Fiend Lords and infernal additions

[umbral geyser]

A ruler type based on different demonic arctypes we see on media specializing on diplomatic states to represent their affinity with dúbios deals and mortal temptations

Demon Princes - masters of brutality and violence they specialize on declaring war and isiduos lies giving them benifits for fabricanted grivences and bonus for declaring wars representing well their cravings for violence and shinign in tatical combat

[umbral geyser]

Archdevils - the less agressive of the two they would benefit for active pacts like defensive, wizard bond and shared vison representing their manipualation and ability to collect secrets they would shine one the strategic level having the ability to manipulate infestations they would have a more humanoid customization and intricate horns and clothing

‐--------------------------------------------

They would get unique signatures called hellish pacts allowing them to link with a unit forming a pact and having variety of effects and increacing their power for each active link/pact

[tough seal]

would love to see a daemonic ruler type, we already have eldritch but i dont feel like he repressents the classic daemonic warlord feel at all

[umbral geyser]

If undead got a special ruler with vampires demons deserve one as well and eldritcg sovering are cleary astral focused

[tough seal]

i think every creature type desrves their own ruler type i think it would be interesting to have elemental/plant/animal/fey/demon ruler types

[umbral geyser]

Bonus points if triumph decided to make a infernalist style class

Ability to summon fiends and upgrade it demonic companion style mechanic

And playing around ghostfire with theyr spells for accursed representation + Plus infernal might uses

[umbral geyser]

Another cool thing to add ro such dlc would be plague/Insect typed demons in a Tome of of Infernal Plagues focusing on buffing the dissead/poisoned type conditions to ignore resistences and draftable insectoid monsters with a big plague lord summon thingy

[unique plaza]

yes we all want plagues!!!

[stray crown]

I've wanted some Nurgle/Xenoplague flavor for a while

Mmmm, yummy disease

[high relic]

I'd rather see insectoids go the Shadow Demon/fantasy Kir'ko route. Even looking at Nurgle it's pretty much just the plague flies and they were a relatively recent addition to Nurgle's lineup.

[woven wagon]

I’m all in if they’re going to do a Fiend Lord Ruler type. But if they do that they might as well do a Celestial Ruler Type as well. That would make for a good story realm being celestial lords vs. fiend lords. Angels vs Demons has always been iconic after all.

[umbral geyser]

Seducting seduction fiends with tome focused on manipulating vassals and mind control and shadow signature for fiend lord another cool thing to explore and of curse succubus return

[tough seal]

i would like a mechanic where you capture enemies after battles and you can sacrifice them like thralls for summoning and all sort of rituals

[umbral geyser]

Yeah thrall like system for summoning other fiends

A special tree like the sovering summon one

[umbral geyser]

I bring more potential demon lords and units desing, Bird like demons seen to surprisingly common, we could get a tome, decaying flame giving burning the blood parasite treatment allowing it to ignore immunitys

[high relic]

Not independently, the Warhammer greater demons were originally ripped off the D&D demons.

[unique plaza]

Games Workshop ripped off everything and then changed their names in the most pathetically obvius way

[umbral geyser]

Fiend Lords and infernal additions

[split forge]

It would also be fun to have demon pacts. So a hero can make a pact with a demon to become powerful, but there is a huge negative. Say no health regen. A chance to go insane.

[umbral geyser]

Another daily demonic archtype submission Bull like demons and Baphomet figure
Not sure what a tome themed around him could be Classic fire is already well covered in base game do maybe it could use bleeding and be a alternative to undead vampires for those who want blood magic type factions but not be undead

In pathfinder minotaurs are also known as the spawn of baphomet só if they wanted to introduce a bovine form it could be a easy match just saying

[high relic]

Bull and goat demons probably don't really need their own tome, just suitable forms and aesthetic options for the ruler.

[tough seal]

we have goat and we will probably get minotaurs at some point, if you combine some transformations with that it should be good

[umbral geyser]

yeah true, could also use warbreed for more monstruos lookin ones for your race as well

i do wish we got another monstruos like racial unit tough

[umbral geyser]

Guys i bring more potential demons, Ape demons this one would also be easy to implement in game as a unit outside of just potential ruler customization, we already have a good roster of fiery infernal animals we just gotta a infernal bloodback

[umbral geyser]

Extra pic just becuse i always forget demogorgon heads are baboon heads

Só it fits ape moneky demon

[umbral geyser]

Im starting to run out of demons só here some more Classic desing of demons the famous balors

Age of wonders fo have their own balors but the desing is pretty distinguished só i think its worth posting these

[high relic]

Well, it'd make sense for character versions of balors to be able to wield weapons, especially if that's what the other demon lord variants are doing. Hard to balance the same lord type between flying and not flying, though, unless they make it a skill point and then there won't be an option to customise the wings.

Unless they justify it by being to heavy to fly even if you have wings until you take the skill point, and then you'd have the wingless forms apparently being able to fly anyway.

[umbral geyser]

I think would be cool to have wing as more of a comestic option initially só we have the freedom to have both winged and wingless rulers

And the actual flying be something tied to their signatures or origin skill tree

[umbral geyser]

also the option to have multiple wing desings if they take a more cosmetic approach and lets say the ruler flying animation is more magical in approach

[umbral geyser]

I return with pit fiends and their somewhat draconic desing

[tough seal]

new ones every week!

[umbral geyser]

I could probally have enought demons to post every day but i been pursofully avoiding some of the demons i see for either being to humanoid or not looking like a demon at all

Like there a demon lord in pathfinder thats looks like a deep sea monster and i dont really like that style and would rather see it on a deep ocean monster type dlc

[umbral geyser]

Someone had mentioned something akin to a undead demon on the last dev stream and of curse it made me remenber Orcus Lord of Undeath altouhg i would like to see demon not have much to do with undead i guess some synergy with old blood transformation would be at least a bit requested

[high relic]

Demons using undead is a pretty common trope, one obviously wouldn't want them to be built around undead, but the option should definitely be there.

[umbral geyser]

yep and the existence of the old blood transformation being undead at warrant some synnergy with undead on the thoerical demon lord ruler

for at least the way i'm imaniging it should have way to synnegise with all of chaos tome lines

warlord, fiends, bleed, fire, accursed etc

hmm should they have some construct synnergy to actuall given dreadnaught and reaver are part chaos and we have the War golem as a chaos construct now as well

[high relic]

War golem does at least trigger from being an infernal fiend as well.

[umbral geyser]

i came hero to add the new Diablo 4 Warlock class
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZaEkqGJfr0

i think they nailed exactly how a imagine a infernalist type class is suppsoed to feel like

someone who holds brimstone and demonic influeces as their power source

as of right aow4 dosent have anything to actually help you with a demonic character fantasy

[umbral geyser]

altough things like temporary and permant summons are not much of a concept in aow4 classes i could see something similar to a lets say skill combo system for such a class
place summon down
use skill to tell summon to x thing

[near agate]

I think its cool but as someone who was dissapointed by the lack of options for the giants in terms of customization and in general weapons I wonder if they could do it justice

feels like one of those ideas that would end up similarly too big for one dlc

In fact I really wish they just changed the format next expansion to just two dlcs, so those could be much bigger and in high detail, then i think they could do a concept like this justice

[umbral geyser]

i also was dissapointed with giants

i think the overall concept that i'm trying to pass on this thread thats just a chaotic space with random demon ideas is doable i think

its boils down to basically a new monstruos ruler type based on fiends
and a class to fullfill the fantasy of a ruler that holds power from infernal sources

and such a class kinda needs to be tied to dlc becuse of i dont think the base game has enought material to bring it to life

[near agate]

in general i think it would need a massive dlc for me to be satisfied, in fact main reason again why i rather they just do two bigger dlcs a year, so that themes do not feel missing in scope

hell i love ways of war but the units of that dlc feel like they only fit the oathsworn in terms of looks, i dont think we ever getting another dlc to add more monsters that are yokai looking like them

and if they keep going with that trend of not rethreading or adding to older dlc ideas in future dlc its better that they go for massive scales and less dlcs a year

[umbral geyser]

i dont think they doing another set of yokain styled monsters but i could see them exploring the Ghostfire damage in future dlcs mechanics

ghostfire was orignally something from signature skills, frostfire detonation and dragon breaths

so having a class thats able to utilize it would just naturally tie to calamity unit line without the need to fully make a new set of calamity units

i think Tob is the best dlc when it come to exploring a specific theme

i also dont think everything on this thread sould make it to the end product if they even give it a consideration for next seasons

this place is just a chaotic mess of random ideas i have on the way to work

[stray crown]

Many suggestions are

[stray crown]

I've not heard this before but I think it's at least viable. Maybe it'd be harder to sell the expansion pass with only two DLC tho

[near agate]

they would have to be a lot more open about what to expect from the content right at the start i think, but it can work

maybe i'm in the minority but i think i'm not the only one that prefers or preferred the bigger dlcs to the smaller ones

some of those dlc really only got very good for me after a bunch of free updates, like dragons didnt land well before the class rework, now they feel great

not saying that the frustrations with scope could all be solved by more focused, and more in-depth dlcs, but in general i do think its better

to me for example as much as i'm loving the new dlc i expected somethings that we didnt get, like sphinxes, and now i'm at a loss if it will happen cause to me that was the theme for it

or the giants dlc, i expected more stuff for demigiants, and more customization options for giants as well, but not sure if that will ever happen either

[high relic]

I don't think it's necessarily the case that just because WoW introduced the accursed fiends type that they'll never touch it again.

[near agate]

sure, but well there's nothing to say on that other than to speculate, in general i'm just noticing that the more complete dlcs are preffered by me at least to the smaller scope ones

and i think i remember some other people frustations about it

maybe i'll make a post about it at some point

[stray crown]

Jordi has stated they don't want DLC that ties into other DLC like that. Since accursed fiends are WoW, their future prospects are grimm

[high relic]

Eh. IIRC, that statement was more along the lines of not wanting to create the impression of DLC for DLC. Simply introducing more units that use the type wouldn't do that, particularly since I don't think there's anything that targets the accursed fiend type specifically. At worst, they might have to do it in a batch so they can still fill accursed-themed marauder stacks, but they could just have it be something that is available to the player to a tome but it rarely shows up in marauder stacks unless the scenario has WoW active.

[cold zealot]

I'm just going to chip in, how about Daedric Princes from the Elder Scrolls franchise as inspiration as well? since DLC expansions can come with rulers and tomes, we can have a demonic ruler and major transformations to add a new flavor of Demonkin.

[umbral geyser]

yeah Elders Scrolls Daedric Princes are great exemples for Demon/Fiend Lords

Molag bal and Dagon being the more obvios ones but Boethie i think can fit the role pretty well specially for more shadowy demons

also for the dlc i agree the more focused the dlc is the better i felt the theme was explored

Again ToB was hyper focused on vampire and it was the best dlc when it came to exploring its theme for me

the fact its content was also close to the full sized dlcs instead of the small content packs was also responsible for giving enought space to even explore those things

[unique plaza]

if we get demons lords i want them to have a crazy design, not something that you can do with champion and demon transformation

give me some thing thats as different as regular forms are from a dragon or eldritch sovereing

[umbral geyser]

i did use mostly animalistic demons for ideas for that reason

[umbral geyser]

but i also i do think we should at least one or more humanoid option just becuse its also part of the fantasy

but most of them should be monstruos

[near agate]

yea I'd want some chaotic lvl of weird limbs and stuff

[tough seal]

would you like your demon lord regular sized or bloodthirster sized?

[unique plaza]

i want them to be big

[umbral geyser]

https://klipy.com/gifs/shadow-of-4

Cutie pie sized

[near agate]

dafuq where is this balrog from

the amazon series?

[umbral geyser]

no idea

just looked big demon in gif

[cold zealot]

I think it might come from one of the lord of the rings video games, either trailer or cutscene.

[near agate]

maybe the mmo, otherwise i cant even think of any that would use such a model lol

[cold zealot]

I know this is a wild tangent but I wonder why we haven't got a clown head for Eldritch Sovereigns yet; there's plenty of horror genre clowns that are Eldritch in origin/appearance, and at least for this topic we might be able to do a little homage demonic clowns like Violator from Spawn.

[tough seal]

it comes from the game middle earth shadow of war 10/10 i recommend you play it

[cold zealot]

I do remember a balrog in that game but I don't remember a scene in that fidelity in that game, though I may be wrong as the GIF file is hard for me to tell fully; also, I believe the balrog came out of a frozen lake (sorry for the spoiler, I don't know how to create the black bar). I do agree that that game is a great choice to play though.

[tough seal]

dont think it was from in game, i think it was a cinematic

[near agate]

I actually finished that game and I have no recollection of a balrog lol

[umbral geyser]

i did research and apperently is from the shadow of war game

[tough seal]

you fight a balrog in seregost

[umbral geyser]

I saw this on pinterest no idea the origin i think its really cool and fitting

[cold zealot]

Since it's a bit cartoonish but not as "silly", I'd think it could be Darksiders concept art. But I imagine that it would be for a T-M game assets (though less of a true M-rated game though)

[umbral geyser]

This a demon lord thread but i havent posted the modt Classic demon from vídeo games yet

Diablo as a franchise has really good demon desings to draw inspiration from

[umbral geyser]

Guys almost forgot to demon post this week

Since i posted diablo heres another prime evil from the franchise with a cool desing mephisto

[stray crown]

You don't have to keep bumping your post with demon pics. The point has been made and it's nice to let other suggestions get their due

[near agate]

Kinda weird how we both need fiend rulers and less demon related stuff in chaos lol

hopefully a big dlc comes that adresses both things

[umbral geyser]

For me fiends need one dlc like tob them they can rest forever

[near agate]

something like that for sure yea

[cold zealot]

when rethinking in someone's post about were-lords and whatnot, I considered possibly a major transformation that allowed you to transform into one of game's base forms more primal design (a [base form] 2.0 so to speak); however, I briefly considered it should be named in homage of Dragon Quest's "Secret of Evolution". It's likely a tangent, and I only brought it up since the monsters of Dragon Quest in a manner of speaking could be demons, and thought it might be interesting way to evoke another kind of Fiend-like design.

[vivid bobcat]

Yes please! With all the mentions of infernal fiends basically coming from the same place it feels only natural that we should be able to play one of the bigger fishes from there

And the three subsection of the rulers proposed are great I think, One Chaosx2 one Chaos/Order and One Chaos/Life would be so fun

[umbral geyser]

Fiends have a lot of potential all they need as a high focused dlc on them and we will have peak

[cold breach]

Fiends could also be really interesting gameplay wise.

When you think demons/devils you think about three main things: deals/pacts, possession, and summoning

All of those are either things not in the game or thingsother ruler types don't do much of.

At best you can kinda squint and say vampires cover the pacts angle with turning your heroes into vamps.

[umbral geyser]

I would love to see a ruler/class that summons minions just tô consume them for diferent effects

Summon a imp só you can consume him for target explosion

And só on

[unique plaza]

demons could have a corruption part, to make others sins, like comming one of 7 sins

[umbral geyser]

Literally this but a ruler pleas

[high relic]

I was wondering how long until this was posted here. Longer than I expected. 😛

[umbral geyser]

I May or May not have forgotten to posti here earlier

[unique plaza]

yes that would be a very good design for fiend rulers

[quiet relic]

Well with one of the story realms we see a world possessed by a demon prince.

So as the entire world is basically a possessed world. Maybe have them be able to “possess” their cultural units with demonic spirits.

Then as they lvl up able to do neutral non fiend units.

With their heroes getting like a vampires but possessed by powerful lieutenants but also they themselves are still there.

With their own unique trees that let you focus either the ambitious mortal or the spirit possessing them

With the possessed units gaining bonus stats and also special abilities based on their unit type.

But with added weakness to the order dmg and potentially easier to mind control as they are already being puppeteered

[quiet relic]

Could have this as one of the different types of demon lord. A mortal outwardly possessed by a demon prince

[high relic]

I think that's just "wizard king". Aka ||Frikka||.

[umbral geyser]

This kinda reminds me of demonology in conquest of eo where we craft demonic spirits and use them to posses our units

Giving them a couple of stat bonuses

[quiet relic]

I’m sorry I’m not quite understanding

[quiet relic]

Yeah I took some inspiration from that and other media that has demon’s possession

We can already summon some demons, a few extra kind wouldn’t be bad, but this would make them a bit more unique compared to the other ruler types and stay true to demons

[high relic]

If you do the ||Crimson Caldera scenario, it turns out that Frikka is actually just an identity assumed by the demon lord who arranged the whole thing.|| We have precedent for what it looks like when a powerful demon lord is posessing, pretending to be, or otherwise puppeteering a mortal - and it's probably something that can be represented story-wise simply through tome choice.

Full-sized demon lord as a ruler, however, cannot.

Could be interesting to have possession as a more temporary mechanic, though. If you're not in combat, possess one of your heroes to use a portion of your power through them sort of thing.

[quiet relic]

I just don’t want possession being Mind control but different. So that could work?

I still like the units being possessed thing.

Tho we do have precedent of one demon lord possessing a WK. I’d say he’s won that world and is basically just playing with it.

This form could be a demon lord attempting to do the same but unable to get in fully.

Possession could also be used to steal or corrupt heroes in your jail

[high relic]

Yeah, I just don't think that having your ruler be a possessed mortal really adds much gameplay. It's like how it's possible that dragon lords can assume humanoid form like in many fantasy settings, but for gameplay purposes, why would you want to? The point is to play with the big dragon. Or in this case, the big demon.

Possessing heroes and/or units is a whole different ball game, though.

[quiet relic]

That’s why I said a type. Could do the GK thing. Where you have a few different ones. Or maybe just the two

[high relic]

Eh, I'm still inclined to think "what does this add that simply playing a thematic champion or wk wouldn't"? I'd rather the effort go into making a second type of actual demon lord.

[quiet relic]

Fair. Still would love the see the possession mechanic on heroes and units though that part id miss

[high relic]

Could even go full Warhammer Chaos on your heroes. The regular signature skills get replaced with various demonic mutations.

[quiet relic]

Ngl that’d be awesome. One for each type of demon. The basic fire boys, the eldritch shadows, and the far eastern fiends

Maybe that’s the types of demon lords?

[high relic]

Name aside, I think the umbral demons are actually something else entirely, it's just ignorant humans calling everything evil a 'demon'. Infernal and accursed, definitely, and I could see there being different subthemes within the infernal category. And they might well introduce a third fiend category by the time we get there. Infernal is pure Chaos, accursed is Chaos/Shadow, could be interesting to see what other combinations there could be.

[quiet relic]

An order/shadow demon archetype could be cool. Order bringers and tyrants

Like the dnd devils

[cold breach]

if they copied conquest of eo's homework I would not be mad