which unfortuately shows when she has to be in a somewhat discret mission of finding sombra
#lore-discussion
regal coyote
valid shell
@shut coral Explain?
worthy rose
I would like to hear voice interactions with Hammond and Winston and maybe we can hear a little more about the scientists on the lunar colony
cunning ledge
only a few hours now
worthy rose
@shut coral I wish to ask if you have something against Russian people, if so all though I don’t agree it is your opinion
valid shell
I doubt he's coming back.
placid zealot
hi
cunning ledge
hello there
willow python
What's everyone think of how Hammond fits into the lore?
peak escarp
I think they did a good job of making an intelligent giant hamster a plausible hero idea
Hammond fits within the previously established rules of the Overwatch universe
cunning ledge
agreed
and they've disconnected him from junkertown enough so that he could really show up anywhere
and it wouldn't be too bad
willow python
I agree with that though some youtubers are bringing up good points. If Hammond and Winston were really friends why did Hammond have to "secretly" attach his escape pod to Winston's. Doesn't make sense
iron plume
considering that we know Chu wasn't happy with the idea, he did a good enough job
willow python
I didn't know that.
I like Hammond as an over all character, will be interesting to see if he replaces D'va. I think his lore background has some holes in it but other than that yeah. Seems like every new character is always controversial. @bronze skynot as far as I know.
peak escarp
the patch should go live in about 10 minutes, but you're right
this isn't the place for it
bronze sky
Yeah I thought it was #overwatch
willow python
@peak escarp lol. You should be doctor six shot.
worthy rose
Chu doesnt like hammond?
peak escarp
I think he said it was hard to work a hamster piloting a mech into the lore
but I don't think he said he dislikes Hammond
brazen river
henlo
severe oxide
do we know Hammond's voice actor? I mean the hamster, not the robotic voice
severe oxide
is it Dee Bradley Baker?
peak escarp
and Jonathan Lipow is the mech's voice
severe oxide
lol no way it's actually dee bradley baker
it's always fucking him
voicing animals and shit
limpid agate
Hammond's VA is also known for perry the platypus.
peak escarp
he is the guy for animal voices
severe oxide
he's like, the VA who's done the most work
limpid agate
And Klaus the fish on American Dad is him talking normally
limpid agate
Hes the only VA since launch that fits that
Before launch, there are a couple that were well known
severe oxide
now Overwatch is only missing Tara Strong and Mark Hamill
limpid agate
Torbjorn's, McCree's, Soldier's
severe oxide
and maybe JK Simmons and H Jon Benjamin
though Benjamin is a little too one note
Bob and Archer have literally the same voice
peak escarp
I've never heard of them
peak escarp
if you're looking for big name voice actors who haven't done anything in Overwatch, how about Laura Bailey, Troy Baker, Nolan North
severe oxide
you've definitely heard Tara Strong's voice
peak escarp
yeah I know the first two
cunning ledge
A few of them have been in WoW and other Blizzard games iirc
limpid agate
3 Foreign VAs
2 Theatre actors
1 tv actor
A new guy
And a big name VA.
peak escarp
but not Simmons and Benjamin
cunning ledge
jk simmons is J. Jonah Jameson from the raimi spider-man
severe oxide
does lots of voices in cartoons
cunning ledge
yeah
severe oxide
Benjamin is Archer and Bob from Bob's Burgers
peak escarp
oh
severe oxide
one of the most iconic voices in animation
peak escarp
I don't watch Bob's Burgers
cunning ledge
you're forgetting terry crews, he's requested a lot
peak escarp
has Terry Crews done any voice work?
peak escarp
oh yeah
cunning ledge
according to wikipedia american dad too
peak escarp
huh
severe oxide
he would have been a terrible voice for doomfist
limpid agate
Fixed a bug that prevented Junker Queen’s voice lines from playing
Yes
cunning ledge
cool thanks
got the analysing location line on junkertown, same as on ptr
no change there
oh here's something neat
when you move while waving hello the trackball moves by itself
either animation effort missed or hint that the mech has control of itself
"welcome to junkertown"
no new lines
same as at the arena
well that was a letdown
dammit blizzard
severe oxide
so, spray with Brigitte, Torbjorn, Reinhardt and Bastion watching tv: likely canon
spray with Emily, Tracer, Winston and Mei: also possibly canon
spray with Sombra, Zarya, McCree and Hanzo?
cunning ledge
Reflections Calaveras + other characters who’ve probably been in the area and/or drink alcohol
iron plume
dva being alone: canon as fuck
which makes me think whether they're ever going to bring up/mention the game dva is famous for
because then it would also work well as an Overwatch stand-in/replacement for those self referential things
cunning ledge
he also has the bubble gum victory pose
regal coyote
@limpid agate also remember Genji's Japanese VA is a pop star (who is a gamer/otaku). Fucker actually had a GUNDAM designed after him in GvG.
limpid agate
I dont know what GvG is
worthy rose
And anyways, why does hammond have sprays of the other characters?
limpid agate
Oh his Japanese VA. Not Gaku Space
cunning ledge
GvG is a hearthstone expansion
Goblins vs Gnomes
still not sure what that means here
limpid agate
Its obviously not that GvG
cunning ledge
and that's probably not what he even meant
worthy rose
The sprays of the other characters are mixed in with his
regal coyote
simple geomatry back as voiceline
cunning ledge
you can tell because you can't buy them
worthy rose
Did not notice there wasnt a price on them
untold quest
Oof
west cove
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/198873108231225344/471445015810539521/ScreenShot_18-07-25_00-30-06-000.jpg wasnt this sort of shit supposed to be dva's schtick before they retconned her? 
peak escarp
what, drinking in a bar?
west cove
no, people watching her missions and tournaments being livestreamed
peak escarp
DVa is still a world champion, so people would watch her compete in eSports
west cove
she's classified as a 'former professional gamer' though
which indicates she doesnt anymore
iron plume
yeah because she has more important shit to do
peak escarp
okay, so then they used to
that was never retconned
"Recently, she has begun to stream combat operations to her adoring fans, and her growing following has turned her into a global icon."
she still streams, it's just combat missions instead of esports
cyan dune
This new overwatch cinematic is insane Jeff really went above and beyond this time!
white cobalt
@cyan dune No memes here, go away.
cyan dune
Ooooooookkkkkkkk byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
timid eagle
Could someone post what they’ve added to the Hero Gallery that wasn’t mentioned in the patch notes?
valid shell
Is it lore related?
timid eagle
From what others have already mentioned, it’s sprays of various cast members hanging out & watching a sports game.
peak escarp
which may or may not be canon
limpid agate
Huh
Remember those cute hero concepts
They made one of them into a Hearthstone card
Or maybe not
That was my first thought when I saw it
But its missing the shotgun
Cyclops cylinder quadraped
covert oyster
I hate that the finals sprays are so bloomin' stupid to get, that they require you to sit there painfully bored if you'd rather be doing anything else, but the possible lore in them is kinda intriguing, Moira before the fuckery especially.
covert oyster
This news thing lied to my ass, they called'er Moira, which I believed after taking a stroll to notice her hair too is orange.
At least it's a lot less confusing in this case.
peak escarp
it was incorrectly labelled as Moira (and Mei was labelled as Mercy) when the sprays were first announced
hasty surge
Who will be the next hero???
valid shell
@hasty surge Who do you think it will be?
limpid agate
Ive got my idea, but Ill wait to hear someone else first
lean prawn
I hope it's another overwatch agent
limpid agate
Then who is yours
hasty surge
Maximilien
limpid agate
Im still expecting Junkerqueen 29, thanks to Hammond's teasers
hasty surge
well he is the next he I next hero I wanna play after Hammond so..
the have to Rename Max's icon 1st
so you expect 29 to be related to hammond?
I'm really surprised we hadn't got any comics yet
limpid agate
No
I expect 29 to be relevant to the 4 months before their debut
Queen had teasers in Hammond's teasers, and she had appearances in his Origin short and a spray
Also, Jeff and co went out of their way to say Hammond is NOT a Junker
Presumeably emphasized so we dont get "Ugh, a fourth Junker?"
limpid agate
Within 4 months
Yes, the rework
And in my opinion, Brig's jetpack cat jokes got people thinking about animal heroes in general. But thats a stretch.
But the HLC rework 100% counts
hasty surge
There's another possibility of Talon Tank/Blackwatch Tank
so a new hero we don't know yet
hero in ayutthaya?
sanjay?
dim root
Sanjay?
He's a bit lanky to be a tank as can be seen in symm's comics
Maybe he makes a suit out of hard light?
hasty surge
hard light user tank?
white cobalt
But hard light
hasty surge
that's pretty cool
maybe he needs time to charge he's suit up
much like dva
more times he charge the more useful heis
dim root
Reverse dva
hasty surge
hmm
kind shale
Wouldn’t sombra destroy the tank’s suit
native silo
hasty surge
Cause talon doesn't have one
I do suppose you need a tank if you wanna have a "brute" operation
Maybe not 29 but sooner or later
cunning ledge
If next lore event is talon they might need one
cunning ledge
???
hasty surge
And they do not need one (a tank) for the previous lore event
So they may not
Need one
Moria was the Blackwatch Healer and Talon healer right?
cunning ledge
Hence the “might” yes
Yes
You say was but she hasn’t been a Talon healer in an event yet
hasty surge
Say if we getting a tank from either Talon or Blackwatch. They may not be the same person (like moria)
cunning ledge
Personally I’d like something along the lines of Reaper/Sombra, Doomfist, Moira, Sanjay as a tank
hasty surge
Ok I apologise I made the very same mistake I warn against
I treated/read talon as Blackwatch
Ok my mistake aside
Say if Sanjay happens to be a tank (for Talon), we can assume that we was not in Blackwatch and we would probably expect another Blackwatch Tank
dim root
A talon tank would be more probable than blackwatch tank. Mainly after that blackwatch retribution event (lorewise), overwatch started crumbling
And blackwatch was also on the hots
As seen in the uprising comic, mccree was in "vacation" in london so nothing official
worthy rose
I dont think a big tanky character would fit in blackwatch
regal coyote
@limpid agate JQ is coming but may not be 29
my reason being her design does not seem to be fully detailed yet.
so unless we get some JQ media between this and 29 release it is gonna be something else, a buffer person that is either out of the left field or is already mentioned even further and erlier.
they hype seem to be not in the "4 month" stage
valid shell
I'm still firmly planted in the camp that we'll never get the Queen.
peak escarp
Why do you think we won't?
cunning ledge
too many australian heroes, probably
brisk harbor
3 junker heroes
valid shell
For those exact reasons.
There were plenty of other places for Hammond to have ended up once he reached earth, established and not, but Blizzard deciding to set him in Junkertown says they weren't really saving it for anything else.
Also, Junkertown Queen's design has declined since her initial poster.
She's gotten more simplified and cartoonish.
peak escarp
Why would they need to save it? We have multiple heroes from some locations
valid shell
More than two?
Do tell.
The only instance I can think of is our three Americans, and they're scattered across the continent with no common roots before Overwatch.
valid shell
That would still be a fourth hero from a very specific city in a waterlocked country.
faint drum
what about Torb, Brigette and Rienhart
valid shell
Reinhardt's German, homie.
peak escarp
(Also don't take this as me dismissing your opinions, I'm just providing counterarguments so there's a conversation)
worthy rose
I dont think nationality should determine whether a character should be playable
If the character exists and has lore and a design, then why shouldnt they be a hero?
Idk
cunning ledge
because people want representation?
worthy rose
And i have no clue why i am here
cunning ledge
serious lore discussion here please @worthy rose
worthy rose
@@cunning ledge asked me to be here
cunning ledge
what?
cunning ledge
you say that
but I doubt there will ever be more than.. I want to say 40 heroes
they could make decent progress to every nationality though
regal coyote
trust me there is gonna be mroe than 40 heroes
it is going to get longer
but eventually some heroes would ahve the same or similar roles
so it is a matter of choosing either A or B which is doing similar job.
this works mostly for dps
think about it, even if they ahve 50 different snipers we will only use 1 or at best 2 in one comp
worthy rose
Some characters are already a combination of others
regal coyote
more likely actually
iron plume
could work like a riptire
regal coyote
pet probably have to be ordered to attack specific target
and most likely a melee thing, like a doge or eagle
if eagle then ai is not problem, just flies from target to target
valid shell
A pet class can't have any amount of AI.
Too many variables.
If it's melee, it would have to have some kind of instant dash or teleport, because pathing would be a disaster with OW's mapping.
valid shell
lol funni jef head
He plays as much a role in the lore as, say. D.Va.
I agree he's tertiary to the plot, but just because he's a sapient space animal, doesn't make him any less of a moving piece.
honest pulsar
So Zero...
limpid agate
Or Lucio, or Orisa. There are lots of meaningless heroes.
Hammond isnt the only one that doesnt do anything to the story
honest pulsar
Not really orisa can help give backstory on doomfosy in a way...
limpid agate
And Hammond can help give backstory on the Junkers and the moon in a way.
valid shell
Being an accessory to Doomfist's story doesn't make her any more a valid character.
valid shell
A gorilla.
limpid agate
So what if he's a hamster. We knew he was a small harmless animal for a year
valid shell
Try and look past that he's a literal Pixar protagonist and you'll see he's not that much different from the roster.
honest pulsar
He is a death ball of fur boi he is not harmless
Anyways I don't understand why he was so important to the lore that they had to add him to the game
valid shell
Brigitte wasn't particularly important to the lore.
limpid agate
The only heroes they added that were important to the lore
honest pulsar
I get dva doesn't do much but they put her in the original roster and they had no real plan for the lore back then
honest pulsar
Except for Doomfist and Talon and Stuff
valid shell
Why do you keep typing Doomfosy.
valid shell
Good luck in your Fortnite match.
valid shell
Does she?
regal coyote
Brig is supposed to take up rein's position in future overwatch
valid shell
Whether or not she's actually joining Overwatch is still a point of contention.
She's not supposed to do anything atm.
regal coyote
it is a matter of WHEN she would join
valid shell
Has it been confirmed she's joining and 'taking Rein's position'?
regal coyote
overwatch have a sub-plotline of old and new generation
limpid agate
She has done nothing now
Saying Brig has the potential to do something
Also goes for the others
Orisa, Lucio, DVa, Hammond
They can all potentially do something
But right now, they havent done shit.
Brigitte is not an exception
valid shell
At this point Blizzard should just auction off the rights to heroes to writers/artists.
regal coyote
or worse ... shit writers that writes 50 shades
worthy rose
I swear if anyone else wrote the story the lore would be finished by now
brisk harbor
Lore is so slow
Literally I quit overwatch for a year and only one comic has been released
worthy rose
I cant think of a reason as to why the story is so slow
You could write a good and coherent story in like, days or weeks even
But taking a year to practically do nothing is just strange
valid shell
Because story doesn't make money.
worthy rose
They shoulda just gave us first strike
iron plume
writing a good story in days
"How to tell that a person isn't a writer"
worthy rose
Its possible
worthy rose
Plot
cunning ledge
they already have a plot
it's just the implementation that takes ages
partly due to lack of opportunities (only one lore event a year, etc) and partly due to apparently the existing story being so shit that they had to cancel first strike
novel quarry
yea uh
I don't think story telling is really their priority
It'd be cool if they made an overwatch movie
Winston VS Hammond:
Friends No More
Jeff could make cameos just like Stan Lee
peak escarp
The story is slow because Blizzard plays the long game
If they gave you everything up front, there would be nothing to hold your interest
They expect Overwatch to last 10+ years, and they don't want to run out of story
valid shell
This weird cult around Jeff is starting to creep me out.
I can't go a day without someone suggesting he become a hero, or a Doomfist skin, or an NPC at Blizzard World, or something.
peak escarp
That is weird
silk pelican
I think jeff should be a multi class hero with a huge healthpool, max dps and a ability to corrupt enimies to make them unabeld to damage their enemies and abeld to damage their allys. His name would be daddy jeff
cunning ledge
serious lore discussion here please @silk pelican
valid shell
@silk pelican I doubt that, since you're pretty much directly responding to my earlier post.
limpid agate
Shitposting will result in a loss of access, consider this your final warning @silk pelican
silk pelican
Ok in sorry
peak escarp
question
Mei's age is listed as 31
is that before she went into cryofreeze or present day?
aka does that include the 9 years spent frozen?
limpid agate
She is 40
peak escarp
so the 31 on her bio is the age she was when she got frozen
and doesn't include the 9 years spent frozen
aha
found it
for reference, if anyone else was curious
valid shell
@grim cipher Shitposting will result in loss of access.
grim cipher
I aplogize, ive made a grave mistake.
subtle dawn
moving swiftly onwards
worthy rose
yup
lean silo
biologically yes
while Mercy is technically 37 but just never seems to age because science magic.
It's hinted at in an interaction between the two
iron plume
She looks young but believable for a 37 year old
lean silo
One who takes extremely good care of herself.
regal coyote
make up and beauty product maybe, but still within range of even today's "science magic" if you can call it that
novel quarry
Yeah, she looks fine af regardless of how old she is
but realistically, everyone in the overwatch art style looks conventionally attractive, with silky smooth perfect skin unless they explicitly need to look different
for all of the women anyway
I think the only character that doesn't seem conventionally flawless is ana, and that's just cause they needed to make her look a little old
regal coyote
that is because they are main characters? they always look better be it villian or hero.
relative to less important character, or unimportant redshirt pieces of shit where no one would remember if they suffer horrable death.
frosty star
lol "red shirt pieces of shit"
hasty surge
And I highly doubt Ana used any skincare
Definitely just nice for Overwatch sake
No one wants an ugly character, unless it is meant to be
For effects
dire timber
it's a non-issue
seriously
I'm not too fond of over-sexualization, but now you're just complaining about characters being decent-looking
which is genuinely absurd
just, let the game keep its style
when you design a character... they don't have to be super-attractive, but why would you go out of your way to make them unappealing?
it's a bizarre mindset to me
valid shell
<@&397922982632226816>
floral herald
Don't
inland crown
believing what you hear from shitposters in general
also, use modmail as opposed to pinging mods for most transgressions
regal coyote
@dire timber < one of the cases i agree with this guy
It is a main character, it has to be appealing.
It does not have to be sexualized but you dont want to play as someone repulsive either, at least not in a fun way
Even things like roadhog and junkrat have a charm in their character design.
Thing is, a really generic boring look of mook like character would not fly as a playable character. people want to feel like they are meaningful in game
this is especially true in terms of overwatch. one way or another you are trying to make a difference, even if it is in your own twisted way, for the msot part (ignoreing a few examples)
Also, in general athe artstyle is quite inclusive in term of different appeals.
Unfortunately to avoid different kinds of overly-zealous sjw style problem (or potential problem) female design would have to be a bit less extreme in terms of variation.
mostly cause extreme variation may be seen as a joke character.
We may have a even mroe curvy female, for example (hopefully) but it would not be as extreme as roadhog.
peak escarp
It's a thing in character design - you can make "ugly" characters as long as they have appeal
regal coyote
and if you get a femle styled as junkrat with sam body you WILL get bitched at.
thanks Six. exactly
especially when it coems to heroes and villians.
moot and goot yeah they can be truly ugly, but not the main ones.
peak escarp
They should also be easily identifiable by silhouette alone and their design should inform you of their character traits
Both things Blizzard does really well
regal coyote
silhouette thing is more of an overwatch specialty, and does not apply to all games (though tf2 does it nicely to start with, the father of hero shooters)
peak escarp
They've even gone as far as to give each hero a unique audio set so you can recognize them before you see them
Not in games so much, but in cartoon design
peak escarp
One of the principals of cartoon character design is a strong silhouette
regal coyote
things like TMNT have quite similar ones, though might be due to cutting costs
also the cartoon design thing would apply to heroes and main villians
and in our case we have at least 28 of them
peak escarp
It's the outstanding character design that makes Overwatch stand out among shooters
regal coyote
that, and coupled with how blizz knows what and when to give fans what they want
and how to play with hype and interests
frosty star
i've got o say though that blizz has always been big on attention to detail (shoutout to WC3 cinematics) the character designs are simple and elegant, and their sp;ecial skins are just incredibly detailed
like if you really scrutinize the leggo skins you're gona be wow'd by the little things
regal coyote
I generally love the skins
Would love to see the recolor version of some skins though
I have to say in terms of recolor hots is more open to it
Some of the recolors look really nice, like the Lucio Black Frog
Also the group of fun reference recolors of D.Va, to name a few
limpid agate
First response that isn't a meme:
I noticed there aren’t any Aliens or some sort of being from an outer dimension in the game. Except for a Smart Gorilla and Hamster. That can be kinda cool.
I now know better than to read forum comment
dire timber
alien suggestions are super dumb
limpid agate
Just looking at my honourable mentions list
Of characters that exist and aren't the Queen.
Emre and Hamid are the only humans that go somewhere new.
Sanjay is another Indian
Sven is another Nord
The rest are Omnics, an AI or a nameless face that showed up a few times in the past
limpid agate
Hamid has potential for the 30s
cunning ledge
queen is the most likely for sure
dire timber
any room for a modern day Caribbean pirate?
limpid agate
But thats something I have 0 faith in and is just based on Hammond, Ana, Sombra, and potentially the Queen becoming heroes 1 year after their introduction
Its not a real pattern, they go longer (Doomfist and Brigitte were 2 years) and shorter (Moira was less than a year, Orisa didnt exist)
31 is the safest guess, but he can happen whenever they want. Just not 29
white cobalt
@limpid agate just curious, why wildebeast?
limpid agate
Because I couldnt think of a better 9th person to put in there
Liao is the only other one.
And a 3x3 grid looks nicer than a 2x4
valid shell
Mirembe/Kimiko/Sam/Ray/Fio?
valid shell
Fucking Ingrid?
limpid agate
Is the least bad of those
valid shell
She's at least voice acted, and her helmet allows for freedom to make her look unique if the time ever comes.
limpid agate
Yeah thats fair
And Wildebeest has been taken and put into 3 heroes now
Or was it 4?
valid shell
Reinhardt, Orisa, and Brigitte.
white cobalt
We don't have hope for Liao, at this point blizzard could delete the name in the page and doesn't affect lore.
valid shell
Yes please.
limpid agate
Oh she has a face
valid shell
Yeah, she has a lot more of a face than I thought.
limpid agate
Thats... Actually a little disappointing
limpid agate
Here you go, exclusively named characters.
Im not putting in Mirembe/Kimiko/Ray/Family Members. Please give me a Liao replacement
valid shell
Gerard.
limpid agate
No more zombies 😦
valid shell
Remember when people were convinced Harold Winston was hard confirmed for 28?
How embarrassing.
frosty shell
We could get Liao randomly
Like a mention
She's probably just not too important to become a hero, but she's probably still canon
frosty shell
Maybe just something like "Liao told me that..."
Even if it didn't reveal anything about Liao it would confirm Liao existed
valid shell
@frosty shell How would that solve anything.
cunning ledge
surely that would make it worse
valid shell
Liao existing, but never mentioned by any of the other founders or on any posters would be a massive problem.
peak escarp
I would like Liao to exist in more places than a single news article
if they are going to exist at all
frosty shell
It would clear up the problem of "Is Liao still canon"
And it would be one of the original founders who said it
It seems pretty likely that Liao died during the Crisis
She didn't show up in any material other than First Strike during the period when First Strike was still in development
You would've thought there would've been some sort of reference slipped in
valid shell
Then why isn't the 6th founder who gave their life during the Crisis celebrated or even mentioned anywhere?
frosty shell
There aren't really any places where we'd expect Liao to be mentioned in the game
Like I can't think of any statues of the OW founders
except for maybe Morrison
Can you please show me a poster that has the pictures of the other OW team members?
Not a shot from the origin video
valid shell
@frosty shell The poster in Hero.
limpid agate
Also, a t-Shirt, not a poster
Which is from a short that takes place in an Overwatch museum
There was also this Mercy magazine someone used for NSFW purposes. This was removed from the game though.
So... Lots
cunning ledge
just ignore that the symmetra one makes no sense
that's her secret agent outfit damit
valid shell
Is it?
cunning ledge
it's what she wears to go do the covert operation
i just assumed that that's what the outfit is
and when she does her job normally it's the vishkar skin
cunning ledge
either that or the vishkar skin appearance was a first (and last?) impressions sort of deal for the mayor
which i think is unlikely
frosty shell
But the first poster isn't from the Omnic Crisis
limpid agate
You never asked about the Omnic Crisis
frosty shell
And the second poster is a Reinhardt spray, so it makes sense that it's just Reinhardt
frosty shell
But Liao would probably be on posters with the original strike team
limpid agate
Thats nice
frosty shell
And we haven't seen one of those
limpid agate
Please dont move your goalposts
frosty shell
I'm not moving my goalposts
limpid agate
You are. You said Can you please show me a poster that has the pictures of the other OW team members?
And when shown a bunch
You say they dont count
frosty shell
I didn't say they don't count
And I meant the original OW strike team
Sorry that I didn't explain that clearly
Thanks for finding the posters, though
But we haven't seen pictures of Ana or Torbjörn on posters either
And they were part of the strike team
The only real place where Liao is missing is in the photographs of the OW strike team battling, which may or may not be canon
limpid agate
Why wouldnt they be
frosty shell
Many of them were from the cinematic
Blizzard must've left out Liao from those pictures for a reason, most of them were made during the development of First Strike
limpid agate
They were from Soldier 76 Origin story
Which has no reason to be retconned
Or Are You With Us
Which is the same
frosty shell
OK, so they are canon, I made a mistake
limpid agate
Of course
frosty shell
Maybe that picture was from after Liao's death
Those pictures suprisingly don't seem to deviate from current canon
valid shell
Consider how mournful Reinhardt is about Balderich, or Torbjorn about the impact of his inventions, or Ana about everyone she's killed.
frosty shell
Even with Reinhardt you can't tell if his hair is blonde or white
valid shell
If Liao died in action, he would be mentioned by now.
frosty shell
They could definitely throw in Liao later
frosty shell
But we haven't actually heard very much of characters talking about their service in the Omnic Crisis
Like nothing about their time in the Overwatch Strike Team
peak escarp
that would be a bit weird, Binge
valid shell
Duh.
limpid agate
Thats the trouble with expanding universes
If you say
This is everyone
There was never anyone else
Then you cant make more heroes
At least, not from that time era
Like Moira
frosty shell
I would like more lore from the past, though
First Strike would be cool if it were released now, or in the future
It seems like the reason why they cancelled it is that it would've been to much lore to remember
peak escarp
the story First Strike was about should still be told
frosty shell
But now that we aren't getting as much lore, it might not conflict with as much
limpid agate
Thats not what I meant
peak escarp
but First Strike as it was was largely incorrect and has since been retconned
frosty shell
If Liao died, that photo easily could've been of everyone
limpid agate
What about Ana Origins
You can say
Oh
Thats everyone in overwatch 20 years ago
But then we got Emre
frosty shell
It might not even be a photo that exists in universe (the soldier photo)
Emre could be the mohawk guy
And also, I don't think all of Overwatch is supposed to be in that picture
And Mercy wasn't even an OW member at the time
That probably is just Ana's/Fareeha's friends
limpid agate
Emre most likely isnt the mohawk guy
Because Emre was confirmed to not have a backstory at that point
Was probably just a name
peak escarp
but they could make mohawk guy Emre
valid shell
Then again, Hammond and Wrecking Ball were also just smushed together from two concepts.
So ^
peak escarp
like how they had a paladin with a shield and made it Brigitte
frosty shell
Overwatch probably had more members than just the 7 ones depicted there
One thing I'd like to see is how 6 soldiers could take down an entire omnium
valid shell
There's no probably about it.
We've seen dozens of Overwatch's living members in Recall.
And dozens of dead ones in Retribution comic.
frosty shell
But the photo is from 20 years ago
Though that doesn't mean anything, Overwatch almost certainly had dozens of members then too
cunning ledge
"In highly secretive missions, they targeted the omnics' command and control protocols. After great sacrifice and heroism in a series of dangerous raids, they destroyed it all, rendering the omnic armies inert."
thats how 6 soldiers did it
frosty shell
But the omniums must've been some of the most heavily defended structures ever
peak escarp
stealth missions
frosty shell
I'd like to see how the stealth missions worked, though
I can't imagine it would be easy to sneak up on a powerful robot
peak escarp
if Overwatch wasn't an fps those stealth missions would be great missions to play
frosty shell
There must've been guns everywhere
peak escarp
my kind of game
frosty shell
And the omnic command and control would be far more sophisticated than any human
shy stag
Tracer is a trap
valid shell
@Chilled_fame.v2#5943 Shitposting will result in loss of access.
dire timber
hm, I still kinda hope that Fio and Tracer were related somehow
still can't give up on that idea that they used to date
and Tracer does have a thing for red hair it seems
but that's neither here nor there, I guess
anyhow
do we have any indication whatsoever that Liao still even exists?
brisk harbor
@dire timber are the only connections that they're both pilots and tracer likes reheads?
dire timber
yea, tbh
like, there's nothing in canon
it just kinda clicked in my mind
but yea
not canon
brisk harbor
Rip they have different eye color
@dire timber also what do you mean by indication that Liao exists
Like still alive?
dire timber
exists at all
brisk harbor
Their names—Morrison, Reyes, Amari, Liao, Wilhelm, and Lindholm—have since become legendary. The world would come to know them as the founders of Overwatch.
dire timber
that's before First Strike was canceled
silk badger
What's going on here I wanna join the discussion lmao
silk badger
W h om st is this Liao
limpid agate
Liao was the 6th founder of Overwatch
They were mentioned once two years ago, supposed to go into a comic that got cancelled, and then never mentioned again
silk badger
Ohh. Sounds interesting.
peak escarp
most people have forgotten Liao even exists
twin pollen
So Morrison is soldier, Reyes is reaper, is it known who amari, wilhelm, and Lindholm are? If they are even alive?
peak escarp
Ana Amari, Reinhardt Wilhelm, Torbjorn Lindholm
peak escarp
yes
Liao is the only one we know nothing about
some people here suspect that even the devs have forgotten about them
peak escarp
I'm hoping Liao is a woman
and still relevant to the story
because that means when we learn about her we learn more about the founding of Overwatch
twin pollen
I think Liao could easily be a woman, and I hope the devs haven’t forgotten Liao, just haven’t gotten to her/him yet
limpid agate
The thing is, the other characters that were introduced back then were:
Athena, Brigitte, Sanjay, Sven
Of those, Athena is the announcer, Brigitte is playable, Sanjay keeps popping up as an important member of the Talon council, and Sven was never important the first time
Liao was never mentioned outside 1 sentence that came out on launch day
peak escarp
if they are going to do something with Liao, it's probably going to be a major lore event
that's a big if though
it's more likely that Liao was retconned out when they dropped First Strike and they just never told us
twin pollen
Well they could always bring Liao up if needed, but you are probably right.
Only time will tell I guess
peak escarp
at this point I'd settle for a simple yes, Liao is still relevant, or no, forget Liao ever existed
brisk harbor
Why didn't widow kill Tracer as well
hearty zinc
Because Tracer is the Cover character for overwatch
worthy rose
Seriously though, Why did the Makers of the omnics put the most valuable hardware (Most likely motherboard/Storage) in the most obvious spot. Like why not relocate it to somewhere like the arm or chest
peak escarp
because the original makers of omnics were humans
and humans like to make things in their own image
and humans in general are not that smart
vapid yarrow
Why couldn't they make a backup
vapid sentinel
since overwatch is disbanded, does tracer have a job, or does she mooch off her girlfriend ?
peak escarp
we don't know
worthy rose
applying to walmart skills include warping through time, wearing my kryptonite on my chest, and being able to move so fast u cant see me
brazen river
We'd assume she'd have a job, other than that they couldnt survive. you could say the same for all of the overwatch team
not a very noticeable job, though, as she'd want to stay out of the spotlight after it became illegal
brazen river
^ it being overwatch
dire timber
well, Tracer would make for a great delivery girl
Torb is a talented engineer, but as for employment... it seems he's mostly retired
Rein is also retired, and he travels around in search for adventure
McCree, Soldier, and Shrike are bounty hunters with a bounty on them
actually, biographies have heroes' occupations listed
plenty of it is just "adventurer" though
terse oak
@ocean epoch don't shitpost in the lore channels
ocean epoch
Ok sorry-
regal coyote
torb is easily having a part time job as a fixer uper
srsly even in a slow enjoyable pace he is a wonderful engineererer
Sombra have money grown on trees
orisa is smooching on her mommy, so to speak
My guess is that talon pays decent to start with
mercy has good work, so did people like pharah\
not sure how zen makes money, or if he even need it
iron plume
I doubt he does
regal coyote
interesting thing is, what does Winston lives on?
I mean, sure Athena can help him scam money with trust funds and what not, and he seem smart enough to invest, but what he doing takes money
iron plume
does it? he mostly uses abandoned OW equipment
regal coyote
i would say power and energy might be free, and hell even equipment might be free
but a monkey needs to eat
and i dotn think he is planting peanut butter trees anywhere
without peanutbutter he would go looney within minutes if not worse
worthy rose
Anyone interested in discussing aspects of the omnic crisis? For example the uprising in UK.
Talon is interesting as well
worthy rose
it's related to the second omnic crisis
jack morrison thought if overwatch didn't get into UK the uprising would have led to open war and the second crisis
but they managed to neutralize null sector
and a second crisis started later in russia
iron plume
Russia's war isn't "a second crisis"
the omnium there is still operating
it's an ongoing war
worthy rose
it's called the second omnic crisis
atleast on overwatch wiki they adress it as such
weary copper
can someone tell me how wrecking ball didnt die from the impact of his pod if it had broken off the main pod?
iron plume
¯_(ツ)_/¯
probably had some independent slowdown system
it's not really explained, it's handwavium
cunning ledge
just the assumption that something worked or did something because it did
called that because it's the creators just waving their hands and ignoring the question
frosty shell
Lúcio hates Vishkar because 1. They used unethical means to demolish the favelas in Rio
- His dad used to work for them (he helped develop their sonic technology), but got screwed over by them somehow
iron plume
They also run their new developments with a very tight grip, while Lucio is all about freedom
frosty shell
Also, the Russian omnium hasn't been active since the original Omnic Crisis
From Zarya's bio: "an attack came from the long-dormant Siberian omnium"
iron plume
yeah it got reactivated
frosty shell
So in Russia, at least, it's fair to call it the "Second Omnic Crisis"
white cobalt
We know which names correspond to the scientists from Ecopoint Antarctica?
frosty shell
Yes, I believe Chu clarified it in a tweet
Luckliy for us, there are some lore questions he's willing to answer
peak escarp
you beat me to it by seconds
frosty shell
I have a feeling that Omnics couldn't join the original Ovewatch
It would make sense, after all
dire timber
the original Overwatch? well, at the very start, it was a secret strike team
composed of 6 people only
dire timber
once Overwatch ended the Omnic Crisis, its existence became public, and it became an international peacekeeping organization
hm
I think they may have allowed omnics in some service jobs
but probably didn't allow them in active duty
iron plume
yeah likely not as agents
frosty shell
Mei's science team didn't appear to have any Omnics on it either
(not counting Snowball)
dire timber
yep, definitely
honest pulsar
regal coyote
well snowball is for sure more than a drone
but probably a bit less than an omnic
so soemwhere in between
if you think about non omnic ai then:
young raptor
iirc there was some official thing saying snowball isn't an omnic
regal coyote
I would say things like Athena is for sure Omnic level or more, snowball and hamsterball is like lower.
young raptor
and the mech is definitely not omnic, jeff said that in the thing
regal coyote
bastion as an omnic is below athena (thena gain msot things are in terms of plebian omnics even i think) but bastion is otherwise still above the balls
regal coyote
yes snowball and hamball is not omnic
I am talking about AI level
in that we can say hamball is jsut an AI controlling a mech too
granted it is a much weaker AI
athena is capable of quite independant thought and reasonaing
fuk probablly a great gf for winston
young raptor
lol
peak escarp
The AI in Wrecking Ball is like a poor-ham's Jarvis
regal coyote
yes, without access to the huge bitcoin account and other toys
young raptor
i mean I am pretty sure its just voice synthesis and that's it
I don't think it ever does any decisions
regal coyote
had hammond be richer it can upgrade to a full Javis I guess
young raptor
lol
young raptor
theres "he says he's sorry"
regal coyote
and it is already said to be a simple AI other than just translation
young raptor
really? where?
brisk harbor
Why is Winston able to speak English but not Hammond
iron plume
They taught Winston to
Plus even with intelligence there’s the issue of vocal chords
brisk harbor
Gorillas can't speak English though
worthy rose
How do you know
brisk harbor
Their vocal cords and larynx muscles have different movement than that of humans
worthy rose
Okay but they can do anything they set their mind too.
peak escarp
Winston as also given genetic therapy which could have altered his physiology to make it more human-like
allowing him to speak
there's too great of a difference between hamster and human physiology for that to have happened for Hammond
worthy rose
technically there is enough similiarity that apes (especially superintelligent ones) could "train" their muscles to speak as humans do, albeit in a very rough manner.
definitely not completely human sounding as winston, but still
their vocal cords are intricant enough to produce human-like speech, recent studies show. It's possibly more about how their brain works why they can't speak, and since winston's brain is altered, he can speak.
Here is a simulation (a creepy one) of a macaque monkey saying "will you marry me?"
worthy rose
like I said, if they could speak it would definitely sound rough, just like that simulation
wat
peak escarp
there's a clip of an orangutan making human-like sounds
not really creepy, just bizarre
worthy rose
very deep voice
peak escarp
well, Winston has a deep voice, so at least that bit is accurate
worthy rose
it's interesting since orangutans have the neck pouch, this one sounds like a human talking through a water balloon or something
knotty thistle
@peak escarp "not really creepy"
pure kernel
Bizarre I tell ya
regal coyote
now we need this fuker to start singing like jungle book
novel quarry
I honestly want blizzard to make a jungle book and overwatch cross over
limpid agate
For what fucking purpose
I dont understand why
Jungle Book
Of all things
Is related to Overwatch
novel quarry
I'd love to see winston caught between two worlds
well, the monkeys in that movie talk, just like winston does
limpid agate
@worthy rose @iron plume I opened this channel to talk about the first/second Omnic Crisis.
The First Omnic Crisis was, specifically, the international war that went on 30+ years ago. It was fought by the original Overwatch Strike Team of Jack Morrison, Ana Amari, Torbjorn Lindholm, Reinhardt Wilhelm, and Liao, and was led by Gabriel Reyes. It ended >23 years ago, and started >30 years ago.
The Second Omnic Crisis is, specifically, the war going on in Russia after the Omnium awakened
Uprising is not part of it
And the Korean Kaiju is also not part of it.
Its a remnant of the first crisis thats still attacking Korea.
And Uprising was completely unrelated. That can be compared to Neo Nazis if you want a real world equivalent.
They're not real nazis, and its not a continuation of World War 2
novel quarry
so
the event where torb, tracer, rein and mercy are fighting omnics on kings row is the first crisis?
Or is that a part of something different since tracer is there?
peak escarp
no
Jewvia just said Uprising (where Torb, Tracer, Rein and Mercy are fighting omnics on King's Row) wasn't part of the omnic crisis
Uprising happened 7 years before present day (when Recall happens)
rain iron
first of all
tracer is about 21 or something am i right
and it was 7 years ago
the fact that all these events happen
novel quarry
👀
novel quarry
Tracer time travels
duh
rain iron
ingrejhb3rfdhd
dire timber
@novel quarry the Omnic Crisis took place 30 years ago, King's Row Uprising occurred 7 years ago
rain iron
im talking about bigger events
valid shell
?
limpid agate
@novel quarry Dont shitpost about things you dont understand
rain iron
like idk what year they are considered to be ago
but it was clearly a while
and small majority of heroes are pretty young
limpid agate
Tracer's first mission was 7 years ago
valid shell
You should really look up Tracer's age before you start claiming things don't make sense. :v
novel quarry
woah what
Does Tracer not travel through time????
rain iron
lmAO
novel quarry
what
dire timber
@limpid agate we don't really have any indication that the Omnic Crisis even lasted longer than a year
rain iron
she goes back in time not through time
peak escarp
she can control her personal time stream, but she does not go back in time
novel quarry
seriously though
isn't that what she does? she rewinds? That actually happened in the shorts though
rain iron
oh fgs
novel quarry
I'm not crazy am I?
dire timber
all we ever got was that it began, and ended roughly 30 years ago
rain iron
im not good at science
peak escarp
see the short Alive - Tracer recalls, but Widowmaker is unaffected
limpid agate
That it started ~30 years ago, and was over before 23 years ago
rain iron
no
peak escarp
she just sees Tracer rewind
rain iron
Ok no do u know when u start up overwatch
and its like bla bla winston talk
and goes on about how the omnic crisis was like more than 26 years ago
limpid agate
rain iron
yet tracer stands in a hallway full of overwatch agents
when it was before her time that she was born
dire timber
@novel quarry she can control the time of her own movements
but she can't travel into different points in time
valid shell
peak escarp
@rain iron that image has been said by the devs to be incorrect
peak escarp
no
peak escarp
they have said it is wrong, but they haven't removed it
valid shell
What.
dire timber
she isn't
valid shell
No, that's abjectly untrue.
rain iron
ok
dire timber
she's 26
peak escarp
dire timber
quit shitposting
peak escarp
here is where Michael Chu specifically says that the image with Tracer among all the other heros is incorrect
valid shell
This isn't up to interpretation, she's explicitly 26.
rain iron
ok wow u all take this so seriously as if its like ur life depends on it
why is everyone so serious about this :(((
peak escarp
this is the lore discussion channel
valid shell
It's almost as though this is the lore channel.
peak escarp
if you're not serious, you don't belong here
rain iron
wtff
novel quarry
In that forum Binge @sleek folio me on, literally every comment talks about how Tracer is out of sync with time
valid shell
Literally every comment isn't Michael Chu, lead writer of Overwatch.
novel quarry
I'm not saying they're correct, but I don't think I should be labeled a "shit poster" just because I made the same mistake
dire timber
rain iron
ok this is what i mean
when i mean serious i mean u all backfire to eacbother about lores in a rude way
like lmao come on
peak escarp
we're not doing it to be rude
we're saying it to inform you
if we come across as rude that's because you're taking offense
rain iron
i think a message is enough to inform
sleek folio
oops @novel quarry 😂
limpid agate
@dire timber Why have I never seen this before
peak escarp
information without evidence is not useful
dire timber
Idk
peak escarp
so we provide sources for our information
limpid agate
This is a useful compilation
novel quarry
?
valid shell
A little bit of research goes a long way.
It's not like OW lore is well hidden or obfuscated.
novel quarry
it does seem a little bit cryptic and confusing
mainly because the game is so popular, but It has little to do with the actual lore
from what I've learned anyway
novel quarry
which honestly makes it kind of unfun, but whatever
limpid agate
Its confusing because they dont put as much thought and planning into sequencing