native kayak She rejoined Overwatch with Winston
runic scroll
I wonder how the new overwatch is gonna fund their operations
Probably some hand wavy anonymous sponsors
Or better yet, not even mention it and just say it works -_-
I guess torb and mercy are continuing their “old” jobs
That has a stable income
limpid agate
Nah, not Torb
runic scroll
Isn’t he a consultant/“takes care of things” kinda guy when it comes to omnic problems
Like freelance
Like slightly more legit of a freelance guy than mccree I guess
limpid agate
I thought you meant Engineer
runic scroll
I’d imagine jack just takes bad guys’ wallets or something
limpid agate
Jack and Ana are in Necropolis.
runic scroll
Right, i’m just curious as to how they fund their operations and day to day living expenses
limpid agate
Theft
long ermine
overwatch is currently officially shut down, and most of the high heads involved with it arent very well liked
they can hardly go get a job at a shop or smth
peak escarp
many of them are criminals, but those that aren't (Tracer, Mercy, Genji?) probably have some form of income
Tracer lives with Emily, Mercy is working as a field medic, and Genji . . .
cedar moon
Who’s considered a criminal in Overwatch
limpid agate
Most of the cast
Roadhog, Winston, Bastion, Doomfist, Genji, Hanzo, Junkrat, McCree, Reaper, Soldier 76, Sombra, Tracer, Widowmaker, Ana, Lucio, and Moira. Also arguably Reinhardt, Mei, and Symmetra.
Maybe Torb too
Its easier to say who isnt a criminal or wanted
limpid agate
Ok, uhh
Not Mercy. Maybe not Torb/Rein/Mei.
Winston, Genji, McCree, Reaper, Soldier 76, Tracer, Ana, and Moira are all criminals or wanted
peak escarp
anyone who answered the recall is guilty of violating the Petras act, which technically makes them a criminal
peak escarp
aside from that, Soldier, Ana and McCree are all wanted criminals for their vigilantism
limpid agate
As are Winston/Tracer for actively breaking the Petras Act
Moira/Reaper are infamous leaders of Talon
dense estuary
people responding to Recall are on paper criminals but its unknown if any national or local police are in active pursuit
peak escarp
Bastion, D.Va, Mercy, Orisa, Pharah, Zarya, Zenyatta
they're all relatively innocent
hidden grove
when did they capture doomfist though
if it was after ow disbanded then genji would be a criminal too
dense estuary
Bastion probably can never really be a criminal as Id not be shocked if no government would acknowledge a Bastion unit as being sentient. As Bastion is the only one we see showing signs of function other than "EXTERMINATE"
weary copper
I got a question
When the monkey revolution started on the moon and winston crashed on gibraltar with a space pod, was he still a child or grown up?
sullen gazelle
weary copper
Is it true that symmetra has autism and OCD?
I see the OCD but i didn't know about the autism
gusty fjord
subtle dawn
@gusty fjord yup, but you'd be better suited discussing that in #general-discussion 
@weary copper that's a reach
the only confirmation we got was that she's on the spectrum
anything else is speculation, really
iron plume
She is on the autism spectrum and likes things organized
the internet definition of OCD is wrong and dumb
long ermine
ocd/autist here
she doesnt seem like she has ocd
and autism is a stretch but its very different between people
either way its uncomfirmed and unlikeyl
long ermine
im aware
i meant ocd
not autism
im tired
i know she has autism, but it seems like a stretch but its different blah blah.. then she doesnt seem like she has ocd, its unconfirmed and unlikely
ordered it wrong
feral lintel
oh, my bad
iron plume
yeah it was unclear
you're right on that
leaden osprey
Sym doesn’t have OCD, being orderly/a perfectionist=/= OCD
subtle moss
OCD is flicking the lightswitch seven times and turning the door handle twice, once clockwise and the other counterclockwise, before you leave a room.
subtle moss
I don't mean that specifically.
But it's a lot closer to the internet interpretation which is just someone that likes order/is a perfectionist.
valid shell
Getting satisfaction from patterns is a very human thing.
It doesn't mean you have a disorder.
runic scroll
I think the difference is that a person without the condition is amused/satisfied with patterns but not particularly bothered when something trivial is broken
But someone with the condition would be a little too bothered by what would be considered trivial by everyday standards
Like not putting your left shoe on first is trivial for most, but it could be something that can’t be broken if you have some kind of condition
I wonder how common energy weapons are in OW universe exactly
We see a lot of heroes with them, but it could be just because they’re heroes and get to use special/advanced weaponry
Don’t most of the grunt guys use conventional firearms?
I also just realized all three Talon DPS use conventional firearms
feral lintel
doesn't the talon assassin in retribution use energy blades?
iron plume
blades aren't projectile
also he's talking about the heroes
aren't there 4 talon dps
anyway all four of them still use firearms
feral lintel
i doubt doomfist's implants or gauntlet count as firearms
iron plume
his shotgun on the left does
although that has dubious canonicity
ionic socket
i can't wait til orisa gets her double swords finally
and til rein can dual wield hammers
and ana gets her barrel roll
who's with me
valid shell
@ionic socket That won't happen.
ionic socket
wow pessimistic much?
iron plume
ana roll has a chance
valid shell
No memes please.
ionic socket
but can we talk about ana for a second?
iron plume
the others straight up don't make sense with their class types
valid shell
The parrot isn't canon.
ionic socket
btw all of the stuff i mentioned is in cinematics
iron plume
she doesn't have one
ionic socket
lets create a petition to name ana's parrot
pearl blade
Kinda bordering on shitposting now.
iron plume
anything containing "petition" is
valid shell
@ionic socket Dude, I know you're trying to bait some le epic ecks dees, but stop.
ionic socket
welp, what were you guys talking about before?
i wanna learn some lore
i wanna stimulate some new ideas
valid shell
Somehow I get the feeling you don't, but I'll humor you.
We were discussing Symmetra's autism and the possibility of her having OCD.
iron plume
and prevalence of energy weapons
ionic socket
Oh, okies
There are so many rare voicelines in the game.
Anyone have a good site to listen to them?
iron plume
gamepedia has a lot of them
ionic socket
ooo okies
iron plume
I think there's one that has a dump but not sure about the link
runic scroll
Oh lol i forgot about doomfist. I was focused on the more traditional gun shooting heroes
But you also see regular overwatch operatives and talon grunts with regular guns i think
So i was wondering how common energy weapons are in general within the universe
subtle moss
I want a hero with the talon footsoldier gun.
it reminds me of a P90 and that gun from Half Life 2
so cool
runic scroll
Maybe soldier could have a skin with a similar weapon, not exactly the talon gun though
I feel like a new playable hero with that kind of weapon could feel kind of redundant
But who knows
vapid orchid
I don'
oops
*I don't think they'd add a talon footsoldier hero into the game, but a skin could be possible
subtle moss
At the very least a Soldier skin, yeah.
I can't think of any potential character that could use one anyway.
They'd have to be a cross between Soldier and Sombra or something.
Speaking of Soldier, can someone explain what pulse munitions actually are?
Is there something special to them or are they just 'generic future bullets'?
iron plume
Pulse weapons are an actual concept, they use electric pulse to launch a metal projectile via magnetic force
They’re a scifi staple and there’s been some IRL concepts
runic scroll
Is soldier’s pulse munition the same thing though, is the question i think
iron plume
we’re a long way off but they’re scientifically valid
that’s what people usually mean by pulse munition
so idk why it wouldn’t be
if you’re asking if it’s confirmed that soldiers gun is specifically that, no
runic scroll
I just feel like blizzard usually refers to energy weapons as pulse
In starcraft franchise
As opposed to railguns
worthy rose
Diva has ptsd prove me wrong
limpid agate
Having bad memories != PTSD
Compare D.Va's reaction in Shooting Star to Bastion's in The Last Bastion for the most glaring difference, but also, if simply remembering that you almost lost a fight with a solemn look on your face is PTSD, then half the world has PTSD from whenever they think of an unhappy memory.
What happened was, D.Va was inspecting her mech and remembering that her team almost lost the previous fight. She was calm and composed as she reflected on that, she wasn't having a PTSD flashback, she was simply remembering what happened previously and it was portrayed to the viewer as a flashback.
It is just as much of a PTSD flashback as the entirety of Honour and Glory.
Which isnt.
worthy rose
Explain my grandpa from Vietnam makes that same expression
summer laurel
having 1 or 2 symptoms does not = a diagnosis.
worthy rose
Papa Jeff knows
limpid agate
Yeah, and my brother makes the same expression when he realizes he forgot his phone
Thats not PTSD
summer laurel
you can have signs of depression and not actually have depression
worthy rose
next time he has an AmA ima ask that
limpid agate
People assume way too many heroes have PTSD because they appear sad at some point in time.
Or not even sad, but merely solemn
D.Va, Soldier 76, Ana, Widowmaker, Mei, Reinhardt, Torbjorn, etc.
summer laurel
many assume they have ptsd because they had a fight go on in the past that they think about lol
worthy rose
Yeah technically by that logic all the hero’s have ptsd
summer laurel
and what evidence do you have that makes you believe that dva has ptsd?
worthy rose
The short
summer laurel
because if its just her thinking back on it, then no. she probably doesnt have ptsd
its not evident enough to me at least
worthy rose
Hold on
iron plume
so nothing then
worthy rose
During her flashback, it was like the whole world disappeared for her, like she was back during the moment again.
can you not plagiarize from a forum post?
summer laurel
but its just a flashback
pearl blade
Pretty sure that was so that the viewer could understand what happened last time, not actually having it block out the world
limpid agate
^
summer laurel
you probably have symptoms of many many disorders, but you cant be diagnosed based on 1 thing lol
worthy rose
But J.hung was talking to her I belive
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/overwatch/t/does-dva-have-ptsd/195264/3
This is the post you lifted from word-for-word.
Yeah cuz it made sense
limpid agate
Recall: http://bit.ly/1T1Aky8
summer laurel
you can think about things while people talk to you
limpid agate
In Recall, before Talon even shows up
The exact same thing happens
The whole world appears to disappear to show Winston's childhood
its not a PTSD flashback
Its cinematography.
worthy rose
bad example
limpid agate
The one from before Talon showed up
Not the one from when Winston was knocked out
There were multipl;e
Its not PTSD. In this case, it is remembrance.
He looks at the photo of himself and Dr Winston, and thinks about his childhood with his father-figure.
Not PTSD, same style of "taken out of the world" flashback
loud wren
Who is the next Greek hero gonna be btw the way
feral lintel
who said the next hero's going to be greek?
white cobalt
Greek? what?
limpid agate
@loud wren There are no Greek characters.
Closest you have is Hamid Faisal, an archaeologist from Oasis who has ties to the digsite at Ilios.
And he aint Greek
main pawn
Who do you think is next?
limpid agate
Junkerqueen
limpid agate
No one else has a chance for 29 IMO.
main pawn
Athena
limpid agate
Athena has no body, and she is the announcer.
pallid nymph
limpid agate
Meh
Theres more interesting characters IMO, and they are not all that relevant either
iron plume
Lynx is one of those characters who'd get further lore content development to later become a hero
if they do
Brigitte style
frosty shell
Isn't there at least a Greek archaeologist (Ionannidis, I think) mentioned in Faisal's e-mails at Petra?
limpid agate
🤷
frosty shell
I believe so
potent vapor
Aha, I was right about Baguette being included in Junkenstein.
potent vapor
Distinct lack of background with the Petras Act.
peak escarp
the Petras Act was likely named after Director Petras, the civilian assigned to be Director of Overwatch (probably after Blackwatch came to light and the UN decided they needed more oversight)
potent vapor
Didn't Papa Jeff said something about how that map directly relates to the Petras Act?
limpid agate
No
potent vapor
Huh, I did recall something he said about it in that developer update.
potent vapor
Seems kinda weird to have a map in Petra, have the Petras Act, and not make the two things directly related.
peak escarp
Petra is a real place
potent vapor
Well, yeah.
peak escarp
Petras is named after Bill Petras, a dev on Overwatch
cunning ledge
Helix Security and Helix Rockets exist without being connected
peak escarp
names are coincidental
cunning ledge
names can just be names
potent vapor
Hmm, I'm still not convinced that Blizz's decision for this is a bit weird.
Unless Chu comes out with a "common misconception" statement or w/e.
cunning ledge
what
peak escarp
he's only ever said that about one thing and now every time lore comes up everyone's all "common misconception XD!"
it really needs to stop
iron plume
especially considering how many actual common misconceptions there are
anyway since junkenstein AU is related, Tracer is "will o' the wisp" and Brigitte is "the shieldmaiden"
potent vapor
Not that much heroes have skins fitting for Junkenstein.