Emote Sets Future Functionaity

[torpid verge]

• Be able to equip multiple emote sets at once

If an emote code conflicts, the most recently added set's emote will take the slot.
I think this would create a lot of cool emote metas like being able to enable emote sets for specific games and then just disable it when you're done and go back to your normal emotes.

• Be able to make a copy of someone else's emote set

• A page/section on the site dedicated to browsing, editing, and managing sets

PLANNED

[stark karma]

I think in addition we could have basic set-operations for emote-sets:

• Union/Merge of two emote sets.
• Difference Emotes from one set "minus" emotes from another set.
• Intersection is probably not that useful.

[torpid verge]

what would intersection imply

[stark karma]

If you have emote-set A and B, then the intersection would be the emotes that are in both sets. Which is something I can't find a practical use for.

[torpid verge]

they'd probably just be null'd as a slot

[gloomy prism]

Tacking on to this, emote sorting in a set would be really nice to put favorites at the top, organize them with similar emotes, put good emote combos next to each other, etc.

[marsh jay]

would be nice to have a function to duplicate a whole set, rename the set, and inside the set I can replace each emote one by one from the emote set ui
I want to replace each one with a christmas or halloween themed version of any emote, and just click between the sets depending on the time of year

[torpid verge]

i think it's planned that you'll be able to have multiple sets enabled at once

think about it like enabling a christmas set and having all of the christmas emotes overlap and take priority over your normal emotes until you disable the set.

the other suggestions are good tho

[haughty lagoon]

there's some cool stuff planned for easily changing to seasonal emotes

[torpid verge]

i will be able to delete my "a" set one day

[haughty lagoon]

leave the a alone!

[torpid verge]

it's annoying

[haughty lagoon]

not more annoying than these replies .

[torpid verge]

🤜 🔔

[rose gull]

Few implementation ideas:

• Deep clone an existing emote set (I understand devs are trying to avoid this as per <#help-old message>)
• Allow emote sets to be assigned to multiple channels, similar in a way to how emotes are where anyone can simply add it to their channel.

I feel like the second implementation will help prevent duplicated data and keep the db small as compared to deep cloning.

Additionally, could pave way for a new feature such as being able to enable/disable multiple emote sets at a time for a particular channel. The one concern with this I see is potentially exceeding the emote count, but I suppose this could be mitigated with another field for disabled emotes for the given set in a given channel.

[haughty lagoon]

there's a thread for that too

(also by hyru )

[rose gull]

sob

[torpid verge]

i think a more logical approach to Allow emote sets to be assigned to multiple channels would maybe be to create like a "reference set" which would auto-update based on whatever the creator adds. You could still edit the set or add emotes to it but it would still reference the original (your own emotes would be minus-ed maybe if it goes over the slot limit)

[haughty lagoon]

there's a lot more planned for sets for sure. copying will be a thing, but I agree with anatole that cloning is not the way to go. it's not a priority now is all, especially not after the recent set update that made things even smoother

[stark karma]

export emote-set as git diff when?

[rose gull]

it's not a priority now is all
I understand, not a huge feature because in reality I suppose people will copy a set once and be done with it such as the case for holiday emotes

That being said, holiday season is nearing, would be appreciated if this feature gets somewhat traction in time so people don't have to copy emotes one by one

[haughty lagoon]

again copying will be a thing, just not pure cloning

[rose gull]

Yea

[wooden gazelle]

I beleive this is sort of like how its planned

[torpid verge]

nice

[wooden gazelle]

synthetic sets that can parent from a preexisting set

[torpid verge]

yeah i'm not good at wording things

thank you for doing that for me

[green panther]

Hello. Just have a suggestion for Emote Set Usability... I don't think creating a new set should immediately make that the active set. With the current iteration, creating a new set while the streamer is live mass removes all emotes before we can swap back to the populated set while new emotes are added to the new set. Just let us create new sets and swap to it later. 🙂

[indigo kernel]

This is kinda how I thought about approaching this, not to merge 2 emotes sets but rather have a delta/diff set that can be applied onto the currently active base emote set.

This way there is no need to clone existing sets and change the emotes you want.

Similar to emote sets, only 1 delta set can be active

[torpid verge]

you already have that option, just leave both boxes unchecked

though it should be a bit clearer

[green panther]

oic. ty

yeh maybe "Start Active in" text or something somewhere. I just took that current display to mean where I wanted to use the set, but in hindsight that makes no sense either since it could be used for both Twitch and YT

[green panther]

OK I got another one... when you click on an emote set in a Profile that isn't active it takes you to a page with all those emotes on a single page and without the normal Search box... can we add that Search box in? I'm currently forced to use Ctrl+F to jump to emotes on that page.

[summer wagon]

thats planned

[green panther]

ah ok thanks

[uneven skiff]

I wonder how the "change season" will work. Now "seasonal emote" and "regular emote" are two different emotes that are in no way related to each other. I would like it to be one emote and it would be possible to simply switch versions to it. So now you need to delete current emote, find another one, add it, and again for everything.

If seasonal versions were tied to a single emote and could be identified by a tag, it would be much easier to change them. And even make a special button in the set to change ALL emotes that have the right tag. For example like on the screenshot, click the button, enter the tag "newyear" and all the emotes in it are replaced by their new year versions. Emotes without such versions remain unchanged. And to return the normal versions - enter a blank value to change, for example.

But there are also a few problems, for example the fact that many seasonal emotes are already loaded, and you can not create your own version of the emote of another user, only to upload separately as new. Although this can be changed.

[haughty lagoon]

that's what variations will be for no?

although I'm not sure I see why you would need to change all existing emotes within a single set rather than making a separate set

[signal girder]

While boolean operations like Nerix suggested are definitely cool and nerdy, I don't think they'd be useful for 99% of use cases (or understood by 99% of users)
I think that sets should have an interface like Minecraft's resource pack screen, where you can enable whichever sets as you want, and re-order them so that emotes in higher sets will take priority over lower sets (when emotes have the same name/alias, like for holiday emotes)
It would be a very intuitive UX, and coupled with the advantage tons of people are familiar with MC resource packs, it makes the most sense IMO.

[torpid verge]

true

[haughty lagoon]

honestly not the worst idea

[torpid verge]

the only thing is how to deal with slots

[haughty lagoon]

im like 50/50 on the multiple set stuff cause i dont truly see why it'd be preferable but im open to being convinced in the future

[torpid verge]

wdym

[haughty lagoon]

i dont see why multiple sets would need to be active if youre mixing up new sets with a "resource pack" type menu, essentially making another set

[torpid verge]

Could be useful for organization and such

like let's say I want to keep my zero widths separate from other emotes

I could have a zero width set that would take priority over other sets

[haughty lagoon]

i feel like that could be solved with a better search feature that would also be available on profile page

[torpid verge]

that's not the point though

I don't care about finding the emotes

Think about it like exclusive emote slots

the higher you put a set in the list the higher priority the emotes in the set will have

so if you're maxed on slots any emotes added to higher sets would cancel out the lower ones

[haughty lagoon]

its just sounding less and less convenient to me

[torpid verge]

you can still just do 1 set

[haughty lagoon]

more popups more menus more right clicks

[torpid verge]

but just having the option to choose may help some people

the way Anson described isn't confusing at all imo

[haughty lagoon]

the general idea sounds neat but the more i think about the details it sounds like a pain

im not a coder though so dont mind my 4 brain cells

[torpid verge]

only other thing that would need to be changed would be choosing the order of emotes in sets so you can choose what would take priority

would love to hear atol's opinion on this tho

[prisma gulch]

Here's a new suggestion for Streamers to make it easier for them to add emotes. Streamers are a bit clueless when it comes to sets today and theyre lazy.
It would be great that whenever a set is chosen for them by an editor the most recent one chosen becomes their default emote sets whenever they try to add emotes by themselves!
Ive seen streamers add emotes themselves and try to figure why the emote doesn't show up, this would fix that and fix a lot of confused people!

Im posting this here cuz im too lazy to make a new thread

[torpid verge]

do you mean like default set for the channel?

bc i know a streamer that still has the old set (not the halloween) one as his default set

so editors have to go back behind him

[prisma gulch]

For exemple if an editor change sets for Halloween on their profile, that chosen set becomes their default one

[signal girder]

it definitely should become the default set, but ideally the concept of using only 1 set at a time goes away

[torpid verge]

oh i see, that would be cool

bc then you can still add emotes to other sets

[signal girder]

I made a mockup of a set managing screen. Completely original design.

Additionally, the emote sets could be managed by dragging them, with the oft-used ⠿ icon as the “handle” to indicate draggability. (The whole set would still be a draggable area.)
While more elegant and intuitive, this draggable system may be more difficult to use on a touchscreen, so IMO it’s important to have buttons as well.

[worthy fjord]

i'd suggest having an option to designate a spot for a rotating set, so you'll be able to switch them fast when you're playing different games (like your ow set).

maybe have an option to switch the designated set through chat command (have the 7tv bot switch it for you or something like that)

imo you dont need to show the global emote set. and even if you do, there's no reason to have an option to change the priority of it

global set should always have the lowest priority

[signal girder]

I considered that, and I mostly agree, but then I thought there might be a case where you'd want to temporarily make global emotes a higher priority than an emote set

like if you had customized the global emotes for halloween or something, then wanted to switch back to normal emotes after halloween was over, but want to just leave all the halloween emotes that don't have non-halloween versions

in the same way as the vanilla Minecraft textures don't have to be lowest priority either

[signal girder]

The rotating slot idea is a little goofy, but being able to switch sets from chat would be nice. Maybe it could be implemented down the road. It's not a day-1 need.

[worthy fjord]

In that case you should add these emotes to your regular set imo

[signal girder]

you should

but it's all about making things faster and easier

[worthy fjord]

Also, adding a global set to the list will mostly cause confusion to new people and imply that they can tinker with, which they can't

[signal girder]

I honestly don't think it would confuse the vast majority of users

[worthy fjord]

Yeah, it's pretty scuffed. But I just thought that it'll be easier to control via command, since you'll need to add less parameters to do it

[worthy fjord]

You'd be surprised

[signal girder]

nah I've seen the kinds of things that 7tv users get confused with

they come in here basically every day to ask about them

[worthy fjord]

No offense to new people here and new people who use 7tv, but some of the questions can be solved by them just reading or looking better at the page

[signal girder]

IMO, in the majority of cases, the page is not very clear for new users

they're legitimate reasons to be confused

like how emote sets have a hidden "maximum slots" value that is separate from your channel's allowed slots

[prisma gulch]

People are dumb and want simplicity in this world.

[worthy fjord]

True

[signal girder]

But they also want more emote set options

multiple sets, making personal copies of sets, etc.

but I agree that, by default, the site should function very smoothly and as automatically as possible

braindead simple

[worthy fjord]

You should be able to share sets like you'd share a HS deck

[signal girder]

or a spotify playlist

[worthy fjord]

Yes

[signal girder]

(I assume more people use spotify)

[worthy fjord]

You click a button and it's there

[signal girder]

copy-on-write

mr. cow

$gn (MC resource pack screen) O o .

[alpine radish]

ansonx10 is now sleeping: (MC resource pack screen) O o . 💤

[signal girder]

$afk

[alpine radish]

ansonx10 finished their beauty sleep: (MC resource pack screen) O o . 💤 (7h, 8m ago)

ansonx10 is now AFK: tf

[river cairn]

i really like this. after using emote sets for halloween i realized how painful the existing system is.

if N number of layered sets is not possible, then i think at minimum 4 would do,
global -> base -> season -> misc

global: here you can set the all year round global emotes or choose the holiday version you want. maybe there can be an opt out setting for people to prevent 7tv from automatically updating the active global set.

base: your channel's base emotes available all year round

season: emotes that will override global and base that might be season specific

misc: most people won't need this but in case people want game specific emotes

[signal girder]

based anson-agreer

[river cairn]

also to earlier parts of discussion, i don't think fancy set logic is necessary. i think just being able to have a priority list where last set in list overrides leftmost emotes is best

[torpid verge]

Tbf that was pretty much the first concept of having multiple sets enabled

I do think Anson's idea is just an improved version

[river cairn]

if the layering operations are costly to do LIVE, another approach is to still only allow 1 active set but give people tools to create precalculated sets that can't be edited directly but can only be generated from other sets. for example, i create base_set and christmas_set and overwatch_set. i click a UI button to layer the sets into a final set, it gives me Anson's UI, i click Finalize As (name of new set) and it creates it on demand

[torpid verge]

[river cairn]

the new set would be locked and not editable to prevent people modifying it when they should be modifying the base_set/christmas_set/overwatch_set directly

[signal girder]

Yeah that could definitely work too.

Ideally it would be fast to change sets and emotes on-the-fly so 7TV power users could do fun stuff in chat by enabling emotes only for a certain time period.

I don't think layering the emote sets would be any more costly than creating a new read-only set every time the underlying sets are updated though.

[torpid verge]

eventapi messages from disabling a set and enabling a new one

[signal girder]

Yeah it should definitely be a single eventapi message for enabling a set

[river cairn]

@signal girder layering the set live every time means conflicts have to be dealt with

[signal girder]

No that's the whole point though

"conflicting" names would just use the emote from the highest-priority set

[river cairn]

if you have 200 emotes per set and 3 sets active that's 600 emotes to process live

to squash down into 200 again

you also have to pull down data on stuff like did the user rename an emote

so yeah, with precalculating you only do that during precalculation stage and from there on it's same as usual

though it might make sense to not lock the precalculated sets but to mark them as dirty if someone edits them. "hey, new emotes were added to this set. if you regenerate, it will be lost"

[signal girder]

Sounds like that just adds unnecessary complication for the end user. All of the optimization stuff can (and should) be done on the backend

[river cairn]

it's true that they can use precalculated sets in the backend

[signal girder]

I'm sure it makes sense to calculate and cache emote set combinations

[river cairn]

but i feel like the precalculated approach as described would be least coding work and least performance hit on the infrastructure since it's using the same pipes

especially with christmas around the corner and people feeling the burn from painpoints of using emote sets for halloween

[worthy fjord]

There's no reason to limit it to 4 sets and also, you don't get slots for replacing globals, that's on you so the site should not give you a separate set to do so

[river cairn]

the 4 set limit was only for the LIVE situation to reduce computational load. with precomputed it could be expanded

as for not getting to use personal slots for global, i wasn't thinking it could be used for personal sets. i was thinking the global slot is only for global sets. so global sets could be holiday_automatic (default), year_round, halloween, christmas - sets that 7tv decided on.

people who wish to opt out of 7tv changing global emotes for holidays could choose year_round global set over holiday_automatic. or if someone wants to be crazy and always have christmas global emotes they could choose the christmas global set in their global slot

i'm thinking of the holiday_automatic thing like how the PSP used to do those swirly colored backgrounds. you could set a static color or you could leave it on a setting that'd automatically change color each month for you.

[signal girder]

I actually like that idea; to be able to switch between the global emote sets

probably won't be implemented

but it's definitely cool

I'm sure a surprisingly large number of people would opt to keep the standard globals instead of the holiday ones,

even if they make their own set for holiday channel emotes

sometimes you just don't want certain emotes changed

[worthy fjord]

this probably wont be implemented. if people want to theyll probably be able to do this kind of thing for themselves