Twitch Chat vs. Neuro Streams: Can a Hivemind beat an AI?

[strange swift]

Nobody asked, but I've been thinking of ways where we could have the entirety of chat involved beyond just typing messages at Neuro and seeing her reaction.

We could try chess, but unlike previous chess streams where it has been one viewer against Neuro at a time, I think it would be cool to try Neuro playing against the entirety of Twitch chat.

Implementation:
Using click maps from SAMMI (https://sammi.solutions/extensions/miscellaneous/click-map), chat would click on the piece and space they want to move the piece to, and Vedal could make that move for them—if he can't figure out a way to automate it and handle exceptions for invalid moves. Neuro would take her turn as she does now, and then the process would repeat.

Could also try this with Battleship or other turn-based board games.

Future Streams:
When the game interface for Neuro is good enough to test on stream, we could potentially do Twitch-Chat-Plays style streams where viewers would enter inputs into Twitch chat to try to beat Neuro at video games (DougDoug has a solid Twitch Chat Plays template at https://github.com/DougDougGithub/TwitchPlays). An example could be trying to see if Twitch Chat could finish a Mario level faster than Neuro.

[bold hornet]

Chess would be a great idea. probably the best game possible for this type of stream

[pseudo patio]

The click map thing is cool

It would clear the chat up and be very intuitive to users

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr9Ho1MVjiw

Automating the process of doing the move that most chat uses might be hard because people might pick random moves
This could be solved by just picking the most popular legal move.
A cursory glance suggests that the extension doesn't have a web API thingy, and instead only works through OBS triggers
Maybe you could set up triggers for each square on the chessboard, and have those triggers send web packets to the server that determines which square is most popular?
(Dunno how OBS triggers work)

[strange swift]

Yes, hence why I said Vedal would make the move for chat.

[pseudo patio]

yeah i guess there isn't a big need to automate it if it's a one-off stream

I guess you could use a small transparent red dot to act as the image that appears when a user clicks on the screen, and Vedal can just pick the square with the deepest, biggest red spot

[strange swift]

If he did manage to automate it, though, it could be one of the things that Neuro could just decide to do during the automated streams.

[pseudo patio]

yeah, it would be funny if neuro lords her win over us for the rest of the stream

[strange swift]

In other streams, I've seen it done where the chat is almost voting on an area that is clicked and it displays the % of clicks in that area.

[bold hornet]

Additional consideration is, for chess, especially during the midgame, there are a large number of pieces and possible moves. (Not simply clicking a square)
For this situation I suggest a two-step move process similar to the chess 4 player minigame "Hand and Brain" where:

1. Chat on a popularity vote, decides the piece to be moved. (clicking on the square occupied by that piece)
2. Chat on popularity vote, decides which square to move that piece (clicking on square to move to)

[bold hornet]

For chess, it is a magnitude more easier to model individual squares for clicking, and not a cluster of click areas. For this Vedal can use third-party website.

Then, the solution would be much more accurate: each square would have its own percentage.

to do this, he could model a copy of the chess game on another website, and allow chat to click on it at certain intervals. would be high-effort stream but would also be much better than simple click clusters.

[strange swift]

I wasn't talking about click clusters specifically, I meant that there is way to do that for individual squares (or other shapes)

[strange swift]

It would be too high effort I think for the first go at this. Maybe if the idea sticks and it ends up being something everyone wants to do again.

[pseudo patio]

gah that's a good point, you might need two pieces of info from each user

[strange swift]

It's easily inferrable. Part of the Twitch chat would be clicking on the piece whereas the other part would be clicking on the space they want it to move.

It's not necessarily about each individual chatter voting, rather coordinating.

You could put two and two together easily like, "Oh, there isn't a piece there so that's probably where they want the most selected piece to move"

[pseudo patio]

not voting, rather coordinating
ahhh i wasn't considering that framing

[bold hornet]

but that would be rather frustrating for viewers, as it isn't easily inferrable. For example, when there are multiple pieces that could move to a square. Also, since each viewer has one vote in a one-step process, they would have to decide between clicking on a piece or a square. For this reason, a two-step process (with or without external tools) is by far the best way to go about this hypothetical stream.

[strange swift]

said pieces would have to be voted on equally for that to be an issue.

The point of the hivemind is that you have multiple forces at play and coordinating against Neuro in this hypothetical stream.

People would have to decide on whether to select a piece or the space, but they could always move their selection over to a space once their selected piece has accumulated enough support. It isn't too bad, I've seen this be used in other streams and it's been fun.

[empty spear]

I remember there was hearthstone stream like this several years ago, and it stayed at the lowest rank level

[mystic glen]

TABS would be cool with this I think DougDoug did something like that

[bold hornet]

That wouldn't be horrible, but it would certainly be a pretty low-effort stream.

[west island]

1 sub = 1 move

[strange swift]

I think it would be fine if it's the first go at this idea, but more effort could be put into it in future iterations if it ends up being something Vedal and/or the community would like to do again.

[strange swift]

I don't think Doug did one where an AI played TABS against Twitch Chat, but it would definitely be a great idea.

If we had something like Doug's AI General that consolidates the strategies being spammed in Twitch Chat into one coherent strategy, I can see a stream where Neuro then tries to counter that strategy. Or that could potentially just be a collab on its own where it's DougDoug's Twitch Chat/General vs. Neuro.

[rare cedar]

[hallow urchin]

get ignored

[strange swift]