madhad | Stripe Developers | Page 1

wary thistleBOT Jul 6, 2023, 12:26 PM

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lusty spade Jul 6, 2023, 12:26 PM

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What specifically do you need to know?

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 12:37 PM

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we have the function that create accounts on stripe and link it to our platform from different countries. but stripe requires different capabilities on stripe.accounts.create due to country.

Like if we have AT (Austria) it's requires card_payments:

country: 'AT',
capabilities: {
card_payments: { requested: true },
transfers: { requested: true },
},

but if we have US it can be without card_payments

country: 'US',
capabilities: {
transfers: { requested: true },
},

so where can I see relations between capabilities and countries? May you had some request to API for collect that data and we create middleware for validate request before

lusty spade Jul 6, 2023, 12:38 PM

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The general recommendation is to just omit the capabilities parameter from Account creation

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And we will handle that automatically

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Otherwise, there's no API for that no

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 12:41 PM

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It's not working
look that request

and it returns error

lusty spade Jul 6, 2023, 12:43 PM

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Ah, probably because you're specifying a country/using custom accounts

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I mean in most scenarios you're like going to want card_payments for all accounts, no?

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 12:45 PM

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not a fact, we doesn't know where from our clients come

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like it may be Austria

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may USA

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may India

wary thistleBOT Jul 6, 2023, 12:46 PM

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lusty spade Jul 6, 2023, 12:47 PM

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I don't understand what you mean by that? What I mean is if you omit the country parameter, and let the user select it in the hosted onboarding flow, then the capabilities hash is redundant

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 12:50 PM

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hi. Could I join ?

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 12:52 PM

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we have an issue with processing onboarding our user and we tries to prefill and send all data we have on our side to stripe. for make user onboarding a less painful. so we need to provide country in that request cause if we didn't do that users should pass all address fields manually

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 12:54 PM

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👋 stepping in here

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Sounds like you are looking for Country Specs: https://stripe.com/docs/api/country_specs ?

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You can use this API to see what PaymentMethods are supported for a certain country

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 12:55 PM

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bismark do we need to use all this to just on-board users ?

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I mean it should be easy to onboard, just send prefill data and then have Stripe forms to fill all not prefilled

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 12:59 PM

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Not sure what you mean

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 12:59 PM

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this is what we had on dev stage of task

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 12:59 PM

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You can certainly just pre-fill the data you want.

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But you do need to know what capabilities you want to request for the account

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 12:59 PM

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yes but Stripe return error!

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we have not been told about this

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that all this will happen at onboarding

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 1:00 PM

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supported_payment_methods returns that. how did we understand what is required? or we should use all of them?

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:00 PM

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Yep so unless you are using Cross Border Payouts (https://stripe.com/docs/connect/cross-border-payouts) you always want to request Transfers and Card Payments capabilities

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The requirements is based on the capabilities you request

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But to use a certain PaymentMethod you need that capability

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:01 PM

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man, we are not talking about payment options now. Is it possible to on-board customers and ommit all this questions on onboarding stage?

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:02 PM

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What questions?

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Let's back up.

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What is your exact concern here?

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:03 PM

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We change standart onboarding flow to custom

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all was good

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until we got a test client data not from the US

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)))

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thanks God we found it on test ))

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:04 PM

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The expected flow with Connect Onboarding if you are going to pre-fill data is that you know (or ask) the users country ahead of time.

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:05 PM

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thats true

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 1:05 PM

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we know the countries

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but we don't know required capabilities to each one

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:06 PM

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but we expect to only use 2 requests for prefill data and then to create link for the Stripe forms (to redirect )

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not all the API's and end-points you have

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could we somehow go back to that simple

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:09 PM

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The required capabilities is dependent on your payments flow. You know which payment methods you are going to support for your users. You need to then request those necessary capabilities. This isn't something that fluctuates -- you should know this based on your own payments integration.

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:09 PM

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in this case we connect Sellers not Buyers - it is a market place

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We could not know all the payments on this stage

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Just need to onboard a customer to Connect with our main account (US based)

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is any option to postpone the payment option settings and capabilities to later stages (not on onboarding)

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may be other requests or parameters

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or different Flow

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:12 PM

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You can request the minimum capabilities initially and then request more later on, yes.

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 1:16 PM

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And we're right back to where we started

if we had the country AT the minimum requirements is card_payments: { requested: true }, transfers: { requested: true } but if we had US the minimum is only transfers: { requested: true }. How does we'll know which is minimum by country?

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:17 PM

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That is based on your payments flow.

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What type of Charges are you using?

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I assume Destination Charges?

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With on_behalf_of for international payments, right?

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:18 PM

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ok, for now there are two types of payments

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subscription payments from both buyers and sellers for PRO subscription - it is payment from customer to the system (which we work for)

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payment between buyer and seller - this could be the payment rfor aircraft part or aircraft repairment service

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it is a marketplace for aircraft aerospace business

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https://www.eplane.com/

ePlane: The Leading Aerospace Marketplace

ePlane is the cutting-edge online trading and insights platform for aerospace parts and repair services. Join now for free and start saving time and money.

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:20 PM

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Can you provide me an example PaymentIntent for each flow so I can see exactly what your integration is doing?

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:20 PM

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do you have sound options ?

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:20 PM

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You are a US platform, yes?

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:20 PM

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I can demonstrate

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:20 PM

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No sorry I can only chat

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:20 PM

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we have both

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EU and US

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:21 PM

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Oh okay.

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:21 PM

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chat is very poor I cant explain everything here it will be for ages

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for now mainly we want to switch for our US Stripe acc

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as one and only

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but clients could be worldwide. China EU South America

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we couldn't know all the options and posibilities

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it is a huge worldwide famous platform

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:22 PM

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Ok it is pretty simple then.

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:22 PM

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good. then show us what to do please

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:25 PM

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Sorry, one more question actually. Are you making the Connected Account the merchant of record? Like who's info are you showing the customer -- your platform info or the Connected Account? This basically is asking whether you use the on_behalf_of parameter or not in your flow.

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:30 PM

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no we want transactions to go through Eplane

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but it is far far further

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for now we are still trying to go through onboarding

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we can't connect sellers acc to ours

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It was quite easy on a demo I sent you above

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and guys here told that it is it and this is how it should be

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we were not told about all this details

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guys?

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so what we shall do?

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:34 PM

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It sounds like you are trying to do one piece at a time when each piece inherently affects the other. Your payment flow affects your onboarding flow so you can't really just ignore that.

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So I think you need to step back and scope what you want to do. The three main questions you need to answer are:

Which country will your platform be in?
Which Connected Account countries do you want to support?
What charge flow (https://stripe.com/docs/connect/charges) are you going to use -- and is your platform going to be the Merchant of Record or will the Connected Accounts be the MoR?

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:40 PM

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platform is US based
Worldwide - EU, China, America, Asia etc.
As I've told you
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF PAYMENTS:

clients pay to Eplane (for Subscription)
clients pay to each other THROUGH Eplane (for buy -sell or repairment deals)

We do know all the answers. But we were not told that onboarding is affected by countries question

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so for now. We need some simple solution if possible to end the feature in MVP way and then improve payments countries and so on

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is there any solving except ommiting country field

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?

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:44 PM

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Well without full information on the payments flow, the simplest way is to make your platform the Merchant of Record for all of this (don't use on_behalf_of at all) and then you request the recipient agreement for all Connected Accounts except US Connected Accounts which will require the full ToS since recipient isn't supported and just request the Transfers capability for all Connected Accounts.

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 1:53 PM

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stay tuned we discuss it with CTO

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right now

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:54 PM

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Sounds good. Like I'm happy to help as much as I can but I really think you are going to run into issues down the line if you don't scope this completely first. Some of these decisions are "irretractible".

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 1:56 PM

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can we use direct payments (account to account) in future if we use tos_acceptance: {service_agreement: 'recipient',} on onboarding

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 1:58 PM

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We don't support Connected Accounts paying each other directly via the Connected Account balances. Everything flows through your platform. So it mostly depends on what you actually mean by "account to account" here.

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The best way to think of the recipient ToS is that it only supports making Transfers (in the form of Destination Charges or creating Transfers directly) from your platform to your Connected Account.

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What it does do though is open up a lot more countries for your Connected Accounts (see: https://stripe.com/docs/connect/cross-border-payouts)

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 2:00 PM

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discussing it thanks. stay tuned

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what means for the platform to be the Merchant of Record?

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where in tyour doc we can read more details about that

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 2:10 PM

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https://stripe.com/docs/connect/destination-charges#settlement-merchant

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The "settlement merchant" === "Merchant of Record"

wary thistleBOT Jul 6, 2023, 2:16 PM

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steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 2:17 PM

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north spire Well without full information on the payments flow, the simplest way is to make ...

if we decide toi move this way

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how it will look like?

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this part

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and then you request the recipient agreement for all Connected Accounts except US Connected Accounts which will require the full ToS since recipient isn't supported and just request the Transfers capability for all Connected Accounts.

north spire Jul 6, 2023, 2:18 PM

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I have to step away, @coarse breach is going to step in and help from here.

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 2:19 PM

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ok, I need some more details about this part:

and then you request the recipient agreement for all Connected Accounts except US Connected Accounts which will require the full ToS since recipient isn't supported and just request the Transfers capability for all Connected Accounts.

coarse breach Jul 6, 2023, 2:21 PM

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Which part are you confused about?

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 2:22 PM

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do you see the whole dialog?

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could you please to read from here:

bismarck — Today at 4:34 PM

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to be in context

coarse breach Jul 6, 2023, 2:23 PM

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I have not. I just got here

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Ok I can read through everything if it's necessary, but you'll need to be patient while I catch up and tend to other users

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Service agreement is requested on account creation. Recommend reading: https://stripe.com/docs/connect/service-agreement-types

coarse solstice Jul 6, 2023, 2:43 PM

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looks like if we use service_agreement: 'recipient' it's cant process any card payments?

coarse breach Jul 6, 2023, 2:45 PM

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Exactly. Because with the flow my colleague described: #1126489232551194724 message you wouldn't process payments on the connect accounts. Platform would be merchant of record and you transfer to connect accounts

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 3:19 PM

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but could the platform then pay to connected accs to the cards?

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or which type

coarse breach Jul 6, 2023, 3:23 PM

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Not sure I understand the question

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Can you rephrase?

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 3:31 PM

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MaDHaD — Today at 5:43 PM
looks like if we use service_agreement: 'recipient' it's cant process any card payments?
codename_duchess — Today at 5:45 PM
Exactly.

my comment is for this part of your dialog with my colleague

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the questions are following:

where to read more about " merchant of record" what does it mean, what rules and abilities is for this option/term whatever it is
any card payments is about receiving or sending too?
I mean if we connect users this way - will they be able to pay to the platform (ePlane) with their cards through Stirpe or not?

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are you here?

coarse breach Jul 6, 2023, 3:36 PM

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Helping multiple users in here

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Will get to you in a bit

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MOR == Settlement Merchant. My colleague shared that info above too: #1126489232551194724 message. See: https://stripe.com/docs/connect/destination-charges#settlement-merchant
Yeah all payments would be processed on the platform. Connect accounts would receive funds through transfers

wary thistleBOT Jul 6, 2023, 3:44 PM

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steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 3:44 PM

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2 is not answered about subscription payments

as I mentioned we have 2 tipes of payments

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1 c2c - for something on marketplace
c2b - from clients to platform for PRO subscription

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in fact all clients are b businesses - I just simplify for you

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I mean if we go this way with "merchant of recod"

what type of payments it affect from following:

a) payment from registered client (connected acc) to platform (fro subscribtion) - usually by cards

b) payment from buyer to seller - SEND funds from buyers card to whatever acc or card

c) receiving funds by seller TO card

dense dome Jul 6, 2023, 3:47 PM

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Hello! I'm taking over and catching up...

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 3:48 PM

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Hi! Start from here

bismarck — Today at 4:34 PM
to be in context

to be in context

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then please answer the last question

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when read all this

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context is very important

dense dome Jul 6, 2023, 3:49 PM

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I'm not sure what message that is; we're in different time zones, so your 4:34 PM is not the same as mine. What is the content of the message you want me to start from?

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Or can you link directly to that message?

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The main thing to understand about destination charges is that the payment objects (Payment Intents, Charges, etc.) exist on your platform account, and a portion of those charges is transferred to your connected accounts. Going back to your question about connected accounts not being able to accept card payments, that doesn't mean you can't do a card payment on your platform as a destination charge and transfer some (or all) of it to your connected account. Have a look at the flow here, for example: https://stripe.com/docs/connect/destination-charges#flow-of-funds-amount

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Does that address your main concern? If not, happy to answer more questions if you have them!

steep nova Jul 6, 2023, 3:58 PM

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as I mentioned we have 2 tipes of payments
1 c2c - for something on marketplace
c2b - from clients to platform for PRO subscription
in fact all clients are b businesses - I just simplify for you
I mean if we go this way with "merchant of recod"

what type of payments it affect from following:

a) payment from registered client (connected acc) to platform (fro subscribtion) - usually by cards

b) payment from buyer to seller - SEND funds from buyers card to whatever acc or card

c) receiving funds by seller TO card

dense dome Jul 6, 2023, 4:02 PM

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a) payment from registered client (connected acc) to platform (fro subscribtion) - usually by cards
Payments do not flow from connected accounts to platforms, it happens the other way around. If you want the person or entity who owns a connected account to pay you it would work like a regular payment from a customer and would not involve Connect or their connected account; they would instead give you money by providing you with credit card information or similar just like in a non-Connect scenario.

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b) payment from buyer to seller - SEND funds from buyers card to whatever acc or card
Can you clarify who the buyer and seller are in this scenario? Is one of them your platform? Is one of them a connected account?

dense dome Jul 6, 2023, 4:50 PM

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You still around? If not this thread will be closed soon as we focus on realtime support here. If you need a long-running async support you should write in to Stripe support: https://support.stripe.com/contact/email (But happy to continue helping you here if you're present!)

#madhad