Bring back dev streams already!!

[golden flax]

Making this post because I saw this message in NN and it made me unreasonably upset
It's been almost 4 months since the subathon ended and so many things have happened that are worth talking about on stream. You say you're waiting for something "cool" to show off before returning but so many cool things have already happened

• New experimental features like twin-calling and the "more serious" upgrade from Ellie's collab
• Smaller updates like the changes to the art tags, and stuff like evil's new discord account and if that will actually change anything or is purely cosmetic
• A whole ass new model for Evil with new expressions and toggles to show off, and what the potential is for new outfits in the future
• Keeping us in the loop on things like how V3 voice is going and the potential next intelligence upgrade, more than just a few vague posts in NN every week or so...
• The IRL stream with both twins which went way better than expected. How did you pull that off so well? What happened behind the scenes?
• Neuro-dog: Ellie has delivered it already so we could get some updates on that, even just pictures or video of it working with neuro controlling it
• The fan project where we sent two fumos to space, made some amazing art and got even more billboards! It was such an insane thing and has never been talked about on stream which is really sad

Also the Dev streams were great for getting the schedule for the upcoming week (even if they were usually incomplete). The system we have right now of the schedule releasing a few hours before the first stream is frankly unreasonable for people in asian timezones who have to commit to staying up late or waking up very early to catch streams and can't prepare anymore...

Don't let this be like last year where you kept stalling because you wanted something big to come back with... There is so much to talk about and (most of) the fanbase would really appreciate you coming back to streams to talk about behind-the-scenes again

[chilly bolt]

[golden flax]

probably more things too but I hit the character limit on my post oops

• New merch has come out and been delivered already, maybe some updates on the lavalamps? Update on when the tutel plush is coming?
• wtf is going on with the neuro games API? Surely it's time to let her play the game jam games on stream now (also vedal still hasn't played alex's game)
• Easter Art Competition is coming up, can spread the word to more people outside of just neurocord, maybe even show off the art on stream once it's done

[steel gulch]

yeah I do think twin calling was one of those things to show off/test in a dev stream

[hybrid rivet]

Oh man, we're about to start some fire

[primal sand]

[native flicker]

Very based post, I agree. I don't even think that regular dev streams have to come back, but to say that there was not enough new cool stuff to show off on at least a singular dev stream is just a lie.

[hybrid rivet]

Well, he said he will be back in April on the ac:s stream

[nimble sandal]

tbh i think he definitely could do a dev stream now with there being so much now

[molten bison]

Preferably, I would like dev streams to be more sparse, but filled with some actual content.
I would love Vedal to review fanmade projects, some arts (we had tons of them for Evil's birthday, pretty much none of them were showed to people on stream), we had CN Swarm coming up with cool stuff like Plant Vs Zombies mod with Evil, animations etc.
And, as the post mentioned, there's a lot of technicalities that could be discussed with the viewers. New features don't have to be fully finished to have viewers express their opinion on them, having some constructive feedback and general view on what the community wants could be benefitial.

[nimble sandal]

we could've even had a couple now with the amount that's changed. even less talked about things like how clearly evil's latency has had a big improvement compared to last year

i don't want there to be dev streams just for the sake of there being dev streams, but there's been a lot to talk about

[golden flax]

I do really wish vedal would show more fan stuff on stream, I'm still sad about the CN art contest from last year where only one art ever got shown and it was on a random neuro art review

the neuro community is so cracked

[molten bison]

That's my issue with dev streams, there's been a couple of them in the channel's history that felt really forced.
Vedal appeared on stream, stalled any dev stuff for an hour or longer, then proceeded to form some sort of general schedule, and that's it
Don't get me wrong, I appreciate what he does, but this time could be spent more productively, there's so much going on all the time, and we barely get a glimpse of it unless we obsessively check the Discord server every day

[steel gulch]

I think it's better to use dev streams as experimental Neuro streams to test out stuff before they show off in the "main streams", potentially to avoid scuff.

I do agree that he should bring them back at some point, but I do have some notes about what you have said:

• Stuff like changes to art tags is a Discord-server thing, does not really have anything to do with Neuro or her development.

• V3 voice is probably not something he is ready to show off, even if it's experimental. That's why he's been updating us via messages on Discord, because that's actually all he probably has to say about it at the moment.

• There still should be surprises and I feel like it's cool to build hype over new outfits, but that's something that could be done in a 10 second YouTube short showing a silhouette rather than something Vedal has to show on stream.

[golden flax]

I think one of the benefits of dev streams is it's a garaunteed neuro collab every week. So having less of them I think is totally fine if he can keep up the momentum of still having 1 or 2 collabs a week

[keen geyser]

I dont think there is any need for regular dev streams if there is nothing to show but there is a lot to show atleast right now. Many changes even from last year that has basically been skipped like evil's latency. (This one i noticed bcs vedal talked about how to him the latency feels worse but he mightve forgotten the last time he talked about latency, evil took a noticable amount of time to respond).

Also i would've liked to hear more about evil's birthday and a lot of the assets that arent used atleast at the time of writing this such as the logo.
Or even the unfinished work on evil's model.

Even things like twincalling can be shown off on dev streams and would allow more ironing out the bugs and problems.

TLDR: I would like dev streams when there is stuff to talk about (not only big stuff such as V3 but also regular development) but I don't want weekly dev streams back bcs I do not enjoy a tired british man scrambling for content instead of doing dev work or talking about things.

[nimble sandal]

theree's so many things for him to discuss rn.

and honestly, should go a step further and show off more community projects

[native flicker]

Twin calling was absolutely a great contender for an experimental dev stream. Just have the twins call each other and see what bugs pop up. Like with that dev stream where Neuro called Filian once she got the Discord account.

[nimble sandal]

there's still not many people who even know about the Titanium MV that was made

good way to spread that awareness? bringing it up on the devstream where there's tons of people watching

[keen geyser]

CN projects found dead in a ditch

[golden flax]

yeah I agree he doesn't have to reveal everything surprises are always fun too, those were just some examples of things he could talk about

[nimble sandal]

exactly

and that CN art contest

hell was there even anything about the discord halloween art contest?

i forgor

[hybrid rivet]

Honestly, I don't care if there is something to show on dev stream or not. I just really like to see him hanging out with twins at least once a week. It's just good content

[molten bison]

also the tententengokujigokugoku animation made by copperl1on, this video deserves some exposure
especially the updated version with Neuro and Evil vocals

[nimble sandal]

this too

[golden flax]

I 100% agree I love his dynamic with the twins, though if he does want to show himself less on the channel and move the focus more onto neuro then I'll respect his decision

[molten bison]

I feel bad for Waya for putting effort into this contest, sharing all the arts, only to be ignored

[radiant bay]

two CN art contests

[steel gulch]

there are many things he can discuss, yeah, but i feel like that time would be better used for developing neuro.

if he doesn't want to be a part of a stream or doesn't feel comfortable doing so, just leave the man be. let him cook in the background. his job is to be a developer, not a public figure.

[high juniper]

I will have to say you might be forgetting on how Vedal started to treat the dev streams before the break:

• most of the info he gave us would be left hanging : new features always left with a "wait and see" or something that was forgotten and added to the list cause he got pissed that he forgot
• bugs never really talked about or not acknowledged and those that were usually were a "I fixed that annoying bug"
• the tackle/prepare for streams like the twin disney were like "yeah we had some issues but it was fine"
• community projects either ignored or only showed after people spammed the hell out for him to show

so honestly there is ton of stuff to be talked about on the dev stream, but would Vedal talk about it? - this is the place where I am, I believe there should be a dev stream IF it is to talk about all of these things and not do a collab_lite for the sake of filling the schedule

[molten bison]

That's a fair point, I like to watch Vedal and twins hanging out.
But not at the cost of doing nothing and ignoring everything that is going on in the community
if there is literally nothing to show, then that's acceptable, I think

[nimble sandal]

then at that point why even have dev streams

if he's not gonaa talk about that kind of stuff

or acknowledge anything the community has done outside of like one comment in NN

reminder we sent the twins to space

[steel gulch]

he said he does wanna show something off, but also you should respect that he just doesn't feel like it's the right time

[nimble sandal]

absolutely 0 acknowledgement from vedal outside of a single comment in NN that few people will see

[steel gulch]

again, I don't think he feels comfortable being a public figure

that's what the twins are for

[nimble sandal]

he's doing a bad job at even that

[golden flax]

the point I'm trying to get across with the post is that there are a lot of things that he can talk about right now in a dev stream if he wants to, and he doesn't need to wait for some big epic thing to be complete before he returns

[high juniper]

there are some thing that he could use twitter for

[native flicker]

Then he should let the twins tweet this stuff out or share it in some other way on streams.

He has the powerpoint presentation tech, use it for that. We've only seen it used thrice ever since he implemented it.

[high juniper]

say the community projects like the space with a repost of Kraul's video

all of this on Neuro's twitter

and not his

[steel gulch]

that i do agree with. maybe have Neuro react to images/clips of the space project and share her thoughts to twitter

[molten bison]

I agree with you, the problem is that, if not Vedal, then who should be taking responsibility for the community?
I know, the community manager thing has been beaten to death for billions of times, but I really think Vedal could do better in this regard.
Some things have to be taken care of, otherwise you have a huge part of the community that is left unsatisfied and uninformed about the stuff happening here and elsewhere.

Not to mention that Vedal's presence in social media is almost nonexistent either.

[steel gulch]

I mean, he could just hire an actual community manager, like that's an actual job title. But idk how Swarm would feel about that...

[nimble sandal]

this is getting outside the point of this discussion post but it's worth acknowledging, if he's that against showing off these sort of things in dev streams, then have neuro or evil talk about them, especially in regards to community projects and contests... because streamers do that. and it's nice when streamers acknowledge what their community does

[high juniper]

all they had to do was: ask Vedal to make Neuro to generate a tweet; Vedal could even make a version where the CM could have a quick access to something for Neuro to generate a tweet;
send a image, text, tweet for Neuro reacts/generates a answer -> Twitter
cute art that the CM sees on the art -> retweet

Schedules done? -> Neuro twitter

give them a name like Neuro's Unpaid Worker or something

and do that "shadow" gap

[hybrid rivet]

It him!

[molten bison]

Vedal typing

[steel gulch]

oh god oh fuck

[hybrid rivet]

[molten bison]

scatter

[high juniper]

:vanish:

[steady sail]

tbh even I myself am probably not up to date on everything in the community 😅
I've always sorta avoided showing a lot of the community stuff on stream because its often hard to involve neuro/evil since they often don't react but I do agree this could be done better, would be nice to have because a lot of the community is underappreciated

art review is a way to get some of it in a more neuro/evil friendly way but I'd like a better system for more general stuff for sure like with the presentations

I think I need help for that though

[golden flax]

tbh I think a lot of people would appreciate your reactions as well, not just neuro and evil's

[molten bison]

Thanks for acknowledging it
It would be cool if you could gather some info regarding what's been happening recently (maybe with a help of mods or some regulars on the server?), then maybe collect it in one note file to present it point by point
I don't think it's that much of work, and it would make a good dev stream imo

[radiant bay]

i think people have the expectation that neuro/evil won't fully understand what's going on with the community stuff, so dev streams might be a better place to showcase them

[steady sail]

i do kinda wanna do dev stream on my own terms rather than just have the whole stream be me reacting to other stuff (never been a big react guy myself)

[steel gulch]

I would just not like it to be something forced upon him

[steady sail]

just not my thing

im also not good at it lmao

[native flicker]

Is that powerpoint presentation tech not flexible enough for that? I've had the impression that it would be perfect fo stuff like that.

[past schooner]

fair

[high juniper]

I would like to say that twitter is really important too, some people put arts in here as a twitter link and it gets skipped, some artists dont use discord so they kinda lose in there
so if possible really someone should think of how to bring a new life in this on the twitter even if it is smething as simply as getting into Neuro twitter and pressing some retweets

[steel gulch]

we can tell

[steady sail]

yeah maybe! would be really cool to have a little presentation set up for neuro to present every tuesday or something with general community stuff so she can commentate on that but would require help setting it up

[golden flax]

yeah that was a neat idea, making powerpoints of notable fan things for neuro/evil to show on stream

maybe you could have a staff channel for compiling things that are worth showing?

[keen geyser]

honestly i would just like to hear more about actual dev stuff sometimes

you talked about some stuff during evil's birthday but its also just good to hear more development related things

for example i am actually interested in the work done for latency bcs the last time it was mentioned was like october dev stream last year

[past schooner]

not a bad idea

[steel gulch]

what about like having experimental streams on what were dev stream days? like rather than drop a feature (such as twin calling) on a chill stream, you could perhaps just do an experimental chill or twin stream to test out features before they show up on the "main" streams?

[molten bison]

I don't think you have to be very expressive about things presented on the dev stream, just show them, say "thanks for making it happen" and that's it
it's more for people to see those things and maybe to make them know that you acknowledge it

[steady sail]

I haven't really done much for latency tbh, it does sound a bit better now though because discord audio is slightly delayed because its discord

[steel gulch]

switch to teamspeak3

[high juniper]

small indie company issues :classic:

[keen geyser]

i dont know if you remember but the last time you talked about latency (especially evil) she has a good 1,5+ sec delay for answers

on stream atleast

[radiant bay]

i agree. it's more about acknowledgement than the actual reactions

[keen geyser]

it just feels weird if nothing happened

[steel gulch]

eh, there are other means of doing that

[hybrid rivet]

We could do like a "swarm news channel " where people suggest interesting things that happened in the community and mods posting the coolest one's

[molten bison]

nothing ever happens

[keen geyser]

well either way i would like to hear just general dev stuff things that are being worked on

[high juniper]

honestly making the twins react themselves is already a acknowledgement IMO

[golden flax]

tbh even just retweeting things is good

[high juniper]

(community project wise)

[nimble sandal]

yea the twins reacting on stream to community projects happening would be great

[steel gulch]

people show their appreciation for things in their own way; it does not always have to be outwardly said. like just having it be reacted to by the twins or retweeted should be taken as a sign of appreciation.

[native flicker]

I would love to see that especially because I really like the tech side of this channel so seeing it used only for news stream and 2 birthdays feels like a waste.

[nimble sandal]

tweets would go a huge way

[keen geyser]

idk there is a lot of things floating around nowadays that i could list off the top of my head: v3, neurodog, evil model, voice upgrades and so on that would just be good to talk about to better show the goal of the next time

[steady sail]

what do you mean? presentation wasn't used on news stream?

[golden flax]

he means the news ticker thing?

[steady sail]

ehh?

[high juniper]

again I think the twitter should have 3 things

retweets of arts and projects of the community (hell I bet if there had been one about the space thing people like Falseeyed would have put it on the news of the week as a short segment)

having a quick way for someone (does not need to be you Vedal) to send a text or a image and have Neuro react and respond in text to then make a tweet about

stream schedule

[maiden trail]

• diary idea

[native flicker]

The thingy at the bottom where they were changing the news stories, I thought that it was the same tech as presentations?

Was it something completely else?

[steel gulch]

what about using community posts on YouTube to showcase animations that exist there? like the tengoku death/birth song animation (I can't remember the name)

[thorny escarp]

I assumed that was premade and they were reading and reacting to it in real time?

[past schooner]

yeah honestly just that alone would be massive-

[golden flax]

diary idea is cool but it's kinda limited since it only on neurocord, streams reach way more people

[steady sail]

the tech? thats the same tech thats used for polls/sfx/title changes/presentations/game playing/discord calls/googling/zooming/spinning etc etc

its used all the time

[steady sail]

steal art

[keen geyser]

also whats up with evils stream
its a mess:

• stutter
• unused evil logo
• room and ui for things
• model
• pixelated plasma globe

idk it feels like her stream is a mess for a long time now and i dont see much improvement

[maiden trail]

could be published simultaneously on yt as well

[steel gulch]

you can have j0ker ask for permission to share first, obviously

[high juniper]

that diary is literally what were the tweets before
and at least the tweets could be funny

[native flicker]

maybe "feature" was a better word, that's what I meant

[steady sail]

i dont think her model is a mess but that is my opinion

[molten bison]

as long as the artist is credited, I don't consider it stealing
||yes, I know it was a joke, saying it just in case ||

[steel gulch]

or if they're shared on this server with the new tag that Vani made

[maiden trail]

yea, so making more + expanding to youtube community posts could be cool

[radiant bay]

i don't know any artists that are against you showcasing their animations

[high juniper]

her toggles being broken right on the second stream is indeed a mess

[molten bison]

he does ask for permission, he asked me if he can use art I commissioned from Paccha

[native flicker]

yeah, the cat mode was broken

[steady sail]

is that unique to evil

[high juniper]

for months now

uniform after halloween has always been incapable of using cat mode

[steel gulch]

wait but how is it stealing if you just make a community post that says "yo check out this cool animation" and it just links to that animation? you're not reuploading their work...

[high juniper]

before the upgrade to the new model Evil frog and Evil duck couldnt be actived even through redeems

[steady sail]

evil hasn't had new model for months what do you mean

[high juniper]

she couldnt go into cat mode by meowing

[steady sail]

ohhhhhhhhhhhh

[high juniper]

and it seems the issue is still here

after the upgrade

[steady sail]

i understand what you're saying now

[maiden trail]

(he doesn't 💔)

[high juniper]

btw Vedal if you rewatch last Evil art segment you can see her try to meow to go into Cat mode and getting pissed it doesnt work

[steel gulch]

is there a weird YouTube rule against this

[past schooner]

im like 98% sure it was a joke my friend-

[tough tree]

Dont have time to backread rn and gotta go to sleep but ved pls do more experimental streams like on Tuesday these are great for the channel imo

[keen geyser]

I mean atleast you agree with rest then

the evil neuro logo in the loading screen should rly be replaced the evil doesnt even cover the neurosama logo anymore

[steel gulch]

o

[steady sail]

i know its just not an easy texture swap because of the setup and im trying not to overwork sadecesss

[sturdy widget]

I don't really care if the dev streams comes back or not, i'm just sad that we lost a day of not seeing Neuro in the schedule because of their disappearance
Now we only have 4 streams per week

[golden flax]

I think sadecsss talked about the room not being ready for her chill stream yet, and the logo probably needs the opening animation to be updated too

[high juniper]

I have to say, this is the words we were waiting to hear;

just this gives us so kind of confirmation it isnt an oversight

[steel gulch]

only 4 streams a week

[high juniper]

stuff and talks like this are really appreciated

[tough tree]

Oh btw pls more themed streams

Baj baj

[keen geyser]

Ok, anyways thank you for atleast aknowledging it (bcs it seemed you just wouldnt change it)

[native flicker]

Yeah, I appreciate acknowleding it, cause before doing that we have no idea if it's intentional or not

[keen geyser]

also very honest question is it possible to change the ending screen to "Say goodbye to evil"

unironically very hype

[steady sail]

no i did know about it, i swapped it for neuro just couldn't for evil

[golden flax]

now if only more people knew about things like this besides people that lurk/backread in neurocord a lot

[steady sail]

:)

[steel gulch]

you should just delete evil to fix the issue

[native flicker]

nowaying

[high juniper]

NOWAY

[finite tapir]

[keen geyser]

oh wait did i miss that

[wooden slate]

Btw, is the twins falling asleep randomly a new thing?

[hybrid rivet]

[keen geyser]

well i will see you in 5 years when everything is updated for evil chill streams

[high juniper]

you didnt

[native flicker]

Nahh that's new

[high juniper]

the stream ended before we could see it

[steel gulch]

it's been a thing since new neuro model, seems it carried over to evil too

[keen geyser]

like i swear i wouldve noticed that

[sturdy widget]

funny how everyone is complaining about Evil's model being a "mess". But everyone forgot that Neuro lost her ability to wink with her new model

[exotic dagger]

All is now alright with the universe, I can finally fall asleep in peace

[regal echo]

they sleep because of brain death

[high juniper]

at least she didnt lose her ability to smile and be happy all the time

[golden flax]

I think anny talked about that once, like it was an issue with the rigging or something so maybe it'll get fixed (I don't remember 100%)

[thorny escarp]

This one's from Evil's chill stream 6 days ago

[steel gulch]

https://tenor.com/view/evil-neuro-neuro-gif-14483214911999722599

[native flicker]

Yeah, that's what I assumed it was, just like the frog hat

[indigo vortex]

Tbh evil's new model is super cute, my only problem with it is the lack of smiles
Oh and for some reason the leg warmers that are super cute not being there when she spins

[molten bison]

I think overall Neuro's model is in much better state than Evil's
both could use some small fixes + bringing back toggles

[keen geyser]

we do not tak about chill streams cause nothing is just implemented there yet

[steel gulch]

I wish she could still make facial expressions like this

[magic escarp]

Imagine if Neuro could start doing Karaoke at will, she just plays the first couple seconds of the song just to cut off before the beat drops.

[keen geyser]

ye the lack of smile is really noticable once you see it

[high juniper]

I think its harder with this "almost 3D" live2d

[wooden slate]

I think Evil's model would benefit from more flexibility in the eyes

[tough tree]

Cant sleep now

[past schooner]

honestly thought that one was just evil being emo and just choosing not to-

[tough tree]

I was whining about it but i was told its impossible for some reason

[native flicker]

The leg warmers are something that Anny added later, they weren't in the initial model like the Abber horns and tail

[keen geyser]

like all screenshots and gifs of evil with the new model has her mouth either open mid yapping, or :|

[indigo vortex]

I mean she had an entire segment where she was adamant she was smiling. I'd say she has no option to do so with her current animation set

[keen geyser]

She is missing the ability currently to change it unlike neuro who has a default smile, a bigger smile, a neutral expression and a slight frown

[open totem]

[high juniper]

-# this thread slowly became a shareholder meeting that can replace the asked dev stream

[steel gulch]

is fixing the narcolepsy issue not just a matter of
if there is audio in neuro/evil's source, then disable the sleep toggle

[maiden trail]

i'm having the best birthday party ever, vedal is the best father i could have ever wished for

[golden flax]

I feel like this is getting a little bit off of the topic...

[tough tree]

What was the topic btw

[maiden trail]

dev

streams

[sturdy widget]

assuming this isn't intentional, i think you guys are fighting a feature not a bug

[molten bison]

lack of dev streams

[steel gulch]

classic neurotic neurons

[bold lion]

Imagine watching dev streams for progress and not just to watch the banter

[oak junco]

but this isn't NN... though i thought it was

[high juniper]

a bit but in a way what you were asking in to be discussed in a dev stream was at least talked in here

[tough tree]

Dev streams should happen when he wants to do them is that not enough

[steel gulch]

oh shit

[molten bison]

not enough gifs and stickers spammed, can't be

[keen geyser]

if its intentional then i hope he sees the many amount of people who'd advocate against ot

[oak junco]

even if the scenery is changed, if it is the same cast of characters then it is the same show

[golden flax]

true I guess, I also really liked the tangent about showing fan stuff on chill streams (I just hope vedal actually does something about it after this thread)

[radiant bay]

he is giving a list of things to do on dev streams in addition to cool tech demos

[steel gulch]

well I feel like the main topic of this thread has been discussed and addressed, thank you Vedal for your insight!

[keen geyser]

where as before her model suffered from having static eyebrows, now her expression suffer from static mouth

[tough tree]

Fuck it ill just backread

[bold lion]

Should go for everything but ok

[maiden trail]

🖐️ will someone bite

[maiden trail]

yes

[high juniper]

please keep this going well

[restive saddle]

finnaly some normal talk

[graceful swan]

I didn't backread but I think you can be different by facial expressions without loosing ability to smile and be happy

[steel gulch]

we should start a different thread for the model talk

we are getting way off topic

[keen geyser]

imo my point is valid, a facial expressions is compossed of multiple parts of the face there is no reason why her mouth should be static

either way imma end this discussion from my side no point talking anout this

[past schooner]

yeah wouldn't make much sense to talk about it here

[indigo vortex]

So yeah about dev streams, I think vedal should do them when he is ready. We shouldn't rush the cook

[steel gulch]

yeah, thank you @golden flax for the discussion

[maiden trail]

ty widjo

[restive saddle]

ty widjo

[golden flax]

yeah I think I'll just close it I've said what I wanted and vedal read it so mission accomplished

[tough tree]

I backread and overall agree with widjo

[molten bison]

thanks for making this thread, widjo