Water Beaver Overhaul

[shell fiber]

oh, in the late game then... i see.

[wicked pecan]

its nice to forgot 30x. go out for smoke and came back to see ur whole colony dead 😄

and 30x is too fast for my computer when colony gouse over 1k and too fast for early game, so it would be nice to have some faster than 3x but way slower than 30x, if its possible. but yeh im also the guy that looks allyoutube videos attleast 2x and listens audiobooks at 3-5x

[ivory fractal]

I think It is a mod: tool finder https://mod.io/g/timberborn/m/tool-finder#description

[wicked pecan]

yeah might be. attleast looks like it, something like that should be integrated or depend in mod also.

as i think making chains to work is more important than spending hours to find out how to make chain

[shell fiber]

i'm ready 😉

[wicked pecan]

u need to add finland billboard

[radiant arch]

would be a fun easter egg to have them change motive with season!

[shell fiber]

if that is something you can do, that would be pretty cool 😊

damn, i used "surely" twice 😑

[wicked pecan]

well maybe balloons should use more airplane quotes.

[radiant arch]

on the backlog

[wicked pecan]

im sure that surely could sure use it on observationdeck

[shell fiber]

definitely "enjoyable" 😅

also, on average on normal mode, one cycle (good+bad season) averages at 20 days right ? so if we want to aim for cyles 20/40/60/80 that 400 days per "true" season correct ?

[radiant arch]

22.5 i guess

[shell fiber]

ah

soo...450 ?

[radiant arch]

we'll figure that out i guess 🙂

i'll leave it to cycles for now to keep it simple

[shell fiber]

at game start there's a shortening of seasons, but that's bad seasons only right ?

okay, gotta go for today

[radiant arch]

something like that i guess. users can set them.
also offset when badtides start.
so first spring might be milder per definition.

might be in by default, but likely can skip it too or use it on any season, or whatever fits best later

[wicked pecan]

my most played customitation is is drought 5-45 days, badtide 2-35days, calm 3-15days. and usually first bad tide at 6. cycle. it gives some freedom at start but also there is change to get 35badtide, 3 days calm and 45days drought or 2x 35d badtide and between of them 3 days water collection. i think than more hardenes is given not by extend of seasons but shortening of calm days

normal factions playtime is around 1k-1.5k days. with whitepaws 2-3k days. but ofc. im "smarter" now days i dont make huge dams and reservoices anymore( except when i decide to make whole land green etc, but that dosent happen with water beavers as no sluices etc. ) with water beavers its efficient and waterguns where needed.. hmm i think i havent done any bots in my water runs yet, as using them only as haulers seems like not needed.

there fore, my previous thinking about last wonder needing enrichment uranium would solve that. only allow bots in high radiation tasks, require enriched uranium for last wonder etc.

so big nuclearthing making enriched thingies only for bots. mild nuclearthing beavers acceptable but 15% change of radiation decease etc. would force ppl to make chains towards engame thingies and both bots and nuclear thingies.

but because of dams should be high things in beaver life, i think whitepaws should have some awards of making them, not sluices etc. but there should divercing things like pump house etc, that u can use for filtering water, but there should also be buildings/prodchains that needs 2-6 tiles of water above( like the wonder, but for making something also) as it is beawers we need dams

dunno what it might be, but ofc we need dams and they should do something

[rapid trench]

normal faction speedruns are <300 days, often <200

[wicked pecan]

that means that im not speedrunning

[radiant arch]

usually within 350-500 if i take it really slow

~1.5k for whitepaws on more difficult (small) maps

but would assume that widely differs for everyone

[wicked pecan]

i dont feel like my my playtrought are speed running eventho i think they are smart ones. im talking about fun playing whitepaws ofc doubples my regular runs, cos there is so much micro management,

[radiant arch]

that's perfectly sensible imho

[wicked pecan]

ofc i could try speedrun of normal factions and i guess it would be around that 200 days. but ofc this is not game where u look for shortest possible runtime. normal factions normal mps etc its one evening whitepaws its 2-4 evenings

[radiant arch]

you meant this regarding what lapan wrote about 'true seasons'?

[wicked pecan]

dunno what u mean about true seasons.

[radiant arch]

implementing some new feature here

basically a couple of cycles form a season (spring, summer, autumn, winter)

and each slightly changes the rules and brings own weather types / length

it should in some way take your settings from 'difficulty' during game setup - so they might be very long seasons

or you might play for multiple 'years' with them

[stiff flint]

I usually run for 80-100 cycles.... I am not in a rush when i play

[wicked pecan]

that was just my normal games and ideas. as instead for making seasons longer i have found out that making season minium lower greatly increases hardness. like in most maps 3 days easy season wont even get rid of last bad tide

[radiant arch]

60-80 was the range the year should fit with so far. so most players should have to experience them all.
your range would fit well and make you finishe in early spring or summer of 2nd year, which sounds nice

[wicked pecan]

for start of my beaver plaing i was so proud of completing 90 days droughts and bad waters.

without touching normal seasons between. then i realized that drought seasons and bad water ones wont affect so much, its just storage problem. but if there is 35d bad water, followed of 3days claer and then 30days drought, those 3 days are so much more important(even tho they cant even clear ur watersources) but thats all that u have to prepare for that 30 days. So it means u need to have storage of 70days and or gather means to and storage to fill need in 3 days

so it makes it harder by much, ofc if u are luvky u get 15days good 3day drought 15days good 1d badwater

[radiant arch]

keeping cycles short like that is more dynamic too. i kinda got bored of 100d-challenge real quick, as it's super repetitive and nothing new happens once you have storage set up

[wicked pecan]

but yeah about getting game harder by extension of droughts and badwater, its much effectiblity by lowering minium days of good water

[radiant arch]

planned changes now are mostly intended to get it more dynamic and nudge players to use more diverse means (i.e. have more use for all the different options whitepaws gives)

not so much to make it more challenging

[wicked pecan]

ofc we could and maybe should make mod where every 3 stances are maximium of 100 days. then use algoryhtms ets to pick up lowest ones

[radiant arch]

got a apocalypse mode in the pipeline, that slowly will kill, but in a way that should make it fun to try and last as long as can (edit: not sure it's something for this year given how much seasons take to get right)

[wicked pecan]

ofc again number just to prove point

but yeah we could use 30 as maximium, and at start droughts and bad waters are xx amount from maximium etc. and also good weather is like maybe max of that but then it decreases and with same input other decreases. so instad of controlling maximium, we would control minium and inverted of that

[wicked pecan]

i know im just letting my brain to bleed after so many whitepaw runnings 😄

[knotty orchid]

hello can I ask how to put this thing on?

[radiant arch]

fits one either side of the abyss elevator

the thing that goes on top of those 'ruins'

long pipe goes down inside, building extends 1 tile outside

[shell fiber]

I wouldn't recommend that with this faction, mostly because power is very dependant on water flow, long droughts tend to stall the game progression and be boring. Also two long droughts separated by a short wet seasons sounds like unavoidable death to me. 🤔

[shell fiber]

Ohh that's a good idea... Purified fuel in a machine that is so horrendously radioactive that beavers cannot even go close to it 🤔

[shell fiber]

Well having 70 days of storage is just asking for three long droughts with two short wet seasons in between 😅

[radiant arch]

the clockwork kitchen?

[shell fiber]

I was thinking more about the implementation of purified nuclear fuel but that is also a possibility

Althout the machine sometimes cook an unfortunate beaver 😅

[radiant arch]

was just joking haha

that kitchen is perfect as it is rn

(also my biggest reason to make bots now)

[stiff lily]

Is the latest version up on Steam or only mod.io?

I am very excited for seasons!!

[radiant arch]

mod.io has 5.4.1 version. also textures and billboards updated recently.
steam seems to be up-to-date on the main mod and textures

[stiff lily]

Awesome! Is seasons the last tweak for U7? I ended up taking a hiatus on my U7 colony because things kept changing and I couldn’t keep up while trying to also plan/build the colony 😂

[shell fiber]

Anyone encountering issues with billboards?

I'm still itching to make certain buildings require access to water, for example the factory could have a cooling loop protruding backward, it some of the kitchens could consume less water but require to touch water 🤔

[radiant arch]

you not plan to make it as bad as the aquifer that requires this exact air tile and ground below to be placed? that one's not really my fav tbh.

[radiant arch]

not yet tested it.

[shell fiber]

the pipe trying to find one block of ground one level behind the farmhouse ?

I heard people say it's inconvenient, but... Would you want the water to spill at the same level ? Lower ?

I made it like that because it made sense to me 😅

[radiant arch]

especially not needing the 'ground below' thing. that's the part that slightly annoys me every time

same level would be fine with me too (very easy to understand). no strong opinion on that though

[shell fiber]

But... Then wouldn't it magically create water from thin air ?

[radiant arch]

couldn't it pump it out from below the farm ?

[shell fiber]

If it's not resting on a dirt block

[radiant arch]

oh wait.. the farm not needs to be placed on ground...

now i see your point...

[shell fiber]

Yeah

[radiant arch]

well, nothing to do in that case

[shell fiber]

At the end of the day I want the pipe to end in a dirt block 🤔

[radiant arch]

for that your solution likely is the best fit

otherwise would force ground below the farm or such, which is almost as odd

biggest issue i had when playing was putting farms next to dry river and unable to put aquifer, if river was more than 1 deep

[shell fiber]

I can try to find other solutions, but I'm not sure what my options are 🤔

[shell fiber]

I see 🤔

[stiff lily]

This is going to mean you can’t use Badwater sources to power your factories, etc

[shell fiber]

If we set aside the possibility of sky islands or this weird 100 tall map, maybe I can try a few other possibilities 🤔

[radiant arch]

technically moving farm 1 tile and using dynamite is easy and quick..
(so mostly my misunderstanding and laziness..)

[shell fiber]

I think it's relatively easy to make a script that allows bad water too 😉

[stiff lily]

But I guess then what’s the point? The vast majority of WB power comes from water, so your factories can’t be too far from water in the first place. Means you wouldn’t be able to stack them? (without the ability to “join” those pumps together)

[shell fiber]

Yeah that's true 🤔
But I'm also worries about the extra complexity. Even if I write it down most people don't read descriptions

[stiff lily]

I clearly don’t understand how the aquifer is meant to be used

[radiant arch]

if you have two triangles (like farmer) you can put it as upgrade.
the pipe thing needs to reach one tile below the farmers ground level and requires ground below it..

[stiff lily]

It would have to be more than just the factory and kitchens for it to be a more widely implemented thing that is just known about rather than being specific to those buildings (yes I’m aware I’m now advocating for making this more widespread when I was challenging it in the first place 😂 )

[stiff lily]

Ohhhhh well that explains why I couldn’t get it to work

[radiant arch]

you aren't alone with that!

[shell fiber]

I'm thinking about the "medium" nuclear power plant and what it's purpose would be.

I want it to be necessary for production of purified nuclear fuel or wherever, but it seems it is competing with the centrifuge 🤔🤔

Thankfully though, I'm not particularly attached to the centrifuge 😅

[radiant arch]

would be really meaningful to drop the centrifuge for it

just wondering about the time needed to make the scroll.. three times. was that expensive?

[shell fiber]

I can still repurpose it for making whatever healthcare thingie I can come up with

[shell fiber]

Did the centrifuge require a diploma ?

[radiant arch]

the nuclear reactor does. adding one more scroll needed for the abyss reactor verus centrifuge?

[shell fiber]

I think originally the centrifuge was almost an excuse to make giant logs and glass necessary 🤔

[sullen cape]

It begins! Time for the endgame 😉

I will soon find out if this is water-tight 🙂
Just have to tunnel power and beavers to it

It's probably confusing what I'm trying to do, so here's two more screenshots for clarity 🙂

The water should hopefully make it's way to the very top of the map, then I can divert badtides with a lot of dirt 😉

[radiant arch]

@shell fiber packed the mod without the weather part for early feedback.. (not safe for playing maybe)
and realised it adds 200MB of textures for my mocks (and how much i hate the UI textures i added..). -> should likely separate that part and the feature itself later..

should have all effects and seasons you listed as defaults now.
just for testing it's set to 1-cycle-per-season still.
this and anything else should be editable from json. hope it's easy enough to use as is.

https://mod.io/g/timberborn/m/seasons#description

is extra work.. but likely should make three mods..
-> scripts with just the feature (and other things like need favour to update that on demand..)
-> textures with the (rarely changing) big files
-> seasons with json files to enable it with other factions
.. so busy 🙂

[summer patio]

Hooow the heck do you power the hydroponic farms? I've got this thing sitting on a bed of universal power shafts & completely encased in them and I cannot figure out

[radiant arch]

.. sorry misread .

hydroponics have a connector next to the entrance. small round symbol

idea is if you stack them, you can access with ladders and have the power shaft run right next to it

[radiant arch]

wondering about some aspects

1) during summer:
if monsoon is forced after badtide, that's 40% chance of monsoon.
than there's a 60% chance of monsoon for all else
so isn't this essentially a 76% chance really??

was this your intention?

2) summer again:
temperate is 0.7 x T
disap. short is 0.8 x B
-> for higher difficulty this will result in longer 'disappointingly short'

was this intended?

3) during winter numbers not add up yet

70% temperate
15% monsoon
 5% rain

should it be 15% rain?

put down my list to allow adding effects to weathers later, so might make rain snow for winter or tweak monsoon slightly without messing with the weather mod itself.

[summer patio]

How do you stack?

[radiant arch]

gimmy a moment to load the game and show

general idea is using giant pillars and mega platforms (hydroponic exactly fits them)

can even put a nice solar array on top

[summer patio]

Ooohh I was wondering what those were for

That worked 🙂 thank you

[radiant arch]

sorry, had to rerun unity to fix a crash and it's sooo slow 🙁

[summer patio]

It's ok!! I think I got it thank you for the help.

Now to wait 15 cycles to be able to build it
Lol

[summer patio]

what am i doin wrong on this bad boy? i built a dam to hold the water higher

[spring heath]

the badwater needs to cover the propeller on the roof so blast down a 2x3 hole and stick the pump in that with a building on top (I use the liquid storage house as only 3 beds, top entrance, and holds badwater)

I'm about to load up to play sometime soon so will send a pic of example

(I am about to fix that path on the right lmao)

[lucid flame]

I am having major difficulties getting this faction to work and hoping someone can help me download the mods to get this up and running. I downloaded only the required mods on steam, but it still crashes. I just cannot figure out what I'm doing wrong. Can someone please help me?

[radiant arch]

would you be able to provide the players log / error report?

on windows those would be under Documents\Timberborn\Error reports i believe

[abstract vector]

Also highly recommended to install the more mod logs mod

[radiant arch]

just being able to see the actual error message and what mods are installed is plenty already. usually that's enough to get it running

[lucid flame]

Is this it?

[heavy lodge]

It's a download error. Do a game integrity file check, or, unsubscribed and subscribed again for the MoreGroup mod.

[lucid flame]

I'll try unsubscribing/subscribe because I do the integrity check every time I download new mods.

Thank you!!

[lucid flame]

Sorry, that didn't work.

[Error : BepInEx] Unable to start Unity log writer

[heavy lodge]

You didn't provided the full game log. Since U6, BeepinEX is obsolete, will crash with most mods and must be no more used.

[lucid flame]

Sorry, I'm not following what you are saying. What is BeepinEX?

[heavy lodge]

It was the software that, before, allow mods to work with the game.

[lucid flame]

So what am I doing wrong?

[heavy lodge]

Read from here : #🚀mod-users message . Is a guide for truobleshooting your isue.

If, still facing issue, drag here the latest crash archive from Documents\Timberborn\Error Reports folder to be able to provide help.

[lucid flame]

Thank you so much for your help, I greatly appreciate it. I researched everything I could think of and Bepinex was not on my list. I just re-named it and it's working. Again, thank you for your help!

[summer patio]

ive tried every level on this - 1, 2, 3, 4 deep - definitely have plenty of storage space too

[spring heath]

hmm... that is odd... it looks like there's an invisible blockage right over the propeller so it isn't actually underwater, but I have no idea what would cause that. Have you placed a side platform or anything that might cover that propeller tile?

maybe that's just how underwater buildings display when clicked

I don't even remember my badwater pumps ever showing that error, they usually just... stop

are you on the mod.io version? maybe this nothing to do flag is something @shell fiber added to the pump?

[summer patio]

no don't have anything over it 🙁 and i tried like all layers - 1 deep, 2 deep, 3 deep and it was just not activating

i think i need a little break from white paws this is the dozenth time i've gotten very close to a nuclear reactor and then brambles spread everywhere and i can't figure out how it's happening lol. but i love the faction, thanks to the designer,

[abstract vector]

Is there a reason why this is not a valid placement?

Huh I can't place the clay pit anywhere

I don't get why that spot isn't valid

[silent lark]

Anyone else have thier Tar storage no longer working? I can still produce it but no longer can store it

[radiant arch]

it's recently been changed.

requires hot storage now, like the soup hand.

[silent lark]

Thank you, I did figure it out after searching through a couple things

[radiant arch]

some mod might have broken it for you?
it's supposed to show 'ground-only' there, which oddly is missing

[sullen cape]

It continues! And I got tunnelled power to it

[sullen cape]

Mine looks like this too, what version of Whitepaws/Waterbeavers are you using @abstract vector ?

[radiant arch]

looks like some of theapologist316's mods to me

[sullen cape]

4k screenshot, now that looks REALLY cool underground! And I badly need the water 😂

[heavy spruce]

It's the what have I done wrong time again

[radiant arch]

does your modlist show some warnings?

i don't know why: it tries to load an assembly (dll) during mod setup and fails to find the file
so would assume either a dependency is missing / outdated or files corrupted for some mod?

As it's referring the moddable timberborn mod might that one is missing
or either of it's dependencies (Harmony, TimberUi)

moddable timberborn also updated yesterday, so it might be a problem with that?

[heavy spruce]

right at the bottom of the mod list I had scientific projects, big triangle of doom, forgot I had that mod...

[radiant arch]

so it works when that is disabled?

[sullen cape]

So cool!

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-squarepants-spongebob-need-water-thirsty-thirst-gif-4502178

[radiant arch]

no worry, only 6 cycles to go for beavers to build the reactor now 😉

[sullen cape]

Honestly, they've nearly done it in one Cycle I've got a lot of storage

I just need some more Glassware
And to actually build it, as it's only 25%

[hidden dome]

Hi guys, for some reason I cannot make any of the Forestry upgrade works... I tried the two arrangements an none working, do I need somehow to platform to the second floor? Farm upgrade works like a charm without platform.

[radiant arch]

yep, needs access up there

from the front a bridge might help

might connect from side or maybe from behind too

but only on the level the arrow indicates

[hidden dome]

Well thanks, I guess for now it is a waste of 100science 🤣

[heavy spruce]

Yes, it works without scientific projects

I say works, it proceeds like a slide show, and I don't even have 4.2k beavers like last time...

[heavy spruce]

The reactors only output water in good seasons for me

[radiant arch]

that should long been fixed now

do you have any mod that messes up water output / weather? (other than moddable weather or ebb&flow which are known to work)

[heavy spruce]

I have moddable weather

I know that's why it's not working

[radiant arch]

i'll need to fix this!!

might have missed some update on that mod..

[heavy spruce]

I have a few reactors and just a little power for the almost 2K beavers...

In good weather and rain the water is flowing

[radiant arch]

and it stops working on drought? badtide too?

[heavy spruce]

let me skip seasons for a sec and see, It wasnt working before the last patch, stoped in droughts if i remeber right

all my crops dried out last drought despite the water system being fed by the reactors.

0.1 days into a drought, and it is still flowing. Did you change something, or is Tech Loki laughing at me again?

[radiant arch]

not sure when, but few weeks ago i gave lapan a fix. likely september still

glad if it still works as intended

[heavy spruce]

Then thank you very much, Lapan must have pushed it in the last patch.

[radiant arch]

if it weirds out again, would be nice, if you could share a savegame

[heavy spruce]

bad tide seems OK too

sure, if you want a slide show

[radiant arch]

looks spooky 🙂

too bad about it no longer giving red water - for the effect ^^

[heavy spruce]

I have been having this issue with the super fertilizing baths though, when you load in the recepie isnt selected

[radiant arch]

it's just visual

should work the same but not shows which is selected

[heavy spruce]

Yeah, I just noticed that it was actually working now, again last update it was not working, but consuming water
Thanks for the fix 😅

[radiant arch]

would need to tell igor, that's a timbercommons feature

[shell fiber]

Hot damn ! Yay ! 😊
Sorry I was at a conference this Friday and the weekend is no longer a time I can mod significantly 😅

[heavy spruce]

conference?

[radiant arch]

pretty sure it's a secret term for 'playing with cat' (which is always accepted as excuse imho)

[heavy spruce]

ah not learning about smart contracts while consuming too much alchohol

[shell fiber]

Uuhh, you might be right, I didn't double check my thing

[shell fiber]

I'm pretty sure it shouldn't be growing during construction, I probably messed up something 🤔

[sullen cape]

The large smelter does the same thing IIRC, I think it looks cool anyway 😎

[shell fiber]

I'm doing research, which is also how I find the time to mod.

It was a mixed bag to be honest, some of the presenters had some good stuff, but there was some weird shit in not willing to believe until I see hard evidence, and evidence was not included 😑

Honestly if this has been in Europe / Japan / USA some of those guys would have a few new buttholes ripped into them by now

[heavy spruce]

I am also a researcher; what are you researching?

[heavy spruce]

There are a lot of claims made to keep research funding, tight deadlines, and not enough time to produce it, or just being lazy and doing the bare minimum to keep the funding.

[heavy spruce]

So China/India/South America?

@radiant arch There's still an issue with the dam drain house, the dam bunghole house. As soon as water hits the building, the game crashes with an ERROR. However, I don't have an error log to share.
Placing the building is fine; however, the height of the discharge can't be adjusted.
To test it, I placed it off a cliff, but I couldn't change it from height 0.0.
Flipping the building around so the blue square is in the water also causes a crash.

[radiant arch]

there seems to be an issue with the block above the discharge being occupied can cause a crash. never looked at this one.
height not being possible to change is by design.

[shell fiber]

biology, as i'm sure you're aware, the medical sector is full of shady crap of dubious effect. generally people advocating this stay away from the scientific community, but i suppose here they payed to present their thing, which is likely how the event was financed in the first place.
i used to work in japan, but i was hired for a position in the middle east recently. i don't want to give too much details because i'm not sure how picky they are about many things.

[heavy spruce]

I’m in research in Japan right now, renewables.

[shell fiber]

oh, nice 🙂

[heavy spruce]

Got it, ill demo that and see. All blocks above the pipe or just the blue square?

[heavy spruce]

there are a lot of papers and conferences where the publish based on fees paid, not merits of the research

[heavy spruce]

no issues with the discharge pipe being on the edge of the map?
Like if I wanted to drain badwater out of a cave.

[radiant arch]

lapan only added those recently. so there might be cases that not got tested..

if there's something that's not intended by the base game but would make sense i might be able to make a patch to get it working. but that's the most i get involved in really^^

(just seen.. made it to the news 😲 thanks @shell fiber )

billboards and that whole category are pretty cool! especially love the big HELP symbol haha

[radiant arch]

seems to work fine

tested drains first time. it's confusing as what it does.

• could do with a directional indicator on the pipe
• looked fine to off a small part of water to irrigation channel
• not sure it's working well as filter (efficiency scales with contamination, pump is weak already)
• could place and connect, but had to read the text to understand how to connect 😅

could reproduce the dirt-above-outlet too 🎉

System.InvalidOperationException: Column for index 14821 and height 4 not found
  at Timberborn.WaterSystem.MutableWaterColumnRetriever.GetColumn (System.ReadOnlySpan`1[T] columnCounts, System.Span`1[T] waterColumns, System.Int32 verticalStride, System.Int32 index, System.Int32 height) [0x00051] in <a4fcc7405a8d4c19b983ef10e6a23f32>:0 
  at Timberborn.WaterSystem.UpdateWaterChangesJob.Run () [0x00058] in <a4fcc7405a8d4c19b983ef10e6a23f32>:0 

seems to have trouble with the water map update process

looks like it might be impossible rn to have the outlet have anything but air above it?

it basically fails to find the outlet water voxel otherwise
should work if it blocks floor or bottom occupancy above to avoid blocks from being added there, while allowing other drains?

[heavy spruce]

How many tiles of just air does it need?
Would the outlet being in water also cause an error?

[radiant arch]

i build it in the middle of my stream and it worked fine

would need some visual idea of what you did to make it crash in water

[heavy spruce]

I want to build a box around the water sources and dump the badwater off the side of the map, but to empty the badwater faster, I want to use the dam bunghole house at the bottom on the edge of the map.
I guess if above the house there are other bunghole houses it should be OK?

[radiant arch]

would need to test it

tbh the water map is kinda.. confusing

not directly works on coordinates, but columns of dirt, air and water..

can stack them

[heavy spruce]

I put a whole bunch in the red boxes stacked on the edge of the map and in between the zones that will be filled with bad water and clean water, where the orange line is

[radiant arch]

should work if you leave at least one voxel above the outlet free

[heavy spruce]

i think theres 24 water sources there that put out a fair bit of water...

[radiant arch]

drain is super weak though and likely scales down with contamination.. so if regular is 0.2cms it's 0.02cms at 10% contamination.

[heavy spruce]

ok, bunghole building, watertight 1 high something, bunghole building, got it

[radiant arch]

(not sure it even is this strong)

[heavy spruce]

ah.....

[radiant arch]

nah, can bunghole only all the way. just the topmost needs a spacer above

[heavy spruce]

I have 3 sluice gates fully open on the other end to drain it in a bad tide, but the reservoir is DEEP, so I have to remove the levee blocks, drain bad water, then rebuild and refill over 3-6 days, depending on if it's a monsoon or not

Any guesses on how many bunghole houses to drain a 1 strength source?
Thanks for your help, as always

[radiant arch]

good question... ~~assuming it's 0.2cms and a source gives 1cms.. it would need 5 drains per source for pure 100% clean or bad water. ~~
more with mixed water filtering
only @shell fiber would know how strong a drain actually is

oh.. it's 0.15cms only!! (just looked it up) so make that almost 7 per source 🙂

hmm.. and the outlet... it's actually on the voxel above (0,0,1)? (WaterOutputSpec)

no wonder it was looking at that and complains

would assume the reasoning being, that it otherwise rejects to fill to the desired height?

[heavy spruce]

ok, so it's actually a 2 block high building that a very fat beaver has sat on

[heavy spruce]

So, making the building 2 high with something over the exit would fix its issues?

[radiant arch]

can just define an invisible occupancy above the outlet to disable dirt blocks / ground while still allowing overhang or stacking another drain

[shell fiber]

i'll make them a little bit stronger and we'll see

i upped the cannon's effectiveness to 0.25 cms, and this one to 0.4 cms

[shell fiber]

basically yes, the real output is below the voxel designated as output, which is... impractical

i made the building occupy that voxel and that's it

[shell fiber]

uuh, problem is that visually...

nah, that would cause weird interferences

well there's no good solution to that maybe

best is probably to lower the output somehow

not necessarily the hardest thing to do actually

just a litte redesign 🤔

[radiant arch]

problem is, the code actually outputs the water on the tile above. it only appears below, as the column height limit is shifted slightly.not intended to lower it without code. only supports the fluid dump model really

if you put it on the voxel the outlet is on, it would stop at -0.1m - would never raise water higher than it's floor than - also require the voxel below to be clear

can't you just occupy the bottom above?

currently there's only the drain lodge that fits there anyway, or top-layer buildings like side overhangs

[shell fiber]

I can

that was my first option, i'm poking at the model, but nah, lowering the output makes it even more annoying to place

I also poked at the aquifer pump, best i can do to make it easier, is make variants with different depths

i can make the pipe go up and down like a water pump, but that is effectively just visual, there's noting preventing the player from having it go into the roof of a building if i don't enforce "i want dirt here"

[radiant arch]

would need a new placement validator (forcing tile below to be dirt) and dynamic length adjustment ..

maybe something to poke at next year haha

[sullen cape]

Thank you Lapan!

[sullen cape]

Hmm, where did my last Sequoia log go?
Ohhhhh lol damnit, oh well

[sullen cape]

Spoilers for building the Nuclear Water Outflow!
||Ooo Confetti!||

https://tenor.com/view/excellent-mr-burns-evil-plans-the-simpsons-gif-15297317

Excellent! My plan works!

[sullen cape]

Last bit of the spam, 2cms of water flow all the time is not a lot, but it will keep my beavers watered nicely. Or I could build another one 😈

[cloud flax]

building a compact airport.

[radiant arch]

may i suggest trebuchets?
you know, to show the way 😇

[cloud flax]

what happened to the metal fastner recipie in assembly line????

[cloud flax]

any clue why these cooking tents are not connecting?

[cloud flax]

@radiant arch where did you go to get contaminated!!

[spring heath]

wine cellar marked as levee but flooding at 1.5ish water height?

[sullen cape]

Hmm
You might be able to add meltdowns to the game 😉

[heavy spruce]

Wait the devs are adding in nukes from the Hoomans???

https://youtube.com/shorts/_ioBQ1XcLkU?si=MIJFlEglgJyYvL6U

is it left over ordinance from the apocalypse?
Is it an attack from an AI from the apocalypse?
Or is there a war between beaver and hooman kind???

[shell fiber]

don't forget that balloons also act as decoration 😉

[shell fiber]

will be back soon, although i thought i had restored it in the previous update

[shell fiber]

what are they on top of ?

[shell fiber]

how are your beavers supposed to open and work on those barrels while underwater ? 😉

[shell fiber]

i thought it was a joke but now i see the short video 😅
well, let's brace for U8 then !😊

[heavy lodge]

Can be an UBO (Undefined Beaver Object) 🤣

[heavy spruce]

So for a 2 strength source, I would need 5 bunghole buildings???

[shell fiber]

yes, but counting from the next update

[heavy spruce]

Can we widen the bunghole a little? IDK, use a sequoia tree to make a 4x wider bunghole lodge out of a triple water right lodge??

I have a set of source blocks in a cluster with a total strength 32, which I want to set up the Badwater diversion for. 16 bunghole houses from the next update is a little excessive

Can we do a little Mythbusters, peeing on the 3rd rail special?

upgrade from 👶 to 🐴

[shell fiber]

it's never been intended to channel a whole river, it's to allow players to build a dam while keeping the downstream area irrigated. also i generally expect people to want to build it at the bottom of a dam, so it must be buildable first, which means the construction costs must remain early mid game at worst. 😉

although... admittedly a larger version would not be unthinkable, i'm just not sure i see what purpose that would serve in most cases.

[heavy spruce]

near the end of the game, when you are going for 10k beavers and need all the farmland you can get, but you are playing on a map where the water system is a set of pressurized water sources and need a large-scale filtration device that maintains water pressure?

[heavy lodge]

10 k beavers ? That's not an end of the game, it's a fps horror 😮

[heavy spruce]

its no longer FPS it is SPF

I got up to 4.2K beavers 666bots on the last map, fully stable

[heavy lodge]

Can be FPS, but must be read as frames per century 😜

[heavy spruce]

@shell fiber Will the bunghole houses work with a pressurized system where the depth at the outlet is greater than 1? 🥺

[cloud flax]

Just building those so I can get 100 pilot lisences. I already have quite a few nearly settlement

[cloud flax]

The new cooking house with roof. I deleted it and replaced it again and it started to work somehow

[shell fiber]

nope, it won't output water higher than the top of the pipe. (that's how the script works)
but you can use water cannons for similar effect.

[heavy spruce]

Ok, so I am going to have to put in any filtering above the height of the outlet

[shell fiber]

oh well well well, what do we have here ?

🤣

[sullen cape]

Oh looks familiar, and they might of added spiral staircases into vanilla lol

[shell fiber]

it seem there's an irrigation tower next to it

also a steam vent and the appropriate generator 😊

not sure what on earth those things are though 🤔

[sullen cape]

Wait vanilla BRAMBLES lol

[shell fiber]

ooh, they are drills !

[sullen cape]

It has it on the steam page

[shell fiber]

:DDDD

what have I done 😅

probably hafl-height blockage and whatever that hole thing is 🤔

[sullen cape]

New object: Brambles. These natural - yet dangerous - obstacles are now found in the wasteland, cutting some areas off. Your beavers can demolish them, but it’s a lengthy process that results in injuries. Maybe it’s time to send the asteroid bots.

[sullen cape]

Well done Lapan!

[shell fiber]

ah, yeah, i should probably read their description too 😅

[sullen cape]

New object: Water Seep. Like Water Sources, these 2x2 objects spill out water… but only until it reaches height of 0.8 tiles. This might sound simple, but it allows creating new wetlands-style maps with shallow, still water bodies that enable cultivation, but dry out fast and won’t sustain too many pumps.
Might be usable for your aquifer pumps?

[shell fiber]

Reserve Tank, sad

[radiant arch]

it appears they want to get rid of needing prefabs and make it all json files

even more control about adding or removing specs..

hope it's not too much work to update for this...

[shell fiber]

Small Relic, Medium Relic, Large Relic
damn, i wonder how much of this is directly comming from me (although it's not exactly a discovery to get the same idea)

[sullen cape]

You get science points out of it?

[radiant arch]

wondered this too. timberborn 2.0 might be called 'whitepaws' at this pace..

[sullen cape]

At least that's new

[shell fiber]

ooh, the reserve warehouses might be some sort of pantry-like thing 🤔

[sullen cape]

Waterfall limit is gone! Oh boy

Added #delete keyword for JSON merging operations, which allows you to remove existing properties from it (for example, built-in Specs from Blueprints).
Oh that's great for the ENS 🙂

[shell fiber]

why ?

hmm... in the end i didn't have that much time to test the seasons

@radiant arch do you want to wait until 1.0 is out to take care of the seasons ?

oh, right, who knows how many times they will change stuff before it's actually finished and ready 🤔

[radiant arch]

pondering.. might have it feature-complete within 2 weeks..
but if anything regarding weather or cycle system changed might need to tweak some.

[shell fiber]

although, there is a fair chance that seasons themselves will be json based 🤔

[radiant arch]

i'm not even sure they do touch anything seasons is using tbh

[astral harbor]

Looking at how they described modding and compatibility, it seems that the JSON based change is supposed to finally resolve the compatibility issues.

[shell fiber]

btw what do you mean by "feature complete" ?

isn't the growth speed effect and water source alteration already functionnal ?

or are you talking about the ground textures, banners etc ?

[radiant arch]

as in supporting anything you intended it to be able to?

currently only should miss weather

and your ideas for textures 🙂

and banners

i guess i will complete the code part and if needed update when that experimental 1.0 is closer to come out for all.
wouldn't expect it this year really?

[shell fiber]

the update going live might take a while indeed, but who knows

i'll push an update for the dam drain house, and then poke at the season

either way the banners etc won't be lost

[radiant arch]

still will need to wait on timbercommons and moddable weather to update first
will have a look at it once they do and look at the scripts i gave you too, so they work with 1.0 when needed.

[shell fiber]

thanks !

[stiff lily]

Lapan, are you just part of the dev team now?

[radiant arch]

the contamination setting of seasons might be broken rn.
or: it resets bad water sources too.. which might not be intended 😅

[sullen cape]

Hmm I need to be less vauge, but does that fix the bug where the game crashes if you remove a recipe?

[radiant arch]

@shell fiber those might be even scarier than whitepaws brambles

not sure they spread.. would be sad if they didn't..

[heavy lodge]

It's like dam pieces from map editor

[radiant arch]

more like the soil protection thing? + blocking transit

with a twist to be hard to remove + give injury

[heavy lodge]

and, block moisture and contaminations

[radiant arch]

would be curious to play with it.. but there's sooo many mods to wait for updates on first..

[sullen cape]

Hmm I think they are already dead though?

[heavy lodge]

It's not vegetation, just static map objects

[radiant arch]

might be a first mod for the new version to change that..

[heavy lodge]

who knows, maybe will make, but only if will spreads like wildfire and will have immunity even on contamination 👹

[radiant arch]

thought about the migration to 1.0..
as there's /version-1.0 option for mods..
i'll publish my scripts pack mod
only have the seasons part in for /version-0.7
and add all the scripts you currently have /version-1.0, once i have each ready (and dependencies are up)
and i'll give you a json for your mod, to enable it (like 8 units per water voxel. swimming speed, seasons..).

so for your side it's just adding the jsons and waiting on them to activate basically.
@shell fiber

for priorities i would go with this:

• finish seasons feature (i.e. weather)
• v1 favourable needs
• v1 swimming speed and water-per-voxel
• v1 'specs' to make abyss reactor ignore seasons
• v1 fix for buildable map height
• v1 update for seasons
• .. other ideas for v1 only

looks like seasons on v1 might not be in time depending on how quick luke is to reach moddable weather (not top of his list rn)
but worst that happens is that it's not enabled for some time. or players enjoy v0.7 for longer
seeing many other mods being in need for updates and devs wanting to test v1 more it might be in time too..

[abstract vector]

Gotta remind myself to change my clients to non experimental

[shell fiber]

Ooh, right, there's all this to fix too 😅

[shell fiber]

Hmm ... I think the most vital one for me will be the favorable need script, although for prototyping the faction I can comment out the needs in question

The rest is important of course, but not having it active doesn't hinder upgrading to U8

[radiant arch]

should get this done next week or one later at the latest

[shell fiber]

No worries, I'll start by the 1x1x2 storage mod and logstairs anyway

[lapis bear]

Is this mod on Steam?

[radiant arch]

it's called "Whitepaws Faction U7" on steam @lapis bear

[lapis bear]

Ok. Thank you

[lucid flame]

Is anyone else having problems loading the game? I haven't changed anything and today it crashed upon loading.

[radiant arch]

are you trying to load the experimental branch per chance?

would assume few to no mods working with that for a while.
other than that i could load a whitepaws save earlier today.

[lucid flame]

yes I am

[radiant arch]

will take a few weeks at least, likely till after the 1.0 release of timberborn for it to support whitepaws again on experimental - likely same with most big mods

[lucid flame]

ok, thank you very much for the update

[heavy spruce]

The rocket silo is submerged right up to the tip of the silo; will it kill most beavers regardless?

[heavy spruce]

around 1K beavers went to the giant beaver in the sky 🥲

[radiant arch]

i believe i got weather rotation running for seasons
force-next-weather to poke at still and a little cleanup and testing.. but important features did work just now!
should be out over the weekend 🙂

[sullen cape]

https://tenor.com/view/spoilers-pandorica-river-song-doctor-who-gif-18293417

[shell fiber]

ah, that reminds me :

[stiff lily]

Tar is now stored in a warm storage? The flavour text needs updating as it still says it's only for keeping food warm... unless the beavers now consume tar?

[radiant arch]

random missing dictionary keys:

Good.OmniCure.DisplayName
Good.OmniCure.PluralDisplayName
Lapantouflemagic.8WayCornerOverhang.Description
Lapantouflemagic.MechanicalComputerFancyBlueprint.DisplayName
Lapantouflemagic.MechanicalComputerFancyBlueprint.PluralDisplayName
Lapantouflemagic.SevereInjury.DeathMessage
Lapantouflemagic.SevereInjury.DeathMessage
Luc.Loglevee.Description

not sure if the last one is from this mod though

[heavy lodge]

Looks like is from @ionic swift mod.

[shell fiber]

no i'ts mine too

i'm unsuccessfully trying to get modding for 1.0.0 to work

as usual, it's a pita

i'll just make an entriely new project and migrate things into it

also, FYI, i don't think i'll update the map editor mod

or maybe a reduced version, just something that allows to place wild crops and maybe that will be it

the floating islands were a fun thing to make, but they are intrinsically problematic

when i made that i hadn't understood why the devs had made water sources etc require a full colum of dirt until the bottom of the map

but it makes more sense now

[shell fiber]

although, i should probably look into what tools the map editor gives

[radiant arch]

might be able to only need 1 mod for editor and game if all it does is add more plants to editor and that's possible from json files now?

will you keep the lemonade stands?

[shell fiber]

not sure yet

although i'm a bit concerned about those hooman relics

the large one gives like 3500 science 🫤

of course i can overwrite this

but it would be more fun if those were extremely radioactive 😇

[radiant arch]

might be fun to make that happen haha

[shell fiber]

probably not too hard

[radiant arch]

would love to see your bots put to use and this idea to show more with 1.0 really

say, i'm trying to put together the seasons scripts and might publish them later today

would it be trouble for you if i bundled them with the favourable needs script?

that would mean you'd need to remove that script once you require seasons as a dependency for your faction?

[shell fiber]

is there any benefit to bundle them together ?🤔

[radiant arch]

if it's too much trouble i could make it only included from 1.0 onwards. might not matter much either way. just wanted to make it available for all

[radiant arch]

convenience for me - having all scripts in one mod 🙂

[shell fiber]

hmm... i see

well some people might want to have only one mod, but if it activates only when the moddable weather is active i guess that's not an issue

but it might be harder to find for people

[radiant arch]

that's a point i worried about too..

i can technically buncle all of it in one big mod that works out of the box for all factions. but that's big, as it needs textures and all

or just have the scripts in a separate mod

tbh i not know what is best and have a hard time deciding ^^

the scripts will only activate if there's a SeasonsSpec enabling the feature

same with FavorableNeedSpec only enabling when it's needed

[radiant arch]

maybe you are right.. might just do a "Seasons Script" mod for the feature and a "Seasons" mod with blueprints and textures to showcase the use with vanilla factions.
this way it would be easy find and wont conflict.

[ionic swift]

nope none of that is mine. All my loc keys are prefixed with LV.<ShortModName>.Something

[heavy lodge]

Good to know and remember. 👍

[radiant arch]

Seasons Mod now supports weather pools per season and overriding banners and description for them, including force-next after hazard

UI placeholders still are ugly - and i hate the seasons progress indicator on the top-right.
also just noticed that the water source strength might not reliably return to normal after monsoon yet 🙂

other than that i'd expect it to mostly work as intended and support all features listed before

it currently defines all that is needed as json files and holds examples of banners (more at https://github.com/datvm/TimberbornMods/tree/master/ModdableWeather/Resources/UI/Images/Weathers)

'seasons' mod enables 5-cycle-seasons for 'Common' faction. It would override if there's a SeasonsSpec for 'Whitepaws' and a game was using that faction.

other than that only the 'seasons scripts' mod is needed to run it if another mod supplies the json specs and ui assets it needs.
(and it's dependencies: moddable weather, harmony, timbercommons, timberui, mod settings..)

both mods are on steam too

if you have want for something to work differently, feel free to tell @shell fiber
hope it works as you wanted it.

will be around to fix bugs. try and fix the monsoon not stopping sometimes.. and look at making some minor improvements on things like rain and snow.
and focus on migrating scripts to 1.0 slowly after

[spring heath]

I am frankly too scared to try seasons, as I currently don't even play with badtides lol, but I do tip my hat to you deeply!

[radiant arch]

thank you

[cloud flax]

wait how are you guys playing with 0.7 version?

[heavy lodge]

They stay on stable version, not experimental

[cloud flax]

so basically "none" here right?

[heavy lodge]

Correct

[cloud flax]

thanks man!!!

now my saves are missing!! idk what happened ☠️

[woeful sun]

ExperimentalSaves and regular Saves are in different directories,

you can manually copy between the two

[fair bone]

is this intentional?

just normal ladder tower things but i cannot build any of them higher than like 2

[woeful sun]

The beavers can't stand on the same building to build directly above,

So one option is to build a platform (or another lodge) next to it,

that way the beavers can stand on something to build the lodge

[fair bone]

oh? i played past versions and they could build straight up. good to know that changed. ty

[woeful sun]

I think it's also changed back and forth a couple of times

[shell fiber]

same for me, just fixed my unity (i think)

[shell fiber]

there was some changes in the game's system that made the previous fix unworkable 😑

i had come up with some solution, but i guess now we'll have to do it the hard way

oh, right, small ideas tossed into the fray

regarding what to do with new V1.0.0 assets

• steam vent : will likely make some sort of power generator from it, for maps that have no water flow and rely on this for power

• steam vent : may also use for sourcing saltpeter (minor strech from reality)

• steam vent : may be required to place alchemist or some other weird building
• steam vent : maybe some sort of hot spring recreation building ?

[radiant arch]

wont those only be available on some maps?

[shell fiber]

that's a risk

but i expect every map to have at least a few soon enough 🤔

i'm pretty sure i want to make the hooman relics radioactive or something, to balance out the amount of science they make

the aquifers are good as they are 🤔

the water seep thing might not be present on every map

but when i carry over the aquifer drill farm upgrade, i may very likely make it work like that

which will be a lot more convenient, because no overflow

the brambles... what should i do with those things 🤔

[radiant arch]

make them multiply? revive them? 😇

[shell fiber]

ahah

i expect that to crash the game 😅

plants are fundamentally different from buildings as far as the game loading is concerned

they will request to know their growth percentage etc, no way that replaces well

i wonder if i can make the other relics self-destruct too 😅😅

[cloud flax]

Hot springs!!!! 🔥🔥 I had just been thinking of then when I got to know about the vents!

[cloud flax]

Since they act as contamination repellent iirc, they can maybe stored and refused strategically? But using them will lead to beaver injuries

[shell fiber]

hurrayy

not so hurray~

[radiant arch]

so close!

[shell fiber]

well i had forgot to import all of my custom 2D textures in the new project, so unsurprisingly...

tadaaaa~

[radiant arch]

new colours are so intense - can't wait to see what your whole faction will look like 🙂

[shell fiber]

are they ? i didn't change anythign 🤔

[radiant arch]

the game itself changed some with 1.0, the fog, the sky. not sure if some of the rendering too

[shell fiber]

ah, yes, right

next step will be the 4 way district center mod

then billboards because it's reasonnably easy, although i won't be able to test it before long

and then 1x1x2 storage

oh actually i need to check those 2x2 storages quiclky

[bitter storm]

I think multiple types of buildings for steam vent would be nice, like one for recreation, one for power, and one for saltpeter or perhaps sulfur (I don't think there is any use for sulfur yet though, perhaps rubber could be made through vulcanisation), entirely up to you though, it would be fine if you go with just one, in which case my vote would be for recreation

[shell fiber]

Sulfur would indeed be the most obvious resource to pull from a stream vent, but salt and saltpeter are not too far off, so rather than adding sulfur I'd prefer to just go with the other two.
The main question is whether I can assume one will always be on the map and if yes, accessible or not.

Althout if I'm not mistaken, the steam vent turbine produces only 400hp, which mean that designing maps with "late game" steam vents would be really silly, unless the map maker is going for a cluster of several vents

[bitter storm]

The power output can be changed right?
Well there is no necessity for power generation in this method for this mod, maybe recreation, or sulfur/rubber, which I remember advocating for a few months ago

[shell fiber]

Well because of the water seep, you can have maps with effectively no useable water flow, in which case you have only steam vent for power, so I kind of have to keep a power generator on it, at least as an option

Of course regarding the power output I was talking with the default factions

I'll probably make a crappy vent turbine for starting, then later on a better one will become available

[spring heath]

No idea why he won't go down the ladder, nor how he even got up there? He must have been idling on the roof of the pit and ladder when the district crossing was done. I'm rushing completion of the lodge to try free him out the side door (stuck in a loop trying to exit the dc)

he's put - completed exit animation onto lodge roof then immediately went back into dc an out p+l door

what goofy lil guy smh

[spiral sigil]

I wonder if you can add pressure concept somehow, add pressure, build high pressure steam and pipe it through tubeway asset to a nuclear reactor. Or maybe to high temperature foundry. Maybe add a boiler kind of building for maps that don't have vents, so no one is soft locked.

[shell fiber]

hmm... i suppose with code anything is possible, but staying mostly script-free, that is not even remotely within my reach.

having the high-temp foundry require to sit on top of the steam vent would not be unthinkable, but since the building is pretty big you risk having issues with maps being unplayable because several immovable objects are in the way.

but most importantly, since U6 i've been trying to put this mod in a completed state, so i want to avoid adding too many new things, except when a new feature clearly mandates it (like rope for ropeways)

the last thing on my bucket list is a medium nuclear reactor that would effectively put the wonder at the very end of the tech tree.

otherwise i'll just integrate the new elements : aquifers, steam vents and relics

[radiant arch]

regarding the MapServices.dll it would seem a simple Blueprints/Configurations/MapSize.blueprint.json does the exact same (with 1.0)

{
  "MapSizeSpec": {
    "MaxHeightAboveTerrain": 24
  }
}

could you please replace it with this for 1.0 please?

(this is to ensure min-building-height-above-terrain fits the nuclear reactor)

[shell fiber]

yeah sure 🙂

remind me if i forget

[radiant arch]

hmm.. trying to find the path for U7...

[shell fiber]

because i'm not anywhere close from updating this mod yet 😅

[radiant arch]

not sure it's working for U7 too.. wont work for U7, as there is no spec yet, but hard-coded values only!

[radiant arch]

can imagine it being a pain 😅

[radiant arch]

likely too much rn, but wanted to say, the scripts you got all been updated to work with 1.0 upgrade now

https://mod.io/g/timberborn/m/grauschweifs-scriptpack#description

has them. with descriptions on how to migrate.
feel free to copy or refer as you like

can technically replace all but MapService.dll for U7 too. would only conflict with NeedFavor.dll (got a copy since someone else wanted to use it too), and could coexist with the rest too.

[shell fiber]

if you want to make them separate mod, i can make them dependencies, that can be easier

but i just got dropped a bunch of work to do on my head before next monday, so modding will have to wait a little bit

not that there is any hurry anyway, since there will likely be quite a few updates to the experimental branch by the time it's released.

[cloud flax]

Finally Got the time to update the tech tree was working on!!

[cloud flax]

Edit: Changed few things so arrows are more straight and better looking

[shell fiber]

can you send it to me in 2048*2048 ?

ah, no it's okay, discord was just taking its sweet time downloading it

i'm shaving off a little bit top and bottom to make it square, but if you want to rearrange a little bit yourself feel free to send it to me

i'll put it in whatever next update happens

[spring heath]

This is great! Although I have noticed one little thing - the clay pit does not show Clay as an unlocked resource 😅

[cloud flax]

theres clay pit at the very top too

its just i added another one at bottom left cuz people forget what to do with dirt by the time they unlock the mech drill so its just for a reminder there

[shell fiber]

hurray ! hurray !

[cloud flax]

Ooooooooh that looks fancy!!!

Sitting in the air, chilling

[shell fiber]

i had like 30 minutes to slack off before the end of the day, so i poked at this a little bit

the 4-way district center mod

seems in order

[cloud flax]

Is this the steam engine over the vents?

[shell fiber]

no it's the normal engine from the ironteeth

but there was always this annoying issue with unstaffed buildings that have more than one input / output

the game used to look at the total fill% to decide delivery priority

but since they made the steam engine consume water and logs, they can now run in the same issue i've been having for the past... very long time

so they fixed it

[cloud flax]

Yayyyyy

[shell fiber]

now i suppose it looks at whichever fill% is lowest among inputs

so in practice that will make the fermentation barrels and other unstaffed buildings work far more efficiently

[cloud flax]

Is this 1.0 thing or even in 0.7?

[shell fiber]

1.0.0

but in 0.7 i had mostly solved or circumvented the issues it could pose

was still slightly sub-optimal though

[cloud flax]

Am trying to find the two icons at the bottom. cant find it in any folder in asset ripper of the mod. anyone has them??

[radiant arch]

base game items I'd assume. can asset rip the base game for them example

[cloud flax]

oooooh. where are the base game manifest files located?

[spring heath]

Dunno where they’d be file wise but left is from badwater dome, right one I recognise but not sure from where

[radiant arch]

the water source icon i believe

[radiant arch]

ripping the game directory, like steamapps/common/Timberborn should give resources path with all those inside. exported for unity, not primary content likely. but not sure. not at the pc to check.

[cloud flax]

Got themmmm

Danke

[cloud flax]

Updated Tech Tree in 1:1 dims @shell fiber
(had to remake it cuz last nights work was not saved )

[stiff lily]

What are sources of beaver contamination in buildings now? My beavers keep getting contaminated and I can't figure out where from. I only have badwater in a very small part of the map and I have two pumps there inset into the ground. The workers there don't seem to be getting contaminated though

[radiant arch]

flowing unclean water is a big one. anything beyond 5% is bringing numbers up quickly.
not sure otherwise. would suspect the glow worm handling and medium bad water pump still. it's not in the json files, so can't be read that easily..

[stiff lily]

There's no pathways through the flowing badwater. The main stream of flowing clean water has 0 contamination in it

Yeah I tried hunting in the json files

I only have the small badwater pumps. I do have firefly grooming stations - I'll keep an eye on their workers

[cloud flax]

Same question tbh

[stiff lily]

In a drought, the contamination has dropped to 0 so it has to be something to do with the badwater pumps But the workers themselves don't seem to be the ones that get contaminated - could the ones that live there get contaminated instead?

[stiff lily]

Wait it is the worker in the bad water pump

[radiant arch]

it should be rather moderate risk for medium pumps?

if that not changed

i used to need 1 jail per bucket post and usually could run 2-3 medium pumps per jail

but than i had pollution resistance potions already usually

[stiff lily]

I understand the need for bucketing posts based on what they're doing, but I thought the idea behind the pump buildings was that they were safe underwater

[radiant arch]

only the mechanical might be

the medium pump certainly had a warning hint still

[stiff lily]

As in the powered one?

The small one has no hint

[radiant arch]

"Why would anyone design something like this?" hahah

also possibly designed by a deranged beaver

[stiff lily]

I do love the flavour text in this mod. Peak creativity 😄

[stiff lily]

I've moved to the powered badwater pump. Will see it happens anymore 🙂

[stiff lily]

Nope contamination still happens 🙁

[radiant arch]

to the inhabitants of mechanical pump?

[stiff lily]

I believe so? Not 100% sure

I got another drought again just as I went to investigate 😄

[stiff lily]

I also now have the washing machine so it’s hard to track it unless I sit there and just watch the bottom left panel

[radiant arch]

my rip says there's these providers:
||

• buckets
• small pump
• ENS
• Library
  ||

[spring heath]

||I guess eating strange mushrooms and… partaking… of pungent salts has negative consequences. Whoda thought 😅 Makes sense but never would’ve guessed it on my own||

[woeful sun]

Yep timbertrees confirms.

[shell fiber]

yes, basically buildings that consume bad shrooms and brainsalts do that too.
the architect and mechanic ideally should when reseaching blueprints, but not when making gears / scaffoldings. sadly i can't make injury risk conditionned to the reciepe so those too are safe 😅

[stiff lily]

Can we add that into the building description or something like that so it’s easier to identify?

[shell fiber]

i could... but isn't it kind of immersion-breaking to have the accident risk displayed ?
also i would nee to update every building's description 😓

[woeful sun]

I think one of the TImprove mods shows it.

Also I think it's added in 1.0

[radiant arch]

might want to add the u7 and 1.0 tags on mod.io for this

so people know it's working

[stiff lily]

Er the Elevator to the Abyss is eating my Hooman Relics... The recipe is set to retrieve relics, but the number is going down slowly, and then after 5h I get another 25

Ohhh it's a possession?! Wow okie dokie

[shell fiber]

oh

[shell fiber]

just in case people didn't know, you can do this :

things seem mostly in order now

[shell fiber]

if anyone feels like crash-testing them (i think i already did but who knows) tell me what you find 🙂

bugs or anything else

tbh this was pleasantly easy to fix 🙂

now time to attack... the beast

[cloud flax]

what happened to the hanging rope btw??

[shell fiber]

It causes beavers to get stuck on trees so I devlocked it 😞

[cloud flax]

thats sad but fair nuf

[shell fiber]

Tbh I made it mostly to help with the pit and ladder lodges, but it seems that most of the actual use was to give access to the river to farmers without taking up planting space 🤔

[cloud flax]

i use it to clear plants on mountains....

[shell fiber]

Maybe I'll think of something that works similarity

[radiant arch]

i consider them one of the best inventions in timberborn tbh

[cloud flax]

used them here to get rid of tons of metal

[radiant arch]

and vertical farming^^

[shell fiber]

Using them for metal was one of the intended uses 😉

[radiant arch]

if there was a validator spec that blocked trees below them, that would help?

would suspect you can't define that otherwise with regular options?

[shell fiber]

Probably but that seems complicated

[radiant arch]

yeah, likely true..

[shell fiber]

My best bet wild be to make something anew

But no hurry

[cloud flax]

Gave my beavers a holiday and they seem pretty happy :D

[shell fiber]

eheheh

(yes, that was absolutely vital)

[stiff lily]

Do Grand Dams require a stupid amount of demolition to get them low enough so they don't flood everything, or am I using them wrong? 😄

They're 5 blocks high, so for water to over-top them they need to be in a 6 deep stream?

[shell fiber]

well if you let water go on top, i'm pretty sure they will be upset about the dry part being flooded 🤔

it's probably better to let water flow off somewhere else

[stiff lily]

Oh so it's not a "dam", but a building that just blocks water and happens to pump at the same time?

[stiff lily]

They don't seem to be upset about the dry part flooding. i.e. water flowing past the door - not it staying stagnant there

Do you have a screenshot of what this looks like in practice?

[shell fiber]

oh, i see, well then you're correct, yes

they are dams, and also pump water

but water doesn't have to go over them 🤔

[stiff lily]

but what is it meant to look like in practice? You have grand dams beside the flowing water just to pump it, but otherwise don't really serve any "dam" purpose?

I feel like my tiny brain has had an idea of what I thought they were meant to be and I can't get past it 😭

This is how my brain thinks it should work

Arguably it looks kinda cool, but that's a lot of dirt to place, or demolitionto do to make it happy to get it low enough for that to be viable

[shell fiber]

eh, sure why not ?

[stiff lily]

but what's in your head? 😄

[shell fiber]

well instead of dirt it could be other buidlings

but that's basically it

[stiff lily]

Well sure, but it's still a 6 deep hole

If water isn't meant to flow over the top, where else does it go? Over one of the side walls?

[shell fiber]

the issue you're having is that you build it near the source, which means you don't have a whole valley to flood, so you have to build it yourself with dirt

[shell fiber]

nah it's fine, i didn't remember my own build

[stiff lily]

Oh that was just the first place I played with it. I also put one further downstream and dynamited down 6 tiles to make the river that deep

I had to go into dev mode to figure out how the building worked before I committed to trying to build one in my real game 😄

[shell fiber]

@stiff lily this is a good setup for example

i'ts a slightly odler design though

[stiff lily]

Woahhh

That's the inspo I was looking for

[cloud flax]

In recent version of dam, you can actually place more buildings atop the dam to further raise the height so play around. But yeah, it's more like the levy part of the dam and it needs to have an outlet for water to flow out, or the dam will burst :P(not literally just kidding)

[stiff lily]

Success 🎉

[sullen cape]

I've been procrastinating about building mine, as the Map I'm on doesn't have a suitable valley unless I dynamite

[shell fiber]

regarding this mod v1.0 :
i've managed to load all of the needs, but it seems that the goods have a slighly new blueprint template now 😓

also the color of the box is getting thrown out of the window, so i guess i'll have to redo them all eventually

[cloud flax]

Damnnnn no more colourful boxes and storages??

[shell fiber]

nah, it's easy to redo

i'm loading items small batch by small batch

because one of them causes crash

going well

[storm gulch]

Do you think this is going to evolve substantially from the U7 version in terms of features/lore?

Because I don't think I'm going to be completing my U6 playthrough within the next 2 months or so

And if 1.0 will be ready (or may reasonably be) by around february or march then I might just skip U7 and do my next playthrough on the 1.0 release

[shell fiber]

no it shouldn't be fundamentally different from U7

save for what i'll do with the new map items

typically i think it is necessary to have a low tech steam turbine, for maps that don't have any real waterflow

i probably want to have some building require to sit on it, unsure if that will be a "mine" (extract saltpeter or whatnot), a manufactory (typically something like the refinery / alchemist), or just an entertainment like a hot spring

so only some minor shaking around of things

also i'll probably make the hooman relics radioactive because free science can mess up the faction progression

[sullen cape]

Heh I didn't realise beavers can fit through one block gaps, I feel like a monster
(not building this, just checking if I need one or two layers of tunnels to get to a Abyss)

https://tenor.com/view/youre-a-monster-cookie-broken-leg-shrek-monster-gif-16642686

[shell fiber]

hmm, that's some very intense glowfluid 😅

[cloud flax]

Sooo colorful!!!

Is lotus tea also glowing???

Or did I just have a bad shroom 🫣

Wait that's grape juice

[shell fiber]

i think the shader changed a bit, it wasn't meant to be so intense 😅

but that makes me thing that maybe the nuclear fuel could be liquid... and glowing 😅

[cloud flax]

Somehow everything is looking more bright and pretty

[shell fiber]

or that hypothethical purified nuclear whatever i still need to make

[cloud flax]

Tbh nuclear fuel should be stored in those metal tanks made of lead....

I know they used for gas but that's the closest building which logically could contain nuclear fuel

[shell fiber]

not a bad idea

but it's clearly indicated as a gaz tank 🤔

a dedicated storage would indded make more sense

but those silly beavers are a bit careless you know 😅

[cloud flax]

Btw those buildings should also have contamination chance... (If they don't already)

[cloud flax]

Thank fully it's not just lying outside in a pile XD

[radiant arch]

surely much safer to store it amongst the liquid tanks!

[cloud flax]

You can probably just rename it to inert metal tank (or something similar) used to store volatile gases and nuclear fuel

[shell fiber]

it's hilarious for beavers but i knew someone (the mother of a friend) who had stored bleach in a normal water bottle, my mom tried to drink from it but spit it out just in time.

that was indeed absolutely stupid.

[nova crescent]

Loving the colors.

[void vault]

dumb question, how do I get bananas from the trees in my greenhouse?

[radiant arch]

marking them for cutting + lumberjack

[void vault]

do they have to be inside the greenhouse? I placed the flag outside and they wont

[radiant arch]

bananas need be inside greenhouse and need to be marked

it sometimes not works when they been marked before the greenhouse was completed or so

unmarking and remarking might help in that case

[void vault]

save and reload worked

[nova crescent]

Yes. Or marking the area for cutting before planting the banana tree also works.

[heavy spruce]

ive been doing that for all my connections, it’s especially funny with a shallow slope as the beavers fly though the ground, or anything planted at that level, like a bramble patch

[spiral sigil]

Or the reason they are 1m tall per the game lore might be fact that they mutated with radiation and are immune to it?

[stiff lily]

I placed new ladders at my CWF, including mega platform and pole extensions. Going back to them later on and it looks like they're built but I can't see them anymore? I managed to click on one of the ladders as you can see in this screenshot, but it hasn't highlighted anything. Also can't seem to click on the built mega platform or any of the scaffolds

[woeful sun]

Might be related to view height limit. Try changing and resetting it?

[radiant arch]

might be i have missed the visibility limit in my patch? the that one allowed abyss reactors on all maps? (can't look at it today..)

[stiff lily]

On reload they're there, so not sure what was happening before

[stiff lily]

How does the Abyssal Nuclear Reactor get built? The elevator is connected to a path but it can't be reached. Any help or suggestions?

[radiant arch]

ladder / stairs and bridge would work - like reaching on top of those storage boxes should do?

might be removing the storage up front would work too?

pathing inside the abyss seems curious

usually it would just build.. but it might need a space in front or back accessible maybe

(so it's build from the outside)

[stiff lily]

Ah I might try this

From the description “is built from the inside like a wonder” I assumed that meant they would build it like they do the other add ons to the abyss - ie through the front door

I can’t finish it yet anyway. Did not realise it needed 4 gold bars 🫠

[radiant arch]

would have assumed the same, but you proved it wrong 🙂

[cloud flax]

I just put 1 set of stairs on one of the corners of the abyss and beavers are happy to climb on it and build

[stiff lily]

Is there any faster way to get gold dust? Drilling for dirt and then panning takes forever and I feel like I’ll just need to let it run at 30x speed just to get there eventually

[cloud flax]

And you should just start building it in low priority. It takes agessssss to build it

By the time you should get those gold bars

[stiff lily]

It’s already in low priority 😆 I have pretty much everything else ready to go

[cloud flax]

Just let them build them lol. It took me more than a cycle for sure to build it

And that's with all the worker bonuses, I had like 110 avg well being and 60 ish builders

And also keep the clay pit close to your drills, like almost opposite to them. Never had issue with dirt blockage ever even with 8 drills and just a single pit

[radiant arch]

if you have trouble using up iron and coal - try the advanced trebuchet recipe 😇

[cloud flax]

There are recipes in treb????

[radiant arch]

sure

[cloud flax]

It can throw away iron and coal??

[radiant arch]

metal blocks and 🧨

[cloud flax]

How come I never saw it... Will give it a look 🙏🙏

[radiant arch]

very convenient way to gather endless amounts of science too

[cloud flax]

I got like 250k science without doing anything. And there isn't anything that uses science

[radiant arch]

so true!

might want more late game science eating attractions or such 🤔

[cloud flax]

Yeah tbh the 2 things that's constantly bugging me these days are the lack of detailers (painted tails) and some science consumption building

Tbh a reworked rooftop nerdy attic for rpg could be used as detailers... Different role beavers have different paints... But all in it's sweet time

[stiff lily]

Wait what

[cloud flax]

And maybe clockwork buildings take science as well, as inputs to keep them operational?
Basically any building without need for workers. Lore being: other buildings have workers to maintain and repair them but these automates buildings issues go to the scholars in ENS and libraries to resolve and ensure their upkeep.

Will as well prevent from mass spamming them like I did

[stiff lily]

Guess I’m building more trebuchets

[cloud flax]

Can you send a screenshot of recipes if you are playing rn???

[stiff lily]

I wasn’t, sorry

[cloud flax]

Haha no worries

[stiff lily]

As a side note, having the balloons now taking library books for some recipes, it makes creating additional compact library sets not that tedious as you’ll already have the books and infra set up!

[stiff lily]

@shell fiber Is it possible to add a worker to the mechanical drills that could also work without them? I keep coming across examples where the drill gets stuck because it’s full of something but there’s plenty of storage and becomes more of a hauler volume of work problem 😕

[stiff lily]

Can confirm that a staircase on one corner works!

[stiff lily]

These are the trebuchet recipes. There's only the "kaboom" one that takes metal and dynamite to create 10 SP

[shell fiber]

yes, there is a tiny ladder on the right of the abyss elevator entrance that usually allows to build the reactor without extra steps, but there's a scroll display build in front of it.

[shell fiber]

mass spamming of those should be then end goal 😉

[shell fiber]

this issue is solved in version 1.0 😊

[cloud flax]

Yeah but adding science cost would as well make people use research and maybe build more ENS/Library specifically for it. But only marginal cost. Maybe 1 ENS for 50 clockworks

It's like those bot boosting towers for ironteeth but they eat up too much research and number cruchers balance them out

[stiff lily]

I can't believe I only just discovered the Zipline Station upgrade 🤦 I've been wanting a building that has more than 2 connections: building the Scavenger's Junkyard but with no workers just seems hacky, and balloons are great but have no exit. Now that I have bots up and running, this is a game changer 😄

[sullen cape]

The balloon one has three!

[stiff lily]

Yeah but it doesn't have a ground exit

Great for chaining distance (and wellbeing), but not great when you want people to be able to get off 🙂

[radiant arch]

really does not work

[stiff lily]

Haha you had me worried there for a moment 😄

Is there any faster way to get dirt other than just building more drills?

[radiant arch]

trading, blowing things up and abyss mines (might be slow, but gets wellbeing bonus)

[stiff lily]

Ooo trading - didn't think of that. The abyss mine is abysmally (no pun intended) slow

[radiant arch]

still trading is only around 20 dirt per day, so drills are much faster still, giving up to 160 per day

[sullen cape]

Heh I wondered if it would but it doesn't

[sullen cape]

Blowing things up is Waste Rock, not dirt? Unless it changed

[radiant arch]

oh, right.. too bad 🙂

[sullen cape]

Hmm, maybe an inverted badtide drain would be useful for Waterbeaver's water sources...

[merry ibex]

Hello discord ppl! I started playing this mod a week ago and I'm having a great time with it. Today I was trying a new run and I saw that all my 30 beavers died of thirst (eyeing the very healthy storage of chestnut beer) I know for food they won't eat the same thing unless absolutely needed, does it not apply to thirst, it says in the tool tip that it gave thirst so idk why they refused to drink.
Apologies if this isn't the right place to be asking questions like this.

[radiant arch]

problem with the base game: once the chestnut beer need is full, they will not drink it any further, dying of thirst rather (which decreases much faster than the need for beer..)
edit unless they are marked 'wastable', which beer is not - no more drinking than is good for them

or... wait...

actually, none of the drinks is wastable.. so they would never go for it for thirst alone - only water can save them

@shell fiber just out of curiosity, but drinks and (raw) foods not being wastable is by design, isn't it? to always use water for thirst, and others for 'well-being'?

looking at the medical center this might be unintended thought, as a non-wastable "medical treatment" currently means, no other treatment is possible once that was applied - rendering the abyss medical center an once-a-lifetime-attraction

[radiant arch]

all 'processed' foods seem to be wastable so in case of hunger they would eat the nearest (or whatever is reasonable close and has highest attraction).
while for 'raw' foods they would rather starve than overeat some of those.

[merry ibex]

Oh wow didn't release that was a base game thing, how unfortunate. Thank you for informing me! I guess I can't lean into the sake/beer/lemonade to leave water for industrial purposes.

[sullen cape]

Oh I wouldn't mind having all the food and drink "wastable", maybe only in an emergency but

[sullen cape]

The more variety you have the less this is a problem, but it's still annoying

[misty verge]

when does this come out

how do i get this mode if its out

[cloud flax]

For The bad water drains, they would be awesome as water slide entrances!! Is it possible to turn them into teleports. basically adding an entrance building to them and you got a superfast water slide connecting you to other end

[shell fiber]

it's more or less by design, the reason why i set it as non wastable is because the beavers will look for the food or drink that gives the most wellbeing value. so if the needs were wastable, beavers will alway always prefer processed drinks to water, even if their drink need is 99.99% full, that 0.01% need to fulfill will make the processed drink preferable.

not only that's a bit weird because... you probably wouldn't want to be stuck with only beer to drink, but since they will all always rush to drink it even to fill 0.01% of their need, it becomes borderline impossible to accumulate any significant amount of processed drink, and its usage becomes very inefficient (as opposed to the current situation, where every single unit of drink is used at its full value).

typically what i'm afraid would happen is a new player starts making lotus tea, but after a while the tea storage desperately stays stuck to zero (because they are all rushing to drink it all even when unnecessary), and start assuming production is out of balanced with the needs and just give up on drinks. at least that's the feeling i got when i implemented drinks at first.

the only way around i sort of see would be to give water a "water" need that gives +1 WB, that would reduce the inefficient usage of processed drinks to some degree but i have yet to test that 🤔

[shell fiber]

the abyss thing that boost lifespan, strenght, speed etc right ? it never decays so yes, it's meant as once per lifetime. it could be wastable i guess... i don't remember if that comes from whatever i used as template or if that's deliberate.

[stiff lily]

Could GMO's used to run without workers but they can't anymore? They do seem to work without them though, but the flavour text doesn't say "can work without workers" (I thought it used to?)

That was a very complicated way to ask: Can GMOs run without workers or do they need to be staffed?

[radiant arch]

even if they could run without, the production speed would be low and with U7 they'd be unreliable to refill

[stiff lily]

Really? They seem mega OP in U7

[radiant arch]

true, maybe that would only be the difference between serving 1000 versus 300 or so haha

[stiff lily]

Oh you're saying if you ran them unstaffed 👍

[stiff lily]

Just got so excited to finish the Abyssal Nuclear Reactor to find out that the Outflor also requires a gold bar

Sorry @storm gulch

Errrr... please help? 😭

[radiant arch]

oh, you want to deal with the outflow before building the outflow tbh

like setting up aqueducts or something

[stiff lily]

I tried deleting all the things around it and still can't get to it. I really don't want to have to build a huge stack of ladders

You know what? I hadn't even considered aqueducts. Here was me just going to blow trenches on either side 😆

[radiant arch]

no way around (temporary) ladder stacks. power outlet is far up there too 😉

[stiff lily]

I can't see the power output on the outflow itself??

[radiant arch]

water will just flood the abyss without any diversion 🙂

[stiff lily]

Oh on the reactor

[stiff lily]

Wow okie dokie

[radiant arch]

... describing it feels like it was made to troll...

[stiff lily]

I feel like I've been trolled

Oh well. Tomorrow problem 😄

Oh aqueducts are... expensive 🙁

Will water come out all three openings of the outflow? i.e. does it need aqueducting on all three sides?

Well that's even more troll

[radiant arch]

you can block them with whatever works. but one side needs a proper outlet

[stiff lily]

I honeslt have no idea how to build that kind of structure at that height :/

Other than it being a filthy amount of giant log pillars and aqueducts

[radiant arch]

i tried to look for a cool example lapan posted while back but can't find..

it's usually a good amount of pillars for sure..

this one is cool design of aqueducts

it not really needs to cover all exists, if you block one with a building for example (i like to use the terrace kitchen)

[shell fiber]

i removed that from the description because without dedicated workers, the suppy is often dysfunctionnal, but it can run without workers

[shell fiber]

well it's an endgame building and it costs a diploma, so it's mean to be powerful enough to make the alternative obsolete 😉

[spring heath]

“Can function (poorly) without workers”? 😂

[shell fiber]

More than poorly tbh, close to not at all. 🤐

I think in JC's playthrough he had one stuck non producing for several episodes

(but he didn't notice)

[spring heath]

Ah, are you planning to make it not work at all without them for 1.0? Might save some confusion if someone sees it doing things while empty once then stop. Or take workers away and make it drill-like ig but I think workers are better personally

[radiant arch]

with 1.0 the issue with resupplying / emptying drills and similar workerless buildings lessens actually.
so it would indeed be more reliable without workers, but it would not have any wellbeing boosts, which would half or worse performance.

[spring heath]

Yeah that’s why I prefer with-workers, you can improve the efficiency over time via wellbeing rather than either being stuck with something slow or getting sth overpowered initially

So glad the hauler check thing is fixed for 1.0

[shell fiber]

Not sure, I think having truly worker free fermentation barrels and mushroom growers would be good since that would avoid having workspaces marked as vacant, but at the same time that makes unnecessary clutter in the menus.

Maybe I'll make worker free mini versions 🤔

[ivory flicker]

Is there a plan to update the mod to u7?

[cloud flax]

There's s u7 version of this mod as a seperate mod on workshop

[ivory flicker]

Any chance it will be in mod io?

[radiant arch]

https://mod.io/g/timberborn/m/water-beaver-overhaul

[woeful sun]

On mod.io you can download old versions, so the Update 6 and Update 7 versions are available from the same mod.

Steam only allows you to download the latest version, so it was split into a separate mod for U6 vs U7.

[ivory flicker]

Oh i see, that mod doesnt have the 0.7 tag so i just assumed its not compatible

[shell fiber]

sorry, i have a thousand things to think about, so half of them fall through the cracks

[shell fiber]

hmm... data loss...
can someone quickly reminds me what are the bonuses of the large farmhouse ?

i think it was something like that ?

[ivory flicker]

Theres also some dependencies missing, i had to find them manually

[merry ibex]

Was it this or do you plan on changing it?

You swapped it I believe.

[shell fiber]

ah, thanks !

how do you get this to be moved to the side ?

[shell fiber]

ah, crap, can someone dig out the same thing for the stackable gatherer's house, and basically every ressource-collecting building ? 😓
Edit : scrap this, i realize the data is still buried in the U7 prefabs, which i can read in wordpad despite unity being kaputt

[woeful sun]

One of the TImprove mods

[sullen cape]

Nope it's changed, you now get 4 per demolished tunnel platform!

[shell fiber]

that is some seriously intense cooking they're doing here 😅

for those wondering what tree i'm munchin on, the scripts governing fires and smokes have been rewritten so i have to fix them, and as seen previously the data regarding building worker's bonuses was lost (but i have a backup)

[ivory flicker]

What cures severe injuries?

[radiant arch]

the clinic would

or rather the medicine it provides (can only be given in clinic)

[ivory flicker]

Thats quite far into the progression isnt it? Not sure i can build that and i have no idea what causes this severe injury

[radiant arch]

any heavy industry i suspect. like the factory

[ivory flicker]

Dont even have that yet

[radiant arch]

clinic is not far - needs library and alchemist and maybe trading or big farmer

[ivory flicker]

Trading with the balloons? Thats a no and neither is the big farmer

[radiant arch]

well, might take some time in that case

[ivory flicker]

Does it heal by itself like the others?

[radiant arch]

nope

but given how early it is, should be rare

[woeful sun]

Mechanized Kitchen House, Rudimentary Sawmill, Assembly Line, Advanced Sawmill, Elevator To The Abyss, and Factory

(according to timbertrees)

[stiff lily]

So close yet so far 😭

Nuclear POWARR

[cloud flax]

Bridge piece not working??

[stiff lily]

Bridge piece couldn't be reached as it's inset from the edge 🫠

[radiant arch]

you can add another level of ladder and a bridge to reach ?

in the red rectangle

[stiff lily]

The end piece of that bridge was over the aqueduct so I just put a ladder and they could walk to it

It was more just a moment of "YES... WAIT NO"

[ivory flicker]

Is there a sluice type thing to automatically divert badtide?

[radiant arch]

short answer: no, by design

long answer:

there's a similar building, that can pump a limited amount through, like a weaker sluice, as can the water cannons.
also floodgates can divert some - and be automated using other mods for example

[ivory flicker]

anyone can help me , what is obstructing the line here?

[radiant arch]

the tower itself is in the way. sadly it's not working in this direction

[ivory flicker]

oh dang

thanks

and for the badwater pump, does badwater go in the fan hole thing?

[radiant arch]

rotating it once would work

[radiant arch]

from above, yes

[ivory flicker]

Is there a trick to doing it?

[radiant arch]

the badwater pump? submerging them works

can place some other building on top and safely access from riverside with stair for example.
usually requires dynamite to deepen river or fit stairs when badwater is cut off

just needs badwater above the fan, so 2m deep river or hole in riverbed.
cant show it right now and not sure how to explain better

[wary panther]

I've generally ended up placing it submerged, and then a pit and ladder tank storage house above to provide dry access to the entrance. Though i have occasioanlly also placed it with a badwaterfall landing across the intake turbine, running across the roof, and into the outflow channel below, without it spilling off the front (since that's one block farther away...

[ivory flicker]

I think u might be wrong, or im misunderstanding the ui on the "dam drain house"

It has like a sluice setting for the filtered stuff

Altho im not sure how it works

[wary panther]

it's really a mechanical pump, but without any lift

so it moves water from one side to the other, and can be selective about badwater (or goodwater), but needs power

but it's kind of like a sluice, in that it can be at the bottom of a dam and can meter its output by the depth on the downstream side. It just takes power and is housing, too

and it can't only do a limited flow rate, whereas an open sluice is pretty much unrestricted

[ivory flicker]

Is there a benefit to the drinking fountain?

[shell fiber]

not really, it's a thing that is useful for districts, just here to unpack barrelled water into plain water

[shell fiber]

some progress today

the fences are quite a chore to deal with

but most building are largely problem-free

[cloud flax]

Since you are on this, can you make that golden gate as well has a path going through it?

[spring heath]

totally understand if you don't fix in u7 but I just had 16 out of 27 beavers get stranded inside the DC upon pathing it to district. (They're looping trying to walk through the walls.) Is it maybe Unstuckify-related? If so I could try let that modder know too

weirdly, some beavers are unsticking in one click but others are taking over 10 attempts to get free

[radiant arch]

yeah, unstuckify has issues with this edge case

something about the pathing and timing of the click

not sure it's a mix of the unique district center with ladder in middle and the unstuckify logic

[woeful sun]

yea, I think unstuckify doesn't wait long enough to figure out that the beaver isn't still stuck

[radiant arch]

might be more complicated too, given there's multiple path group transitions within that building and beavers might get into weird states. not sure this matters for other factions

[shell fiber]

fixed the water particles

[woeful sun]

shiny 🙂

[radiant arch]

the pillow storage got roofs!

[shell fiber]

those are scroll displays 😉

[shell fiber]

yeah, the materials are still from the U7 texture pack, not an issue for functionality, but a bit too bright 😅

[stiff lily]

Is this a lido with more than 1 depth, or a lido that will work with a small amount of water in a 1 depth hole?

[shell fiber]

it works from 0.2 depth, but yeah that's kind of low 🤔

hmmm

[stiff lily]

I thought the base game (and previous WB) made the required height 0.6m?

[shell fiber]

to my surprise, they all activate from 0.2 depth 😐

[shell fiber]

quick question : assuming someone make a housing optimizer script for version 1.0, should i really bother with the district stuff ? like the barrelled water etc.
i'm seriously considering ditching it entirely, no one likes districs anyway🤔

[radiant arch]

would be fine with me. really not that useful since u7 tbh

[cloud flax]

Please don't remove those long district crossings though! They look super cool and fancy. I mostly use them to connect my robot only district to the main colony. Don't really care about the resources or the different district centers

[sullen cape]

I do use it, but you can store a decent amount of water with it too...

[shell fiber]

One more reason to remove them 😅

[sullen cape]

😇

||I miss the buried tank, I might of built a few before updating hehe||

[cloud flax]

tbh am finding building bigger dams more and more useful with time after the water desnity has increased. but you do need a map which can be dammed. plain maps will for sure be PITA

[sullen cape]

Yeah the map I'm on now needs lots of dynamite to damn properly

Hmm, for maps that don't dam well you'd need lots of big tanks, but then people spam them (me 😇 )
The big glass tank can help...

[cloud flax]

I would any day prefer dynamite over building up Terrain:P

[shell fiber]

don't forget that pretty much all blocky buildings are watertight, might consider rebuilding your whole town as one big dam 😉

[sullen cape]

Maybe when I play next time, that would be hours of building and I'd need a lot of dirt as well, the water is all under ground lol

[delicate lantern]

Hi guys! I’m rly confused, how do I obtain „brain boosting salts”? I’m not able to progress

[delicate lantern]

Nvm, went through every building and found it finally

[radiant arch]

https://darkskies.za.net/~norman/timbertrees/u0.7/enUS_Whitepaws.html does help lots with such question

[delicate lantern]

Thanks

[spring heath]

also Tool Finder, I believe it's a dependency so use the default keybind "/" to search for things to see where it's produced :)

[woeful sun]

Ctrl-F or / both should work

[cloud flax]

@delicate lantern this might help in the long run^

[radiant heart]

👀 asaking for a fren, is WB for 1.0 a thing? wanted to get back into the beavers but would feel wrong not to use the proper and best faction

[stone spruce]

Not as of yet. Also, the last update to experimental seems to have broken a lot of the additional mods it uses -- 1x1x2 storage, logstairs and 4Wdistrictcenter are all crashing for me right now

(I literally just finished posting crash logs to their threads here)

[radiant heart]

kk, last time around was a bit too far to catch up and read, would have taken probably 2~3days, sry

[stone spruce]

Nah you're good. I consider Lapan's mods pretty much essential, I get it 😄

[cloud flax]

I believe the update 7 version is still very well balanced and great to play!

[radiant heart]

idk last i played was on U5.. been a hot minute

[cloud flax]

Then you really should check out U7... It's milesssss better!!!