#The grand feedback

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

pearl chasm
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The grand feedback

This post was inspired by Vedals to-do list in NN (https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1072697081443131476/1374126908534427718).
In this post, I want to point at all the issues I, and other members of the community, have with streams at this moment. Any feedback to this message is appreciated. I'm looking to see the issues addressed and questions presented answered. I also brought some suggestions on how to make streams better in my opinion.
!!Important disclaimer!!!: This message was first drafted in the mid of last week. And it aims to focus on picture in general rather than specific weeks or streams.

1. General issues

1.1. !!!Stuttering!!!. The stuttering began as an Evil only issue in late 2024, on one of the dev streams, and since then it only got worse. First it impacted karaokes, then it became a widespread problem during subathon, and nowadays neuro began to stutter on her karaokes as well. Examples of Evil stutter, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0W573qRhyo, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lI48YQeQU4c, https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2465537298?t=01h42m45s, Thread on this issue: https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1367642901185691698
1.2. Neuro/Evil response quality. Back before iteration 18, neuro had no access to polls and Google, and she was forced to come up with fun answers by herself. Nowadays, most of the stream is just. "Google said x" and "Made a poll about y, make sure to vote," which I think takes a lot from twins personalities.
1.3. Amount of streams per week. During 2024, we could've expected at least 4–5 streams a week on average, with only one chill stream on the schedule. Now we got two chill streams, and we don't even hit 4 streams a week on average this year.
1.4. Unkept promises. We were promised a dev stream in April. It is June with no dev in sight. A cyberpunk princess outfit was promised (community paid for the subgoal) over a year ago!!! We are also missing 6(!!!) subgoals from this year as well: Twins Rap Battle, Public MC server for 24h, prank calls, AA release, Tutel plush, and Evil original song. (List of this year's subathon goals: https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1072697081443131476/1343834599582597160)
1.5. Updates. A viewer who cares get a small amount of updates nowadays. And most of them are some sort of v3 voice doomposting. Useful updates on channel direction are few. Issues on this list had no acknowledgment or something in lines "yeah its a problem" with weeks without news. But average viewer has 0 updates whatsoever. Without scouring for updates in NN, viewer gets 0 news. A good thing will be an #updates channel were some plans, some directions, updates will be posted (or they can be reposted from NN via discord forward feature if instant feedback is still important). This will allow easier access to updates to all viewers and a nice way for community to see that something is being done.

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2. Chill streams

Last few chill streams had insane amount of improvment compared to the ones we had for a month before. Segments seem to work again, games are being played and stuff looking better nowadays. Yet a lot can be done to make chill streams even more entertaining. Here some complaints and questions I have left for this point.
2.1. Segments.
2.1.1. Art. Last streamed showed that it works great. Don't want to complain about it anymore. But curious if new systems supports GIFs or twitter embeds?
2.1.2. Games. A lot of improvement on this front as well. But I want complain about unused games and API. For 6 months+ now we have the Neuro integration API. None of the integrations made by fans were implemented. Would love to see Neuro playing some GameJam games or other games for which integration was made. Another point is some games were played like 1 time (Liar's Bar, for example), I would also love to see Neuro playing with viewers again maybe. Liar's bar and Buckshot have working integrations, same with chess.
2.2. Highlighted message overflow. Highlighted messages are a problem in my opinion because they are queued and that they used to completely change the topic. They also destroy any chance of Neuro/Evil having conversation with chat. When they ask chat a question they get prompted with another highlighted message 99% of the time, and this leads to question being absolutely pointless, which is sad. They make normal messages almost pointless because of how many priority messages are being sent in one stream. You can read more on this point in this thread https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1373761349804363857/1373761349804363857

3. Evil issues

3.1. Model issues. It's been two months since we got Evil model. She lacks facial expressions, like she can't smile for example. Her toggles are not working. She got the new model, but she is still less expressive than Neuro is. And it takes a huge part of Evil personality. You can read a wonderful post that goes in detail on this point here: https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1375957641901375598
3.2. Evil being locked in the chill stream basement. It has been great to see Evil have at least one dedicated stream every week this year, a far cry of the sometimes several week drought of Evil content in previous years. However, there is still evidently (see screenshots) more that can be done in terms of Evil content variety, as the vast majority of her streams are still just chills and karaoke, with a 2.5:1 collab ratio with Neuro and virtually no unique theme streams outside of twin streams.
3.3. Plasma globe. Plasma globe can use some updates. It looks mid at best. Niac made a much better one for Evil's birthday; you can check it out here: https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1355554097474044025

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4. Minor issues

4.1. Twitter art tag. I personally don't mind seeing vedal art on the tag occasionally. But I don't like when I open the hashtag, looking for cute Neuro or Evil, but I see Vedal being shipped with yet another vtuber every third post on the tag. The solution is simple: make a Vedal-only hashtag for Vedal art. It won't affect cute family art because you can just use two hashtags, one for twins and one for Vedal. But it will save people from being flooded with Vedal-only art. Kinda thread on topic https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1294938511555690496
4.2. Twitter art repost. Most streamers repost fan art on their Twitter page, and I think it will be really cool if Vedal did the same with Neuro/Evil fan art. This would help artists with getting recognition and attention they deserve for making Neuro/Evil art. A small thread on this https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1370868618077802567
4.3. Model toggles. Evil and Neuro have model toggles that are not used because the redeem system is broken or because they were never implemented. Alt hairstyle for Neuro and Devil horns for Evil; ~~Neko mode for both; frog hat for both; Duck for both. Kinda thread on this issue: https://discordapp.com/channels/574720535888396288/1370470472776679565 ~~. Looking at Tuesday stream toggle redeems seems to be fixed. Curious about unused toggles now.

5. Karaoke

5.1. Plasma globe and lava lamp. Lava lamp shaders are broken during the last few karaokes, and the plasma globe is straight up missing. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2458701009?t=00h09m20s example of always white lava lamp. Missing plasma globe https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2446745130?t=00h12m07s
5.2. Say goodbye to Evil Neuro. Again. At the end of Evil Karaokes, the message still says, "Say goodbye to Neuro". Example of this one: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2446745130?t=02h10m43s

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TL;DR:

  • evil stutter, and its getting worse
  • overuse of polls and google
  • not enough stream per week with less content variety
  • promises being ignored (e.g devstream april, subgoals)
  • Lack of useful updates from Vedal and inconvenient search for them
  • potential improvements for art review (e.g implementation of gifs)
  • game integrations not being used
  • highlighted messages being overused
  • evil model issues
  • lack of evil content variety
  • plasma globe looks mid
  • Problems with Twitter art tag
  • Suggestion to repost Neuro/Evil art on her account
  • unused model toggles
  • lava lamp shaders broke during Karaoke
  • Evil Neuro ending stream still says "Goodbye to Neuro" during karaoke
1Evil_stream_data.png 2Neuro_stream_data_pic_2.png 3Collab_stream_data_pic_3.png 4Collab_split_data_pic_4.png
gritty otter
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the cult approves of this message

trim cove
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To be fair AA release was the joke goal

pearl chasm
trim cove
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they paid more for the new record rather than AA

mild lagoon
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its more of is this just added to the long list of missing subgoals until the end of eternity

lime sun
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Then put a true joke at that point. Like just put Unknown, and if it hits that point, he just makes up something on the spot that's some bs, not promise to release something.

twilit scarab
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honestly I don't expect AA to be released any time soon. not because it's actually been abandoned and the subgoal didn't mean anything, but rather because gamedev takes a long time. a really long time. unless you're making a basic game, it can usually take multiple years, and with everything else going on, it can easily take longer.

I would like for it to eventually come out, but it's definitely something I don't expect to see this year.

would be nice for the other missing subgoals to be realized, though.

pearl chasm
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AA is just one of the 6 (if we count cyberpunk princess model - 7) subgoals. No need to focus on it too much

trim cove
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AA is definitely on the backburner with Neuro

mild lagoon
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NeuroSip why even focus on that specifically, agree with everything else 👍

pearl chasm
mossy mirage
lilac jasper
viral sluice
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Amazing write up, hopefully this gets some kind of response

night cliff
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Evil smile is worth 100x more than Abandoned Archive

ancient grail
vale orbit
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The cult approves of this message

gritty otter
ancient grail
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i will say that from yesterday's experimental stream, im not sure about the poll/googling spam now since, at least from what it seems like, that was reduced quite a lot. could be a one time thing of course but since vedal hasn't given specifics about what was changed, we can only speculate.

still, it's one of my biggest current issues with streams rn personally, specifically the polling... my god lmaoooo

viral sluice
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I just want the damn stutter gone ASAP cause it's really lowering my enjoyment of the streams

ancient grail
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stuttering is the other at this point. at first it didn't bother me all that much until the long drive section where it got really, really bad. now i just can't... not notice it

warped fern
gritty otter
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the first two things to address is Evil's model and the stutter imo

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those would affect the experience the most

viral sluice
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I think a better thing to address is the future of the models in general, both Neuro and Evil. Cause we have no clue what is going to happen to them because of the recent events

warped fern
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Sure.

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Some of these points were addressed/discussed in other threads.

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I would yap about this topic, but there isn't much point in repeating all that's been said.

pearl chasm
viral sluice
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Fridge acknowledged that it was addressed in different threads in this post, and that most of that was just "aware that it's a problem" without any other thing to elaborate on

warped fern
warped fern
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Well, I hope vedal sees this at least.

lilac jasper
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waiting for the dev stream NeuroSip

ancient grail
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He can do one whenever he wants but if he plans to keep pushing it back, would be nice if he clarified if he's at least working on some of this stuff/is being pushed back for whatever big update he's gonna do

devout bramble
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Perhaps he could hire someone, like an agent or something, to schedule/arrange collabs for her. If he's doing it himself that's a lot of work on top of everything else.

gritty otter
devout bramble
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Well we can hope. One thing off his plate would be wonderful.

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Nuero is so good because he wants everything to work so well but he really grinds himself to do so. I think it'd really help him.

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Perhaps this agent could be also a general assistant to help with the merch as well? I dunno, I just think he needs help.

viral sluice
devout bramble
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Oh good! I just worry for him. It is a complicated project and some companies can be one man outfits.

waxen sierra
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yeah... vedal put's on itself a lot of work and let's behind some of those "details" in the "low priority list" that accumulate overtime and never get fixed/addressed

devout bramble
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Yeah, that's why I said a general vague assistant.

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Nuero does great comedy when paired with humans so more collabs is why I suggested an agent.

waxen sierra
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The biggest problem he has is: He's both an AI developer and a streamer manager for not one, but two streamers.
He has help... but not enough considering he has the job ammounts of a big business

lilac jasper
devout bramble
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Indeed!

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It is obvious I suppose.

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But I guess the hiring process might be something that is stressful.

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Because its a process of picking people to trust.

lilac jasper
sharp hull
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my bad for saying I'd be back in april I really did think I would be 😅

devout bramble
lilac jasper
pearl chasm
sharp hull
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ill address a few for you

unique grail
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Is this a shareholder meeting? ReallyInnocent
But good list and overview. Good to see the endless discussion in NN summarized and infinitely more digestible.

sharp hull
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1.1. !!!Stuttering!!!
I know. for karaoke today at least probably going to do quick restart halfway through to stop that
1.2. Neuro/Evil response quality.
actively being worked on. see last stream, this stream (🤞) and future streams
1.3. Amount of streams per week
partly nerfed by no dev streams, but at least we're getting collabs (and some new ones) - there have been periods where I've been worse at this
1.4. Unkept promises
saying I would be back in april was my bad tbh I thought I only said that I would be stupid if I wasn't back by april but I was wrong
all subgoals from this year will be done this year (unless I really can't finish AA or something but I really hope I can) - I don't think this is super unreasonable. some of these subgoals take time too (one of them is literally finish an entire video game 👍 which is great because not like I have anything else to focus on)
cyberpunk princess will come it's just a little more complicated
1.5. Updates
yeah no dev streams has not been great for this either. i will probably just fix this with dev streams

2.1.1. Art
art works now so not sure why this is here, also I did give a hard to find update in nn about this but no we still don't support gifs or twitter embeds
2.1.2. Games
afaik liars bar got updated and broke the mod but not 100% sure if this was fixed. for chess I rewrote to use the new game API for the filian collab and with a few more lines should work nicely for chat but need to do that. I did do the cookie clicker fan integration but yes need to do more of these. I've mentioned before that I partly need to fix security for it. If I had nothing else to do this would be easy. sorry for taking a while on this

3.1. Model issues
her toggles are working. I think smiling should return, am very aware of the discourse on this

4.3. Model toggles.
toggles fixed now. most toggles are used or I have plans for

5.1. Plasma globe and lava lamp
not sure about lava lamp, plasma globe will come back to evil karaoke today
5.2. Say goodbye to Evil Neuro. Again
was already fixed after last evil karaoke stream

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I hope that answers some of your questions

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but generally just know that I do read a lot of feedback so I'm aware of 90% of issues

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main thing is just lack of communication (or good communication) from me because no dev streams

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i think i know the fix for that one

hollow fjord
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Will you stream regularly again or one dev stream per few months is all we will get?

viral sluice
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Thanks for the response, I'm really happy about that model part cause I thought that this is just how it's going to be from now on.

warped fern
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That’s great to hear.

lilac jasper
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neuroPray thank you

lilac finch
pearl chasm
sharp hull
pine crown
pearl chasm
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If possible some time frames when to expect some stuff will be appreciated as well

rustic gyro
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ok you're doing great vedul.

hollow fjord
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LETS GOOOO

mild lagoon
proper violet
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That means dev stream is confirmed now?

lilac jasper
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one day

neat igloo
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Soon™️

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Which could be tomorrow, could be November

lilac finch
hollow fjord
lilac finch
proper violet
lilac finch
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That's fair I guess, also lets him get immediate feedback on stuff since it's on stream

tight cloud
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nice to read, thanks for the infos

dapper dove
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Dev stream? Where neuroLookUp

lilac finch
dapper dove
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Good comprehensive list. Thanks for the updates neuroHypers

vagrant ferry
rare kettle
eternal vapor
devout bramble
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Perhaps some vedal streams with nuero and/or evil that aren't tech updates like the scribblenauts stream.

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Sorry If I don't know the actual amount of how often things happen. I'm new not only to the discord but the nuero in general.

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I think a lot of people just enjoy their Vedal/Nuero comedy fix.

pearl chasm
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I think this thread can be locked now. We've got a reply from Vedal (thanks for this one btw). It seems like thread served its purpose and If nobody against it I will lock it

proper violet
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im fine with it

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thank you for making the thread

rare kettle
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good read, thank you for the thread

devout bramble
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I agree, I have nothing of great signifigance. And vedal replied(thank you and that was very detailed!)

pearl chasm
mild lagoon
warped fern
pearl chasm
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okay I can't close it wheehw

hexed parrot
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ask crimon

pearl chasm
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@brave patrol Really sorry for pinging you ReallyInnocent
This thread is answered can you please %lock

hollow fjord
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wait, teletric is typing

unique grail
lime nacelle
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Regarding highlighted messages, it would also be helpful to have a visual indicator on stream to show queue size and whether or not the queue is open to prevent people wasting their money/channel points and also to know whether the queue is overflowing or not.

sharp sandal
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Thanks for your response, Vedal! Nice to know you read so much of the feedback, I know there's a lot of it just because of how many of us there are. 😛

spiral lintel
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this was a nice read. thank you for doing these Fridge and thank you for the updates Vedal neurOkay

brave patrol
teal pollen
pearl chasm
granite pier
brave patrol
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alright was just waiting for that last message so I’ll close it