IIP-XX-R Revenue distribution pre-fuel prod. and compensation for delay

[fallen ingot]

The Illuvium community has expressed apprehension regarding the fairness of the current distribution model for Fuel revenue during the Open Beta phase. Landholders, especially those actively engaged in gameplay, feel disadvantaged by the proposed flat distribution system, which needs to reflect their contribution or skill level. To address these concerns and uphold the original intention of rewarding active participation, this proposal seeks to modify the distribution mechanism to align with player engagement and skill.

Due to the adverse impact of this proposal on individuals who have invested in land plots to fund their Overworld and Arena activities, thereby hindering their anticipated profits, weekly fuel crates will be distributed. This measure serves a dual purpose: firstly, to provide compensation to affected parties, and secondly, to expedite the implementation of Zero going live on chain.

Proposal:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/e/2PACX-1vSorAYPuEx7YmD9Hkn_gGt3xBWhjnV4bLdhqv1YeuIAb7cFCpCvSDOyUstJC4tqq7gkHCvqOSDrEdHy/pub

[terse willow]

@fallen ingot

[rain solar]

Omg this doubling thing is savage 🤣 . But I quite like the hardcore approach to the problem.

[tall rose]

@fallen ingot good job. Well explained. Rather simple, feasible solution. Thanks for your dedication

[charred jetty]

All the language thus far points to Zero going live around OB or shortly after. The doubling prob won't be necessary but gives that extra lil nudge 👉 ✨

[tall rose]

I'd just add that not being able to mint skins/find bps etc. is also an incentive for fuel airdrops

[fallen ingot]

Well, i heared worst case Couples of weeks maybe 2 months delayed, so should be incentive to bring it live asap, but shouldn't get to bad, right? 🙃

[fallen ingot]

I actually tried to find an extra solution for missing time of finding bp's in season 1 but i couldn't think of an appropriate solution yet, without going overboard.

[rain solar]

I mean normally I'd agree. But this isn't a situation where they can just magically speed up development. The time to pressure them was 6 months ago 🤣 . No amount of incentive would probably have any considerable impact now I don't think, but maybe it doesn't hurt to try

[visual root]

airdropping blueprints probably wouldn't be a horrible thing. You have to harvest all the resources for them to mint the skins so more reason to play and trade. Maybe even just 1 random one per plot per month?

[tame spruce]

In your example, assuming 4 weeks = 1 month, shouldn't month 3 sales reward delayed ETH from month 1?

The 1% calculation is a simple example, but this assumes that 100% of fuel is generated and sold by players at the 1:19 ratio in month 3 and the DAO isn't producing and selling any extra fuel at the upper rail.

I'm voting down on this for reasons I've already expressed:

1. I prefer IIP-49's distribution method using a set or periodically adjusted % added to each sale because it's clear-cut and understandable for sellers. It also very evenly distibutes the delayed rev over a longer time window.

2. Kieran has something in mind for airdropped fuel and also bonus airdrop points already. Adding more fuel drops unnecessarily takes away from the ecosystem to some extent. Here I would much rather see ILZ sped up for a set amount of time upon launch to help us catch up without impacting the economy. #1227003710840766484 message

I do think the 4-6 week hold is really important and should be added to IIP-49!

Thanks for putting this together and keeping the conversation going

[brittle heath]

I think it’s aimed to people wanting to use their own fuel even though spoon put it that way. I actually agree there isn’t much we can do to speed it up having very few weeks left

[rain solar]

Yeah its got 2 major components. The people wanting to use their fuel thing is great 🙂

[brittle heath]

I think the only thing it does not addressed is the fact that is probably delayed. But still is kinda addressed indirectly. And the airdrops would be like compensation also.

If I could give it 10 thumbs up I would. This encloses a lot of landholders concerns. If we could squeeze in the 4 or more no land sale period, would be great. But I still want to see more feedback from community

[brittle heath]

I’m fine with either way. I see the spoon way more fair to players. I also like the speed ups but I can’t tell right now if it would be fair evenly to all tiers. My first guess is the same for everyone

[steep ermine]

One possible way to incentivize playing is to have the fuel crates not be airdropped but instead have to be claimed. And claimed within a certain time period. This would likely lead to more dev time. So that’s annoying. But limiting the total airdrops that way may be worth it. 🤷

[charred jetty]

That’s a great idea

[tall rose]

hmm and maybe only being able to claim them reaching say level 100 in the plot, or any other achievement

that would be more fair for people who spent more in higher tier lands aswell

[visual root]

Even if fuel crate claiming wasn’t based on gameplay but still must be claimed in a certain amount of time, at least the airdrop would only go to active landholders.

[gilded night]

We hope that the team can get it done on time, but this potential delay is only made public recently.
@vast vale when was the decision to redo IZ P2E client made?

@fallen ingot i see the proposal is a tweak of iip-49

1. Can we not use the word "bonus"? it is landowners entitlement, and this is how to claim it
2. what is the calculation of claim? I saw sell fuel for $15k and claim $25k?

3. Do we agree that Fuel Crate airdrop is taking away revdis from stakers?

[fallen ingot]

Or we argue in 6 months about it when it possibly Looks the Same to put some pressure on.
The Same thing with staking Land for some benefits. Would probably have been a sweet idea back then in June 2022 but IZ was just a Couples months away so everybody thought it doesn't Make Sense because it's just arround the corner.

[fallen ingot]

Thought about that too... Not Fan of random drops, Like some get t1s1 bp and other get t5s3 bp.
If you give everyone the same you see the same thing happening with Alpha blueprints, value goes down asymptotic to 0

[fallen ingot]

1. If you artificially wana give low Tier more than they would have, thats a valid opinion.

2. Again, you seem to Like pushing low Tiers, and again i get that. But something that ist the Same value for everyone would be preferable.

[fallen ingot]

Smart, maybe they even developing already a claim function. Would probably Cut airdrops by a considerable amount and also in future airdrops reward those that are actively participating

[fallen ingot]

1. I can edit that for sure.
2. Maybe read it again
3. We can... Can Change it to cold Hard ilv out of treasury if you Like, then it doesn't take away from stakers

[gilded night]

Dr spoon trying to help, theres no need to be sassy

[fallen ingot]

Wasn't my Intention to be sassy

[gilded night]

can u explain this part? using the fuel sales % in month 3 to the pool? Doesnt that make the pool depleted in month 3?

[safe echo]

Tbh, I dont actually see how this distribution will push the team to release P2E IZ sooner. While this benefits the early adopters and get their plots developed as top priority, it would be at the cost of all the other landowners fighting for the same pool.

If the goal is to get labs to push out P2E, I dont think this is the right direction. If this is a way to deplete the pool faster, yes, this is one way to achieve it. Though not sure if its the best way. Im happy to be proven wrong 🙂

[fallen ingot]

the player sold in month 3 15K worth of fuel (1% of month 3 IZ-Share)
in month 1 there was 2.5m IZ-share, 1% of that is the 25K he receives additionally

[gilded night]

i see, so the claim duration is as long as the delay plus 4 weeks grace period

[fallen ingot]

yes

should be

[gilded night]

thats sounds much better than iip-49 well done

[fallen ingot]

@boreal hare is the genius of that system

[gilded night]

idk if 4-6 weeks grace period is fair, but i think you know better than me

[fallen ingot]

the distribution method hasn't an effect on pushing the team, that's what the multiplier is thought of.
Pushing might be a strong word for it, more of ensure IZ is top priority to get out.

It's not about faster or slower depleting the pool, it is about to simulate the fuel share one landlord gets as close as possible as if iz would have launched 4 weeks prior to arena and overworld.
Any artificially shorten or lengthen of the pool payout phase is either benefiting high tiers or low tiers.

[fallen ingot]

was planned to get IZ 4-6 weeks live prior to arena and ow... it's just that grace period.
but this for sure could be changed if there are reasons for it

[gilded night]

Yes, i would prefer the compensation comes for treasury or even team's token rather than revdis

[fallen ingot]

i thought about that too.
Imo the advantage with fuel crates airdrop is:

• Those who wanted to pay ow runs don't need to swap until they get fuel out of ilv
• It is fuel, so used in the ecosystem on some way
• There is a little "fuel production" ongoing, since people could sell those crates (some data for devs for balancing fuel)

[safe echo]

How though? Theyre not penalized. Its actually the players who are affected. I mean, im sure they will push it out asap. I dont doubt that. I just feel theres a disconnect with the goal and the means to achieve it. Anyway, its not a major item.

Personally, I like to time-gate the pool in a sense that it ensures it gets depleted within 4-6 months. This allows land to be developed and increase its fuel output. What I like though is an increase in percentage per month. Its a good incentive to get your land optimized asap so that on the later months you get bigger cut of the pool with a higher optimized plot.

[fallen ingot]

well high tier are faster on a level of selling fuel, right?
So if you say lets keep the revenue small until low tier catched up and increase then the revenue share, low tier would get a bigger chunk, because they wouldn't have had spare fuel at all in the beginning to sell.
If you shorten the period and say lets deplete the whole pool in the first 2 weeks, low tier probably get almost nothing of a share.
(speed up push and builder buys obviously not calculated in)

[gilded night]

fuel has that advantage, its just its very costly to revdis with the 2x multiplier, if we the delay is 3 months then GG

[fallen ingot]

idk about pricing at all.
but if they make the game accessible for everyone i guess in month 3 we are arround 700K.... don't think thats gg lvl.
but obviously my assumption could be wrong and a s1 run would cost way more than 1$

[tame spruce]

I don't think you need to make accusations of me trying to push revenue to low tiers!

1. The IIP-49 methodology can be used to distribute revenue over any timeframe desired, simply by adjusting the %. A whole new system isn't needed.

2. Speeding up time across all plots in now way benefits lower tiers more than higher tiers. It goes back to how quickly the funds are distributed, which again can easily be adjusted in IIP-49.

[tame spruce]

What if some fuel is still being sold at the top rail in month 3 and generated by the DAO?

That example just doesn't work.

You need to change the example so that month 3 (in an example) has 50% of the fuel sold from the DAO at the upper rail. Then add a scaling factor so that a person who sold 1% of the total fuel will actually need to get 2% of the month 1 pool.

Otherwise half the pool is still sitting there

[fallen ingot]

you are right, appologies

1. why you want to manipulate the timeframe artificially? Shouldn't the held back revenue being paid out as soon as possible to landowners and shouldn't the way to do it be the closest it can get to as if IZ wasn't delayed?

2. It does, the time needed to build up, was the biggest driver to pull down the max fuel output ratio from 36:1 to 10:1 (T4:T1), now if in worst case IZ would be delayed so every plot would be maxed out immediately, you completely delete the build up time advantage of high tiers.

[fallen ingot]

work as usual, paid out weekly based on weekly fuelsales.

would be wrong imo to take that into consideration if it comes to the held back revenue.

[boreal hare]

The payout for the top rail is based off the same percentage of fuel that the Month 3 example is showing so there is no need to include it in the calculation. In the example in Month 3 that player would have recieved 1% of all the top rail 5% land owner cut so the numbers would be the same. It's the reason I used overall fuel sales because it took this in mind. So in Month 3 that land owner would get another 1% payment of the top rail sales (of the 5% land owner cut) + $40k (the 15 sold + 25 from Month 1 portion). Just remember once fuel is sold by the players in order to receive the top rail profits the demand has to eat thru 20x the player supply to receive this payment. We should all be happy if that's the case

[vast vale]

The alpha was always intended to be rebuilt since day one mentioned publicly multiple times through the years.

The decision to focus effort on f2p was discussed by council it is in their notes I believe.

But as per my status breakdown posted in zero channel this has next to no impact on land connected timeline.

[tame spruce]

Yep, sorry you're right

[vast vale]

---

Also I saw some people here mentioning putting pressure on the team. Please say 'council' or 'admins'. The team are employees working way more hours than they should be and anyone who suggests they are doing anything but working hard will be added to my ignore list permanently.

[tame spruce]

1. So you agree it's a question of time frame and not methodology?

2. Time speed-up would not benefit one tier over another unless it's due to how delayed revenue is distributed. A percentage from the pool would be absolutely equal. If everything goes 2x speed for the first month for example, high tiers may have only half as much time maxed out before low tiers, but during that time they are also profiting 2x

[fallen ingot]

1. Thats not an either or question. With the methodology you control the timeframe

2. So you would say if we don't have to build up the Base and get a maxed out plot, it's the same ratio paid out between high and low Tier as if you would have to Start with an empty plot on normal Speed?

[tame spruce]

1. Changing the % in Kieran's proposal, as has been discussed extensively, would also change the time frame

2. No, that makes no sense?

[fallen ingot]

Appologies for that, i didn't thought about the exact terminology, thought it's obvious talking about people in Charge, like those you mentioned.

[fallen ingot]

1. Absolutely thats intended

2. Was trying to give an extrem example

[tame spruce]

In what scenario do ILZ players not build up their plot?

Well having a build up period is critical to the game and also allows higher tiers to max out more quickly, giving them that advantage

[fallen ingot]

😄 so what are we really arguing about?
With speedup you lower that advantage, no?

[tame spruce]

No, I explained that

[vast vale]

All good, just read poorly, at least to me, who sees these guys pushing themselves to the limit.

[fallen ingot]

Heading to bed, but gona Check out proposal tomorrow and gona change it

[fickle breach]

I haven’t read everything yet, but I saw Kain post recently about how it’s not an airdrop if you have to claim it and I tend to agree with him. Airdrops should be airdropped.