Fuel Crates Disadvantage

[sour palm]

First of all, thanks @hollow pebble that you can now get the same amount of fuel with SILV2 as with Ethereum. However, as already discussed in detail in #1270921792655069286, Fuel Crates, which have a fixed dollar value of purchasing power, still don't seem to get the same amount of fuel. Since they represent a fixed dollar value, exchanging them should get you the same amount of fuel as buying them with Ethereum or SILV2. For example, a $400 crate should receive the same amount of fuel as a purchase of $400 worth of fuel with Ethereum or SILV2. A lot of people have prepared in advance with the assumption that this will be the case. Fuel crates already have the disadvantage that you can't choose the ratio in which you receive the 3 fuels. They should not have the additional disadvantage that they give significantly less fuel. At the current market conditions, a 400 dollar crate is only worth about 140 dollars. Many people are waiting for this to be corrected before they trade in their fuel crates obtained through holding land or purchase. The sooner this is adjusted the better.

[tight chasm]

Im glad to hear silv2 got fixed, its important we do the same with crates

[vapid pelican]

fuel crates were always advertised as being tradable at the top rail-guard. I'm not against changing that But it was said it would be so from the beginning.

[rare wave]

No
Was always meant to be Dollar value for whatever the fuel price is when you redeem

[vapid pelican]

that's not what I remember but ok.

[last compass]

yes

i cant find it written in the announcements, i think it was explained by johnny or someone else

[tight chasm]

Why would it intentionally be this way? People get rekt without knowing and now fuel crates are also the way for illuvium to reward community events, feels bad when people see their 15$ crates are worth half whether they sell or use it. Even worst, most wouldnt know and simply use them thinking they got 15$ worth

[rare wave]

maybe i remember wrong 😄
but as patate said, wouldn't make sense for them only being redeemable at top rail.

[sour palm]

I never saw an announcements stating that. But I also never heard of the bonus system. The top rail right now is just an imaginary number which has no connection to the actual price movements. If it would be at least connected somehow like 10% above average price or so I could see your point. But right now I find it strange that you basically get fuel equivalent of what number is chosen by the team with no relation to the acutal market price.

[vapid pelican]

I think it does make sense. It's the price they were given. Why should someone get more fuel now then if you claimed it in the launch?

[sour palm]

You also get more fuel now when you buy it with Ethereum compared to buying at launch

[vapid pelican]

yes welcome aboard on hating the bonus system. 🤣

[vapid pelican]

yes but did the fuel crates price increase? no... That says they shouldn't give you more fuel depending on when you claim the crates.

[sour palm]

Why would it increase if you devalue it? You also get more Ethereum/Fuel depending on when you buy. Why would it be different when claiming the crates?

[vapid pelican]

I'm confused now, do crates give a fixed $ value equivalent of fuel? Or they give a fixed amount of fuel units?

[sour palm]

Right now they give a fixed dollar value based on the top rail ("random number") but ignore current market conditions. So if you claim your 400 Dollar Crate now you get fuel equivalent to around 140 Dollar in Ethereum (because you get the "bonus" when purchasing with ETH)

[vapid pelican]

that dollar value is fixed because it gives a fixed fuel amount. I don't know what to tell you man. This was how it was presented to me.

[rare wave]

you might be right, looks like it's intended to be that way at least according to some old post from johnny.
might write an IIP/ICCP after dinner to change it to the price one buys fuel with eth.

[sour palm]

Why would it be that two things pegged to the same currency gives you different amounts. It is like 400 Dollar in EUR has a different value than 400 Dollar in Yen

[sour palm]

That would be great and I would greatly appreciate it!

[small viper]

Sorry but did they really fixed silv2 fuel exchange? Tried to swap just few min ago but still doesn't give bonus..

[sour palm]

I did not purchase with silv2 yet but I can see the bonus displayed in my preview

[small viper]

Yeah it does display it in the preview, However, I tried to swap twice but still doesn't give a bonus.

Oh when hovering on the info icon it shows that you can get bonus when purchasing ETH. sILV2 is not mentioned though. 😢

Really hope they allow bonus when purchasing sILV2

[tight chasm]

Ah crap, it really needs to change. Ill make an IIP following the post about it https://discord.com/channels/760344898200666112/1270921792655069286

[vapid pelican]

fuel crates were meant to give a boost in the beginning to compensate for IZ not releasing much prior to launch. I don't think it's fair now changing this mid way.

If I knew this would be so I wouldn't have claimed my fuel crates so early on.

we were told the value of the crates would be redeemed at the top rail-guard. And people, myself included made financial decisions based on that.

[sour palm]

I am sorry to strongly disagree about that fact. There was never an official announcement. A lot of people did financial decisions based on the fact that fuel crates display a fixed dollar value. People were buying fuel crates in advance to prepare for launch and save some dollars. Same as people buying SILV2. There are still people buying fuel crates thinking it is a good decision but they are actually loosing money. That should not happen. Seeing Johnnys message writing an IIP/ICCP seems to be a good idea.

[vapid pelican]

what do you call this from the man that was in charge of IZ?
#1275124210607591548 message

[vapid pelican]

ppl do all kinds of stuff based on bad/false information. That's very different from what I said. We knew it was so because it was said by an official source.

what you guys want is just for your own convenience.

sILV2 is one thing, and I agree it should get the same bonus as with ETH purchases. But the fuel crates nah.

[last compass]

well, we still have one more fuel crate airdrop.

[vapid pelican]

yes we definitely need that with all the lack of fuel supply we have going on

[last compass]

it doesnt work for me too

[timid rune]

I sold my fuel crate at half its value because I saw fuel was lower than half of top rail price

if I had known we'd have an ICP to change it into a fuel gift card I'd have saved it 😖

[rare wave]

why not?

[vapid pelican]

lol I just explained my reasoning before

#1275124210607591548 message

[rare wave]

fuel crates weren't just made for a pre launch goodie for landowners.
There is at least another airdrop of fuel crates planned (should have already happened), and something like fuel crates could be leaderboard/tournament prizes instead of or along with $/ILV/cosmetics.

I also redeemed most of them, but to me that's not a reason to not change a system.
if you write a dollar value on the nft, it should hold that $value and not be less.

[vapid pelican]

• "if you write a dollar value on the nft, it should hold that $value and not be less."
  In that regard I do agree. That's why I think it's messed up that they say one thing and do another. If the crates were redeemable at the top rail-guard then they would know how much fuel units they would give. Putting a $ value to is just begging to create confusion.

A fuel crate has X number of fuel units in it. Not a $ price tag.

[sour palm]

I agree on that point. If fuel crates would have X number of fuel units in it, there would not be a discussion. But putting a dollar value on it, it should hold its value. We (people being active in the discord and trying to improve the overall experience of Illuvium because we believe in the project) have probably all already claimed fuel crates, but moving forward it can still be adapted. As more fuel crate airdrops are planned, I think we all benefit from it in the long run.

[timid rune]

yeah the crates shouldn't have a price tag in the title

[vapid pelican]

IMO the proposal for this should be about removing the fuel crate's $ price tag and instead make them have a fixed number of fuel units that corresponds to their value when sold at the top rail-guard.

[timid rune]

thats how they work right now right? so it's just asking to remove the $ tag

[sour palm]

I don't think it's a good solution for the current fuel crates since they were released with a dollar value. You could argue that you should change that for the upcoming fuel crates. However, in this case, I don't see any advantage to tying them to the top rail. They could just contain X amount of fuel regardless. They don't have to be linked to the price at all. Neither to the top rail nor to the average market price

[vapid pelican]

I said for them to be tied to the top rail-guard cause that's what was sold to us. And that's their current value. We just need to translate that to the corresponding fuel units.

[sour palm]

Even if you tie it to the top rail, there would be fluctuations and no fixed amount of fuel per crate. I claimed a fuel crate when fuel was over 0.0088. If I would have claimed it now I would have received much more fuel. So why would you want to treat fuel crates diffrent from Ethereum?
Of course, if everyone was watching every channel in the Discord all day, everyone could have seen Johnny's post and maybe there wouldn't be any confusion. Currently, however, the fuel crates and their value are obviously perceived differently. The current fuel crates are limited and mostly owned by people who are deeply involved in the ecosystem or own land. I would therefore decide in their favor and not punish them. Changing it now to the same purchasing power as Ethereum doesn't hurt any of us, it only helps the core community. All future fuel crates could be airdropped with a fixed value of fuel so that there is no confusion due to the top rail or the “bonus system”

[vapid pelican]

do you not realize we have a supply problem? I don't want us dilluting even further the fuel supply with this...

[rare wave]

hmm... i feel $ value would work better than a specific amount of the fuels, if you give them out as leaderboard/tournament prices or for marketing in general.
Everybody who isn't in the ecosystem already would know the worth he could get.

[vapid pelican]

yeah I get your point but if they're playing the game do they really need to know the value? They'll just be spending the fuel no matter the $ price of that fuel...

a stage 3 run will always be 1350 crypton no matter the price

[sour palm]

This is a completely different topic. I know that since I also own land. But I would avoid discussing this in this thread as there are already enough other threads focussing on that topic

[vapid pelican]

you don't wanna discuss it but you're suggesting something that aggravates the problem...

[sour palm]

The fuel from the crates is negligible in relation to the whole supply and people can't even sell it.

[rare wave]

sure, but one not already having knowledge about the ecosystem don't know what to do with the number of fuel he gets. Is it much, is it less... no clue.
If you set a fuel value he knows he can get for example 1k$ worth of fuel

[vapid pelican]

I think I've said my piece, just let me know when you're submitting the IIP so I can go buy some cheap fuel crates 🤣

[sour palm]

Even though we disagree on some points, it was a solid discussion. Thank you for your honesty and opinion. I'll let you know 😉

[vapid pelican]

all good bro