A Completely Casual Player's Thoughts on the Equipment Loadout System

[void aurora]

Hello! I have only been playing the game since like April of this year, but I've been privy to the game since last year and pored over ancient footage from the pre-pre-pre-pre-pre-pre-alpha and the like. I do not claim to be a good player, I do not claim to be a game dev, I do not claim to know anything about meta balance or anything. I'm a simple casual player wanting to foster some discussion over this, as well as get people's overall sentiments and thoughts on the Equipment Loadout system.

Previously, in typical Battle Royale fashion, you dropped with nothing, and you had to farm mobs in the hope of getting the item that you wanted from mobs. This accomplished several things. Mobs were important to both get the gear/level up your gear that was important to your Hunter, and also inadvertantly caused you to level up to get all your abilities. In the event that your initial mob cluster or even mob camps in biomes didn't yield the item you wanted, you had to go find MORE mobs. In lieu of that, you could just go to the nearest shop and get the item you want, as mobs also dropped gold. Both of these outcomes encouraged rotation and encountering other players. This ALSO had the downside of shortchanging your Hunter, depending on the loot that was dropped (ie. getting only helmets as Shiv). This forced you to have to rely on your team (SCARY!) or book it to a nearby shop to get even. Getting shortchanged could also happen to the enemy team, however, so you could potentially have the upper hand on a team that would normally be scary, but lack the damage numbers to contest with your kitted Hunters.

I forget when it happened, but at some point this year, right before Alpha or right after Alpha was announced, the loadout system was introduced, which to the cheers of many Arena players, allowed every Hunter to enter the game with a predetermined combination of upgradeable equipment. This way, you could effectively and very easily build the exact build you required for your Hunter, at the cost of simply finding enough Power Shards. The universal upgrade currency now meant the levelling of your gear was now "normalized". This was a good change in allowing for more player agency, as they were no longer at the whims of RNG in order to get the build that they wanted. However, I think this change caused Supervive to lose the "make do with what you have" feeling of typical BRs, which I understand people have mixed feelings on. I also think this came at the cost of inadvertently restricting the amount of power Equipment could have, as ANYBODY could have whichever item they wanted with relatively 0 issue. Amplifier, for example, is an insane transformative piece of equipment that could morph the playstyle of hunters completely (assassin KP, cross-country Jin, Shrike-Ghost, etc.). With the Tech blade being basically available from the rip, with no friction in obtaining, ANYBODY could build it effectively. I believe this issue would be less prevalent if there were no Equipment Loadouts, as players would have several more hoops to jump through in order to get their meme build.

Currently, they have to Drop -> Farm -> Select Tech Blade -> Farm enough to evolve it -> Get Amplifier. In the previous system, farming would still happen, but Tech Blades wouldn't be guaranteed. The player could simply go to a shop, however, as the amount of farming could surely yield them enough gold to just buy one. But OTHER players could have the same idea, and again, a rotation would force players to fight eachother. There's a sentiment of the "Day 2 Lull" or the lull in time right after a drop where there's "nothing to do" after hitting Level 4, and for more experienced players, I think this sentiment doesn't exist since they KNOW they need to find powers, crack vaults, break level cap, etc. For the general population though, having structure is key, and while Quests have done a lot in guiding players to rotate and like, DO something, I think the incentive of "shoot, I need to get my build going" is a strong incentive that exists across most BRs that motivate players to rotate regardless of a quest telling them to rotate.

Rotating, the feeling of being underkitted, and the RNG of getting "what you want" or "meta items", are universal, accepted points of a BR. But the variety that arises from having these negative aspects in place, and you as the player attempting to circumvent these negative aspects, are what make BRs feel really different from game-to-game. There's also a sentiment of Supervive games feeling "largely similar" between games, and I think pre-selecting your equipment might have some part to do with it.

I'm rambling at this point, but I would like to hear what other players feel about how this system affects the general pacing of Supervive, and whether or not having RNG loot again would "fit" in today's Supervive, or having the more pre-determined loadout is something that for-sure needs to stay. Again, I'm just your average player, and I might be missing some key aspects and points. But I would like to hear any and all thoughts on this topic, if you have any opinion on it.

[young crest]

I feel like the random loot aspect of BRs has sort of just become tradition at this point. Most BRs do it because all of the big successful ones have done it, when the system is sort of just coincidental with their success in some cases I think?

When I convinced my partner, who is very much a Stardew Valley/Hearthstone player with her only shooter experience being Overwatch, to play Apex Legends a few years ago she found the loot system the most off-putting part of the experience. She wanted to stop and read what the items did and would agonize over what to take because she didn't know what was good or bad. She found the powers and the shooting and the general strategy easy enough to get to grips with, but the items were the sticking point and ultimately ruined her enjoyment of the game.

That is to say, I think Supervives current system is a step in the right direction for retaining that kind of player without being detrimental to the enjoyment of all of the games other systems. If anything, I think going even further away from randomised loot drops is one of the ways that SV can stand out in the BR segment.

[void aurora]

I see, I suppose the classic BR system is less new user friendly. And since Supervive is shooting for new space, I can see why they broke away from the traditional loot system

I guess another question I have is, WITH the new new system, is there any point for shops to carry equipment? You keep equipment after death. Do people pivot their builds ever?

[young crest]

I've never used the shop, no. By the time I have money to buy things, I've already got them most of the time

[void aurora]

Yeah, I find the shop to be purely for shield purchases after getting boxed

[exotic flame]

If you find an early blue item that is not ideal it still is a big power spike in early game fights. After winning those fights and getting ahead it is nice to be able to swap to your preferred build

[void aurora]

Oh, is it possible to find higher-tier already-evolved loot?

[fringe tide]

One of the best ways I've found to "sell" people on this game is by stressing that it doesn't really feel like either a battle Royale or a MOBA.

Part of this game's strength imo is that it takes strong elements from these genres without being adherent to their tropes.

Elements like vision, creep farming, emergent item interactions, and obviously the hero based RPG-lite systems all come from MOBA, but huge swathes of gamers have numerous valid reasons to not have a taste for the genre as a whole.

The dropship, ring, and last team standing elements are all BR staples, but in Supervive divergence from that genre's traditions I think it makes itself far more appealing to a very large cohort of players.

While I agree with many of the potential positive points you outlined that stem out of a greater reliance on shops and farming, I think the game benefits far more from the baseline reduction in randomness and frustration.

Encouraging players to consolidate on points of interest can be (and currently is) done in numerous ways. Supervive is full of systems that encourage players to fight over loot and powerful map control. Vaults, airdrops, bosses, meteor souls, camps, and loot dense POIs all create an incentive for players to interact.
By no means do I think the game would suffer from more elements like this, but this particular system probably isn't one that I think would benefit from more reliance on luck.

In terms of players "making due", I think there's a really solid balance right now with powers. Seldom do hunters feel they NEED certain powers to play well, but getting powers that synergize with your hunter can make your experience infinitely more fun.
Getting xray or delicate disguise on kingpin radically changes the way you can approach a match.
Finding guardian angel on a support or backline massively improves your ability to stay in a fight and gives you more to think about and juggle.

The core difference here is that without powers you don't feel like you're gimped or playing a nerfed version of your hunter. Powers give random elements to the game and to your playstyle in a way that always feels positive without ever leading to frustration. Playing a mana heavy hunter without access to mana regen just makes you feel like you were never allowed to play from the start

Finally, in regards to restricting equipment power and always having the perfect load out

There's no reason why this needs to be the case. We already have a number of exotic tier equipment items which give higher stats and (in some cases) very powerful added effects.

I'd argue that we just need more items like this, and that their appearance in matches should ironically be more consistent. Having major bosses spawn with relatively abundant or unimpressive drops seems like a waste to me. Even when I do see a boss spawn with one of the few exotic equipment items I rarely see players scramble to pick them up.

My ideal solutions here would be to add more interesting exotic equipment items, make them on average more appealing, and have them spawn more consistently in world events to encourage teams to go out of their way to fight for them.

Right now the exotic POWERS from major bosses and evil chests are the star of the show, choosing a soul stealer or endless reaper over a fate rewinder or delicate disguise feels like an objectively bad call. Making them more appealing both addresses the "power limit" on equipment you mentioned, the feeling of having a "perfect build", AND encourages players to congregate in the mid to late game as opposed to shops or creep camps in the early game.