IIP-XX - Exclusive Alpha Season Regional Ranger & Moz4rt Skins

[blazing moon]

Sponsor:
@brazen merlin

Full Proposal:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Z-xEDhHtjvZ-XFas-eDgy3APC8RBeBrzrczf6197W4E/edit?usp=sharing

Simple Summary:

Exclusive “Regional Alpha Skins” will be granted to all Landowners who mint a minimum of (1) Blueprint per Land during the Alpha Season’s specified minting period in Illuvium Zero (“ILV-Z”). These “Regional Alpha Skins” will include (1) Moz4rt Skin and (1) Ranger Skin per qualifying plot of land. The distribution of these skins will be an automated process, ensuring that minters receive them upon minting completion (*or a redemption coin, good for future claiming)

[pulsar monolith]

Voting with a 👎 based on the pressure such a change places upon the Art Team coupled with the thinking that more skins don't always = better, e.g. World of Warcraft has an absurd amount of in-game cosmetics to the point that they're now meaningless.

Having a small number of skins that mean something is important to me.

[half fractal]

i don't want yo be rude and sorry if its Hurt but i think The way you manage your investors is the worst I have ever seen in any project.
2021 il0 and Ob delay = nothing, silv2 drama =nothing,
Il0 sale and delay = nothing,
ilv staking bug =one year lock and nothing.
But if you spent ton of money on illuvatars = exclusive rewards. Great 👌

[pulsar monolith]

I respect the opinion, and to be clear I'm not the decision maker here - the DAO is.

When I buy, I buy with the knowledge that X Product is In Development.

While I understand the sentiment, you may find that giving players freebies is a short-term positive but a long-term negative.

Illuvium Beyond is an evergreen product that will continue to be developed and improved on, completing collections to unlock in-game utility is a part of the game.

Creating assets to make people feel good because of delays isn't a strong starting point when making game design / reward decisions.

It only devalues the in-game assets we have planned and further delays development.

[boreal vessel]

I like that the skin is completely unique to the region and separate from illuvials.
I see this being a nice thank you.
I like that you came up with a
redemption option.
Some questions
Is this a one time only?
Are the people who have played other people's lands taken into consideration? Does it matter?
I'm also wondering what the team have going behind the scenes. Johnny has mentioned a few times about working on land holders being rewarded.

[brazen merlin]

Hi Teloolah. Yes it’s a one time thing. If people have lent out their lands it will be up to land owners and their tenants to negotiate.

[west shoal]

finally a little reward for the owners !

skin rewards that come from the land ✅

[glad palm]

While I'm all for awarding players who help test out the game and find bugs, One set per plot might be a little excessive. Many players have multiple plots and getting 5+ or 10+ of the same skin doesn't really make it feel exclusive, at least not compared to the "Buy X disks" skins from beyond.
One per account would probably be more suitable, but then you have the issue with those who are lending lands probably not being able to get them.
So I'm unsure on this one.

[west shoal]

make goals more difficult ,unlock all blueprints ,reach level 1000 of the land ,?

a minority will succeed

[blazing moon]

It was left at the minimal amount to entice others to join in the fun - perhaps bumping it up to 5 BPs might be a better threshold to consider (1/3rd of all required) 🤔

The leveling system is a bit more difficult since you can easily "power level" without really advancing your land (hundreds of converters running daily)

Essentially looking for a 100% completion reward (15 / 15 BPs collected)?

[blazing moon]

Because BPs would break the flow of the gameplay for the lands, this is why Skins were considered

They will limit the supply as new skins.

Ex: if they were BPs, this would allow an endless amount to be minted/fabricated after gamelaunch

[boreal vessel]

It makes sense. I'm still a bit on the fence. Maybe it's the amount.
Yet with the idea of a redemption token, I can see it could be pushed to a date the team don't have a lot on.
I'm still a little hesitant for extra stuff so close to launch.

[blazing moon]

@glad palm great points - thank you!

Most people have multiple plots (20k lands - 8,035k holders per illuvidex marketplace)

It might not feel exclusive, but these are set # of skins 20k total for all plots vs. The "Atlas Armor" blueprint that will have up to 20k editions also, especially after game launch. If each person mints 5 skins, your supply is now 100k.

Players might have multiple lands*, but do they have one in each region? If not, they have the option to trade on the secondary to complete the set. I know the number isn't exact but that means there are only approx. 2850 of each skin (20k plots/7 regions) - only few will have 1 per region

As for the land lending - I am also a "scholar" for 18 total lands. This would need to be negotiated with the "land manager" on how they want to manage this - most splits seem to be 60/40 or 50/50 for alpha season and the fair way to look at this is to add this into the split (again that's between all relative parties and agreements between themselves to figure out)

[tropic lance]

This looks awesome! A little extra Thank You gifts for those hardcore early adopters.

[blazing moon]

That is why the tradable redemption coins would help - this would be an NFT that is tradable on the secondary market for speculators and would reduce the time needed from the art team pre-launch

We also want to be sure all Illuvial skins are completed first as a priority for set 1 and then ensure these skins are unique from them afterwards

Priority = Game Launch first, Skins mentioned here second

[boreal vessel]

It might even be that is too much work. New nfts, new contracts. I like the idea yet I'm not sure.
Plus I know it has been noted in the iz channel that landholders/testers are being acknowledged.

[glad palm]

I think I would rather see a single Alpha skin over 7 regional ones.
The advantages of that would be far less work for the art team. And it would be a much more distinct look directly associable with an Alpha tester.
Havin 7 different ones feels like it would just be confusing when you show it off.
I can see discussions like "Hang on, this is also an ILZ alpha skin?" rather than the desirable "Wow, nice suit" reaction.

[blazing moon]

I have seen this as well - so perhaps a Team member can share some light on thst in this Thread

No need to overlap efforts 👌

[boreal vessel]

I like where you headed with this.

[blazing moon]

Noted - that would reduce the overall time to develop as well - 1 Master Alpha Skin

The idea behind the regional skins were to show off the nature/plants in the region through the armors.

My opinion on it, it like repping your favorite region

[blazing moon]

Minimal added skins is prefered by the Team as well - to be honest, the original idea started at 28 skins, up to 56 and then settled on 14 😀

[glad palm]

I do like the sound of that idea.
But I think that could be more suitable as an in-game goal to achieve once the game is launched, potentially linked to the Podarium/Morphopod building and mechanics. Depending how the functionality of that will be.

[celest geyser]

I need to think more about out but just hot take, I think this is worth considering and there are fun ways to loop in marketing around it.

I’d like to know what percentage of land plots are being played right now, and of that subset what percentage has minted 1 blueprint or more so far.

[blazing moon]

Added to the list for additional questions to the Team

[brazen merlin]

Thanks for bringing this up. It’s a great question.

[young compass]

Most of them

[young compass]

As long as we can delay the art teams need to create the skins for as long as possible and easily create a coin in its place I think its not a terrible idea. But I don't think it solves the issue we are faced with really.

[green vapor]

Voting 👎 because the team doesn’t need any further distractions until we go live with the full product suite.

If this is a popular idea I would like it to go into an ideas backlog and be assigned a priority, to be analysed once the team has more bandwidth.

[pulsar monolith]

Agree, I like the idea of region inspired skins as a thought. Although I'd prefer a gamified way of obtaining them.

[brazen merlin]

I agree it needs to be put on hold till the team is able to comfortably find the time without causing any interference with open beta. This is why we suggested a redemption coin in its place for now. But I appreciate your input as it is an important point to consider.

[brazen merlin]

Thanks for you constructive criticism. I appreciate that this puts more pressure potentially on the team.

[green vapor]

I’d hate to see a great idea get voted down because of bandwidth and timing, it wouldn’t take long to knock up a cheeky ideas backlog in excel and manage it on behalf of the team, however I’m fairly sure there is already a backlog in one of the Jira boards.

[brazen merlin]

If the team want to comment and have some revision to this iip I’m all ears. ❤️

[proper horizon]

Source?

[young compass]

My knowledge is a little outdated but Kieran has shared some of the stats internally many weeks ago. I will bring it to marketing subcouncil to better make this data transparent

[proper horizon]

Wow, that surprises me, but in a very good way! Great to hear really.

[young compass]

As far as how many playing I cant remember how much exactly. But those that were playing were playing the game consistently. x minutes every single day. And it was a high number of players

[proper horizon]

As a land holder since the DA and someone who's provided a significant amount of feedback on ILZ, sure I'd love to get some exclusive rewards like the big Beyond players do. Land holders feel a bit neglected at the moment, but our time will come!

These skins sound awesome too, but I just don't think there's a whole lot of benefit to doing this vs using the skins in a more unique way (no... NOT for Beyond players! 🙃).

If they decide to do some type of rewards simple works. ILV, fuel, d1sks....(hey Beyond got skins!)

[blazing moon]

Appreciate the feedback! Thank you

When you say this - mind elaborating?

vs using the skins in a more unique wat (no... NOT for Beyond players!

[proper horizon]

Sure, was just thinking ability to earn or discover them more tightly integrated into the game design rather than an airdrop (future, down the line feature as time/priority allows, not day 1).

[blazing moon]

Interesting idea for sure!

The idea for this proposal is for Alpha Season specifically - which is under a time crunch for sure (thus the ideanfor the placeholder redemption NFTs)

There could always be the idea to incorporate later after OB Launch - there will be people interested in representing their favorite region

For the people that 👎(if you see this, as I do not want to tag each of you) - I have spoken with some of you privately, but would love to hear other feedback why you would not like this to proceed if it has not yet been shared in the thread by someone else.

Appreciate everyone being so active

[proper horizon]

The placeholder tokens are a nice idea if this does go through, to minimize timeline disruptions. I will not be voting for or against this proposed idea, as I'm rather indifferent here.

It would be interesting to get the numbers on how many lands would actually qualify for this reward as of today. If most lands would qualify already, seems both the value to the project and of the individual rewards would be pretty watered down.

[leaden horizon]

I see what Nick is saying about devaluing skins and i ageee with the sentiment but I did vote yes as I would like to see more happening with land. That said, I disagree that it should be for people who mint one BP. I think it should be harder to get. Need to mint all 15. Or if they want us to keep testing now most have BPs done give us a new goal that you need all 15 BPs & ______ to get it. I do realize the team is busy and a placeholder NFT would definitely work.

[celest geyser]

I think this is a reasonable take. It will be easier to make a decision regarding the devaluation of skins if we know how many lands are actively managed. I like the idea of making it harder to get.

[mortal grail]

Do we have an estimate on how much time/effort would be needed from the team to implement something like this even just a placeholder token? I agree very much with what Nick said and also would prefer regional skins be attained in game through achievements. A single alpha land skin that is harder to obtain for the most active land owners would be better imo. I like this idea/concept, but I'd much rather see 100% of focus and effort put towards PvP and launch this year

[celest geyser]

I’d also want to know if the art team that would be tasked with this is integral in shipping pvp / open beta.

[brazen merlin]

The only thing that needs to be implemented pre launch is the place holder coins nfts. All art ect can be done after open beta.

[celest geyser]

even more reasonable then

[brazen merlin]

The reason I would like it to be just one bp achievement is so that people who are slow or who haven’t played still have time to get one. It feels more fair give the tight time frame till minting window. Also people who have been on the fence about buying land may jump in.

[blazing moon]

Adding to this - we all knew the goal "obtain 15 BPs", however since this reward is being introduced so late in the game, need to have a fair opportunity for anyone new ...

[brazen merlin]

This was always the plan. Minimal work for the team now. When the team is freed up the they can work on it. The plant art is already done for each region.

I sincerely wish to thank everyone who participated in this vote and who have given feedback. If you have any more comments please continue to make them. Our Dao is only as strong as the participants in these forums. Thanks all of you. 🫶🏻

[celest geyser]

Maybe make it 5 as a middle ground. 1 feels too easy, but 5 seems reasonable for anyone who intends to do it. Open to either though.

Looks like we’ve got 25 here now though.

[brazen merlin]

If we made it five or any arbitrary number more than one I believe it adds layers of complexity in sorting out who made the cut and who didn’t. One is simple. You either are minting during window or you are not.

[celest geyser]

Fair. If it's a technical barrier then 1 is fine. Also leads back to my desire to get this info: #1146665567206506537 message

[brazen merlin]

We will make a list of question and seek answers before revising and submitting the final iip to go to sub councils

If anyone is interested in what @iron flint has to say to say about alpha blueprints not being exclusive or about the dev team work load he has just answered these two things in zero chat.

[brazen merlin]

If anyone had direct questions for @tidal notch he has kindly offered to address them here.

[proper horizon]

It's a good point you raise that current BP rewards will not even be exclusive to the alpha players, so I get what you're trying to achieve here.

Is @iron flint's other comment at the bottom there of council members looking to make things a little more rewarding related to this idea or something else that's still in the works?

[wet perch]

As a CSC, non-IMC, member I view it as my responsibility to represent the community and to aid in getting their ideas in front of the proper sub-council and IMC. My interpretation of a CSC member is to never be a blocker unless a proposal does not align with the greater community sentiment or has severe flaws.

While I always strive to share my true opinion in #📯〕council-chambers regardless of my vote, several community members as of late have asked me to share my opinions earlier in the proposal process.

Since this proposal has hit the required community votes to go to a council vote, and there are no severe flaws I would be passing this proposal at the community council level.

However, as a community member, I vote no on this proposal.

The first question that came to my mind when I read this proposal was "why?" Why are you proposing this, what is the added value or the reasoning behind it?

One person I talked to said : "To "reward" land owners that participated in the Alpha Season." ... "Everyone thought they were alpha blueprints and unique ' that was shutdown and would not happen."

To me, that is not a good enough reason. Just because the blueprints are not exclusive does not mean they are not a reward. There are plenty of people when IZ launches who will focus more on fuel production than blueprint research. When the game launches successfully researching blueprints will become much harder, and certain blueprints will become harder to find due to regional restrictions. For example, finding biodata for a Ti-ru in Halcyon Sea will be nearly impossible. Many people will feel the need to choose between either putting resources into researching or producing fuel to sell to players of the Overworld. Choosing between the chance at a blueprint or guaranteed income.

The blueprints now are a reward in that case. At this moment in time players do not need to choose, so as long as they put in the time during the Alpha season players can get up to not 1, but 15 blueprints.

For those who do want to research blueprints once the game launches, rather than starting at level 1 they will be able to start researching the next stage of each blueprint they were able to discover during the Alpha. They have saved time and have gotten a head start in comparison to those who chose not to play the Alpha.

Another complaint I have heard has been comparing IZ to Illuvium Beyond. "Illuvium Beyond players are getting rewards and people who have bought land have been sitting on it for over a year."

Illuvium Beyond is not a fair comparison in my opinion.

Illuvium Beyond is a type of game, the rewards are things that the players get from playing said game.

Illuvium Zero is a type of game, where the rewards the players will get from playing that game are fuel and blueprints.

Both games come with rewards for playing, the difference is one is publicly launched while the other is not, yet.

This proposal to me comes across as asking for restitution because the game is launching so much later than usual. While as a land owner myself I sympathize with the agony and frustration of having gone so long with no return on investment this does not entitle people to more free stuff. This is one of the risks that comes with investing in any game - delays.

If you have read this far, I appreciate you taking the time and I hope no one felt insulted or attacked as that was not my intention. Regardless of my personal opinions if someone came to me and asked me to help them write this proposal I would have done so to the best of my ability. I often subscribe to the notion that "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" - Voltaire

Loves and Hugs.

TLDR; there is not enough reason to warrant spending team resources on giving IZ players more skins when they're already been rewarded with 15 while playing the Alpha.

[proper horizon]

That's very in line with my feelings. The first wave of beyond was fine because we thought the game would soon follow, but then having delays and deciding to push out wave 2 ahead of open beta, PLUS adding skin rewards and other incentives was tough to swallow. Again, I know as land owners our time will come! Just never fun sitting on the sideline in the meantime, so I completely get where these motives come from.

[brazen merlin]

Thank you for being very clear on your position. I accept both hats you have to wear.

[brazen merlin]

This proposal in my opinion addresses the problem of first and limited edition skins in line with beyond

So @tidal notch is unable to reply to questions nor is @iron flint I assume. Both of them are happy to answer questions from the Team prospective in leak’s discussion and zero chats. This is not ideal and will be hard to track but me tacking screenshots and reposting here does not feel transparent. If anyone has logistics and timing questions please direct them to either of these two team members. I will do my best to take into consideration what they say when revising the proposal

Hopefully we can get them to answer questions directly here

[pulsar monolith]

@valid haven has the power to make your dreams a reality @brazen merlin

Strange that they're unable to comment here o.o

[cyan maple]

I think he does

[brazen merlin]

Wonderful. Now hopefully we can be all on the same page. 🫶🏻

Do I need to ask Jeremy or have you?

[pulsar monolith]

I've tagged him, it's the weekend but I'm sure he will be around at some stage

[brazen merlin]

Thanks. I want everyone to be able to understand the logistics and timing issues.

Best for the community to ask directly and me not be defending my position.

[pulsar monolith]

Not a problem, minting a generic token that represents the skins is trivial as mentioned by others above.

These skins if they do get implemented, will certainly be need to be delivered post Open Beta Launch.

I think it's important @dull patrol is aware of this. Although I'd prefer not to further fragment his time.

I have real concerns about us ending up in a 'Retail World of Warcraft' type scenario whereby we have so many skins that they lose all meaning.

[brazen merlin]

That is outlined in the current proposal

[pulsar monolith]

Yep

[brazen merlin]

Good call. I’m not trying to break things.

[pulsar monolith]

Sweet 🙂

Region specific skins, at least to me, feel like something we would want a broad population of players to have access to

but this is all personal opinion, will continue to watch the thread

[brazen merlin]

Thanks for being involved and helpful.

[brazen merlin]

Is this a veiled threat? 😂

[dull patrol]

I agree with the sentiment to do more to help out landowners. But this is extra work (not just art). Is there really a need to flood Mozart with skins? Or will this end up requiring one per drone (so actually 5 skins per region or 35?)

We could save a lot of effort if it were made just a ranger skin. Then at least it’s just 7. Also it’s going to be hard to distinguish this from other skins and will further dilute them.

Personally I would rather not do this specifically and instead think of some other way that is more impactful to help out landholders.

I’d also prefer it be something that is unlocked for all landholders so that we don’t need to check their progress in order to see if they have unlocked it.

[brazen merlin]

I did not know that there were going to be more drones. Yes this changes things.

I think there is enough sentiment from the community to be pro doing something.

[dull patrol]

There are 4 drones.

[brazen merlin]

Yes Dmitriy informed me today

[dull patrol]

Yeah no doubt. And it isn’t like we are specifically avoiding doing something for landholders. We’re just grinding everything we need to get the game out.

But I really do feel like there must be a better and easier way to accomplish this sentiment.

[brazen merlin]

Tried my best to consult before posting this iip. The last thing I want is more upset for the team when you are all so busy with the huge task of game release. I’m all ears to change the iip with input from you and with the understanding that any extra work other than a redemption token will be done after open beta.

[dull patrol]

I am not sure right now. But a skin for each region doesn’t feel awesome to me.

There are a few skins that will be unique like Crystal Shores and a few that will look pretty generic or close to other illuvials.

[brazen merlin]

Do you have any other suggestions. Ie battle boards ect holo skin one off land owners single not region specific

[dull patrol]

Not right now. But I think a battle board skin for the region would be pretty cool.

[brazen merlin]

Holo

I will hold off revising the proposal to let all parties have any input they wish to voice. I will look to make notes early next week. Enjoy the weekend. 🫶🏻

[west shoal]

(Personally I would rather not do this specifically and instead think of some other way that is more impactful to help out landholders. ) ideas ? I'm curious...

[brazen merlin]

If we get too far off track then a new iip may need to be written. I wish to stick to the skin idea here either ranger drone or battle board. Otherwise scope blows out

[odd copper]

Just read dmitrys comments in leaks discussion.

So there's two schools of thought right now. 1) reward should be unlockable through progress and 2) taking a snapshot so that it can be worked on after open beta.

I really like these conditions as it doesn't put pressure on the team and if we are going to make it unlockable after some progress I'd suggest X amount of fuel produced to incentivize the focus on producing fuel in the first few weeks after open beta. This helps ensure we have enough fuel during the first few weeks of open beta.

With the higher tiers known to produce more fuel this gives landowners who invest in higher tiers less time to unlock therefore giving them a premium.

[proper horizon]

Battle boards are a neat idea, more unique, in-line with Beyond type rewards, wouldn't compete on the market with land blueprint skins....good stuff!

[celest geyser]

also a fan of battle boards as an option

[brazen merlin]

For reference

This is just some of the conversation that was had in leak’s discussion channel.

[proper horizon]

"....it sounds like it could set a bad precedent for newcomers to see og's with so much stuff they can never obtain.. its good to have things be special cuz someone was early,, i think its a bad tactic to give out so much stuff, new comers feel like they are late."

This is how I felt about releasing Beyond Wave 2 before open beta, but it seemed like the revenue was more important. I hope the council will consider extending Wave 2 at least some amount past open beta launch and not rush into Wave 3.

[fervent remnant]

More skins just reduces the value of all the skins. Also not seeing why land-owners need to be given anything in particular. Even though i'm a land owner myself. Yes the game is later than expected, yes land value has decreased since release. That's no different for the ILV owners. Just because Beyond collectors receive some reward doesn't mean that everybody else should also receive something.

[odd copper]

Though there's some truth to this but the business model of releasing new skins as time goes by contradicts this theory. Players get bored with their skins and the dopamine effect of getting newer cooler skins gets them hooked.

This is why games like fortnite and apex releases skins seasonally. So yes I agree that if we throw in so much skins at the start of open beta it will devalue the overall skin-nomics. But if you release it in cadence, which I believe the team will considering they're planning over 5000 skins lol, this will keep players hooked for years on end.

*note fortnite and apex earns most of its revenue in skins purchases.

So having a token nft you can redeem at a future time where the team has scheduled it in the cadence works.

Now if the question is about "does land owners deserve a reward for being in alpha/early or the fact that beyond has 'out-rewarded' ILZ?" That I cannot answer fully and ultimately this is the crux of the matter.

[vocal birch]

I think we should reevaluate this after open beta. Weren't the Blueprints the gift to early landowners? Let's see how happy landowners are after open beta before we prematurely reward them and put extra work on the team.

[odd copper]

If the team can do a snapshot of the wallets holding during alpha season thus makes sense. But if it's not possible then issuing a token nfts is a good interim solution and people can speculate on it too lol

[fading pier]

I don't like the idea of writing IIP's that reward investors more than what was promised at the time of sale, seems like a slippery slope.

[brazen merlin]

A lot was promised pre land sale.

[fading pier]

I mean as far as 5% revenue and the ablility to find blueprints

[tawdry meteor]

what were those promises besides what @fading pier just said?

[proper horizon]

Timeline. Sure, everything was delayed, but in comparison to people spending money on d1sks and having potential returns for the leaderboard nearly instantly, this was THE huge miss for land investors.

[tawdry meteor]

yep spending thousands of $$$ on beyond to be on the leaderboard just to get 20-40$ a week really is worth it

[proper horizon]

The price to get on the leaderboard is nothing compared to what people spent on land.

[tawdry meteor]

wouldn't be so sure of that statement as most plots are T1 and T2

we'll get blueprints ahead of everyone else and 5% revdis guaranteed do we really need to be asking for more at a time like this?

[proper horizon]

I was just answering the question above. If you see my previous comments, I'm not advocating for more and do not plan to vote either way on this.

And yes, I'm fairly confident that the top 100 wallets spent more on land than the top 100 wallets spent on beyond. Same with the remainder of wallets for each. I haven't looked into it, but would be shocked if it's even comparable.

[leaden horizon]

I have been doing a lot of thinking about this proposal since putting my thumbs up on it. I know it's pretty much passed as it hit 25 so this may be redundant but I am changing to a thumbs down.
TLTR: Two wrongs don't make a right.

Long form:
I love my land. But I have been disheartened lately. We were told BP's would only come from IZ. Skins would come from BPs. So, I thought land would be the only way to get skins, that if skins came from the DAO , it would somehow work in conjunction with landowners. Maybe that was naive or misguided but that was what I thought. So, to see skins being given away, especially before we can even mint any has been a tough pill to swallow.

When Splendor put this up my knee jerk reaction was: "Yeah, land-owners should get something too!" So I thumbs upped. However, that is inconsistent with what I feel is the principle of the matter, which I stated above. I don't want to react with a "if they get it we should too, even if I don't think they should get it" response. Me getting it too doesn't change what I think is best for Illuvium, which is to increase the value of land for the good of both land-owners and ILV holders (future land sales) by keeping blueprints and skins running only through IZ. There are many playable ways that the DAO could make it happen so that skins could both be used for marketing/rewards and come from land.

Thank you Splendor for putting this up. It has brought to light a lot of how land-owners are currently feeling. My apologies to you and everyone else that does support this for withdrawing my support. I know the other skins are a done deal, so I probably should just give in and support this but at the end of the day I don't agree with what is being done with skins right now and me benefiting this time around doesn't change that.

[leaden horizon]

I made a poor word choice but see there have already been responses to my post so I am making my edit here.

"There are many playable ways that the DAO could work it so that skins could both be used for marketing/rewards WHILE coming from land."

[fading pier]

I think that you are forgetting land gives you blueprints which allow you to make as many skins as you want, Beyond skins are account bound and have no power to create more skins like blueprints do. Bueprints will be powerfull especially if you can find a rare one!.

there will be like 200 skins just for illuvials and beyond will only gives out what 4-8 a year

[novel sage]

"Illuvium beyond d1sk bought perks" are not Account bound.
Such as the Obereum skin or the new Mozart and Ranger skin. (or the Mozart Gamestop skin)

[fading pier]

Where did you hear that? If true either way skins are not blueprints

[proper horizon]

It's the album rewards that need to be account bound, so people don't just fill an album and then resell illuvitars but keep/sell an NFT reward. There's just not a need for that with rewards for minting 250 d1sks, etc.

[brazen merlin]

There is still further costs involved in crafting of skins. Consumables will need to be acquired in the o/w or illuvidex in order to create the skins.

We have at this point no way of knowing what these costs will be or the returns involved

[novel sage]

#🎮〕illuvium-beyond message

[fading pier]

true but still blueprints and way more powerful than skins

[brazen merlin]

Not if skins can be generated at will from illuvium labs

[boreal vessel]

Maybe we could think of capping beyond skins to a minimum a year?

[brazen merlin]

I feel that a deeper discussion around what conditions labs can generate skins under should be had. Perhaps we need some clarification

[fading pier]

I see the worry, perhaps an IIP regarding Illuvium labs creating skins is more appropriate

[brazen merlin]

Certainly feels like we should have a better understanding of this for sure

[fading pier]

I agree, some kind of guidelines everyone is happy with

[leaden horizon]

No. Land gives the opportunity to maybe acquire skins if I invest more time and money into trying to get them. They are not given.

[fading pier]

acquire Blueprints, skins do not equal blueprints

[brazen merlin]

I think we all understand the way in which blueprints and skins are created through zero. The underlying issue is clarity is needed around what other ways skins will be generated and how many there will be. Also are land owners being rewarded for their investment as well as beyond.

In game cosmetics will be a potentially powerful marketing tool and money generator for both the Dao and land owners. I would just like some perimeters around how this all works.

[leaden horizon]

Yes, I know that. Apologies, I misspoke. Point is still the same - not given to us or guaranteed.

[inland shard]

Some love for land owners is definitely needed. I don't see what's the harm here, tons of games have done similar things and the outcome is usually positive. I never had the chance to be so early in a game I played but always found these super rare/early adopters skins to be very cool.

I don't see how 1 skin per land owner (maximum 20k) is going to dilute anything, if it was a real concern we wouldn't be giving out 15bps to every land owner.

To avoid stressing the art team further before OB, it was already suggested to introduce some sort of token which we can later claim the skins with.

I don't see anything wrong with this, upvoted.

[cobalt wyvern]

While it may come across as unpleasant, there are certain things that I find somewhat limiting... it's just my perspective, but can someone remind me how much the sale of lands has contributed to the project? Who can tell me what investors in the lands have gained since this sale? Who can tell me today the purpose of this purchase when we see how much prices have fallen compared to the initial sale? And I'm told that it's too much to ask to reward all these people who took the risk to believe in the project? For Illuvitars, it's gifts galore, no problem, but for those who bought exclusive land skins, is it too much? Especially since the idea of creating an NFT token while the team creates these exclusive skins doesn't seem insurmountable to me, especially if the skins are delivered after the alpha season. So, at some point, it would be good to stop always rewarding the same people and think about those who have truly invested in this project, don't you think?

[cobalt wyvern]

I may be nobody in your eyes, but since this project is a DAO, my opinion matters, so I would ask everyone here to carefully consider their choice and ask themselves the right questions! A DAO is also about going against the team members, and I say rewarding land buyers is of utmost importance! I am currently a scholar for quite a few people! Here, in an image, are all the lands I manage on my own, and I still refuse more! Are you sure that players like me, passionate about the project, should not be rewarded for their efforts? Who here can tell me - "I understand the efforts you put into this project, I understand the time you spend on it, loving it, supporting the team, and you deserve it?" Who will dare to say even once that passionate players like me do not deserve a reward? The message you want to send is simple: our community is a cash cow, let's reward only those who spend money, is that what Illuvium is about? Did I make such a mistake in listening to the Warwick brothers describe their project? I am one of those who want to show everyone that our efforts pay off! No matter who you are, support this project, spend time on it, come and play, discover the world of Illuvium, and be rewarded for your patience and loyalty. That's the message I want for my community, and this message should be the same for you! You must and have the obligation to tell everyone here that Illuvium is THE PROJECT! So, don't make the silly mistake of neglecting your players for wallets! Make the right choice just this once. This is not just an idea; it's the future image of the project that is at stake here. So, reconsider your decision and support Ricky for his brilliant idea! And give your players the desire to follow you, even to hell if necessary. Thank you.

Now, who can tell me why I don't deserve to be rewarded for my efforts?

[blazing moon]

Merci - This is @brazen merlin 's idea. I am just one of many council members and community members that provided feedback to help get it to where it is now! the OP/Sponsor (Splendor) will be posting an updated proposal taking into concideration community feedback, as well as Team feedback

[heavy trench]

Downvoted.
More skins? Just give them ILV token, they will be happier.
Plus, landowners will have a head start pre OB, that's a huge advantage.

[cobalt wyvern]

An enormous advantage? We know nothing about future token prices, land profitability, or their future gameplay. We simply bought, and since then, there's been nothing, just a demo. So, okay, the promises are there, but in reality, we haven't received anything yet. On the other hand, for Illuvitars, there's no issue. I'm asking for fairness! How much do Illuvitars earn for the top of the list? There are still rewards being implemented, but for those who bought land, there's still nothing. Promises aren't kept on one side and are more than generous on the other. It's neither logical nor beneficial for the project's image to continue like this. Rewarding Illuvium Zero players will foster loyalty and discourage them from selling their land to move on to other projects that reward them genuinely, without having to wait for two years.

[heavy trench]

u had a full year to sell your land if ur not happy.
nobody is forcing u to hold and test the game.
even revdis got suspended.
life is not fair. welcome to web3.
we are a dao, any utility can be changed with a vote.

[cobalt wyvern]

I have just one thing to say to that: continue to discourage your players and enthusiasts with your ideas, go ahead, and don't come crying when, instead of achieving the global success you dream of, you only achieve a monumental failure due to your arrogance. And I would add, before telling me to sell my lands in a foolish and mean-spirited manner because you have no argument, try to educate yourself about marketing in the video game industry. Currently, many are thinking of leaving the ship, and those who make even a minimal effort to try to retain them are despised. You may be right, this project may not be for gamers or true players, but only for unintelligent speculators who hope to make x10, x100 without thinking and without understanding anything.

[wet perch]

Illuvium Beyond is a released game. The players earn rewards from playing a game that is released and open to the public. Illuvium Zero is an Unreleased game, which **Will **have rewards for its owners once it hits open beta. Rewards in the form of more blueprints and fuel that can be used or sold for Eth.

Should Illuvium Beyond players complain about not getting blueprints or Fuel once Illuvium Zero is released?

Do landholders have to wait longer to see returns on their investments? Yes.

Does it suck? Yes.

Have they been rewarded for having to wait, yes they have.

They have been given the chance to earn 15 blueprints prior to Open Beta. Earning these not only gives them the blueprints but allows them to start researching the next stage once Illuvium Zero Open Beta is launched. What is one or ten more skins really going to do that **15 ** blueprints, which can create multiple copies of skins to be sold, hasn't already?

While as a land owner myself I sympathize with the agony and frustration of having gone so long with no return on investment this does not entitle people to more free stuff. This is one of the risks that comes with investing in any game - delays.

Demanding that land owners receive more compensation for the delays will only make the game further delayed. What then? More skins, more delays. An endless cycle that is just not worth it in my opinion.

[cobalt wyvern]

I understand your point of view and your concern, but you don't seem to consider player retention in the long term. It's true that player satisfaction and engagement are essential for the long-term success of a game, but in your logic, you don't reference it at all. The decisions made by the development team and the community can have a significant impact on the project's future. Have you thought about that? We're not asking for 200,000,000 NFTs; just an exclusive skin. It's not a big deal, and the work can be done later. What's the problem with that? Have you even read Ricky's work before debating?

It's important to remember that each project has its own history, and potential players consider many factors before committing. Delays and expectations can be frustrating, but how they are managed and the rewards offered to players can influence their decision to stay or leave!

In any case, I wish you a good evening, and I hope that the Illuvium project will find ways to satisfy its players and create a positive gaming experience for everyone involved.

[wet perch]

Player satisfaction and engagement are essential for the long-term success of a game, hence the team allowed the owners of Illuvium Zero the opportunity to earn blueprints prior to open beta, an argument you yourself ignored.

It could be argued that everyone in the Illuvium Community should be compensated then for the delay of Arena and Overworld. A game that was originally projected to be out by now. And I am not trying to say that the decisions made by the development team and the community don't have a significant impact on the project's future. But I think it is insincere to insinuate that the team has done nothing to appease the community as we wait for the main game to hit open beta.

The work can be done later, but how much later? Once the game launches into open beta** Then** the real work begins. The bugs, the balances, the fixes. Those all take valuable time and resources. After Open Beta there is probably at minimum 3-6 months where the team will continue to spend 16-18 hour days working on fixing the problems before they even consider moving on to things like new games and projects.

Again, another point you yourself ignored - why is 15 blueprints not enough?

Feel free to not answer the questions posted above, honestly we can truly agree that this is an agree to disagree kind of situation. And apologies for my outburst, this is certainly a topic where my emotions and opinions runaway with me.

As I've stated above,
#1146665567206506537 message

as a member of the CSC I will be passing this proposal due to it reaching the needed votes, but as a community member I think asking for more compensation after compensation has already been given is ridiculous.

[cobalt wyvern]

Getting upset doesn't serve any purpose, but I don't consider the 15 blueprints as real rewards, and the members of the community aren't fooled either. They're just breadcrumbs left by the project to appease investors, very nice breadcrumbs indeed. But what we want here is for the project to support us in return. Is it a crime to want an exclusive skin as a thank you for us players who have contributed so much to the success of this project? Without our massive investments, many developers wouldn't have had salaries, the project wouldn't have reached this level of quality, or even had as many features or a future. An artist isn't necessary for bug fixes, and I believe that a small team dedicated to creating these skins wouldn't be an insurmountable burden for the project. Unless there's a significant liquidity issue, but with the safety pool, there would be more than enough funds to pay a small team for this purpose while 90% of the rest continues working on fixes and updates. Once again, I have a much more practical perspective, and even if the team disagrees with this idea, it's fundamentally about recognizing the team's commitment to the players by channeling their talent into a reward that the community truly deserves. Am I wrong to think this way?

[wet perch]

You're right getting upset doesn't serve any purpose, but it does make me human. And me admitting how I feel on a position does not mean my arguments are not practical or hold value.

How is the 15 blueprints breadcrumbs but a skin is compensation enough?

I am not saying your feelings are unjustified, I am a land holder after all and I also am frustrated at the delay on being able to make a return on my investments.

I suppose where we differ is I feel as though the landowners have been compensated with the blueprints, and you don't. Since I feel as though compensation has been provided I am against spending any more resources or time providing additional compensation. Since in my opinion it's not needed.

[brazen merlin]

As the community is very evenly divided I have written a new iip which will seek a new vote to try to help clarify sentiment. I feel that it will be better than sending this iip to council even though the required 25 up votes were achieved

[cobalt wyvern]

We have two completely opposing points of view, and I enjoy debating this issue. The blueprints were marketed as a great reward but are nothing more than tier 1 Illuvials that likely won't have real value and will be endlessly duplicated! What I and many others are asking for, because I'm not speaking for myself alone but for my community as well, is some recognition from the team. Yes, it seems like spending resources is a real burden for you, but what about us? We've invested money and time, supported you, listened to you, and we're still here to believe in this project! An exclusive skin isn't a blueprint, it's just a skin that would be meaningful to the player who gets it, and it would also be a thank-you from the team to the landowners! We've done a lot for this project! Okay, we'll earn other things over time! But we've still waited for 2 years! Two years of promises and missed deadlines! But we didn't say anything, we understood, and we continued to be here. Now, I believe it would be a fair return for the project team to show that they also appreciate their landowners with something artistic that's truly made to thank us. It would be fair, just, and it would also encourage players to remain loyal to the project rather than waiting for an opportunity to leave. Because today, how many members are really active here? Not as many as during the land sale. Rewarding those who have stayed is, in my opinion, evidence of the team's commitment to its entire community and not just those who buy Illuvials.

[wet perch]

I'll say, this is actually probably the first point made that I can concede to. The difference in a set number of skins vs an unknown number of skins.

That being said you could argue that the blueprints hold more value as you have the value in selling the blueprint itself and the value of being able to craft skins to sell.

While the number of skins that would be created, for say Atlas, might be unknown it will be limited. Set 1 will end at somepoint in the future, successful capture percents will diminish as more Illuvials of a type are caught, and people will want to keep Illuvials whether for their decks, the potential in future games, or investment.

Value wise I would argue it's hard to accurately say one is more than the other before we see how they perform on the secondary market. If we equate Atlas to Pikachu, you could argue a stage 1 Atlas skin would be more sought after than an Abysal basin skin.

[cobalt wyvern]

Except that we're not talking about the blueprints, which are one of the products sold with the lands as part of a complete package of lands + fuel + blueprints. The subject is not there, and that's probably why you don't agree... I'm talking here about Illuvium's responsibility, which has officially committed to providing us with a product by a certain date, as well as the revdis that are still not here... It's borderline false advertising that allowed so many lands to be sold, I think, so offering a "gift" or "compensation," call it what you want, would be the least Illuvium could do for all these investors who have been misled by the project (I'm talking about missed releases and promises as well as the drop in land prices). Take it as you like, but I'm realistic and not unreasonable in my reasoning. With a single action, you can change everything! But your pride doesn't allow you to see clearly... What does it really cost you to offer this kind of content to your community? Apart from making them understand that they just have to shut up, you're not doing anything else, and it's a shame. Today, we don't want promises anymore; we want something concrete

Whether you like it or not, I'm here to encourage the work of all those who think about the community and Illuvium's interests. If you disagree with my point of view, which I can understand, instead of a categorical no, as a member of the DAO, you also have a duty to find a solution that pleases all parties, rather than putting a stop to your colleagues' ideas, who have understood that to have a project that stands the test of time, you also have to think about all those people who are about to leave the project because they're tired of waiting. Illuvium's and Kieran's strategic choices have led to this situation, so I think we need to right the wrongs and stop playing a game of who's right but objectively help find an agreement for those who are against it and also for those who are in favor of this idea without closing all possibilities. Do you think you can do that?

[wet perch]

Let me just lead with something I have said multiple times throughout this thread - I am here to encourage and work with all members of the community to help make this project as successful as possible.

As I have mentioned before, multiple times, even if I disagreed with certain community proposals I will do my best to make sure they are both heard and reach the appropriate sub-council to be considered.

Pretty sure I've said multiple times that at the CSC level I will be passing this proposal. Due to this, I think it is unfair of you to insinuate that I am blocking this proposal or this process, let alone not supporting the community as on this proposal it is evenly split in opinion and preference.

From a professional standpoint, I support this proposal being heard and reaching the proper people. From a professional standpoint I have helped give feedback and poked holes in what might make this a less than ideal method. I have spent hours in meetings with my fellow CSC members discussing the process of this proposal, it's strengths and weaknesses, etc. So no I am not putting a stop to this idea, I am actively helping it.

I often don't share my opinions publicly because it holds little to no bearing on how I vote as a CSC member and I don't want to give people the impression that it will. However, I've been requested multiple times that I share my opinions earlier in the process, so that is what I have done here. I have shared my personal opinions on the matter.

It is my personal opinion that no further compensation is required at this stage in development. If you disagree that is fine, if you want to propose something and enough community members want to be given free skins great. But I am not about to surrender my personal opinions with an argument that I fundamentally don't agree with. And by looking at the number of downvotes on this proposal I am far from the only one who feels this way.

But your pride doesn't allow you to see clearly. What does it really cost you to offer this kind of content to your community? Apart from making them understand that they should be handed free stuff the moment something doesn't go in a direction that they like, and it's a shame.

Whether you like it or not, whether you agree with me or not, I'm here to encourage the work of all those who think about the community and Illuvium's interests. Just because we stand on opposite sides of the bridge in this discussion does not make either point any less important or relevant.

I am officially done with this thread, and will see you in the next one once Splendor has completed it and posts the revised proposal. While you are welcome to poke holes in my arguments and provide all the reasons you have already posted here, I do request that you refrain from insinuating that I am not here for the community or acting in Illuviums best interest simply because I disagree with you. Do you think you can do that?

[cobalt wyvern]

In that case, what do you propose to bring back all the players who got tired of waiting and left the project, and who no longer want to be involved because they were so disappointed with its management? If your goal is only to please new players, then what was the purpose of those who joined long before?

[proven stratus]

Extra Dev work with no real upside,
Landowners already received 15 Blueprints that are already a bonus to what was originally promised...

I say this as a Landowner, this is not a priority and its also clearly being pushed for personal gain by Landowners

I have no issue if the Team randomly decided they had the free time and wanted to do this, but us imposing it because we want free stuff is not the way, firmly against this

[cobalt wyvern]

After all, you probably have much more information than I do about the project's progress, that's a fact. But I can only react based on the facts presented to me and what I've observed for some time. Many have left the ship, and nothing has been done to retain them because the team has been betting everything on Illuvitars for several months, which doesn't make sense, especially given the results they've brought. Now the question is mainly how to bring them back and retain them? If I'm wrong, I'm willing to admit it. I can introspect when the facts are what they are. I'm not perfect, but neither are you. A loyal and solid player base is necessary for the project's success, and in my eyes, this proposal is a starting point to achieve that goal. Am I wrong?

[proven stratus]

as for the comparison between current beyond rewards and a lack of pre-launch rewards for IZ

Beyond players are rewarded for spending large amounts of money with rewards worth considerably less than they are spending...
(also beyond has no yield outside of those top 100 spots and the ROI on those are far worse than what IZ will get post launch)

IZ has proper ROI and is actually an investment vehicle rather than a degen money sink like Beyond, totally different imo

[cobalt wyvern]

I don't want to impose anything, but rather make the project recognize its management mistakes to the extent that they have managed to discourage players to the point where they are willing to invest elsewhere, even if it means selling at a loss. Nothing is done to retain players, but everything is done to extract money from them with beautiful promises. At some point, it's also necessary to reconsider the marketing strategy. If the goal is to drive away the early players who believed in the project, then you have the right methods, that's a fact. I also want to point out that it's not just the English-speaking community here; other communities have their own opinions, but it remains to be seen whether they are of interest to you.

[proven stratus]

Very detailed feedback, Great Response!

[proven stratus]

I completely agree that the Team (especially the Leadership) have not done nearly enough to publicly acknowledge past mistakes.

I agree that more can certainly be done by the Leadership to improve community sentiment than has been done, but we've also been already very significantly delayed and nothing will improve community sentiment more than actually launching the damn thing, so just prioritising on Launching rather than creating new rewards makes a ton of sense imo (no bigger reward to us all than the game actually coming out)

Its defo not just the English-Speaking Community here, but governance is currently conducted in English, many participate with Google Translate and other translation software also, not sure precisely what the issue is there?

[cobalt wyvern]

How do you expect to succeed if your entire player base has already left? How do you expect to succeed if all the information is concentrated in a single language? I am fully aware that everything is in English, the teams, the language spoken, etc. But you are neglecting all the other communities that do not have the opportunity to participate in the discussion. Why not conduct surveys in different languages to get a real sample of what the community thinks about these ideas? The problem here is that very few people vote, and many are English speakers, which leads to false opinions because many here accept things without explaining to others the reasons behind them, creating unnecessary conflicts and differing opinions!

[proven stratus]

The team has defo not been betting everything on illuvitars lol

The team is betting everything on Open Beta Launch and are working full force on that (so that IZ can begin earning and selling Fuel)

Illuvitars is just the only digital product that were actively selling prior to OB Launch but its just a mini side project that a small fraction of the team engages with...

[cobalt wyvern]

In that case, why not provide the community with an organizational chart of who does what and how the teams are divided, instead of letting rumors run wild? Sharing your information and regaining the trust of the players who have lost confidence in you, is that too much to ask?

[proven stratus]

Our entire playerbase was never here, less than 0.01% of the players that will ever play illuvium have even heard of it yet...

majority of people here are investors, some are investors and players...

As for launguages, Once Open Beta comes the game will actually be available in multiple languages, we will also have Polls held in-game asking players their opinions and feedback on different things, these features will all be available in different languages

Currently however we are a small Start-Up Studio with limited Staff on hand and prior to launch multiple languages just hasn't been a priority and I do not blame anyone for it being that way, it makes sense

If a French Team started a project in French and translated nothing prior to launch I also wouldnt be surprised or offended and if I was really interested and wanted to get involved I'd do my best with translate software and chatting to other english speakers interested in that project...

We can always do better, but lets also appreciate what we've got and what we've accomplished with a studio of this size already

[proven stratus]

what rumors are running wild exactly?

this is completely not relevant to this proposal, if you feel there isnt enough info from the team to the players then message the founders or Andrew and ask them to present more info...

Your frustration with the project isn't directly relevant to this proposal and if your entire reason for supporting this proposal is literally just your frustration with the project then maybe lets rethink that...

[proper horizon]

I don't think anyone took exception until wave 2 was pushed out ahead of game release with additional rewards for minting and others promised for different album completions, including skins, etc.

I'm indifferent on this proposal, but yeah that bothered me with land holders waiting in the wings for well over a year already.

Please don't say beyond players are spending "large amounts of money" to the land holders....there's really no comparison.

[proven stratus]

Reward for buying massive amounts of a product that has no real built in revdis or investment utility like IZ…

I get the frustration w delays but adding scope isn’t the solution imo

The hope is that all these delays will eventually mean a higher quality product that will lead to higher revenue for IZ owners and ILV stakers…

[proper horizon]

They're also pushing for a TCG now that will use Illuvitars instead of Illuvials, right? I think this is another interesting divergence in the favor of beyond vs the rest of the ecosystem

[proven stratus]

I mean defo no guarantee that ends up actually happening

[proper horizon]

I'm not totally opposed to it either, just think people need to really consider if that's the right path vs integrating a new game like that fully into the IBG. It would directly take away value from the others, including land.

Obviously this is way down the line before we would even see anything, but discussions are happening now and Johnny has a GDD in review

[proven stratus]

main concern for me about a card game is that it targets a very similar player base to the other games we will have out and potential split up our playerbase rather than attracting a new audience to our ecosystem

but defo off topic and a ways down, sure we'll be discussing it more on Johnnys GDD

[proper horizon]

Yep, exactly

[brazen merlin]

I understand some of your points and appreciate you taking the time to weigh in on the conversation. My only response is that by looking at the feedback and thumbs up there is sentiment to prove that perhaps something needs to be done to make the rewards more fair for land holders.

[proven stratus]

idk

On a proposal that just adds value to assets people already own (clear financial incentive to upvote) the fact that the votes are so close and that there is as much opposition to this suggests that perhaps there is no need for additional rewards even if obviously we'd all enjoy more rewards...

as a whole people will always want more than what they were originally promised, I'd love bonus value randomly but do I really need it? and do I think its worth added dev time? and don't ILV holders/stakers also deserve the same? or more since theyve been waiting longer? etc. etc. etc.

[blazing moon]

Just to add one thing to this, a LARGE amount of people who 👎 are landowners and would "appreciate a bonus", but still opposed the proposal for many reasons, mainly being the added scope/device which could delay other more important items (like launch) & added skins to the ecosystem

Hopefully the new proposal that will be shared and linked will be more agreeable to the community

[brazen merlin]

A new vote may help to clarify sentiment

[cobalt wyvern]

So, disagreeing with you means being frustrated? What a wonderful mentality! I didn't expect much, to be honest, but you managed to disappoint me once again. It's quite an achievement! You're confirming my point that investors are just 0.01% of the target audience you're focusing on, so there's no interest in taking care of them, right? Wow, in the end, I thought this project was something revolutionary, but I realize now that a handful of people prefer to remain in their hypocrisy and not question themselves. Personally, I'm willing to be wrong, but you don't engage in debate, you don't provide anything new, and you constantly criticize anyone who doesn't share your ideals. In the end, it's become almost like a cult! Keep doing what you think is best, but don't cry when you become the number 1 flop in the web 3 gaming world because you're not mature enough to listen or question yourselves. Furthermore, I want to add that when you say it's up to people to send messages to get information, I find that very surprising and unprofessional! It's certainly not up to the players to beg for information; it's up to the projects to organize and provide it to as many people as possible. And to get back to your example of a French project, I'm involved in other projects, and two of them happen to be French. You know what? These projects may not have millions, but the team communicates in both English and French, provides information every week in two different languages, and brings in new arrivals! It's amazing, isn't it?

Why can't we do it here? Do we think it's unnecessary? In that case, what are the sales figures for Illuvitars? What are the sales figures for Illuvium clothing? When I see the project struggling to fill a simple safety pool of 15 million, it seems to speak volumes about the results, especially in comparison to competitors doing the exact same thing. As for the rumors, I want to clarify that, in my eyes, they are just rumors and not founded information. The creation of Illuvitars was not supposed to delay the project, but it seems like it did. Who can confirm or deny it? As Artemis would say, I'm human and I have emotions, but right now, I just see increased hypocrisy and no valid argument to prove me wrong, even though I'm just waiting for that. We're not asking for the moon, just concrete things that improve the image and attract more players. The time for waiting is over! If the deadlines are indeed being met, it's now that we need to prepare the ground for a future launch, not after. Let's not make the same mistakes as during the launch of Illuvitars Wave 1! Illuvium deserves better than this, especially after all the time we've spent waiting.

[cobalt wyvern]

But we're tired of waiting for a miracle with the hope that someday, perhaps, a bit of concrete action would do everyone good if it's not too late already.

[cobalt wyvern]

If possible, try to ensure that this vote reaches a broader community than just the general chat. If the votes are negative under these conditions, I will admit that I am wrong in this specific case. However, it's essential to stop thinking that not even 100 votes represent 100% of the Illuvium community. Just give it a try; I'm not asking for more.

[brazen merlin]

I will do my best.

[cobalt wyvern]

I would be delighted to help you with it if you feel the need.

I complain a lot, I get a little upset, but one thing is for sure, I'm not doing all this for personal gain, but solely to ensure the project thrives and succeeds as it promised us, even if people don't agree with my opinions. 😄

[cyan maple]

Closing this at request of OP @brazen merlin