Non-canon info: "Oh, I've seen this before... you're unstuck in time! I can fix that, you know!" Tracer Response: "Please don't... Winston would never let me hear the end of it!"
#lore-discussion
worthy rose
dire timber
... and yeah HotS is not canon
low axle
Umm My link is not HoTS based 😛
cunning ledge
@limpid agate heroes of the storm personal background lore info though?
Also I don't even know it's that
No one has checked
low axle
Now you can hand wave it and say its dreams in your own head cannon. But in mine those "dreams" where her actually time traveling while she was vanishing.
peak escarp
it is a poke line
limpid agate
@low axle Your link is HotS based
peak escarp
the one about being a maid
limpid agate
Sometimes she had strange dreams about the past, including being a kitchen maid at a large house in the country.[5]
worthy rose
@peak escarp chromie's tracer interaction
dire timber
HotS is not canon for Overwatch
dire timber
...
cunning ledge
It's not lore yo
dire timber
you're a fucking moron, sorry
low axle
Wow way to be a bitch
worthy rose
even hots is now getting its own lore tho
cunning ledge
Not here please
dire timber
Blizzard already said that HotS is just "their version" of the characters they're taking
HotS stuff is not canon for the source media
dire timber
no, but you are the one being an obtuse idiot
worthy rose
let's not extrapolate this further
limpid agate
I said lets not
peak escarp
HotS is Blizzard's official AU
limpid agate
@low axle @dire timber THat means stop
peak escarp
like how the Junkenstein stuff is an Overwatch AU
cunning ledge
Speaking of junkenstein
Who do you guys think could he possible characters for the next time it comes round?
Usually they echo the real world in some way
Would be neat to get hints like that
Although having the mercy made reaper theory as actual canon in the story isn't very helpful
limpid agate
Ronin Genji as a skin, at least feels like it has decent odds
cunning ledge
Lucio as some form of bard with a connection to the summoner could be cool
Really? I thought the swordsman in the comic looked too similar to young Genji
It's just got a cool hat
peak escarp
I didn't think we saw enough detail from Genji the Swordsman's outfit
peak escarp
it just looked like a hat and a cloak
cunning ledge
Soldier, ahem, Soldier
limpid agate
Soldier 1886
cunning ledge
Hell yeah
cunning ledge
I'd love to have bastion as some arcane enigmatic automaton
But it might just make the mode too easy
Shame
Imagine a bastion skin where he's a stone construct covered in runes
peak escarp
having played plenty of custom Junkenstein games as Bastion, I can confirm
Bastion breaks the mode
cunning ledge
And the the Viking could have made him with Norse god magic stuff
It would fit with the parallels so well
limpid agate
Also the details on Genji are minimal because he wasn't a skin. Its hat, cloak, shorts, bandages, and those wooden samurai platform shoes.
Young Genji is just shorts in common
cunning ledge
I suppose I could see that being a skin then, yeah
limpid agate
Even Young Genji doesn't have the two sash tails
He's got the scarf, but I think its only 1 end?
worthy rose
I really would like an actual alchemist ana skin
limpid agate
dire timber
Alchemist and Soldier need skins tbh
worthy rose
I imagined one with some reference to dishonored
limpid agate
Hanzo can get away with no skin because he already looks traditional enough
But a more traditional skin
dire timber
McCree and Hanzo already got Lone Wolf and Van Helsing though
cunning ledge
Fantasy rogue Sombra would be neat because of the stealth
limpid agate
Thats a painting of Hattori Hanzo
dire timber
I think Lone Wolf is the canon look for the Archer
cunning ledge
But hack wouldn't do anything in the mode so
worthy rose
because the age setting of dishonored and it's relation to alchemy (discovered through books) would really fit to alchemist ana
limpid agate
Also the bosses
cunning ledge
Oh huh never tried that myself
limpid agate
It just disables abilities
Sombra would be a good hero in Junkensteins
EMP on Sym
cunning ledge
@worthy rose also she's literally referred to as the alchemist
cunning ledge
Good point actually
limpid agate
She would probably replace Soldier
cunning ledge
Wow now I really want rogue Sombra
cunning ledge
Just needs a big ole cloak and a knife on the gun handle for melee
peak escarp
The Archer doesn't really have a canon appearance
dire timber
it is implied to be one of the wolf skins though
peak escarp
you only see his silhouette in the Revenge of Junkenstein comic, and it matches Hanzo's default look
limpid agate
And doing some crazy fantasy PvE
cunning ledge
Yeah it's a bit odd why they made those lines
peak escarp
that's probably just in case the player uses a wolf skin
cunning ledge
He's clearly regular Hanzo in the comic
dire timber
no dragon version iirc
limpid agate
Everyone is regular in the comic
worthy rose
and the sidearm would be a similar one to dishonored's crossbow
limpid agate
Even Soldier 76 looks like his normal self
The silhouettes are not really credible. They just didnt want to make new silhouettes
peak escarp
Van Helsing McCree can be seen in the background of the Countess's section, which makes him different than the Gunslinger
cunning ledge
I really want a "someone telling a story" event that's an obvious parallel to a real event
Like that one borderlands 2 dlc
Although the real life story relevant characters are already established in junkenverse
So maybe it'd have to be something new
dire timber
@peak escarp that's definitely Gunslinger though
Gunslinger and Countess are said to have a history together
something about Gunslinger wanting to hunt her down
peak escarp
idk then
cunning ledge
He's hiding in wait for her in the comic
In the background, behind a tree
So now we just need McCree to fight Widowmaker in actual lore and it's perfect
dire timber
but yeah, like Jewvia said, the shadows aren't reliable
cunning ledge
Yeah
cunning ledge
Well maybe Reinhardt forgets the era he's set the story in sometimes
limpid agate
So the alchemist
Is not an alchemist at all
But just
Regular Ana
The shadows are not reliable
Ana, Hanzo, and Soldier don't have cannon appearances for Junkenstein's Revenge
Also Genji, technically, doesn't have a skin for his
cunning ledge
Now I hope it's just a metaphor for Reinhardt not understanding nanobiotics
valid shell
I wonder if every hero will eventually appear canonically in the Aldersbrunnverse.
iron plume
I mean he probably doesnt
solar inlet
worthy rose
could it be a younger ana?
next lodge
the pilot's name is fio
valid shell
@worthy rose Ana wasn't a pilot.
worthy rose
true
dire timber
@cunning ledge The second batch is reliable, the shadows of the first batch are not
and I don't really understand your statements about Reinhardt
worthy rose
General question regarding Ana
Is there any lore regarding the material she uses in her bionade?
I assume it's similar to her sniper bullets
peak escarp
the schematic for her rifle showed that it used the same technology as Mercy's staff and the biotic fields that Soldier would later use
so it makes sense that her bionade would be similar
worthy rose
Didn't even think of Soldier's thing
She said something about not using it on herself right?
peak escarp
actually, the schematic shows the biotic grenade using the biotic field generator
so it is the same
worthy rose
On a side note, Razer and Overwatch sharing a Conan O' Brien gif session is pretty cute
And ok that makes sense
Also, probably a dumb question, I assume this is completely unrelated to the healing aura on Lucio?
peak escarp
correct
we don't know if Lucio's healing aura is canon, but his tech is derived from sonic crowd control tech used by Vishkar
worthy rose
One can only pray for some comic or notion of Lucio's uprising in Brazil
Yeah I remember the Vishkar bit
It sucks that my 2 favorite heroes, Lucio and Zen, get no love in lore
peak escarp
I think they will be important in the future, and will make up the next generation of Overwatch
worthy rose
Also is there anything else to know about Efi besides her involvement in Orisa's development?
I hope so, they have such cool backgrounds and wholesome beginnings
worthy rose
valid shell
@worthy rose ?
worthy rose
@valid shell There was a scrimmage with other coaches from a different server and during the game we were discussing Efi's story and Ana's healing juice, I was just curious.
peak escarp
it would be nice to see Efi have more involvement in the story, but she is a child, so she can't get too involved
worthy rose
Lucio's/Zen's lack of proper lore is just a personal gripe, my 2 favorite heroes just have no background
Even a brief mention would be nice
In game dialogue between Orisa and Bastion/Torbjorn/Doomfist is always nice
valid shell
D.Va's in the same boat.
But at least she and Lucio appear in HotS, even though that's not canonical.
Zenyatta's completely isolated.
honest magnet
zen at least has the genji connection
lucio and dva have pretty much nothing and aren't connected to anyone
valid shell
It's funny, because Mei's disconnected from everyone in lore.
But she's gotten a map filled with easter eggs, and a cinematic, and two Christmas events at this point.
buoyant thunder
What is the timeline for everything in Overwatch
valid shell
@buoyant thunder There's no official one.
buoyant thunder
@peak escarp thanks it’s better than nothing
peak escarp
yes
hasty surge
anyways Angela probably visits the Lindholms on festive seasons
peak escarp
there is a holiday line where Angela asks about Ingrid's pies
Mercy: *sighs* Torbjörn, I miss Ingrid's apple pie at the holidays.
Torbjörn: *chuckles* Well, it just so happens she has some saved for you.
valid shell
Torb doesn't seem the type, but perhaps Ingrid is involved in some kind of foster program.
low axle
Torb also seems to have ana rmy of kids/Grandkids so they are already making tons of food too 😛
probably
peak escarp
she's Torbjorn's daughter and Reinhardt is her godfather. She serves as Reinhardt's squire and has taken up arms to join him in battle.
limpid agate
@rain patio Brigitte: http://bit.ly/2GSto50
valid shell
It's been up since her announcement. :v
limpid agate
All of them are pinned
timid eagle
I keep getting confused about this detail, but is Brigitte Torb's eldest or youngest child?
timid eagle
Well, that doesn't sound the least bit confusing.
low axle
Well at least we know what Torb got up to after the crisis.
Maybe that's why he was grumpy in the uprising comic
brittle willow
I’ll leave this here.
So fun fact:there’s a interaction in the archives event (retribution) between genji and Reyes:
Genji:Talon once tried to recruit my father.
Reyes:He didn’t take them up on their offer?
Genji:He did not find them to his liking. Their arms did not coincide with his own.
Alright so I have a question
Why is talon wanting the shimada brothers?
Because there’s also a interaction between widow and hanzo
Widow:Talon restore your family’s empire
Hanzo:but at what cost?
valid shell
@brittle willow
Doomfist: Hanzo, you should consider joining us. I think we'd see eye to eye.
Hanzo: I would have little to gain from such an arrangement. No, I will find my own path.
They don't want the Shimada brothers.
Just Sojiro, and just Hanzo.
brittle willow
Wait wait wait I’ll go back to data mining
brittle willow
Alright I came back
no interactions between Talon and genji
So only hanzo and his dad
valid shell
Which suggests that Talon doesn't want the Shimadas so much as their clan.
Which is why they never bothered with Genji.
Because he would never inherit it.
white cobalt
valid shell
So far, we know that Sojiro was soft on Genji, was approached by Talon, refused them, and his death was described as "untimely".
So perhaps Talon had a hand in his death, or another Shimada elder, because he wasn't harsh enough on his sons.
brittle willow
alllright I feel like we just dug up some more lore
brittle willow
But the genji with the Reyes interaction kinda confirms Talon had something to do with Sojior’s death
valid shell
I wouldn't say it confirms it, but it's a valid theory.
Perhaps after Sojiro refused them, Talon influenced a Shimada elder into killing Sojiro and forcing the duel between the brothers.
Maybe thinking that a broken, brother-killing Hanzo would be easier to recruit.
But the plan backfired slightly when Hanzo refused the title, which is why both Doomfist and Widowmaker have been hassling him.
iron plume
The thing about "Talon wants the clan" though is
Hanzo isn't a leader of the clan anymore and he hasn't been for a while
Like with talon help he can "rebuild" it with himself as the leader
but would it really be the same clan with its connections/businesses
limpid agate
The clan doesnt exist
But Hanzo is the rightful heir
Widow and Doomfist say they can help restore the clan
iron plume
Yeah and the implication in "restore your family's empire" would be rebuilding it
My point is, what good would the clan bring Talon
if its business/connections/deals would be set up by them in the first place
I think Talon want Hanzo himself now, and restoring the clan is their way of getting him on their side
limpid agate
There is some loose yakuza in Japan
And its implied they know Sombra.
Restoring the clan could put a stronger foothold in Japan, as a country
As well as all the resources that are currently loose
iron plume
Hm, fair point
especially considering that yakuza clans are in the kind of grey legal area
whereas talon are straight up terrorists
could allow them more freedom if they operate together
low axle
But it could fit Doomfists survival of the Fittest View too. Maybe there Clan is the strongest of such criminal groups..even in its weakened state. interjects kinda lateish
dire timber
@iron plume Talon could provide the remnants of the clan with resources, but they need to control a leadership figure in order to truly have the clan in their pocket
that would be Hanzo
... huh, I like the name
Shimada Remnant
iron plume
Yeah it makes sense as an in to the clan
The question is why'd they need the Shimada clan in the first place
especially in its current condition
The suggestion of a "foothold" in japan makes sense for that
iron plume
are there a bunch of ninjas?
and would the efforts put into rebuilding and organizing them be worth it alone when you can just like
hire mercs
and equip them with moira's tech and weaponry
cunning ledge
I thought the interactions were saying that they'd help Hanzo rebuild the whole clan
iron plume
Yeah which is why it doesn't make sense that they'd do it just for the firepower
dire timber
why not?
iron plume
or swordpower
dire timber
it's an investment
cunning ledge
I mean yeah they've already got a lot of weaponry
dire timber
I think Doomfist is interested in Hanzo's talents specifically, though
Widowmaker is just being grandiose
cunning ledge
Maybe they think it'd be more of an instigating factor if there are Japanese cartels performing assassinations too
iron plume
I mean that
To rebuild a whole yakuza clan is much more effort than to train/Moiratech up a bunch of shooty guys with roughly equal firepower
Which is why they either need the legitimization which yakuza sort of brings
cunning ledge
Doomfist certainly seems to respect Hanzo's character arc so far
iron plume
or they want hanzo specifically
cunning ledge
He did the Genji thing, exiled himself, and presumably became stronger by doing so
Doomfist respects that
cunning ledge
I was hesitant to say "talon wants magic dragons"
iron plume
Surely Moira (or Sanjay) would love to get their hands on that
cunning ledge
especially as it's obviously hard light
If it's something in the tattoos, Moira would probably want to know
wild theory
doomfist wants hanzo because he wants to know about genji
he has prosthetic envy
iron plume
what would hanzo know about genji's prosthetics tho
cunning ledge
not that hanzo would actually know anything
cunning ledge
but maybe he thinks hanzo knows genji's connections
(hang on wouldn't sombra know all this anyway)
cunning ledge
I still think that mercy couldn't have done everything to genji herself
she could stabilise him and save his life
worthy rose
You know what they say?......
cunning ledge
but making all this armour and stuff he has?
iron plume
She likely didn't make the prosthetics
but she may have been taking care of like
actually making them work
connecting to the living tissue, etc
cunning ledge
i'm sorry
iron plume
(not really)
anyway, making the "interface" between prosthetics and living tissue/nervous system wouldn't be too far out of her wheelhouse
even aside from that, she was the one to stabilize him, and his attending doctor after
cunning ledge
cyborg tech is obviously very real
but genji's much further than that
i'm pretty sure it's implied he has full feelings of pain etc from his artificial limbs
iron plume
i don't mean realistic, i mean it fits mercy's field
cunning ledge
I guess yeah
xcom enemy within has this thing called meld you collect that allows you to build mech suit cyborgs
in-universe it's this basically magical thing (from outer space) that somehow connects living tissue and artificial nerves
she basically must have used that
iron plume
yep
well she has the healy thing, why not the meldy thing as well
although I'm entertained by the idea that the prosthetics are Torb tech
cunning ledge
I like the idea that when he left blackwatch he was still the horrific half human abomination thing he is in the blackwatch skin
and it was only after meeting zenyatta that he replaced all of his limbs
and got the green/silver armour
iron plume
thing is
where would he get it from if it was after overwatch?
Did he get like a secret stash of vibranium meld nanomachine metal
dire timber
@cunning ledge uh, we don't know anything about Genji replacing his other limbs
could be that they're just armored
also, he already had this armor while still working for Overwatch
dire timber
personally, I imagine that his current silver-green armor was a reward for finishing the task of dismantling the Shimada clan
cunning ledge
I also imagine there's some super secret shimada tattoo person who he got the make the armour for him somehow
just because it's got those various symbols on it
your theory has more of a base anyway I suppose
I could accept that
dire timber
would be cool if we got Zen and Genji meeting as an animated short
we would have more to go off then
iron plume
healers? in my overwatch shorts?
cunning ledge
it's less likely than you'd think
iron plume
free lore check today
cunning ledge
the year is 2050
there hasn't been lore in decades
dinoflask videos are now accepted as canon
twilit imp
Oii
valid shell
@twilit imp Yes?
valid shell
I do not speak your language.
twilit imp
Noo
valid shell
Yes.
twilit imp
@valid shell @valid shell @versed shuttle
versed shuttle
?
valid shell
You seem confused.
This is the Overwatch Lore channel.
Not Meet Hot Single Latinas In Your Area.
short scaffold
@twilit imp Keep it to English on this server please
worthy rose
Binge lol
dire timber
iron plume
40%, no comments
never change reddit
peak escarp
half of them don't believe in lore anyway
dense estuary
that is true of many many gamers across multiple genre
peak escarp
They say an fps doesn't need lore
But it's also a Blizzard game, and their games have some of the biggest lore
If they don't want to play a game with lore they can go back to Fortnite
You shame the words ofthe mighty epicgames?
cunning ledge
serious discussion here please
cunning ledge
there isn't an official one
the one in the pins is generally decent
and updated regularly
peak escarp
Not really, but there's a good fanmade one
restive verge
Thats decent at least we have some ground touse.
peak escarp
It's hard to figure out the timeline because a lot of it is vague and some of it is conflicting
I appreciate the work overgosh did to make that timeline
lavish rune
Overgosh is very good
peak escarp
And they're very responsive if you spot errors or have questions
dire timber
they didn't react that one time when I wanted to point they shouldn't assume that a year passed
😞
peak escarp
Well, celebrating Christmas kinda implies a year rollover
Maybe I'm just special because we've talked a bit
echo snow
So the spawns in Oasis University are labs, with Angela's and Moira's papers, but are they actually labelled? Do they have a name or specific purpose, or are they just Science Labs?
regal coyote
Well, secret project for telon isn't really something you would put on your archway, so no we dont know what theya re researching, but we can guess
echo snow
Oasis University isn't owned by Talon
regal coyote
but the said lab in question is Moira's
echo snow
Do we know if it belongs to Moira? Do we know if she's using it for Talon's purposes or her own?
regal coyote
And with the other paper about S24 included I would say whatever in research concerns the Reaper situation
echo snow
Strangely enough, that paper is in the lab with Angela's paper, not Moira's
This proves Mercy made Reaper lulz
cunning ledge
pls
echo snow
It could mean Moira uses both labs
regal coyote
well, it could mean the reaper tech did have some relation to mercy tech
granted mercy's tech get used without her preference anyways at least once
moi is big in Oasis so she probably have a reasonable bit of control over there
echo snow
Well, Reaper's powers were made by Moira, and it's suggested that Moira's work builds on Mercy's
regal coyote
actually we are not sure if reaper power is made by moira even
echo snow
Her origin video literally shows it, so
regal coyote
maybe already thee at S24 research and moira just modify/enhance it
dire timber
would be cool to have a Mercy comic set in Oasis
with Moira appearing in it
I'm curious how it would go down
echo snow
That doesn't seem likely Ham, but I suppose it's not impossible
regal coyote
would be cool if we ahve ANY lore with mercy not as a background standin
dire timber
uh, pretty sure that Reaper's powers are entirely Moira's work
I swear, why do people cling to the idea that SEP have Gabe anything that Jack doesn't already have?
cunning ledge
potentially there's a soldier enhancement program connection
but as far as we know it's all moira
low axle
I'd be happy with at least a comic even if it just covered that event in the trailer were she finds the lil girl in the rubble.
regal coyote
well gabe brought in moira for a reason, and it may be linked to hsi pre-existing condition
dire timber
or, he wanted to be enhanced further
I mean, Chu's exact phrasing was "he wanted Moira's help on genetic matters", right?
regal coyote
one way ot another, we can be sure moira is party the reason of the current reaper power set
but not sure how much of it is moira
i guess regeneration may already be soemthing S24 have
it could be that the regen power of gabe is a bit out of control already and moira is supposed to fix it, instead she did this thing, cool thing bust still
iron plume
@echo snow Moira is the genetics minister
So while the lab may not "belong" to moira, it's her workplace
dire timber
lmao, there's no way that Moira was "fixing" anything
iron plume
and with regards to science the goals of Oasis and Moira align
echo snow
I'm aware
dire timber
I wonder whether Oasis would have second thoughts about her
if they found out about Talon
echo snow
Her bio suggests those rumors were already abound
regal coyote
they dont care about shit like moral
dire timber
um
iron plume
it's one thing to be an amoral scientist, another to be actually working with terrorists
dire timber
^
yes, that
Moira's down for working with Talon, but not every unethical scientist would
there's some difference between doing whatever it takes to uncover the truth and actively supporting a terrorist organization
echo snow
Regarding Reyes having a condition: Jack mentions in one of his Ana interactions that the stuff they got pumped with may be related to aging. It's theoretically possible that Reyes had some sort of genetics issue with it, but given who Moira is, she probably did it on her own because she can.
dire timber
I don't think any Reaper-related stuff is anything but Moira's work
SEP just means that Reyes can kick ass
dire timber
yea
regal coyote
what is SEP anyways
cunning ledge
bruh
regal coyote
we know S76 have anti aging, some regen and enhanced speed/endurance
echo snow
Reaper seems to blame Overwatch for it, so I disagree
dire timber
??
cunning ledge
jack literally runs up a wall in old soldiers
dire timber
ah yea, I think Reyes' Reaper abilities became unstable as a result of severe injuries sustained at Overwatch HQ
which is why he's blaming Jack
regal coyote
right, cap makes more sense
dire timber
as in, the guy who was able to hold onto a helicopter in Winter Soldier
echo snow
Why not both?
regal coyote
i ams aying S24 emhancement might be closer to making a deadpool originally
dire timber
ah
echo snow
Yeah, 76 is 100% Cap
regal coyote
but itglitches, so gabe thing moira will "fx" things, but moira did her own thing instead and give him all those upgrades, if youc an call that
regal coyote
well, reyes does not seem to be the kind that would just randomly want upgrades, at least not the old reyes
so i assume his enhance did indeed have glitches, and needs fixing.
echo snow
We don't know when he first got his shadow powers
regal coyote
and since reyes would not want to advertise that, moira isa no-questions-asked person
dire timber
uh, anything smoke/shadow related is definitely 100% from Moira
but he could be suffering from some different issues before that
regal coyote
i assume reyes does not have shadow powers originally, but just regen power, or sorts
the shadow thing is, as said, 100% moira
hence i am comparing to deadpool, meaning reyes might have better regen modification to start with in S24, compare to S76
limpid agate
We don't know when the shadow kicked in, if it wqs 100% Moira or only 70 %.
limpid agate
We do know that Reyes wanted her to look into something
limpid agate
And then he received his current state shown in Retribution
regal coyote
we actually dont know if he is already at his current state in retribution, but we can be sure some enhancement of moira is already there, and he has access to some shadow power
even if powers are slightly different from current state it would not be shown for gameplay sake
limpid agate
We know he at least has some semblance of control
We dont know if he is 100% ethreal like in the present
regal coyote
and from the outfit maybe he cannot regrow shotguns yet
cunning ledge
I like to think that part would come with his current talon agent outfit
the guns are clearly a talon design
maybe somehow he had them designed specifically for the purpose of generating them on the fly
regal coyote
another thing i am wondering is moira's status during kings row incident
obviously since her design is not complete at the time of the comic about kings row and the event she would not make appearance
but at that time, is moira still with ow/bw?
cunning ledge
that's a good question actually
would she have just gone ahead and left when blackwatch was decommissioned
regal coyote
we know genji is still with the group, and mccree working as soemone on holiday
worthy rose
Maybe she had to be let go?
worthy rose
Cause she had a bad rep anyway
cunning ledge
but there are others still with them
echo snow
The way McCree reacted in Retribution, it sounded like that was when he decided he wanted to leave, but he's still there in Uprising. Maybe it's another plot hole?
cunning ledge
maybe jack convinced him to stay, or something
or ana even
they had some form of relationship
limpid agate
McCree stuck around for a year longer. His narration sounds more like that's when it started to fall apart but he didnt notice it then
cunning ledge
it almost sounds like the narration is from even later than uprising
it isn't, right?
echo snow
It could be. I assumed it was from the same time as the teasers (the debriefing right after the mission), but Jewvia's right that it does sound like it's in hindsight of Overwatch's fall from grace as a whole
echo snow
Anyway, I brought it up because I figured maybe they hadn't thought about Moira's potential standing in Uprising
But, uh
Her employment was a closely kept secret, until it was uncovered during inquiries following the Venice incident. Many high-ranking Overwatch officials disavowed all knowledge of her affiliation with them.
So she was probably immediately kicked out
regal coyote
now if reyes requires moira to sta alive/powered/whatever, and moira joins talon... what would reyes do?
also, interesting thing to think of is that, how many of all these are the doing or Talon, and how many of these are "the eye"
dire timber
I think Archives 2019 will be a Talon event occurring concurrently with King's Row Uprising
regal coyote
i am saying, by the time of venice incident reyes may be hooked to moira's treatment, or require some regular performance by moira.
dire timber
with Widow, Sombra, Doomfist, Moira
regal coyote
and if moira is kicked out of overwatch group he would ahve to get treatment elsewhere, or else?
dire timber
Blackwatch being suspended is a perfect opportunity for Moira to start working with Talon directly
echo snow
That entire idea is baseless speculation
regal coyote
there is no widow at the tim, and sombra is independent at the time
exactly my point, Moira might be going for talon directly
now if reyes still want treatment then he would ahve to make a choice, to deal with moira.
i mean, afterall, reyes would like to see his child/relative grow right?
echo snow
Are you shitposting right now
regal coyote
@echo snow call the mods for all i fucking care really. but it makes sense, in terms of how blizz likes to mke the story, a tragic hero.
dire timber
uh
echo snow
Reaper is a tragic hero for reasons entirely independent of Moira
regal coyote
My theory: reyes requires moira to keep going, venice incident cuts reyes off from easy moira access since moira is kicked out.
dire timber
could be
regal coyote
Moira join talon at soem point, and makes deal with the then semi-defunct blackwatch reyes.
dire timber
I think Moira is already working with Talon by the time of Retribution
wispy fog
It depends
regal coyote
well the sniper upgrades points to that
cunning ledge
actually plausible
oops i meant the "my theory" bit
and yeah, there's the sniper smoke thing
kinda odd that they even had a voice line where genji says something along the lines of "watch the smoke!"
seems like they're almost intentionally hinting at something....
wispy fog
Like what do you think the are hinting?
cunning ledge
that moira, who made reaper have the smoke stuff, is already in talon modifying their soldiers
echo snow
It could also just be a cool visual effect. I don't think Talon has access to Tracer-like teleportation devices for their Assassins, seeing as the chronal accelerator is a one-of-a-kind device made specifically because of a failure of teleportation technology. It also probably would've been non-existent at the time, since Retribution takes place before Uprising where Tracer first uses it in the field
cunning ledge
honestly I'd rather think that the assassins are hard light based
gives sanjay a vague purpose
and even though he isn't mentioned in retribution
it confirms he was there before reaper, moira, etc
echo snow
He's not mentioned in Reyes' list of new Talon leadership, so that makes sense
cunning ledge
maybe at the time of retribution he was just a tech guy
that supplied hard light stuff
but then became a council member
echo snow
Nah, he's not an architect
echo snow
Or he could just redirect some supplies
cunning ledge
the blades are just a simple shape that projects out from a thing
low axle
Still think it would be neat if the sym rework was just to cover up the leak of Sanjay's abilties:P
cunning ledge
just like the crusader shields
echo snow
Vishkar's not an honest business to begin with
cunning ledge
anyone can use them
so if he was to get talon some regular ol' projector thingies
that could be made to project super sharp blades
he could have been involved in the creation of the assassins
echo snow
never heard of it but basically yeah
echo snow
Hey @dire timber , how did you get the big text in your Reddit post?
cunning ledge
Psst install RES for the big editor
It's got all the tools and then some
Also I think it's by putting a # in front of the text
Hope that helps
dire timber
@echo snow start the line with ##
it turns it into a header
also, @echo snow, the Sniper's smoke properties are acknowledged in voice lines
I don't understand why you'd dismiss that
echo snow
I was not aware of these voice lines
dire timber
Genji says "Smoke! Watch for the Sniper"
when the Sniper spawns
also, on the Assassins, I do actually think that Talon got their hands on Slipstream tech
and augmented their Assassins with it
with some... disturbing results
that they don't really care about as long as it works
meager wharf
The elites whose weapons are not in the armory in Rialto are the heavy and the assassin. I wonder if that means anything
valid shell
It means that both their weapons are attached to their models.
Rather than drag-and-drop guns.
limpid agate
@echo snow Surprised you didn't post the thread here too
I just got on, maybe it was just a summation of the past hour's of discussion
echo snow
I meant to, but then cooking food demanded my attention
limpid agate
Fair
echo snow
What are your thoughts?
limpid agate
I agree with the first theory that the eye she saw was probably a non-malicious observer.
But I agree with you that's its not quite the Iris, but something related to Omnica instead
Since we see a lot of eye related things with Omnics in general.
echo snow
I do think the eye is the Iris
limpid agate
I misunderstood the first part about it not being an AI, my bad
echo snow
I'm curious as to why you think it's non-malicious
I agree that there's no active plot secretly controlling everything, but it's hard to imagine that someone could drop and hide their entire identity over an incident that isn't a real threat
limpid agate
I think by non-malicious, it was more
Its not what Sombra thinks
She thinks someone is controlling the world and pulling all the strings
But its really just a passive observer
Looking at everything
iron plume
it's aliens studying us
echo snow
I think it's more dormant than passive
It doesn't have any bearing on the current state of affairs, but I think that's because it's still not ready for what it wants to do
As the plot unfolds, it will reach that state of readiness and then become public about it.
low axle
I heard theory it was the Iris. Not sure how it works, but think they just ran with the eye image you see on her chart
and the iris is actually an ai
lavish rune
Let's guess who the next hero is
valid shell
@lavish rune You first.
lavish rune
Hmm
I guess... Specimen whatshisnumber, the other monkey from horizon
You can see him on the sign when waiting to attack
limpid agate
Hammond
lavish rune
Yeah
limpid agate
We dont know what he looks like
lavish rune
But 2 monkeys might be 2 much
But he might be the subject of some sort of top secret genetic alteration project
limpid agate
I dont think Hammond is a monkey
lavish rune
True
limpid agate
He could be a rat, a cat, a rabbit
Or something else entirely
But I dont think he's a monkey
My prediction for hero 28 is Hammond, but he's jetpack cat.
valid shell
It is, primarily.
Which runs the question of why nobody would care about a missing monkey specimen.
Therefore, Hammond probably isn't a monkey.
lavish rune
If Hammond is 28, then he's a crocodile with who bites everyone
But he also has laser beams
valid shell
Ecks dee.
limpid agate
I'd think thats arguably more dangerous than a monkey
valid shell
Taht would mkae me rofl.
limpid agate
No one cared Hammond was gone for a week
valid shell
I mean, we've already seen a rabbit who's been genetically tested.
lavish rune
Binge what's your vote
limpid agate
And he is treated like an animal in a cage, rather than a person
valid shell
@lavish rune For hero 28? Nobody who's been named.
valid shell
Both Orisa and Moira came out of nowhere, with vague, misinterpreted teases in comics and map changes.
I feel like #28 will be the same.
lavish rune
Yes
valid shell
So no Hammond, no Sanjay, no Maximilien.
limpid agate
Hammond being a monkey is a vague, misinterpreted tease
But yeah that pattern does exist
lavish rune
What about the antonio-isnt-dead-and-will-be-hero-28
valid shell
Nah.
cedar galleon
Id write a strongly writte letter to get max in the game
valid shell
Antonio being alive would be a disservice to the entire Retribution plot.
lavish rune
Winston can take 3 reaper headshots
cedar galleon
Antonio wasnt even likeable fuck him
limpid agate
Winston is a monkey with plot armor
valid shell
Winston's never been shot in the head canonically.
limpid agate
And real armor
valid shell
Just his arms.
lavish rune
And roadhog is as fat as antonio
valid shell
Antonio isn't fat.
limpid agate
Roadhog has never been shown to get shot
lavish rune
And has 300 hp
cedar galleon
Roadhog is far bigger
limpid agate
Gameplay != Lore
limpid agate
We've seen Soldier and Winston survive shots from Reaper
Soldier in the leg, and was promptly healed by Ana
And Winston shot on his heavily armored arm
cedar galleon
Antonio is an unlikeable npc, and should never be anything more than that
valid shell
In the waist, but same thing.
lavish rune
He took 50 face shots and lived
In the steal doomfist gauntlet
And he has no armor on his face
lavish rune
Let me see the vid again
limpid agate
Cinematic Trailer: http://bit.ly/1yhzaCC
lavish rune
I think reaper clearly shot his head
limpid agate
Fight starts 2 minutes in
lavish rune
And winston takes a full widow headshot and lives
cedar galleon
Lmao
lavish rune
2:26 or 2:27
cedar galleon
The first trailer cant be used
cedar galleon
Blizzard didnt know what they were doing
He was warm and comfortable, covered in plot armor
lavish rune
Lol
valid shell
Please screenshot what you mean.
limpid agate
I watched the video
Reaper never hits him in the face
Its always either chest or blocked by the arm
cedar galleon
Those monkey cheeks though. The only tank that can take a canon headshot is orisa
lavish rune
Sec
valid shell
And as Jumunculus said, the Cinematic Trailer is full of inaccuracies anyways.
limpid agate
This is as close as she gets
For some reason, the bullet hits above the crosshair, but whatever
And that's a piece of armor she hits
limpid agate
Its this thing in the top right
lavish rune
Other then Hammond maybe widows husband, Gerard?
lavish rune
Yes
But widow wasn't good at that time
She was just brainwashed
No special powers
limpid agate
You dont need special powers to kill someone in their sleep
limpid agate
We dont know. Doesn't matter. He was killed and pronounced dead, and there is no mention of there being a missing body.
Overwatch likely found his body, given the circumstances
lavish rune
I thought I saw something about missing vody
limpid agate
Being he deid in his sleep and his wife went missing
lavish rune
Might have been mistaken
limpid agate
Why would there be a missing body
lavish rune
Other then hammond
Cuz like
Both Orisa and Moira came out of nowhere, with vague, misinterpreted teases in comics and map changes.
I feel like #28 will be the same.
limpid agate
My other expectations are that it can be Maximillien or Emre. But Jetpack Cat is my biggest bet
lavish rune
Where @valid shell
limpid agate
Reflections
valid shell
There's little known about him.
He accompanied Reinhardt, Torbjorn, and Ana for Operation White Dome.
And that's all we know.
lavish rune
My other guesses btw: Sven, that random engineer in torb comic. Lynx 18 or 17, the hacker omnic from zarya comic
They both are never mentioned again
limpid agate
Which is why I think they have no chance
lavish rune
Was Moira mentioned several times?
valid shell
Nope.
lavish rune
Sure briggite was
limpid agate
She didnt have to be
lavish rune
And orisa also
limpid agate
Orisa was not
valid shell
Orisa wasn't.
valid shell
Sombra/Doomfist/Brigitte all fill the slot where they were mentioned repeatedly.
limpid agate
With the exception of Ana who was the first, Every hero was teased 4 months before their reveal.
@valid shell Ana too
valid shell
Meanwhile, Orisa and Moira were just subtly teased.
valid shell
Ana's a bit of an amalgamation.
limpid agate
She eludes a lot of patterns
valid shell
She doesn't really fit the pattern, yeah.
lavish rune
Yeah
limpid agate
But every hero so far was teased within the 4 months before their reveal.
valid shell
We only saw Moira in the background of Masquerade, and heard her mentioned by Reaper in Oasis. That's it.
Never by name.
valid shell
Not Orisa or Moira.
limpid agate
Literally just answered that
valid shell
Sure, exceptions happen.
limpid agate
She was the most well known NPC at the time
valid shell
But until they do, I'm going to adhere to the patterns that Blizzard has set for themselves.
limpid agate
Ana doesn't fit patterns, but she gets a by due to being first and being a really well known character.
lavish rune
So just heroes who we never heard of
limpid agate
What
lavish rune
So impossible to guess
valid shell
We pretty much guessed Moira.
limpid agate
And they were both around when the previous hero was revealed
lavish rune
Ok
limpid agate
Orisa was the only one that everyone overlooked
valid shell
Everyone wanted another European hero, an evil healer, a Talon healer, an Oasis hero, and a "core" healer with vampiric abilities.
lavish rune
Searched google for clues in Brig release
limpid agate
Because they assumed her teaser was just a random spider tank
Instead of a character
And even then
There were people expecting something from Numbani
valid shell
Brigitte has been around since Dragon Slayer.
lavish rune
Yeah
valid shell
One of the first comics.
lavish rune
I doubt they thought it would be a hero though
valid shell
I did.
lavish rune
I joined overwatch really recently
valid shell
Once she started appearing in other comics and sprays and finally, Honor & Glory, I was sure.
lavish rune
So I don't know all what happened then
limpid agate
If you havent yet
lavish rune
I joined end of season 8
limpid agate
All the shorts and comics are in the pins
Actually, hold on 1 second
Short Stories:
Bastet: https://bit.ly/2QuXHmM
What You Left Behind: https://bit.ly/2Fh7MRz
Valkyrie: https://bit.ly/2CF5JVE
Stone By Stone: https://bit.ly/36EsPul
Code of Violence: https://bit.ly/33CeroL
Yōkai: https://bit.ly/3UDJzKb
Reflections: https://bit.ly/3FiMNx2
News Reports:
Fading Glory; Jack Morrison: http://bit.ly/2f9TPq4
Experimental Weapon Stolen: http://bit.ly/2fMrKsj
Lucio's Synaesthesia World Tour: http://bit.ly/2flja2U
LumériCo: http://bit.ly/1XAJfd1
Overwatch is Back: http://bit.ly/1TAWebT
LumériCo Revealed: http://bit.ly/2e6P5oj
Portero Steps Down: http://bit.ly/2fk8Bes
Efi Oladele Interview: http://bit.ly/2miMZkT
Horizon Lunar Colony: http://bit.ly/2reMSKx
Attack on Helix: http://bit.ly/2tn45mk
Oslo Attack: https://bit.ly/2uHKXUr
Don Rumbotico: https://bit.ly/2VtzZKX
Documents:
Mei's Adventure: http://bit.ly/2fMxRg4
Torb's Letter: http://bit.ly/2HK4CWa
Venice Declassified: https://bit.ly/2Hs807B
Cuerva: https://bit.ly/2BHEqd9
Yamagami: https://bit.ly/2XJC9Jr
Travel Guides:
Oasis: http://bit.ly/2iPTM4K
Paris: https://bit.ly/2GEyOoq
limpid agate
limpid agate
Not those
1 sec
Okay
The top pin
Is all the shorts
Middle pin is comics
Bottom pin is blog posts
valid shell
I'm banking on Maximilien being #29, but only because they seem to be pushing him pretty hard.
But him prematurely getting a player icon is
Weird.
limpid agate
He is popular and prominent
We also have characters like Lynx who are just popular
Or Sanjay is who is just prominent
valid shell
Very true.
Or characters like Liao who are all popularity, and literally 0 prominence.
limpid agate
Literally just a name.
lavish rune
K
From Venice Declassified, I wonder what Antonio's real last name is.
Shimada?
xd
limpid agate
No
echo snow
I was just reading that because I discovered it exists (thanks Jewvia)
It's funny how they redacted McCree's cover job, which he got fired from
valid shell
I think that, with this bracket in particular, all we can really look at is what continents/countries need representation, and what kinds of character archtypes the game is lacking.
echo snow
Honestly, I can't trust representation as a source of postulation after Brigitte
They had a really good opportunity with Emre and completely blew it.
echo snow
Eh... They could, but it would leave a very bad taste in my mouth for them to do bait-and-switch on him and them come back later
It would be like admitting he was a better choice but including Brigitte anyway
valid shell
It wasn't a bait and switch, though.
They just namedropped an Overwatch agent.
They've done the same for dozens of other characters.
And I feel like introducing a younger hero into Overwatch 2.0 served the plot better than yet another ex-Overwatch in his 40's.
echo snow
He was the only new namedrop in a hero teaser, so it was different
I agree about the second point, but that could've been easily solved by making it a relative or something. Like, if Brigitte was Turkish and Emre's child instead of Torbjorn's, it would've been super cool
buoyant thunder
🤦🏼♂️
valid shell
@buoyant thunder ?
buoyant thunder
Meant to send that 2 someone else
valid shell
And they've been setting up Brigitte being a Lindholm since https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/overwatch/images/e/e8/Spray_Torbjorn_Brigitte.png/revision/latest?cb=20170417201341
If not earlier.
valid shell
Later than that spray, that's for sure.
buoyant thunder
Around September?
valid shell
If only there was some kind of timestamp on the video.
echo snow
Obviously, the hero wouldn't be Brigitte herself, but a new Turkish character with a Turkish name
valid shell
I'm fine with Brigitte.
I mean, we had Orisa as a buffer before Doomfist, and that was fine.
buoyant thunder
Is Doomfist of this era the Savior?
valid shell
Wh
buoyant thunder
And his master was the scourge
valid shell
Our Doomfist is the Successor.
buoyant thunder
Ok
echo snow
Orisa is actually an original character, though
buoyant thunder
Have we seen any other mention if the first Doomfist
valid shell
Not really.
echo snow
I can describe the entirety of Brigitte's character as 50% Rein, 40% Torb, 10% Ana
valid shell
We don't know his connection to the Scourge.
buoyant thunder
Could have passed the gauntlet down
valid shell
We don't know if the Savior created the gauntlet.
We just see him wearing a simple knuckleduster.
Narratively, yes, it would be best if the Savior was the start of the Doomfist title and gauntlet.
But for all we know the Scourge created it.
valid shell
