Sega Saturn

[safe trail]

Reading that issue, it sounds like the games are fine if not played by CHD... although there is still room for bad rips to be a reason for failure (it's not 100% clear whether the rips everybody is using are sufficiently good)

It would be helpful if somebody clearly stated that it works (with redump set ?) when not using CHD

[uneven dove]

I suppose the fastest way would just be to get the games as bin cue and make your own chds from those and if one format works and the other doesn't then that would clear it up

[safe trail]

Well it was established earlier in the thread that CHD doesn't support the necessary indexing in those games.

[burnt matrix]

I can do that, or try

[safe trail]

So in theory, all issues should be validated against original BIN/CUE

[thorn pagoda]

thats how we generally tested everything on psx core

[rotund steeple]

I guess there are still a lot of faulty CHDs out there, created with older versions.

[wise brook]

chd compression format looses important but obscure metadata
mister users:

https://tenor.com/view/dumb-and-dumber-lloyd-theres-a-chance-jim-carrey-gif-11098164

i’ve found that using chdman to revert the file back to bin cue doesn’t fix the issue

the data was lost in the compression

just get a clean bin/cue

[stiff patrol]

the other thing is donmt use any old chdman only use the latest direct from the Mame release

No metadata is lost in the CHD

thats the whole point of the CHD format

[thorn pagoda]

it was in this case, due to the older chd format not supporting it

[stiff patrol]

but the latests does

[wise brook]

mine might be quite old, cause i sure as heck couldn’t get the game to play right after compression

/decompression

[stiff patrol]

hence only use the latests CHD man and not one you found on some random website

[rotund steeple]

This!

[stiff patrol]

MameDev.org

has the latest

always the latest

[wise brook]

hey, i love randomwebsite.com

[stiff patrol]

dont use ones from one of the bastardised Mames

or retroarch

[rotund steeple]

Or MOMS

[stiff patrol]

https://www.mamedev.org/release.html

[burnt matrix]

I'm doing a test right now with the latest chdman in releases

In my testing it does not retain any INDEX past 01

[stiff patrol]

if it does lose Metadata then file an Issue on the Mame Github with a repeatable series of steps

[burnt matrix]

what if I am lazy

[stiff patrol]

it wont be fixed by bitching on a Discord

[burnt matrix]

what if I keep quiet and just use bin/cue

[hearty marten]

Yeah, that’s not technically true. No data is lost, but metadata certainly is. In theory you can go back from a chd provided you have the original cue file though - but recovering the original cue isn’t possible in the case of more than 2 indexes

[stiff patrol]

bin /cue is inferior

[stiff patrol]

if you can prove it raise an issue in Mame

[burnt matrix]

yes, please. I am lazy

I used Dark Savior which is pretty small

[hearty marten]

It’s well known - there’s already an issue about it

[stiff patrol]

In the Mame Github ?

[mortal mist]

https://github.com/mamedev/mame/issues/10308

[hearty marten]

If you search my message history I had lots of discussions about chd several months back where this kind of thing was discussed

Thanks @mortal mist

[stiff patrol]

Thats a 2 year old issue

does it still occur with the latests CHD man ?

[hearty marten]

Okay dude, don’t believe us if you don’t want 🙄

[uneven dove]

in the end you only need to have like 10-20 games that you'll need to keep around in Bin Cue format

[stiff patrol]

I am asking does it still happen

[hearty marten]

Yeah, it does

Unfortunately

[burnt matrix]

Cuavas from MAMEDEV said in regards to CHDMAN:

"not all TOC and CUE directives are supported (IIRC TOC zero fill is another thing that isn’t handled)."

so yeah there you go

if only I knew what that meant

[stiff patrol]

yes but thats a 2 year old post

hence me asking is it still there

[burnt matrix]

oh

[stiff patrol]

and if it is then probably best to raise a new issue

2 year old bugs tend not to get looked at

[burnt matrix]

yeah lmao they sure don't

to clarify, that wasn't a joke at the expense of Mamedevs. Like I don't look at bugs that are two years old. Development often moves so fast that even a month old bug needs to be retested to make sure it's still valid.

[uneven dove]

Monster Slider out here with its 69 tracks

[pearl harbor]

If only it was a Too! year old Bug!. Then it would gain immediate attention for its extra cool factor.

[grim snow]

Ahhh so when you say weird controllers, that includes something like the Saturn 3D pad?

[stiff patrol]

looks like

https://github.com/mamedev/mame/pull/12191

is a fix attempt

that was 3 weeks ago

so within the current release window

[hearty marten]

Ironically that PR closes an almost 5 year old issue. So 😄

[stiff patrol]

as in all emulation. There are a finite number of devs

none of them get paid so you take what yiou can get

[grim snow]

Thanks for the response arnrh! Guess I’ll start with Snax64 since I want to use the 3D pad and possibly a lightgun someday.

[hearty marten]

No problem at all. Happy to help. Hope you have fun!

[grim snow]

Thanks! I definitely will! Just finished putting together my RGB setup and it looks incredible. All I need now is the ability to use my controllers and I’ll be set for a while.

[stiff patrol]

Snax 64 adaptors also fit the reflex adapt

[safe trail]

It's still open though

[stiff patrol]

Snac is generally annoying as you cant run the menu via it

[safe trail]

Now, even if the CHD compressor in MAME were fixed, that still wouldn't mean that:
a) random users would be using a working verison
b) the decompress in MiSTer would have the corresponding decompress fixes in

[stiff patrol]

Random user needs to be educated to not use any old thing they find but to go to the source for the latest version

[hearty marten]

Okay, so I take it you have a CI pipeline setup to recompress your library of games on every mame release?

[safe trail]

In any case, we arrived at this point due to a user filing a Saturn core bug, which turned out to be unrelated to the Saturn core, and seems to require fixes in multiple different systems in order to work.

[stiff patrol]

No because I keep my CHD up to date and so dont produce any

[hearty marten]

You don’t produce any what? CHDs?

[safe trail]

I don't use CHD so I prevent encountering the issue

[stiff patrol]

yes I dont create any CHD

And currently Mame doesnt need the fix to run any of its current CHD Arcade games

[pearl harbor]

Honestly, I'm just using whatever CHD Man release there was when I needed a friend help me get it working on my Mac. He had to write a custom script for me to use in Terminal. It works, and I've never had an issue with it over the last couple years since I started using it. But I'd never be able to get a newer version working on my own.

[stiff patrol]

Its released Eevry Month on MameDev.org

[safe trail]

Well, the point is... don't use CHDs on Saturn - for at least the games listed in that issue

[pearl harbor]

Unless they made a native Mac version, I'd never be able to update it without help.

[stiff patrol]

https://sdlmame.lngn.net/

[hearty marten]

Even if a new version came out tomorrow, people would a) need to know to update their dumps; and b) the core/MiSTer would need updating to use it. So @safe trail’s advice is the best here

Whether you should or shouldn’t use old versions is somewhat irrelevant imo

[ripe valley]

I was away earlier as I had family business.

So, I've tested the games in CHD format for Space Jam, Monster Slider and Taito Chase HQ this morning.
The CHD files were done with CHDMAN 0.243 from multiple BIN+CUE format.
The dumps were realized from my personal dumps (original Saturn discs), with the same checksums than those in the Redump DB.

On the core, we have some stutters and freezes when the core tries to access to multi-indexed tracks.

With the original BIN+CUE files, at least for those 3 games, the issues don't appear at all.

[stiff patrol]

its highly relelvent. Using Old versions just leads to issues with old bugs that have been fixed

[hearty marten]

Did you read my point a)?

[stiff patrol]

thats the users responsibility

[hearty marten]

Can you read, or are you just trying to be a fucking know it all and have an argument with everyone?

[green jacinth]

Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete (MPEG Edition), this requires video cd card + hisaturn. is this something we could see work or is it possible to get it working?

[ripe valley]

Mostly improbable at the moment, use the regular version (or the PS1).

[green jacinth]

okay, was just browsing a romantic cd site and it caught my eye

[stiff patrol]

Very unlikely the core occupies almost all the FPGA. Adding in the decoding HW isnt going to fit

[shadow merlin]

It doesn't work at the moment (boots but doesn't get far due tot he lack of an MPEG card), probably not going to get added to the core TBH. I own a Saturn with an MPEG card and you're not missing out on much, follow zet-sensei's advice and play the PSX version

[pearl harbor]

And yeah, the PS1 versions of the Lunar games are quite good actually. And there are patches that remove the damage that Working Designs did to the game if that stuff bothers you.

[safe trail]

Maybe in a larger FPGA in a future FPGA console

or maybe not

Nobody seems interested in writing MPEG decoders

[serene thunder]

@burnt matrix
Are you still playing Princess Clara

[hearty marten]

He got sucked in 😂

[shadow merlin]

I used my MPEG card once to watch a VCD of Thunder in Paradise. Worth every penny 😅

[serene thunder]

The final section of the game has like a Giger look

[green jacinth]

yeah, i kinda figured it was a no-go, just wanted to confirm i wasnt missing something being enabled or if it was just impossible. lunar is the only game id have been interested in trying anyhow and there's clearly better alternatives anyhow

[safe trail]

Hmm... MPEG 1 has a higher likelihood of getting implemented than MPEG-2

but not on this core, on this FPGA, as it's pretty full

[green jacinth]

https://new.reddit.com/r/SegaSaturn/comments/13owbr6/lunar_normal_vs_mpeg/ doesn't even look that good tbh

[shadow merlin]

FWIW the fan translated saturn version of Lunar without the mpeg card has had improvements to the FMV so the difference between normal and mpeg is not that great

[stiff patrol]

is one of those games people get all upset about and then even if the HW is added would probably never play

[green jacinth]

good info @shadow merlin keeping that in mind

ha, i had no idea anyone was even clamoring for it

in any case, this satiates my curiosity

[shadow merlin]

It's a pretty popular game and the Saturn's MPEG version is arguably the best version, if only by a very small margin

[naive whale]

Can you blame them? Heavy lift for a few titles that use it

[uneven dove]

It would probably be a good idea to pin SRGs list of multi-index games

so when people 5 months from now come in with their problems for their Nanatsu no Hikan playthroughs we know where to direct them

[serene thunder]

Craboid boss

[burnt matrix]

Yup! Completely agree. Got it pinned right now but thank you for calling it out.

[hearty marten]

Feel free to edit my post to make it clearer if that helps

I’m on my phone otherwise I’d do it myself 😅

[burnt matrix]

I can't, sorry

[hearty marten]

Ah, okay. I’ll grab my laptop and do it

[serene thunder]

I love how there are random cute animals in the chaos

[ripe valley]

I've left the list too this morning.
#1046941029296779344 message

[serene thunder]

Princess Clara

But it may have a name like Purikura daisakusen

[ripe valley]

I love playing that game.

Thought it was more popular.

[serene thunder]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purikura_Daisakusen

[ripe valley]

Japan was not better sometimes.

I respect your tastes in women.

[hearty marten]

Hope that's okay. Let me know if you want me to make any changes.

[burnt matrix]

That’s perfect, thank you!

[sterile roost]

I use the 8bitdo DIY mod kit on a real Saturn controller

I’ve also replaced the crappy switches with really nice OEM-like ones

[ripe valley]

We attempted a Saturn Bomberman mini-tournament earlier with the younger ones in the family, always fun.

And after that I showed them some Saturn games on the MiSTer.

[sterile roost]

With the exception of not having a home button, works quite well

[serene thunder]

If you want chaotic anime shmup, this one also

[safe trail]

Not at all. Just explaining it to others,as this topic comes up from time to time, and I still have no desire to make one myself.

[hearty marten]

Lunar MPEG can get in the queue behind Shrek on the GBA 😆

[green jacinth]

i think i still have a matrimelee mvs poster from back when i used to have a big red. wish those things werent folded. would be a nice one to frame

[green jacinth]

where it belongs

😄

[ripe valley]

Doronjo-sama!

It reminds me watching some episodes of Yatterman during my childhood.

[serene thunder]

Game is also on PSX and probably has fewer dithers
Aside from the dithering on the entire image
Which can be disabled using MiSTer FPGA!

[naive whale]

SaturnDay over on #share-media

[kindred sundial]

Just want to say what has already been said. I had v2.5 ram and upgraded to v3.0. Huge improvements in the Saturn core. If you are on the fence with a lower version buy the v3.0

[serene thunder]

interesting

[quick sorrel]

So for the CHD thing earlier, we don’t know what version of chdman is needed to avoid this? Or if you’re using it from the MAME install from within a year, should it be fine?

[safe trail]

No, it seems that no version is suitable at this time for those games

you must use the games as-is, not CHD

...or don't play them

[frail token]

Wait I Missed it what games are borked on CHD

[hearty marten]

#1046941029296779344 message

[pearl harbor]

At what point does Dark Savior get messed up from CHD? I've tested it before without issues in the early game at least.

[frail token]

Damn

[hearty marten]

Nobody knows, as far as I know. It might be fine.

[drifting frigate]

It loads fine for me but has some juttery FMV. (Ed: present on bin/cue as well)

But 'works on my machine' is meaningless and I trust the math folks are doing.

Both CHD and bin/cue have some rough sound artifacting.

Yes, I'm one of those melodramatic fools who kept both bin/cue and chd dumps.

Wow, I haven't tested Dark Savior in a while...it's looking REALLY good!

[quick sorrel]

Bin cue for two games is not a problem in the whole shebang of it all 👍

[frail token]

Looked like a lot more than two

[serene thunder]

GOOD games

[quick sorrel]

Well yes, but only two that I play

[frail token]

ohhh

[quick sorrel]

Good is subjective 😉

[serene thunder]

https://tenor.com/view/aliens-newt-mostly-gif-25791528

[green jacinth]

https://tenor.com/view/south-park-cry-cartman-crying-at-night-gif-16935682

[warped saddle]

keep your bin/cue of minnesota fats - pool legend so you can experience this hidden gem

[uneven dove]

a critical title in the saturns library

[delicate mantle]

Got my new ram stick from MA yesterday, think it fixed most the sound issues in radient silvergun, mostly the soundtrack cutting out and some other stuff.

[green jacinth]

Shoujo Kakumei Utena - Itsuka Kakumei Sareru Monogatari (English v1.04)

wont load for me, says cd drive open

2.9, single ram

latest unstable

hisaturn bios, either auto or japan

[drifting frigate]

Do you have the ability to try a different image? The one I have is loading fine, but I've had discs in the past that had that behavior. A different image fixed it for me.

[green jacinth]

will try

[uneven dove]

Game loaded up for me just fine on my end

[green jacinth]

was a naming issue with bin / cue

checked cue, renamed and shortened title

almost didnt think of it but windows told me the file name was too long to send to recycle bin as I was about to delete the files and i thought maybe i should check it out

issue courtesy of romance

[drifting frigate]

Glad you got it sorted!

[green jacinth]

me too, now i can proceed to probably never actually play the game. :/

[simple hound]

I have 2.5 ram and this build works flawlessly (except for sound glitches) Saturn_unstable_20240227_07098f.rbf

[tulip urchin]

'

[simple hound]

/new

[twin canyon]

https://tenor.com/view/phuong2-gif-8619471846694107429

[wise olive]

Is the official Saturn core supports direct video, using laserbear MiSTer Direct Video to Component Adapter? There's rubbish image when I load the Saturn core. Other cores is working fine with the direct video component adapter.

[open swan]

last i checked his uses a rankie adapter. i don't know why he chose that particular one, but the last i read that adapter had some compatibility issues

https://mister-devel.github.io/MkDocs_MiSTer/advanced/directvideo/#list-of-adapters-which-are-known-to-work-with-direct-video

it's literally listed in the ones known not to work

but maye they changed the chip in it

[wise olive]

Most of the cores works with his adapter but not the Saturn core unfortunately

[tawdry lion]

The most recommended and supported direct video adapter is the design by MikeS. Others sadly have compatibility issues with certain cores that can't be fixed.

Most vetted vendors by now supply the MikeS design.

[thorn pagoda]

also saturns 480i output is still weird, you might just be seeing that

[tawdry lion]

I do feel bad for those that were early adopters of direct video adapters. There wasn't really a set standard for a long time. MikeS's implementation was the best we've had so most core devs now directly support it

[thorn pagoda]

the laserbear one is just for component video its not doing the new MikeS stuff

[ripe valley]

Revolution X is driving us nuts at the moment on beta testing sessions.

That's not even a game I will play regularly.

[drifting frigate]

I haven't been able to try the new core srg linked in the GitHub yet. Have you?

[ripe valley]

Yes, I've done a report on the issue tracker.

No changes on my side.

I think I've covered all the bases during the tests.

[drifting frigate]

I'm still an hour or two out. Oh, I didn't see a reply. They usually go to my inbox

Lol, it just came in

[burnt matrix]

There’s a visual bug on that Tenchu muyo game

[ripe valley]

Easily reproductible ?

[burnt matrix]

Yeah, always happens to me. Start a new game and there’s a camera zoom that looks distorted.

I’ve been too embarrassed to report it lol

[ripe valley]

That's not a bug on Yakyuken though.

[burnt matrix]

what’s that

[ripe valley]

Nobody should play Yakyuken.

How to describe it.

[burnt matrix]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yakyūken

[ripe valley]

Rock paper scissors for perverts.

[burnt matrix]

Rock paper scissors?

OH LMAO

no the tenchi muyo game is pretty normal outside of screaming anime people. People recommended it as a cool puzzle game to play.

[drifting frigate]

Some of us get tricked into playing it by YouTube comments.

😦

[ripe valley]

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/194

[ripe valley]

Like some tried Miniskirt Police.

[burnt matrix]

Noooooooo don’t credit me LOL

[ripe valley]

Too late.

😏

Changed it, as I don't want Robby to suffer from an otaku effect.

[burnt matrix]

THANK YOU

no one can know my dark secret

I played a fat baby game

[trim nimbus]

mario brothers 1?

https://tenor.com/view/smw-mario-gif-5613089

[ripe valley]

I tried the test build (for Revolution X) from srg320 on SEGA Rally Championship.
Flickering fest on the textures during gameplay.

[pearl harbor]

But those are the only games you play!

Especially your favorite, Magic Knight Rayearth!

[mortal mist]

For me works fine 🙂

[green jacinth]

nagic knight rayearth is a gem

unworking design patch

hoping to see this game to completion

[mortal mist]

I see the texture flicker problem started with core 20240417 along with changes for vram

I see it every time I finish a race and the car starts flashing

Works ok with 20240409

[ripe valley]

So, previous builds have some problem too ?

[wise brook]

grandia is suffering from it quite bad rn

[mortal mist]

Yes I thought it was ok , but I noticed more bugs , especially when you play from a first person perspective

[ripe valley]

Could someone open a regression issue on the tracker about that ?
I need to leave for today.

Thanks.

[mortal mist]

Yes , I will do a video comparison

09 vs 17 core

[mortal mist]

Same for car on Sega rally at the stage end

[drifting frigate]

Yep. The bug even made it into the newest VGE Saturn video. Hehe.

[thick oriole]

So what's the current state of Sega Rally? I've seen a lot of discussion, and I'm just trying to figure out how much of the problem is my 2.5 RAM, and how much is the current core. I managed to finish about four race segments before I got white-screened.

I did see that texture flicker as well.

[mortal mist]

Maybe you could also put this video in the bug report for Sega Rally on github?

[wise brook]

done

[mortal mist]

thank You!

[supple vine]

Does the core support the 3D Controller via SNAC already?

[drifting frigate]

Yes with a 'but.'
3D Controller in 3D mode only. It will not do digital currently. So you can only use it for games that support the 3D controller in 3D mode whole cloth.

A regular digital controller works over SNAC, though.

For fully featured SNAC support, Blue1's core from about a month ago still works. But SRG will likely have it more ironed out in upcoming builds.

[supple vine]

Awesome, I just ordered two 3D controllers. I already have a digital one.

[drifting frigate]

It's the BEST way to play a number of games. Burning Rangers, in example. I love it. Analog trigger support is amazing in racing games, so I prefer it to the wheel, too.

[unkempt matrix]

How does one get the serial input to show up? Got the latest core from update_all, snax64/snacv3 plugged in with a controller, yet I see nothing beyond the controller type selection.
My thumb is killing me trying to play Nights again.

[tiny flare]

Grab the latest build from #unstable-nightlies instead, I don’t think the current “stable” build had SNAC support yet

[unkempt matrix]

Ah, gotcha. That sure would explain it. That link does say "No Access" - wonder if there's a role I need?

[tiny flare]

Yeah, you will need to opt in using the channels and roles tab

[unkempt matrix]

Yep, that there did it. Thank you.

[burnt matrix]

What’s new in the Saturnhood?

[soft valley]

Another day of me contemplating an impulse m30 buy when I have a perfectly good working Dualsense and 8bitdo ultimate 2.4

[burnt matrix]

You should, it’s very comfortable

I actually prefer it over most other controllers because of the 6 button layout

[soft valley]

That’s the main reason I want one

Also bc I love the Saturn controller

[burnt matrix]

I mean how serious are you about the MiSTer? Hoarding controllers is the next step in MiSTer owner evolution.

[lusty rapids]

I have an M30 and it's great for Mega Drive and Saturn

it is a great complement to the DualSense I use otherwise

[cunning citrus]

Same here.

[tall radish]

I should raid my garage for sega controllers since my ironclad has a SNAC8 port

[soft valley]

I have a bunch of Saturn controllers and a bomberman multitap but they’ll all need to be cleaned

A white 3D controller barely pictured here

[burnt matrix]

That’s cool, what’s a SNAC8 port?

[tall radish]

I think it’s SNAC broken out to an 8-pin Sega style serial port? or at least I hope so, it kinda came with the ironclad and I haven’t really thought about using it til now

[burnt matrix]

That’s awesome

[tall radish]

damn I’m looking up more details and it seems like it needs forked cores, which I’m not that interested in using. I might see if it’ll fire up without them and if not, I’ve always got a regular SNAC port

or maybe it works fine? fuck it, one more thing to experiment with

“SNAC8 is an extension of SNAC6 (IO <= 6.0) and SNAC7 (IO >= 6.1). So it has same zero lag. It also works with official cores (but without OSD control and one player only).” nice, time to raid the garage

[trim nimbus]

https://32bits.substack.com/p/expansion-hack-high-velocity

[tall radish]

how are loading speeds in the saturn core? any difference between single and dual SDRAM? i assume it'd essentially be like an original optical drive with no seek time. think there will be any options to improve load times like the SAROO has?

[celest ingot]

No difference between single and dual, load times seem normal but my last experiences with real Saturn hardware were in the late 90s so who knows

[leaden dagger]

Been thinking about this
Is it possible in a hacky way to do this by applying the 3d pads triggers to values associated with the right analogue stick x and y axes

[tall radish]

thanks for the info. some saturn games aren't too bad with load times, but others are a total slog! sonic 3D blast comes to mind

[mossy crystal]

Yeah, I use direct video connected to a crt via composite through YC, and it works fine except 480i which displays like 240p.

I have a rankie adapter, but it's not the best one for me.

[ripe valley]

Just came home, I've seen a test build for @drifting frigate and myself.
The build is perfect for Bust A Move 2/Puzzle Bobble 2X & Revolution-X too.

Today could be another Saturnday if srg320 publishes those commits. Stay tuned @naive whale and @old pasture

[naive whale]

What commits? What did I miss

[old pasture]

Thanks.

[ripe valley]

We are finishing to test a version for srg320 today with Andy D.

[drifting frigate]

Check the revolution x bug on the GitHub

[naive whale]

Ahh I see. I’ll keep an eye out. But I’d run it tomorrow. Just did Saturn Sunday

[ripe valley]

This will fix Revolution-X (the music was cutting off multiple times during the intro and attract mode) and Bust A Move 2/Puzzle Bobble 2X (some jingles were missing when we are winning/losing a round).

[wet hull]

New build incoming

[ripe valley]

Nice.

[thorn pagoda]

awesome

do you think interlacing can be fixed soon? thats the only issue i'm even noticing day to day anymore

[burnt matrix]

Does it fix the issue with Magic Knight Rayearth?

[hearty marten]

Wonder if the flickering in SEGA rally is also fixed

[burnt matrix]

Yeah but the issue in Magic Knight Rayearth is more severe

[hearty marten]

I don’t know it 😅

And I can’t see a GitHub issue, unless I missed it while scrolling through

[ripe valley]

Didn't had time for testing earlier, we will see with the unstable build.

Surprise!

[burnt matrix]

@hearty marten Do you know the Magic Knight Rayearth issue?

[ancient surge]

Disable SCSP debug options

Is the core in a mature enough state that srg is phasing out the debugging tools?

[mortal mist]

Disable SCSP debug options for "normal builds"

[naive whale]

fun stuff

[burnt matrix]

enjoyable things

No, Magic Knigjt Rayearth still has that huge visual issue.

[mortal mist]

whhattt

where ? 😛

[burnt matrix]

Everyone still looks like a fat baby!!!!

🪄 🏹 ⚔️

[mortal mist]

haha 😄

[burnt matrix]

||I apologize to anyone who thought I was serious lol||

[green jacinth]

I've been playing through magic knight rayearth, never played Saturn version. What visual issue have I not been noticing?

[burnt matrix]

Everyone looks like a small fat child. It’s very distressing.

It’s 32-bit, they can make larger sprites!

[ripe valley]

It's always time to mention Robby on the issue tracker. 😏

[burnt matrix]

NO OK

you win!

I’ll be quiet

[ripe valley]

Easy peasy

[green jacinth]

Oh okay I was just browsing github issue trying to find it lol

Looking like a small fat child is my personal aesthetic so I didn't even notice

As a 42 you man I'm sure everyone else does tho.

[hard reef]

This build seems to have fixed a couple of missing sound glitches I was having - the Sega Rally start/ignition sound and some missing sounds in Space Harrier

[naive whale]

coming from a man whos been described as "cottage cheese in human skin" thats bold (kidding I love you but it was too funny not to write)

[burnt matrix]

lol “cottage cheese in human skin”? Oh my god that sounds like a horrible movie monster lolol

[naive whale]

in my head what would be more "fat" then the texture and chunkiness of cottage cheese poured into a human mold. Ripples, chunks, divots...the whole fat aesthetic 🤣

[ripe valley]

CAS latency changes could help for some SDRAM chips.

[halcyon mica]

yes, helped for my older v2.5 single sdram

more games start, those that did start before now have sound

sadly, cotton-chan still crashes for me 😦

[tawny forge]

Whoa! Crappy RAM fix commit 😱

[ripe valley]

Maybe, maybe not.

Schrödinger fix.

[naive whale]

thats the one thing I never say in videos...maybe 2.5 will work better

for every ONE comment I get saying x core fixed 2.5 I get three saying no change

[unkempt kelp]

It's almost like the core is in active development(!)

Haha

[naive whale]

dont FPGA cores just grow on trees

were just waiting for them to ripen

[burnt matrix]

You’re 100% right but for an ignoramus like me all the games I play are perfect. Obviously they aren’t which is why I’m grateful for the testing and super fans calling the issues out.

But damn it’s so cool to play Saturn

[naive whale]

but you made Wood. You know these things

[sterile roost]

Hopefully there won’t be a hardware ceiling to completion like there was for the N64

[tawny forge]

N64 is perfect. We just need a patch for fixing conker 🙃

[unkempt kelp]

Couldn't agree more. MiSTer is wish fulfillment for me in nearly every way.

[sterile roost]

jUsT gEt RaRe RePlAY

[burnt matrix]

I mean, you should get Rare Replay anyways it’s so good lol

[tawny forge]

If it doesn’t run on MiSTer there’s no way it’s any good

[mortal mist]

No change

[burnt matrix]

What’s the Sega rally flickering?

Wait I’ll find it on GitHub

I’ll be better about that lol

Damn nice bug, with videos and everything!

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/195

[mortal mist]

Not only SR

[unkempt kelp]

Unless it's a future core in the making. Then it could be good.

[mortal mist]

This probably applies to more games

[sacred goblet]

I notice that in every saturn games when there is Big screen transition (for exemple just After Sega logo are After a loadin screen) i have some artefact on the screen transition during few frames (i assume that normally it must be a black screen). This is very Quick. But everything is ok otherwise. I dont know if it comes from the core or from the system

[ripe valley]

Just by curiosity, no changes on Time Gal/Ninja Hayate.

[safe trail]

It's a Freudian slip.

[mortal mist]

I think it's the same situation as with the PSX, which is why the Black Transition option was created for PSX

[tawny forge]

Do we have issues parity for both 2.5 and 2.9/3.0 RAM now?

[safe trail]

Those would likely be related to the scaler not dealing cleanly with resolution changes. Inserting a black frame was the workaround that FPGAzumspass used. I'm not sure whether any other cores are doing it though

[sacred goblet]

I'm using HDMI output.

[safe trail]

yes, scaler on HDMI

[ripe valley]

That topic was discussed some days ago with birdybro on the PSX channel.

[naive whale]

video exported...run tomorrow

[pearl harbor]

srg320 is spoiling us! I can only handle so many Saturndays a week!

[mortal mist]

works fine

[burnt matrix]

lol who added that as a sticker

[pearl harbor]

I assumed it was you!

[green jacinth]

Check the file name within the .cue file matches the actual file name. If using bin/cue

[alpine pagoda]

no fix on multisystem ram with this core, sega rally is still a mess, dropped music and sounds, white screens, sound effects that continue endlessly.

[hearty marten]

You got me!

[burnt matrix]

lol sorry

[burnt matrix]

Virtua Fighter Kids still won’t launch via mgl

[zealous karma]

I had the same issue on my MMS with the redump bin/cue. But the CHD dump worked for me, you should try it

I havent tried todays core, but it worked on previous for me

[alpine pagoda]

Huh, interesting, I’m using chd, but can try a pre-made chd and see if it’s any different

[burnt matrix]

@ripe valley good news! No more slowdown during DoA fights. Tested with today’s dual ram build. I must’ve done like 15 straight matches in a row plus practice mode.

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/107

But not sure if I just got lucky, so I’m hoping other people can corroborate.

[zealous karma]

all that jiggle held up huh? 🙂

[burnt matrix]

Kasumi kicked my ass lmao. I was playing as Jann Lee

I did beat the singleplayer though

[wooden dew]

So, 3d-pad mode for generic/non-SNAC controllers is already implemented on the core, just it's not supported by the MiSTer framework?

Or does it also need to be implemented on the core, it's just not possible now.

[tawdry lion]

@safe trail I don't feel this was ever answered well enough but I highly recommend converting your redump bin/cue's to CHD's yourself. Updates (The last couple years actually) fixed some CHDMAN bugs that caused a number of audio bugs.. Highly recommend collecting the latest chdman with a copy of the latest mame and converting them yourself. It's stupid easy

I am disinclined to believe CHD is causing issues until it's proven newer versions of CHDMAN were used

there's no telling if the person who uploaded those archives used whatever chdman executable they already had on their machine. There are a lot of script bundles shared on the internet that convert bin/cue to CHD that have super old chdman executables included

[sacred goblet]

Very interesting. I converted mine in August 2022. I don't have any issue for now. Is possible in chd file to see the chdman version used to convert them?

[wise brook]

seems good here too

[mortal mist]

yeah, it's much better

but not perfect

[burnt matrix]

Oh damn

[alpine pagoda]

no difference for me. I can't even get into a race on the recent builds, white screens after mode select. Still runs if I go back to a february build, but has the same old sound drops it always had.

[burnt matrix]

@mortal mist bringing us down like a teacher grading homework

or tests lol

[zealous karma]

that sucks. You will be happy to hear that Ultimatemister is going to sell new horizontal RAM modules for the MMS. I have the first on they way to me 🙂

[burnt matrix]

Hooray!

[alpine pagoda]

yeah, I was happy when I saw those. I'm still hoping the core just works someday, but will probably cave before long

report on your results when you get it, I'd love to see how easy the process is and if it solves all the problems

[zealous karma]

Yeah, something happened with my MMS ram module when I broke it off the MMS board. So cant test todays build with my MMS until I get my RAM module

[wise brook]

.chd of wold series baseball 98 crashed not long after a match started, comentator kept repeating a line and it crashed to bios

[alpine pagoda]

oooh, yeah that was you, I remember reading. Hopefully the replacement works for you

[burnt matrix]

Yeah? How can I reproduce?

[wise brook]

just spam ok until youre in a match i guess

[hardy lodge]

First find a girl you really really like...

[wise brook]

2 for 2 now

might be the chd fomat

[hardy lodge]

Gonna keep that for later occasion.

[ripe valley]

Better but not perfect too.

[mortal mist]

Recently I realized that my free time is spent testing various things and only on that. I guess it's time to play something 🙂

[ripe valley]

Flowers and bees.

[burnt matrix]

Sorry, I meant it as a joke like “you did good but it’s not perfect DoA”

haha

But it’s awesome we have experts like you evaluating stuff

[hardy lodge]

There was a time when I tested the smt1 gba translation for like 50hours in a week. It was time really well spent and I think it really made it better!

[mortal mist]

I'm not saying it's a bad use of time, I'm having fun 🙂

But I have a need to play something from start to finish 😄

[safe trail]

Well, fair enough. I don't use CHDMAN because I'm not short of space, and I know that additional complexity can cause issues where it's least expected (in this case, rips with multiple indexes). I would recommend that any issue found on a CHD version of a game is retried with a regular BIN/CUE. Then, as you say - if absolutely necessary - retried on a CHD made with the most recent version of CHDMAN. Otherwise, you'll never know whether the issue is in the core, or in the CHD portion of the game... or even the rip itself.

So the safest thing to do is simply not to use CHDs

[rotund steeple]

Never used CHDs. Space is indeed cheap enough today. And i surely don't need Full Sets from CD consoles. I use a 1 TB SSD and it's just fine.

[hardy lodge]

There will be time for that later. In my experience these projects won't be worked on forever (though mister cores have been way better in that regard than many other open source projects I followed). So it's important to help out if you got the time and having fun doing so while the iron is hot.

[tawny pendant]

Can you order the new RAM yet?

[mortal mist]

don't stop me I'll play something anyway 😄

[hardy lodge]

Work!

🤣

[zealous karma]

I dont know, I was the one talking them into doing horizontal rams, so got the first ram outside of normal ordering through the webpage. I will test it and see if i get parity with the 2,9/3,0 users

[mortal mist]

hmm I think there is something wrong with Lara's face in Tomb Raider

[zealous karma]

screenshot?

[mortal mist]

is too scary

[zealous karma]

lol, looks like sad eyes with Bart Simpson mouth

[mortal mist]

but what I really mean is something else

textures break down

maybe related to Sega Rally bug

unless that's what it looks like on real hardware 🙂

[zealous karma]

can you point out the issue? Maybe I´m blind

[mortal mist]

look at the head

[zealous karma]

the seams in her head? I thougth that was part of the 32bit 3d issues. Cant check on my Saturn right now, but I think our tolerance is lower today than in the 90s. So maybe thats why we see more "issues" now

[mortal mist]

this may be so , but today it caught my eye more 😉

without filters

Here it is without filters , if someone can compare with real hardware is very welcome. I unfortunately don't have access to Saturn at the moment 🙂

for me there is a difference between core 20240323 and 20240423

[pastel basalt]

I’ll check it out

[mortal mist]

thanks

[pearl harbor]

It's the analog triggers that are not supported by the MiSTer framework. So games that don't use the analog triggers should be fine. It's mostly racing games that use the analog triggers, and it's those games that don't function properly without using SNAC.

[pastel basalt]

Here’s real hardware (over composite though)

Texture looks more complete for sure

Is your save compatible with real hardware somehow?

[mortal mist]

and that's how I remembered it as I played earlier

[pastel basalt]

Definitely a difference imo

[mortal mist]

yes

something is wrong

[pastel basalt]

If anyone wants something tested on real hardware feel free to ping me!

Would love to help when I can

[mortal mist]

thank You for checking !!🍻

I thought I was crazy 😄

[pastel basalt]

That’s how I felt with battle garegga for weeks…

[mortal mist]

haha yeah 😄

[sacred goblet]

Same for me. Single and dual version.

[mortal mist]

and stable release 20240323

i see difference 🙂

[zealous karma]

yeah, you are not crazy sir

[mortal mist]

not yet 😄

[pearl harbor]

Not yet, but soon!

[mortal mist]

I don't doubt it

[wise brook]

just pulled a fresh bin/cue of WSB 98 and no change

[mortal mist]

What is the problem with WSB98 ?

[wise brook]

#1046941029296779344 message

[mortal mist]

ah ok , thanks!

[mortal mist]

works fine here

[quick sorrel]

Most of my conversions were done with a chdman from within six months from the MAME zip. There was a point that I was converting one that chdman refused to execute and that was when I found out how to get it properly. But I would haven’t a clue how to check which chds were done with the older version, just estimating that half or more were. Thought most users preferred chds if they used SD cards.

[tawdry lion]

sadly I don't know of a way to check what version CHD's are made with myself. CHD's are preferred to save space but they can come at a cost. Previous versions of chdman would convert the audio to a lossy format. Newer versions now losslessly convert it.

Also sometimes converting to a CHD has caused issues with certain games. I'm not sure the exact reasoning, but the data is technically manipulated a bit in the conversion process

it isn't a lossless compression exactly.

to my knowledge, anyway

[quick sorrel]

Hmmm that alone could be enough to push me to redo them.

Fair enough

[tawdry lion]

But it generally does not lose data that is important to the operation of the game

Thus it has been generally accepted to use for CD-based consoles

But yeah, it's why most people recommend never tossing your bin's/cue's

It can't reproduce a 1to1 copy of them from the chd file

@quick sorrel plop this in a directory with any number of bin's/cue's, even in subfolders, and put the latest chdman.exe in the same folder, then run the Cue to CHD script. and it'll do them all for you

there may be a better script that keeps them in their original folders. Sorry as I haven't taken the time to really modify it. It's just what I found on a forum ages ago

it's not just for Saturn either. can be used for PS1 or Dreamcast too

as long as it's a .gdi, or .bin/.cue

[sudden tusk]

Stolen!

[leaden dagger]

Does the new unstable core have too many issues to be worth downloading?

[naive whale]

the new unstable core is like @burnt matrix not really worth it but you know you are going to interact anyway!

[leaden dagger]

Sigh. Yeah I know

[tawny forge]

@gloomy hedge how’s the new unstable core on your cursed mister?

[gloomy hedge]

ping me when the core is ready 🙂

to meet its maker

no idea tbh because I havent used it, but I will once it gets stable

[gloomy hedge]

https://tenor.com/view/dead-my-honest-reaction-damn-skull-skeleton-gif-15885937969029652188

[tawny forge]

It is 🙃

[gloomy hedge]

https://tenor.com/view/jim-carrey-look-gif-3522542

I can do it without even turnign my mister on... I'll do a brain FPGA of mister FPGA doing a saturn

cotton 2 crashes

no it doesnt on mine it works perfectly and with sound and music and it paid me $100 for basement repairs

damn it didnt do that for me

you should get better ram

ok

and scene

[pearl harbor]

Cursed MiSTer is cursed!

[rotund steeple]

Maybe it's a MARS!

[green jacinth]

well that's a copyright strike right there

[sudden tusk]

Can we not name the FPGA platform that “shall not be named” even if it doesn’t really exist yet ..

[burnt matrix]

Yeah, let’s keep that in #fpga-platforms

Don’t want to distract from the Saturn testing and big conversations

[green jacinth]

that being said, tried the new unstable and played a bit of my small fat child simulator earlier (magic knight rayearth) and i don't notice any changes. still full of fat babies. also slowdown, which im not sure if the slowdown is accurate to original hw or not

[drifting frigate]

Those fat babies are by design. Fat babies everywhere.

Victor Ireland humor is a bug.

[green jacinth]

by design? that's working designs!

they have the market cornered. or did, i guess

seriously though, never having played the original hw, is this game plagued by slowdowns?

or is that a core / mister issue?

[drifting frigate]

MiSTer is pretty damned accurate to real hardware in my experience. It has a bit of slowdown. I have the un-worked patch and it's great. But the engine still does hiccup. Eeven on real hardware.

I need to go through and get the Un-worked patches for all of the WD games. Lunar is SO good when you remove the rental difficulty and MP buy for saving.

[green jacinth]

yeah, im running through the unworked patched version atm

im really enjoying it

[pine bobcat]

Actually, it would be super handy if there was a maintained CRC32 database for CHDs converted from Redump ISOs.

It would help reveal:

• flawed/non-redump source disc images
• bad CHD conversions
• outdated CHD conversions (when the format is bug-fixed/updated)

[delicate mantle]

New ram fixed the Batrider core for me, left it running over night yesterday, and it was still working in the morning, no more ram rom failures

[delicate mantle]

Yeah I need to play the unworked, looking forward to it.

[frail token]

Is this even possible given there are different versions of chdman or whatever it's called

[pine bobcat]

That's part of the benefit, if a newer chdman version was released that actually produced a different CHD due to updates with the format, you would most likely want to update your current CHDs.

This would be a way to alert you to which ones are affected, as the database would be updated with the hashes of the latest version (presumed most correct).

For example, that small list of Saturn games with multi-index issues that was recently posted
If the CHD format eventually gets a fix for that, rather than saying "oh well chdman was updated guess I'll need to redo all my CHDs now", a hash db would just warn you about the few titles that were actually affected/updated

[tawdry lion]

I think that's part of what they meant by maintaining

the issue is that... you'd have to run it on an entire set every time chdman updates

which is every mame version

[warped saddle]

or just don't worry about it until chdman adds support for whatever feature (if they do) and then just rebuild the ones you need to. there's not really any need to do something weird like recompress with every mame release or something

even mame doesn't do that

[burnt matrix]

Don’t download chds, make your own

[tall radish]

My CPU is so slow that it’s quicker to download a CHD that make it myself!

[burnt matrix]

Sorry, you know the rules and so do I

[tall radish]

Understood, next time I will make my own 🙂

[burnt matrix]

A full commitment's what I'm thinking of
You wouldn't get this from any other guy

[still maple]

If you just download the CHD, you don't get to write a fun shell script to make the CHD!

[stiff patrol]

I just want to tell you how I'm feeling
Gotta make you understand

[tawdry lion]

so you can make a CHD from scratch? 😮 Wow that's some intense skills

also you did not just rick roll us

[burnt matrix]

Never gonna give you up
Never gonna let you down
Never gonna run around and desert you

Never gonna make you cry
Never gonna say goodbye
Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you

[tawdry lion]

I'll turn you into a cream puff

[severe whale]

I've been away from here for a few wekks and now downloaded the latest beta build. Some fantastic improvements in recent weeks! All sound issues i had in games i tested before works fine now

[burnt matrix]

Awesome to hear! Love reading posts like that. 🍻

[severe whale]

one notorious one that refused to be fixed was the clipping sound in Gran Chaser. That was my go to game to test improvements. Now with the latest build there are no issues. :-)))

[tawdry lion]

I have a number of games but are there any notable recommended Saturn games people would recommend me try

not gonna lie... I've never touched Saturn

[severe whale]

and funny enough, one of the games i tested a few weeks ago was Jung Rhythm, yeah that shameless japan only Parappa ripoff. I was like "this game will probably never get a fan patch"

and lo and behold

a full english patch was released just the other day

lol

[burnt matrix]

Please say that about Princess crown next

[severe whale]

haha

yeah its crazy. That should had been translated ages ago

That one and Nanatsu Kaze no Shima Monogatari are the ones on top of my most wanted translated games for the saturn

[hardy lodge]

At this point I'm convinced all english fan translations are made to mock the fact that evangelion n64 doesn't have one.

[tawdry lion]

I find my file manager invaluable for all this rom management :3

[burnt matrix]

I gotchu. This list is short to give you plenty of variety across all the different regions so you can get a good example of what's available on the platform. These are definitely not "the best" but a mix of really well known and less known games that might pique your interest into searching out other similar games on the Saturn.

EUROPE:

• Formula Karts - Special Edition (racing)
• Herbereke's Popitto (puzzle)
• Keio Flying Squadron 2 (platformer)
• Parodius (shooter)
• Street Racer (racing)

JAPAN:

• Elevator Action^2 - Returns (action)
• Gouketsuji Ichizoku 3 - Groove on Fight (fighting)
• Radiant Silvergun (shooter)
• Tryrush Deppy (platformer)
• Willy Wombat (platformer)

TRANSLATED:

• Bulk Slash (action)
• Drift King - Shutokou Battle '97 (racing)
• Linkle Liver Story (action rpg)
• Ninja Penguin Manmaru (platformer)
• Sakura Wars (strategy rpg)

USA:

• Christmas NiGHTS into Dreams (action)
• Die Hard Arcade (action)
• Panzer Dragoon II Zwei (shooter)
• Sega Rally Championship Plus Netlink Edition (racing)
• Virtua Fighter 2 (fighting)

[tawdry lion]

ooh.. thank you. This is why I asked as some of these aren't on top 100 lists

[burnt matrix]

My pleasure, it was fun to do. You probably won't like all of them but it's worth looking up at least. I forgot to mention I also kept to games you couldn't find on other platforms.

[tawdry lion]

I appreciate that

[severe whale]

Elevator Action 2 is such a fun game

[tawdry lion]

Also apparently it's Hebereke's Popoitto

[severe whale]

you forgot to mention Guardian Heroes

[burnt matrix]

Yeah, I actually did that on purpose. It’s amazing don’t get me wrong but I thought Die Hard Arcade really displayed Sega’s arcade skill.

but that’s what I was deciding between haha

[tawdry lion]

I already have that anyway... also Guardian Heroes was on the 360

it was ported to its Live Arcade

[burnt matrix]

Yeah true, I have it too

[tawdry lion]

I was looking for more exotic recommends

[burnt matrix]

Ohhh, well I guess I didn’t go too exotic

Kinda a mix

I’m sure you’ll get a ton of answers from the real Sega fans. I’m just a Johnny come lately who’s like “woah this is amazing” 20 years later lol,

Meanwhile all the real Sega fans were like “we told you bastards that back in 96 but no one listened!” Haha

[tawdry lion]

xD

[trim nimbus]

If you are looking for more exotic there is always Death Crimson

[severe whale]

LOL

as bad as Death Crimson is there is actually an even worse game on PSX

Cosmic Race

i challenge anyone to play that

its so bad i actually oredered a copy from japan

i just had to have it

[trim nimbus]

bad? @naive whale even made a video on what a misunderstood masterpiece it is

[severe whale]

haha its just awful

[naive whale]

lol no its just straight garbage

[severe whale]

everything. the characters

THE CHARACTERS

[trim nimbus]

well, tell me this, then— if we do not play bad games, how will we know what good games are?

[severe whale]

when I've had friends over who played it, they just become silent and cant believe their eyes

[trim nimbus]

therefore, Death Crimson is the most altruistic and single most important game in the library

[tawdry lion]

now you've piqued my interest

[severe whale]

its funny since if you watch early PSX promo videos sony actually used it to promote the console. lol

[tawdry lion]

I'm always interested in knowing more bad games

[severe whale]

i read that the company behind cosmic race had never done a game prior to it. They had only done buisness cards

it was also their only game

[trim nimbus]

you will (not) be disappointed 😄

[severe whale]

and they basically only used assets from the development kit lol

the music in Death Crimson makes your ears bleed

how is it possible to compose something that lousy. you could get better results recording a beginners child orchestra

[tawdry lion]

perfect

[naive whale]

death crimson 2 / OX is misunderstood. OG Crimson is BAD

[ancient surge]

SEGA Saturn legit has some absolutely abysmal games on there. Daibouken: Saint Elmos no Kiseki, Pappara Paoon, Fist, etc. are all terrible.

[kindred sundial]

I played through the first two levels in Panzer Dragoon last night using the 4.20 single ram build with my new MisterAddons v3.0 ram and I didn’t notice a single issue. Audio was perfect, fmvs played completely. Such a night and day difference from when I tried previous versions of the core with my v2.5 ram from Feb 2020. Can’t wait to test more games 🙂

[severe whale]

Yeah there are lots of great games on Saturn

But there are also some true stinkers

[river wing]

Audio is not perfect on Panzer Dragoon: have you played it on original hardware? There are some FX that sound bad in the current core. It's already been reported (I am a big Panzer Dragoon fan, have the original game on my Saturn and know it very very well)

[wooden dew]

I was getting some loud humming feedback in the main menu of Nights into Dreams yesterday. The hum would go away during gameplay. Is that a known issue? 3.0/2.5 dual ram build.

[leaden dagger]

I would include the NTSC version of Deep Fear and the US Enemy Zero in this. As they are basically saturn exclusive survival horror games
Also surprised no mention of saga

@pearl harbor I ordered a 3d pad for snac btw

[clear condor]

Saving this for later 👜

[burnt matrix]

Those are all deep cuts imo

[trim nimbus]

Can try Three Dirty Dwarves….I don’t see it mentioned much lately

Bad game that is worth playing due to Tim Curry: Frankenstein Through the eyes of the monster (there is a computer version as well)

[kindred sundial]

Ahh guess I didn’t notice. I haven’t played this game in like 25 years so thanks for noting that. I was excited because with v2.5 ram I would get audio dropouts or loops along with fmv pauses. Now I don’t.

[trim nimbus]

Legend of Oasis/Story of Thor is a good one

[river wing]

Don't worry. SRG320 is on the track with these SFX problems, I am sure they will be fixed soon 🙂

And then we will be in Panzer dragoon paradise forevere! mhaaa hah aha!

[burnt matrix]

My list isn’t perfect and it’s not meant to be. It’s not even meant to identify the best of the best. Just an assortment of examples to help encourage him to explore the library. It’s why it’s so small.

And conversation too.

Apologies if your favorite game isn’t part of that. Some of my favorites are also not there.

Not including Bug! is a travesty but sacrifices had to be made.

[trim nimbus]

oh, not criticizing the list (much), just adding more suggestions

I noticed that your favorite game (Magic Knight Rayearth) wasn’t on it, so the intent is pretty clear

[burnt matrix]

your suggestions are great

Thank you

[trim nimbus]

although, for constructive criticism: you are providing a pretty good survey, so you should probably include the genre next to each title to help people more quickly filter

[burnt matrix]

That’s also great idea

[prisma wraith]

Any reason to play the euro release of street racer over the Japanese 60hz version?

[burnt matrix]

It’s in English. To be honest I don’t know if the Japanese version is also in English lol.

[trim nimbus]

Translation…same with Flying Squadron

[burnt matrix]

I don’t know why I have ninja penguin in there lol

Should probably replace it

[prisma wraith]

usually not an issue with racing games, i'd take 60hz over english for most of those, but if its a euro developed game sometimes 50hz is superior. was wondering if thats the case. i have the jp "Street Racer Extra" version

[burnt matrix]

Yeah maybe he’ll see that and think the same

[prisma wraith]

mainly wanted to try street racer with the JogCon, especially with its top-down view mode

[burnt matrix]

ohhh on the PS1? How is that?

[trim nimbus]

50hz means frames are longer, giving us poor old folks whose reaction times have degraded a better shot at winning

[prisma wraith]

no on saturn with the reflex adapt's fake spinner mode. its great for a lot of racing games on any system/computer

[pearl harbor]

Nice!

[grim snow]

Oh my god I didn't know this was a thing. Time to give Lunar Silver Star Story another shot. Loved everything about it exceot the difficulty. Thank you so much!

[severe whale]

Now all we need is mouse support on the core \\\o/

[wooden dew]

Only thing stopping me from playing Policenauts

[severe whale]

SAME

I’ve been sitting on the game like a chicken brooding on an egg

Going to jump on it as soon as we get mouse support

[ancient surge]

https://segaretro.org/Sega_Saturn_consoles

There are a number of SEGA Saturn variants.

[sterile roost]

The plastic photographs quite differently based on lighting conditions

[polar mountain]

We don't report bugs in here do we?

[trim nimbus]

You can share issues you have seen to see if others have the problem/can verify. The best place to post verified issues is the github.

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer

[polar mountain]

Thank you

The sound test visualiser in Steep Slope Sliders doesn't display properly apart from effect 0 and 1

I think

I'm on a single ram analog out

[mortal mist]

All effects are ok , yes there someone ate a large amount of LSD

The only thing to complain about is that the textures are drawn too slowly

In core 20240409 it works ok

And core 20240417/20240423

[polar mountain]

The ones after that one?

That one and the box look normal

The others can't be right can they?

[mortal mist]

Yes , the next ones are ok

They look strange , but that's how they were created

created on LSD 😛

[polar mountain]

I don't remember them looking like that but of course I could be wrong long time ago

[warped saddle]

the 90s and computer generated tunnels....

[polar mountain]

Mine doesn't look like that on the crt

It's strobing

Impossible to look at

Weirdly I can't capture it on my phone camera

[sterile roost]

You should see the mazes

[polar mountain]

Through the phone camera it looks normal!?!?

[primal osprey]

new chdman drop today lol

[mortal mist]

Yeah , looks different when recording 🤣

Strange

[naive whale]

SaturnDay video is loose

[mortal mist]

It would be best if someone checked on Saturn , my memory is also sometimes unreliable

[sterile stump]

Those tunnels remind me of this Net Yaroze game
https://youtu.be/ZNqTJZeccG0?si=S5iwMNzoimhrZfzC

[gloomy hedge]

shhhhh dont tell em

[gloomy hedge]

what do you want me to check, I can do it right now

[polar mountain]

Check whether effect 04 in the sound test is displaying properly on a crt on the mister

Please

[sudden tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/yeah-cordell-walker-walker-texas-ranger-yes-agree-gif-18216916156655954417

[gloomy hedge]

Don't have a CRT

I thought you guys wanted to check the saturn

My mister is cursed

[drifting frigate]

Oh, no problem. Just open the files in a ...... hex editor.

gottim

[gloomy hedge]

Lmao

Community : do mister
Me : mine sucks
Community : do CRT
Me : don't have

Community: do a || kickflip ||

But I do have a Saturn and a Retrotink5x!

[drifting frigate]

"Anyone ever tell you you look like Tony Hawk?" "No."

[gloomy hedge]

Sega Saturn has a distinct lack of skateboarding games

Are we sure we need the core

[hearty carbon]

Which skateboarding games of the era did you want?

Because Pro Skater came out in 99

[naive whale]

Haha my vid today has people asking me to shoot a kick flip as proof 🤣

[pastel basalt]

Tony Hawk 1cc or bust

[green jacinth]

time to cement your status as BigPPEsoterica

[gloomy hedge]

https://tenor.com/view/flip-kick-flip-kick-flip-fail-fell-off-skate-gif-14170285

[pine kindle]

Here's a fairly basic question that I hope someone can illuminate me on. So, in lists of Saturn disk images (chd format preferred) I see files with the same name but they have different endings... like 1M, 2M, 3M and 4M. What is the difference in those? So like "Made up game name (1M).chd" and "Made up game name (2M).chd".

[tiny flare]

The 3M images are the stickiest

[trim nimbus]

Should just be disc pressing codes?

As in the number on the inner ring

[pine kindle]

kevind: So the higher the number... that means it could potentially be a slightly newer build of the game... and that generally speaking, one should use the one with the highest number? Or they don't really mean anything?

My initial GUESS was that it was for how much RAM in MB the Saturn had... but I didn't think so many game makers would make so many derivative builds.

[trim nimbus]

I don’t actually think they are in any particular order, but I don’t know.

[pine kindle]

kevind: Are the numbers an artifact of the disc reproduction presses / makers... or are they related to the software/data on the disk? Soulds like it might be the former.

[trim nimbus]

http://redump.org/discs/system/ss/letter/f/

For example, look at fighting vipers for us. There are two versions in the db, with different mastering codes 5S and 6S

Both list the same version.

So…probably safe to use either.

Maybe @old pasture can do a redump side by side stream 😄

[pine kindle]

kevind: Thanks for the info. Appreciated.

[drifting frigate]

Edit: Deleting this because while I am fairly sure some of my (#M) isos are named such because they have patches, I can't find anything online but a circular link back to the original reddit post about disc versions and I don't want anyone to get misinformed by my misinformation. None of my physical discs have anything but a string of 6 numbers on them, but the reddit poster seems confident.

[severe whale]

in the category of weird saturn games: https://www.reddit.com/r/SegaSaturn/comments/y20e3/playboy_karaoke_yep_japan_had_that/

[mortal mist]

finally some good game for Saturn 😉

[ripe valley]

Mastering code that could be found on the transparent ring when looking to the back of the disc (laser branded/etched).

[simple hound]

Any change to the 2.6 ram situation with this update?

[ripe valley]

From multiple feedbacks since last day, nope.

[naive whale]

Haha why can’t someone ask me to throw a backflip on skis instead

That I can still do second nature

[sacred goblet]

For information i own a Sega saturn with fenrir and DFO. I can do tests to compare real hardware / saturn core.

[shadow merlin]

Might as well throw my hat in the ring too: I have a JP saturn with a Satiator and an EU Saturn with a fenrir if any testing is needed

[tiny flare]

I have an unmodded PAL Saturn, with all of a tiny handful of games…yeah that’s not super useful

[severe whale]

I might still get the Saroo, once it gets more complete. Those short loading times are gamechanging

and the price is very competative

once it get MPEG support :S

[severe whale]

i repeat this

why is the symphony of night on saturn a mess

[mortal mist]

is not that bad

https://www.segasaturnshiro.com/2023/10/01/the-case-for-saturn-castlevania/

[tiny flare]

it's really only "bad" because you know what you are missing from the PSX version

if this was the only version available to play today people would still hail it as the genre-codifying masterpiece that it is

[mortal mist]

yes, this game is simply a masterpiece

[severe whale]

I’m not referring to the game itself but to the fact that there are several patches but none of them is “ultimate”

I would just like a RAM enhanced patch with full English translation. No editing of the script

[cursive turtle]

The extra levels aren’t very good honestly. Certainly not worth all this trouble. Maria is cool though

[analog totem]

does anyone have a link to the list of games that work more reliably in bin/cue format handy? I saved the link to the message and of course my phone refuses to open it

oh wait nevermind, I had to close discord and then click the link haha

[severe whale]

Must be only a handful games with issues left

[wooden dew]

Maria mode is the best thing about it. The slowdown really gets to me though.

[severe whale]

Can’t be too sure unless someone tests the playboy game

[pearl harbor]

At the very least, the most well known games anyway. There are a lot of Saturn games across all regions, so there are surely a fair number of them with issues still that we just don't know about.

[ancient surge]

Hope you like combing through the mahjong games!

[unkempt kelp]

I opted to stick with bin/cue because storage space on my NAS is cheap. Also nice that it works with real hardware ODEs.

[cunning citrus]

Except Rhea and Phoebe. CDD/IMG/SUB or CDI for those 😦

[cursive turtle]

Are the mahjong games full of poorly drawn porn like on the PC98?

[unkempt kelp]

Ouch

I only have a fenrir

[sterile roost]

Giant pain; I used to convert everything to cdi and use a cdi sorting script in power shell

Very annoying.

[sinful verge]

Try Idol Janshi Suchie-Pai series and Shinseiki Evangelion: Eva to Yukai na Nakama-tachi.

[vernal sun]

Was a beautiful day when I sold my Phoebe and got a Fenrir. I actually think I got more for my Phoebe than the Fenrir cost too

[sterile roost]

I did sell the Phoebe as well! Still keeping the Rhea as a relic of a different time 😅

Great kits, but the limited image support is a huge turnoff

[tiny flare]

I was so ready to mod my Saturn with a 50/60hz switch + Fenrir, but then development started on this core and it felt silly not to just wait and see how it ended up...

seeing how far it has come definitely glad I did 😄

[waxen vortex]

Its still fun to mod 🙂 I did my European Model 1 with a 50/60hz switch years ago.

[cunning citrus]

I was so lucky getting a Phoebe back then, I don't want to sell mine. I'll eventually get a Saroo to have a second solution.

When a USA friendly sale opened, I did the process but it didn't worked. I've posted in the comments section of the page. Deunam himself had to put me in the list.

[light pine]

are the panzer dragoon cinematics supposed to be really dark compared to the gameplay?

[thorn pagoda]

has anyone here got a saroo ? kinda curious what its like

[waxen vortex]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txuF4f92h_I&t=256s&pp=ygUMU2Fyb28gcmV2aWV3

[thorn pagoda]

thats pretty useful cheers

[wooden cosmos]

Where do I find the latest releases? The update script from vampier does not work

[mortal mist]

#unstable-nightlies message

[wooden cosmos]

Cheers!

[serene thunder]

My dream is to have a cart like this for Saturn that also has FPGA and cores for Genesis, SMS, etc

[drifting crown]

And megacd but using the cd drive

[sudden tusk]

Look for my comments on this vid !

[light magnet]

Has Panzer Dragoon 2 been fixed? Tried it at a friend's house (he refused to update beyond the 3/23 update_all release) and one of the stages was just a white void.

[mortal mist]

Please provide more details , which stage ?

[wise brook]

perhaps he only has the 1st publicly released core like the really alpha one

[mortal mist]

you never know , I have not completed PD2 with core 20240323 , maybe there is a bug, worth verifying 🙂

[light magnet]

I don't know. I'm not sure which path he was taking. @haughty dove which stage was it?

[haughty dove]

Second stage. The flight-path through the level was a white void; skybox didn’t load in at all.

It’s normally mostly white with a strip of sky at the top.

[mortal mist]

yeah confirmed

no sky texture

[ripe valley]

Regression.

[ripe valley]

Good catch.
I didn't had time to check the last opened issues.

[mortal mist]

is there any way to get to the second stage quickly ? I did not find anything, unless someone has a save with level selection ?

[pearl harbor]

Dang, nice catch indeed.

[ripe valley]

Press Start on the title screen, then press Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, X, Y, Z

Stage Select

[mortal mist]

panzer dragon II ?

[ripe valley]

Oopsie.

Wrong page.

[mortal mist]

I've also seen a few other minor bugs, but this looks to be related to the bugs with Sega Rally and Tomb Raider

when it's fixed I'll check again

[next bronze]

Wow. An N64 port of Panzer Dragoon!

[mortal mist]

not bad 😛

[mortal mist]

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/198

Does anyone have a save with stage selection ?

[ripe valley]

We need the Pandora Box option, maybe possible with a save from Panzer Dragoon Saga from the same region.

[mortal mist]

not sure if it will work

[ripe valley]

I can try later.

[mortal mist]

I have no way to check at the moment

[ripe valley]

Can't use it, but I've another method and it works.

I've imported my PDS save to Zwei.

We can use the Pandora's Box.

I will update and upload a save on the issue tracker.

[mortal mist]

thanks!

[ripe valley]

The skybox seems to work on my Dual RAM system.

[mortal mist]

i tried dualsdram too

[ripe valley]

Anyway, we need a save file, so let's go

Done

[mortal mist]

thanks

[ripe valley]

That's all I can help for now, pretty busy week at work.

[mortal mist]

You chose the left path ? there must be a flying section.

right path works fine

[ripe valley]

Okay, only a path is correct, I will check later (for myself).

[sudden tusk]

That last line sounds almost like a haiku

[drifting frigate]

Woah. Garth.

[tall radish]

@burnt matrix if you don’t mind, how did you set up that multi-bios configuration you mentioned yesterday that uses the right bios for each region? the only thing I could find was cd_bios.bin which looks like a per-game thing rather than per-region

[mortal mist]

cd_bios.rom

create a folder separately for games from each region

and put the appropriate bios in each one

• auto region

in osd

all games should be in separate folders

[tall radish]

ahh thank you! it wasn’t obvious from the docs that this was the structure to use, I figured it meant one cd_bios.bin per game directory which would be ridiculous

[drifting crown]

You can also do that if you wish

[tawdry lion]

@tough star is there something I'm missing here?

How is it that these were the same....

that's weird. They do seem to be when I check my dumps

[trim nimbus]

USA bios was released, then bug fixes were made for the euro release. 1.00 was already taken so they upped the version for newer us releases?

[tough star]

good find - don't know - it's been a while since I put that together

[tawdry lion]

maybe?

[unkempt kelp]

Is there any advantage to the region free bios now that the core features an auto region?

[cunning citrus]

Some Europe games runs better in 60hz, so you can load a USA region free bios and boot those games.

[tawdry lion]

Why Sega Rally Championship Plus Netlink Edition specifically? Is net functions working on the core or is there something that was added to this version for local play?

[tall radish]

Better draw distance, some reworked textures and support for the analog pad.

[burnt matrix]

Damn he beat me lol

[mortal mist]

Yeah but JP verison

Is better

https://vsrecommendedgames.fandom.com/wiki/Saturn

[tawdry lion]

oh dang. fair enough

[rich violet]

Can you user your Sega Rally (USA) save with the Sega Rally Championship Plus Netlink Edition?

[pearl harbor]

Good question. I suppose the best way to find out is to try it out!

[next bronze]

Is that actually referring to Plus? That more accurately describes the original NA non-Plus version.

and why the heck is there no cutting room floor page for this game? I went there to look for more info and found out that they don't even have a page for the Saturn versions.

[river wing]

Talking about analogs: Do you guys know if Retro-Bit's Wireless Analog Saturn Pads work with the Saturn core? I mean, if the analog part works.

I have one of these and can't get the analog joystick working with Nights or Sega Rally Plus

[wise brook]

hate to be the bearer of bad news

but yeah they should

just use the button combo to set it to xinput

[tawdry lion]

Question.... does save data differ between chd and .bin/.cue copies of a game?

I'm genuinly curious....

[burnt matrix]

Nah.

Unless you name it differently it’ll work fine.

[tawdry lion]

ok I really don't get it

I have a cd_bios.rom in the USA game folders

so why does it always say "This game disc is unsuitable for this system"?

[tawdry lion]

For those curious I have a redump-verified dump

it's Guardian Heroes US version

Anyone else had trouble with that?

I've tried BIN/CUE with separate tracks and a CHD from those separate tracks (made myself)

I've tried both US bios's that each have the correct checksums

I'm out of ideas. Multiple people here say they got it working and that's the game I've had this issue with since I first tried the Saturn core

I just checked each bin's MD5 against Redump and they're all verified

Cue as well, same MD5

Anyone got any ideas?

Wow this channel died :/

I tried loading the US bioses manually too

[drifting crown]

What have you got the region setting set to in the core?

[tawdry lion]

Auto

settings saved and core reloaded

[drifting crown]

And are you running the latest unstable main?

[tawdry lion]

I tried with that and the 3.23 version

same result

wait unstable main?

This still needs that?

[drifting crown]

Yeah for auto region

It hasn’t been merged yet

Give it a shot

[tawdry lion]

#unstable-nightlies message

last one I see is this

I'll give it a try

https://tenor.com/view/alrighty-then-well-okay-sure-right-gif-16104115

[drifting crown]

#unstable-nightlies message

Any unstable after that saturn build should have the fix

Disclaimer: I just change region manually in the core as I only really play one game at a time.

Good luck!

[tawdry lion]

I got it. Thanks

[river wing]

I put it in XInput mode (START + B, according to the manual).
But if I set the P1 input in the core to "3D Pad", directional movement is ignored.
The Main MiSTer menu does detect the "Tilt Joystick 1" movements however.

[river wing]

Ah, got it to work! Wasn't setting up properly on the main MiSTer menu 🙂

[ripe valley]

I've seen that srg320 is working quite intensively on the VDP2 these last days.
🤞

Seems to be doing some researches for working on Cotton 2 and other recent regressions we found, adding support for VDP2 hires mode and fixing some strange timing behavior that could be seen on Street Fighter Collection (in the Gallery mode).

[ancient surge]

Oh so that's why things have been quiet for a while.

[ripe valley]

I won't spoil anything more and won't leave too many expectations either, but he's working hard now and needs time.

[ancient surge]

I'm not complaining, just was wondering what was going on.

[burnt matrix]

spoiler alert

[old pasture]

Streaming shortly
#share-media message

[gilded inlet]

start button not working for anyone? works in other cores, tried binding in the core to another button, tried different controllers, no luck?

[mortal mist]

Start button works fine

[drifting frigate]

Yeah, no issues here. HOWEVER...if you're using a 3D pad and have it in 3D mode via SNAC, it won't work in a lot of cases.

[wise brook]

i’ll ask here ‘cause Saturn relevant

is there a way for me to check if MiSTer main has had all of its updates from unstable added?

seeing as their were specific saturn fixes in unstable

[mortal mist]

The last stable main is from January , fixes for Saturn were in February and March

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Main_MiSTer/commits/master/

I don't know any other way to check it

[wise brook]

nono, thanks for looking into that, i was stuck assuming i was missing something

as always i value your assistance

heh, i hadn’t ran update all in several months so it took a long time

or rather

i also realized my favorites script was way outta date

couldn’t add any Saturn .chd to it

[quick sorrel]

is the favorites script not updated when you update_all?

[wise brook]

if you’re update all script is old enough it’s not an option

so i had to update my update to update my script

love this

the illusion of the ceiling lights reflected on the floor

[quick sorrel]

The latest update_all script is 2.1 that I knew of.

and yes, the reflections are nice vfx

[wise brook]

i even grabbed the boot-rom cores for fun

[gilded inlet]

had mission stick saved in input lol. Fixed

[hearty marten]

Which game is that? Has a similar look to the Dragon Quest games on the DS 🙂

[wise brook]

[wise brook]

do you like Golden Sun?

[hearty marten]

Never played it 😅. But thanks!

[mortal mist]

it's Shining Force III

[hearty marten]

Thank you 🙂

[wise brook]

i ask about Golden Sun because the majority of people here are nintendo fans

and they all like GS

so i try to lure them in with the dev hook

[mortal mist]

New core alert !

[burnt matrix]

[river wing]

Nice! 😄

[burnt matrix]

Happy Saturnday!

[old pasture]

Boo-Yaka-Sha

[naive whale]

Fun stuff

[ripe valley]

Happy Saturnday everyone.

[burnt matrix]

That’s what the ninja hero turtles say

[old pasture]

Absolutely!

[naive whale]

Damn it hit the filter with joke lol

[naive whale]

In America the turtles say yippie ki yay mother “fudger”

[burnt matrix]

Yeah I saw it lol

[open swan]

the safe for tv version had it changed to "yippie ki yay mr falcon"

[naive whale]

I mean I get it. But I’m still let down 🤣

[mortal mist]

everything I recently reported on github has been fixed

Sega Rally, Tomb Raider and Panzer Dragoon II