It would be so cool if the game could switch between tonemappers depending if youre indoors or not because lighting sucks in aces
#Graphics General
silent zealot
proud pike
It would be so cool if the game could switch between tonemappers depending if yo...
that would have to be hard coded in, no?
or would it be customizable, if ever implemented?
silent zealot
twas just spitballing. I just really hate aces indoors
Ofc....customizability beats hardcoded anytime
white willow
I don't find any of them to really do well indoors. Just really a deferred thing
proud pike
i wonder if the harsh transitions in exposure due to AE will ever be improved upon
white willow
But also I'm used to how well BRTX handles in door scenes so everything to me will kinda look awful indoors
proud pike
i wonder if the harsh transitions in exposure due to AE will ever be improved up...
you can kinda remedy this by playing with your colour grade
silent zealot
I don't find any of them to really do well indoors. Just really a deferred thing
Well, for emissive pixels, r luminance shines very well. Aces just makes them all white
proud pike
i'd be better if they were to improve the AE
silent zealot
Artifical Emissive?
white willow
Well, for emissive pixels, r luminance shines very well. Aces just makes them al...
Yeah. Aces doesn't do emissives well. As I said last night, I like how it desaturates them but it does it way too much
proud pike
Artifical Emissive?
im talking about Auto Exposure
proud pike
i wonder if the harsh transitions in exposure due to AE will ever be improved up...
from here ^
silent zealot
Not caught up with all the graphics acronyms
white willow
Another thing I hope will get fixed is when you are underground and there's skylight but that area of skylight is just pure white and you can't see outside
While also leaving this weird unshaded lighting everywhere
A part of that seems like an auto exposure thing the other part of it idk
quick beacon
it's a mess from what I can tell
grizzled phoenix
Hey guys I am using events in a particle and I have several particles in one particle, but I want to order them by layers, that is to say I want one of them to be shown behind the main one and others on top, do you know how I can do it using Materials.
Thank you!
viscid moth
ehm wrong channel??
tribal trail
we need shadow map which has a longer render distance
viscid moth
oh
tribal trail
this make fog better
from my tests it takes about 20 fps but honestly I still think it's worth it and there should be an "ultra" setting that includes longer render distance for shadows
viscid moth
could we expect any fix for this
if you have low render distance and chunks unrender
sky become visible and admits bloom
sonic canopy
aaj is online, that means we're getting something new today 👀
viscid moth
definitely staying up for this preview
silent zealot
aaj is online, that means we're getting something new today 👀
It is with great sadness to announce we're discontinuing the Deferred Rendering experiment
sonic canopy
Oh just went offline, seems like no deferred features today :)
viscid moth
It is with great sadness to announce we're discontinuing the Deferred Rendering ...
there goes my hobby 💀
silent zealot
There are two important people when it comes to deferred rendering: Aajabrams and Veka. Per tradition, if we see them type in chat, we must all be silent and wait for them to bestow upon us their knowledge
long ruin
white willow
from my tests it takes about 20 fps but honestly I still think it's worth it and...
I agree. I did a preset not that long ago that increased shadow distance to 256 and now I'm back on the default 128 and it's just not good
Same with long range point lights
We should also have a slider tied to light clustering as well or soemthing. Increasing the light clustering helps with so many lighting issues with high point light counts ie nether
faint snow
New preview
white willow
Volumetric fog fixes have gone live
faint snow
white willow
We need to modify our densities by quite a bit
Lemme see how it looks
Wait
This sounds like a typo
Shouldn't it be .12
Because an increase of 12 is actually insane
silent zealot
Multiplying a decimal by another decimal will just make it smaller
long ruin
maeth
quick beacon
time to add 12 to your values ^^
sonic canopy
Multiply*
white willow
But hopefully fog looks more like fog and not... whatever it was before that
faint snow
Hopefully it’s not eye bleaching
quick beacon
We can ask Aaja when he comes online?
white willow
I'll have to fix all this once the windows update comes out and I'm out of class
quick beacon
It says it matches the fog of RTX so idk if that means anything. Probs not.
quick beacon
We'll see when we get the update on PC
white willow
But perhaps I can port my RTX fogs over without much adjustment
Because I like how those look much more
Omg even jungles
I set fog to ultra and still nothing
Pretty crazy change
Jungles on my pack just yesterday
long ruin
Definitely
white willow
I'll be fixing these up later for sure then
Hopefully fog will just in general look less overwhelming
If my desert fog can look more like this I'll be happy
quick beacon
Could it even be possible in deferred?
sonic canopy
Fog brightness was decreased by 4*PI btw
quick beacon
so it'll look bad now?
sonic canopy
~12.5
quick beacon
like blidning
sonic canopy
Sorry I meant decreased
quick beacon
Okay, so getting light rays would be harder now?
quick beacon
Keep in mind: I am stupid ^^
white willow
It's fine
quick beacon
I don't like how current fog blocks the sky
quasi trench
what happened woah
quick beacon
Sky color*
quasi trench
sandstorm
white willow
what happened woah
This is RTX
sonic canopy
Okay, so getting light rays would be harder now?
If u multiply density or scattering by 12.5 it will look the same as before
white willow
I don't like how current fog blocks the sky
In theory it shouldn't now
Since for RTX it only would with absorption values
Absorption maybe will have a greater effect on sky rather than fog color
still zenith
Because an increase of 12 is actually insane
12 is correct. The specific value is 4pi, but 12 should get you back to a sensible range.
white willow
12 is correct. The specific value is 4pi, but 12 should get you back to a sensib...
Yeah I realize now it's a multiplier not a flat 12 value increase
silent zealot
12 is correct. The specific value is 4pi, but 12 should get you back to a sensib...
... let us use molang so then we can do Math.PI
still zenith
Ah, yes, sorry we weren't clear on that. It is indeed a multiplication by 12 we're recommending.
silent zealot
Technically it would be 12.6 rounded to the nearest decimal
Yeah, factor usually implies muliplication
quick beacon
Hello aajabrams
Could you explain this change? Does it only lower fog intensity, meaning if we * by 12 our fog would look the same as before?
silent zealot
Too much time spent on looking at deferred rendering, cannot read things properly anymore
white willow
I have spent to much time looking at photoshop screens and VSCode lol
still zenith
Hello aajabrams<:haiii:1228291638602760232> Could you explain this change? Does ...
It lowers the brightness of in-scattering specifically, but you are right that multiplying by 12 will get you back to roughly the fog levels you had before.
quick beacon
Oh, I see.
proud pike
ooh
quick beacon
Absorption is untouched?
pale urchin
I'm curious to see what this will actually look like in practice
Words aren't properly conveying what the difference is
quick beacon
Maybe the same. I just wish there was a way to have light rays but also be able to see the sky almost as clearly, like 80%.
tribal trail
aajabrams could you make shadow render distance longer? 🥹
white willow
Or even adding a new slider
quick beacon
Maybe the same. I just wish there was a way to have light rays but also be able ...
Maybe it's possible and I am just missing something. TBF I get confused with absorption and scattering for some reason
tribal trail
aajabrams could you make shadow render distance longer? 🥹
either an "ultra+" setting or a separate slider for shadow distance
white willow
Maybe it's possible and I am just missing something. TBF I get confused with abs...
Scattering controls the colors in the air. Absorption controls how much color is absorbed by the fog
white willow
Scattering controls the colors in the air. Absorption controls how much color is...
Scattering in theory would control fog color
quick beacon
It does
sonic canopy
Absorption is untouched?
That's a good question, density also affects extinction, right? So you should only be changing the scattering but not density
pale urchin
So is it that "in-scattering" from ambient light is reduced only?
If so that means fog is much clearer when there's no sun light
white willow
My hope with the fog changes make night look less like haunted forests
quick beacon
quick beacon
My hope with the fog changes make night look less like haunted forests
Oo I like it when it's like that
white willow
It's not necessarily a bad look but it can be a put off putting to some
quick beacon
Oh, my moon brightness is quite high ^^
white willow
Mine is like 2.15 I think
still zenith
So is it that "in-scattering" from ambient light is reduced only?
The 1/4pi factor is now applied to both the ambient and direct terms for in-scattering.
quick beacon
Mine's 15
quick beacon
The 1/4pi factor is now applied to both the ambient and direct terms for in-scat...
So this means absorption has not changed? Ooh my this is confusing ^^
still zenith
Absorption itself has not changed, correct.
white willow
This for me personally is more what I like night to look like
quick beacon
This should make fog better then?
pale urchin
So is it that fog is going to be darker overall?
quick beacon
I'll have to mess around when the preview is out.
white willow
Yeah same
tribal trail
hmmm
quick beacon
I'm a nerd for light rays ^^
pale urchin
This for me personally is more what I like night to look like
Why does the moon have mie scattering?
white willow
Why does the moon have mie scattering?
I added a little to try it out. I don't like it though so I'm gonna remove it
sonic canopy
Absorption itself has not changed, correct.
Density also affects absorption tho, right? But scattering doesn't, so to compensate for this change only scattering can be changed, but not density, since that'd also boost absorption
pale urchin
So the only thing this change addresses is that similar fog values now give the same result between RTX and deferred?
white willow
yeah im gonna be honest, i dont think this change to fog did a whole lot. night looks a better but i dont really notice improvements to light shafts
although
maybe im wrong
sonic canopy
How does the same fog look in rtx and deferred?
white willow
lemme port this exact setting over to rtx real quick
white willow
How does the same fog look in rtx and deferred?
should i add my global.json for sun angle?
quick beacon
It's kinda better?
Okay, usually I would not see stars when I wanted to see rays.
Still using your sky stuff @white willow :3
white willow
How does the same fog look in rtx and deferred?
aha.....
quick beacon
Blind
white willow
this looks a bit better than i wouldve thought
im curious how my rtx fogs actually transfer over now
ehhh still doesnt translate over very well
quick beacon
It's way better
white willow
ehhh still doesnt translate over very well
i kinda wished rtx fogs meshed better after this change
quick beacon
What is it doing down there
white willow
_Still using your sky stuff <@575765209785040908> :3_
nice
quick beacon
It looks better imo
white willow
yeah now that im seeing it yeah it looks better. just i was hoping i could port my rtx fogs over because visually i like the styles i went for over there much more
quick beacon
I'm sure you can get it with some tweaking ^^
white willow
this level of fog does look a lot better in deferred now though
you can see light rays
quick beacon
level fog?
quick beacon
I noticed a huge difference right away
tribal trail
I did not
white willow
i am noticing a difference between how thick the fog is and light shafts. i have much thinner fog and see light shafts much clearer
just my colors are messed up rn
quick beacon
I use 0 absorption
white willow
that could be it as well
i use some absorption
with some biomes having more and some having less
depends on if i wanna make it hazy or not
the underground exposure stuff looks a bit better now too
long ruin
It's way better
Very nice
white willow
this is more the look i wanted for savanas. kinda like a uh dry fog
to describe what i mean, i mean like theres a bit of a background haze
quick beacon
I see that
quick beacon
Now would be an epic time to let us push fogs based on the time of day 
quick beacon
It feels nice to be able to see my sky while having some rays ^^
white willow
its definitely a pretty look
i might try using less absorption on some fogs and see how that looks tbh
hm how do you have the god rays is it your moon brightness?
quick beacon
Might be :p
white willow
yeah it looks like it. i made mine 15 and i can see sunrays
it feels too bright at night for me personally but its a neat look
pale urchin
What is it doing down there <:wolfdizzy:918804259204636692>
That looks great!
quick beacon
This is kinda odd. my FPS stays at 30 when I do /time set 0
pale urchin
Ah, but I do notice a high amount of absorption being used
quick beacon
I use 0
pale urchin
Oh, must be my eyes deceiving me then
white willow
forests seem so weird when it comes to fog
like where you think there should be sun rays there arent
tribal trail
Now would be an epic time to let us push fogs based on the time of day <:doggysm...
-___-
quick beacon
My somewhat new "vanilla" fog preset (still not perfect)
I kinda like what they did here
pale urchin
My somewhat new "vanilla" fog preset (still not perfect)
This does look a lot better. How does it look in an open field
quick beacon
Best I can do atm
white willow
huh i can get my deserts fairly close to how they look in rtx
pale urchin
Best I can do atm
Is it your atmosphere? Why does it looks so blue where there's no fog lighting?
quick beacon
That is just how my stuffies work :3
quasi trench
aurora borealn’t
pale urchin
aurora borealn’t
At this time of the year?
quasi trench
it could be winter in minecraft years
pale urchin
Time to make some adjustments
white willow
I've changed a bunch of stuff nothing has given it color
I'll try some more in a bit
I'll try porting my RTX fogs over see if maybe those work better
quasi trench
noooo not the netherrrr
tribal trail
more work to do TwT
proud pike
viscid moth
SSS on light blocks
sonic canopy
I've changed a bunch of stuff nothing has given it color
You just have to multiply scattering by 12.5 and it should be back to normal.
drowsy lantern
It's animated water texture with 128 or 256x i think
vague shoal
i wanna know how to make one
drowsy lantern
Like fire texture but 30 or 60 picture
pale urchin
It's just a scrolling texture. It would've been neat if it had more stillness to it
mossy verge
i wanna know how to make one
Skills and experience
white willow
https://x.com/cubeOhm/status/1772549091815264446
I made something like this but is was heavily simplified
And not as detailed in any way
As well as had looping issues
tribal trail
How does one obtain such high detail textures
they make them
vague shoal
they make them
where?
silent zealot
🙏 Once exams are over, I can release a new update for my pack
vague shoal
where can you make a water texture like that
silent zealot
You hand draw them
quick beacon
Ask an AI to make one for you 
faint snow
Ai is dumb
white willow
I the best I got is taking the texture and applying the photoshop 3D normal map thing to it. They aren't good but they work ig.. until I can get over my skill issue with making normals
bitter cargo
you could also directly steal other peoples work
sonic canopy
How does one obtain such high detail textures
Proper way to do is is to create a procedural animation, with something like blender shader graph or in pure shader code, and then render it into a texture
Blender already has an ocean node, you can probably find some tutorial on how to make it tileable and how to bake normalmap from it
quick beacon
:o
quick beacon
:O woah
white willow
Blender already has an ocean node, you can probably find some tutorial on how to...
Huh interesting. Might have to learn how blender texturing works and stuff then ha. I imagine you could also do this in substance designer?
I tried using substance to make a new water normal but it didn't exactly work. It was just erroring
sonic canopy
Huh interesting. Might have to learn how blender texturing works and stuff then ...
No idea about substance painter
white willow
Ah
long ruin
Here's my most recent render in Blender (completely unrelated to this channel :D)
silent zealot
Is the sun supposed to shine behind the mountain?
pale urchin
<:Thinkdricks:769309770363568159> Is the sun supposed to shine behind the mounta...
I think it's just the terrain blending with the sky
pale urchin
Question, what does this place look like with RTX?
white willow
Very deep red. I'll have to find a pic as I don't have any currently on hand
They are the exact same values across both as well
white willow
Question, what does this place look like with RTX?
These two biomes in RTX
pale urchin
These two biomes in RTX
Interesting. Does fog in RTX get affected by GI?
white willow
It does yes
pale urchin
I see
white willow
Although I'm using BRTX so idk if that's something it adds or not
I haven't really tested with vanilla RTX
vague shoal
@quick beacon how did you get this orange tint in your pack https://youtu.be/w6Bj83kElak?si=1ATm6yyGXaYo3pZI
I still can’t figure out how to get an orange tint to my pack
Like this
quick beacon
I use a red-orange for my sensets and I use aces with some color grading which makes those colors more vibrant if that makes sense-?
white willow
nether fog is going to be an absolute pain
i cannot replicate my previous look no matter what i try
idk how possible it would be to do per dimension but i strongly believe the nether should get its old brightness restored
proud pike
idk how possible it would be to do per dimension but i strongly believe the neth...
i mean, the dark and dreary look is pretty cool ngl
but there should be a way to brighten it up
white willow
this is what i had before and i preferred this look
proud pike
proud pike
this is what i had before and i preferred this look
hm this is better
white willow
like sure it being dark and depressing works especially for what the nether is but i liked it brighter
time to play with warped forests and see if i can kinda tweak them back a little
proud pike
time to play with warped forests and see if i can kinda tweak them back a littl...
you'd probably have to play with your colour grade a little to bring it back to the old brightness/saturation
that would prolly hurt the overworld's look
white willow
it would yea
i looked at it on my neutral preset and it was almost pee yellow
despite the fact theres so much red color that should be coming through
white willow
yea
the nether fogs used to be colored via absorption and scattering barely did anything
sonic canopy
idk how possible it would be to do per dimension but i strongly believe the neth...
You can just multiply scattering by 12 and it'd be back to normal
sonic canopy
Did you multiply scattering or density
silent zealot
~~seperate dimension colour grading when~~
Per biome better
proud pike
Per biome better
true
white willow
multiplied scattering here by 12
on my old settings. if you look at the background, youll see the fog color is still the same
just not as thick
white willow
multiplied scattering here by 12
but ig this looks fine
not as bright as my old fog but it works
sonic canopy
Could you send me your old fog, I'll try to see what are the differences in old and new preview, and how to correct for that difference
white willow
yeah
if theres no way to restore the old brightness im fine with how it looks here
it was just more vibrant before
white willow
you'd probably have to play with your colour grade a little to bring it back to ...
yeah my neutral more vibrant preset more closely matches what i had before
proud pike
hmm
white willow
also hable does emissives very well, kinda surprised
there is rather clear defininition of brightness
white willow
changed mangroves to use a height based volumetric fog
also im genuinely unsure if this is a bug or a feature. it feels like a bug
(this only happens with height based vol fog)
if you hang out near the outskirts of the biome it wont fade down either
If it's not a bug the transition is just super harsh and jarring
The fade down transition is rather cool but the fact it flashes to a uniform fog then fades down after moving a little in feels wrong
quick beacon
changed mangroves to use a height based volumetric fog
"zero_density_height": "32 + q.heightmap",
"max_density_height": "3 + q.heightmap"
I would love something like this (just an example)
white willow
what would that do
sonic canopy
```json
"zero_density_height": "32 + q.heightmap",
"max_density_heig...
Doubt we'll get support for molang anywhere in deferred
white willow
oh its a molang query
quick beacon
Doubt we'll get support for molang anywhere in deferred
But it would be cool tho, right?
sonic canopy
Absolutely
white willow
omg this looks cursed
sonic canopy
Adding density noise into fog should be relatively straightforward via custom shaders tho, so if it doesn't get added officially, there will definitely be options in community shaders
quick beacon
Cuz then fog would look like this (blue line)
cuz I see no point in using density heights anyways
quick beacon
omg this looks cursed
My swamps look like this. I call it misty :>
white willow
i more said its cursed since it should be low to the ground
but the transition is just weird
this looks neat
quick beacon
Mangrove swamps are flat so density is useful there, same for swamps
but not for normal terrain
white willow
yeah i only really like using the height parameters here since its easy to gauge. i tried it with jungles at one point
it didnt fully work how i liked it to
quick beacon
```json
"zero_density_height": "32 + q.heightmap",
"max_density_heig...
Yea, because we won't get this 
. It would be really cool if fog height stayed with the terrain shape.
white willow
would something like that allow for something like this (yes the fog is very thick in these ik)
quick beacon
I know what Java shader that is
white willow
should be bliss. its the only shader ive been using recently
pale urchin
would something like that allow for something like this (yes the fog is very thi...
Why does it look blurry?
quick beacon
Photon is nice
white willow
Why does it look blurry?
bloomy fog i believe
ok this may be too thick
or at least the max thickness height may be too high
quick beacon
Do you want your swamp to look misty?
white willow
thats kinda what im going for yea
i made a small change this looks a bit better
i also forgot i added SSS to vines which just looks so good
quick beacon
That looks nice, because you're using the height stuff, so player would be able to see the blue sky
white willow
yea it wont be a dirty brown
welp im gonna port these changes to normal swamps since i separated the two of them
the fog brightness changes for light shafts make the height based fogs look so much better
night time swamps look rather spooky
oh yeah this is perfect
white willow
Ooh yk what biome this might also look good in
Savanas they are mostly flat as well
quick beacon
cuz I see no point in using density heights anyways
On second thought... 
still testing
vague shoal
On second thought... <:Shrug:587462299174830090> still testing
Beautiful
white willow
On second thought... <:Shrug:587462299174830090> still testing
this uses height?
yeah i cooked
quick beacon
this uses height?
Yep ^^
real berry
On second thought... <:Shrug:587462299174830090> still testing
this is beautiful Poggy.
quasi trench
On second thought... <:Shrug:587462299174830090> still testing
deer?
true wadi
On second thought... <:Shrug:587462299174830090> still testing
oh my god it keeps getting better and better
now we need volumetric clouds
white willow
welp i figured out how to mostly fix my nether fogs. i just did a little bit of a gain boost in color grading which helped better achieve the colors i wanted out of it
white willow
huh using the height fog params on jungles looks good. them having this misty looks is great
ok wow yeah this is like perfect
sonic canopy
Also a small update on the fog, I tried figuring out how to bring back the old fog, but got stuck on a formula for calculating AirAlbedoExtinction, seems like there's some complicated formula which uses both scattering and extinction. But it seems pretty clear that multiplying scattering or density by 12 won't bring the exact same old fog
Which might honestly be for the better, seems like y'all are liking the new fog look, and it's also more physically correct now
white willow
yes the new fog works really nicely with the height parameters
tribal trail
Which might honestly be for the better, seems like y'all are liking the new fog ...
I don't
I can get the same beautiful light pink and blue
tribal trail
Also a small update on the fog, I tried figuring out how to bring back the old f...
that's something quirky plague already told you. You just can't get the same look
And i hate it
white willow
i tried very hard at least with the nether fogs. unfortunate i cant replicate it but ive got a new look and style im cool with
tribal trail
I want to kill myself when I look on screenshots with my old cold fog
long ruin
tribal trail
<:Rulebreaker:1012483031212237001>
Why
long ruin
Idk
tribal trail
this looks better
safe urchin
but fog is low
barely visible light shafts
but yeah the colors are definitely better
safe urchin
tribal trail
Will release an update soon
tribal trail
fog is soo dark in nether
quasi trench
my goodness
white willow
yeah im not a fan of the current nether fogs
even with my pack going for a more dark and depressing style, i liked the nether fogs being bright and vibrant
white willow
Alright I'm having some issues and it seems to be an issue with my pack specifically and I have no idea why
This is specific to mobile from my testing
I've tested 3 different packs and none of them had this happen
I've had this reported by a few other people as well. Idk if I did something wrong or what
And to note this started with the release of 1.21 previews
quick beacon
I have some issues with fog in the birch biomes. There are times where I am inside a massive one, but the fog isn't called from biomes_client.json for some reason.
At random times it gets called.
sonic canopy
Seems like something in your pack is way too bright and exceeds maximum allowed brightness
white willow
Idk what. My sun isn't that bright, 36k luminance
Uh I'll look at some other stats too I guess
This doesn't happen at night tho
Limited to just daytime
And doesn't occur with reflections off
viscid moth
And doesn't occur with reflections off
reflections bug
reduce the sun glare shape
viscid moth
hmm it might be another bug then
white willow
Producing NaNs or whatever
I initially wrote this issue off as a game bug since it has a condition to fix it but after seeing other packs not having this issue it's probably not a game bug
Along with this not happening in 1.20.80.23 or whatever was before 1.21 again wrote it off as a game bug
viscid moth
also on whatever biome if you have a height density parameter and if you are above the zero density height it gets really really thick and transitions back to normal fog
it just happens some times
white willow
Yep that too
quick beacon
I never faced this issue
white willow
I've noticed that happens only on the edges of biomes haven't seen it at the height though
white willow
I've noticed that happens only on the edges of biomes haven't seen it at the hei...
I have sent a video previously showing this
white willow
This right here
vague shoal
I’m not trying to self promo here but would anyone like to join my game when I stream Minecraft deferred this Friday
vague shoal
I’m cooking this Friday so I hope y’all can join
vague shoal
😭
graceful iron
On second thought... <:Shrug:587462299174830090> still testing
do you still get flashbanged on biome borders with this fog? It's been an issue in RTX so I would assume so but idk.
white willow
do you still get flashbanged on biome borders with this fog? It's been an issue ...
it happens still but since deferred handles fog differnetly its less of a flash bang and more of, HELP IM BEING CHOKED OUT BY SMOKE
vague shoal
@tribal trail how did you get rid of the black hole in the sky
There’s no black hole in your pack
proud pike
Wdym by black hole
i think he is talking about the NaNs
proud pike
<@599744269359775745> how did you get rid of the black hole in the sky
those should be fixed in the game itself
vague shoal
Well somehow she fixed them herself in her pack
vague shoal
those should be fixed in the game itself
It’s not
vague shoal
That was for the sun bug
vague shoal
something in your pack is probably breaking it again
It happens in other packs
vague shoal
I can’t find a screenshot
As I don’t get the black hole sun bug
But I do have one of the sky one
proud pike
But I do have one of the sky one
yes that one
sonic canopy
The hole in the "ozone layer", opposite of the sun
vague shoal
proud pike
proud pike
ooh
vague shoal
See how the back of the sky is dark?
proud pike
bad sky config
vague shoal
Well how do I fix it
proud pike
also may wanna fix the colour grade
proud pike
Well how do I fix it
ask the pack wizards
vague shoal
But the darkness is still there
sonic canopy
Set moon illuminance to the same value as the sun and turn off moon mie scattering. Also the larger your orbital offset is, the less this fix will help with the issue
proud pike
sonic canopy
Also on that pic your color grading is what's causing that harsh blocky falloff
vague shoal
Set moon illuminance to the same value as the sun and turn off moon mie scatteri...
What should I set the offset to
I still want a custom sun angle
vague shoal
Also on that pic your color grading is what's causing that harsh blocky falloff
It’s an old pic
I fixed it
sonic canopy
What should I set the offset to
Ideally 0, but you could try larger values and see what compromise you can take
vague shoal
Uhhhh
tribal trail
vague shoal
No it’s not
tribal trail
🧐
vague shoal
Here lemme send a pic
tribal trail
Set moon illuminance to the same value as the sun and turn off moon mie scatteri...
it makes sky reflections much more visible on anything
tribal trail
Set moon illuminance to the same value as the sun and turn off moon mie scatteri...
actually from my tests orbital offset set to 0 makes it worse, and sky is symmetrically dark on both sides
tribal trail
Ok well it’s not as bad as all the other packs
but it makes you deal with terrible sky reflections several times more
tribal trail
but it makes you deal with terrible sky reflections several times more
without it
vague shoal
Also how do I fix where I can’t see anything at night
It’s pitch black at night for my pack
tribal trail
Also how do I fix where I can’t see anything at night
brighter moon
vague shoal
Ok
viscid moth
ngl it would be a good time to bring custom blockshapes back
sonic canopy
Yes, let's bring back all custom features which have sha in the name!
viscid moth
Yes, let's bring back all custom features which have `sha` in the name!
Veshaka - Veka 2.0
silent zealot
Yes, let's bring back all custom features which have `sha` in the name!
Notshaders
vague shoal
tribal trail
Yes, let's bring back all custom features which have `sha` in the name!
shachatgpt
pale urchin
That's not the final result is it?
vague shoal
Ofc not
white willow
Oh yeah this issue
vague shoal
Ye
tribal trail
Oh yeah this issue
@still zenith could you please fix this
this has been a problem from the beginning of deferred
vague shoal
Hollup nvidia advertising better rtx??? https://x.com/nvidiageforce/status/1734349155492073701?s=46
Twitter
sonic canopy
Yeah lol
quasi trench
huh is there something in that ss that is betterrtx
white willow
The whole video is betterRTX
long ruin
Lmao
safe urchin
lol
proud pike
real
quasi trench
injects brtx code into the normal game
white willow
*injects brtx code into the normal game*
Funny cuz that's kinda how the mod works
But it would be nice to just have normal RTX looking like that for sure
Maybe in the future we can only hope
vague shoal
I wish deferred would get a name announced for it when the 15th anniversary happens
But it’s too early for deferred to have a proper name
proud pike
imagine it'll still be called deferred or SDGP
silent zealot
imagine it'll still be called deferred ~~or SDGP~~
Rip my pack. Awaiting cease and desist
proud pike
tribal trail
imagine it'll still be called deferred ~~or SDGP~~
that would be funny
and cute
i like it being called deferred
mossy verge
viscid moth
safe urchin
i was able to achieve stable 120 fps with Deferred.
- i set the screen resolution to 720p
- lowest settings
- airplane mode on
let's not talk about how the temperature went up (around °45c)
quasi trench
no way insane
i never new airplane mode made it better
but also lowest settings…
but also i dont really know how low settings looks rn
vague shoal
i like it being called deferred
It might be just called “fabulous graphics”
Idk
That’s the best and simple name I could come up with
tribal trail
It might be just called “fabulous graphics”
it could be, but "deferred" sound iconic
vague shoal
Deferred is too technical name
tribal trail
If it was possible and up to me, I would call it that officially
deferred sound cute
vague shoal
And not everyone is gonna know what a “deferred” is
tribal trail
they don't need to know, people can just treat it as a name without meaning
tribal trail
yea
pale urchin
It might be just called “fabulous graphics”
Would conflict with the rendering mode in Java
tribal trail
Do you think deferred could release with its own update
nuh uh
vague shoal
Like the armored paws update
pale urchin
Like a minor update?
vague shoal
Ye
quasi trench
a drop
pale urchin
Well I don't see why not. They did the same with RTX
vague shoal
Yeah but deferred should be more popular
When it releases
Hopefully
I think we should have a big celebration server when it releases
And we all play Minecraft together with deferred enabled
But thats just an idea
😢
undone root
I’m curious whether they will stop support for RTX (as far as any fixes etc) and just stick to deferred, or at least make RTX and deferred work the exact same. They kind of seem somewhat related until I see the majority of the models I find broken in RTX work fine with deferred so they’re different enough to have different bugs etc
silent zealot
I’m curious whether they will stop support for RTX (as far as any fixes etc) and...
Their focus rightnnow is cross platform api. Maybe once deferred hits version 1.0 then they can chip away at rtx
pale urchin
They need RTX people first. Maybe they'll hire MadLad, lol
undone root
That’s why I wonder if they will keep supporting it though. You have a much larger base with deferred and my hope is that they could somehow make both of the … I can’t think of the word. It’s too early but … lighting pipelines? Work the same so fixes for one would fix the other but I’m sure it’s not really realistic lol
silent zealot
They need RTX people first. Maybe they'll hire MadLad, lol
But does madlad want to work for Mojang
pale urchin
¯_(ツ)_/¯
faint snow
Well paid job
vague shoal
Their focus rightnnow is cross platform api. Maybe once deferred hits version 1....
1.0?
undone root
1.0 I assume is when they release it out of preview.
Glad I’m not a dev. I would release everything at 0.92 just to drive people nuts 🤣
lucid token
When it fully released
white willow
They have something really cool with raytracing.. I hope they can expand on it for sure. Honestly at this point it would just be nice to have things like global and atmospheric json as well as the color grading json
Yes RTX has ALOT of other issues but it would be nice to have those available to it as well
sonic canopy
It definitely would be nice if RTX was getting the love it deserves, but even if it won't, there is still a lot of untapped potential with community mods
white willow
Yep
white willow
Oh???
sonic canopy
Imagine if they just forgot to mention it in the changelog. Would've been awesome if true
quick beacon
When they add a new material, is it enabled by default or does it need some code or whatever to enable it?
sonic canopy
There is a material for water but it's not functional atm. I think it depends, but addition of a new material doesn't mean that the game is using it
white willow
Yeah just checked no SSR
The sky reflections though, unless I'm crazy or I'm just not used to my new and upgraded water, look a bit better
quick beacon
Got a pic?
quick beacon
Surprised no deferred fixes or anything this week. They might be busy with other stuff.
white willow
Yeah probably
Rain fog feels... uhhh a little intense
It was like this before as well
quick beacon
PC update is out i think
white willow
But it would be nice to be able to control it (if you can then maybe I just set it up wrong idk but adding weather to the volumetric tab broke everything)
sonic canopy
IBL cubemap + point lights
white willow
Performance wise not really. At least to my knowledge
It's the added effects to it that hurt performance more
Like denoising
quick beacon
Idk, on Java I can have Ultra SSR and still manage 60+fps
sonic canopy
SSR is a bit heavier than other techniques that we have now tho
quick beacon
but we should be fine right?
sonic canopy
It can be done fast, but current implementation isn't yet
safe urchin
ssr on Yss Se shader doesn't affect fps that much
white willow
I can imagine for mobile devices water may end up getting a little laggy
safe urchin
ssr on Yss Se shader doesn't affect fps that much
i think Deferred will be even more better
white willow
Yeah I imagine official implementation will look a lot better
Hopefully it won't have the same insane amounts of noise that YSS SE has
sonic canopy
I don't think it will
quick beacon
IBL cubemap + point lights
Why did they start with this?
pale urchin
Why did they start with this?
Works more performantly on more devices
And covers more cases
sonic canopy
They're easier to implement and lighter to run. Maybe just those would've been enough
quick beacon
Would it be replaced with SSR?
quick beacon
Oh ok
white willow
Here's what I think would happen. High and ultra reflection would use ibl and SSR
Medium and low just IBL
quick beacon
hmm
sonic canopy
Yeah, each technique has its own limitations, and they can complement each other, fill the gaps
white willow
Or SSR will just get its own slider but I see it just being tied to high and ultra reflection quality
safe urchin
Here's what I think would happen. High and ultra reflection would use ibl and SS...
most likely
long ruin
æ
vague shoal
What’s ibl
pale urchin
What’s ibl
Image based lighting. It's what's providing the sky reflections
vague shoal
Image based lighting. It's what's providing the sky reflections
Dang it I thought it meant wavy water
safe urchin
long ruin
This unfortunate moment forever haunts me 
faint snow
Current consoles can’t handle Minecraft raytracing
faint snow
Minecraft rtx is path tracing
faint snow
Cyberpunk is ray traced
naive solstice
This unfortunate moment forever haunts me <:SpringbCry:877548678661943419>
Really wondering if this turned into development of deferred or it's another scrapped project
white willow
If Minecraft's rt was anything like cyberpunks PT... I wouldn't get 70fps at 1440p
faint snow
It’s Minecraft
white willow
While true cyberpunk utilizes many modern techniques like ReStir
Minecraft's implementation is as barebones as it gets
It has standard raytraced shadows GI and reflections nothing too special
safe urchin
Current consoles can’t handle Minecraft raytracing
so you're saying that ps5 and xbox sx are just scamming machines
white willow
They very well can handle it. Its one of the lightest rt implementations in the industry
faint snow
Rdna 2 isn’t good for ray tracing
white willow
The consoles have what the equivalent of a 6700XT
safe urchin
so ps5 and xbox sx are weaker than rtx 2050
from what i see in ps5 games
I see that ps5 cna run Minecraft rt
Pretty
Well
Stable 60 fps
It's really strong
white willow
so ps5 and xbox sx are weaker than rtx 2050
I don't believe that. The 2050 is straight garbage: the consoles can run games at 4K60. That card is lucky to do 1080
Oh wait
You weren't saying they were
Nvm
safe urchin
I don't believe that. The 2050 is straight garbage: the consoles can run games a...
so PS5 and Xbox are strong enough to achieve stable 60fps with Minecraft ray tracing
white willow
Ehhh
safe urchin
on something like 8 chunks
safe urchin
Probably not
wait why
safe urchin
Due to RDNA 2 limitations
wtf
white willow
Cyberpunk in RT mode runs at I think 1200p at 30fps
faint snow
Xbox series x was barely hitting 60 fps
white willow
They had to cut it down very heavily for it to be playable
white willow
Cyberpunk in RT mode runs at I think 1200p at 30fps
Doom eternal in RT mode runs at 1200p 60fps
They'd have to do resolution cuts for sure
white willow
The biggest misstep in the consoles was going RDNA 2 over uhh I forgot the last gen cards name was it Ampere?
Since these consoles were being pushed for raytracing
AMD is amazing in raster but if they wanted these consoles to be good with RT AMD was not the play
safe urchin
whatever
white willow
What I think happened was nvidia didn't wanna make a console gpu
Although they make gpus for the switch so idk
safe urchin
so
quick beacon
What is this about
white willow
Minecraft RTX on console
safe urchin
ray tracing is only accessible on Nvidia gpus ??
white willow
At least how it started
quick beacon
ray tracing is only accessible on Nvidia gpus ??
No?
white willow
ray tracing is only accessible on Nvidia gpus ??
No it's just better on them
quick beacon
^
safe urchin
What I think happened was nvidia didn't wanna make a console gpu
so why this
Why don't Playstation support it natively on their gpus
i mean upgrade it
Make it better
quick beacon
don't they use AMD for their stuff?
white willow
It would've been a better choice to go nvidia for the consoles since they wanted them to be raytracing devices. I'm guessing nvidia just didn't want to make console gpus and that's why they went with amd
safe urchin
i think so
white willow
Why don't Playstation support it natively on their gpus
This is on mojang to enable it
Other games run RT on the ps5
Ratchet and clank, cyberpunk, cod Cold War, doom eternal
safe urchin
This is on mojang to enable it
mojang didn't enable it because bad optimization and performance
white willow
I think Spider-Man as well
safe urchin
I think Spider-Man as well
yes
I tried Ray tracing on spider-man 2
Looks normal
but capped 30 fps
white willow
I'd what they raytraced in that game. I don't think it's full rt. I thinks it's just reflections in that one
Which if they weren't limited by RDNA 2, they probably could have had fully raytraced games, rather than just semi raytraced games
safe urchin
well true
quasi trench
but capped 30 fps
it can go 40-50 ish when you have 120hz and VRR display
but it uses dynamic resolution so like
white willow
I still don't fully understand why consoles don't utilize FSR as much as they probably could either
quasi trench
not as strong as it seem
white willow
I mean... ok FSR is garbage but it's still better than nothing
long ruin
I remember seeing the videos of people using RTX on the console when it accidentally got "released", I was around 45-50 FPS on the Series X
But at least we have Deferred
white willow
I remember seeing the videos of people using RTX on the console when it accident...
Better than I would have expected
long ruin
But at least we have Deferred
Albeit, performance dropped after 4K was supported
quasi trench
have you guys seen anything else other than like the SSR materials
safe urchin
I remember seeing the videos of people using RTX on the console when it accident...
that's even on 1080p
imagine on 4k
25 fps moment
long ruin
Yeah
safe urchin
white willow
Yeah without upscaling it's not running
long ruin
Lmao
white willow
Unfortunately
But 45-50 from a fully raytraced game without upscaling isn't bad
About on par with a 6800xt
long ruin
Maybe once Deferred is finished with the "Only adding cross platform features", we might see some updates to RTX
I'm unsure
white willow
We can only hope
long ruin
Yeah
safe urchin
Maybe once Deferred is finished with the "Only adding cross platform features", ...
adding brtx and boom rtx 2.0
white willow
I recently went back and played with RTX and it just, wow I forgot how good it can look sometimes
(With BRTX)
long ruin
I play with BRTX frequently, I enjoy it
white willow
I've just been working in deferred so much
long ruin
Although I'm looking more forward to Deferred due to it's features
white willow
I just really enjoy the customizability of it
long ruin
Like banners being fixed, entity, particle, and soon-to-be item pbr
long ruin
I just really enjoy the customizability of it
This too
First person shadows
And better performance
That'll hopefully get even better in the future
white willow
There's definitely a lot of issues but it's in development
And most of its issues are not nearly as bad as rtxs issues
white willow
Chunks literally break and stop loading with RTX
safe urchin
from what i see in Deferred progress, i think it'll probably look better than rtx when it comes to release
white willow
Maybe we will see
safe urchin
from what i see in Deferred progress, i think it'll probably look better than rt...
maybe just for me
long ruin
I'm actually working with the creator (Hirxs) in the FNaF Decorations Add-on to make it supported with Deferred
I'll see if I can find a photo
white willow
I think at base all RTX has for it is better fog rendering. Fog in RTX just looks better. And rt reflections are just unbeatable and will always just be better
white willow
Deferred fog isn't bad but fog in RTX is affected by GI etc.
safe urchin
maybe Deferred will have more features
white willow
It already does have more tbh
safe urchin
(Not gi and other fancy stuff)
long ruin
First 2 are BetterRTX, then the last 2 are Deferred
white willow
First 2 are BetterRTX, then the last 2 are Deferred
BetterRTX looks better but it's due to the fact that indoors are just unbeatable
long ruin
Yeah
white willow
I don't think deferred will ever look amazing indoors
I'd love to be proven wrong
I think if they can fix the exposure bugs and stuff indoors will vastly improve
safe urchin
real
white willow
Woodland mansions are just cursed
long ruin
And someday getting point light shadows from block lights
And a fix for custom blocks not having pointlight support
sonic canopy
I think if they can fix the exposure bugs and stuff indoors will vastly improve
Imo SSR will be a huge help here
long ruin
Imo SSR will be a huge help here
I agree
safe urchin
yea
long ruin
At the moment, indoors look "plasticy"
quasi trench
Woodland mansions are just cursed
yeah they are very foggy i had to take this at a weird angle for it to look ok
white willow
I'm mostly talking about when you into a building right, the fog all deletes itself and out are left with these ugly bright patches coming from windows.
Then when you get near the window it brightens your screen respawns the fog
pale urchin
Physically speaking, you can't have sun rays without fog
long ruin
At the moment, indoors look "plasticy"
#1182095383015456829 message
pale urchin
SE has fog too
silent zealot
Too much fog, not enough frog
long ruin
https://discord.com/channels/523663022053392405/1182095383015456829/123526274185...
Sun rays look nice, but there's just something odd about the other areas
safe urchin
Physically speaking, you can't have sun rays without fog
Yss Se moment
there's absolutely no fog
white willow
Physically speaking, you can't have sun rays without fog
Yeah. To make sunrays there needs to be some form of noise dirt dust
white willow
Yss Se moment
There is fog. It's just not as thick
pale urchin
Yss Se moment
That's definitely fog
safe urchin
but rays are so visible
white willow
Sun rays look nice, but there's just something odd about the other areas
Yes. The sun just floods everything and kinda ignores shadows
long ruin
but rays are so visible
Poggys sun rays do this good
long ruin
Yes. The sun just floods everything and kinda ignores shadows
Exactly
white willow
This could be improved by lowering the packs sun brightness
But then everything else looks bad
Here's a decently bright moon but the shadowing doesn't get obliterated
Also yes I added SSS to vines it looks amazing
long ruin
Now that looks good
white willow
I made the moon bright enough to cast sunrays but not flood everything
safe urchin
Here's a decently bright moon but the shadowing doesn't get obliterated
the Atmospheric and vibe is great
Gives you that true night experience
white willow
We just need daytime to shadow that way now
Without having to nuke the sun brightness
Which in positive there will be improvements to this
Deferred rendering to my knowledge is the new industry standard rendering method. Plenty of games manage to nail a good balance between brightness and shadowed areas without rt
safe urchin
Deferred is good
white willow
Yeah it's also again still early development
I'm confident these issues will be resolved
white willow
And it's improved so much
white willow
Here's a decently bright moon but the shadowing doesn't get obliterated
Nobody expected it to be able to look like this when it released
quasi trench
pics i stole from others from the early days
white willow
Oh boy
Yeah it's come a long way
Oh and heightmaps and stuff were inverted I think too
white willow
hm a very cool/random feature i just thought of now would be able to control things like dust. adding in some form of like volumetric dust that exists within a space. this is not something to consider but it would be cool.
this idea just came to me from a game i was playing that uses a mix of volumetric fog and dust. leads to really cool looking scenes
vague shoal
Where did they confirm wavy water again in the deferred qna?
I can’t seem to find it
white willow
i dont think it was confirmed
i think they just said they had updates to water planned
lemme look
and theres also a snells window effect they said they will be adding
which is like when underwater and you look up theres like a circle above
this effect
vague shoal
I just want my water to at least wave a little bit
😢
Also
Deferred is better than rtx
In my opinion
Cause it’s getting a lot more features
white willow
and i respect that opinion and its mostly true tbh
safe urchin
this effect
This would be so cool
white willow
just rtx has its moments where im like wow ok holy crap
vague shoal
I can’t wait to see deferred when released
I hope that’s soon
December if we’re lucky
safe urchin
2025
white willow
like indoors as ive said are just incredible with rtx. deferred cannot touch it in that regard at all
vague shoal
🤞
white willow
i should note deferred in its current state
rocky halo
Cause it’s getting a lot more features
Don’t forget that it is on more platforms and there are settings for weaker devices
white willow
i ported my roofed forest fog over to rtx
uh yeah whoops
lemme adjust that
much better
there are a lot of things rn about rtx though that are far superior. for example emissives
they just simply look better
about the exact same spot. deferred vs rtx. this exposure issue near windows really kills the look
rocky halo
It isn’t rtx vs deferred here ?
white willow
rtx is on the left deferred on the right
rocky halo
Ok ok
white willow
this issue also just makes it not look good either. the light doesnt flow in correctly like it should
im hoping they can fix things to look a bit more correct in the future
there are definitely instances where rtx is just superior and thats ok. they use completley different lighting styles
but also cant miss the fact deferred does not shade well at all
and i think some ambient occlusion might help a lot as well for sure
vague shoal
Anyway
white willow
shadows went poof
vague shoal
Who else thinks we should have a big celebration server for when deferred releases
Yss server can probably host it
rocky halo
Who else thinks we should have a big celebration server for when deferred releas...
For « Super deferred graphics packs »
rocky halo
dont switch to rtx if you had deferred on lmao
Oh I hope a new painting with this image
white willow
what happened to the underwater godrays with rtx they arent working anymore 
not in the normal version, with betterRTX or default rtx
im sadge
wha caustics are borked too
in both 1.20.80 and 1.21
update they are not broken. i just messed something up
yeah fixed it.
this effect though would add very cool details to deferred for sure
proud pike
But does madlad want to work for Mojang
he already helped mojang with some stuff, even deferred before release.
proud pike
fr fr
drowsy lantern
this effect though would add very cool details to deferred for sure
Under water?
white willow
yes
drowsy lantern
This looks great
white willow
yeah why i want it added. the devs said it will be though so its cool
tribal trail
I FINALLY HAVE A PREVIEW ON MY PHONE