Allow Shit-talking and Banter in the Discord

[rapid bough]

Pretty sure that people can get a timeout right now just for saying "x person sucks" or "you're trash" and similar such gamer chiding banter which in many gamer communities is considered totally normal etiquette

I think the Illuvium Discord is over moderated in some areas currently and this is not conducive to gamer banter, (which is especially an issue as we aproach game launch) this becomes most glaringly obvious when we have founders who like a bit of playful banter and at times have displayed a ruckus nature that we all know and love as its down to earth and real and have themselves bantered in the discord in ways that will currently get someone temporarily server muted or potentially banned

the founder thing was just meant to be an example, i dont think theyve done anything wrong in this regard I just feel like average users of the discord should also be able to banter and shit-talk in a similar fashion

idk, maybe im the only one feeling this way in which case whatever just ignore my rant but who knows maybe im not the only one lol

[orchid prairie]

👀

[lavish plinth]

Why toxic behavior is bad in gaming communities?

Toxic behavior is detrimental in gaming communities for several reasons:

Negative Impact on Players' Mental Health: Toxic behavior, such as harassment, insults, and bullying, can have a severe impact on the mental health of individuals. It can lead to feelings of frustration, anger, anxiety, and even depression, making the gaming experience unpleasant and potentially harmful.

Deterioration of Community Atmosphere: Toxic behavior creates a hostile and unwelcoming atmosphere within gaming communities. This atmosphere can drive away new players and make existing members feel uncomfortable, ultimately diminishing the overall quality of the community.

Reduced Player Engagement: When players encounter toxic behavior, they are less likely to engage in social interactions within the game or community. This can hinder the development of friendships and cooperative gameplay, which are essential aspects of many multiplayer games.

Impaired Learning and Skill Development: In order to improve at a game, players often need constructive feedback and the opportunity to learn from their mistakes. Toxic behavior, such as berating others for their performance, can hinder this learning process and prevent players from getting better.

Loss of Potential Talent: Toxicity can drive away talented and skilled players who might otherwise contribute positively to the community. When talented players leave, the overall skill level of the community may decline.

Damage to Reputation: Toxic gaming communities can develop a negative reputation in the broader gaming industry and among potential players. This can deter new players from joining, leading to a decline in community size and activity.

Potential Legal and Regulatory Consequences: Some forms of toxic behavior, such as harassment or hate speech, can have legal and regulatory consequences. Game developers and platform operators may take action against toxic players to ensure a safe and inclusive environment, which can result in bans and suspensions.

Erosion of Sportsmanship and Fair Play: Toxic behavior goes against the principles of sportsmanship and fair play, which are essential in competitive gaming. Encouraging positive behavior helps maintain the integrity of competitive gaming and e-sports.

Stifling Creativity and Diversity: A toxic environment can discourage creative expression and diversity within gaming communities. Players may feel pressured to conform to toxic norms or avoid expressing themselves authentically.

Lost Opportunities for Collaboration: Collaboration among players, content creators, and developers can lead to exciting new features, mods, and community-driven improvements. Toxicity can hinder these collaborations, limiting the potential for innovation and growth.

Overall, toxic behavior is detrimental to gaming communities because it undermines the enjoyment, growth, and inclusivity of the gaming experience. Many gaming communities and platforms are actively working to combat toxicity through reporting systems, moderation, and community guidelines to create a more positive and welcoming environment for all players.

via ChatGPT

[rapid bough]

Why Trash-Talking and Banter aren’t always negative and in fact have positives in gaming communities

"Shit-talking" in gaming refers to the act of engaging in trash talk or making derogatory comments towards opponents during a game. While some players may find it entertaining or part of the competitive atmosphere, it's important to note that the perceived benefits or drawbacks of shit-talking can vary widely among individuals and gaming communities. Here are a few reasons why some people might consider it a "good thing" in gaming:

Competitive Edge: For some players, trash talk can be a way to psych out opponents and gain a psychological advantage. If you can get into the head of your opponent and disrupt their focus, it might give you an edge in the game.

Entertainment and Social Interaction: In some gaming communities, trash talk is seen as a form of entertainment and a way to engage in social interaction. It can add a layer of excitement to the game and create memorable moments for players.

Camaraderie among Friends: When friends engage in friendly banter or trash talk during a game, it can strengthen their camaraderie. It's important to recognize the context and ensure that it remains light-hearted and consensual.

Expression of Confidence: Some players use trash talk as a way to express confidence in their abilities. It can be a form of self-assurance and a means to demonstrate dominance in a competitive setting.

However, it's crucial to emphasize that trash talk can easily cross the line and become toxic. Excessive or malicious trash talk can contribute to a negative gaming environment, lead to conflicts, and create a hostile atmosphere. It's essential for players to be mindful of the impact their words can have on others and to prioritize sportsmanship and respect in gaming communities.

Conclusion
Ultimately, the acceptability of trash talk in gaming varies from person to person and community to community. What may be perceived as harmless banter by one player might be offensive to another. As with any form of communication, it's important to be aware of the context, be respectful of others, and ensure that the overall gaming experience remains enjoyable for everyone involved.

Via ChatGPT

[thin locust]

There is a place and time for banter; friendly banter between friends is great fun. But this suggestion opens the door for 'unfriendly banter', which is just straight-up bullying people from the community. I feel like the Discord is under-moderated, and I have heard a lot of community members voicing the same feeling.

Friendly banter is not being moderated at the moment. The 'victim' would have to report you, and this will not happen if the victim is your mate. If it isn't your mate, you should treat them with respect and kindness. Calling people you don't know well 'trash' or telling them 'you suck' should never be allowed in any community. Feels weird to type this out as I feel like this is something we all learned when we were children.. 😅

[lavish plinth]

For some player, for friends, some players..... its only a hand full here in the discord that trash talkes and being toxic.

[thin locust]

I just saw someone suggesting a great solution for this: create a guild that allows this kind of behavior and invite all the like-minded community members there.

With the Phantom Guild, we did something similar, on the other side of the spectrum. We created it as a positive, kind environment, away from the toxic individuals in the Illuvium Discord.

[robust kelp]

I don’t think Illuviums main discord is the place for trash talk. Friendly banter between friends or people you know is one thing but open trash talk to is not a good thing in my opinion. I want to feel good about playing games not crappy. I’m not good at games but I enjoy them. I know I’m trash I don’t need to be told.
If people want an outlet for their trash please take it to a guild that is built with this purpose in mind.
(Not written with chat gpt)

[rapid bough]

Fair enough, if you want to have fun w friends trash talking do it other discords, i guess thats why i only hang out in private discord w friends from the community rather than the actual one

I guess the point if this feedback was wouldnt it be cool if we didnt have to all be in different private discords but maybe thats just the way it is 🤷‍♀️

[robust kelp]

As Illuvium grows this discord will have to evolve into a hub for a lot of new players. I think it will become very noisy with lots of newby questions. Many of us oldies will find or create spaces to suit our play style and social needs. I don’t think it’s a bad thing.

[rapid bough]

Very fair

[brazen tusk]

I get your point. Among friends it can all be said in jest and for some people it really improves the fun of it all. However, I am concerned for people who are new or are trying to learn the game; they come on, see the trash talk (or worse someone tells them they are trash) and feel they can't ask the questions they need to ask to improve at the game. Then they just leave. I think Illuvium Discord as a whole needs to be welcoming. Personally, I wouldn't be against a channel dedicated to a more trash talk environment with an enter at your own risk type post at the top. It would leave Arena free to be used for people asking questions or setting up matches. That said, I would definitely understand if Illuvium didn't want to do it because an absolutely anything goes might be too much, yet where do you draw the Mod line? It would be a bit of a nightmare.

On the one side I like that Guilds are up and people are able to hang out and chat and have a more specific atmosphere. Like, for you trash talk is fun. For me, I wouldn't want to be trash talked. I have a thick skin about most things in life but I suck at arena and I don't need other people telling me that. I'm liking being part of Phantom because when I play and suck I have people who are telling me how to be better not telling me I am trash.😂 But yeah, honestly, Guilds also make me a little sad as people are moving off and I for one miss a lot of the people that used to hang out here often but are now in private discord groups.

[vestal coyote]

Sorry but this one gets a big 👎from me!

I have been around the Toxicity in alot of other games and hard to believe but contributed to it at times (sorry to anyone that came across me in Warzone lol)

The discord does not need this type of behavior or banter - take it elsewhere and keep the discord clean and family friendly. I really liked @lavish plinth summary from the article (thanks char GPT)

However, I have seen other discord have "grungy" and "hidden" sections where the rules are more relaxed and allow for NSFW and more trash-talking to occur, if somehow the discord could allow that, I would be okay with it. It just should be more tucked away and not forward facing for new community members coming in

[plain cloak]

i agree. Discord is under-moderated for some people who just seem to be allowed everything that others don't but that's not the topic here 🙂

[hidden meadow]

lol good luck with this in our community. Not a lot of gamers here and most are a bit sensitive after losing so much money buying ILV at the top

[regal urchin]

I think at times, yes, there is some over muting.
Yet due the nature of people not really knowing each other it can be hard to understand where people are coming from, often things are misunderstood yet also some things are deliberate.
My thoughts have changed a lot around this, yet it still remains a fact of human nature, that negative banter, no matter how friendly, can quickly snowball into an avalanche.

Like others have said, it's definitely context based.

I also feel there are numerous cultural differences, it just makes sense to keep it a minimum.
Maybe there could be VCs or Chat areas that are specifically for this.
Like they say, warning no filters,or something like that.
I also have fun bantering. I don't see how it's constructive on a large scale.

[regal urchin]

I'm a gamer and I like banter, yet it's too hard to control the flow of it in this context.

I do believe however you have been muted at times when a conversation would have been reaped better results for everyone.

[hidden meadow]

Yah the mutes for every little thing is way too much
There's a difference between being a toxic asshole and just having a different opinion on things or people than others (ive been guilty of both in the past)

[regal urchin]

On the other hand, it could be said why don't people come to the discord here, learn how to have fun and comradery without using trash talk.

I think we are just used to that being the standard and have lost our ability to do otherwise.

I'm double explaining now as I mentioned in another post. Yet maybe illuvium could have separate channels, for those who wish to be in the discord and trash talk.

[regal urchin]

Agreed.

[orchid prairie]

1. We do have #✍〕rules
2. We are listed on Epic store
3. We have VCs investment
4. We need web2 adoption
5. Seriously, we are not memecoin project

ILV discord is the official communication channel for gamers and investors. The team is doing a great job at moderation and continue to improve.

I was banned once, I know first hand how difficult it is to get muted or banned. The discord is much more lenient than other official discords. I should know I have been in 50+ nft project discords. The institutional discords dont even allow trolling at the slightest.

[fickle geyser]

And look how the redemption arc ended

[orchid prairie]

[robust kelp]

Has it ended…. Dun dun da.. to be continued….

[fickle geyser]

https://tenor.com/view/time-will-tell-this-feels-like-one-of-those-time-will-tell-deals-gif-13223772

[robust kelp]

Season 2 cliff hanger.

[robust kelp]

Really good bullet points. Puts things into clear perspective. 🫡

[orchid prairie]

[rapid bough]

Family friendly for a financialised game for adults seems a bit much to me personally, but i do get how the line between mild-shit talking and straight bullying is a tough line to draw and a much easier line to draw is no shit talking at all, its defo easier to define and to moderate

I agree there shouldnt be NSFW content on here, i thought that went without saying and I'm defo not advocating for that lol

[sleek bolt]

This is a fun topic. Honestly I just think the lines get super blurry which is an issue we have dealt with a lot in the past. I rather over moderate and leave less subjectivity, simply because anyone who wants to have extra banter can do so in other communities that allow it

[rapid bough]

Fair

[jovial zealot]

The report Synix posted an image of is extremely worthwhile to read through in its' entirety for anyone interested in this subject.

Everyone's got an opinion on how they like to play, but data >>> feelings.