nothing special about the gun except its boring alt fire
#Steam ( IF YOU CANT SEND MESSAGES USE STEAM 2 )
glad mist
I love the scalpel, high fire rate, good inscriptions and provides great damage increase efficiency because of it's alt fire mode
It's alt fire is literally. Double Damage
fallen escarp
It isn't, actually.
hoary rapids
I think the whole alt fire, sacrificing accuracy for a double shot, combined with good critX, high ROF and decent DMG makes it great for melting heads
lucid nova
everything in this games has great dmg since everything is overtuned
hoary rapids
Great for proccing elemental effects too
lucid nova
- double shot gives the worst recoil
glad mist
Single-shot has an inexplicable +33% total DMG.
I did not know that
hoary rapids
Did not know the single shot had a dmg buff
Still, two bullets = +100% dmg per shot vs +33
glad mist
It's still a bigger increase in damage, the recoil is honestly not hard to control and doesn't it stack with projectile inscriptions
so a +1 projectile scalpel essentially makes it 4 projectiles
fallen escarp
133% DMG for 1 ammo vs 200% DMG for 2 ammo, worse accuracy, worse recoil.
hoary rapids
Stay close
fallen escarp
Even disrecarding the accuracy and recoil, that's only a +50% DPS for a +100% ammo consumption, or about -25% ammo efficiency.
hoary rapids
I don't use it for even medium range tbh, just a consistent close range stream of dmg. Accuracy and recoil isn't a problem then
fallen escarp
Hold on, let me do some calculations including the magazine and reload times for actual DPS increase in total.
glad mist
Scalpel is absolutely insane for bossing with spores or tao
One of my best builds i've ever had was a tao on hit blossom with spores build with strive to survive
hoary rapids
More frequent reloads is great for some builds
glad mist
I had a +1 projectile scalpel enhanced with extra projectiles and an increase to projectiles per enemy killed, at the end i was firing around 20 projectiles i think? and had fish n bear paw
It was disgustingly good
fallen escarp
Ok, so single-shot mode Scalpel has about a 494 DPS, including reloads and not including stuff like crits or anything.
Double-shot increases to 610 DPS, which is less than +50% because you need to reload more often.
(Also yes I'm including the Assalter talet for +25% magazine.)
glad mist
Whats the dps values not including reloads?
fallen escarp
Result is about a +23.5% DPS increase.
glad mist
there's enough scrolls in the game to cancel out reloads easily enough
hoary rapids
For builds where I want to reload, I always end up with scrolls filling my mag all the time
fallen escarp
Ammo consumption including reloads also increases from 9.27/s to 15.2/s, or about a +64% increase.
hoary rapids
Gotta dump a bunch if I actually want the reloads for whatever reason
fallen escarp
Whats the dps values not including reloads?
Well that's simple, about +50% DPS for about +100% consumption, as explained above.
glad mist
50% dps is a lot especially if consumption doesn't matter, if you can control the recoil that's a crazy increase considering how it a completely seperate damage increase from every other modifier
fallen escarp
Keep in mind that the only realistic ways to keep yourself from reloading a Scalpel is Magazine Share with something else with massive magazine capacity + Against the Flow, constant dashes with Skateboarder, or Advanced Depot which gives you an extra +50% total ammo consumption.
Or Warlike Blade 3 and some of the above, if you're Tao.
glad mist
Strive to survive?
fallen escarp
That too I suppose.
Realistically though, if you've got an infinite magazine, unless you're going for the slightly higher CritX, longer effective range and better accuracy as you fire, you're probably better off with an Angelic Aura.
Same RoF and +50% damage per bullet.
glad mist
Does the scalpel +55% chance to gain one extra projectile stack with the double shot?
fallen escarp
I think the double shot is a multiplicative +100%.
So you'll go from 2 projectiles to 3.1.
That being said, Scalpel's +0.55 projectiles is additive with pretty much everything else, including +1 Projectiles, +100% Consumption and +0.2 Projectiles per kill, reset on reload.
glad mist
true
but it because of the double shot all projectile increase bonuses are doubled which can go to insane levels
fallen escarp
Except that doubled projectiles is the same amount of projectiles as Angelic Aura, don't forget.
glad mist
it's easily the best weapon for a tao blossom on hit build
fallen escarp
Angelic Aura is 24 RoF, Scalpel is 12 RoF (x2).
"Doubled projectiles" only sounds cooler than it actually is.
fallen escarp
Yes.
Oh right yeah, Angelic Aura's exclusive inscription also got buffed for no reason in the DLC update.
glad mist
lmao
fallen escarp
So while Scalpel stays at +0.55 projectiles, Angelic Aura went from +80% lucky shot chance to +100%.
glad mist
I mean my favourite smgs are demonlore and scalpel, but demonlores spread is awful
Also the angelic aura is way too accurate for what it can do
glad mist
So while Scalpel stays at +0.55 projectiles, Angelic Aura went from +80% lucky s...
Wtf
It did not need a buff
fallen escarp
It and a lot of inscriptions.
Did you know Deafening Mortar and Shrieker had exclusive inscriptions buffed, but Frenzied Shark and Tiger Cannon didn't?
glad mist
Why
glad mist
"Let's just buff the better weapons in each group rather than the ones that acually need it"
"People use these more, so lets make them more powerful"
The issue is with gunfire is i feel they're way more focuses on buffs than nerfs, instead of nerfing something down to the level of others they buff others up to that level instead, which sounds good, but really it just enables more power creep
As a great man once said:
fallen escarp
And they don't even do that correctly.
glad mist
fallen escarp
They practically buff random things.
It's why crap like Eye of Providence, Bladed Cleave and Dominating Fist still exist, while perfectly useful blessings before like Painkiller and Overconsumption become godlike.
glad mist
I literally only use overconsumption for r1/r8 speedrunning, as it's almost neccesary for a good early game run now
fallen escarp
The best you can hope for is that they hit something weak out of pure luck.
And yet you also hope they don't, because the weak stuff might be the only things you can use to keep the game challenging.
glad mist
They just need to add some bizzare dreams that are purely negative
They seem to not realise that people enjoy challenge, and adding modifiers that increase challenge are fine
fallen escarp
Technically you can almost consider Transcendent Arsenal to be more negative than positive.
glad mist
Yeah coz it removes a chance for extra scrolls
fallen escarp
Because the Arsenal Guards appear so late they're practically useless, they take up a scroll chest, the backup weapon slots are usually unnecessary and you get challenge events in all vaults.
Guess what though?
People complain about it.
They call it useless and such, because they don't see the point in it.
What's the chance that the next update will buff it in favor of the player?
glad mist
Independent fortunes should have been you get the scroll you want but a random effect is added to enemies
Then its more of a gamble
then just being like. this is clearly not worth taking because the enemies will be stronger
Instead it becomes, i really want this scroll, im gonna gamble for it
fallen escarp
Eh, that breaks the concept of the modifier.
What should be done is the enemy effects... simply aren't so easy to use to sabotage the enemies and benefit you.
Either they provide stronger effects compared to stronger scrolls, or the negative effects aren't so easy to synergize.
glad mist
It honestly would have been better if they didn't tell you the enemy effect... yes you could look them up on the wiki once they were found out, but the average player isn't gonna do that
fallen escarp
I mean, I made this when it was first released.
#1087608046039072888 message
glad mist
Or you HAVE to choose one
fallen escarp
That too.
You pick the modifier, you can't just opt out when you don't like your choices.
glad mist
That would be a lot better
It's like the intention of jokul buff. It gives the player benefits but makes the game harder, except for the fact that jokul benefits the player way too much and by the time you reach the harder stage you're already way more powerful than you would be
Same situation with lone wolf
wicked python
IMO forcing you to use them just makes it feel bad and players would simply opt out of using it
fallen escarp
Then they don't get free scrolls or enemy penalties.
If you want a reward, you take the risk too.
wicked python
Altho obv there's a good amount of people who a) dont even know you dont have to pick one and b) dont even know you dont have to use the scrolls to get the enemy effects
fallen escarp
Right now it's a cherry-picked reward, and if a risk appears, you ignore it.
glad mist
IMO forcing you to use them just makes it feel bad and players would simply opt ...
These same player likely wouldn't pick up modifiers that make the game harder. Even though those are perfectly reasonable to have in the game
wicked python
On the flip side tho if you're forced to pick a reward it makes it less interesting as a "science experiment" type mechanic where you can forcefully mix-and-match, and can also occasionally put ppl in situations where they have nothing except extremely Bad-For-The-Player choices
glad mist
Hades skull system is an amazing system of adding difficulty
glad mist
On the flip side tho if you're forced to pick a reward it makes it less interest...
that's the risk aspect
wicked python
I agree but I think negativity bias plays a big role for something like this
you'll way more remember the cool run that got screwed by the random 3 bad fortune choice than youll remember the most times where you just got a decent scroll for free
especially because its (mostly) non-mitigatable rng as the fortune pool is insanely large now(and prolly continue to grow)
glad mist
I understand your point but personally I would much prefer that or something similar like you get to reroll the scroll selection one per area etc.
What i'm saying it that it should have been balanced to not make it so it is purely used to make the game easier
hoary rapids
It's like the intention of jokul buff. It gives the player benefits but makes th...
What's the Jokul buff? I know it increases enemy health and damage, and makes the final boss have extra mechanics. I thought the only player buff was offering to swap a single blessing?
glad mist
What's the Jokul buff? I know it increases enemy health and damage, and makes th...
It provides an extra reroll in both shops and elites spawn at the end of each area that provide you an extra ascension per stage
fallen escarp
especially because its (mostly) non-mitigatable rng as the fortune pool is insan...
Well that's what happens when you try to make modifiers which are both good and bad at the same time.
You either make it easy to break and the game becomes easier when you use it, or you actually balance the good and bad and you piss the casual players off because the dice didn't roll 6s every time.
hoary rapids
It provides an extra reroll in both shops and elites spawn at the end of each ar...
Sweet, didn't notice those effects
glad mist
Casual players that cry about basic mechanics that are in most games of the same genre are the worst
Have you seen everyone complaining about having to make a new character for seasons in diablo
fallen escarp
Compare to Spiritual Link. No one complains about that one. You either turn it on for an easier game, or turn it off for a harder game. Nothing complex about that.
glad mist
literally how diablo and most arpgs work
hoary rapids
Oh yeah so I got to gluttony with the fox, just went hard on the fire damage and chromatic reload was nice. Maybe it's more the co-op that's busted for SA
wicked python
Well that's what happens when you try to make modifiers which are both good and ...
while I agree with ur overall point I think its an especialyl bad case here where the game might tell you to outright pick your poison for a bad option just via a dice roll. Compare to cursed scrolls and the various crazily bad or crazily ignorable negative effects, people don't really complain about that, even though they're fairly analogous of situations. The way its presented via fortunes would make it feel much worse imo which gives good reason to allow players to skip
but to be clear Im pretty much wholly w/ this statement regardless -> #1055550986292297838 message
glad mist
If youre picking a modifier than includes a negative addition to the game it should in some way or another force than negative part onto you
Which it "techinically" does with lone wolf and mysterious jokul, just not enough
wicked python
yeah
glad mist
Where as fortunes is entirely choice
wicked python
as a dev you just worry about this kind of thing that would create a barrier for people trying new mechanics you spend a ton of time developing which I think plays a factor in how difficult such a modifier is
especially with fortunes that have TONS of effects exclusive to the mode
glad mist
I love the idea of fortunes, it just needed to be implemented in a better way
wicked python
I find it rly fun to create rly hard runs with them tbh
glad mist
spirit feline is a good one to make it harder on yourself if you have a high damage single hit build
also lifesaver is pretty funny
basically just gives everyone the immortal modifier
wicked python
spirit feline, triple comeback, lifesaver, some other one I dont remember
fallen escarp
Shrine of Recovery.
wicked python
yeah shrine of recovery is pretty tough altho admittedly on its own not that bad imo
but when you put it with something else really hard you actually run into the timer a lot
lucid nova
Its OP af
quasi arrow
Yea if *only* the star ring was good on nona 😭
What is wrong with Star Ring on Nona? https://i.redd.it/uztdcdphh57b1.png
quasi arrow
Look at the damage i did lol
They should add some fucking commas
hoary rapids
How are you guys getting almost 5 billion damage?
fringe crystal
I agree
hoary rapids
Highest I've got must be like 400 million or something?
fringe crystal
Lmao
quasi arrow
So yea, OP af
fringe crystal
The star ring takes little to set up and just destroys
hoary rapids
Wait a second @fringe crystal that's like almost 9 billion, how??
fringe crystal
Overdamage
You ever slap an arctic seal so hard, they lose all 8 future reincarnation lives
glad mist
Also damage inflation via immortals and multiplayer monarch clones are the easiest ways to increase it
lucid nova
How are you guys getting almost 5 billion damage?
Damage inflating at polemonarch
Shoot his clones to get fancy player stats
fringe crystal
Except the pole monarch got shredded
I had all 3 conversions so once i got to hjm i just swapped to lightning
glad mist
Except the pole monarch got shredded
Pole monarch doesn't take damage from his clones whilst he's sucking the juice, so you can just keep racking up damage
Also immortal enemies function basically the same
wicked python
also just to be clear you can definitely hit >5b without doing these things
just happens way less often and any run that would do that much without farming will get inflated regardless lmao
glad mist
Yea if *only* the star ring was good on nona 😭
Tbh... this run is not a "good run" considering it took you almost and hour and half
fringe crystal
Well its more or so me waiting for people
glad mist
What is wrong with Star Ring on Nona? https://i.redd.it/uztdcdphh57b1.png
The most impressive run on this sheet is the 2.7 solo as it was also sub 30 with that much damage
fringe crystal
50% of my runs is just me sitting there going through twitter while everyone collects their ascensions and stuff
glad mist
It doesn't take nearly that long
wicked python
its actually mind numbing sometimes xd
fringe crystal
Its taking you 20 seconds to find a scroll in a list of 15
quasi arrow
The most impressive run on this sheet is the 2.7 solo as it was also sub 30 with...
Asians ¯_(ツ)_/¯
lucid nova
This is why i dont like multiplayer, ppl take forever and when you go fast they get mad and start shouting at you
fringe crystal
Today someone had to speedrun cause they wantdd to finish a run in less than an hour and i hit the portal as soon as the room is done and take my ascensions / buy things while the timer goes down
The guy who asked for the speedrun missed a quarter of his ascensions
We also skipped every vault
And finished like 40 minutes
wicked python
ppl just get stuck doing pointless things cuz they arent thinking giga actively
glad mist
This is why i don't play with randoms
lucid nova
Fax
fringe crystal
I dont blame them for taking their time
glad mist
if you've got that much of a god run and other you're clearing rooms before others get a chance you might as well just force portals
fringe crystal
If i ever have a god god run ill tone it down abit
And stop shooting here and there
Ill always ignore elites and bosses if i can just 1 shot unless the group wants me to
lucid nova
They only times when i accept slow ppl is when they are under lv 80. Everything above should know better
glad mist
Unless you literally have to go afk for a while theres no reason a run should take 80 minutes
fringe crystal
Unless you literally have to go afk for a while theres no reason a run should ta...
Literally
glad mist
Pretty much every team up i've ever done has been under an hour except a few
I don't think i've ever done a game over 70m
even when one of my friends went for dinner mid game lol
fringe crystal
Usually my games are an hour to an hour and 15
But people do play to relax and chill, doesnt bother me
lucid nova
My games are 90% under 40min
glad mist
I genuinly dont understand how a game can be 80 minutes
wicked python
like I said ppl just waste their time cuz they dont kno what they are doin which is fine
but its how u get 90min runs, they are looking at all their scrolls and reading for synergies etc.
fringe crystal
I have to be proud of never having a game be 2 hours
lucid nova
Solo its 99% under 30min and if im speedrunning its under 10min (if i go over i reset)
wicked python
backtracking in the slowest way possible
until u actually realize ur doing it, you dont feel like ur taking forever lol
lucid nova
I hate it when my friends say" hold up i forgot the pedler at the start"
fringe crystal
Lmfao
I literally do everything as i find them unless im looking for a weapon to put a legendary exclusive on at the start
glad mist
I hate it when my friends say" hold up i forgot the pedler at the start"
If i do this or i need something at the start like if i didn't have enough money, i'll tell my friend to start up the portal
fringe crystal
Then people call out stuff at the start when we’re towards the end of the stage
lucid nova
I literally do everything as i find them unless im looking for a weapon to put a...
Yes as you should be doing it
glad mist
Yes as you should be doing it
Also scroll upgrade chests, weapon upgrades/geminis if you're looking for a particular weapon
I understand why people would backtrack
but it doesn't take that long
fringe crystal
You click one button 3 times to upgrade
lucid nova
Yes, everything you shouldnt be backtracking at all
fringe crystal
It should take an average of 2 seconds
lucid nova
You click one button 3 times to upgrade
I dont even click it, i hold my autoclicker on it lol
fringe crystal
Lmao
lucid nova
To lazy to click that shit
glad mist
It should take an average of 2 seconds
there's exceptions, like if you dont have enough money so you recycle stuff. but again
80 minutes in a game sounds insane to me
fringe crystal
there's exceptions, like if you dont have enough money so you recycle stuff. but...
Thats acceptable
I guess theyre just stoned
glad mist
like even with all this shit i don't see how it can amount to that long
fringe crystal
80% of players who i play with are hitting bongs and drinking
So i dont blame them at all
glad mist
If i was with people taking that long i would simply not play with them
lucid nova
like even with all this shit i don't see how it can amount to that long
Ppl are shit at the game somehow
Also, where did all the community managers go? There were quite a bunch for a while but now there are none
cobalt dock
80 min is standard coop
quasi arrow
80 min is standard coop
If you step away to smoke for about 20 minutes.
red glacier
Also, where did all the community managers go? There were quite a bunch for a wh...
like from the studio?
lucid nova
ye
vapid crag
How do I post group id? I'm on steam deck
vapid crag
I love jet octopus. That looks awesome
lucid coral
doubling the effectiveness of your crits be kinda silly
i had a 70% crit rate between enhanced casual gunman ship and counterviolence for non weak spot hits
anything that had a bit more health i hit with the beam
red glacier
How do I post group id? I'm on steam deck
you should be able to copy the code from the top left i think
unreal horizon
Yea if *only* the star ring was good on nona 😭
Star Ring itself is the carry, just saying Nona's ascensions don't synergize well with it. The crit stacking one does though.
winged cove
Guys, is this how you do it?
ashen helm
Yesterday someone gave the enemies lightless shield from the scroll choice. I have never felt so trolled by such bullshit before.
ashen helm
Converts into fire dmg.
Fire water. . _.
ashen helm
Lightless shield plus these little bastards 
, especially the enhanced elite ones, just caused so much havoc. Being swarmed by a hundred suicidal bombers that also have a second of invulnerability. . _. And they got a super speed boost from ostrich rider.
slender kettle
sounds like hell
unreal horizon
Spirit feline lightless shield triple comeback lifesaver is pretty hard to kil
slender kettle
yeah it is
unreal horizon
I feel like the devs have mixed opinions on Lucky Shot's power level because the scaling is all over the place
I also think weapon damage scaling is kinda trash on this ascension https://i.imgur.com/94S3NNE.png The level 2 should be +1.2% weapon damage and +30% movespeed because as is the 2nd level is a dud
That weapon damage isn't the reason most of us are going to pick it
we want the movespeed
unreal horizon
it's general damage, it's not a damage multiplier
general damage is the least valuable especially that low
unreal horizon
The movement speed is the only reason to take it...
cobalt dock
get 100 speed and its 240%
unreal horizon
compared to any of the other 5 ascensions in the tree the level 2 is worse than all of them
https://i.imgur.com/m1n7LZy.png this is considered a bad ascension, yet it's better and applies to skill damage
cobalt dock
can't scale
unreal horizon
so what? by the time you have +100 movement speed general damage is worthless
cobalt dock
i disagree, but playing something else atm
unreal horizon
assuming you're going gun build on nona, since battle pace adds no skill damage to the mech, that would mean you're probably picking a weapon damage blessing
so... overconsumption would make it pretty bad
first strike would also make it pretty bad
if you have overconsumption and were going from level 1 to level 2 it would increase your dps by 15%
compared to the other 5 it is the worst for dps gain
Probably in this order: Nimble Finger / Eagle Eye, then Magazine Modification, then Lucky Break, then level 2 Battle Pace, and probably put specialized Shield on the same tier as Nimble Finger and Eagle Eye
Nimble Finger is OP btw
I think Nimble Finger 2 also suffers from the 1st ascension giving lions share problem
https://i.imgur.com/1B5pltt.png this could be "for the first 3/4/8 seconds after reloading" instead of limiting it to magazine size to make it more viable with all the pistols
cobalt dock
if the mag is over 10 size its infinite uptime
unreal horizon
you mean under?
cobalt dock
ah, ye
unreal horizon
if they want to keep "for the first 10 shots" with my suggested then you could keep that benefit and also make it more viable with all pistols
thorny solar
Most pistols have a mag of 10 and under though, right?
cobalt dock
not star raing 😭
thorny solar
It’s only those weird pistols that make you question why they are pistols in the first place
unreal horizon
cloud weaver and star ring are 2/12
but keep in mind there's nimble finger that also increases reload speed yet 5/12 of the pistols don't even reload
and if we removed foundry that 2/11 and 5/11
and if we account that really there's only 6 decent pistols...
then that's 2/6 pistols getting screwed by magazine mod, not including aura of venom getting screwed with magazine share
that's also 2/6 of the good pistols don't reload, and cloud weaver and star ring are minimally benefitted by ROF or reload as well (and aura of venom gets no benefit from ROF)
so nona's pistol ascensions kinda suck for most of the good pistols...
so the only pistols that meet all the requirements for all her ascensions is unmodified Aura of Venom (using primary fire only) and Sunder
emphasis on "that are good" Scorching Rounds, Thunder Storm, and Foundry obviously aren't good
So realistically the only weapon that fits all her criteria is Sunder
who the hell uses Sunder
So instead we just kinda acknowledge that her ascensions are conflicting and shitty with most pistols and choose ones that fit whatever weapon we find that we're gonna use
that's not very good design
It's such a shame to not use Nimble Finger so it feels like you're better off just not using pistols
Wild Hunt, Hell, Pupil, Illusion, Mortar, Tiger Cannon*, basically every SMG or Rifle (but no enhanced magazine),
Obviously Star Ring and Aura of Venom are still strong without Nimble Finger
but what a waste not to use it
balmy plover
how good is talisman as a weapon
and for fox, are builds for only fire better, or for element combos?
thorny solar
Combust
quasi arrow
how good is talisman as a weapon
as a weapon - shit. as something that can apply lightning orb and delete boss under Bolt From the Blue - decent
glad mist
Get talisman with crits create a elemental balls and it shreds
The right click auto targets weak points
unreal horizon
how good is talisman as a weapon
The only reason to use Talisman is if the inscriptions you get are so significantly better than anything else you find
It is, by far, one of the worst weapons in the game
It has less DPS than a FOUNDRY
and that's by using weapon skill only
with primary it's like 3/4ths the dps
the only reason I'd use glimmering, prism, or Talisman is mostly lightning orb on crit for Tiger or Crown Prince
or temporarily use a Talisman because it has the best humanly possible inscriptions while waiting for something else to drop
Like, a +1 Projectile, +elemental effect chance, +all elemental proc, +lightning orb on crit, best in slot Talisman
is still usually worse than most top tier weapons
I'd rather have a -40% reload Angelic Aura over the Talisman I just listed unless I'm running Crown Prince or Tiger
I'd rather have... a stock Illusion
I'd rather have... an Arc Light with okay inscriptions
but Tiger wants lightning ball on crit at all costs for Bolt from the Blue build
so he doesn't give a shit about how good the weapon is
ideally he wants an aura of venom with lightning ball on crit though
hollow prism
kinda confused on this interdependent fortune of copper miner
is it saying only the first enemy within 7m will drop 2x rewards, and for any other monsters in 7m will be halved?
nimble flint
Not all enemies have those effects you know ?
An icon above them that looks like the scroll icon indicates they have that effect
hollow prism
ohh
nimble flint
its basically attaching auras to random enemies
hollow prism
so if i kill a monster beside a enemy that has that aura, then that enemy will drop 50% less rewards
nimble flint
So if you have one with that aura he causes enemies around him to drop less
Yes
Same for the other effects
they allways go FROM the monster
hollow prism
if i press escape on this current choice of 3, do i go to my next interdependent fortune selection of 4, or do i miss out on all 4
nimble flint
You have a set amount of selection
you can choose to not take any of the presented set
hollow prism
alright ty
nimble flint
but that doesnt give total more choices
wise oasis
Take a scroll everytime because you are chieftain
That does not back down from a challenge
hollow prism
i did that before until i realized enemies get buffed substantially by some of the scrolls
wise oasis
Only makes your victory and their defeat ever sweeter
nimble flint
i did that before until i realized enemies get buffed substantially by some of t...
Or cripples them if they get the Flesh and Bones + Paranormality effect
hollow prism
i see
unreal horizon
gotta love it when the host uses alt f4 instead of quit game and crashes the lobby
unreal horizon
annnnd a second time
wise oasis
Mm?
unreal horizon
two lobbies in a row got crashed after host Alt+F4ed or DCed in desert
different hosts
wise oasis
In mm?
unreal horizon
yeah
fringe crystal
this is what being a bird is all about
red glacier
huh
keen void
how did you get there? it wasn't knockback. that stops you from using your primary.
unreal horizon
just found out the hard way that relying on Nimble Fingers and 1 magazine gemini is pretty rough on final boss dps check
since you know, you can't reload
man mortar 1 magazine gemini without ammo saving shit is super rough
it still spends 3 a shot and you're spamming it basically
carmine scarab
rip
fringe crystal
Tbh... this run is not a "good run" considering it took you almost and hour and ...
i love playing gunfire reborn
thorny solar
dry cloud
man that mass spawn elite mob modifier is brutal
vapid crag
you should be able to copy the code from the top left i think
I can copy it but that's pointless on Steam deck 😞
red glacier
yeah fair
lucid coral
i love playing gunfire reborn
this is why i dont like playing with inexperienced people
40mins start to finish solo
this run was sicc
mcombo, fish and bear, toxic glove, first strike 230 total ammo for combine
got lightweight trigger pretty early
silly fast rof
upbeat drift
this is why i dont like playing with inexperienced people
I love playing with inexperienced people
I love carrying
doing runs with good players is hella fun too, but carrying makes me feel like my way of giving back, since I was carried
glad mist
giving back? most people hate being carried...
at least in games like gunfire
obviously that doesn't apply to games with roles
glad iris
I hate it too because it feels like I'm not playing the game and I ask myself "Why am I here?"
Honestly, I think you gain very little to no experience from being carried so I try not to do it.
vapid crag
I was looking forward to having fun with multiplayer but I think now I'll probably solo at least for a while. I just play to have fun and don't overthink it.
wise oasis
Ill carry, its just that the feeling of progression through your own effort and gaining knowledge and skill is something i think newer players should do in this game
Understanding why certain things are good vs just watching a 188 player blitz through mobs not learning anything
quasi arrow
I hate it too because it feels like I'm not playing the game and I ask myself "W...
Non-asian teams in LoL Worlds think the same xD
sorry, force of habit
glad mist
League 🤮
wise oasis
League at least has muslim representation
Cant say that for a lot of popular games these days
glad mist
Does it?
wise oasis
yeah
quasi arrow
Does it?
yea, one Champion and one player. Can't say "pro player" coz all pro players are asians
wise oasis
wait what champion are you thinking of
quasi arrow
wait what champion are you thinking of
Malza
fringe crystal
Honestly, I think you gain very little to no experience from being carried so I ...
In my experience, I learnt more from playing with other people and I just hate solo games, I’m more of a multiplayer person myself
I learnt nothing playing by myself
Having people who knew the game, I could ask questions and get them answered immediately instead of having to go on the discord and ask a million questions
I also did watch a ton of gunfire reborn guides and tips videos trying to learn the game
Also explains why I have like 10 total solo games played in my entire time playing this game
I can’t stand one person games
glad iris
You learn from experimenting.
Which can be best done in solo.
If you've learned nothing from playing by yourself it just sounds like you weren't putting in the effort to learn.
fringe crystal
If you've learned nothing from playing by yourself it just sounds like you weren...
I didn’t enjoy playing solo at all
Not for any type of game, which is why I only play multiplayer games
I experimented, but in multiplayer
fringe crystal
If you've learned nothing from playing by yourself it just sounds like you weren...
You’re absolutely right
I despise playing games by myself so I did all my learning in multiplayer
tropic garden
guys i need help real quick
if i have a corrosive weapon, with share elemental effect chance with fire, Does increasing fire damage do anything for that weapon?
as it says shares the elemental advantages, so id assume it makes the weapon corrosive and fire damage, but my friend reckons it only means if can inflict burn therefore not gaining bonuses from fire damage increase
nimble sky
Who's stronger, Mecha-fox or owl?
glad iris
red pandas aren't foxes :u
nimble sky
Good answer, but far away from the questione 😄
thorny solar
Just my personal preference
For the main game I like Panda better
For assault, I like Owl better
fallen escarp
if i have a corrosive weapon, with share elemental effect chance with fire, Does...
No. It's still a corrosive weapon, just with an advantage against HP with a chance to inflict Burning.
tropic garden
lame
was my copium hoping it worked the way i wanted, had pyrodominance 2, and the fire fox burning damage increase
spice mist
is this +3% weapon dmg AND skill damage
so like +3% wep AND +3% skill dmg?
or is it just like one 3% increase
fallen escarp
Both.
elder ridge
Lmao I've encountered my first bug, I was playing with the iron mech chick
And I used a curiosity chest and it said 'you got (4 or 5 Chinese characters here)'
And then the scroll showed up as gourmet lol
limber ruin
hey quick question about the connected mind croll.
discord lagging so hard. what does weapon type mean? element or ammo size?
its not clear
fallen escarp
Weapon classification, like rifle, pistol, sniper...
misty zinc
Feeling good first reincarnation 8 clear
1.1 billion damage, I think the owl is broken
fallen escarp
At this point, every hero has a broken build.
The only real difference between them is how easy it is to pull off.
Worst way to "balance" them. By making them all hit the damage cap.
red glacier
tbh i tried birb's leap build for the first time a week ago
it was in a speedrun, but it was my first time on the build
first time ive ever felt effortlessly OP on birb
14m foundry only R1 run
fallen escarp
That's because, despite the obvious issues of killing yourself early-game and screwing over non-Reincarnation runs, All or Nothing builds were actually buffed. To a massive degree I might add.
red glacier
yeah
dapper prism
hi guys, i'm new player, i just unlocked the reincarnation mode and bizarre dream, I wanted to know what were the best settings to use on bizarre drean to play a solo game
fallen escarp
Depends, do you want it easier or harder?
dapper prism
at the start a bit easier
fallen escarp
Pick everything except Mysterious Jokul (and maybe Transcendent Arsenal).
dapper prism
ok, ty
kind void
nah R8 maxed 4 player lonewolf youll breeze through it trust
fallen escarp
Well you will.
dapper prism
ok, i just finished a run r1 2 player lonewolf without Mysterious Jokul and Transcendent Arsenal
red glacier
nice
fringe crystal
Good work
lucid nova
Not sub 10 :(
fringe crystal
Not sub 10 :(
It was so close
lucid nova
yeah just a few mins off sadly
fringe crystal
glad mist
Not sub 10 :(
Is every game supposed to be a sup 10?
lucid nova
I was joking in case you didnt notice
glad mist
I got you were joking, you just mention it a decent amount in the non speedrun channel 😛
cobalt dock
Skill booster working infinitly on Card Storm is busted 
im looking at a replay and i don't any decay procs with Rare astro on Last Star
queen citrus
i injured my hand when i first started playing because the prism was my favorite weapon and that was before they made it so you could just hold down shoot to shoot. i was clicking so much that my hand locked up and i didnt have full range of motion for two weeks. i play guitar too so it was scary
fringe crystal
bought this game 2 weeks ago and now im addicted
It only goes down from here
quartz raft
yo do i need a good pc to run this?
queen citrus
not really
unreal horizon
Yeah I injured my hand spamming Wild Hunt about a week ago, swapped to a macro now
unreal horizon
Spiritual Assault tier list - assuming optimal setups, but not assuming elemental orbs - https://i.imgur.com/pKlbPBF.jpeg
glad iris
With optimal setups, I don't agree with Aura.
unreal horizon
S?
I think it belongs in A because it can be an AOE killer with combustion combined with the highest RPS in the game, making it only inferior in single target to wild hunt but also ranged
Wild Hunt would be above Illusion if it was a god tier Wild Hunt
but I placed it lower because I'm not assuming BIS inscriptions with perfect ascensions and perfect scrolls
but like, reasonably optimal to obtain
it's pretty easy to get infinite mag + combustion, so I rank it pretty highly
Mortar's so easy to pilot it's fucking dumb
literally any reload inscription + -50% reload gemini or infinite mag, you just need to find a way to get ammo
ideally you'd want bloody ammo since it solves both problems
glad iris
auto-lock spores is pretty easy to obtain with smgs tbh
unreal horizon
you mean the 6 slot one?
guaranteed exclusive?
can auto crit hit behind walls when you're close to the wall like rainbow?
unreal horizon
so BIS would be auto crit Wolf Gaze with explosion on death Spore huh
red glacier
Spiritual Assault tier list - assuming optimal setups, but not assuming elementa...
rainbow not S
really put the L in Tier List
quasi arrow
auto-lock spores is pretty easy to obtain with smgs tbh
AFAIK spore crits was fixed a year ago. so auto crits spore its just crits+spore
glad iris
I'm not talking about spore crits
I'm talking about the inscription with spores.
Since spores can trigger that inscription which makes it more powerful.
And easier to trigger.
craggy elk
now i may be stupid, but is there a way to directly see what category a gun is in during a run
trying to play pistol build but im not sure what counts as a pistol
craggy elk
i Can just pull out the wiki there arent that many
but i thought i might just have overlooked it
craggy elk
fair enough
thorny solar
Damn
Tiger Cannon in B and Jet Octopus in C
tough pelican
im checking tier lists for weapons but they all seem super old
like apparently the glimmering is trash but it seems fun to me
especially on cat
i dont think its better than like fire dragon or something tho
wise oasis
most are out of date
tough pelican
is this a game that even has tier lists
because most weapons seem super strong
except the frenzied shark
that thing feels like trash
glad iris
Some weapons need setups to be more effective, others don't.
wise oasis
yes, there are weapons that are better than others
thorny solar
Certain weapons go better in certain builds
Some more specific than others.
Like Frenzied Shark can work decently well with Dog's grenade shockwave build despite being an overall not very good weapon.
Sure, it's not the best in slot weapon for that build, but I find it to be a decent option to go with, and a lot better than other weapons for that specific build.
quasi arrow
just gotta memorize it or alt tab
or pick Monkey 🙂
tough pelican
i understand
unreal horizon
Damn
Tiger Cannon in B and Jet Octopus in C
Jet Octopus doesn't AOE for shit and it's not a good spore target so it's a decent weapon but not for Spiritual Assault
thorny solar
It doesn't?
unreal horizon
the left click is -okay- AOE but nothing special
compared to reload speed tiger cannon?
thorny solar
unreal horizon
or star ring?
thorny solar
unreal horizon
"to all nearby enemies" and what's the radius
thorny solar
No idea.
I ran it with combustion so everything I looked at died.
tough pelican
hey so for the horde mode
if you combine elemental conversion perks together do you deal multi elemental damage
unreal horizon
auto-lock spores is pretty easy to obtain with smgs tbh
https://i.imgur.com/SUKCT9c.jpeg I only got to level 51, I think Aura is better
tough pelican
like if i combine the fire and corrosive perk does every shot i do have a chance of triggering miasma
thorny solar
Don't know for sure, but I doubt it.
unreal horizon
wasting 6 slots on that exclusive thing is kinda mid
unreal horizon
you only get one elemental jade at a time and it only applies to non-elemental weapons
so if the weapon already has an element it doesn't do anything
not sure what happens if you have a normal primary with elemental gemini, if you keep the fire conversion or not
glad iris
I got to nearly 54 with it, I don't think it's a waste. It's there to reduce rng to make the run smoother.
wise oasis
chromatic magazine?
wise oasis
reloading every once in a while will not hurt
glad iris
It would with auto-lock spores if you have infinite mag.
unreal horizon
Tao doesn't need infinite mag, she has Ammo Extractor anyways
unreal horizon
yeah it's pretty strong, though most builds get so strong that you don't even need to throw a smoke to kill everything
tough pelican
i managed to get super lucky this run
fire/corrosion enthusiast
evil devouring sword
lightning shard
im also using the perk which applies all three elements on reload
and i got a really nice aura of venom
unreal horizon
evil devouring used to be one of the best scrolls in the game, not even sure they intended to nerf the damage
probably intended to nerf cooldown but not necessarily perma screw over the damage multiplier...
tough pelican
also i managed to get that scroll which makes it so you dont consume ammo after killing an enemy
so aura of venom goes weeeeee
unreal horizon
yeah, deft hands
fire enthusiast is a bit risky without fire shard / silver shield / flesh and bones / tao so keep in mind
but it's also quite good when it's not killing you
it even triggers Deadly Counter
tough pelican
jesus christ that was a crazy run
you know this game kinda feels like how i wanted tiny tina's wonderlands to be
nimble sky
What 'extra ammo' means, in 3 new scrolls: Normal ammo, large ammo, and special ammo. And what is "in this shooting". it's very confusing
😕
tough pelican
hey so the grenades that proc with acidominance 3
do they also apply hex smoke
or is that only for thrown grenades
glad iris
What 'extra ammo' means, in 3 new scrolls: Normal ammo, large ammo, and special ...
It means it's using other ammo to have an effect with the current ammo type weapon you're using.
nimble sky
Thanks man 🙂
granite prawn
why is this game unable to sync?
unreal horizon
do they also apply hex smoke
acidominance 3 grenades are grenades in every sense
cursive creek
quartz narwhal
was about to ask
dense parcel
Servers seem to be back, try syncing now. May reset you a day or two tho.
nimble flint
Thats not how steam sync works..
unreal horizon
I just ran it as a spore build, it was less powerful than even Lightning Glove so I mean... I don't get it
dense parcel
Thats not how steam sync works..
Oh mb
unreal horizon
unlike single player where Jet Octopus is like a 40% beam uptime, even 75% beam uptime (not including reload downtime) isn't very good in Spiritual Assault
compared to my +150% rate of fire rainbow I just had last run
all the other guns including SMG with crit homing were trash
buuutttt I could see crit homing exploding Wolf Gaze beating it for sure
I had element spread + element chance + rate of fire radioactive gauntlet but that Rainbow blew it out the water
honestly with me killing elites faster than they can spawn I'm a little confused how I still only ended up at 51 last run
distant idol
how do these stack?
got all three, just wondering what exactly my odds are, if they even stack at all
sidenote, critical brick moment
fallen escarp
how do these stack?
Multiplicatively, which is worse than additively.
Instead of a 50% + 20% + 50% = 120% chance to crit, it's more like
1 - (1 - 0.5) * (1 - 0.2) * (1 - 0.5) = 0.8, or 80% chance.
distant idol
ah, multiplicatively makes sense. Now I'm just curious as to how it synergizes with the passive
Does it do the nerfed crit?
fallen escarp
If Surging Crit triggers, yes.
distant idol
hoping that they made that the last check
fallen escarp
That 50% chance for only 70% CritX also applies to what would otherwise be guaranteed crits, like Wait For Good and Deadly Counter.
distant idol
Interesting.
Does that mean that the game interprets the initial hit as a "non-crit" for all intents and purposes?
and if so, would that doubly imply that Brutal Glove synergizes with those methods of garauanteeing crits?
fallen escarp
Not sure.
My assumption is it checks for non-crit, then if effects succeed it becomes a crit, then it checks damage bonuses.
distant idol
That 50% chance for only 70% CritX also applies to what would otherwise be guara...
Just kinda weirded out since the order on this is odd too
so I'm doubting the ordering on other things too
glad mist
Learning more about damage multipliers and additives has very much helped with diablo 4 which has now consumed my life
carmine scarab
whats the highest damage turtle build
wise oasis
Multiplicatively, which is worse than additively.
path of exile players reading that statement
nimble flint
I have eliminated Relead speed on my Tiger Cannon
I shoot faster than Advanced Depot probably
-60% , -50% ,-50% Reload Speed
After reload Dmg and Attack Speed up
maybe for a frame I can see my arm reaching for the tiger canon
nimble flint
yep
keen void
nice
distant idol
sidenote, critical brick moment
first brick of 9, done.
I WILL fill up that 3x3 with
fervent bough
any good videos/guides for newer players? Furthest I've gotten is the desert final boss and it melted me 💀
carmine scarab
Highest damage you guys have ever had in a run?
glad mist
Over 400m but i don't have proof as I lost the save, so on this save its only 177m
distant idol
Highest damage you guys have ever had in a run?
single instance I assume?
unreal horizon
What's the odds of first hit combustion with the standard aura of venom 40% + Fire Tower 50%? If both apply on first hit, does it trigger combustion?
fallen escarp
20% chance.
70% chance to apply at least 1 effect. 50% chance where you apply exactly 1.
30% chance to apply neither.
pearl garden
Electrodominance Tiger Cannon build S tier clearly. No Pyrodom III tho F.
fallen escarp
Assuming that's Combustion, only 1/10th of the way to the damage cap.
fervent bough
I can't seem to get anything going dps wise lmao. Prob just a skill issue
distant idol
single instance I assume?
scoured my old screenshots and found my highest instance of damage (from August 30th of last year)
occult booster my beloved
pearl garden
It seems like the Lightning Ksana was just released and now this post is telling me it existed in August? Wow.
distant idol
That’s what the screenshot info said in properties, but yeah time flies.
Scrolling through, I saw screenshots of me and my friends squadded up as triple prince + 1 dog, since there wasn’t character variety in the start.
kinda crazy how much the game has changed, for the better ofc
fallen escarp
It seems like the Lightning Ksana was just released and now this post is telling...
That's how little you've fired it. Being a lightning weapon with high shock chance and a defensive multiplayer-specific bonus doesn't really qualify it for much genuine use.
pearl garden
It's funny on Crown Prince with Energy Blade at least 
But, as always, Pyrodom III w/ Fire offhand is scaling its damage better than any lightning damage buff oops
fallen escarp
That's what happens when Combustion goes up and Shock goes down when that was already the case to begin with.
distant idol
I’ll always love 
and , but I’ll admit it does slightly hurt knowing that I’m not ever playing even close to “optimal” when using them.
cobalt dock
play him in SA with both his lightning blessing and the generic lightning blessing
true
fallen escarp
How does that fare compared to... I dunno, Poisonous Ghost combustion?
Or even just Crown Prince throwing nades everywhere.
nimble flint
How does that fare compared to... I dunno, Poisonous Ghost combustion?
Ghombustion
upbeat drift
INTRODUCING!!! Some new mod made a ping for a server I'm in
I captured the beginning, and the middle, I'll update the final ping count when it finally gets a temp shutdown
red glacier
what's this have to do w gunfire
red glacier
#off-topic works
upbeat drift
<#717665661236674612> works
k
queen citrus
best frenzied shark build?
if you can get rof and reload time inscription it is a lot of fun. maybe in spiritual assault it is better since you can get fire conversion and gemini it to a corrosive weapon for combustion.
lucid coral
best frenzied shark build?
they killed the best build you could have done with it
you used to be able to do combine mag that had rof get an rof inscription use tao with warlike blade to spam it out like a machine gun
its still not that good even doing that
its a fun weapon just absolutely trash for scaling
lucid nova
best frenzied shark build?
Dog dual wield + aoe radius
queen citrus
i'm not a fan of dual wield. i guess two frenzied sharks are better than one though.
high salmon
I like dual wield I just wish so many of ao bai's ascensions weren't gated to it.
of 18 ascensions, only like a third of them should be exclusively focused on dual wield imo
could also make it so weapons that can't be dual wielded increase attack speed or hit twice, something like that
would also make weapon skills more prevalent for ao bai as well. I should do a write up on this for suggestions honestly.
lucid nova
why does my brick have that critX???????
glad iris
Are you using GI?
lucid nova
@small ledge i think you will like this
the goofy 1hp enemies
doesnt rlly seem to work sadly
small ledge
<@311703843325083648> i think you will like this
Not my favorite inscriptions but it's a solid brick
lucid nova
solid brick lol
rain vale
I don't know what more I could have wanted for a missile run
Also I didn't even save quit to get armed caster and skill freak
Nona busted
lucid nova
dual edge
meager nest
I need help with how to build zi xiao
fallen escarp
Spam cards.
meager nest
ty
fallen escarp
Considering the ascension group is called "Strategy Thought" it's probably the one thing he does that requires neither strategy nor thought.
fringe crystal
i love playing gunfire reborn
@leaden nebula
warm iron
Am I having a stroke or does dashing having some wonky interaction with the cooldown of lightning gov?
I swear it auto fires another chain lightning after a dash instead of waiting for that internal 1s cooldown at level 1.
fallen escarp
It still does that? Thought that got fixed at some point...
warm iron
It was very funni since I had a few cooldown decreases.
Field Proficiency, advanced joggers, magic watch, enhanced good and evil and propulsion device for uhh.. a lot.
warm iron
I don't know what more I could have wanted for a missile run
Enhanced capacity overdraft and sanguine relic. It's pretty chill and the mech will raise you when you inevitably touch any kind of puddle / get touched.
My friend was definitively not at all concerned when she saw me getting downed ~3 times in every room.
fervent bough
idk what mini boss it was but it absolutely destroyed me in Duo Fjord. It was spamming red projectiles and then teleported on me.
dark girder
what tf did I do...
every time I kill an enemy is goes up by 5% help
nvm I have enhanced elemental relic, false alarm
fallen escarp
idk what mini boss it was but it absolutely destroyed me in Duo Fjord. It was sp...
Elite Catfish Warrior.
fervent bough
Elite Catfish Warrior.
that thing was brutal. Was the best run I've had until I decided to go into that vault lol
fallen escarp
He's not so bad once you know what you're dealing with. Other elites can still annihilate you even if you know what you're doing.
fervent bough
yeah it was my first time in that level. I just started playing so I got a lot to learn still
fringe crystal
i love building thorny bloom
dark girder
fervent bough
how nutty does that bow get
fallen escarp
It's alright, but there's probably stonger stuff it could've had.
Nice and solid though.
pearl garden
Lucky shot is always welcome, especially on a sniper. A good damage buff that doesn't rely on conditionals.
upbeat drift
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/815476063718735873/1123091682657833071/im...
I had one exactly like this but lucky
It was garunteed reds
Tho ofc arsenal wasn't on so I lost it
cobalt dock
got the legendary Expanded Hippo with 100% and 60% mag
fallen escarp
Kill reloads extend magazine?
dusky totem
Anyone has a guide for nona i cant seem to make enought dmg
warm iron
Reincarnation or not?
Also, lul. the Brick makes a crit hit sound but doesn't drop stars when chucked at the merchant.
Peddler even.
I've found that a very, very consistent approach for Mech Panda is to just hard line for anything that reduces cooldown, taunt a pack and bring an aoe weapon. The taunt drop is very... potent, to say the least.
Or take advantage of them being taunted and use a scalpel or a wild hunt or something and go up for some point blank guaranteed crits.
upbeat drift
id keep it anyways im just like that
We're getting a divorce now
main canyon
i see.
kind void
"was" 😭
winged cove
Which build do you think is more consistent for Li in Spiritual Assault?
Meteor, Spiritual Flame or that one where you walk and burn things with the spiritual blessing?
cobalt dock
Chromatic mag
dark girder
4mil with a frenzied shark is wild
quasi arrow
I understand that we have a new challenge: to make Frenzied Shark playable?
pearl garden
It's good in R8 too because the game is full of overpowered blessings to make it good 👍
queen citrus
Frenzied shark isn’t even that bad
winged cove
Been trying Spiritual Assault solo
How tf is it so much easier?
There are way less enemies
And they are much less tankier
I know there are adjustments for multiplayer but bringing a friend actually makes things harder
quasi arrow
Frenzied shark isn’t even that bad
Yes, the Holy Trinity of "isn’t even that bad" weapons - Frenzied Shark, Talisman and Lighting Ksana
lucid coral
Frenzied shark isn’t even that bad
The only way it's good is to have projectiles on kill, projectiles +1 and a rof inscription running combine mag gemini
And its still not good
At that level of investment you at better off with almost anything else besides ksana and talisman
distant idol
Yes, the Holy Trinity of "isn’t even that bad" weapons - Frenzied Shark, Talisma...
lightning Ksana somehow has my highest damage done, so I actually stand by that
If it can reach those numbers and my other snipers can’t, it’s doing SOMETHING right.
is it actually worse than others though?
I feel like I don’t get shit out of using the Piercing Flame and Double Calliber
unreal horizon
Yes, the Holy Trinity of "isn’t even that bad" weapons - Frenzied Shark, Talisma...
Nah Talisman, Prism, and Glimmering are all their own shit league, Lightning Ksana doesn't deserve that level of smoke
It's not a good gun, at all, but it's still better than those three
Frenzied Shark is... Well, you shouldn't be using even god rolls over normal other weapons, but it exists
Controversial take? Lava field Justice is extremely overrated and it wasn't rated that highly
quasi arrow
ffs, second time in a row I got Lightning Elite Spearman and Point Blank aura...
lucid nova
I understand that we have a new challenge: to make Frenzied Shark playable?
already is, every weapon is, game is to easy
green blaze
a question cause I don't remember: the damage made by Combustion via decay + burning gemini is included in the overall damage of a weapon at the end of a run?
unreal horizon
Still haven't seen anyone clear the level 1 Foundry Only Fresh File challenge with no skills or scrolls or chests or shops or upgrades allowed
unreal horizon
a question cause I don't remember: the damage made by Combustion via decay + bur...
Yeah Combustion is how you raise damage cap from 10 million, to 15 million for hitting weakness, to 45 million for hitting weakness with Combustion
green blaze
I meant in the tooltip 😄
unreal horizon
You mean max damage dealt correct? that's what I'm referring to
unreal horizon
Yes it counts for that and this https://i.imgur.com/urow2b2.png
green blaze
which is shown at the end of a run when you rollover the mouse on the weapon
mmmhhh then I have no idea how I did so much more damage with skills lol
unreal horizon
you'd have to post a screenshot of the run screen
green blaze
was helping my friend unlock R8
and I wanted to try a primary skill run with Zi Xiao, but the ascensions didn't go very well for that
in game it feltthat my damage started to go way up after I geminied gloves and sword
red glacier
elemental damage
green blaze
but in the end it was just 37% of overall dmg, so I wonder
red glacier
why did you level up your glove
unreal horizon
You got Card Storm 3 and you're a Star Compass build, you also have the Lightning Nova which will cause Miasma
red glacier
that barely helps gemini at all
unreal horizon
He went gemini element I'm pretty sure Jeff
red glacier
oh
green blaze
I said it was a share element gemini lol
red glacier
nvm i see rainbow/gauntlet and i assume spores
unreal horizon
Yeah I can see how you got 37%, you could have ditched an older weapon and you could have gotten a large portion of damage from Star Compass and Card Storm
and the Lightning Nova causing Miasma
green blaze
I don't think miasma has a lot to do with that though, that still does less dmg in coop, right? they didn't revert that change, or did they?
unreal horizon
It's decent depending on the amount of players, if it's 4 it's not going to be a large portion of your damage except early game, but if it's 2 then you could get a decent amount off it if you're not insta-killing enemies
green blaze
well... they were mostly instakilled lol
anyway, I'm still trying to understand if falling start is underwhelming or not
at least compared to a nobrain astroforecast build
unreal horizon
I'm not a fan of Falling Star but I do think there's at least the secondary spam build or the Stacked Deck -50% Reload Hell Last Shot build
green blaze
falling star seems in general very underwhelming dmg wise
unreal horizon
Yeah
green blaze
with all the setup it requires compared to just "cards go brrrrrrr"
unreal horizon
It's just comparably weak
green blaze
seems similar to Nona missile build vs mecha build
at least, from the little I could try them out
unreal horizon
Kinda depends, Missile build requires you to basically never use your weapon unless it's Cloud Weaver, Mecha Drop build allows you to use an actual weapon
green blaze
also, I was under the impression that Falling Star does the DoT effect only if the astrohouse is legendary
but I got the DoT effect even on rare astrohouses
what gives?
green blaze
oh lol you're right
quasi arrow
Yeah Combustion is how you raise damage cap from 10 million, to 15 million for h...
Idk about this damage caps but here is a Nona run. Yea, there may be some combustion procs coz of Fox in team
green blaze
that's why it wasn't 100% of the times that I got the DoT with a rare house
unreal horizon
This also plays a role since you could be 3 rare 1 legendary and get a chance for 2 rares to be replaced with wilds https://i.imgur.com/UDm6lMx.png
unreal horizon
yeah I'm not a huge fan of it
green blaze
(not a little, a huge chunk of meh)
green blaze
yeah, spiritual flame is definitely way better
fallen escarp
Falling Star is what I like to call "Balanced".
AKA compared to a lot of other things that shred the game on any difficulty, it's weak.
green blaze
Falling Star is what I like to call "Balanced".
not that much tbh
especially the legendary one
the dot is mostly useless due to the fact that enemies will go outside
unreal horizon
Altanna's saying that everything is OP in this game and if it was tuned down then Falling Star would be "balanced" in that world
green blaze
I'm not arguing against that at all
but still falling star is underwhelming even under "not OP" circumstances
compare it to a swords out build of Tao
sure, Tao has the OP flower spam build, but still swords out feels ok to use
falling star... QQ
unreal horizon
I think the most vanilla build possible would be like... Energy Orb Crown Prince with a Cavalry
that would be "balanced"
fallen escarp
Swords Out can get just as OP as Fatal Bloom.
You just need a bit of cooldown reduction.
Conveniently, Swords Out has no great blessings, so you're free to go after one that gives cooldown reduction.
inner umbra
red glacier
missiles
meager nest
is there any fast or good way to farm essence
fallen escarp
Join a group of players on R8 difficulty and let them carry you to victory.
meager nest
ty
kind void
There's also pistol build
Always take blue ascensions, aura of venom and star ring/big hippo with mag share gemini
That's lame tho
glad mist
I much prefer pistol build to her missile build
Missile build is probably the most boring build in the game imo
You can basically go afk
south oasis
what do you need for mona missile build?
and do yoy need to use fire mode for iron wing?
fervent bough
I can try to find the youtube video I watched where someone had the perfect missile run
I've been enjoying my fox runs
quasi arrow
Missile build is probably the most boring build in the game imo
Most boring? Hold my beer
glad mist
Still more enjoyable than press E once then wait
fervent bough
lol
fringe crystal
Having characters choose from a few animations would change it up alot lmao
glad mist
That's just a weak build
fervent bough
there are two bosses for each level and it's just random which one you face right?
tough mist
there are two bosses for each level and it's just random which one you face righ...
For all but 4-2
nimble flint
there are two bosses for each level and it's just random which one you face righ...
for now
fervent bough
I got to the boat last night and got one tapped lmao
pearl garden
I prefer snake. New players tend to prefer boat I feel. To me, snake is much easier but does suck if you're not strong enough/relying on Miasma.
fervent bough
I've only seen snake in the vidoes of runs I've seen so I didn't know what to expect when I got boat
snake looks easier
I mean it'd also help if I wasn't dumb and dashed into a volley
pearl garden
Once you're used to snake's attacks it's not too difficult besides the ending rush of attacks that can sometimes clip you even when played "correctly," but usually it's alright. Boat on the other hand...I still don't really understand how to dodge the blue cannon shots without hiding in the back behind cover.
fervent bough
I'm mostly struggling with finding the right weapons
I haven't found a good cloudweaver in days
pearl garden
There's a lot of strong weapons. Builds that would work well with the Cloudweaver likely also work well with other multihit/rapidfire weapons. Unless you're using it while doing a skill build and just want some extra firepower I guess.
fervent bough
yeah I just like cloudweaver. I'm mostly skill heavy on the fox too since it seems OP
pearl garden
It is a pretty cool weapon. It's fun to watch the projectiles zoom about the place although at times I feel like the lid moment in Spongebob. The lid. THE LID. the lid. LID. And the projectiles don't listen and just float around a bit.
fervent bough
yeah sometimes it does some goofy things like not attacking, it took me a bit to get used to them when I first found them
I'm sure once I figure out builds/weapons more it'll be a lot easier to get through
lofty bay
I prefer snake. New players tend to prefer boat I feel. To me, snake is much eas...
Snake feels very feast or famine
You either make him vanish in .3 seconds, or you have an hour long fight ahead
glad iris
I'd rather fight snake just so I don't have to deal with multiple cannons exploding at once spawning a wall of projectiles.
pearl garden
Boat is also worse imo for close range builds as it's hard to remain safe when you can't see what's happening behind you. Snake is much easier to know where attacks are coming from, though you do have to wait for the head charge for close range builds.
fervent bough
Is the fire tower good? It looks fun to use
lucid nova
so when you pick up dual fang with ele share, wich element gets shared? or does it change all the time
fervent bough
Do cloud weavers not work on the boat boss?
fervent bough
Yeah they weren't doing anything so I just died lol
That run was good aside from that. I was melting everything even the other bosses
lucid nova
goofy ele share :D
lofty bay
so when you pick up dual fang with ele share, wich element gets shared? or does ...
corrosion
pearl garden
Is the fire tower good? It looks fun to use
Long story short, yes.
Short story long, it's good because it naturally plays into making combustion ( 
+ 
) hit hard because it's a single high damage, high elemental % chance hit. Gemini with weapon for best results. Look out for blue text inscriptions like +50% damage against Decay, Burning, or 8m AoE spread.
It's arguably even better as a stat stick secondary weapon for other elemental weapon builds. Just make sure you're getting a 50% burn one.
The downside of it, as with any sword/close range build, is that you will be constantly putting yourself in more danger to close gaps and clear out rooms of enemies. So consider defensive ascensions and scrolls if you're not confident in your movement just yet.
unreal horizon
Since Energy Overload gives separate modifiers on weapon and skill damage, does that mean launchers double dip? https://i.imgur.com/ovaQxsz.png
lunar bridge
nope. from what i was told (since it's a question I've asked before), launchers don't double dip and prioritizes +%weapon dmg if something gives both +%weapon dmg and +%skill dmg at the same time. (ie: evil devouring sword)
unreal horizon
err from my understanding, pre this expansion, evil devouring sword was multiplicative damage not general damage
then they patched it to be general damage
so is there a different example
unreal horizon
but brutal gloves doesn't have two modifiers like Energy Overload having two separate numbers
nimble flint
That is still coded as weapon dmg up and skill dmg up
which only ONE applies to launchers
unreal horizon
Separate meaning as 30 weapon and 60 skill vs 30% weapon/skill which is just a translation issue of "all damage"
this isn't a translation issue, it's two modifiers
nimble flint
Then I am done as the answer isnt the one you want but it is it
unreal horizon
Did you test it or are you assuming?
nimble flint
We did test this in the past
unreal horizon
Test THIS ascension, not brutal gloves
nimble flint
scrolls dont double dip
unreal horizon
Is there any other scroll or ascension in the game with listed different stats for weapon and skill other than pre nerf evil devouring sword which was a multiplier?
lunar bridge
err from my understanding, pre this expansion, evil devouring sword was multipli...
this doesn't really change anything...? launcher still only gets the +%weapon dmg portion of EDS regardless?
unreal horizon
EDS was a damage multiplier that uniquely listed skill and weapon separately but wasn't general damage, so it's unique
now it's general damage
that was the patch
fervent bough
The downside of it, as with any sword/close range build, is that you will be con...
I'm mostly playing Fox right now, I can pretty much get to boat every game now but then I get destroyed by the boat lol. I try to run the fire + decay stack since my abilities are fire based anyway.
I got close to the 2nd phase of the boat but the jelly fish ruined it and I had pretty bad guns for that fight
unreal horizon
and the thing is I think EDS listing skill and weapon damage separately made it a damage multiplier so does that mean Energy Overload is a damage multiplier and not general damage?
so my question is it like pre nerf EDS or does the separate modifers act like general damage and you get two low value general damage mods, or do you get one low value general damage mod?
three options, Cry is saying it's 3, I think it's possible to be 1 or 2
flat warren
Finally got it working on Pop_os
unreal horizon
https://i.imgur.com/87LRc5r.png now this wording in the wiki implies that it's one general damage and it's just doubling up the general damage bonus on skills
fallen escarp
and the thing is I think EDS listing skill and weapon damage separately made it ...
Technically both old Evil-Devouring Sword and Energy Overload listed their weapon and skill damage bonuses separately.
Being additive or multiplicative shouldn't matter, if the code merely checks for the first thing it finds.
That being said, I have no idea how Energy Overload actually works, so it would be a surprise if launchers get both bonuses, but I doubt that's the case.
nimble flint
No Scrolls , Aoe inscription +0 Bone dragon
It just gets the 30% not and not the 60% skill
Like every other instance of dual dmg sources
fallen escarp
Can confirm. Maths checks out.
fallen escarp
Maths for those not in the know:
• Bone Dragon: 680 DMG
• Stronger Arrow Talent: +25% general DMG
• Skill Enhancement: +50% general DMG
• Energy Overload: +30% or +60% general DMG
No buff:
680 * (1 + 0.25 + 0.5) = 1190
+30% buff:
680 * (1 + 0.25 + 0.5 + 0.3) = 1394
+60% buff:
680 * (1 + 0.25 + 0.5 + 0.6) = 1598
fervent bough
I finally beat the boat for the first time
fervent bough
Yeah I just got stuck on the boat for like 5 tries
quasi arrow
Is it legal at all?
tough pelican
50% burning scalpel or fire dragon with elemental enemy spread on a pyro/acidominance build
hmm
i took both
blazing lily
Anyone got a good nona build they could put me on to?
fringe crystal
Anyone got a good nona build they could put me on to?
Aura of venom and just take scrolls that help you not reload
Or you can do missile build with fire coverage
And take all the missile ascensions except suicide device
blazing lily
Thank you! I normally like weapon dmg more and I like pistols, so
fringe crystal
Thank you! I normally like weapon dmg more and I like pistols, so
For pistol, take same boat
blazing lily
For pistol, take same boat
Will do, tysm!
fringe crystal
For missiles, take fire coverage
Force recovery can be taken if Ur lacking missiles but you have a bot which infinitely shoots so I usually just prioritise the damage
fringe crystal
No worries!
The star ring works exceptionally well with the pistol build too if you're into that
blazing lily
The star ring works exceptionally well with the pistol build too if you're into ...
I tried it and I honestly hated it lmao
fringe crystal
But it's abit more advanced
fringe crystal
I tried it and I honestly hated it lmao
Have you used auto mode
blazing lily
nah, that might be why
pearl garden
Yeah you can swap it so it just whirs out automatically at full range