#REVERSED! (EDH) Assistance!

1 messages · Page 5 of 1

lilac heath
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i don't play mine under bracket 4

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it's like imagine if nadu was the whole deck

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"oops all landfall commanders"

deft belfry
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legend matters cascade automatically go into B3 or above

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i wish jodah was fun to play against 😅 the legend coat of arms is too much

lilac heath
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tbh I feel like it's the cascade noone likes

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10 billion years of exiling till I hit my combo piece 2 drops

deft belfry
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hmm i mean if the board is just random things, who cares

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at least cascade was not about comboing in the first place

lilac heath
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kellan the kid just straight up says "well I guess we're going infinite now"

deft belfry
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it can be, but it was initially extra value

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on overcosted cards

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and gambling off the top

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and then the tibalt thing broke it

lilac heath
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ah true , but then it's like with jodah"well I only have 5 2 drops in the deck, lemme jhust basically turn all my 3 drops into tutors"

deft belfry
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and then they did restriction cascade [[codie dex]]

shrewd zealotBOT
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https://scryfall.com/card/stx/253/codie-vociferous-codex

Codie, Vociferous Codex <:mana3:292901508771610624>

Legendary Artifact Creature — Construct
You can't cast permanent spells.
mana4, manat: Add manawmanaumanabmanarmanag. When you next cast a spell this turn, exile cards from the top of your library until you exile an instant or sorcery card with lesser mana value. Until end of turn, you may cast that card without paying its mana cost. Put each other card exiled this way on the bottom of your library in a random order.
1/4

deft belfry
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and jodah without the cannot cast restriction

lilac heath
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oof

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yeah these effects are kind of nuts with the filtering potential it could provide

deft belfry
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OG jodah was much cooler imo

lilac heath
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I mean 5 cmc blightsteel was gross

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but then again I'm playing 3 cmc myojins I can't speak

deft belfry
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i guess you skipped the [[mary jane watson]] stuff?

shrewd zealotBOT
lilac heath
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tbh I had her in there cuz it was a prerelease foil

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but I only have like 10 spiders

deft belfry
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fair

lilac heath
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spider-man cards kind of blow ngl

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and I'm like

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life long spider-man fan

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tho they do make a fun bracket 2 deck in bant

deft belfry
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i want to build [[!serah farron]] for the art

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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know close to nothing about FF

lilac heath
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I just felt like I wanted a deck that would do fun gross combos with peter parker over spider-man tribal

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oh that's some cool art

deft belfry
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try build 2 decks

lilac heath
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wish I could run it in any of my legendary tribal decks

deft belfry
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the baack side is even better

lilac heath
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yeah that's really good

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I might put it in my abzan legends list

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I've been recently thinking about putting surrak and goreclaw in spider-man over the other deck

deft belfry
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if you want more humans

lilac heath
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yeah she could be pretty good but like my main issue is that webslinging does that already for me ish

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oh wait surrak?

deft belfry
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but at this point it is likely to become good stuff tribal :/ [[aragorn and arwen web]] is this any better than the 7 drop 7/7

shrewd zealotBOT
quaint linden
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my friend mono

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question

quaint linden
shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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i see [[maja bretagard protector]] if it is dedicated to human theme

shrewd zealotBOT
quaint linden
lilac heath
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oh weirdly enough maja was my first ever commander

deft belfry
lilac heath
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now it's a necrobloom deck 🙂

deft belfry
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i think necrobloom is one of those, most of them looks fairly identical

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if you want to go above B2 with more tutors, there is always [[captain sisay]]

shrewd zealotBOT
lilac heath
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ah true she's pretty good

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I might also add [[time of need]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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too many tutors probably will pump up a tier 😅

quaint linden
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not what i was referring

say for example i have [[hellkite tyrant]] exiled with it and i have cards reducing the cost on the field. while "dancing with calamity" states 13 or less to be cast for free. can the cost be reduce to 2 for the hellkite?

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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but whatever you see fit

lilac heath
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ah that's fine you said it was waaaay stronger than a 2 should be tho

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i'll probably bump it to a 3

deft belfry
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depends on how it play, less consistency will bring it down

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jank with myojin would be a fun way to play too

lilac heath
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oh yeah

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it's genuinely disgusting as a combo piece

deft belfry
shrewd zealotBOT
quaint linden
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wierd jank i made was wabbits and dragon's approch

lilac heath
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my main wincon is like draw for each permanent I control, then try and get out the old green myojin out with something like relic of legends or we ride at dawn o nthe field

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then draw till I hit karn's sundering or smthng

deft belfry
# lilac heath it's genuinely disgusting as a combo piece

when it comes to playing with fun cards, i think some are naturally more interesting when it is harder to appear in a game or somehow used in an unexpected way. it is to create the memorable moment rather than trying to get the best combo out of it

quaint linden
deft belfry
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if Cedh is the extreme, trying to win with few cards as possible, lower power is doing inefficient things that will make your heart go blegh

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if you want only humans and spiders, that would be a restrictive enough rule so that the deck is completely differernt from others

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sort of like [[!kaheera the orphang]] if it was your tribal

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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do you own [[noble hierach]] btw

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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strictly better more human llanowar elves

quaint linden
# deft belfry strictly ~~better~~ more human llanowar elves

can I crack a fetch, put a land in play, have [[Aesi Strait]]/Tatyova trigger and THEN respond with [[Mystical Tutor]] to put [[Devastation Tide]] on top? then let Aeshi resolve for the Miracle?

I say yes this is another person question. Im just testing my knowledge

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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you just have to hold priority

quaint linden
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Yep thought so

deft belfry
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finish casting all your spells/adding abilities before passing

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most people dont use mystical tutor for miracle/top deck manipulation but thats part of the fun of that mechanic

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can make certain synergy out of nowhere

lilac heath
deft belfry
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[[mitotic manipulation]] is this blue rampant growth, idk if it is worth trying out 😅 also i forgot to mention [[surveyor's scope]] for all those high cost decks @empty bison

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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get yourself 2 lands behind, easier with bounce lands ex [[guildless common]] or the desert

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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but the idea is that even if you hold off a land drop, the chance of it getting 2 -3 more lands into play untapped, that "ceiling" is probably almost as good as [[ancetral recall]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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if any one casted any land ramp, someone got ahead and you are not first in turn rotation, then playing it on curve will get the most out of it. i think it is less than 20% chance where it can be a late game not so useful card to draw where 80% of the time, it will ramp a minimum of 2 untapped lands

empty bison
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@deft belfry I am working on a new deck that I am excited for you to look at! Maybe this time it will be more cohesive. 🙂

quaint linden
lilac heath
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so I'm trying out a funny deck of rakdos treasure party

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but i'm new to rakdos and uncertain really how to lead the deck into a fun and strongish way

deft belfry
quaint linden
deft belfry
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give haste, play expensive dragons, double triggers for gross things to happen, burn your wallet 3x more than the oppoent for the most expensive foil special art dragon to assert dominance

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that explains the funny looking CGI dragon

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iam not sure if temur hiuman got something going on

quaint linden
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¯_(ツ)_/¯

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Thought it was a good idea

deft belfry
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the hard part is usually getting all the party members

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since it will need at least 3 other creatures and hopefully as few overlap as possible

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once party member is set, may want to hold the rest until the party is wiped. and then rebuild

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2 drop bulk may not be worth while but are good placeholders until you want to upgrade

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i believe scryfall can set creatures to types you want

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2 colour decks dont need diamonds tapped rocks

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guild signet, talisman, colourless source with utility

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since i see tons of stuff on the side already. probably good to go for the most part

lilac heath
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ah true I was hoping to heavily mitigate that by having almost every creature generate treasures

deft belfry
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i remember seeing a new card that turns all artifacts into creatures with menace with in rakdos colours?!

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otherwise, having ton of mana is just going to flood

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since your commander can make 3+ treasure each attack, i think your treasure count will go off the chart if not interacted

fervent rain
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im kinda liking [[squall]] as a mix between control,landfall and reanimator, but some of the infinite combo there , i dont like ,they require a sac outlet which isnt what squall wants

shrewd zealotBOT
fervent rain
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[[squall, mercenary]]

shrewd zealotBOT
fervent rain
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it feels like a threat however

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does it feel like a must kill target?

deft belfry
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without build in evasion, and grave is technically public info

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it looks less threatening than in practice

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gtg to work 🏃‍➡️

fervent rain
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idk i feel like im gonna be a bit of a target for attack

fervent rain
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i feel like im gonna be a target fro attack in this deck

deft belfry
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4 toughness dont die to that many things, its usually collateral damage if you are not extremely ahead

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the fact that what you can get back is a 3 drop, it limits the potential power of those recursion targets

deft belfry
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and i think the best direct comparison is, when is the last time you played or see a [[sun titan]] being played

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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the attack alone to gain double strike instead of squall having double strike is kinda a downside as well

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[[duelist heritage]] only on your turn, as a removable creature, and limit it to some "exalt" synergy

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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so squall in the end, as a 4 toughness that needs to connect to reanimate small targets, and doesnt work with go -wide alpha strike with the double strike

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shouldnt necessarily be kill on sight, unless you have assembled some combo engine

deft belfry
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swinging with only one thing usually means you will have blockers behind

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[[ghostly prison]] standard pillowfort should redirect lot of attacks if you are worried

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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other than like the angels and [[felidart retreat]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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there are very few land fall triggers in orzhov, black has some drain effect

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ob lixis is probably the strongest one i remember

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but then another card is required to give squall unblockable

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using 3-4 cards to do less than 10 damage is not that scary imo

marble cedar
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I never said it was good :3

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GREAT SEGWAY ME

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Talk about weird or not good

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This is an idea...

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So the plan of this deck is simple

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I cast Flubs turn 3

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I play every card in my deck

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The hope and prarer is, that I hit enough fast mana to be able to hard cast abundance

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and then from that point onwards only draw non land cards

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Use [[Ulamog the infinte gyre]]

shrewd zealotBOT
marble cedar
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and [[Engineered explosives]]

shrewd zealotBOT
marble cedar
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To infintely loop my entire deck

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My entire deck is either mana positive or 0 mana

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apart from ubuyndance and ulamog

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So I am here for a simple question.

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Is there any fast mana/mana positive which I have missed?

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Right now this is more of a thought experiment I will work on a win con later

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Im not sure if theres even enough cards to do this

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But that's why we are testing

marble cedar
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Cool Manamorphose lets me bin ulamog

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You can also use a delayed draw trigger from mishra's bauble!

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Oo

deft belfry
marble cedar
deft belfry
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technically with flubs out

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the untapped turn you have 3 open mana

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and 1 land drop

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i think [[helm of awakening]] still fits

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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[[chancellor of the tangle]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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i believe you missed both spirit guides

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[[highway robbery]] plot does this work

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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nvm, doesnt work

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i guess lands are like [[gem stone carven]]

shrewd zealotBOT
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No card found for “gem stone carven”

deft belfry
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anything that can make 3 colours

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and i guess you cant play [[flare of cultivation]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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[[sol mox]]

shrewd zealotBOT
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No card found for “sol mox”

deft belfry
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i think the problem i see is that anything non spell would stop the whole chain

shrewd zealotBOT
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No card found for “strike the rich”

deft belfry
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[[strike it rich]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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[[urza artificier]]

shrewd zealotBOT
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Multiple cards match “urza artificier”, can you be more specific?

deft belfry
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[[urza lord high]]

shrewd zealotBOT
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https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/130/urza-lord-high-artificer

Urza, Lord High Artificer <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manau:292901508754702338><:manau:292901508754702338>

Legendary Creature — Human Artificer
When Urza enters, create a 0/0 colorless Construct artifact creature token with "This token gets +1/+1 for each artifact you control."
Tap an untapped artifact you control: Add manau.
mana5: Shuffle your library, then exile the top card. Until end of turn, you may play that card without paying its mana cost.
1/4

deft belfry
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actually we didnt get affinity

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i find [[[[barricade breaker]] improvise instead lol

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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[[bottle cap blast]] only make tap treasures

shrewd zealotBOT
calm forge
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cause at the moment the deck can function

marble cedar
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therefore no flubs triggER?

deft belfry
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i am wondering if spirit guide is needed

marble cedar
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i dont think either is

deft belfry
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actually, maybe use the 3 mana on

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extra chances of land drops

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forgot the name, play two additional lands

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that way, turn after flubs, can play a 3 drop, and up to 3 lands

marble cedar
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hmhm

deft belfry
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i think the deck can run at least 5 lands

marble cedar
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Nah

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No lands

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(im joking I just havent got to that yet)

deft belfry
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XD will see how it turns out

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the unplayable fool

marble cedar
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i have always wanted to make a 0 land EDH deck

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tbf

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With enough fast mana

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I belive its possible

deft belfry
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some precon stuff [[beacon of unrest]] are the easier cuts

shrewd zealotBOT
calm forge
deft belfry
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[[roadside reliquary]] is a bit of an odd choice because there are only 3 enchantments?

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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almost every deck can run a [[warroom]]

shrewd zealotBOT
marble cedar
calm forge
deft belfry
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i forgot the names of lands that draw one by sac but there is a few others

marble cedar
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[[phyrexian tower]]?

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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i think it may cost less than 2 mana

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sac the land itself

marble cedar
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oh!

calm forge
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the lands that has cycling ?

deft belfry
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but most arent great, more of an emergency draw

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sacrifice from the board

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speaking of cycling, you can swap the [[polluted mire]] for the one that cost single black

shrewd zealotBOT
calm forge
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not sure if i would use war room tho since my commander wants to cheat out stuff from grave/ hand

calm forge
deft belfry
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thats why you want ways to get more cards out of the library

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its repeatable draw, not single use cantrap

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without scarecrow to sac, i am not a big fan of the [[scarecrone]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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because of the high mana cost, although it is fine

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can do things on repeat and is on theme

calm forge
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5 life for 1 draw idk man ill think about

deft belfry
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read warroom again

marble cedar
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^^

deft belfry
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lot of people misread that, you arent the first

marble cedar
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That is 1 life

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for 1 draw

deft belfry
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if anything, its the 4 mana for a card that is a lot

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but its an untapped land

marble cedar
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yea there is litterlayt no reason to not run it

deft belfry
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i think 9/10 times it almost a strictly better [[locth wain]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

marble cedar
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lool

deft belfry
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the "hellbent" land that draw in back

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unrelated to artifact theme, i think something like [[mortician beetle]] has a bit of potential

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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low initial cost, can become like a 10/10 in certain games/decks

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actually, i think [[tarrian cleave]] would be much better

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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vigiliance is very hard to get in black

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not sure how off-theme you are willing to go [[rankle master of pranks]] looks nice in here

shrewd zealotBOT
calm forge
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very interesting

deft belfry
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because it gets through the deck, get things into grave, and scale well with multi player

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easy way to set up on repeat

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the best tip i can think of would be, dont over rely on the commander to play the big cards, at some point, without a consistent source of life gain, and having to replay it from the commander zone, wont be worth the mana cost

calm forge
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seems relatively cheap now is if my local market has them or not lol

deft belfry
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yeah, it was a nice reprint

calm forge
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also should I run [[syr konrad,the grim]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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i think its a good finisher in many decks, but it may not fit here

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in general, the mill ability is not a build around but a desperate last resort

calm forge
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ah man I already brought but eh its aight

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@deft belfry oh yea so err we ain't gonna run [[diabolic intent]] and [[portal to pyrexia]) right ?

shrewd zealotBOT
calm forge
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[[portal to phyrexia]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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just because 5 mana is on the higher end and comes out slow, doesnt mean your game will instantly kill something that is slowly draining the table, the same way people ignore [[blood artist]] doing like 20+ on its own

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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as much as i notice that players prefer [[zulaport cutthroat]] i think i rather go for blood artist first

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
calm forge
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fair thx

deft belfry
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unrest is one of them

lilac heath
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so I'm trying to make a dimir pirate deck but idk really what pirates should do as a deck

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this was gonna sorta rely on reanimator effects or smthn but idk

deft belfry
#

what is [[[dragon throne of takir]] doing here

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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there is a strictly better (mechanically) coastal piracy with cycling but less pirate theme

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colour pips, colour balance, low curve, tribal synergy, draw engine, the deck has many things and many are good; i am trying to see what seems to be missing. and if the deck is actually able to get the proper payoff from the values

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also not sure about the consistency outside of getting creatures and lands. other category seems to be much lower

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so the % archidekt shows were quite low

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i think it is okay is trade out pirate without evasion to deal dmg for more utilityin order to get more than treasures and maps tokens

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[[pillar of orgin]] probably one of the worst mana rock iever brought XD and idk why i got more than 1 copy. even for tribal its pretty bad because it restrict to creature spell, and with low curve, i dont think it is too important to have that as a 2 drop, but you can definitely test it out

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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the logic is that, if i have a 2 drop in hand, i rather get out creature to wait for summoning sickness. if i have a 1 drop, i can probably play it already without additional "ramp". or for a bigger pirate, a colourless rock that can help cast non creature spells

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in additional to rogue passage, this is a deck that can also use [[access tunnel]] earlier

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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i pay too little attention to creature types now a days, will have to scryfall search

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correct myself, theres no map tokens, its just explore without creating maps

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i keep thinking that falco creates maps

lilac heath
deft belfry
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interesting way to sink mana 😅

lilac heath
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true i dont really know how the deck should finish ppl lol

lilac heath
deft belfry
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[[reconaissance mission]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

when you use scryfall, the tagger option will list card with the same/similar text so it is a nice way to find cards you have yet to know about

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i especially like the artwork tags for checking out decade old designs

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or weird looking or horrific paintings

lilac heath
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its a good thing I need all the reconnaissance/coastalpiracy effects

deft belfry
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i only run the cycling one at most, no room for a second copy

lilac heath
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ok it's wierdly functional now with the exta bident effects

deft belfry
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the 2 drop pirates without evasion maybe my cuts if there are alternatives

lilac heath
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I found a good way to close games with dimir pirates

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time sieve!

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and if I lean into reanimator I can use explore willy nilly to pitch to grave

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also living death 😈

lilac heath
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also fun fact with partner commanders [[feywild visitor]] makes 6 1/1's a turn

shrewd zealotBOT
dawn ore
deft belfry
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i think the main issue would be match up, threat assessment, politicking, rather than the deck not doing its thing

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i would simplify it as a "combo + control" deck

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with the right card + wheel, its a near one shot kill on an opponent

deft belfry
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if you understand what that means

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personally, i also dislike cards that cost more than their counterpart such as [[megrim]]

shrewd zealotBOT
kind galleon
#

May I ask your wisdom for 4-5 card draw cards in sultai that are not theft cards.

calm forge
deft belfry
shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
kind galleon
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Though I am moreso looking for generic good draw effects outside of gamechangers

deft belfry
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because you can have extra synergy such as [[plum the forbidden]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

just need to tag your cards so you know what the deck is doing

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[[eden seat of sanctum]] is an odd choice when you can play almost anything from grave

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
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5 mana + land sac just to add back to hand

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seems to me like a desperate red/green way to return something

calm forge
calm forge
deft belfry
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missed the 2 that give lands

deft belfry
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i cant make sense of mana refra and prophetic prism

abstract canopy
#

Hi I’m working on a rev tithe deck. It’s still in wip but can I get your thoughts on it? Maybe I’m missing a key element? I’m not looking for infinite combo or hardcore stax. I want to lean into the card steal/play aspect but I’m pretty sure I’ll become the target. So I’m sure I’ll need a way to deal with that 😅 maybe I need a solid finisher combo…I’d appreciate any input. Ty.
I had a vision of basically attacking everyone for all those card steals and treasure tokens.

https://archidekt.com/decks/16763045/black_tithe

Archidekt
Black Tithe • (Mono-Black Commander deck) • Archidekt

Rev, Tithe Extractor - Commander deck

(1) Commander • (4) Artifact • (1) Creature • (1) Drain • (11) Draw • (5) Evasion • (1) Instant • (37) Land • (1) Lifegain • (1) Protection • (8) Ramp • (6) Recursion • (6) Removal • (1) Stax • (2) Theft • (2) Tokens • (3) Tutor

deft belfry
#

you can draw for value as much as you want, unless there are clear ways to convert the value into a win con (like the kappa cannoner) or fun stuff what you want do, the deck is just casting spells and drawing cards to cast more spells

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while i dont think you need to play tutor [[fabricate]] (esper got it all) or combo [[sharuum the hegemon]], but as a thought experiment

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

if you can have any one artifact you want either from hand or from grave, what are the top 5 that you enjoy playing

deft belfry
shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

(from commander)

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[[?hooded blightfang]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i do see 6 other cards that naturally has it

#

1 of each is a deathtouch anthem

#

nothing wrong with [[mutilate]], it is just one of those that is harder to control later into the game as land drops accumulate. it is likely to wipe your own board as well

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

in general its better to look for wipes that doesnt reset yourself if possible

#

i may also look for generic cards that sort of work with anything you may get from the opponent's deck

#

its harder because every game is different

#

[[scheming symmetry]] is a nice one

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

if by chance they search for something "useless" expecting you to attack, you can just mindgame and not attacking them? XD but its more about denying the "downside" part of the card as your commander basically say "mill 1" also opposition agent control both searches

#

hard to get first strike/double strike in black but it would be able to get more triggers as well

#

last of all, because rev doesnt allow any black mana as any colour and give a treasure, it may be nice to get more mana fixing lands/mana rock to play non black spells

#

not saying you need [[chromatic lantern]], but having more option would be nice

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[gixian pupperteer]] doesnt make too much sense

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

mono colour decks sometime work like [[endless altar]] for card draw, or [[tome of legend]] etc

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “endless altar”

deft belfry
#

[[endless atlas]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

but if its for synergy, there s probably a few "combat damage trigger" that works with death touch attacking creatures

#

overall, i think theres are ton of flexibility when half the spells are your opponent's

#

all that matters is that you have enough creatures to get through

#

first few turns should be getting small evasive creatures and then Rev for the multiplayer steal, just be aware of boardwipe that put the deck back into the stone age

lilac heath
#

so I really wanted red and ended up trying to brew a grixis version of malcolm evasion matters pirates

#

no clue if it's too good tho

#

well good is relative I wanted this to be a pretty lowkey kind of deck

calm forge
abstract canopy
#

Thanks for your insight! I appreciate the suggestions and thoughts on it.

deft belfry
#

yeah, because it depeneds on many things its hard to say how the game will turn out. i do have a bad habit of building decks that lacks a win con

deft belfry
deft belfry
#

perhaps vial smasher is a bit too open ended ?

#

it is one of my favourite rakdos partner tho

#

i will look into it again at a late time

#

tribal has so many cards availible and some do feel like a trap

lilac heath
#

Vial smasher is kind of just there for the color fixing

deft belfry
#

thought so

modern knot
#

Hiii! I would like to ask if this deck

  1. is Bracket 3
  2. if it is, is it ok to play at bracket 3 or is it going to be very oppressive
    3)any generic ideas to improve it.

The concept is have a bunch of indestructible bombs and Life "Gain" cards as valid prismatic bridge targets, and then pretty much every regular destroy boardwipe under the sun, making them asymmetrical

Archidekt
Esika Control • (WUBRG Commander deck) • Archidekt

Esika, God of the Tree // The Prismatic Bridge - Commander deck

(1) Commander • (1) 1/99 • (8) Casino • (2) Counters • (9) Draw • (35) Land • (8) Protection • (16) Ramp • (2) reflect • (20) Removal • (1) Tutor

deft belfry
#

the salt is not for everyone but can be somewhat expected at B3

#

i wouldnt play something like [[depopulate]] in here because it doesnt benefit myself and can give other players a card

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

so there can be small adjustment to swap out better options

#

but the overall deck will play the same; getting out a blight steel when someone is valuernable will create an experience to say the least

#

and then its the "cost" even with bridge to cheat things out, it maybe a good idea to balance that out in case cards get stuck in hand

image.png
#

can change many white cards out if you want

#

with a commander that need WUBRG, i disfavour [[wild growth]] and [[overgrowth]] [[ranger s path]] since those dont directly fix your colours

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

when it is getting two lands, i usually prefer the 3 mana options [[kodama's reach]] so that i get to the 5 mana mark on the next turn. instead of setting myself up for 6+

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

unless you absolutely need the triome/forest land types, i think cultivate is still better for 5c decks

#

[[single combat]] [[tragic arrogance]] and i would still try to avoid only "destroy" effects so there are ways to deal with heroic intervention, etc

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i usually do [[slaughter the strong]] [[split up]] in my own decks, that has white (which isnt my main colour) [[last one standing]] is one of my favourite

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

if budget allows, there is always the staple toxic duldge, i think [[dont move]] is a nice one as well

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

or as simple as some form of fog will basically turn off a turn

#

i always run [[living death]] in all my black creature decks just because it is like a cheap [[all is dust]] to get rid of any boardstate

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

those probably dont help in your case

#

i think [[eidolon of blossoms]] is a creature that is worth it for decks with so many enchantments; but it also go against the plan of constant board wipe

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
modern knot
calm forge
empty bison
#

Hey @deft belfry. I'm at it again. 🙂 this time I need some help with understanding the dynamics between creature count, mana ramp, self mill, instant interaction. I'm struggling with knowing how much instant interaction to have while not losing out on filling my Graveyard with permanents. Also, knowing how much reanimate to add in. When I play test this deck, once turn 5 or 6 come I can go off. Let me know what you think!

#

I didn't want to stuff the deck with 1 mana cost mana dorks that don't help later in the game. I could also add medallions, but they are not creatures. Maybe I have too many creatures and need to cut some for more diverse interactions.

deft belfry
# empty bison Hey <@391063794387910656>. I'm at it again. 🙂 this time I need some help with u...

creature count: if it is too low, there will be no board presence so that you are the easy target to become free value from [[professional face breaker]]. naturally, it usually doesnt come out pretty but its also not immediately lethal. the upside would be the "immunity" to board wipes

Mana ramp, really just to play lot of big spells, faster and earlier than you would in a normal game. there s a reason why outside of commander, most decks dont run ramp because its less efficient than just hitting the land drop

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i think the other stuff is more flexible since a consistent engine can make up for those things

#

i think its just hard to know exactly the commander is trying to do

#

i dont think having tons of creatures in here is a problem

empty bison
#

Mostly the venom side.

empty bison
#

I was thinking another avenue could be additional attack phases.

deft belfry
#

would be an interesting way to cheat permanents into play

empty bison
#

[[Fear of Missing Out]] [[Éomer, Marshal of Rohan]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i was thinking about the enchantment from fallout that gives extra combat

#

or was it assassin creed

#

without aristocrats payoff, i dont know if vicera seer is good

empty bison
deft belfry
#

worst case scenario, venom is a [[thalia and gitrog]]

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

I really considering fear of missing out now. It hits all the boxes. Creature, draw, discard, and extra attack. Yes, you only unap 1 creature, but that would be venom.

deft belfry
#

which is apparently better than i expected

#

sac a thing, draw a card, play a land

empty bison
#

True

deft belfry
#

[[kaya ghostform]] abuse etb/ltb one extra time

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[surrak and goreclaw]]'s value decreases since venom already has both haste and trample

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

it still a nice riot enable for other creatures

#

i may flavour a etb utility creature such [[revenous chubacapa]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “revenous chubacapa”

deft belfry
#

[[revenous cupacaba]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “revenous cupacaba”

deft belfry
#

the horror dog thing

#

[[archetype of mortality]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

nice i remembered this name correctly. since so many creatures already have trample, i would probably try to sneak in deathtouch since i am a sucker for DT + trample combat

#

[[sprint attack]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “sprint attack”

empty bison
#

I'll play around with that.

deft belfry
#

i will check what is that free run attack when my pc is working better

empty bison
#

All good! I have some digging to do and a ton of questions. 🙂 ill be back in a few hours after the kiddos go to bed.

empty bison
#

What do you think about [[Zagras, Thief of Heartbeats]] vs archetype of finality? Both of them have a single purpose to give deathtouch but zagras has flying and a very small chance to have a reduced cost. This begs the question of what was my initial purpose to put Suurak in the deck? I think I overthought the haste part. The creatures that are cheated in by venom can't attack anyways.

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

I did add [[Kaya's Ghostform]] [[fear of missing out]] [[Zagras, Thief of Heartbeats]] for now... and I took out Viscera Seer, [[Garruk's Uprising]] [[Surrak and Goreclaw]]

shrewd zealotBOT
lilac heath
#

so I tried brewing a casual dragon list cuz noone wants to play miirym at a power 3 at my lgs

deft belfry
#

so far those looks like good swaps

empty bison
deft belfry
#

tell me the testing result, its a tough one since its so open ended

deft belfry
lilac heath
#

ancient copper is not there because i do not want to pay 90 dollars for a dragon

deft belfry
#

without green ramp, i feel like dracogenesis is actually much worse

#

it cost more than the highest cost of a dragon

#

commander makes treasures

#

background draws once per turn

#

a flash dragon would be nice to draw on opponents turn

#

dragon tokens would be nice too for making more treasures

empty bison
deft belfry
#

i think there is a dragon hellkite thing that create 6/6 on attack, somewhat similar to [[!lathliss dragon queen]] that makes 5/5 on etb

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

[[hellkite tyrant]]

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

oops

#

not that one

deft belfry
#

i probably got the name wrong, only remember it is an attack trigger

empty bison
#

[[utvara hellkite]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

YES

empty bison
#

SICk card

deft belfry
#

i never drew it in my games 😭

empty bison
#

lol

deft belfry
#

reprint dropped its price nicely too

#

if you want an 8 drop, this is probably much better than the dracogenesis non dragon spell

#

and the thing that red is best at doing, is to create clones of your own until end of turn

#

from the lowest cost sorcery from Big Score set to the chaos fun [[mirror march]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

the possibility is endless as long as you dont mind going out with a bang

#

[[Twinflame]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i guess this is also 2 mana, not 3

#

overall looks like a solid and simple deck, play dragons, draw cards, rise and repeat. so its just comes down to getting things out on curve and do what you want in boros, interactions or utility spell is very sunjective. i know people who play like 20+ which is overkill

#

as always i try to play [[war room]] or [[Concave]] for the 4 mana for a card in the mana base

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “Concave”

deft belfry
#

[[bond conclav]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “bond conclav”

deft belfry
#

[[bonders enclave]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[[dragon cultist]] is a bit slow

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

just the backgorund weakness of having both itself and commander out is enough to slow everything down

lilac heath
#

hmmm

haughty frost
#

https://archidekt.com/decks/16741291 yo @deft belfry I’m looking for some advice on adding 1-2 top-end reanimation targets to this deck. Could you give me a hand with that and cutting 2-3 cards from the list for those and lightning greaves?

deft belfry
#

very strong synergy, and lot of high quality low mana cost good cards

#

in comparison, [[izoni thousand eyes]] seems too weak

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

things that depends on the grave is still good but it works against the self exile from grave synergy

#

and since delirium focus on as many types as possible, the creature count in grave is often lower than a creature focus self mill deck that resolves around [[jarad golgaro lich lord]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

the sac win con will still give the value in this case

#

it somewhat resemble a black [[fling]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

so many card art i dont recognize XD

#

i find it interesting that you can 3 visit for a basic land so [[hermit druid]] will end up milling more

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

but it may increase the risk of decking out

#

[[revenge of the rats]] is another one of those that wants high creature count

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

and because the tokens are tapped, it is one of the slowest generators i have tried. It was a rough one to get values of it

#

i think they are fine if you want to play them, just find that those stands out to me in terms of card types

#

can bring a closer focus to what the deck is already doing with value permanent to reanimate

#

deck stat looks perfect

#

because winter puts finality counters, the most interesting thing i can thing of is [[aether snap]] and it can work against token decks as well

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

if those things goes back to your grave, then it is easy to reanimate again

haughty frost
#

it hasn't come up much in playtesting

#

neither have the rats, unfortunately

haughty frost
haughty frost
#

what would you recommend putting in reanimation-target wise? (I'm game for strong and/or spicy options)

empty bison
# deft belfry tell me the testing result, its a tough one since its so open ended

Hey, quick question for you. I am not sure if it is worth it to replace [[birds of paradise]] [[ignoble hierarch]] [[llanowar elves]] with [[goldhound]] [[skirk prospector]] [[wild cantor]]? I'm thinking the ability to send them to the graveyard when I want to continue to reduce the cost of bigger spells, have an additional effect if I have to sac them with venom, and a 3rd reason would be able to play Eddie a turn early, and then bring that 1 mana creature right back. I know Eddie isn't even close to the main purpose of the deck, but if he is there, I can use those sac outlets as additional ramp. OR... Is the lost mana by not having mana dorks not worth it in the long run?

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

OHHHH maybe [[tinder wall]] instead of Skirk Prospector? or one of them?

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
shrewd zealotBOT
haughty frost
#

Any other ideas? You’ve been a massive help man

deft belfry
#

i think trying to reanimate a one drop mana dork is not much better than hitting each land drop

empty bison
deft belfry
#

[[ashaya wild]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i think this will work with [[giltrog monster]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “giltrog monster”

haughty frost
#

thank you so much!

#

will definitely ask for advice again some other time

deft belfry
#

np, i havent look too hard to see what are the best creature for the deck, i just thought of ashaya becomes its kind of a combo machine, and every creature will now trigger landfall

deft belfry
shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

and [[journey to eternity]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

https://scryfall.com/card/rix/160/journey-to-eternity-atzal-cave-of-eternity

Journey to Eternity <:mana1:292901508373282827><:manab:292901508872273920><:manag:292901508654301185>

Legendary Enchantment — Aura
Enchant creature you control
When enchanted creature dies, return it to the battlefield under your control, then return this card to the battlefield transformed under your control.
Every journey has its inevitable end . . .

Atzal, Cave of Eternity
Legendary Land
(Transforms from Journey to Eternity.)
manat: Add one mana of any color.
mana3manabmanag, manat: Return target creature card from your graveyard to the battlefield.
. . . but every end is a new beginning.

deft belfry
#

another big creature that works in grave is [[multani yavimaya's avatar]] trample reach is also better than hogaak trample along, i think there are some flying dragons/demons that are worth reanimating but they are just a Timmy big beater thing

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

DANG great ideas

empty bison
#

Maybe [[icetill explorer]]

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

The endless value to fill my grave yard, ramp, mill and a creature.

deft belfry
#

yeah thats a agood one since you can get more lands out of your hand

deft belfry
#

[[azusa]] is probably going to stay the best for a long time

shrewd zealotBOT
#

Multiple cards match “azusa”, can you be more specific?

deft belfry
#

[[overpower attack]][[grim reapers sprint]] were the names i didnt remember last time, not sure if those have a place for multiple attacks

shrewd zealotBOT
#

https://scryfall.com/card/acr/218/overpowering-attack

Overpowering Attack <:mana3:292901508771610624><:manar:292901508796645397><:manar:292901508796645397>

Sorcery
Freerunning mana2manar (You may cast this spell for its freerunning cost if you dealt combat damage to a player this turn with an Assassin or commander.)
Untap all creatures you control that attacked this turn. If it's your main phase, there is an additional combat phase after this phase, followed by an additional main phase.
"Anubis awaits you." —Bayek of Siwa

deft belfry
#

both doesnt seems to have the synergy with venom as expected 😝

empty bison
#

Ahhh all good! I love the idea.

#

Ohhhhh [[Moraug, Fury of Akoum]] is a wild thought! The ruling is interesting as well.

"If the landfall ability resolves during your precombat main phase, the additional combat phase will happen before your regular combat phase. You'll untap creatures you control at the beginning of the additional combat but not at the beginning of your regular combat."

"There won't be an additional main phase after the additional combat phase. For example, if the landfall ability resolves twice during your postcombat main phase, you'll get two consecutive additional combat phases after your main phase (untapping your creatures at the beginning of each), followed by your ending phase."

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

So you really would want to play it 2nd main phase unless you get multiple lands. I think this could work pretty well.

deft belfry
#

that one is als obroken ashaya 😓

empty bison
#

Wait a sec...

deft belfry
#

there is a one drop that can sac itself to put a land into play

#

from hand

#

krosan something

empty bison
#

You can put a land into play with venom....

#

Wtf. Wow.

#

I totally forgot that. I feel silly.

deft belfry
#

yeah thats why i mentioned the [[giltrog monster]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “giltrog monster”

empty bison
#

[[Krosan Wayfarer]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

not that one the [[thalia and gitrog monster]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

you sac a land, play "an additional" land

#

but thats a combat phase land so it wont work with the extra combat

#

comes in 1 turn later but has haste menance instead

#

and less salt from your opponent trying to remove it

empty bison
deft belfry
#

not main phase

#

read moraug, basically has to be the AFTER combat MAIN phase

#

at least 2/3 players at the table will get it wrong

#

the last player is just not paying attention

#

so korsan wayfarer in this case can delay the land drop

#

or just an early game ramp

empty bison
#

Ahhh yeah, I see it now.

deft belfry
#

it s still a bad "steve" but it happens to be a 1 drop

#

i dont really have a deck for it since i run high cost stuff and may risk going hellbent

#

ashaya is still my go to XD

empty bison
#

Lol awesome.

empty bison
#

@deft belfry Eddie Brock (or rather the venom side) is ridiculous. I've only played 3 games but wow. The self mill seems to be the most important. I used [[magus of the wheel]] to put [[Ghalta, Stampede Tyrant]] in the bin from my hand and drew Etali. On attack with venom, sacked [[Junji, the Midnight Sky]] to put Galta on the battlefield which put Etali out... one opponent had rite of replication on top and another had Restoration Angel... so much can happen on one attack.

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

I know I was lucky for all that to happen. I've never been a self mill guy, because I want to play the best cards, but I have to have a different mindset with this. The more in the bin, the faster I can play big stuff to sac to venom to draw a ton of cards. Then, always having a max hand size so I can discard back to 7.

#

I think I want more re-animate in the deck, but I'll play at least 10 games before making any changes.

#

Also waiting on 8 cards to come on Monday to shift the deck slightly anyways.

#

I think if I do make changes. Instead of adding more attack phases, I'd add more Reanimate. We shall see!

deft belfry
#

yeah i saw that coming, but the downside is that self mill has a high chance of removing those reanimate spells so it will be hard to balance between: set up & self mill > reanimate targets > reanimate abilities

marble cedar
#

Hi it's me again

#

Wondering how feel about this selsyna aristocrats list ive been building

#

it mainly functions around [[Verdant Succsesions]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “Verdant Succsesions”

marble cedar
#

[[Verdant Succsesion]]

shrewd zealotBOT
marble cedar
#

Using this to loop creatures for infinite death triggers

#

and then using either mass tokens off of [[World Spine Wurm]]

shrewd zealotBOT
marble cedar
#

or mill off of [[Altar of the brood]]

shrewd zealotBOT
marble cedar
#

to kill everyone

#

or [[God eternal Rohnas]]

shrewd zealotBOT
marble cedar
#

To make every creature infinitley bigh

#

very much a dedicated combo list and a WIP

#

wondering what people think

#

and any ideas!

marble cedar
#

so I can tutor for any creature off of any death trigger

#

which is mad

empty bison
deft belfry
#

i dont think you have [[psychic paper]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

will look at the list again and goldfish it later

deft belfry
#

lot of crazy stuff going on in the deck, some part is lacking tho. but i could also be missing some combos since it can potentially search up anything

#

i do think 34 total lands with trying to play additional land is on the greedy side of mana base, along with some enchantment ramp. if everything works then it will be explosive, but when it doesnt, it will really inconsistent. few cards i thought of that is somewhat along the land of doing loop from grave to library things: [[desecreted tomb ]]
combo time [[dragonlord dramoka]]
or just the fun [[lurking predator]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i think the best GC card here gotta be [[aura shard]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i think its about flushing out the combo line, and its toolboxy nature of the deck, and then find room for support. i also thought of few others like [[aluren]] combos or [[fecundity]] aristocrat style draw

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

the main reason why those are all green cards is that i dont remember any white cards off the top of my head 😅

#

maybe with tokens go wide there can be a build that runs [[rise the past]] or just value [[call of the coppercoats]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

ore side note, in the case that removal like [[beast within]] is never used on a creature, then the primary target would be artifact/ enchantment i believe

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

in that scenario i imagine [[krosan grip]] may have more potential with ashnod altar sac combo that bypass splitsecond and allows for an uncounterable trigger ability loop

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[pact hunt]] seems really hard to do with hare in the 99

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “pact hunt”

deft belfry
#

also be careful with nonbo with [[cornered market]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

also affect fetch lands

#

even if you can turn a basic land into a creature to target, it is still a bad tithe effect [[gift of estates]] i would reconsider the use of this 4 mana "tutor"

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[!pack hunt]] maybe edhrec has some commanders that uses that?

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

it can target opponents creature which is interesting

thick basin
#

trying to get a low to the ground go wide equipment aggro

#

need a few cuts to trim down the avg cmc

#

nice little tutor packages in there of skullclamp to get consistent draw, sunforger getting clever concealment to doge farewell yada yada

haughty frost
#

@deft belfry Made another deck that I need some advice on. It's a blink/lifegain control deck built around the idea of being able to switch my commander to any of the legends listed in the description and have it function decently well without changing the decklist. In goldfishing, the deck feels kinda inconsistent and I'm not quite sure what to cut and what to add to fix it. Thank you so much in advance for the help! Your recommendations for my self-mill deck were really handy! https://archidekt.com/decks/17025725/mmmmmm_thats_some_good_orzhov_soup

deft belfry
#

this doesnt show impulse draw^

#

i think [[neyali suns vanguard]] will do well in the 99

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[jeska ascedenc]] will also net a decent amount of card draw

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “jeska ascedenc”

deft belfry
#

oh wait wrong name

#

confused it with [[whrlwind of thought]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

there are many bounce artifacts to hand to reuse the cast trigger similar to [[rebuild]] or [[paradoxical outcome]] for some card draw

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[preplexing test]] could be a nearly one sided boardwipe

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

any poly morph /warp effect maybe a fun consideration as well for token deck since you will have twice as many permanents out on board

#

i think the red ones that targets are more fitting than [[mass polymorph]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[chaos mutation]] double as removal

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

as a chaos player, i would probably be doing [[confusion in the rank]] to do unfair trades using 1/1s

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

if there is an important artifact, i am sure you will end up getting it back anyways, but it does risk losing your commander without shroud

#

which i am sure your opponent cant get much out of unless they are also playing ally equipments

#

i thought of some other fun stuff but its more of an afterthought that isnt exactly going to help, [[echo of eternity]] may sound like a bad [[anoited possession]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “anoited possession”

deft belfry
#

but the potential of giving equipment that [[mirror room fracture realm]] effect is always fun

shrewd zealotBOT
#

https://scryfall.com/card/dsk/67/mirror-room-fractured-realm

Mirror Room <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manau:292901508754702338>

Enchantment — Room
When you unlock this door, create a token that's a copy of target creature you control, except it's a Reflection in addition to its other creature types.
(You may cast either half. That door unlocks on the battlefield. As a sorcery, you may pay the mana cost of a locked door to unlock it.)

Fractured Realm mana5manaumanau
Enchantment — Room
If a triggered ability of a permanent you control triggers, that ability triggers an additional time.
(You may cast either half. That door unlocks on the battlefield. As a sorcery, you may pay the mana cost of a locked door to unlock it.)

deft belfry
#

if you want doubling, i think the OG [[panharmonicon]] is the way to go

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

two allies, both allies get up to two free equips

#

its basically that [[roaming throne]] with a commander with seperate trigger abilities value

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

for the most part, the deck is fine as it is, i would say play test it first before any major changes

#

double, draw, and self bounce are the main things i want to include

#

[[bureau headmaster]] is my potential cut unless you need to move equipments around

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[armed with proof]] is about the last card i will give a mention just because it sounds like a "funny" couple having argument moment "who were you with last Wednesday night"

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

anything that gives lot of value would be good too. i see that most of the draw in here is single use

#

and then with a single target blink spell, it still turns the spell into a cantrip

#

whenever a deck has black, my direct comparison would be [[phyrexian arena]]. at the cost of 3 mana in an unimportant set-up turn. i will be getting cards from it for the next couple turns as long as the game last. With the expectation that it will draw at least 3+ cards and i am fine with it. high cost commanders like [[stinging study]], being an instant really adds to it

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

[[well of the lost dreams]] may have a chance here

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i see the include of [[arid archway]] but no [[archaeomancer's map]] ?

shrewd zealotBOT
#

https://scryfall.com/card/otj/252/arid-archway

Arid Archway

Land — Desert
This land enters tapped.
When this land enters, return a land you control to its owner's hand. If another Desert was returned this way, surveil 1. (Look at the top card of your library. You may put it into your graveyard.)
manat: Add manacmanac.

deft belfry
#

after card advantage i think its protection, because you really dont want to recast a high cost commander more than once

#

white etb has strong synergy with go wide tokens if thats a route you want to go into, but the idea is just 1 card for more than 1 permanent on board

#

rightnow, ia m not able to see the focus of the deck besides life gain

#

with the best card out + blink, it will only be able to redo that thing once

#

i would be looking for a mass reanimate sort of [[living dead]] so i can maximize the payoff all at once

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

the high creature count make me think that its better off with the taxing [[thorn of awak]] to stall the game out

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “thorn of awak”

deft belfry
#

[[thorn of amethyst]][[Thalia, ]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

Multiple cards match “Thalia,”, can you be more specific?

deft belfry
#

if you are the one playing once per turn big spells, my favourite [[rug of smoothering]] would affect yourself less compare to the rest of the tabel

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

even without the life gain in the core

#

since you mentioned something about "multiple commander" build around, i think its best to put as generic cards in there as possible so it is always easy to castthem

#

without vigiliance [[split up]] is one of the lowest cost wipe

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

that also require very little synergy to work with

#

if you do want to lose all your life, [[toxic deludge]] is always going to be broken and versatile

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

some are slightly more niche necromancy cards that can make you lose tons of life for card draw and such

#

if you do end up commiting to the low to the ground creatures, there is always [[raise the past]] to rebuild

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

getting through the 99 is the main condition to fill up the grave

#

sort of giving yourself a reminder "what should i doin order to always get the Threshold part of cards like [[stitch together]] in case i top deck it" moment

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

casting lot of spells is bad with Liesa on board, so its better to not cast spells or only a few impactful spells

#

what are the distraction/ baits? how to sandbag the threats to always work toward the slow drain gameplan

haughty frost
#

Wow that’s a lot of card suggestions

deft belfry
#

yah i can see many potential route you can go into

#

too much to change for that consistency

haughty frost
#

I think I’d prefer to zero in more on life gain and make blink a smaller theme in the deck to make it more consistent

deft belfry
#

so you want more focus toward liesa, more generic so that it fits any commander of your choice, more card draw and versatile options in game plan, or synergistic control style that is hard to deal with

#

but life gain cant end the game

#

unless you want liesa to drain to death

haughty frost
#

Hm

deft belfry
#

and losing life yourself after gaining it is sort of pointless, would need ways to turn the life into value

#

life gain also just make yourself the target for attacks when there are no [[ghostly prison]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

its the same as playing a planeswalker, +1 it, then it dies in that round, which essentially gainned like 5 life

haughty frost
#

yeah fair point

#

okay

#

i think i'm going to make the deck again with a more coherent theme in mind and then get back to you

deft belfry
#

[[elesh norn, mother of machines]] okay, this for example, strong card. can you explain why you put it in?

shrewd zealotBOT
haughty frost
deft belfry
#

over [[panharmonicon]]

shrewd zealotBOT
haughty frost
#

i forgot that card existed 💀

deft belfry
#

which cost less and harder to removal than a creature

#

XD

#

if you own it, want to play it

#

then play it

#

if you want to use it to somewhat stax your opponent from etb, thats fine

#

make it into part of the plan so it makes sense for synergy

haughty frost
#

makes sense

deft belfry
#

you want a slow steady game

#

that wont end on turn 5

haughty frost
#

i gtg, i'll be back with a retooled version of the deck

#

would you say that a blink/control deck with cards like mister negative and gray merchant to close games could work?

deft belfry
#

as you accumulate your resources, then end it on one big swoop, 👋 gl

#

ofcourse, control plays the long game

#

but negative is single target

#

very different from the slow drain everyone

thick basin
#

I do want to test it in low to the ground aggro style for now so im keeping my average cmc down

#

and if it comes to the late game go for the kaldra plan

#

I'll see how this plays out before i change it more

thick basin
#

Also make [[trusty boomerang]] 0 mana which is very funny

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

🪃 that does look fun

thick basin
#

Dont know if i should put in board wipes

#

Cause its mostly aggro

deft belfry
#

i think its subjective, boardwipes are just interactive multi-target removals

thick basin
#

Yeah

#

Looking at stuff thats tutorable with [[sunforger]] First

shrewd zealotBOT
thick basin
#

I guess if i fetch a free protection spell and then boardwipe thats really good

surreal agate
#

oh hey I'm back lol
Been a while and I've been changing the deck a fair bit so I'm reposting the link: https://moxfield.com/decks/0Wmb0-7hXkiCA9toJYB2ZA

Anyway, I wanna try and fit [[Spark Double]] back in but idk what to take out for it?

Moxfield
The Phyrexian Undead - Commander (Marchesa, the Black Rose)

{up}{bp}{rp} The Phyrexian Undead {up}{bp}{rp}

{up}Proliferate.{up}{bp}Reanimate.{bp}{rp}Dominate{rp}

The Phyrexian Undead

This is my oldest deck, and I suppose by extension: my most tweaked deck. It's gone through many iterations; having originally started as a Thraximundar deck before mak...

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

is there any cards you cant cut or just added in?

image.png
#

looking at the colours, and curve, i think anything that is land/ramp related cant be touched, card draw is too important as well

#

cards that has a high 5+ drop are going to be very hard to hard cast

#

would rather not miss the first 4 land drop in this deck

#

the removal stuff that say exile ore destroy with no synergy can always be an option for cut

#

but those are all just generic cards like a [[counterspell]]

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

thats why i think cutting from the higher end is better especially with a low creature count

surreal agate
#

I suppose I could cut Blasphemous Edict? Since I already have Act at least

#

Nvm actually, think I still would want Edict in

surreal agate
#

idk, it might be either Blasphemous Edict or Act. I forgot to list Contagion Engine under my Mass Disruption category so I technically have 5; I wouldn't be averse to cutting one

#

that being said, which is better?

#

Might stick with Cutting Act just because Edict goes around indestructible and Protection

haughty frost
# deft belfry as you accumulate your resources, then end it on one big swoop, 👋 gl

Alright I remade the deck, this time shrinking the commander options and focusing in on playing a controlly blink deck with a couple ways to turn incremental swings and drain into a win (grey merchant, big elesh norn, exsanguinate, and life total fuckery with mister negative and possibly pact weapon). The deck has more stax pieces to slow the game down as well as more card draw and more tutors to make sure it finds a gameplan every game.
I was also considering a brisela package (easily tutored prison wincon that ends games fast) but couldn't find the space for it. Are there any glaring flaws in the list you can see? Also, are there any cards you would reccomend cutting or adding? https://archidekt.com/decks/17087735

deft belfry
shrewd zealotBOT
surreal agate
#

Eh, this is Bracket 2, I'm not too concerned about having everything needing to be instant speed imo

deft belfry
#

had to recall my memory what the orzhov deck was about, but it looks like there is a much clearer game plan this time around, if there are cards you want to use more, i think removals can be reduced, otherwise, tutor is the easiest to change around since they are redundancy of a "2nd copy" @haughty frost also, check if Gary devotion actually makes it, i think it may be bit low to stay

deft belfry
#

basically i dont flavour the additional cost sac at sorcery speed for exile

#

i should pull up the name because there are other similar cards

#

i wouldnt cut act or edict

deft belfry
shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

somewaht niche scenario btw, if you have a 1/1 with a +1 counter, you can technically [[grim affliction]] on it to give it a -1 counter, proliferate only the -1 counter. when the spell resolves and statebase action is checked, iirc, because it now has 0 toughness, it will die without removing the counters. Since counters doesnt cancel out unless the creature survives on board. Therefore marchesa can still trigger

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

much easier to just use that flare of denial

#

@surreal agate or you can be like me, counterspell the easiest cut in my life XD i dont run double blue pips 95% of the time

#

if i do its for [[narset's reversal]]

shrewd zealotBOT
surreal agate
#

I mean both are in the deck anyway, I have Flare in here because sometimes I have to deal with something urgent and so long as Marchesa has a counter on her, she'll come back at eot

deft belfry
#

yes i was listing things you can do with the cards you have

surreal agate
#

ahh

deft belfry
#

to make room for spark i think i would cut Eaten alive

#

giving my reasoning with sorcery sac

surreal agate
#

I actually cut [[Lulu, Stern Guardian]] in favor of Flare, she just didn't do much for me unfortunately

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

but it makes the most sense to remove a 10 drop that needs to be hard casted

#

i mean, lulu is kinda like those [[propagada]] semi pillowfort

shrewd zealotBOT
surreal agate
#

I think earliest I've managed to get Ulamog was turn 6-7? Depending on how much I proliferate my counter based rocks

deft belfry
#

they arent suppose to be "obviously" doing something

#

fair

#

the land drop miss is my biggest concern

#

my marchesa deck back then was clones "i am better than you" build

surreal agate
#

also because Ulamog's base power is 7, I could easily pitch it to discard and then reanimate it with [[Body Launderer]] lol

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

but launderer need 7 then

#

how do you discard

surreal agate
#

that's 4 counters, I don't usually have that many problems

#

usually I discard from either Benthic Biomancer or Yawgmoth

#

mostly the Biomancer

deft belfry
#

oh right i forgot about yawgmoth

#

that card i usually see in high power combo-ish deck

#

so in the end you cut Act for sparkduble

#

i guess thats fine since you run lot of colour fixers

image.png
surreal agate
#

I mean I set it up awhile ago, I was busy doing other stuff and reading the convo cuz I was convinced I was gonna cut Act for it

#

my big issue with cutting Eaten Alive despite it being Sorcery speed is that sometimes I need something GONE gone, like yeah I could kill a creature by normal means and then hope I get Boggart Trawler to exile the graveyard later, but sometimes I need to make sure my opponent can't possibly bring back what I'm getting rid of

deft belfry
#

i would be aimming for stronger effect like [[chaos warp]] tuckbut its removal at the end of the day so its just preference

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

note that i dont really draw it when it need it because i didnt have enough spot removal anyways XD

#

too greedy on the fun janks

surreal agate
deft belfry
#

i mean that chance is low enough i am willing to take it, and those games are more memorable for low power so i didnt mind

#

i got [[tunnel visioned]] the other day and when i was asked about my favourite card name possibility storm... it was the second last card in the deck

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i was lowkey convinced that i was missing a card when i am 10 cards away from decking out

#

Act is a fine cut, but power wise, its definitely the stronger removal that can be one sided

surreal agate
#

tbf I also recently put in [[Massacre Girl, Known Killer]] so I also have more access to -1/-1 counters than I did before

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

i rarely run it nowadays because i like to get around indestructible consistently

#

yeah i am still having fun with my Massacre Girl deck b4 i eventually take it apart

#

drawing close to 30 cards per game is really nice with random janks

surreal agate
#

I'm eventually going to finish building my Hapatra deck in which I've got another copy of Yawg and Massacre Girl planned to be included in

deft belfry
#

massacre wurm is the MVP in lot of those games

#

i failed with a satisfying hapatra build, it feels too combo-ie

#

waiting for future -1 counter cards that i find interesting

surreal agate
#

half the decks I build tend to focus on whatever combo I couldn't make work in my Marchesa deck before deciding to just keep it B2

deft belfry
#

esp with a tight budget restriction

#

[[black sun zenith]] the fun stuff

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

definite want to get myself a [[black market]] someday if it go down in price

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

it may even become a "black" theme deck

surreal agate
#

on my backburner list is:

Thraximundar Aristocrat Combo
Kilo Counters w/ Vivi Cauldron
Mikaeus the Unhallowed Combo
Hapatra Poison & -1/-1 counters

on top of the other decks I have I could probably stand to upgrade/improve at some point

deft belfry
#

when i want to be edgy and be Dark than black

#

poison yhavent received too much good comments in my LGS

#

so i am not too sure about my direction with green infect stuff

#

[[tainted strike]] i have used one time successfully so far

shrewd zealotBOT
surreal agate
#

I once won a game with [[Lightning Reaver]] + [[Phyresis]] lol

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

it got 10 counters on it? or multiple turns

surreal agate
#

10 counters, then I put Phyresis on it in the 2nd main iirc

deft belfry
#

nice

empty bison
#

Good morning @deft belfry. This deck might be a bit out there and possibly to mean to play, so I was wondering your thoughts. I know that Horobi will die to opponents anything really, so not even sure if this is viable. I love the idea of going full mono black in a different way than most people. It has too many cards so still fiddling with it. https://archidekt.com/decks/17096809/horobi

Archidekt
Horobi • (Mono-Black Commander deck) • Archidekt

Horobi, Death's Wail - Commander deck

(1) Commander • (18) Artifact • (30) Creature • (7) Enchantment • (5) Instant • (40) Land • (2) Sorcery

deft belfry
#

i have run horobi in the 99 and its both chaotic and oppressive XD
let see if you have the [[you can't hide]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “you can't hide”

deft belfry
#

oh no its not there

#

[[cannot hide from me]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

https://scryfall.com/card/dsc/360/you-cannot-hide-from-me

You Cannot Hide from Me

Ongoing Scheme
(An ongoing scheme remains face up until it's abandoned.)
At the beginning of combat on your turn, up to one target creature gets +2/+2 and gains vigilance until end of turn. It can't be blocked this turn.
At the beginning of each opponent's end step, if that player has less than half their starting life total, abandon this scheme.

deft belfry
#

[[can run can hide]]

shrewd zealotBOT
#

No card found for “can run can hide”

deft belfry
#

[[nowhere to run]] 🤦

shrewd zealotBOT
deft belfry
#

it provides both the target ability and remove your opponent s hexproof that was either part of the creature or have boots equipped Before horobi is out

deft belfry
#

since there is liquimental coating, you can also do [[karn the great creator]] to turn anything into a creature

shrewd zealotBOT
#

https://scryfall.com/card/rvr/1/karn-the-great-creator

Karn, the Great Creator <:mana4:292901508712890379>

Legendary Planeswalker — Karn
Activated abilities of artifacts your opponents control can't be activated.
+1: Until your next turn, up to one target noncreature artifact becomes an artifact creature with power and toughness each equal to its mana value.
−2: You may reveal an artifact card you own from outside the game or choose a face-up artifact card you own in exile. Put that card into your hand.
Loyalty: 5

deft belfry
#

karn byitself can already kill treasures/ tokens, with coating you can kill lands too

empty bison
#

Ohh both are perfect!!!

deft belfry
#

😅

#

yeah, the deck that ran horobi had lot of gross things even tho its a weak deck

empty bison
#

I figured as much.

deft belfry
#

[[power conduit]] iirc only target the second part

shrewd zealotBOT
empty bison
#

So I focus on Reanimation as well?

deft belfry
#

not as good here, i used it to loop saga and stuff

#

not sure, because

#

playing a creature deck also means all your things are going to die

empty bison
#

True.