Problems with Cetus X RTF kit

[slender nova]

yooo
new pilot here
just got my new Cetus x RTF kit in the post yesterday, it was flying great. Went to make dinner after a perfectly normal flight, ate my food, got my drone back out of its case and got it set up again. I put in the batteries, but only got a red light on the back of the VTX, no signal to the FPV goggles or the receiver either.. Swapped the batteries, same thing... "Okay... This is odd" I thought.

I then got betaflight downloaded and it mentioned setting some default values before I could use the drone, almost like it had never been setup before and the VTX wasn't showing up, it said something along the lines of "your VTX is either not supported or not configurated". After about 5 hrs of tinkering in Betaflight with my housemate (she doesn't own a drone) we came to the conclusion that the settings had somehow been wiped/lost. We got it all set back up and went to grab a snack. I powered it on, but realized the VTX was having issues, even on max power, in the same room, we tried a few different VTX tables, but quickly realized that the VTX that the Cetus X has, the M04, doesn't exist on BetaFPVs website... so I can't find the correct VTX table for it ANYWHERE. The closest I can get is the M03 v1.1 VTX table but it still has the same issues.

Anyways, we did some more testing, using different VTX tables etc, I plugged back in for a flight and... Red light on the back of the VTX. No VTX signal, no receiver connection, just the red light. Just like before. I've sent out a support ticket but its currently Chinese new year and honestly, I don't wanna have to wait a week if it's a problem I can fix myself.

Any help is greatly appreciated, gutted that my first proper drone (my other drone is a £20 toy basically) has seemingly died on the first day of having it. When I can fly it, it's so much fun, but if it's gonna require me to go back into Betaflight every time and redo the setup then this ain't gonna work.

[maiden hull]

the settings had somehow been wiped/lost
this tends to happen on 1S whoops from time to time

We got it all set back up
how did you configure it? Did you use a configuration backup from the manufacturer?

sorry, I forgor: Welcome to the hobby ^^

[slender nova]

ty ! Just actually made some progress with it, but will answer your questions first

how did you configure it? Did you use a configuration backup from the manufacturer?
We found the CLI on BetaFPVs website, but mostly it was just trial and error really, so there's a chance that it might not be setup properly but it does now fly

the progress I just made is that I found the CLI.txt file for the cetus x (the drone I have) and ust grabbed the VTX table values and now I actually can leave the room with it. it's just now the drone is saying MSP when I try to arm and I can't arm I believe because of it

[maiden hull]

MSP means that the FC thinks that it's connected to a configurator

[slender nova]

o h

[maiden hull]

usually fixed by disconnecting/power cycle

[slender nova]

lemme give that a try

[maiden hull]

is it just me or are the links in BetaFPV's manual not clickable

[slender nova]

which links? the docs are so hit or miss istfg

[maiden hull]

well, it's BetaFPV... having any docs whatsoever from them is above average >.>

this is stupid. All of that text is there in non-text form

[slender nova]

yeah, as I've come to learn LMAO
ctrl + click maybe?

oh

[maiden hull]

can't click or copy it lmfao

even in a dedicated PDF app

sigh

Somehow I am not even surprised.

[slender nova]

if you screenshot it you can run it thru an online OCR tool

[maiden hull]

I managed to get there through the search on their site..

[slender nova]

it appears that the MSP issue is gone too

[maiden hull]

aaand the CLI is a dump
smh

[slender nova]

and that the range is now better

[slender nova]

is this not normally how you'd do it?

[maiden hull]

did you apply the whole config?

[slender nova]

no, just the VTX stuff, but it's working

might dump my current CLI and then apply the whole config

[maiden hull]

it probably lost the tune too then

it might be wise to apply the dump

dump gives you the whole config, including board defaults
diff all gives you the changes made compared to board defaults.
Whenever you get a new FC/drone you should make both backups, but diff all is way less of a pain to dissect and use.

quick explanation: BF sometimes fixes bugs by changing the default value of some setting. This happened from 4.0.0 to 4.0.1 for example.
If you were to apply a dump from 4.0.0 into 4.0.1, the incorrect value would get copied over as well.

[slender nova]

I will apply there dump and see how it goes

this is the config me and my friend came up with ^^

[maiden hull]

Now, in regards to your FC being forgetful:
This tends to happen (randomly) when the battery on a 1S drone drops below ~3.1V
Some drones are much more tolerant than others. It can vary between units.

[maiden hull]

I won't be able to decypher that, send a diff all 😄

I would have to diff that dump against the dumped defaults for BETAFPVF4SX1280

and seeing as I don't have that board and don't want to be flashing a FC with incompatible firmware...

[slender nova]

there's the diff all

[slender nova]

is there any way to stop this from happening?

[maiden hull]

Honestly it seems like most of the config is there?

[slender nova]

will probably chuck the one they provide in and give it a go
as the throttle is currently VERY sensitive it seems

[maiden hull]

oof, don't fly it

if it launches the moment you add a bit of throttle, then you REALLY shouldn't fly it

you risk blowing up motors/esc

[slender nova]

it's not that bad
I can sustain hover and stuff fine
just seems more sensitive than when I first used it maybe
but I only got one or two flights out of it before it did thelil forget trick on me

[maiden hull]

Be more careful about how low you fly the batteries?
Basically, the main chip gets glitchy at the low voltage, corrupts the config memory, and on next boot it just resets to default.

Imo, just keep the backup and fly however you wish.

[slender nova]

aye aye 🫡

also, just put in their config but there's an error:

[maiden hull]

moment

[slender nova]

here's the full thing:

[maiden hull]

lmfao BetaFPV are complete and utter idiots

they kept a config error in the file

[slender nova]

LMAO

[maiden hull]

this is legit in the file

[slender nova]

oh wait WHAT

LMAO

[maiden hull]

fortunately that line is not important, it gets set from the radio

[slender nova]

NO WAY

[maiden hull]

open the file

set expresslrs_switch_mode =
###ERROR IN dump: CORRUPTED CONFIG: expresslrs_switch_mode = 255###

delete this

save the file and load it again

fml

[slender nova]

what would you normally set that value to?
I can't believe that slipped thru QC

[slender nova]

okay shall I give it a test?

[maiden hull]

oh, I deleted the explanation by accident, sorry
the radio will tell the FC what to set the value to
this just indicates that the value on the radio was corrupted, it's a common ELRS issue

[slender nova]

ahhh I seeeee
that makes more sense

okay

[maiden hull]

also

binding

set expresslrs_uid = 0,0,0,54,0,87
save

run this in CLI afterwards

this should restore your binding

[slender nova]

is that the binding to the controller/receiver?

[maiden hull]

in this board's case, the FC itself is acting as the brain of the receiver

[slender nova]

ohh okay, interesting

[maiden hull]

your controller advertises itself to receivers as "0,0,0,54,0,87"

and when binding, a receiver learns that value and stores it

this way you're just pre-configuring it since you already have it

If you've been tinkering with ELRS - these numbers are what "Binding phrase" translates to.

[slender nova]

so glad that I can actually learn this stuff from SOMEWHERE
also, which is the best channel to be on? currently its on raceband but the quality isn't great

[maiden hull]

well, you need your drone and goggles to be set to the exact same band and channel

if your drone is set to R6, your goggles need to be set to R6

-- A band is a set of numbered frequencies - channels.

Different bands overlap in various ways.
Sometimes frequencies match perfectly, other times they're close enough to give video but the range will be garbage.

That's why you shouldn't use auto-search on the goggles.

[slender nova]

ah, that makes sense
so as long as you know what the drone is actually set to, don't use the autosearch

damn this VTX gets toasty even on 25mw

[maiden hull]

as long as you know
if you don't, don't fly 😄

[slender nova]

I presume RCE is similar to pit mode?

[maiden hull]

damn this VTX gets toasty even on 25mw
unfortunately that's the nature of VTX's

[slender nova]

solid answer

[maiden hull]

I think so, you can check OpenVTX documentation

if there is any

[slender nova]

I found git repo if that helps LMAO

[maiden hull]

Race Mode - When at a race event and using pitmode on a switch with Betaflight, select the RCE VTx power level. It will force pitmode on boot and only use 25mW.

[slender nova]

damn you beat me to it

xD

so yeah its the same thing

[maiden hull]

RCE is forced pit/25mW

you can have manual pit/0mW/25mW

RCE is just a special state

[slender nova]

what would you normally have pitmode set to? not sure if it matters if I let the VTX get too hot too often

[maiden hull]

I wouldn't fly with pit mode..

never cared for that

[slender nova]

ofcourse
but when its sat in the pits aka on a bench

getting worked on etc

[maiden hull]

when sitting on the bench, I'd either turn the VTX off entirely if possible, or set it to its lowest power level, 0mW in this case.

what radio have you got?

[slender nova]

aye captain
it's the lite radio 3 that came with the kit
seems like its okay but I have nothing to reference it off

[maiden hull]

I despise most of BetaFPV's radios for their proprietary software that always breaks..

the only exception is the LiteRadio 3 Pro which runs EdgeTX

[slender nova]

my only complaint so far is that sometimes the arming switch gets STUCK and you have to press the top of it to get it unstuck

[maiden hull]

don't touch the firmware on that radio..

Since you don't have a UI for ELRS functions, you can use Betaflight's OSD menu to control the VTX settings (and other stuff) wirelessly

[slender nova]

if I really get into this I will either a) get this as an upgrade
or b) get something else

I actually already checked the firmware on the controller using BetaFPVs own version of what looks like old betaflight
it wasn't fun re-setting up the controller but it works now as it did before

[maiden hull]

There are loads of awesome ELRS radios nowadays

ELRS completely changed the drone RC landscape over the last 2 years 😄

[slender nova]

the one thing I do like about this is the crossfire bay
but I know a lot of ELRS recs have one so it's not exactly exclusive

[maiden hull]

crossfire bay
why use crossfire when you've got ELRS xD

[slender nova]

oh
does it not just increase range? I thought it did LMAO

obviously I don't know a lot

[maiden hull]

Crossfire is a 900MHz hardware and protocol

ELRS comes in both 2.4GHz and 900Mhz variants. You've got 2.4GHz.

Your radio probably doesn't have a high power output, but there are modules and radios that do.

ELRS is significantly more efficient and effective at using RF compared to Crossfire.

and is cheaper

and is open-source

[slender nova]

https://youtu.be/INNztTGUJeM?t=918
this is where I learnt this

but it makes sense now that if I have ELRS I don't need crossfire

[maiden hull]

A good set of ELRS transmitter and receiver will be able to go 10km+ on 2.4GHz

What a lot of these videos are comparing to are old systems, like FRSKY or Flysky

[slender nova]

JESUS

[slender nova]

..if only my batteries could last that long LMAO

[maiden hull]

someone's done 40km on 900MHz...

on a plane

[slender nova]

that's insane

[maiden hull]

In your drone's case, the receiver isn't the most sensitive, and your radio isn't the most powerful, so don't expect results on that level, but you can upgrade the radio and maybe the receiver (though that would add some weight)

[slender nova]

Okay, gonna give my batteries, reciever and goggles a charge and then give it a test flight

[slender nova]

is the radio the part on the drone and the receiver is the controller? just so I'm clear

[maiden hull]

other way 😂

[slender nova]

fuck

[maiden hull]

radio/transmitter is the thing with sticks you hold in your hands

receiver is the component in the drone which receives the signals from the transmitter

[slender nova]

do you think it's possible to upgrade the one I have or would I HAVE to get a new one?

[maiden hull]

no clue how upgradable the one you've got is

the most significant limitation would be the very basic OS

Generally you want something that runs EdgeTX and has a screen to configure it

[slender nova]

hmm okay
good to keep in mind then

How much do ones like that normally cost? probably won't pick on up for a while but

[maiden hull]

You could get an ELRS module which has screen on it and a input button

to configure it that way

think.. Jumper AION Nano?

[slender nova]

also, slightly unrelated, the joysticks are REALLY knurled and have irritated my thumb :')

[maiden hull]

Your radio's internal 2.4GHz ELRS module can do 100mW of transmit power, which is more than enough for a whoop in most cases.
The Jumper AION Nano can do up to 500mW

there are modules that go up to 2W

but your radio wouldn't be able to power those 😂

[slender nova]

ayo that's pretty cheap

[maiden hull]

BetaFPV makes their own

it used to be crap and then they fixed it

which is... a first.

for BEtaFPV...

fixing something that was crap.

[slender nova]

with me being in the UK too I'm not sure what the laws are like
I read that you're not supposed to use over 25mw on VTXs

[maiden hull]

https://betafpv.com/products/elrs-nano-tx-module?_pos=1&_sid=b3a06fada&_ss=r

but this one has no screen..

would have to be configured from the radio and I have no idea what it can and can't do

[slender nova]

might pick this up if it just slots in
but yeah no screen LMAO

[maiden hull]

100mW on 2.4GHz, 25mW on 5.8GHz, if it follows EU

hoooweeeveeeer

unless you're blasting it 24/7

I doubt anyone except for airports would care

[slender nova]

aye aye
I do live somewhere close to RNAS Culdrose in cornwall so might be worth being careful

its about 10mi from me

[maiden hull]

well, also keep in mind that for anyone to realise that you're running more than 25mW, they'd have to be very close

[slender nova]

so i'd probably be okay then

[maiden hull]

like, if you were running a 2W VTX, I'd be concerned

but otherwise.. nahh

[slender nova]

https://tenor.com/view/watch-yo-jet-gif-20547110

me with a fancy new 2W vtx

jokes obviously

[maiden hull]

especially if you're flying close to the ground, houses will murder 99% of the signal before it leaves the street

Not telling you to do anything illegal, just explaining how RF works 🙂

[slender nova]

yeah, that's something I need to get to grips with
the drone laws over here are either a) really strict, or b) odd

[maiden hull]

"dum"

about sums it up

[slender nova]

yeah
bout right
it makes some sense as the UK is quite dense for what it is and with how many rf signals are being blasted
but iirc only VTXs use 5.8ghz so... why the limit?

[maiden hull]

there's lots of stuff on 5.8GHz
wifi, nanny cameras, originally security cameras (where our vtx/camera/video receiver hardware comes from), etc

[slender nova]

ohhhh

[maiden hull]

seen even garage openers that run on 5.8GHz lol

[slender nova]

okay
I know 5g exists for wifi
thought the .8 would seperate them though lol

[maiden hull]

wifi 5GHz is actually quite a large range, up to ~5.8

[slender nova]

as for another question, how can I increase the flighttime on my drone? am I forever locked to short flights or can I find higher C rated batteries?

wifi 5GHz is actually quite a large range, up to ~5.8
cant wait for the UK to do some stupid shit and reserve the rest of the band just like they did with 3g and a few others iirc

[maiden hull]

C rating tells you how fast a battery can be discharged without being unhappy

higher C should mean better voltage stability under load (aka not sagging)

[slender nova]

ohh okay

good to know lol

I still gotta learn the terms and stuff

[maiden hull]

unfortunately, C ratings are mostly marketing nowadays

you can buy higher capacity batteries, but those would be heavier

[slender nova]

I seen a clip of someone doing a powerloop, getting battery sag at the end of the loop and then crashing and people recommended higher c rated batts

[maiden hull]

higher C rating would reduce the voltage sag

unless the battery was too empty

you could also get HV batteries, which can have a tiny bit more energy crammed in them, at the cost of longevity.
For the same capacity they're lighter (or they give you more capacity for the same weight)

[slender nova]

not sure if it's common on other drones of this size but when you put any power down it says LOW VOL or LAND NOW

[maiden hull]

welcome to battery sag 🙂

[slender nova]

so less recharge cycles?

[maiden hull]

yep

Voltage sag doesn't necessarily happen just because of the battery, often the connectors are at fault (too much resistance)

That's why you'll see some people upgrading battery connectors

[slender nova]

ahhh
and as beta fpv uses there on BT2.0 connector..

[maiden hull]

BT2.0 is pretty good

[slender nova]

oh

good

[maiden hull]

that's actually a common upgrade

PH2.0 sucks

[slender nova]

https://tenor.com/view/avengers-endgame-hulk-bruce-banner-i-see-this-as-an-absolute-win-gif-17006739

[maiden hull]

lool

https://betafpv.com/collections/batt-1s/products/bt2-0-450mah-1s-30c-battery-4pcs

these batteries appear to he HV rated

so you should be able to set your charger to HV/4.35V

[slender nova]

I haven't flown outdoors yet tbh
need to put my operator ID on my drone for it to be legal lmao

[slender nova]

the charger that came supplied is this little dinky thing

[maiden hull]

get a whoopstor

dangit I thought there was a command fo dat

[slender nova]

I think the drone comes with these

[maiden hull]

yeah

[slender nova]

ooo the whoopstor looks cool

[maiden hull]

yes let's put extra weight on this thing that's so light the universe barely knows it exists
I would fly the cetsus into myself at full speed in front of a drone inspector and then dramatically pretend to die from the injuries

I'm not fixing that typo.

[slender nova]

wait how the f can it store the batteries

[slender nova]

LMAO

I was just gonna get a little bit of paper and wedge it inbetween the batteries and the body

https://tenor.com/view/sus-among-us-gif-24132003

[maiden hull]

For more than short term storage, it's best to charge them to ~3.8V/cell

they don't like being stored full or empty

the whoopstor can handle that

[slender nova]

aye aye

I think im dumb
I thought the whoopstor meant it could like HOLD/store the batteries when not in use

[maiden hull]

hahah

don't do that xD

don't leave batteries plugged into a charger

the charger's parasitic drain will discharge them to death 😄

[slender nova]

Yup
This is the charger that comes with it

[maiden hull]

oh that's actually kinda neat looking

[slender nova]

It does have a tester function built in that shows the voltage

[maiden hull]

but ofc, very very basic

oh, keep in mind that the whoopstor needs a proper power brick, like a good phone charger

[maiden hull]

that's the first RTF charger that I could call "elegant"

[slender nova]

I think I have a spare apple iphone adpater somewhere

[maiden hull]

that won't work

[slender nova]

I see this as another win

[maiden hull]

iPhone adapters specifically won't work xD

[slender nova]

I also have a 45w PD charger for my soldering iron

[maiden hull]

that should work

just check the specs on it and the whoopstor's requirements

[slender nova]

stonks

[maiden hull]

vifly whoopstor V2?

just checking

[slender nova]

this link sent me there

[maiden hull]

"new version"

seems like the V2

[slender nova]

yuuuup
if I get some more batteries it'd be nice to have
I guess it will charge them faster too?

[maiden hull]

check the charging specs, idk

I have no idea how fast your current charger charges them

[slender nova]

tbh
yeah

boutta say that

[maiden hull]

the standard charging speed for lipo results in about 1hr charge times

most drone lipos will happily charge at 2x that speed

[slender nova]

https://betafpv.com/collections/batteries/products/bt2-0-battery-charger-and-voltage-tester-v2

[maiden hull]

it either charges 1x1A and 2x500mA, or 2x1A..

[slender nova]

I know in the manual it says it will charge them in 20mins but it really takes longer off of a USB
if I plug it into my phone charger (huawei adapter) it got too hot for my liking

[maiden hull]

yeah charging in 20min is not good for the longevity of the batteries

especially with these dinky little cells

Whoopstor:
Max charging current: 0.9A/port

[slender nova]

not wanting any battery fires LMAO

[maiden hull]

so it seems like it can match the BetaFPV one

until it runs into this limit:
Max input power: 30W

okay it won't run into that limit

anyway, the whoopstor is configurable

so you can set up whatever you're comfortable with

[maiden hull]

yeah

Output: 4.35V/1A

doesn't say whether it does 1A to both

or 1A total

[slender nova]

I could check
I do have a multimeter

lol

[maiden hull]

you'd have to put it in line (series) with the battery to measure current

[slender nova]

true
otherwise there would be no load

[maiden hull]

otherwise you would short it out lmfao

if you tried to measure current like voltage

[slender nova]

yeaaah
not gonna mess with it
I love tinkering
but not with stuff that I'm new to

lot more learning to do yet

I did send a ticket off to their support so we will see what they have to say
it's so insane that the manual doesn't mention the config getting corrupted at all

I've seen atleast 4 or 5 other posts in various places mentioning the same issue

[maiden hull]

manual doesn't mention the config getting corrupted at all
it's fairly random and varies unit to unit

there are ways to build the FC to protect against it, but those add weight and price

[slender nova]

i mean, tbh the manual doesn't even have a troubleshooting section iirc

[maiden hull]

honestly I'm still surprised there is any manual at all

[slender nova]

I found one part of one of the site or manual (cant remember) which misspelled the cetus as the ceuts

don't get me wrong I still dont thing it's a bad drone
but sad it's got issues like this

[maiden hull]

I don't think it's a great drone xD

frankly, most whoops kinda suck, in varying ways

You just have to make compromises when trying to reduce every gram

[slender nova]

Yeah
I think if I stay in the hobby (I very much will, just a broke uni student atm) ill opt for a non whoop class of drone

[maiden hull]

don't get me wrong, whoops are super fun, but they just have limits

in the UK, I can't recommend going much bigger than 3"

[slender nova]

Not sure how big mine is tbh

[slender nova]

just wanted to say thank you for your help! the drone is flying great :D

@maiden hull