Moira might have theories on what happened, but probably can't say definitively "yes, this is what happened"
#lore-discussion
peak escarp
runic scroll
right
worthy rose
Whatever she did to Reaper was better than what she did to Widow
peak escarp
we don't know what (if anything) she did to Widowmaker
worthy rose
Although I lowkey think they just normal brainwashed/indoctrinated her
Widow appears to only think she doesn’t feel
Ye
peak escarp
we can only speculate at this point
I would think that since Moira's specialty is genetics, she would have more to do with slowing her heart rate and making her blue and less to do with brainwashing and mental conditioning
worthy rose
Possibly
peak escarp
physiological changes, not the mental changes
runic scroll
while that's the reasonable way to think, i think you're giving too much credit to blizz
i think blizz is perfectly capable of going "she's a phd in something so she's probably smart enough to do these vaguely related looking things that actually aren't related"
and make her just be THE tech person of talon or something
well, science, not tech
fringe pewter
She's the genetic scientist of Talon
worthy rose
I can’t ever really tell who are the good guys in present day
Sure Talon antagonizes but OW is technically just as illegal 
limpid agate
I wouldnt say just as illegal
They are breaking the Petras act and playing vigilante
But they arent exactly
- Stealing
- Assassinating
- Kidnapping
- Bombing buildings
- Hacking into governments and private corporations
- Conspiring to start Omnic Crisis II
Among other things
Slaughtering security guards is another thing to add
New Overwatch hasn't taken a single life yet
Not that we know of, at least
worthy rose
The protagonists often aid Talon unwittingly tho no?
limpid agate
How so
valid shell
Wuh
worthy rose
Symmetra & Vishkar is the first example that comes to mind
runic scroll
i feel like the most aid-y thing is tracer unwittingly letting mondatta get shot
which isn't really aiding
which is my point
limpid agate
She's one of the antagonists, if anything. She opposes Lucio, who is portrayed as a good guy
last inlet
She just made it take longer
runic scroll
and vishkar is working with talon anyway
limpid agate
And possibly:
Brig
Genji
Torb
Bastion
runic scroll
so if anything, i think symmetra is just being used
fringe pewter
She does care about people but she doesn't know Vishkar is with Talon
worthy rose
Smolverwatch
limpid agate
Those 4-8 are the only ones we know are in Overwatch
valid shell
We don't know if all of Vishkar is with Talon.
runic scroll
huh i thought vishkar-talon connection was canon from some comic
valid shell
It's a Sanjay-Talon connection.
limpid agate
But thats all we know
runic scroll
isn't he the owner or something
limpid agate
We dont know how high up Sanjay is
runic scroll
ah okay
worthy rose
Oasis and Moira are connected too aren’t they?
worthy rose
And Oasis and Symmetra?
last inlet
She just has a skin
worthy rose
Oh just a skin then
valid shell
Nothing connects Symmetra with Oasis.
worthy rose
Lame
valid shell
Her Oasis skin isn't canon.
runic scroll
symm doesn't have a map iirc
peak escarp
the skin is hypothetical
valid shell
She even says that Vishkar doesn't have a presence in Oasis.
runic scroll
i wonder if we'll ever see anyone connected to lumerico
valid shell
Which pretty much confirms that Sanjay doesn't have much influence in Vishkar, or Moira doesn't have much influence in Oasis, or both.
runic scroll
the same way that symm is connected to vishkar, not like sombra
reef river
for next hero release?
dire timber
@valid shell I mean, does it?
maybe they just didn't get to it
maybe Moira's not interested
valid shell
Of course.
dire timber
I imagine that Oasis has plenty autonomy as it is now, and while they'd be willing to work with Vishkar, they would not be eager to lose it
so it definitely wouldn't be like India or Rio, where Vishkare is basically given control of the area
limpid agate
@reef river August is Gamescom
Hero should be July
Teasing can start as early as late June
dire timber
huh, there'll be a hero before Gamescom
and, uh
we did get an animated short on Gamescom, right?
limpid agate
Yes
Last Bastion
Rise and Shine
Before shorts, we got Lucio
But that was pre-launch
worthy rose
I wish they’d tie Lucio and DVa into the main story a bit more
worthy rose
What new lines?
cunning ledge
The lucio's father ones
Him working for Vishkar
Probably won't tie into the main story unless there's some slightly obscure Talon - Sanjay - Vishkar connection though
worthy rose
Ah
dire timber
well, yeah
there's definitely a "dos Santos" listed as the inventor somewhere in Vishkar patents
worthy rose
Why do we still not have one Talon tank
cunning ledge
Correia Dos Santos family friend confirmed
dire timber
Correia is part of the surname?
limpid agate
No
cunning ledge
I'm just remembering from the quote @dire timber
worthy rose
Oof
dire timber
we don't even know if he's going to be a hero at all
limpid agate
We dont even know what animal he is
dire timber
just that he was a smaller subject
dire timber
what we know about Hammond
cunning ledge
He was lost for a week at one point without anyone knowing somehow
New map detail reveals that he had/has a plan related to winston's escape to earth
But it's unclear
dire timber
- smaller specimen
- went missing before the rebellion
- currently away from the Horizon Lunar Colony (or disabled his tracker somehow)
cunning ledge
It's currently plausible that Hammond somehow hitched a ride on Winston's scrap rocket
And made his way back to earth too
cunning ledge
I had an idea that the pod in the office is actually what Hammond landed in
worthy rose
Is he a villain?
cunning ledge
Winston was in a ship and Hammond was in the pod trailing behind
dire timber
that's such a random question
cunning ledge
Probably quite refutable though
dire timber
@worthy rose Hammond has a room on Horizon Lunar Colony
cunning ledge
So then Winston found the empty pod and knows Hammond is somewhere in earth
dire timber
you can see it on the PTR
cunning ledge
Basically I just want a hero teaser in the form of the pod in winston's office changing to have some hidden Hammond detail on it
That would be neat as heck
Maybe not even hero
Just general lore
worthy rose
Well it’s a bit odd that we know so little about him
cunning ledge
Lore.png
dire timber
we still need to need more about the current heroes to be honest
worthy rose
Well
If Hammond hitched a ride with Winston then surely they must have had some interaction after arriving at Earth
limpid agate
How little we know about him?
Its in line with most NPCs
What do we know of the Queen of Junkertown?
Her voice, her face, and that she became queen for being a gladitorial mech champion.
runic scroll
and that she doesn't have high regards for junkrat and hog
limpid agate
Eh, nobody does
cunning ledge
@worthy rose I just said that in my theory Winston found the empty pod
cunning ledge
Harsh but true
worthy rose
That almost sounds like DVa @limpid agate
dire timber
didn't Winston use the pod to get back to Earth?
limpid agate
The only similarity is they can pilot mechs
runic scroll
i think he's saying that's about how much we know about dva
limpid agate
And they are champs of something
limpid agate
Fair
cunning ledge
@dire timber that's what's currently assumed (for obvious reasons), I'm just spitballing because there's no absolutely direct proof and I think it would be neat
dire timber
"Her voice, her face, and that she became (...) a mech champion."
dire timber
we don't really know his stake in Talon
runic scroll
dva is criminally under-lored for a character with such dominance in pickrate lol
valid shell
We know that he lends money.
limpid agate
Athena, Max or Sanjay are the three most well known NPCs.
valid shell
Talon doesn't run on dreams and promises.
dire timber
same with Zen and Lucio
valid shell
They need their shekels from somewhere.
worthy rose
How are robo-monks even a thing
dire timber
uh
runic scroll
cuz science
limpid agate
Things like Hammond, Queen, Hamid, Emre, Lynx, Sven...
valid shell
Same reason why any religion is a thing.
peak escarp
Athena?
runic scroll
and robot souls
peak escarp
we hardly know anything about her
limpid agate
@peak escarp We know quite a bit
dire timber
@worthy rose you should probably catch up on lore
peak escarp
she's just an AI that keeps Winston company
peak escarp
we know more about Lynx than we do about Athena
limpid agate
Eh
runic scroll
i want more omnics until a viable all-omnic comp can be formed
limpid agate
We know Lynx is a shitty hacker omnic thats from Numbani and friends with Zarya
worthy rose
@runic scroll looks at 3v3 mode
runic scroll
6v6
cunning ledge
Rude
limpid agate
He is though
worthy rose
So Sombra but omnic
limpid agate
No, Sombra is a good hacker
peak escarp
who also identifies as nonbinary
runic scroll
is sombra supposed to be like the undisputed bestest haxxor in the world?
limpid agate
Lynx sucks
runic scroll
or just really good
cunning ledge
I mean I guess I'd think an actual robot would be better at hacking
worthy rose
@peak escarp I can’t tell if that’s a pun or not
peak escarp
that's still more than we know about Athena
dire timber
@peak escarp I think "gender neutral" was the exact description
valid shell
All we saw Lynx do is be wrong about things and disable Sombra's barrier and then get hacked by her.
runic scroll
i'm really enjoying the new sombra-orisa interaction voicelines btw
cunning ledge
@worthy rose I'm pretty sure that's the joke blizzard was going for
worthy rose
That’s pretty funny lol
limpid agate
They have to say "gender neutral" because they cant say nonbinary. Because hes a robot
valid shell
Zenyatta is he, Orisa is she, Bastion is it, and Lynx is they. We have a whole sweep.
worthy rose
I mean aren’t all Omnics gender neutral voice aside
valid shell
They're sexless, but they have a gender.
Like how words in Latin-based languages have genders.
worthy rose
I’m leaving this conversation before I cause controversy nice talking to you runs away
valid shell
Good talk.
dire timber
this conversation is bound to go wrong
valid shell
Not really, if people act like adults.
worthy rose
That’s exactly what I’m worried about
dire timber
already got a silly "hehe non-binary, but computers run on binary xd" joke
valid shell
Just think before you type and we'll have no problems.
cunning ledge
Bastion is just interesting because Bastion isn't gender neutral, Bastion doesn't have any concept of gender
Like its a non factor in its personality
dire timber
I mean
peak escarp
Bastion would be agender
cunning ledge
Whatever you typed isn't displaying on my phone
limpid agate
Bastion is the only character who is an it
Not a he or she or they or some other new pronoun
But it
dire timber
you sure neither of these were used to refer to them?
cunning ledge
I'm pretty sure even Anubis is called he but I'm not completely sure
dire timber
... you know what i mean
limpid agate
Bastion is referred to as it in game in the tips
peak escarp
which makes it very awkward to talk about Bastion and use the proper pronoun
limpid agate
As well as in its kit description iirc
dire timber
I tend to alternate between "it", "he" and "they"
limpid agate
And its bio
peak escarp
the devs usually say "he", but what do they know
limpid agate
I try to use it, but like I said, it's awkward in English to refer to a sapient being as "it"
dire timber
yeah, both "they" and "it" can cause complications
valid shell
With Bastion it's fine, because no - or very few - real people want to be called 'it', and Bastion itself wouldn't care.
dire timber
cause "they" can be used refer to any other "them"
and "it" can be used to literally any other "it"
worthy rose
See but like
dire timber
it's complicated
worthy rose
That’s sort of a consistency issue
dire timber
anyhow, I just wish people wouldn't be so immature-slash-awkward about this subject?
cause it's not really all that "special" or whatever
valid shell
Hey, nobody's more awkward than the guy who laughs nervously and says "Awkwaaaaaaard" at a party.
limpid agate
Its been coming up a lot more since Doomfist. Back then there were lots of "Why are there no black people in Overwatch" questions.
So the whole LGBT discussion has been on the backburner
dire timber
why are there no black women tbh
limpid agate
It came up with Tracer, but fettered off with Orisa
limpid agate
There's Gabrielle Adawe, but yeah no hero
worthy rose
Bastion is “it”
While Zen is “he” and Orisa is “she”
Which makes the status of Omnics difficult to say the least
They embrace human gender but only sometimes?
dire timber
@worthy rose how's that difficult
valid shell
@worthy rose Bastion is arguably sapience.
And caring about gender is a very sapient thing.
dire timber
it's like, they either run with a gender identity or just stick to being gender neutral like Lynx
limpid agate
Bastion likely doesnt understand the concept
dire timber
ehh
valid shell
Zenyatta's "enlightened" and likely chose his own gender, and Orisa was literally coded to be female.
dire timber
ehhhh
valid shell
Extrapolate pls.
cunning ledge
I hope the OR-15s had a concept of personality because suddenly gaining sapience after experiencing death would be a pretty big shock
dire timber
"doesn't understand the concept" or bringing being "enlightened" into this is exactly the kind of thing awkward talk I meant
valid shell
Again, it's not awkward unless you say it's awkward.
dire timber
maybe "awkward" isn't the right word
valid shell
Are you the type to call your dog gender neutral pronouns until they choose it themselves?
limpid agate
Its a being that was built for war, and not for human communication
It cannot even speak
dire timber
@limpid agate Idk, why would Bastion understand human language? and yet, it does
limpid agate
It was just designed to slaughter, regardless of gender
valid shell
To obey commands.
worthy rose
I mean sometimes it legitimately appears that Bastion is less intelligent than Zen or Orisa
valid shell
Bastion Units were designed to serve humans as guards.
limpid agate
"Retreat" "Shoot the big one" "Flank Left"
valid shell
They would need to be able to obey commands.
limpid agate
Either to obey commands, or to intercept enemy commands
cunning ledge
They have their own beep boop language too
valid shell
Same as Siri.
cunning ledge
For internal communications
dire timber
it's just... completely irrelevant to the story whether or not Bastion "understands" what sex/gender are, since it'll never ever be relevant unless you're writing a sappy Tumblr fanfic
limpid agate
It really is
peak escarp
agreed
limpid agate
This discussion is pretty pointless.
cunning ledge
^
peak escarp
here's something to discuss: there's a theory going around that Hammond is the rabbit Moira was experimenting on in her origin trailer
limpid agate
Nah
dire timber
whoa
peak escarp
I never said it was a good theory
cunning ledge
Hmmm
Didn't hammeh make that joke in his video
Because of the carrots in the room
peak escarp
ignoring the whole Simian Research Division thing, and the fact that Hammond is able to write and therefore has opposable thumbs
cunning ledge
There's already a rabbit (themed) hero too
cunning ledge
I want to say a map email
dire timber
oh
cunning ledge
Well there you go
dire timber
it probably is a chimp, then
cunning ledge
Did anything ever come out of that datamined "Chimpston" line a while back
I don't know if it was ever confirmed to be anything
limpid agate
Nothing
cunning ledge
No proof it was ever on live servers?/ actually triggerable in game?
Darn
Oh well
worthy rose
What I’m beginning to see in OW is that Bliz is creating “sidekick” heroes, which I’m not sure I like
Hopefully Hammond is more than just Diddy Kong
runic scroll
i don't mind sidekick heroes as long as they're still interesting
i feel like brig is just so bland
hopefully she'll get more character development
but dva development when
limpid agate
Junk is fine
regal coyote
not a chimp
a chimp can be quite dangerous, so not knowing where a chimp is would be something bad bad
a smller monkey, maybe
limpid agate
Yes but it looks like they through that email out the window
Even smaller monkeys are dangerous
regal coyote
also the lack of climbing levels in the cage
so less likely monkey/ape type
depending on how small though
but from the cage it cant bt too small
so no finger lemur
the whole email about thinking "hammond is not a good idea to start with" makes me think it might be an offbeat creature
also why the fuck is there no water in the cage?
peak escarp
they probably didn't eat in their cages/rooms
regal coyote
...bananas. carrots.
limpid agate
They probably didnt think things through
peak escarp
I mean like, full meals
the bananas and carrots were probably snacks
like Winston's peanut butter
Winston's room doesn't have water in it either
limpid agate
Yeah but Winston wasnt kept in a cage
regal coyote
unless the cage is like a room, where the creature regularl comes out anyways, at least for a reasonable amount of time
like how you let your pet birdd out of the cage
not it not a bird for sure
worthy rose
I speculate that Hammond might be our Talon offtank
limpid agate
Eh, I dont see him being Talon
worthy rose
It just depends on his character design
He could be a mindless good guy sidekick like Brigitte
He could be in his own category entirely like Hanzo, Lucio, DVa, or Symmetra
Or he could be a villain (this would explain him being caged)
whole terrace
Same reason I was doubtful when people thought junkertown queen would be best hero and everyone thought she'd have a mech like dva
limpid agate
I dont see that at all
@whole terrace She is a mech champion
She doesnt need to spawn in the mech
It could be her ultimate
whole terrace
True
whole terrace
I was just saying some people thought she'd be like in a mech most of the time similar to dva
peak escarp
That would be an interesting take on the mech fighter type
worthy rose
A mech that has mini guns that shoot faster and faster the longer they are held pls
limpid agate
Most people think she would be a mech hero because she is a Mech Champion
She is only the queen because of her skill with her mech
whole terrace
I can see what your saying about a mech as like an ult for a short time
So yeah
I'm just wondering
How would they add another gorilla to the roster
whole terrace
true
whole terrace
It's just, monkey seems to similar to Winston
kappa
peak escarp
Why though?
worthy rose
Well is there any evidence that HLC hosted animals other than primates?
peak escarp
I can't really see them adding a non-humanoid hero
worthy rose
Ye
whole terrace
Just, it feels too obvious and un unique to have two monkeys (or similar animals)
I guess there's the whole thing about calling Hammond a "smaller subject"
Not outright a monkey
worthy rose
I want an evil offtank Hammond
whole terrace
Maybe they started with animals like him
worthy rose
Skinny edgelord monkey
peak escarp
There's no indication of any animals on HLC that aren't apes
worthy rose
Err not edgelord
Angsty ape
He might just be younger than Winston @whole terrace
Thus smaller
whole terrace
Yeah
I just really don't feel like they'd add another monkey type animal
Yet they've pretty much told us he'll be next hero
limpid agate
Not quite
worthy rose
Who knows eh
whole terrace
I thought brig was way too obvious
limpid agate
Hes been my number 1 for 28 since Brigitte
limpid agate
Nah, every hero has been predictable.
If its not Hammond
Its either Max, Sanjay, Emre, or Hamid
whole terrace
Yeah
limpid agate
At varying levels of possibility
worthy rose
It’s the Petra dude if not Hammond
limpid agate
Max has good odds
Hamid seems way too soon
But is not bad
Sanjay and Emre arent very likely at all
But their chances are not zero
limpid agate
Look at Hammond
If Hammond is 28
Thats 1 year after he was namedropped
Could fit Hamid in 31 using the same
He'll be a hero eventually. Just maybe not now
Just like the Queen and Max and Sanjay
Theyll have their time
peak escarp
It could be someone we don't know
Someone we haven't seen yet and have no clues about
peak escarp
In the lead up to release, sure
limpid agate
The Anchora leak sullied speculation, but she had clues, some of which were caught on prior to her leak
peak escarp
But long term clues? Who was guessing Orisa in her current incarnation?
peak escarp
They'll probably take an idea of a character and adapt it, like how they adapted Anchora into Orisa and their paladin idea into Brigitte
limpid agate
I was saying "Numbani but maybe not Doomfist" for a month until Anchora, where I was saying "Look, Anchora is in Sombra Origins, fake leak"
peak escarp
I dunno, I'd just like to see something unexpected
I'll be a little disappointed if it's anyone we've been talking about
limpid agate
If you want unexpected, you should spend less time in this Discord
Things like Hamid, Max and Sanjay would be unexpected to most.
peak escarp
I'm not saying I won't be happy that a lore character becomes a hero
peak escarp
It's just nice to get all new lore, rather than just constantly building on the lore we have
Oasis was the last "all new" thing I can think of
reef river
oh, Max is that Talon omnic dude
peak escarp
Yes
I don't really see him being a hero because he seems like a non-combatant character
But we have heroes like Mei and Mercy, so maybe
peak escarp
Built-in body armor?
reef river
could be another Talon support
he's sort of a gambler right? I could see some cool mechanic where he gets "lucky" and forces enemies' guns to lock up and reload
¯_(ツ)_/¯
valid shell
@peak escarp Made of metal.
whole terrace
Rip
gaunt seal
I'm back baby
valid shell
@gaunt seal ?
valid shell
Scroll up.
cedar galleon
peak escarp
today's topics: who we want for hero 28, and Hammond is probably not a rabbit
peak escarp
Sanjay Korpal is Symmetra's boss/handler at Vishkar and a member of the Talon council
Hamid Faisal is an Oasis? (unconfirmed) archaeologist working on the excavations at Petra
prisma wren
oh thx
prisma wren
why would hammond be a rabbit?
peak escarp
Jewvia just really wants jetpack cat to happen
peak escarp
😛
prisma wren
but wasnt he the one who pushed done the door in the updated horizon lunar colony?
peak escarp
the door was pushed in from the outside
and footprints lead from Winston's room to the door
so Winston may have broken down the door, only to find Hammond already gone through the air vent
prisma wren
whut air vent?
peak escarp
inside the cage in Hammond's room, there's a panel in the wall ripped open that leads to the air vent
peak escarp
idk
I'm just theorizing
maybe it wasn't Winston then
maybe it was one of the other gorillas, who get Winston for their uprising, saw he was gone, then went to get Hammond
prisma wren
but if hammond is still alive whut happened to the rest of the gorrilas?
peak escarp
the other apes in the colony revolted against the scientists, tricking them into the airlock and killing them
prisma wren
i know that much
peak escarp
Winston liked the scientists and wasn't popular with the other apes, so he left and went to earth
we don't know much about Hammond or why he left
peak escarp
they're probably still on the moon
they have food, assuming they know how to grow things
the colony still has power
whole terrace
maybe hammond felt forced by the other apes
he was building the thing to attach to winstons pod cause he wanted to leave with winston]
white cobalt
I hope they dont go for the trope of jealous monkey of another monkey because Harold.
and start to beign evil
worthy rose
Yeah, me too.
frozen hollow
Yeah, me too.
barren fiber
so we had this rein
who said
"i kept them in spawn for half the time, why wasn't anyone pushing the payload"
what he didn't realize was everyone on the team was with him
so my question is was this person bullshitting or did he really not notice he was surrounded by at least 3 of his comrades
cunning ledge
NP
dire timber
people are pretty badly informed though
ebon wadi
it makes sense, it's just confusing as hell
cunning ledge
That sounds like a redundant statement but I think it actually means a lot
ebon wadi
pretty much
quasi schooner
I’m badly informed, so I read this channel. Where do I find the massive spiky ball and the footprints?
Also if the lore don’t make above 50% sense, you’re not trying hard enough (or the reason you’re making it is brand new lore)
woeful pike
who broke hammond out, did winston
worthy rose
What with this new found lore, it has to lead to Hammond coming in to the game sometime or another right?
It may not be the next hero- but he's sure to be added sometime right?
quasi schooner
Athena 2.0?
ebon wadi
Nothing's ever sure with Blizz
worthy rose
Hmm, that’s true.
worthy rose
Think about it, Winston is specimen 28, he’s a scientist monkey lol.
Next hero is the 28th, you don’t think Winston might have been specimen 8 but hacked into the system and swapped him and hammonds specimen # around?
It’s a long shot, and kinda stupid but it’s all I got lmao.
ebon wadi
there's already plenty of clues indicating 28 might be Hammond without going full speculation mode
it ultimately comes down to whether Blizz wants to pull an Orisa on us or not
ebon wadi
no shitposting please
quasi schooner
I’m sorry for the shitpost, I couldn’t help it
i was only going to do spec specs, but it’s inston, so
i do try to be more serious
regal coyote
so whstver it is this banananana eating thing is most likely 28 then
wo we have the following: 1) Hammond 2) Sanjay 3) whoever is digging old stuff
valid shell
Are you drunk
worthy rose
I believe he is.
timid eagle
A Talon Tank/Off-Tank should be up next.
We’ve been getting a decent sling of Support Heroes for some time, so a Tank Hero seems likely to pop up this month.
The character doesn’t concern me, as I’ll be happy with whatever comes up next.
cunning ledge
there's a very, very good chance we get a talon tank before next lore event
valid shell
If the character doesn't concern you and you just wanna talk meta roles, then this conversation belongs in #overwatch
worthy rose
How many Talon dps are there, 3?
cunning ledge
Reaper, Sombra, Doomfist
cunning ledge
Widowmaker is also in the new damage category
cunning ledge
And Moira is a support
cunning ledge
I still firmly believe Sanjay has a chance as Talon Tank
worthy rose
Ah.
cunning ledge
He's on the council too
worthy rose
It’s in his new voice line with mercy.
valid shell
And he says that he owns Vishkar?
worthy rose
Yeah.
valid shell
That's abjectly incorrect.
worthy rose
He says ‘it’s mine now’
valid shell
Please don't spread misinformation.
valid shell
He means the sonic technology his father invented.
His sound gun and such.
Not Vishkar.
worthy rose
Sorry.
I’m stupid lol
valid shell
All good.
frosty shell
My best guess as to why nobody noticed Hammond was missing is that nobody thought he could escape from his cage, but then Zhang checked in and through viewing the security camera footage realized Hammond had been missing for a whole week. The "guess it's not a big deal" part was probably somewhat sarcastic.
worthy rose
I would go as far to say that Hammond developed intelligence only slightly below that of Winston, as his ability to design, model, and construct seems to be surprisingly proficient
If we can assume that the office chair and picture are confirmation that Dr. Harold Winston escaped with Winston, it will be interesting to see if the focal relationship in Hammond’s character development is not Winston but rather Dr. Winston
whole terrace
maybe its actually Dr. Winston as next hero 
idk how that would be explained
maybe hammond was actually building the capsule to help the doc escape? idk but still would be cool
and it bypasses the whole "another monkey?" problem
valid shell
@whole terrace No thank you.
Harold surviving would be a disservice to Winston's entire character.
Same as Gerard suddenly being alive.
@worthy rose And there's FAR from confirmation of Harold escaping with Winston.
Look at the pod in the attacker's spawn of Gibraltar. That can barely fit a gorilla.
whole terrace
yeah'
you right, especially about the disservice
its just so hard to see hammond being a bunny, cat, etc
but then again, i feel like itd be a disservice to winston's uniqueness to add another monkey
idk, i dont follow the lore enough most likely
valid shell
I don't want Hammond.
whole terrace
if hes going to be another monkey, i dont either
valid shell
But I'm not going to pretend that Blizzard isn't going that route.
valid shell
We don't, though.
whole terrace
we need a main tank imo
valid shell
Another tank would be nice, but there's hardly a power vacuum like there was pre-Orisa.
whole terrace
only 2 (3 i guess, but only for dive) main tanks though
whole terrace
still, i dont want another monkey
i was just trying to use that to help think about what hammond might be (as its likely he's the next hero)
valid shell
Me neither. But pretending that this is somehow a red herring bait-and-switch for Harold Winston is just naïve.
reef river
what do you guys think the likelihood is of getting a Lucio animated short now that we got that new Vishkar lore?
valid shell
@reef river More than zero.
reef river
my dream short is Lucio and DVa at some ritzy party, and then when things start going south they leap into action and kick some ass
graceful fern
Lore wise, why do you think hanzo has 2 dragons and genji has one?
valid shell
@graceful fern There's a couple different explanations. One is that it's because the Shimada crest is two dragons, and Hanzo still considers himself a Shimada, so he has to represent both dragons on his own without Genji. Another is that Genji is spiritually "whole", while Hanzo is still conflicted and split in two.
Another is that Blizzard just didn't think about it.
reef river
interesting, i like the second explanation a lot
worthy rose
So guys, do you think hammond will be good or evil?
dire timber
that's such an odd question
worthy rose
I wouldnt mind seeing him as "evil winston" just as moira is "evil mercy"
dire timber
I don't think Hammond would be the type, honestly
some sort of rebellion leader could fill that role
but I don't think Hammond was a leader
I think being a sneaky guy out to save his own skin would be much more fitting to him
reef river
i could see him being resentful of winston maybe being Dr. Winston's favorite though
worthy rose
Although it begs the question on why hammond also decided to leave the moon
If he did hate winston
reef river
well we know that he somehow knew that winston was planning to escape
reef river
he had time to prepare a way to attach his pod to winston's escape shuttle
with blueprints and a model
primative, yes, but premediated
worthy rose
A huge grappling hook?
Actually that makes me wonder if winstom knew if hammond was tailing him, and if not how did he not notice. And where hammond is right now etc etc
reef river
but also then why wouldn't he just be in the shuttle with winston?
which makes me think that perhaps they communicated but for some reason winston didn't want to bring hammond with him, so there may be some sort of tension there
after seeing his grappling hook tailing thing, my theory is that he detached before the shuttle landed and got separated
possibly brought under the protection/guidance of Talon or another group
dire timber
could be that he was taken in by Talon as a burglar
you know, sneak in, get something done, get out
not that he's evil exactly, or that he cares much about some schemes of the higher-ups
it's just that a job is a job
whole terrace
A monkeys gotta do what he's gotta do to get by
reef river
yeah, i could see him as a sort of McCree type who isn't necessarily good or bad
cunning ledge
Would be hard to fit him into the main story then
The whole y'know
Battle between good and bad
reef river
It's hiiiigh babooon
I would actually love if he was originally with Talon and then Winston recovered him and now he's sort of like the grumpy, angsty nephew to winston
graceful fern
I think Hammond will kinda have a rebellious teenager type of tone
That'd be interesting
Not annoying tho
worthy rose
monkey dva?
worthy rose
Angsty monkey DVa
timid zodiac
I think
worthy rose
Do you think that all the specimens can talk?
regal coyote
it does not have to naturally talk
it can for eample use a voice synthasizer like our fav wheelchaired scientist
also, the fact that some scientist have doubts of Hammond being a test subject make me think he is not a common ape, not even a chmp. mybe not even a monkey
reef river
darth vader monkey?
valid shell
@reef river ?
reef river
re: the comment about voice synthesizer
cunning ledge
Darth Vader does actually talk though
It's just through a robotic mask/breathing system
What Hamster is saying is basically that one episode of rick and morty where the dog gets the device that translates its thoughts into words
valid shell
A less cringy pop-culture comparison would be Stephen Hawking.
reef river
ahh, yeah that could be rad
also would fit well into the world where people like Genji exist inbetween omnic and organic
cunning ledge
I only used rick and morty because it's particularly apt
An intelligent animal that doesn't have the physical capacity for speech
So if you could look past your prejudice that a vague mention of rick and morty is "cringy" you might actually see the meaning in what I'm saying
lean silo
I was gonna say, I think that comparison fits better
valid shell
🤷
terse oak
Not the place to discuss it
dire timber
I was bored, so I made the list all the things relevant in real world that Blizzard won't ever touch in their worldbuilding:
- Modern political discourse
- Modern geopolitics
- North Korea
- Israel/Palestine
- Taiwan
- the region of Catalonia
frosty shell
I think Catalonia is more like "it doesn't really matter"
Well, maybe they had a king who "King's row" is named after
Good chance that king is somebody that's already been born IRL
They probably have less incentive to ignore Israel than they do Taiwan because there's no Hebrew or Arabic dub of Overwatch
Another reason they're ignoring North Korea is that we have no idea what's going to happen to it
China's government will also be a can of worms
Showing it as either more democratic than it is now or more hardline than it is now would both trigger backlash
So they'll probably leave it as exactly the same if it ever gets mentioned
A dictator of a real country would be hard, though, especially if that country's mostly democratic right now.
However, they have made UK into a hotbed of human-omnic tensions, so it's not like they're opposed to doing something that paints a country in a semi-negative light
worthy rose
there aren't any talon tanks
i feel like a 400hp talon agent would be a good addition, with an ability that makes them stronger per kill
frosty shell
I'm also wondering if a corrupt politician will ever be involved specifically in the game
frosty shell
Naming a specific country where they are from might seem weird
worthy rose
Yeah.
frosty shell
I doubt we'll ever hear that a country's system of gov't has changed
Even though that'll probably happen sometime between 2018-2076(?)
It would be easier to do in a country that never officially changed systems of government, but is not very democratic at the moment i.e. Russia
Russians would probably be pleased to see that their country was democratic in the future, even if that would represent some sort of change
Or some African countries
valid shell
@worthy rose Gameplay discussion like the meta and hero roles and hp belong in #overwatch
sly yarrow
Does anyone have any idea how much of Genji is... well... Genji?
What sort of injuries does he actually have?
analog canopy
I believe he lost one of his arms
along with both his legs
the theory a while back was that he was cut in half, from the shoulder to the waist
but Chu has said that he still has working genitals
it could be that it's prosthetic but
we don't know
sly yarrow
Where'd Chu talk about that? (for a friend)
peak escarp
it was a foreign language interview in India?
the interviewer asked about Genji's "lower body"
Chu confirmed "his lower body is intact"
correction: Thailand, not India
(article is in Thai, you'll need google translate or something to read it)
Via Google translate:
"6. Everyone knows that some parts of the Genji body are cyborg. We want to know if the lower part of the Genji is cyborgs. If so, is he in the bathroom ?
Michael Chu: If you look at the Genji Blackwatch, you will see that Genji has a partial body missing. But I assure you that the bottom of the Genji is normal. "
interpret that how you will
eternal void
Yo i wasnt sure if this goes here or not but i thought if something
What if the real reason genji calls for healing so much is to use his minor(ish) injuries as an excuse to get mercy over to him
forms new headcannon
valid shell
@eternal void The frequency of asking for healing depends entirely on the player and has nothing to do with the hero in question.
So there's no correlation between the dank "I need healing" meme and Genji's character.
valid shell
You're welcome.
peak escarp
that's what we're here for
dire timber
@frosty shell seems that there's a fair share of gangsters in Italy
"I'm also wondering if a corrupt politician will ever be involved specifically in the game"
there's talk of Antonio having government officials and law enforcement agents in his pocket
@eternal void we don't really like "funni gameplay meme xd" stuff here
it has nothing to do with who these characters are, nothing to do with lore, nothing to do with the story
it exists in a void
worthy rose
So.
How did emily and tracer get to gibraltr in time for the christmas party?
When it was already night time in england?
iron plume
#general-discussion for all your shitposting needs
not here
formal lantern
U know that they revialed pharas dads nationality and name
fringe pewter
They did that before
formal lantern
Hes called henry and hes insigeounas american
fringe pewter
It's Sam.
formal lantern
Also what do u think of the changes to horizon lunar colony
fringe pewter
I welcome it
valid shell
@formal lantern Wher tf did you get Henry from.
worthy rose
Maybe he got the H confused with Hammond lol.
worthy rose
The lunar colony level reminds me of the starbase level in turtles in time.
valid shell
K?
worthy rose
I think it has more touch to it.
sonic tide
Why do some heros fight when they are not fighters (ex.Mei)
regal coyote
gameplay is not lore
limpid agate
Mei, Lucio, and Zenyatta are the only ones I think can be considered civillians @sonic tide
And of those
Mei is a member of Overwatch in the present day (A small team, 4-8 known members)
Lucio led a rebellion against Vishkar in Brazil
Leaving just Zenyatta in a weird state of limbo. Mostly because we dont have any lore
dire timber
Moira is a civilian, kinda
in a way
she did work with Blackwatch, but now she's just a Minister of Genetics
... does that count as a civilian?
limpid agate
No
Shes not
She is a combat trained field medic and blackwatch operative
Zen is some monk
Mei was some scientist
Lucio is some dj
cunning ledge
She obviously has combat gear at the Talon table in her origin video too
That is because they used all the classic skin designs
But still
regal coyote
Monk is combat savy as according to stereotype
worthy rose
yeah monks are looking peaceful but when they are threatened, they can fight
regal coyote
traditionally they are taught sicne they travel alone, and to help protect others
not to mention some are retired combatants
frosty shell
I wouldn't be surprised if Mei fought people who were damaging the environment i.e. poachers
Maybe Mei and Winston can team up to defend some gorillas? That'd be cool.
@dire timber I was talking about specific politicians, not just "corruption exists." I was thinking about actually seeing an evil (or morally questionable) politician
We don't know what the governments of any of the countries are like politically, although that's probably on purpose
I assume that business vs. government is still a big deal given all the megacorps
regal coyote
haha, all the fucking politicians are at least morally questionable
thing is, how far they will go
there are obviously corruped ones in some parts of the overwatch universe though
primal tiger
I mean, the Italian politician that Reyes killed was a major Talon figure
limpid agate
That sounds expensive
fresh briar
It's blizzard we are talking about here
limpid agate
Exactly
fresh briar
What exactly is expensive to them
limpid agate
Blizzard is a business, not a charity
worthy rose
if something works perfectly don't try to fix it
peak escarp
If charging for lore content is what it takes to get more of it, then maybe they should start charging
I'd buy it
fresh briar
They already charge for lootboxs and skins lol so why not
limpid agate
@fresh briar How much money did Blizzard make when they released Rise and Shine?
fresh briar
I haven't done research on it so I wouldn't know
limpid agate
Okay
How much money did you spend
To watch Rise and Shine?
And what about the other 10,086,467 viewers?
It has no ad revenue either
fresh briar
Wait isn't that one of the animations
fresh briar
But u have to think about the massive amount of players that are buying and paying for things in overwatch
limpid agate
Okay
So what did Rise and Shine add to the game that made people spend money
1 skin half a year later?
And its not even tied to an event
fresh briar
And the other games blizzard have lol I'm sure they can make everyone an animation
limpid agate
They can
dire timber
my wishlist:
limpid agate
But they wont
dire timber
- Pharah animated short, in which she reunites with Ana at the Temple of Anubis
- Symmetra animated short, with Sanjay and Lucio both appearing
- Zenyatta animated short, showing his break-away from the Shambali and meeting Genji
- anything for D.va
- anything for Mercy
limpid agate
There is no reason for them to make shorts faster than they already are
dire timber
mhmn
limpid agate
They make 2 a year, and that will probably slow down sooner or later
limpid agate
They make more heroes than they do shorts in a year
So giving every hero a short is probably impossible
They sometimes make mini special things, like the Doomfist Anime or The Plan, but those are rare and inconsistent.
fresh briar
Yeah their animations don't have as revenue but what about their actual ads
limpid agate
What do you mean their actual ads?
limpid agate
People are not paying Blizzard to advertise Overwatch
Its the other way around
Blizzard is paying other people to advertise Overwatch
You can only go so far for Marketing
Gamescom and Blizzcon are major events for Blizzar
So they release shorts there to attract people
But thats it
cunning ledge
Also important to note First Strike would have in fact cost money
limpid agate
THeres no reason for them to make a short in March
Or in June
The gain is largely nonexistent
regal coyote
@limpid agate think about it though, they can indeed make more lower quality videos like character intro ones, but on lore
that way it is much cheaper, and faster, and fill in the gaps
and we know those types of videos would take much less $$$ to cureate, sicne it is basically slightly animated stills
hell even amateurs can make those in a few days
valid shell
@worthy rose Delete pls.
lucid sierra
Is Roadhog Junkrats dad?
limpid agate
No
valid shell
No
modest cove
i mean... do we know he's definitely not?
limpid agate
@modest cove We know hes not
There is 0 indication of anything for either way
They first met in Wasted Land
regal coyote
100% sure not his dad
not sure if they have met before the incident, but yeah the incident is msotly the first time they team up
gilded gulch
not 100% sure though
opal swan
what's reaper look like under his mask?
cunning ledge
we don't know
although Ana did recognise Gabe somehow
so while he's an undead shadow abomination that has to put effort into having a physical body his face does look like how it used to
whole terrace
Maybe she knows what happened to him, and therefore recognises him
regal coyote
would not
cunning ledge
she doesn't know
regal coyote
if there is a blank hole or skelleton or a kitty then she would nto have said the same thing
cunning ledge
read Old Soldiers again
regal coyote
my guess is that under the mask reaper ahve a bit of simialrity to his old face still
cunning ledge
my theory is that it kind of looks like what his face would be at that age but it's only half formed from smoke stuff
you can see his arms so it's clear that he can form the skin
but his face is usually covered
and ana took off his mask before he had a chance to form his face completely
worthy rose
reaps' skin is probably white as marble
regal coyote
nope
worthy rose
at least his arms
worthy rose
I just imagine a pale malnourished gabriel reyes under the mask
cunning ledge
to exist in a physical body like a regular person he would need to form arms, bones, muscles, etc
which is why his arms look like that
regal coyote
depends
if forming color is a process then since he is black smoke forming black arms would be mroe simple
worthy rose
Maybe his body cant produce melanin anymore?
cunning ledge
actual human flesh without any blood in it is basically white though
and yeah melanin/blood wouldn't be present
worthy rose
Although i dont think its something that really going to be explained
Along with how he is actually able to turn into smoke
cunning ledge
that's not a great question
just assume that "he comprises of unstable molecules so he can turn into smoke and back" makes sense
and ask questions around that
worthy rose
How is he able to control that?
cunning ledge
"he comprises of unstable molecules so he can turn into smoke and back"
the concept as a whole doesn't make any damn sense
just know that he can
something that could be debated is how he manages to generate infinite guns from his own body
and/or if that's even canon
worthy rose
He does it in one of the shorts
cunning ledge
and boy have I debated that enough already
worthy rose
He pulls a gun from his back which obviously wasnt there
cunning ledge
he does it in Infiltration which is the best evidence
but only in the cinematic trailer does he do it exactly like in game
worthy rose
And he can make the mask dissapear in the old soldiers comic
worthy rose
How he is able to control clothes is beyond me
Unless they arent clothes and the mask is made from his actual skin
cunning ledge
here's my paragraph from last time
worthy rose
Ooooooo