#Orchestral Suite

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plucky burrow
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they is evil

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is it good?

limber rover
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feels like it could get into a lot of unfun ways to catch someone out

plucky burrow
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Hmm..yeah...

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ok I gtg

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cya!

plucky burrow
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You & a Minion know each other's character. From night 3 onwards, they are poisoned & no longer act.

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Hmm

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I wanna change Night 3 to a player alive count

plucky burrow
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You & a Minion know each other's character. If there are 5 or less players alive or 5 or more players dead, they are poisoned & no longer act.

plucky burrow
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Each night*, you may choose a player: they die. If your last choice was no-one, if executed tomorrow, you don't die. your team can only win if no good players live.

fathom rivet
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hi

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
plucky burrow
plucky burrow
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@hollow ferry Wanna help?

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I need a new demon ability for the Conductor

plucky burrow
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This script is being run! πŸ˜„

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https://botc.app/join/clonktower

Blood on the Clocktower Online
Public Game Session 'clonktower' (2 open seats)

Chat language: English
Edition: Homebrew (Orchestral Chorus by Oversplat & Lumious)
Phase: βŒ› in between games
Storyteller(s): GoodpartAFK, Lumious
8 Player(s):
βšͺ Why, βšͺ Games🦘, βšͺ VŌKAI,
βšͺ Mega, βšͺ Dylan 🦘, βšͺ Finn,
βšͺ Seat 7, βšͺ Seat 8
3 Spectator(s): Angel, Cladwell 🦘, Abe
You can join this session with a free account!

plucky burrow
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I plan on making a few changes

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After running the script 1 time with 9 people I noticed a few things that weren't very good

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The Crescendo madness cannot really be justified as the version I ran didn't have a reason for evils to be killed at night.
Night Order broke for some reason.
Rest has too bad of a punishment.

plucky burrow
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Conductor (Demon) - Each night*, choose a player: they die. If you kill a minion your ability is altered (you know how). Your team can only win if no good players live.
Rest (Outsider) - If you have died, an alive townsfolk might not act (once).

plucky burrow
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I just need to fix the Night order and it'll be ready! πŸ˜„

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Idk why it broke Xb

plucky burrow
trim yew
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they clash

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(orchestrator)

plucky burrow
trim yew
plucky burrow
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oh wait that isn't meant to be Orchestrator

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Sorry Xb

trim yew
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from a game design standpoint

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how is that justifiable

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what purpose does it serve to achieve

plucky burrow
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I think it can be taken away

trim yew
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yeah remove that

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vestiges aren't exactly the best especially when they have anti-synergy with the rest of the character

plucky burrow
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Conductor (Demon) - Each night*, choose a player: they die. If you kill a minion your ability is altered (you know how).

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Also should I add the -1 Outsiders for the same reason vigor has it?

limber rover
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no?

plucky burrow
flint crater
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Vigor needs the right kind of minions AND outsiders

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Rest works here, repeat would if it wasn't so confirmable, the rest very much don't

plucky burrow
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hmm ok

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Understood

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Also I wanna replace Poisoner with something that can poison and make good player act multiple times because if someone acts multiple times rn only good can do that

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Each night, choose a player: they act an additional time but are poisoned tonight and tomorrow day for 1 action.

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Someone else made it and I wanna know what should be changed

flint crater
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"...poisoned until dusk..."

plucky burrow
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Each night, choose a player: they act an additional time but are poisoned until dusk for 1 action.

plucky burrow
frosty tangleBOT
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Gave +1 Thanks to @flint crater (current: #299 - 116)

flint crater
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Why not poison both actions? (Or all actions)

plucky burrow
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actually yeah that works

flint crater
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If nobody claims to have made them act extra, they'll just figure it out

plucky burrow
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Then it is also close to poisoner....

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I wonder

flint crater
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That's fine imo

plucky burrow
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Is there a way to make it so selecting evils would be good?

flint crater
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"if good they are poisoned..."

plucky burrow
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hmm

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ok a littttle too strong

flint crater
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Make it unable to choose demons if you do

plucky burrow
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mhm

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Each night, choose a player: they act an additional time but if good are poisoned until dusk for 1 action. The demon is safe from you.

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eh Idk if safe is the right word

flint crater
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  • Each night, choose a player (not the Demon):...
  • Each night, choose a player (no Demons):...
  • Each night, choose a non-Demon player...
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As long as it never turns good it's probably fine

plucky burrow
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hmm

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I kind of want the ability to just not affect the demon

plucky burrow
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it cannot turn good on it's home script

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but I want compatibility

flint crater
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it's homebrew, the home script is all it's likely to get

plucky burrow
flint crater
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Each night, choose a player: if not a Demon,...

plucky burrow
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yeah I like! πŸ˜„

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Each night, choose a player: if not a Demon, they act an additional time but if good are poisoned until dusk for 1 action.

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also should it be *

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we haven't really decided on what happens if they don't act and they act an additional time

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any help?

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Please Xb

flint crater
plucky burrow
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yeah I am just saying

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how does acting an additional time work if they don't act?

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This is the 1 major problem with the script

flint crater
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That is entirely your call

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There's no precedent for not acting due to external abilities

trim yew
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and is only the case because tpi wanted snv to have negative outsider mod smileyface

trim yew
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it is very unlikely any of them will end up off of this script because the characters were made for the script

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not for general use

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
plucky burrow
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ok I changed poisoner to percussion

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and the ability now is
Each night, choose a player: if not a Demon, they might act an additional time but if good are poisoned until dusk for 1 action.

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the might is there because nothing else can cause extra actings on Night 1

limber rover
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it poisoning good demons shouldn't be an issue

plucky burrow
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uh

limber rover
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Each night, choose a player, they might act an additional time but if good they are poisoned for their next action.

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maybe?

plucky burrow
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oh that was before it poisoned

plucky burrow
frosty tangleBOT
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Gave +1 Thanks to @limber rover (current: #162 - 228)

plucky burrow
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Notes
Clarinettist - The Minion should be drunk not poisoned.
Drummer - Good.
Noble - Good. It is official so obvious. Could be replaced by something else, Suggested ability

  • On the first night, choose a good character. Learn if they are in play, and if so, one of two players that are that character.
    Organist - Good but Strong. Still Good.
    Xylophonist - Good.
    Bassoonist - Good. Works well with Exorcist.
    Exorcist - Could be altered to be an instrument
    Pianist - Good but make it learn false info instead of arbitrary.
    Trombonist - Good.
    Trumpeter - Good.
    Violinist - Good but maybe add something that also visits ST to obfuscate.
  • Once per game, choose a player: If a minion they don't act that night.
    Harpist - Good but maybe make it so it's downside isn't removed by executing the Harpist when it would activate it's downside.
    Hornist - Good and gives an out for an evil to die.

Crescendo - Suggested new ability which works well with Conductor. Maybe something that can learn the Crescendo is actually the Crescendo.

  • You think you are another Outsider character, but you are not. Your team cannot win.
    Repeat - Change the death text to When you die.
    Rest - Suggested new ability.
  • You start knowing 1 player. If you die, they no longer wake.

Percussion - Suggested ability change.

Conductor - The new change is good!
Composer

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I am gonna finish this later

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@hollow ferry

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Here

limber rover
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Weaker ww and librarian

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If in play or not claimed by an evil

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And quite strong if claimed by evil

flint crater
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Yeah real noble does the job better in every case

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Minus the one way confirmation ig

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
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I do wanna change noble

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maybe something else that visits the ST

hollow ferry
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Hi all!

I was the one who suggested an alternate ability of the Lib and WW to replace Noble and give a bit more varied confirmation. Basically you get one character you either know is not in play, or one that is with a narrowed down view of who it could be. Great for catching a possible bluff, but also great confirmation of a good player.

With the possible drunkening and poisoning available, it also means there is space for it to be bluffed or straight up false. Imagine an evil player with this as a bluff, saying there is not a Crescendo in play, causing outsiders to want to stay alive to not harm town but actually giving evil an advantage. A flexible You Start Knowing based on what Character you really want to know about.

Obviously some choices are more powerful than others, such as Crescendo but it does give freedom to choose.

hollow ferry
plucky burrow
frosty tangleBOT
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Gave +1 Thanks to @hollow ferry (current: #2173 - 1)

plucky burrow
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Yeah it is something

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But we are closer and closer to this script being good!

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I want to flesh out the acting but you have no clue of it

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Basically if you wouldn’t act and a ability makes you not act, you are told you do not act by the ST at night. It is a similar thing when you act an additional time but you aren’t meant to act, you get told you acted and how many times you did.

plucky burrow
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@hollow ferry are you available rn?

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I never finished writing down all of your input

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Also should we change wake to act?

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
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Uhhh

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I tried making a Poll and it put it in event listings xb

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phew I deleted it

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Ima just do this Manually

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Should We Change The Script Name To Orchestral Suite? (This Was The Name Of The Original Script That Had Only Homebrew Characters)

βœ… - Yes
❌ - No

plucky burrow
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@deft bloom Hello Dwayne

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latest version is just above

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You Here?

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@grand nimbus Hello!

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you are the Luke right?

grand nimbus
plucky burrow
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kk!

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Latest version is above

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please provide any input

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And if you like then you can give a thumbs up!

grand nimbus
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yeah I saw the harpist

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
deft bloom
plucky burrow
grand nimbus
plucky burrow
grand nimbus
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In a "I might screw good team by accident" kind of scary

plucky burrow
deft bloom
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it looks like it would be fun/aa good challenge to play, I do like the demon choices sans yagga

plucky burrow
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The harpist is definately an interesting one

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Personally the main challenge I see is that when are you actually meant to use it?

deft bloom
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thats it it would be all about timing

plucky burrow
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mhm

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You would probably just say, hey I am the Harpist! Watch as no one dies tonight! ✨

deft bloom
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wait what is the crescendo?

plucky burrow
deft bloom
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your team cant win?

plucky burrow
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You dont understand it's ability?

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Yes

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Exactly that

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Very simple I know

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Basically like the Evil Twin's ability

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even if the demon is no more, good just wont win

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game will keep going

deft bloom
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does it nt aply upon death?

plucky burrow
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not an even if dead

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but 2 of the outsiders on script do NOT wanna die

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and there is another reason on script why you might reach a final 2

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Being Conductor

deft bloom
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sorry i mistyped, if you are dead good can win right?

plucky burrow
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not an even if dead ability

deft bloom
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okay cool i was worried there fora second

plucky burrow
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Basically you think you are another outsider (Probably one that doesn't wanna die) but you need to die in order for good to win

plucky burrow
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I can give a fav of Each character type

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Townsfolk - Clarinettist
Outsider - Crescendo
Minion - String
Demon - Composer

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String has so much script presence and I love it

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Crescendo makes you second guess everything

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Clarinettist is a YSK role that doesn't wanna get hung immediately (Also it is the role that I think would be the most reasonable to be added if you just remove the acting part)

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Composer is just FUN

deft bloom
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i feel there are a lot of really strong/good townsfolk i like

plucky burrow
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mhm mhm

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As long as the ST makes the bag balanced it isn't an issue

deft bloom
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bassoonist/violinist and organist

plucky burrow
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mhm?

deft bloom
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exactly

plucky burrow
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I say Organist, Pianist and Trumpeter are the most powerful TF

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Trumpeter was by FAR the most crazy before it got nerfed

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So far what is your guys' favs? πŸ˜„

deft bloom
grand nimbus
plucky burrow
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Drummer is very simple

plucky burrow
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yeah violinist is a very popular one

plucky burrow
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@fathom rivet You there?

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  • To Do List
  • Crescendo ability overhaul.
  • Pianist ability overhaul.
  • Need to decide what kind of hint system to add to the Composer's ability for balance. (Might need to do something similar for Conductor)
fathom rivet
plucky burrow
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I have been working on the script!

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Can you help me work on stuff?

fathom rivet
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i can try, i kinda lost intrest in the script but its cool that you have been working on it still.

plucky burrow
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And thanks! πŸ˜„

fathom rivet
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:fear:

plucky burrow
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We want to remake the Pianist's ability

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Powerful info role

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was too similar to a tracker role

fathom rivet
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what is it currently

plucky burrow
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Well we want to comlpetely remake it from the ground up

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but this is what it was

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Each night*, choose a player (not yourself): learn the character they chose. If no-one or if they're evil, you learn false info.

fathom rivet
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ok

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so what do you want it to be like

plucky burrow
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Strong Info

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Possibly a Once per game visit the ST type role

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to go with Violinist better

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like how you don't attack anyone who visits the ST on S&V assuming they are Savant because they might be a spent artist

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something to do that could be good

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but just powerful info would be nice

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More on par with Organist and Trumpeter

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This is what the script looks like rn

Orchestral_Chorus.jpg
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Hate that it doesn't load the official icons Xb

fathom rivet
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yea

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so so far we have "Once per game, visit the storyteller..."

plucky burrow
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Mhm Mhm

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nice!

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Gotta be powerful

fathom rivet
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Once per game, visit the storyteller. If good is winning, gain an outsider ability. If evil is winning, gain a townsfolk ability.

plucky burrow
fathom rivet
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yes

plucky burrow
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yeah that ability is not good

fathom rivet
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ok

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Once per game, visit the storyteller and choose a player. If townsfolk, they die.

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idk

plucky burrow
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yeah no

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😦

fathom rivet
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give me more of what you want

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like all im working off of is visiting the storyteller

plucky burrow
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strong info

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I mean you can make it a each night thing if needed

limber rover
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virgin that doesnt lose a day

plucky burrow
limber rover
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and can't be blocked by someone else nomming them

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also doesn't have the 1st condition

plucky burrow
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not really what I am going for

limber rover
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so is stronger to fight poisoning

plucky burrow
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ok I gtg

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hopefully I come back to an ability! πŸ˜„

fathom rivet
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bye

hollow ferry
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Hi Lumi! Sorry for my absence, had my wife's birthday over the weekend which needed all of my attention.

To finish my input;
Brass - I like it. Gives evil a way to prevent waking up. Possible consideration could also be changing it to "or 1 good player might not wake up and 1 evil player might wake an additional time". Removes the random 1-3 option in favour for a hard number to track.
Assassin - Official, can't beat it (pun intended).
String - Honestly, probably my favourite of the minions. Makes outsiders be paranoid, but grants an alternate win condition. No notes.

Yaggababble - Personally, I feel like the random kills not controlled is the only weakness. What if we made a slight tweak into something like;
"Ensemble. Learn a phrase. For each time you said it publicly during the day, you wake that night to choose a player; they might die." Grants the Demon plenty of killing potential, can be targeted, and still let's the ST stop a potentially bad kill that could have been bad for evil. Also just different enough that it's not a total rehash, since it's waking multiple times and not just the once.
Conductor - Already given notes, love it. Though with the change to Crescendo, may not need evil deaths anymore.
Composer - I touched on it briefly that it doesn't work in a teensy, but aside from that, does have the most variety as it is an evil Amnesiac like ability. To balance, I would potentially say that maybe the player who learns there is a Composer also gets a hint about the ability. Such as "The Composed player picks players", "Does not wake", etc. That way it allows some ways to identify onto the selected character somehow.
Orchestrator - I feel like it should be a guaranteed not act, but worded like "Choose two players; one dies and one does not wake." That way the ST can choose which one would most benefit the Demon/evil team in that moment. Though if I may also add another possibility, make this allow evil to wake in the following way;

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"Each night, choose two players (not yourself); one dies, the other if good doesn't wake or if evil wakes an additional time." That way it's truly an orchestrator making an impact on the game.

And I think thats all! I'll definitely be more talkative going forward now. 😁

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Ooo had an idea for the Ensemble. Make it so that each evil player may say it to allow the demon an additional kill. (Possibly even changing the name to Symphony or Harmony to represent the multiple people.
Something like;
"Ensemble. Each night, all evil players learn a phrase. For each evil player who publicly said that phrase, wake to choose a player; they might die."

limber rover
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as its a lot harder to feel fine rewarding 2 kills as an st of the 2 strongest characters

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while a lot easier with rewarding said kills to 2 spent characters or opg abilities

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also forces the st to listen to everything that is said always, but thats a side note

hollow ferry
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And on its own, yeah Yaggababble is alright. Personally seen too many games where a Yaggababble just fails to affect the game meaningfully.

Regardless, it's place on the Script is more what I'm honing in on, and trying to think of an alternative possibility for a demon there.

plucky burrow
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Oh nice!

plucky burrow
frosty tangleBOT
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Gave +1 Thanks to @hollow ferry (current: #1807 - 2)

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
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Brass has been changed!

Brass (Minion)

Each night*, choose a player: they are "mad" about waking abnormally, or that night, a player 1) doesn’t act or 2) acts an additional time.

fickle heart
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alrighty what do we have here

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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Can I get an example of an alter for conductor?

plucky burrow
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btw the Characters that we want to replace are Pianist and Crescendo

fickle heart
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got it

plucky burrow
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like

fickle heart
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Also for composer does the good player learn their ability was altered? I assume not

plucky burrow
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we wanna add a hint thing for the person who knows Composer is in play

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Conductor Ability modification could be as simple as gaining something from another demon

fickle heart
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instead of a person learning at the start a good player could learn each time it happens? This might be way too big of a nerf

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it could be the same person each time

plucky burrow
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to anything ya want

plucky burrow
fickle heart
fickle heart
plucky burrow
plucky burrow
fickle heart
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ah, don't mind my poor reading comprehension lol

plucky burrow
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oh I thought of a conductor change!

plucky burrow
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this could also be a self composer change

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since composer can self target

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or target a minion

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to improve their ability

fickle heart
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String does not need to include at least 1 outsider

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if there's 0 then they have to guess that there's 0

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and if they guess someone as an outsider then they cry :)

plucky burrow
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A Conductor change could be, you may choose not to attack, for each night you choose to not attack you can attack again the following night

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
fickle heart
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that seems like a cheap gamble lol

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and also a bold move to assume your ST won't start to meta you if you always do that

plucky burrow
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Yeah, I wouldn't always use just 1 ability

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it is like amne

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have a collection ready

fickle heart
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I'm more so saying to do that for shorter text and also as a once in a while gambit for the ST just to keep them on their toes

plucky burrow
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what

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what are you saying?

fickle heart
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to remove the at least 1 outsider from String

plucky burrow
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1, use replies so I know what you are talking about

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2, Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh........... But I don't want people to feel cheated thaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat much

fickle heart
plucky burrow
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in general people should

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like with amne abilities

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but I will have one eventually

fickle heart
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Orchestrator should probably use the same wording as rest

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since I assume they're meant to cover each other being in the game

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although not very well hmm

plucky burrow
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wait...

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oh did I copy the wrong thing????

fickle heart
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you might've lol

plucky burrow
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yeah that is not what rest's ability looks like now Xb

fickle heart
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ah alright lol

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yea just repost the newer version

plucky burrow
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oh wait, no

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I think i am confusing myself Xb

fickle heart
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hmm?

plucky burrow
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I may of looked at the wrong thing

fickle heart
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either way brass isn't up to date

plucky burrow
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yeah no I made myself think I was wrong

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don't worry that is the latest version

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it was updated recently so I was confused Xb

plucky burrow
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Hmm, we still need to decide actually

fickle heart
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well I assume you meant to change it to what you posted in #homebrew-characters ?

plucky burrow
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do we want act or wake...

fickle heart
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I'm still concerned about rest

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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since it more or less confirms itself

plucky burrow
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Can you find the message?

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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I mean

plucky burrow
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you can make a person not act with the right tools

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alwell

fickle heart
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think of it like a Virgin

plucky burrow
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yeah

fickle heart
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sure you basically sacrifice 2 players

plucky burrow
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still

fickle heart
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but you're also more or less confirming 2 players

plucky burrow
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this is 1 person

fickle heart
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remember Virgin is one of the strongest townsfolk characters in the game lol

plucky burrow
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and they are the dead one

plucky burrow
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still

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think of it like this

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They are dead, they are doing something bad that can be done by other means

fickle heart
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what other means?

plucky burrow
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did you read the script?

fickle heart
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I haven't looked at the townsfolk that's it

plucky burrow
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Once per game each, at night*, choose a player to 1) not act tonight or 2) act an additional time tonight.

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ok that is like the only good role that can cause good to not wake

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but still!

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the evils also can do that!

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soooo yeah!

fickle heart
plucky burrow
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Bassoonist

fickle heart
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I don't think they're going to try and fake a rest being in game considering they're good

plucky burrow
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oh wait

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I forgot the main reason the rest wont wanna say anything

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String

fickle heart
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hmm

plucky burrow
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what kind of outsider is gonna come out with this thing on script?

fickle heart
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rest can still tell the person who isn't waking

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since they're almost assuredly not evil

plucky burrow
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an ST could show them the String

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it doesn't affect the string

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:D

fickle heart
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while true string still has other outsiders to guess

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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rest isn't guaranteed to be the only outsider in play

plucky burrow
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yes

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Still the rest isn't gonna want to say anything

fickle heart
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hmm

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I still don't think it's that bad of an outsider

plucky burrow
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ok, make it worse

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I mean it kind of was worse, idk Xb

fickle heart
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"Evils learn who"?

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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yea

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or rather just the Demon

plucky burrow
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I mean that does confirm the outsider......

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Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

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maybe we can get a 3rd opinion?

fickle heart
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For the characters you're trying to replace, do you feel like your script is lacking anything?

plucky burrow
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hmmm

fickle heart
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oh hmm

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what about

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"Outsider: Whenever you or an evil player dies 1 player no longer wakes, even if dead."

plucky burrow
#

Enough players to test it?

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

have you not had a chance to playtest it?

plucky burrow
#

oh I have

#

like maybe 4 times in it's entirety?

#

5 maybe

fickle heart
#

Ok, in the playtests did you feel like anything was lacking?

plucky burrow
#

ok real answer...

#

uhhh

#

well, there is 1 issue

#

but ehhhh

#

nah not that big of an issue...

#

:<

fickle heart
#

lemme know :c

#

spit it out

plucky burrow
#

a Once per game visit the ST role to complement Violinist in a Savant/Artist type relationship

#

but that should prob be a TF

#

also PM is on script

fickle heart
plucky burrow
#

severly more damaging

fickle heart
#

ok you don't like it, why?

plucky burrow
#

I didn't say I didn't like it

#

just wondering if it is balanced

fickle heart
#

as in which way?

plucky burrow
#

Balance way

fickle heart
#

I meant as in too weak or too strong?

plucky burrow
#

Uhhh

#

Idk!

fickle heart
#

so here's the thing

#

it's really hurtful to the good team yes

#

but

#

it also feeds them a ton of information

plucky burrow
#

Btw why are we working on Rest? I thought we were doing crescendo?

fickle heart
#

uuh

#

ngl that was meant for crescendo

#

but

#

it works better for rest

#

lol

plucky burrow
#

oh

#

XD

#

yeah it is what rest is meant to do

fickle heart
#

ok out of curiousity is there a certain vibe you're going for on crescendo?

plucky burrow
#

Well, originally it was thinking you are something else

fickle heart
#

that's what it says atm ye

plucky burrow
#

but an outsider thinking they are another outsider isn't that good

fickle heart
#

mmhm

plucky burrow
#

And an outsider that thinks they are good is just drunk

#

outsider that thinks they are the demon is lunatic

#

and an outsider that thinks they are a minion is ehhhhhhh

#

nah

fickle heart
#

alright

#

well Crescendo makes me think of echoing

#

building up to something bigger

plucky burrow
#

I do remember the V1 of Crescendo made someone else think they were evil

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

so something along the lines of "Every other night*, a player next to the Demon's first choice dies."

#

although

#

Repeat is already very similar to that

plucky burrow
#

yeah that is a no

fickle heart
#

Alrighty

#

what about something that does something on final day

#

it's building to a finale ye?

plucky burrow
#

Hmmm

#

yeah I like

fickle heart
#

this leaves us with 2 choices though

#

well a few

#

since the ability needs to make it that far lol

#

how do we prevent him from just dying

#

an on death effects are a bit overused so I generally try to avoid them if we have better options

plucky burrow
#

This feels like we are just making reverse mayor XD

fickle heart
#

exactly

#

:p

#

"If you die by execution or when there are 4 or fewer players..."?

plucky burrow
#

ehhh

fickle heart
#

:)

plucky burrow
#

nah

fickle heart
#

hmm

plucky burrow
#

Ooh, idea!

fickle heart
#

mmhm?

plucky burrow
#

Rippoff another idea! πŸ˜„

fickle heart
#

always

#

what is it?

plucky burrow
#

There is at least 1 death each night, even if you are dead. If you die at night, you are drunk.

#

Idk how to word it

#

but yeah!

#

Good?

fickle heart
#

how much death prevention is on this script?

plucky burrow
#

uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

#

Lemme find that!

#

ok from sources that are not stupid

#

Yagga

#

Exorcist

#

Bassoonist
Hornist

fickle heart
#

yagga?

#

oh I guess

#

but then you also have an assassin

#

speaking of which

#

why is assassin on this script

plucky burrow
#

uh

#

to fill the slot!

#

πŸ˜„

fickle heart
#

ok lets maybe replace assassin lol

plucky burrow
#

that is a later thing

fickle heart
#

hmm

plucky burrow
#

is this ability for the Cresendo good?

fickle heart
#

I don't think there's enough death prevention

#

especially with assassin on the script

plucky burrow
#

ok, what if you ignore the assassin?

fickle heart
#

even then

#

there's like 3 characters on the script that prevent death

plucky burrow
#

does it have to be good death prevention?

plucky burrow
#

1 is yagga tho

#

sooo

fickle heart
#

there's a good chance crescendo and none of those characters are on the script

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

rack?

plucky burrow
#

a game

#

ya know

#

the roles that people get

fickle heart
#

mmm yea

#

there's a good chance none of them show up in a rack ye

#

and even if 1 does

#

they're not guaranteed to prevent any deaths

plucky burrow
#

yeah

fickle heart
#

and I don't think the threat of this character existing does enough to make up for that either

plucky burrow
#

ok so do you have any better ideas? >:<

fickle heart
#

it doesn't really eliminate worlds

plucky burrow
#

ok maybe a similar format tho?

#

(Insert Spooky Bad Thing), even if you are dead. If you die at night, you are drunk.

fickle heart
#

hmm maybe

#

what if we went a boomdandy route?

#

that's certainly building to a finale 😁

plucky burrow
#

what, it wants to be exed?

fickle heart
#

no

#

I meant more in the vein of blowing up most of town

plucky burrow
#

Well then it is just boomdandy

fickle heart
#

hmm

plucky burrow
#

Crescendo (Outsider) - The ST hates you.

fickle heart
#

If you died the majority of town dies?

plucky burrow
#

ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

#

I mean

#

hmm

#

boom.......

#

hmmm

fickle heart
#

how do we make it a climatic finale

#

hmm

plucky burrow
#

Hmm

fickle heart
#

what's the most climatic game you've ever played? :p

plucky burrow
#

If you are dead, and there is only 3 players alive, 1 minute later, the player with the most players pointing at them, dies.

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

Evils win when there's 4 or fewer players alive? lol

#

naw

#

I don't like that

plucky burrow
#

When people straight up couldn't tell who was evil because of logical reasonings for all players being evil

fickle heart
#

hmm

#

I'm gonna go think for a bit

plucky burrow
#

If your team would win, they lose instead, even if dead. If you die at night, you are drunk.

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

brain has been thinking

#

I have 2 concepts

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#
  1. Turn it into a townsfolk "Each night*, you gain +1 vote while dead."
#

so basically it builds up in votes

plucky burrow
#

Hmmm

fickle heart
#

if it lives until N2 then it's dead vote counts as 2

plucky burrow
#

ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

fickle heart
#

if it lives until N3 it's dead vote counts as 3

#

ect

#

second concept

plucky burrow
#

yeah I don't know if i likee that one

fickle heart
#

Each night*, choose a number of living players equal to the evil player count: if all living evil players are chosen, evil wins at dusk and you learn this.

plucky burrow
#

hmmmmmmmmmm

#

cant this choose itself to avoid everything?

fickle heart
#

good point lol

plucky burrow
#

yeah fix that

fickle heart
#

just include other players

plucky burrow
#

also this just wants to die

#

maybe make it a if you are dead

#

ability

fickle heart
#

maybe, however

#
  1. how are you going to get yourself killed? You can't out for execution because of strings. You have to get the Demon to kill you.
  2. there is an incentive because this does technically narrow down the Demon candidates, but only for you.
plucky burrow
#

hmmm

#

ehhh

#

ok I have 2 ideas

fickle heart
#

Each night*, choose a number of living players equal to the evil player count (not yourself): if all living evil players are chosen, evil wins at dusk and you learn this.

plucky burrow
#

lemme fix them up and I can show ya

fickle heart
#

aight

#

I just find the same old death prevention tactics boring

#

and I'm not entirely convinced using executes on outsiders is strictly good for town

plucky burrow
#

oh also

#

this is an oracle

#

since it knows how many evils are alive

fickle heart
#

mmm well

#

it never actually changes how many players it chooses

#

so even if one dies it's still choosing the same number of players

plucky burrow
#

Each night*, if you are dead, choose a number of living players equal to the evil player count (not yourself): if all living evil players are chosen, evil wins at dusk and you learn this.

Each night*, even if dead, choose a number of living players equal to the evil player count (not yourself): if all living evil players are chosen, evil wins at dusk and you learn this. If you die at night, you are drunk.

fickle heart
#

it's just more likely to activate

plucky burrow
#

ohhh

#

wait

#

eventually it just forces itself to activate

fickle heart
#

yes

#

:)

#

it's building to a finale

plucky burrow
#

ok..

fickle heart
#

you can't stop it

plucky burrow
#

but this def needs a string jinx

fickle heart
#

does it?

#

why?

plucky burrow
#

Yeah?

#

Because Crescendo needs to say it is happening!

fickle heart
#

well that's their job to figure out

#

they don't need a jinx to help out

plucky burrow
#

Really???

fickle heart
#

I mean

#

they know the entire living evil team

plucky burrow
#

I say we get a 3rd opinion

fickle heart
#

surely they can whisper to some goodies and get them on board

plucky burrow
#

ok ok

fickle heart
#

they have an absolutely massive boon

plucky burrow
#

@hollow ferry can we have your help please? πŸ˜„

fickle heart
#

they know all living players outside their choice are good players

plucky burrow
#

actually yeah

#

wait wait

#

hmmm

fickle heart
#

:)

#

I think it's more of a game of

plucky burrow
#

ok we need to add something that tell them who is evil

fickle heart
#

they already know though

#

remember they learn if their choices include the entire living evil team

plucky burrow
#

Each night*, even if dead, choose a number of living players equal to the evil player count (not yourself): if all living evil players are chosen, you learn the identity of all evil players, evil wins at dusk and you learn this. If you die at night, you are drunk.

fickle heart
#

ok hold on

#

think of it like this

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

true

#

but only 1-2

#

and they already know every living player outside of it is good

#

and remember this is an outsider

#

it's meant to be bad

plucky burrow
#

ok ok fiine

#

yeah

fickle heart
#

it's like heretic

#

it's really bad most of the time

plucky burrow
#

Each night*, even if dead, choose a number of living players equal to the evil player count (not yourself): if all living evil players are chosen, evil wins at dusk and you learn this. If you die at night, you are drunk.

fickle heart
#

but

#

there's that small niche

#

that tiny window

#

where if you pull it off

plucky burrow
#

Honestly I like

fickle heart
#

you can win your team the game

plucky burrow
#

but I'd like someone to look at it

fickle heart
#

fair

#

I don't think the if you die at night you are drunk is necessary

plucky burrow
#

I mean, it is an out

fickle heart
#

having the demon sink a kill into your is good enough imo

#

naw

#

nothing can stop the crescendo

#

it's coming

#

and all will hear

plucky burrow
#

hmmm, ok ok

#

yeah we can ask some people

fickle heart
#

also technically you can survive until final 3 anyways

plucky burrow
#

We can continue on for Pianist now

fickle heart
#

and also you're technically eliminating evil teams

#

you are gathering information

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

ok

plucky burrow
#

also we do agree the Crescendo is an even if dead

#

right?

fickle heart
#

eh sure

#

Yea I suppose that's fine

plucky burrow
#

yeah, I mean as you said

#

it is coming

fickle heart
#

Yea :3

#

I do like that feeling of inevitability

#

and even at that you can still technically never activate it until final 3 anyways

#

you just have to be good enough lol

#

ok uh

#

outsiders are hard

plucky burrow
#

yeah

fickle heart
#

my brain power is waning

plucky burrow
#

Pianist now

fickle heart
#

lol

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

o noes

#

πŸ™Œ

plucky burrow
#

:D

#

Now, strong Townsfolk role

fickle heart
#

alrighty

plucky burrow
#

info

fickle heart
#

what should pianist do

#

man tho

plucky burrow
#

Have powerful info

fickle heart
#

I love crescendo now lol

plucky burrow
#

you have made your mark on this script

fickle heart
#

:3

plucky burrow
#

trust me this is going to be the next Fall Of Rome

fickle heart
#

hmm

#

some high aims you have there

#

Ok what are the best evil characters and why does town struggle with them?

plucky burrow
#

Aim high and you will either reach the moon or land in the stars

fickle heart
#

fair

plucky burrow
#

Assassin

#

nah jk XD

fickle heart
#

pff

plucky burrow
#

oh evil characters in general

#

Composer, and I guess Conductor now too

#

just reeeeaaaaalllly random

#

rn the only thing that can take a peak at the randomness for town is Violinist

fickle heart
#

this feels like

#

Each day you may visit the storyteller to learn something that's changed since last night

plucky burrow
#

hmmm

fickle heart
#

my only issue is I'm not great at thinking of stuff like savant info so idk how this would play out

plucky burrow
#

Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

#

We already have a savant replacement

#

Maybe something like a Once per game ability

#

something on the level of Artist

#

Once per game, during the day, privately ask the Storyteller to do a favour (they my refuse).

#

Yeah just bend the rules for me why don't ya lad?

#

"I am legally obligated to do this"

fickle heart
#

once per game, during the day, play the piano in real life, if everyone enjoys your performance, win the game!

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

my work here is done lol

plucky burrow
#

Ya know what is the funny thing

#

We had something similar to this XD

fickle heart
#

lol

plucky burrow
#

Note - Outsider - If you died today or tonight, all players learn this and something bad might happen to good players who doesn't sing to talk tommorow.

fickle heart
#

"Once per game, during the day, choose any number of players: learn something they all share in common."

plucky burrow
#

ok which is better

#

Once per game, during the day, choose any number of players: learn something they all share in common.

Or

Once per game, during the day, privately ask the Storyteller for a favour (they my refuse).

fickle heart
#

should probably be at least 2 players actually

#

The favour just sounds like wizard ngl lol

plucky burrow
#

Wizard?

#

Wazzat?

fickle heart
#

leaked official character iirc

#

lemme hunt it down

plucky burrow
#

ok!

fickle heart
#

Wizard (Minion): Once per game, choose to make a wish. If granted, your wish may have a price, and leaves a clue to its nature.

plucky burrow
#

Hmmm

#

well do you like my version?

#

or should we use your version?

#

I am down for both

fickle heart
#

I feel like it's too esoteric for this script

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

yea

plucky burrow
#

nice

#

ok we can use your version!

#

can you give some exampes tho?

fickle heart
#

doesn't mean what I thought it did but oh well lol

plucky burrow
#

of somethings an ST would say

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

mmm give me a set of characters

fickle heart
plucky burrow
#

yeah

#

now give examples or suffer πŸ”«

fickle heart
plucky burrow
#

oh sorry I didn't see that

#

Also if you are liking this script, please be sure the like it and I wont hunt down your family! πŸ˜„

fickle heart
#

but yea tbh I think between mine or yours it's really up to you since it's more of a designers choice here

#

they both accomplish the goal of a once per game visit the ST

#

it's more of a question do you want a mechanical impact or a info impact

#

and more open ended versus more closed off in terms of a results

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

which there's no real right answer it's more of a designers choice here

plucky burrow
#

yeah info I think

plucky burrow
#

I like yours more tho

#

Also, do you like the script? πŸ˜„

fickle heart
#

They all involve not acting at night in some way

plucky burrow
#

hmmm, good one

#

ok I will give another

fickle heart
plucky burrow
#

So are you gonna like it? πŸ˜„

fickle heart
#

uh

plucky burrow
#

ya know

#

press that button

fickle heart
#

idk what impact that has lol

plucky burrow
#

Makes me feel like I have acomplished something

fickle heart
#

eh crescendo concept is here I'm invested now lol

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

anyways

plucky burrow
#

Drummer, Percussion, Repeat

#

there

#

DO IT

fickle heart
#

They all involve doubles

#

:)

plucky burrow
#

Woh

fickle heart
#

but also

plucky burrow
#

You are amazing!

fickle heart
#

this experiment was interesting

#

because I think 3 is a sweet spot

#

any more and it becomes a lot harder to find a connection

plucky burrow
#

yeah...

fickle heart
#

and 2 just isn't really interesting

plucky burrow
#

mhm mhm

#

so 3?

fickle heart
#

yea

#

I think have them always pick 3

#

(ngl I'm surprised I found connections lol)

#

yea looks good

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

use artist wording probably

plucky burrow
#

???

#

oh

fickle heart
#

Once per game, choose to make a wish. If granted, your wish may have a price, and leaves a clue to its nature.

#

uh

#

Once per game, during the day,
privately ask the Storyteller

#

there

#

wait

#

that doesn't work

#

hmm

plucky burrow
#

Once per game, during the day, privately go to the Storyteller and choose 3 players: learn something they all share in common.

fickle heart
#

Yea

#

probably get someone else to do wording

plucky burrow
#

yeah

#

I will find someone

fickle heart
#

the fun part about this as well

#

is if the group knows instruments you can also make connections with those :p

plucky burrow
#

yeah!

#

:0

#

btw

#

for composer

fickle heart
#

mmhm?

plucky burrow
#

should it be a 1 time hint?

#

or should it be an amne style thing

fickle heart
#

1 time hint

plucky burrow
#

kk

fickle heart
#

what alterations have you done for composer btw?

plucky burrow
#

now, gimme an example or 3

fickle heart
#

for?

plucky burrow
#

the hint

fickle heart
#

That depends what the alterations are lol

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
#

Oh wait

#

Ohh

#

no the ability changed!

#

AGH

#

sorry

#

this used the old Clarinettist as a base 😦

fickle heart
#

that's fine

#

this alteration still works ngl

#

or at least it's close enough

#

it would probably just be like

#

uh

#

idk I'm bad at this

#

best I can think of is there's extra abilities in play

#

actually that's probably fine

#

Ok

#

but I should really sleep now

plucky burrow
#

Clarinettist - You start knowing a not in play evil character and might learn another at any time. When an evil character dies, an alive evil character gains their ability.

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

Gn

plucky burrow
#

Crescendo (Outsider)

Each night*, choose a living player for each evil character in the setup (not yourself), even if you died during the day: If all living evil players are chosen, you learn all evil players & evil wins at dusk.

#

Pianist (Townsfolk)

Once per game, during the day, privately visit the Storyteller and choose 3 players: learn something they all share in common.

plucky burrow
fickle heart
#

Also, maybe don't be so aggressive in trying to get people to shorten it xd

#

Also you didn't update the Crescendo text to what you posted

hollow ferry
#

Rather than read all the chat, why the change from the simplified Crescendo that prevents a good win while living to this?

Also had a couple of ideas that could that I'd like to share;
(Townsfolk). Each night*, choose a player. They cannot die until dusk, but if good also do not wake.
Protection at the cost of possibly not waking.

(Townsfolk (Pianist?)). Once per game, visit the storyteller during the day to choose a player. That night, they wake two extra times.
Basically overclocks a player to gain a ton of information, but at the same time terrible if choosing evil. Evil have a chance to stop this by watching who visits the storyteller and possibly killing them at night.

(Townsfolk). You start knowing a good character. This character's ability is altered if it is in play. You learn how.
Also some bluffability to a Composer, but of course benefits good. Could possibly be out of play, which is to balance such critical information, since you never truly know if the character you saw is real or is instead a bluff.

(Minion(Demon?). Each night, choose a player: they wake an additional time. The previously chosen player dies.
I personally think Minion, since it could very much be used to get kills alongside the demon, while also benefitting town in some way. Can also be used on Evils, but at a risk. Definitely a more out there option.

fickle heart
#

(Townsfolk). Each night*, choose a player. They cannot die until dusk, but if good also do not wake.
This is just monk but like worse

(Townsfolk (Pianist?)). Once per game, visit the storyteller during the day to choose a player. That night, they wake two extra times.
Doesn't Bassonist already do this?

(Townsfolk). You start knowing a good character. This character's ability is altered if it is in play. You learn how.
Looks interesting but knowing an out of play good character means you're just useless which isn't fun.

(Minion(Demon?). Each night, choose a player: they wake an additional time. The previously chosen player dies.
Actually looks like a fine minion design, very interesting risk reward dynamic. Should probably be once or twice per game ability.

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
plucky burrow
plucky burrow
plucky burrow
#

does also make another reason for extra death

#

which can be interesting

hollow ferry
# fickle heart > (Townsfolk). Each night*, choose a player. They cannot die until dusk, but if ...

1st one; while yes, technically a worse Monk, there's three key differences. First being they cannot die period, including the execution of said choice. This also causes another way to not wake, which can be some information if you choose an evil player and they say they did wake. Finally is that it's another townsfolk way to cause lack of waking.
Not saying it's definitely good. Considering there is no other way to survive execution publicly, it definitely doesn't fit at the moment. But it's something to consider.

2nd one; That is fair! I was still remember the old Bassoonist when I made this one. I just liked the idea of allowing someone to definitely wake multiple times at the cost of being more visible in your choice of doing so.

3rd; Agreed that it should be an in play character, but the angle I was aiming for is that this townsfolk might also see a Bluff, and could be used in tandem to possibly find out it is a Bluff. But definitely applicable as you suggested since Puzzlemaster and Percussion are currently available.

4th; The only reason I think it should stay as I worded and not limited is that it becomes very obvious very rapidly that this minion is in play, which can be used to possibly track minions and demons that are limited in kills. Though this was mainly suggested as a Assassin replacement, so limited uses is still quite fine.

#

I still also like my Ensemble idea, to share it again, as a Yaggababble replacement, now slightly reworded.

"Ensemble. You start knowing a phrase. For each living Evil player to publicly say this phrase, you wake to choose a player; they die."

Basically allows for multiple kills, but at the risk that the evil team will have to repeatedly saying a particular phrase. Also let's the Demon hide somewhat if the town decides to start killing the evil players off. Balanced at all numbers, since in -9 players it's just a Minion and a Demon. 10-12 is 3, and 13+ is 4. Some situations allows for extra evils, but put the evil team at risk to trust said evils.

plucky burrow
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Minion - Each night*, if someone died today, choose a player: they wake an additional time. The previously chosen player dies.

plucky burrow
plucky burrow
hollow ferry
plucky burrow
hollow ferry
# plucky burrow Hmmm, the Ensemble idea is interesting

Personally I could also see "Orchestrator" being the name of the Ensemble, since the Demon would orchestrate the evil team into doing their song.
But obviously Orchestra is elsewhere for the name, so no pressure for that. 😁

plucky burrow
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You exe on the 1st day, This guy chooses someone. Don't exe on the next day, this guy doesn't choose and consequently doesn't kill. There is an exe on the 3rd day and this guy chooses someone that night, the 1st guy they chose dies.

plucky burrow
hollow ferry
plucky burrow
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thanks!

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Also if you acted an extra time you might wanna executed yourself so they don't get that kill

hollow ferry
plucky burrow
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but you can always get away with 1 execute since they need 2 executions for 1 kill

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πŸ˜„

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thanks!

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well it was mostly your idea

hollow ferry
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It's a team effort nonetheless!

Got to go for work, but will talk more later. 😁

plucky burrow
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kk!

plucky burrow
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Orchestral Suite

fickle heart
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you were being a bit rude

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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yea

plucky burrow
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How?

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I didn't think i was?

fickle heart
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you were being a little demanding to people who didn't really seem like they wanted to fix the wording

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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you have to keep in mind it's a volunteer thing and you shouldn't try and force people to do things for you

plucky burrow
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I am sorry if I did 😦

fickle heart
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that's fine

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just something to keep in mind for the future

plucky burrow
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ok 😦

fickle heart
# hollow ferry 1st one; while yes, technically a worse Monk, there's three key differences. Fir...
  1. oh all of these points just hard confirms it in the game and probably makes it way too strong of a character. Remember that confirmation is an ability that comes at a price (Virgin)
  2. In play character is really strong information. E.G. King or pixie. This needs something to do when it isn't in play but knowing for sure it's in play is too much information.
  3. Yea I think once or twice because each night killing on a minion is a bit much.
plucky burrow
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@fickle heart Is this good for a Assassin replacement?

Each night, choose a player (not yourself): they wake an additional time. If you already woke tonight*, the player you chose last dies.

fickle heart
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I would just make it if you choose the same person twice in a row, this seems like overcomplicating it if I understand right

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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Well right now you can choose a player to wake an additional time

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if you choose yourself

plucky burrow
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yes

fickle heart
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you can choose yourself again and kill yourself

plucky burrow
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yes

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you can also use that to force a kill

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but think of something like Bassoonist, it can make you diededed

fickle heart
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yea but that's a townsfolk

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I wouldn't rely on townsfolk abilities for evil abilities to work

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I guess this almost exclusively makes the demon kill an additional time each night

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which is... probably too much

plucky burrow
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yeah

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that also can make the demon die XD

fickle heart
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hmm

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not sure how much I like it as a minion ability then

plucky burrow
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ok

fickle heart
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you don't have a lot of great options

plucky burrow
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well please feel free to give input!

fickle heart
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I guess it's fine if you can answer this:
Who are you doubling?

plucky burrow
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and suggestions

plucky burrow
fickle heart
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as this character which characters can you double that benefit you?

plucky burrow
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I'm doubling a random townsfolk and then choosing myself

fickle heart
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oh uh

plucky burrow
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not gonna risk my demon

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I mean, you could add a clause that this can only double the demon Once

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would that make it more balanced in your eyes?

fickle heart
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so

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ok

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you can choose a player n1

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n2 you can choose yourself and then another player

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you can effectively kill a player each night at the cost of doubling them hmm

plucky burrow
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hmmm

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Yeah we don't wanna do that...

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help! (please)

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any ideas @fickle heart ?

fickle heart
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I'm a bit busy atm

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I might come up with something later

plucky burrow
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kk!

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all good πŸ˜„

hollow ferry
plucky burrow
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thanks

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I swear there is another homebrew character that is popular that does this tho Xb

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oh well

hollow ferry
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So basically you can overclock a person once, and the second time you'd choose them they die instead.
Though it might be better worded like this;

Each night, choose a player; they wake an additional time tonight. Players chosen twice die instead.

plucky burrow
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Hmm, I like!

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thanks Mega!

hollow ferry
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My pleasure! 😁

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It also means that on nights where the Harpist allows evil to wake twice, this minion can get a single kill for free. So very dangerous.

Also means if the Demon and this Minion don't coordinate, they can have they picks killed before they would kill with them.

plucky burrow
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mhm

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this also can forces the Harpist to act twice

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wait nope

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they can say no XD

hollow ferry
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Well technically no I think? A harpist is still once per game, no matter how many times they wake.

plucky burrow
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but I think only for that night.

hollow ferry
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Oooo I see. In which case, nice.

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Question, can a harpist go before a composer on N1, preventing the custom ability?

plucky burrow
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Harpist is an * ability

plucky burrow
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Ok Our Assassin replacement is
Each night*, choose a player: they wake an additional time tonight. players chosen twice die.

hollow ferry
plucky burrow
hollow ferry
hollow ferry